>Artificial Difficulty: The Game

>>284939605

is it this jump'n run souls?

You need to git gud at luck .

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Define artificial difficulty & real difficulty.
Your definition may not consist entirely of examples.
Go.
   ▲
▲  ▲

>>284939605
Who cares man. It's a game and it's fun. Myself and lots of other enjoyed it.

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>people waste turns on the pot

What?
It's easy as fuck, way too easy in fact even after they fixed the stupidity of stunlocking to heal.

>>284939605
More like RNG: The Game

>>284939605
>Buzzword:The Thread
also get good you pathetic scrublord

>>284939605
Oh boy Dank Dungeon thread.

I stopped playing it awhile ago because I'm waiting on the full release but I'm considering booting it back up again and running almost exclusively highwaymen. They're awesome.

>>284941087
sounds fun but you're shit out of luck if you get at low health, also HWM have shit stun/dot resistance.
I'd rather run a shuffle party plus Occultist

>>284941327
I thought I would shove some occultists in so I can get annoyed when they heal nothing and make my party bleed.

>>284941421
get Cleansing Crystal m8

which one is more artificial, FTL or this one

>>284941765
FTL doesn't spend the entire game making you think it's more complex in every aspect than it actually is, and has relatively engaging well thought out mechanics

Neither of them are artificial when it comes to difficulty get good

>what are dungeon crawlers

Literally Luck: The Genre

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>>284939605
>artificial
There's nothing artificial about a random number's generator.

>>284941894
if you can't evaluate the risk, your decision matters shit all. You can pretend that you are "getting good" by being cautious and not picking a choice when its more dangerous, but in the end you can never affect it.

the problem isn't even in the randomness itself, but in the fact how one dice roll can shit all over your game immediately forever.
Its the same with new Xcom versus old Xcom, instead of managing your shots and movement in a detailed way, you're hit in the face with walk or walk further and 56-72% of hitting 2-6 damage.

very good game, what's your favorite team?

>>284941765
see>>284941067
stop posting anytime retard

so are there new classes released?

>>284942315
Occultist/BH/Leper/HWM

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>start new playthrough
>do first dungeon after tutorial
>first 3 fights i get critted literally 20 times
>everyone freaks out
>3 guys dead
>can only recruit 2 new guys

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>>284942524
git gut
Luck is a skill, the mighty forge their own destiny.

>>284942524
>he didn't update the cart first thing

>>284942287

>the old Xcom wasn't a facefucking RNG spamfest

ok kid

>>284942315

Vestale/Plague Doctor/Highwayman/Crusader

or

Jester/Plague Doctor/Highwayman/Bounty Hunter.

>>284942287
>if you can't evaluate the risk, your decision matters shit all.
but they do, the way you adapt when shits hits the fan is where this game it's at. adapt and overcome.
seriously, no amount of RNG can fuck you up if you know what you're doing.
>old Xcom was not RNG
what he said >>284942973

Also

>Poor technical compartment - the game

Why many games from the early '90s have better graphic than many modern indies?

>>284943657
but the artstyle in this game is fucking boss, and if you don't see it you must have a case of cronical eye retardation

>>284943657

Are you kidding? The game looks and sounds fab.

>>284942192
well except the randomness.
computers can't be truly random. They can come close, but its still a script to simulate randomness.

>>284942192
thank you for posting this, I was about to.

>>284943883
he's just attempting to shitpost with poor results. he probably hasn't even played the game.

>trying to shit on one of the few good games currently out
nigga please

>>284943096
Vestal, highwayman and crusader are 10/10 classes.
Fuck the grave robber.

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>>284939605
ooops, looks like your posted the wrong pic
lmftfy

It's a constant fight between playing that game and waiting to not get burnt out

>>284945625
Except compared to say, dark souls 1, that game was easy.

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Bros before hos.

>>284945625
But that one has pretty legit difficulty once you get into the mindset of enemy attack tracking defying all rules of nature.

I played it for a bit and really liked it, might have to get back to it now. I just got my first Hellion and actually learned how to equip items.

I called it, I fucking knew the artificial difficulty crowd would eventually latch onto this

Fuck you, I thought it would at least lat until official release before you faggots jumped in

>>284942524
>can only recruit 2 new guys
They told you about upgrades bro!!!!
They told you dog!

Binding of Isaac is literally the definition of artificial difficulty yet /v/ slurps that dick up until it's dry

Why is this $5 game priced at $20?

>>284946438
Because you're a huge jew and don't know how to price things.

Also there's more content planned. You did see that it was early access right?

>>284946309
In Binding of Isaac you can win no matter what if you are skilled enough.
In Darkest dungeon there are tons of un-winnable situation.

>>284939605
Let me guess, you also thought FTL was RNG bullshit.

I'm more worried if it's
>Unfinished early access: The archetype

>>284947120
Well as long as they don't take early access dollars as enough and leave the game unfinished, I suppose Ill be fine.

>>284939605
I'm comfortable with the RNG in this game compared to most. I want to love most roguelikes out there but the RNG is just too retarded most of the time.

Oh hey you prepared as best you could with equipment for every possible situation and resist and as many escape items and other shit as possible? Well too bad, RNG just created a huge faglord monster that has an elemental attack for the one resist you couldn't find enough of and destroys you in one hit lulz git gud.

>All video games are made of artificial difficulty.
>/v pisses and moans about artificial difficulty.
>/v hates artificial difficulty.
>/v hates the stuff that video games are made of.
>/v hates video Games.

>>284942192

The rng is artificial though because computer can never be truly random. You learn this in Any Basic Programming Language 101

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>>284939605

Top fucking kek. I managed to defeat her at my first try. Balanced team makes a difference mang.

>>284947096
In Dark souls you can win no matter what if you are skilled enough as well.

It didn't stop pcucks from coining the term now did they?

Grave Robber or Leper, which is more useless?

>>284947293
early signs points to the devs being bros and actually caring about the game. lots of updates and balances fixes in the first days after release.
I am 90% sure this game will see full release, the problem is that it's going to take six months.

>>284946438
price's about right for the amount of content and polish it has.

>>284947767

I hope Hound Master won't be a shitty class.

>>284947758
>Grave Robber or Leper, which is more useless?
Let me guess, you haven't even hit lev3 dungeons yet.
both classes are late bloomers and become based as fuck, especially Leper

>>284939605
>No Leper
There's your problem. Also only children can't deal with dice-rolls.

Literally get good.

>>284947758
Pick neither you fucking scrub

>>284945889
was there ever a better depiction of homosexual romance? not even Bioware games get close

>>284947758
>leper
>useless

This is how I know you're not good at this game.

>>284947913
>>284948256
>>284948609
Well my first guy to consistently go into heroic mode every time he got stressed was my Crusader so my entire main party evolved around him. And the Leper just felt inferior to him. Grave Robber never really matched up against my Highwayman Plague Doctor Combo either. I always go Vestale in back. I suppose I must be a scrub then.

>>284947758
Everyone except Graverobber is useful. Leper is one of the most useful, in fact. Get some fucking accuracy you cunt.

I use Graverobber, Highwayman, Jester and Demonologist. With the right skills selected, it's broken as sin. Oh you just had your lineup moved around? 3 of my characters have abilities that allow them to attack and move at the same time.

>>284949120
So if i get a lot of accuracy on leper it will fix the reason he's useless, which is the fact he can only attack the 2 front spots and only from the two front spots?

I didn't know that, i always though that accuracy only increased accuracy and didn't modify abilities like that, that's great!

Since you know, a unit that can only attack the front row is useless since all the dangerous enemies are backrow enemies, especially if that unit has absolutely no attacks from the 3rd and 4th positions when it gets shuffled there by a surprise or enemy abilities.

But now that i know that accuracy fixes that leper is looking great!
Does accuracy change what positions an ability can target on other classes too or is that just for leper?

>>284949120

>have to spend multiple turns buffing him
>good

Id rather mark targets then get 100% bonus damage without needing to buff accuracy

Grave robber is the best class.

+accuracy after her dagger throw is op as shit. It even procs if you miss.

Just stack her with some +crit +damage -acc shit and face roll the game.

>>284950060
>>284949847
You're forgetting the rest of the shit he has, which is massive base damage, self-buffs and being the tankiest merc in the game.

If you have a bard and a leper in your party, you'll come out with full hp and less stress than you came in with.

>>284939605
bring me hag lewds

put her in lingerie or something

I'm a fucking degenerate and I want it

>>284939605
>15 different monsters
>3 bosses in 3 different variations
>like 6 different adventuring scenarios

Hope they add at least once as much content before release. As it is, the game is 3 - 4 hours long unless you're a grindhound.

this game is extremely easy.

got to 28 weeks with just 3 deaths, and 2 of them were level 0 characters yoloing without torches to end a quest for free money.

the ones that struggle either don't understand the really easy bases of the game or had a start so bad that they end up spending all the money every week, keeping their characters always under upgraded.
if you get ahead on gold and you upgrade your squad you snowball easy and you end up not needing stress reduction in 90% of weeks.

>>284950531
The game is way longer than 3-4 hours even though it has little content.

I'm 24 hours clocked into it and my highest levels are 3 rank 5's

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>>284947758
>The Sweeper and The Jack-of-all-trades is useless

>>284940151
Doc, the medication is incomplete, how am I supposed to get better if you don't give me all the medicine needed?

Every fucking torrent of this game reports a trojan/alware. Tried Kapersky, Malwarebytes and Panda Cloud.

>>284950239
I come out with full HP and less stress than i entered with using Vest/Occu BH HWM Helion and i don't have to waste 2 slots on party member that won't be attacking the backrow.

And Leper is not even close to the tankiest merc, he has beyond shit dodge and it's the only defensive stat that matters since it's the only one that prevents crits which are the only attacks that matter.

>>284950239
aside from bosses, 60% of encounters you have one guy with 60 hp sitting in front row and 2 dangerous enemies in the backline with 20 hp that need to be eliminated.
i'd rather get a frontliner who has options to choose target than leper, because 15 bonus hp, 2 extra damage and -10 accuracy won't make the fight as good as actually killing the courier first turn.

>>284939605
I enjoy the game for the atmosphere and art style. the only thing that really pisses me of are the skellingtons with the goblets.
>HOW QUICKLY THE TIDE TURNS

>>284939605
>Git Gud: The Game
FTFY

>>284950719
>>284950531


the game gets boring pretty fast.
it's quite content-dependent.

needs more enemies/zone ( just a few more will create many possible enemy's party setup).

also it does encourage you to try different party setups with 5 bosses and 5 zones...but you need more reasons. i would love a couple missions where " a zone has been infested by X enemy" forcing you to make a weird party setup to get through it.

>>284949120
Graverobbers dagger skills are OP as shit

>>284951086
Try a good antivirus

>>284951420
>crits goblets
>dodge holy lance
>crits goblets again

everytime.

>>284951086
i got the most recent version from tpb and its fine

>>284940151
Real difficulty: consistency
Artificial difficulty: inconsistency

>>284940151
>real difficulty
It's a NES game
>artificial difficulty
It's on PC

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>>284951420

>>284951709
>Crusader gets critically splashed with wine
>half of my party goes insane and refuses to do anything
i think that the stress mechanic is a good idea and really adds to the atmosphere but sometimes it just makes my party look really squeamish

i think the ideas behind the game are good, but its just too fucking easy and the combat is SO SLOW PACED. turnbased is fine, i like that, but in fights with tons of resists/miss etc having no option to skip animations is horrible.

>>284952435
But muh "Death waits for the slightest lapse in concentration!"

>>284952346
>graverobber gets critted for ONE damage by a stupid stun spell
>2 other party members go insane

fuck this shit.

>>284952346
>wine

dude that's not just wine

that's also blood

other men's blood

that's been sitting around in an underground cavern for who knows how long

plus it could also be magic, it is a "tempting" goblet

maybe it means they're tempted to take a drink of the putrid juices, and they just can't stop thinking about it, but they know it's wrong, but they just can't stop wanting to drink it

>>284952435
game should not stop for dialog boxes for sure.

animations are not that slow honestly, but your turn/enemy turn should start as soon as animation end, there is currently half a second delay.

>>284952346
Stress should scale better. When my Crusader shrugs off a 1 HP blow people shouldn't be freaking out with +9 stress.

It really is random to the point that is isn't even fun. If there was something to where you could at least strategize your moves better, that would be good. Such as seeing who moves next for the next 5 turns or so.

>>284953007
If you don't like it don't play it.

>>284952435
nigga just modify the speed of the game by modifing the game files, just look for it and you will run at insane speed.

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>>284939605
>All the literal garbage players complaining about the RNG on the forums.
>Times when the RNG fuck you over are actually super rare.

I really wish garbage players that actively complained could be culled. You're allowed to be shit at a game, you're just not allowed to give your opinion, especially in regards to balance.

>>284940151
Real difficulty is when something is challenging but is entirely possible to overcome.

Artificial difficulty is when something is designed specifically to harm or defeat you and there's nothing you can do to alter that course.


Many claim a lot of the traps in the Souls series were artificial difficulty, but there were subtle hints to let you know what was ahead.

>>284952945
Yeah this is my biggest gripe so far.

>>284953134
>>284953007
people have been wondering for a while what actually determines turn order, and it's not so much an indicator people are looking for, more just an outright explanation for how turn order works

but really they game's files are wide open so if there were enough people that cared you could find out pretty easily

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>>284942524
Except there will always be a minimum of four heroes available, whether they're in the cart or in your roster.

I tested this personally by throwing Reynauld and Dismas to the wolves in the tutorial. The coach had four heroes in it rather than the usual two and dismissing was disabled.

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>decide to do a champion level dungeon for the first time
>read a book
>instantly get over 50% stress level

yea, fuck that

>>284952834
it would make more sense if stress was tied to damage
>kill 3 of these fucking pig demons, only one of the small ones left, party is doing fine
>he vomits on my graverobber for 2 damage
>WE ARE ALL GOING TO DIE

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>>284953420
>reading books
>ever

nigga you wat

>>284953420
Just like real life

>>284953321
>turn order
it's simple really, ever played D&D?
character speed score + dice roll. highest result goes first. it's rerolled every round.
The devs recently added a turn indicator that, while not giving you the turn order, it shows with a counter who has taken its turn during the round.

>>284953420
>Reading book stacks.
Retard.

Contrary to what most people say though, bookcases are ~66% chance of good.

>>284953424
A better mechanic would be reduction of stress gains as enemies die the fewer enemies the less you stress out

>>284953420
stop interacting with anything you can't neutralize with an item, the risk is rarely worth it

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>there are people in this thread that don't know you can use a shovel to smash a locked cabinet if you don't have a key

>>284954157
You get a worse reward than using a key.

That being said though, locked cabinets are 100% bad if you don't use a shovel or key.

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>>284939605
I actually love it.

Pirated a build off a torrent, and started playing it now and than. Succeeding against RNG chances in games feels great. Its gambling with your character's lives. I wish more games work off the RNG factor so victory is not always certain. Every time my two front assaults miss on their turn and my support in the fucking back keeps getting picked off nickle and dime his health. There is so much pressure to fucking end the fight so you can break camp.

It takes a few dungeons to get the flow of the game. The most important part is making sure you can upgrades your combat abilities, manage your stress levels, and have a healthy roster to rotate.

Bounty Hunter is my bro. Fuck those traps, and fuck them back of the line faggots picking off my Vestal. Face full of axe nigger!

>>284953413
I never leave battle after being caught off guard because I always thought that would increase my parties stress levels like leaving the dungeon to early before completing the mission.

Thanks for the tip in that vid.

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>>284954157
>there are people in this thread that don't know you can use a torch on the scrolls to burn of a negative quirk

>>284954378
Have you played FTL? A little less RNG but it's a fun game. I like having random shops and having to decide what to spend your limited resources on.

>>284953703
>enter bookstore, flip trough random books
>have a mental breakdown, start cutting yourself right there
>go on tumblr and complain about the bookstore not having a warning for people triggered by paper

>>284954819
Your ruining the magic exploring the fucking game. At least spoil that shit. Fuck the internet.

>>284955095
implying you don't read all spoilers anyway

>>284950083
This Anon gets it

>>284955034
I have not, but I'm more into TBS games. FTL looks fun, and comfy as fuck thou. I'll look into it.

Just sucks going have to wait till August to buy this game.

>>284955353
Fuck

>>284953192
What makes me laugh is how all garbage players forget to read the text before the menu.
The game is all about making the best of a bad situation.

>>284940151
>real difficulty
I can tell others to git gud.
>artificial difficulty
I am told to git gud.

>people actually defending this game

imagine FTL, then suddenly a critical hit on your ship opens a hole and you start to lose oxygen, your party is dying and you try to start the oxygen generator but it rolls and FAILS to start, so you move your party to the medbay that rolls a 1 in healing while you take 10 dmg per second and everyone dies

that what FTL would be like if it played like darkest dungeon

>>284955696
This

But most lazy niggers don't read.

>>284956021
I don't see how that's different from regular FTL.

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>>284956021

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>>284956021
Good thing its NOT and its a different fucking game.

Go back to bejeweled grandpa. Men are playing here.

>>284956021
>Jump to system
>Mantis raiders with teleporter in front of a sun
>Everything is on fire, Mantis boarding crew destroys your life support systems and slaughter your crew
FTLs RNG fucks you over pretty often

it's not artificial difficulty, even things like wilbur warn you.

the game is just lazy rng on top of lazy rng, with the quirk of being 'punishing' by the results being extreme.

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>>284953420
>Interacting with anything on a difficult dungeon without diffusing-items

>>284939605

>Tempting Goblet: The Game

>>284956584
>>284956584
There is an upgrade that lets you know where suns and other hazards are, you can be prepared, there are constants in FTL

If it was like darkest the sensors would roll, fail to detect the sun and then fuck you over, you can never be prepared in DD because everything is random, might as well go gambling

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>>284957254

>>284957276
There are upgrades in the game that help you prepare for the unknown. Like your abilities, and gear. They are two fucking different games nigger. Comparing the two as the same is fucking nigger tier faggotry.

Its like comparing two completely different gaming systems like DnD 4th Ed to Rogue Trader.

3.5/Pathfinder is the better of the two.

>>284957545
HOW QUICKLY THE TIDE TURNS

>>284957545
>Masochistic

>>284940151
Real difficulty: The more you play the game, the better you are at that game.
Artificial difficulty: There is no way of knowing what the correct course of action is, or how to beat an enemy, except for trial and error.

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>>284957545

>>284957627
>reads spoiler
my negro

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>>284958006
>Real difficulty: The more you play the game, the better you are at that game.
>Artificial difficulty: There is no way of knowing what the correct course of action is, or how to beat an enemy, except for trial and error.
>both are mutually the same
A-a-are you actually stupid?

>>284957627
My group is actually really enjoying 5e D&D

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dank ass game

>>284958486
I gave it a read, its just a watered down version of what we correctly play. Its not a bad system, but no reason for out group to get into it.

>>284939605
more like... DANKEST dungeon hahahahhaha

>>284946050
And you have to get passed the fact that the only means of making encounters "difficult" was adding a shit ton of enemies to ambush you.
>literally the only hard bosses are the ones with multiple enemies
>none are genuinely challenging or interesting
>most just encourage you to hold up a greatshield for a dumb amount of time and wait for all the enemies to incidentally swing at the same time giving you a chance to attack one of them once without trading

The narrator is fucking amazing

>Dazed...reeling..about to BREAK

Real difficulty: Good play is rewarded, bad play is punished
Artificial difficulty: No matter how you play, you are at the mercy of the RNG
You could play with the shittiest party composition ever, luck can always make you win.
You could play with the best party combination ever, bad luck can always make you lose.
The whole point of this game is that it's artificially difficult.

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>>284959081

>actually trying to make an argument about a buzzword created and used by /v/ alone

>>284959081
>Artificial difficulty: No matter how you play, you are at the mercy of the RNG
I bet you think dice games at the casino are all artificial difficulty too.

>>284959081
>RNG = artificial difficulty = bad video game

Way to completely miss the theme of the game, being that the odds are stacked against you. There are factors that will affect you in a negative way, no matter how hard you try to minmax your way out of them. Calling the game artificially difficult is actively validating their effort, because you've proven that you can't handle it.

Go back to playing tower defense games with OP.

On a related note, can someone take >>284958161 and replace "Triggered" with "Arificial Difficulty"?

>>284959081
>You could play with the shittiest party composition ever, luck can always make you win.

>You could play with the best party combination ever, bad luck can always make you lose.

You would have redundant skills and lineup otherwise. Meaning that you have to have a select team with a select set of skills in order to actually win, because anything else would be rendered difficult. Almost, dare I say, in an artificial manner.

How would you make the game difficult then?.

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>>284958161
FUCK YOU AND YOUR PIECE OF SHIT GOBLET, STICK IT UP YOUR BONY ASS, I FUCKING HATE YOU, HOPE YOUR PARTY WAS FUCKING SHIT
man, fuck these guys

>>284959081
That would be the case if the game didn't offer you ways of getting better. Increasing your chances for a more favorable RNG with leveling, gear, and upgrades is not artificial no matter how meager they are.

Artificial difficulty for example is damage sponge enemies while reducing the amount of damage you deal to them. No real difficulty is added to enemy A.I, reduction in item pick-ups or in game ability adjustments.

You are complaining about the system used in the game, and what the game is about. Calling it an artificially difficult game because you're too stupid to retreat from battle, and don't know how to manage the situation is just being a whining baby used to hand holding.

>>284953413
>Oh shit, you actually came back!

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>>284958819

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>>284959081
But you CAN rig the RNG to be in your favor.

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>>284960032

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How should I provision for the Weald? First time in there

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>>284960192
Lost it at "Blaze it"

>>284960192

>That Vestal

amazing

>>284940151
I need a stronger dose doc, hurry there not much time.

SOMEONE HELP!

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>>284960269
>550 gold in the bank
you're gonna get SO fucked if this goes wrong
if you are this much strapped for cash consider sending a bunch of expendables on a no-torch run

>>284960269
If short
>8 food
>0 torches
>1 shovel
>1 bandage
>1 antivenom
>1 herbs
>2 keys

If medium/long
>12 food
>8 torches
>2 shovels
>2 bandages
>2 antivenom
>2 herbs
>2 keys

No holy water.

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>>284960269
Jesus Christ man, talk about over preparing. You're going to dump half of that shit for the loot you wont be able to fight in there. You wont even break even with how much you spent. If you are not given fucking firewood, don't get more than 12 food, and 8 torches. I full stack each is often the best without camp outs.

>>284960269
I just get one full stack of food and one stack of tor hes. And a shovel, maybe two for weald.

>>284960269
In future weald runs, take a poultice. You can disinfect carcasses for lots-a-food.

>Fighting 3 ectoplasms
>Kill two
>Suddenly a large one appears

What the fuck, it almost wrecked my party

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>>284960963
>citokynesis
>citokynesis
>citokynesis
>citokynesis

>>284960963
You're supposed to lower their health and try to kill them all in the same turn. If they use cytokinesis at any point, even if they miss or you dodge, it spawns another.

>>284960269
herbal medicine will usually give you food when you use it on one of the pig's tables, so you can bring less food.

I'd also bring an extra shovel, but that's me being paranoid

>>284959360
Gambling is the definition of RNG, games of probabilities are only difficult because you can't affect the outcome. Yes it's artificial difficulty.
>>284959647
>>284959843
>>284960084
Did you even read my post?
>"The whole point of this game is that it's artificially difficult."
I obviously know it's the point. There's no point in whining that the game is artificially difficult, but there's no point in denying it either.
>>284959654
You make the game difficult by the use of player skill(Action games), Strategy and planning(Grand strategies), micro and macromanagement(RTS), etc...
Risk management is gambling, I can see how it's fun but it's in as fun as playing the lottery for me.

>>284961251
Pig tables are in warrens.

Weald
>Beast Carcass
Warren
>"Dinner" Cart
>"Dinner" Table
>Moonshine Still
Ruins
>Iron Maiden
>Alchemy Table

That's everything you use herbs on. Moonshine stills only give you a damage buff so they're not even required.

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>>284961381
the fact that this game heavily relies on RNG is apparent and doesn't bother me at all. What bothers me is that you keep insiting on using a retarded buzzword that only shitposters and people that are actually mentally challenged use, which leads me to believe that you belong to either category

>>284961381
I don't have time to debug all this autism. Just don't play dice if you can't pay the price.

>>284940151
Artificial = RNG

fuck off, Doc

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>>284961381
Even though you plebs insist it's purely RNG, I bet I could run through five dungeons with appropriately levelled heroes and still make it out just fine.

RNG is an excuse for shit players.

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Dose coming through


Also the game becomes piss easy after you have a lvl 3 party. One of the main complaints about the game is that it gets easier as you go along instead of more difficult.

>>284961945
This. Although they do get all high and mighty and refuse to take part in certain runs.

>>284961664
Nice Ad Hominem, my whole point is that the game heavily relies on RNG and denying that is lying to yourself. Artificial difficulty defines that well and I don't see why I can't use that word because it triggers you.

>>284961381
>There's no point in whining that the game is artificially difficult, but there's no point in denying it either.
Its not though, you confusing RANDOM NUMBER GENERATING outcomes to artificial difficulty. Its a gaming system, not artificial difficulty which is lazy implemented game difficulty. No one uses that fucking term with GAME OF CHANCE rolls for dice based games which rides on CHANCE being the main part of the game.

Don't be fucking stupid with comparing GAMBLING to "artificial difficulty".

>>284961903
Exactly this.

I see shitter complaining all the time yet i only lose character when i overextend like a retard

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>>284960423
>>284950915
>>284961945

>>284940151
Artificial difficulty is when a game increases difficulty by scaling numerical values, such as enemy health and damage. Yes, it is more difficult, but not nearly as enjoyable to play with than more inventive ways, such as enemy placement and different movesets to throw you off.

Destiny is a good example of a game that uses a lot of artificial difficulty.

>>284953281
yea there is no way souls is artificial. im a huge casual and claim artificial difficulty too much but in souls I was able to breeze through. /v/ is just megacasual

>>284962076
I have a level three Highwayman that refuses to go into any Level 1 dungeon. Its beneath him. I don't even know how he got that high that fast. No one else is even close to him. I only lost 3 characters in this campaign, and they were still under level 2. Everyone else in my roster is still Level 0-1. I wonder if he got those bonus levels randomly for heroic outcomes test of faith, disarming traps, and opening bags.

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>>284939605

The most obvious sign for lazy or incompetent development is RNG. And it is what ruined the game for me.

Ran out of ideas or time? Don't know how to create meaningful content? No problem simply put RNG in it advertise it as a "rogue like" and call it a day!

>>284962212
Are you sure this isn't an overdose Doc?

>>284962091
For me, real difficulty relies on "own fault"
"Own fault" means that the fact that you lost can always be traced back to a bad decision you made.
In games of chance, even if you always make the right decision you can still lose you are really unlucky, i'll give you that it does not happen that often, but it does happen.

>>284962081
>game heavily relies on RNG and denying that is lying to yourself
nobody's fucking denying that.
>Artificial difficulty defines that well
no it fucking doesn't, RNG is just fine as a definition, artificial difficulty has no fucking definition and thus is a meaningless word.

>>284962453
>using old bait
I'll take a nibble mate.

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>tfw my vestals keep getting nymphomania

>Doing well
>Brigand Fusilier gets two crits in a row on whole party
>They all go fucking insane

gg

>>284962523
The definition of artificial difficulty is that it's not real difficulty, see >>284962509

>>284961945
Most roguelikes do this.

If it was the opposite way it would be boring as fuck to grind for hours through the easy early game and then hit a stone wall eventually

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Babies that grew up on games with purely determined static game figures has completely made a generation retarded on what games of chance are when used in video games.

I don't know if there are actually trolls in the thread or just a bunch of dumb high school niggers ignorant to dice games.

>>284963023
Just go onto SPUF steam powered user forums and see for yourself. Do understand that a fair number of the people in this thread are just baiting though.

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>>284962794
>the definition of artificial difficulty is something that some dumb nameless nigger on 4chan came up with 4 posts ago
wow stop posting anytime

>>284962905
Grinding? What kinda roguelike are you playing?
>>284963023
I seriously hope you're not comparing games like DnD with this.

>>284963023
>dumb high school niggers ignorant to dice games.
Oxymoron, bro

>>284963179
I linked it because it was my post retard.
>nameless
Go back to reddit

Artificial Difficulty has got to among the stupidest fucking terms /v/ has come up with.

Most of /v/ doesn't even have a consensus on what the fuck it means.

>>284953413
Seriously, people need to learn how to cut their losses and run in rouge-likes and -lites. People always over commit to things then end up screwed.
>captcha:ocrap

>>284947485
Seems about right

>>284963190
DnD is a game a chance where your chances of success gets better as you level. Yes nigger, yes it is exactly the fucking same.

Prove me wrong, you can't.

>>284963391
cause it means fuckall.

>>284950329
/d/ vore threads plz go

Why is Crusader the best? My nigga has been stressed out and he just gets stronger.

>>284963409
Actually I can, did you ever play DnD in your whole fucking life? You have access to a literal arsenal of scrolls, wands, magic, prayers and magical items to deal with any situation you could think of.

>>284963391
Its a great way to weed out the parroting idiots. Artificial Difficulty IS a thing used by lazy or rushed dev teams in games. Just the same as GIT GUD is a true that you get better by playing more.

/v/ is a board as a whole is a cluster fuck of casual shits, lurkers, trolls, marketeers, social knight, various other cancers, and genuine hobbyists. As soon as you act as if its a hivemind. You are that fucking nigger faggot with an invalid opinion that is part of the cancer.

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>>284963714
most of them are tied to dice checks. roll a 1 in a critcal situation and you are fucked, no matter how prepared you are.
now if I were a dumb person like you are I would be screaming "muh artificial difficulty" but guess what, I'm not, I accept the mechanics for what they are and enjoy them without spouting buzzwords

>>284957276
>what is scouting
>what is doing things to increase the chance of scouting and generally swing RNG in your favor

>>284963960
>Artificial Difficulty IS a thing used by lazy or rushed dev teams in games.

Define it.

>>284963714
Yes, have you ever played DnD? You still haven't prove to me otherwise how its any different.

>>284964178
>Define it.

Lurk More.

>>284963960

>As soon as you act as if its a hivemind.

God fucking damnit. I swear to god, as soon as anyone goes "/v/ says" or "/v/ acts like" there's always some fucking dipshit who just feels compelled to pipe in
>/v/ is one person
Like we don't fucking know /v/ is more than one person. It's speaking generally. It's talking about observed consensus.

>>284964314

>I can't

I know.

>>284964314
List a game that has this artificial difficulty as such a detriment that it destroys the gameplay.

>>284939605

>DD
>Any kind of difficult

In 30+ hours I've only had to abandon a dungeon twice, and both times it was because I was being retarded and forgetting to bring enough supplies.

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>>284964312
You had fucking holy water, anti venom, herbs, and you STILL let him die. You just ARTIFICIALLY created DIFFICULTY to try an prove a point.

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>>284964312
let's analize this case here. you were fucked by the RNG and lost a Crusader.

Is this Artificial Difficulty, according to this definition here?>>284962509
Is it true that "you couldn't have predicted that, this is trial and error gameplay?"

Let's see what you could have done to avoid this.
>You could have brought Antivenom
>You could have brought a Vestal
>You could have brought a Plague Doctor
>You could have brought retired from the battle and used food to heal
>You could have equipped death blow resist trinket

I rest my case.

>>284964554
>artificial difficulty
>>destroys the gameplay
>not making a game boring, or needlessly longer with padding
That is not what it means, again you are parroting terms by using them wrong.

>>284942640

Goblet skellies have nothing on Swine Wretches. You think Tempting Goblet cries are bad? It's the same shit with Vomit, except it gives you The Runs, Syphilis and 9 different kind of AIDS.

>>284963409
That would make DnD a game that gets worse the longer you play it, which is the opposite of what it is.
Actually, your chances of success stay the same all the time since the situations you encounter get harder as well.
You merely acquire more possible solutions and have access to a bigger arsenal of skills and items.

>>284939605
>early access
Yeah nah I learned my lesson. When's it gonna be done?

>>284964641
Don't jump to conclusions, anon. He could just be shit.

>>284964871
>parroting terms by using them wrong.
use artificial difficulty correctly then
I'm still fucking waiting

>>284946050

>Tracking is hard because I have to do something other than BS

God you fucking babies are useless. Go back to DaS1 where everything is completely shut down by moving to the left or right.

>>284958720
Is there more of Graverobber?Any of Hellion?

>>284964970
I REFUSE to believe that.

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>The only way you can get truly RNG screwed is if a character gets crit dog piled at the beginning of a fight, and that is absurdly rare
>Everything else can be managed easily enough if your party setup isn't utterly retarded
>Scrubs complaining about how RNG dependent this game is

Truly repulsive. Also a protip to the new players: don't fuck with the curios besides bags and boxes unless you have the proper item to neutralize it. It's almost never worth it otherwise and your characters will get fucking stacked with bad traits and stress.

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>>284940151
STARCRAFT = REAL
RNGSTONE = ARTIFICIAL

>>284965040
Wait all day nigger.

>>284939605
The game gets easy as fuck once you get the hang on it. After week 15 you should be swimming in money and have enough high level heroes to tear the game a new one.

>>284947096

There really isn't. DD is fucking easy. What are you retards doing to find it hard in any way? It's simple resource management.

>>284964187
>>284964063
In DnD you can literally do anything, how can you even compare that to a videogame with strict limits?
Need kill the leader of the bandits? You could wait for the night, sneaking in their camp and making use of the veil of the night to make the kill, or you could disguise yourself as a bandit, get in and wait for the right moment to strike with horses ready for your escape, you could put fire to the camp, and wait until he gets out to kill him, the possibilities are endless. And you can prepare all you want, put traps, ask the guards for help, buy mercenaries to help.
There is simply no way this game can be compared to the depth DnD provides. Yes DnD uses dices, but the the game is strategically and tactically deep enough to offset the RNG.
Darkest dungeon relies mostly on numbers, that means going from 70% chance to hit to 75%, but that does not make the game any more deep, all it does it make it easier the more you progress. The consumables are not bad but there is a clear lack of them, most are only used for healing/removing debuffs.

>>284965067
Or Grave Robber x Hellion?

>>284964641
A character can only use a bandage/antivenom on themselves. Blight/Bleed damage happens at the beginning of the characters turn AKA the antivenom meant nothing.

but Pedro is a big shitter for not healing me.

>>284965067
http://rule34.paheal.net/post/list/Darkest_Dungeon/1
thank me later

>>284964871
You're a moron, thanks for confirming.

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>>284965308
ITS A GAME OF FUCKING CHANCE YOU FUCKING AUTIST! THEY ARE THE SAME AS IN THEY RELY ON FUCKING RANDOM NUMBERS FOR OUTCOMES BUT YOU GET BETTER OUTCOMES AS YOU PROGRESS IN THEM! THAT WAS THE FUCKING ARGUMENT!

WHAT ARE YOU TRYING TO SAY?!

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This game actually made me pretty sad but its probably just because I'm a pansy

>Campfire scenes are sad because party is helping each other out even though they're all probably going to die shortly anyway
>Hag was scary and stressful for me because being boiled/eaten alive is a serious fear of mine
>The pleads from my party members to help them didn't make me feel any better

>>284947913
grave robber is the only class with no damage penalty to ranged attacks i think? Add an insane crit rate and stacking accuracy buff and its a pretty reliable ranged dps.

>>284940151

Artificial is a stupid word to use. The word you all are thinking of is "cheap". Like when you make a turn in a hallway and there is a guy that killed you with a shotgun before you have time to react. Obviously you can try to plan out your moves, you don't know what is around every corner, but the fact that something you can't predict with in all previous gameplay knowledge in check, is cheap not artificial.

>>284953564
>>284953420

Reading books makes you think demons are in your head. Don't you idiots know anything?

>>284965040
>>284965590
samefag pls ;)

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>>284965595

>>284947096
This is fucking bullshit. You can flee almost any time and even if you get your team killed you can always hire a new one.

Why are the Necromancer and Hag so easy while the Swine King can knock your niggas out like it's Friday?

>>284965592
My point is that good games that relies on RNG also give have enough strategic depth for you to be able to offset the RNG, like DnD.
Darkest Dungeon does not possess that kind of depth, but still relies on RNG for everything.
I don't know how I can put this any simpler for you.

>>284965240
Babies first TBS game that relies on RNG?

>>284965595
>>Hag was scary and stressful for me because being boiled/eaten alive is a serious fear of mine
Same here, I have no idea why its so awful but just thinking about it is the worst shit imaginable.

>>284940151
>"artificial" difficulty
You cannot predict the difficulties ahead. (Heavy RNG, trial and error gameplay on your first run)

>"real" difficulty
You can see what's gonna happen and prepare for it/ avoid it.

Artificial difficulty can still be fun, and there's nothing inherently wrong with it. I like rougelikes, and those things are RNG to the max sometimes. Still, you can improve your strategy and get better at them.

>>284939605
You have two heroes who can damage the hag, what is your problem? Ignore the pot and shoot her until she dies, she doesn't even have many hp.

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>>284965841
Official Tier list

>BABBY TIER
Necromancer

>REAL MEN KILL WILBUR FIRST TIER
Swine King

>LITTERALLY SATAN TIER
Hag

>>284965853
>My point is that good games that relies on RNG
Okay now, I see. Your using subjective opinions to validate them. Never mind then you fucking idiot.

>>284966039
>Heavy RNG, trial and error gameplay on your first run
Seems like real gameplay to me. nothing artificial about that in the least.

>>284966141
Wow you really blew me away with that ad hominem, you really must be right with those arguments and that impeccable logic.

>>284966456
Stay mad nigger.

>>284953420
>read a book
>catch syphilis

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>>284965841
>Party getting fucked up
>One dies, three at deaths door
>They all survive and kill the Swine King
>Wilbur delivers a deathblow to all three with a 1 damage party-wide debuff

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>>284965853
>My point is that good games that relies on RNG also give have enough strategic depth for you to be able to offset the RNG
please refer to >>284964819
and possibly shut the fuck afterwards

>>284966079

>REAL MEN KILL WILBUR FIRST TIER

Did this on my first time fighting Swine Prince. No idea how I managed to win that. RIP Leper.

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Come on let's play

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>>284939605

>>284960269
General rule of thumb is 12 food and 8 torches if you want to be on the safe side and aren't doing a loot run. If you go into weald bring at least 1-2 shovels.

>>284958006
But you actually do get better at the game. Sure random dice rolls can fuck you over at the beginning of the game but once you get the hang on it, it is easy as fuck.

>>284966249
Well, I did say "artificial." It is an actual form of difficulty. I was just trying to define the buzzword m8.

Guys, guys, i just started to play this game and enjoyed it very much for the last few hours. Any general tips? Because i just lost a shitton of loot

>>284966646
>You could have brought Antivenom
Refer to >>284965432
>You could have brought a Vestal
>You could have brought a Plague Doctor
You don't choose your party, you take what's given to you.
>You could have equipped death blow resist trinket
You don't choose what trinkets you have
>You could have brought retired from the battle and used food to heal
Valid, he could have done that, that mean he played bad and deserved to die. It's only artificial difficulty if he did all the right things and still died.

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>buying early access shit

>>284965595
It doesn't necessarily make me sad but goddamn if it isn't a great dark fantasy setting.

>the change in music when your torch goes out ramping up the tenseness 100%
>the music change in the warrens especially with the fucking pig squeals

Genuinely unsettling.

>>284939605

To be fair that's really the only artificial difficulty part.

So have they added more content yet?

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>>284967275
>blights does damage at the start of the turn
he had a vial and definitely could have used it before. he also allowed his crusader to go at low health so much
>You don't choose your party, you take what's given to you.
you fucking what?
>You don't choose what trinkets you have
fair enough

>>284967186
Start over, and learn from you previous mistakes. Once your to poor to afford bare minimum provisions for a medium length dungeon. You're better off starting over. Basic provisions for a dungeon without a camp out is a least 12 food, 8 torches, and bring a shovel. I cannot count he number of times I should had bought ONE fucking shovel.

>>284967275
>You don't choose your party, you take what's given to you.
The fuck are you on? Your entire strategy starts at the party selection screen.

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>>284967458
>not pirating early access shit

>implying I'll need anything else but Vestal Jester Hellion Hellion
V/J are swapable and entire lineup is capable of attacking at least something from any position.

Alternatively I've done double holy spear crusaders in the front. But If It Bleeds is just to retarded to give up as it murders literally every boss

>>284967275
Have you even played the game past the first couple of weeks you gigantic retard?

>>284955696
That was one of my most favorite parts of the game

You open to that and then it just leads straight into the opening screen.
The music and just nothing but text set that tone right away

day time /v/ is sure full of highschool/collage/workstation casual retards

>>284967776
Thanks. What upgrades are most important?

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>>284967458
>not playing the GOTY 2015

>>284967748
>>284967873
>>284968009
I meant by that you need to choose from what the caravan gives you, early game having a good party is down to luck.

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>>284968231


> flash game with JRPG combat and SICKDARK art style
> GOTY, let alone good

>>284939605
Ge higher dodge, fag. Hag is the worst earlygame boss for difficulty, just wait until you get to Swine God

I don't know what's more pathetic, this game or the people who defend it.

Posts in DD threads are usually something like "Look how I got fucked over by RNG haha isn't this game soo hardcore". It's like that because beyond those events, there's nothing much to the game. It revolves around random chance: crits, how characters get quirks.

What is there beyond that? When RNG doesn't destroy you, the game really is a complete breeze. The system is simple and easy to understand and master, as far as the elements you have control over.

This is why I'll never understand the "git gud" crowd. The game doesn't present an engaging challenge. I'm quite sure everyone who stopped playing didn't do it because they weren't capable of continuing, but because they simply noticed all the game's shortcomings. Why continue to play a shallow, unrewarding game?

It's possible that I'm being too harsh on a game that's not even complete, but in order to change my opinion it would require more than just more content, but a whole reworking of the mechanics.

tl;dr Game is shallow, tries to compensate for it with RNG.

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>>284968194
wagon for new heroes, blacksmith (armor), guild, blacksmith (weapons)

in that order

also look at the quirks that your heroes have and upgrade the parts of Taver/Abbey that would give you better stress relief

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>>284967458
>you have to buy games to play them

>>284940374

If it grabs one of your only party members that can fucking do anything to the Hag and it's one of your valued party members that you don't want to lose then yeah people might go after the pot.

What pissed me off a lot was how she just grabbed whoever the fuck she wanted and I lost my bounty hunter because of that, haven't really played since as a result since I also started to see the stark lack of content at that point.

>>284968439
>rng is all there is to the combat
Yeah I remember back when I took the "ise any attack on any enemy until it hits" route. I lost a lot of people.

>>284968194
Early game upgrades will be to worry about your roster pool, from the wagon. I would also look into upgrading your abbey, and tavern to stress release. It will get costly when the stress mounts up too high.

You'll eventually figure out the rest from there.

>>284968340
You can always start a new mission and quit. After that you get new heroes. Why don't you try learning the basics of the game before you complain?

>>284952027
Pretty much this.

>>284968439
>I don't like the mechanics of the game so they should be redesigned to appeal to me
get your own kikestarter mate

>>284968545
>he didn't even get into the later dungeons
I agree the games a bit sparce but if you haven't even killed the first few bosses you havent seen the content.

>>284967748
Looking back at the raw video;

>Got surprised.
>Occultist/HWM moved to front.
>Occultist spends two turns at the front due to me miscalcing where everyone would be after swap/holylance/pointblank.
>Pally got hit with three groping swipe 7's, marked and gassed with escape cloud (over two turns, a lot of focus fire).
>Move him forward so the occultist can go back (and be able to heal again).
>Pally was still marked from earlier.
>The one heal Pedro makes during the fight and he heals for nothing.
So yeah, it was all completely avoidable if I got Pedro to the back lines sooner. He ended up killing my other friend with a clutch 0HP heal a few dungeons later.

I was also apparently unironically listening to Phil Collins.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Mt0ee9FraQ

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>>284965109
>play darkness only
>sometiems think "Oh fukn rng gaem"
>get tons of crits myself at 20~35% crit rate per person (and can get higher with jester)
>get rekt fukn scrub gaem
>mfw

>>284968415
It'll be ISO game of the year when released. I fear the early access beta testing US for a smartphone game.

>>284942315

I was having fun with Vestal/Occultist/Bounty Hunter/Crusader for a bit, marking with the occultist and collecting bounty for 2x damage is pretty awesome.

Also, anybody who picks Leper over Crusader is a retard, enjoy your misses for days.

>>284968441
>>284968624
Thank you

>>284968415
> sickdark
Well shit, it's that faggot again. Isn't there a Bloodborne threat you can shit up?

>>284967490
>get to pitch black
>Black as death
pls more torches

>>284968439
tl;dr Its fun, and you're a cunt.

>>284968780
>leper
>missing
95 accuracy, and leper becomes unerringly accurate after a campsite buff.
Leper is a late game god. 20 damage with hew god.

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>Get hit by mass Crit.
>Just push exit.
>When I reopen the game it's even my turn again.

I'm 2PRO.

>>284968903
>it's only not shit when I waste respite points buffing him rather than getting a crusader who does just as much without otherwise crippled accuracy

kek

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>>284968780
>shitting on my husbando
he will fuck you up
just give him a couple rounds to buff himself and he will fuck you up I swear

>>284969151
>lategame crusader
Absolutely garbage, his trinkets are all shit.
>lategame leper
I have two berzerker masks and I always move first.

>>284969058
>savescumming
you're like a jew Hitler

>>284968616

Oh fuck you gotta attack the fucker that does the most damage first, what strategy

>>284968739
>>284968871
lel

>>284969359
>attack the fucker that does the most damage first
Oh god enjoy your stress, fag.

I would have said that "artificial" difficulty is just number padding.

So most FPS/RPG difficulty settings rarely come from the AI being smarter, or getting new abilities/functions...but just more HP/damage and/or YOU have less hp (or rarely less damage).
It just pads out how long fights takes and usually forces specific styles of play. So if only mage/warrior are valid on hard mode, rogue is either retarded or the difficulty nullifies it out in some unfair way.
But having difficulty that requires more mastery of controls/skill or require more planning isn't necessarily a bad thing.

I use ME2 as an example what I like and hate about difficulty. Enemies gained armor or shields that they didn't have before (or barriers later on) and used skills more often, some even just having them when they didnt before.
BUT this was also tied into difficulty basically meaning "how long you can have Shepard out of cover before you have to go back into cover to wait for shields". Always felt lame

>>284969151
>two respite points
Oh nooooo, I could have had one of the more useless abilities.
Seriously, don't be mad simply because Leper is a straight upgrade to Crusader

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>>284969359
Stupid ass, attack stress-based monsters first, those are always first priority if you dont want a party filled with lunatics.

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>>284968748
>wasting turns to reposition while you have holy lance
Phil Collins's alright though

Is there new content yet?

Both Hand of Fate and Dankest Dongeon make me laugh at people whining about RNG.

>>284969587
How is Hand of Fate? I've heard good things and it looks like a good DnD substitute

>>284969587
People don't whine about RNG because it's hard, they whine because it's lazy.

>>284969587
RNG doesn't get me booty bothered, because that's pretty much their central mechanic. I enjoy pretend-gambling, and hell in Dank of Fate I've gotten to the point where I can actually keep my eyes on the success cards during shuffling.

>>284969710
But it's not in this case, if Darkest Dungeon had RNG be more important than strategy, it would be lazy.

Is Darkest Dungeon even good?

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>>284969575
SIX MONTHS
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