my only frame of reference is fantasy rpg so I'll say:
melee fighter
ranged fighter
wizard
rogue
>>55391048
>Ranged fighter
>Wizard
Redundant, a wizard is already dealing heavy damage from range.
Switch the former for a healer and you've got it
Depends on the setting, the mechanics, and the goal of the party. Without context I'm going with Black Mage, White Mage, Red Mage, Blue Mage.
>>55391169
classic. thought about this too but I like a fighter hanging back in case the wizard starts to get ganked
>>55391201
nice. wanted to keep vague to see what an ideal party is in other systems
>>55391201
But anon, there was no blue mage in FFI so all you had was Black, White, Red(black), Red(white)
Alchemist/Rogue
Alchemist/Fighter
Alchemist/Sorcerer
Alchemist/Barbarian
>>55391048
Two martials, a wizard and somebody with connections and skills. You're pretty much right.
>>55391169
Play something other than D&D
>>55391048
for d&d 4 wizards would be ideal
>>55391048
>cleric
>wizard
>fighter
>rogue
>>55391048
Fighter, Rogue, Cleric, Wizard
Fighter is tank and spank
Rogue is utility and burst dmg
Cleric is support and secondary tank
Wizard is a wizard and therefore everything
>>55391351
Fighter Barbarian(Ranger?) Rogue Mage
>>55391351
Paladin, Expert, Rogue, Warlock
Fighter
Wizard
Rogue
Cleric
>>55391554
There was a homebrew 5th edition class that was made that was sort of like Expert taken and made into a proper class. I wish I remembered what it was called I would like to hold onto that bit of homebrew.
>>55391581
>5e
Expert is 3.5 DMPC class
>>55391595
I'm aware of that, but someone made a 5th homebrew class that was essentially a mundane expert.
>>55391645
I gathered, and no offense. But my point was: why play 5e when 3.5 exists.
>>55391048
D&D 5th Ed.
4 Bards.
>>55391664
Because 3.5 is shit, bloated, outdated, a trainwreck, inconsistent, confusing, messy, unbalanced, and terribly designed from start to finish.
>>55391763
I think you accidentally put a "3." in front of your 5WAAG
>>55391169
The wizard in OP's pic is an illusionist, you drooling retard.
>>55391784
>>55391763
no
not here
>>55391048
You always want two melee-capable fighters because a single fighter can't block a standard hallway. In early editions of D&D, fighters were just as capable at ranged combat as they were in melee, so all fighters were "ranged fighters" as well as every other kind of fighter.
One wizard is fine, but two wizards can actually share spells by copying from each others' spellbooks, which is valuable, but more than one wizard is more risky. One skillmonkey is great.
>>55391048
Brick
Backup Brick
Healer
Backup Healer
Mage
Sneak
Face
Most classes should be able to either take on at least two roles themselves or have some sort of pet/summon that can perform a backup role, so in reality there will only be about 4 players to cover all seven roles.
Backup roles can usually perform one function of the overall role fairly well but not all of them. If bricks are expected to both take and deal damage in melee, or if healers can heal and buff, then back bricks can either take or deal melee damage and backup healers will either heal or buff.
4 characters is easily ideal and allows some leeway into party comp. With only three, your party will either be stretched trying to fulfill all the roles or missing a role, both of which have their own issues. Five also works but can get repetitive with characters stepping on each other's toes and more than that is too many, since it slows down the game.
All Imperial Guardsmen.
>>55392305
kek
Fighter
Rogue
Wizard
Cleric
Paladin
Barbarian
Bard
Sorcerer
>>55391048
without knowing mechanics or setting;
Wall, Face, Skill-monkey, Caster
4 Bards.
The brains, the looks, the muscle, and the wildcard.
>>55393093
But what about the shocker?
>>55391048
ideal 4 man party:
- Host
- Scheduler
- Snack Provider
- GM
Leader, Smart Guy, Big Guy, and The Chick
>>55391048
Rogue/Fighter, Cleric/Paladin, Wizard/Alchemist and Ranger/Bard
Fighter
Black Mage
Thief
Red Mage
>>55391784
>>55391763
>>55391664
>people actually arguing over the "differences" between 5e and 3.PF
well now I've seen everything.
>>55391048
I play 4e, and we tend to optimize for fun just as much as we optimize for power
Shifter Warden
Human Warlord
Bugbear Rogue
Genasi Wizard
Every role is taken care of SOLIDLY, and each has some sub-elements of control, which is honestly the best secondary role to have, save for the warden, who is a secondary leader/healer, which is just great for the warden
>>55391048
>Wizard
>Cleric
>Druid
>Bard
Cleric that is the leader
Fighter that grew up on the streets.
Wizard that spent all his time in the library.
Ranger that grew up hunting and outdoors shit.
I'll skip on the rogue/assassin types and make do.
>>55391048
A Knight, a wizard, an archer and a rogue all walk into an 80's tavern
The A-Team. The guy with the plans, the tough guy, the handsome chatter and the wild card.
Barbarian
Ranger
Paladin
Monk
Should be fun, might substitute monk with fighter though.
>>55394090
shut up 4rry. nobody plays your game at all.
>>55391048
Solver of practical problems
Solver of social problems
Solver of violence problems
Coordinator/information provider
can be mix and matched as needed but as a group, all 4 must be present.
Two fighters, a rogue, and a mage/support caster.
Splitting up types of magic into separate classes and making wizards anything other then wise sages with healing, banishing, and maybe illusion magic was a huge mistake.
>>55391048
Healer
Caster
Warrior/tank
Rogue/glass canon
The Face.
The Hand.
The Eye.
The Mind.
>>55391048
Squad Lead
Autorifleman
Marksman
Heavy Gunner
>>55391048
Tank, healer, range dps and melee dps
>>55391048
A barbarian, two healers, and a wizard.
3 supports 1 berserker
1 specialized in crowd control and debuffing
1 in buffing and other supporting spell
1 in healing
>>55391048
1 tank
1 DPS
1 healer
1 toolbox
Who cares? You adopt the adventure to the party composition. My players could roll four sorcerers if they wanted.
>>55391048
A human without a name on a quest to find a new one.
A serene half-orc that fights so others don't have to.
An exile that dreams of slaying the enemies who drove his people away.
A cute mascot character that will one day rule the world.
>>55398284
>who cares?
40+ anons apparently
but enjoy your (you)
>>55397755
Joke's on you, I play AD&D, and you're OGL garbage has been shitting up the hobby for two fucking decades.
Seriously though, if you come from a perspective other than "I started with 3rd, played a bunch of games identical to 3rd, and absorbed every detail on the optimization boards until even the slightest minutia seems different because 'it changes the meta'" it's genuinely difficult to tell the difference between 3e and 5e. 3e and 4e both burst into fucking flames they were so bad, but at-least they had the balls to be different and try something new: that's how we learn new things, by trying new things and often failing. 5e is just.... so corporate-focus-group-going-backwards-safe it's sad. It doesn't try anything new at all.
>>55391048
>Cleric
>Cleric
>Cleric
>Cleric
Need a melee guy? There's a cleric build for that.
Need a skillful guy? There's a cleric build for that.
Need a ranged damage guy? There's multiple cleric builds for that.
Need healing? ALL of them can do that!
>>55399639
>>55399639
I've thought about running this party. Other than being satisfying as a huge clericfag, it seems like it'd be the most viable monoclass party
>>55391048
Regardless of skill, a four-man nobleman party
>>55400726
Is that Jesus and Buddha?
>>55399639
Cleric is literally best class
Nobody seems to complain about clerics though.
>>55401153
My guess is, from left to right
>????? (Quetzlcoatl?)
>Abraham
>Muhammad (how is the artist even alive?)
>Buddha
>Jesus (in a leather jacket for some reason)
>Cthulhu
>>55401153
And Mohammed, and Moses, And Quezcoatal, and Cuthulu,
Why do you ask?
>>55401244
>One of these things is not like the other
Here's looking at you Big A
>>55392496
So simple yet so beautiful
Fighter
Black Mage
Red Mage
Thief
>>55391048
Factotum
Wizard
Cleric
Thrallherd
I can't believe nobody's posted it.
>>55401467
5 people
Kakyon best
>>55401359
Oh you...I see what you did there anon...
>>55401467
Fuck, that's five.
Well, here-- Polnareff is redundant, Star Platinum is straight up better than Silver Chariot, anyway
>>55391048
Depends on setting and power level.
For example in a high fantasy world with powerful magic, your ideal 4 man party might be four different types of Wizard.
>>55391048
For fantasy
>Fighter
>Cleric
>Magic-user
>Thief
For 40k stuff
>Guardsman
>Commissar
>Psyker
>Tech Priest
But the best party I ever had consisted of:
>A noble knight (The Nun's Priest's Tale)
>A self-proclaimed knight (Don Quixote)
>A psychotic cleric (The Hunchback of Notre Dame, with some Powerwolf Album covers)
>And a nun with guns (Two Mules for Sister Sarah, and some Sin City thrown in there)Ironclaw: Crusades edition was the greatest thing I have ever beheld.
>>55391048
>ideal 4 man party
>4 man
Clearly you want a fire team. Ideally you split up a hooligan kit among the 4 of you, and everyone has CLS training
>>55391048
Solo, Fixer, Techie, Rocker
>>55391048
I'd say that it's:
Cleric, but not the kind that fights
Wizard, the shooty, zappy kind
Rogue, but not the super stabby kind
Barbarian
Honestly, you can replace that fourth one with any kind of front line martial you'd like, but I usually default to barbarian. Maybe you can replace the cleric with a bard, too, but there's less wiggle room there.
>>55401843
>Cleric, but not the kind that fights
>Cleric, the shooty, zappy kind
>Cleric, but not the super stabby kind
>Any kind of front line martial you'd like, such as Cleric
3 bards in clown makeup:
- orc
- dwarf
- gnome
and a drow bard, as mime.
>>55401492And the Fighter is equipped with sword-chucks, yo
Occult, Helion, Abomination, Jester
>>55402248
You're a good person anon.
>>55402310
Vestal, Plague Doctof, Highwayman, Crusader
>>55391048
>What is the ideal 4 man party?
Depends entirely on what sort of ideals you adhere to.
>>55391048
Shield Fighter
Sniper Rogue
Blaster/Support Caster
Bard/Healer Cleric
1 BBEG
7000 Skeletons
Good luck reaching me.
>>55391048
Melee tank
Rogue
Ranged damage
Cleric or Bard
>>55398641
the future is now, grognard.
>>55391048
>>55401467
>>55401479
>>55401500
'jo ref?
Cleric
Barbarian
Wizard
Rogue
>>55391048
For sure have a Druid and a Cavalier. Druid turns into a bear and have it act as the Cavalier's mount.
Bonus points if there some sort of warlord to beef them up a bit more.
How about a 5 man party?
Face + backup utility spells/skills and damage
Tank + melee damage
Healer + buffs
Skillmonkey + high crit damage (ranged or melee)
Caster + loremaster
This kind of layout reduces MAD dependency in D&D and similar systems, since you get a decent spread of the roles everyone is trying to fill.
You get a diverse spread of damage and lots of utility/healing redundancy in the event that the healer/skillmonkey needs helpplus you can ship the tank and healer, and also the skillmonkey and caster. The party face would romance outside of the party
>>55391048
Final Fantasy 1 has taught me the following, which has progressed into nearly every system I've ever been in.
The ideal THREE man party is as follows:
> 1) Healer
> 2) Ranged/Magic Specialist (details vary between systems)
> 3) Physical Fighter/Tank
Anything past that is padding.
Mind, padding can be good. Sufficiently good padding can make things easier, comfier. But you don't NEED anything else.
Any remaining slots should therefore concentrate on smoothing out and supplementing the existing party.
Rogues are situational, and it depends on the DM. Some DMs never use traps or locks, and so a Rogue is unneeded. Some throw that shit in like they're having a sale, and in that case a rogue is extremely helpful. Maybe your game needs a scout, because your DM likes to spring ambushes, so you get a ranger. Maybe you just want a backup spellcaster to buff the shit out of the party faster. But it just depends on what you're going to be up against.
>>55405172
Objectively wrong. Everyone knows that the most optimal FOUR man party from Final Fantasy I is:
>White Mage
>White Mage
>White Mage
>White Mage
>>55391048
>wizard
>cleric
>wizard
>wizard
>>55391048
Fuck wizards except magic is actually kind of useful so you can stay Red Mage
Wizard, cleric, druid, bard
>>55391332
i say 2 wizards 2 clerics for tanking and healing and spellcasting
>Team leader/grenadier
>Rifleman
>Automatic rifleman
>Designated marksman
>sammy
>hacker
>mage
>face
>>55398164
You're missing an assistant gunner, unless the SL is pulling double duty.
>>55406332
Pic related or 4 black belts are pretty great too. Go fast, and slap ass.
>>55392305
Fuck you I bought this Rocket Launcher, I'll use it on this hiest if and when I want
>>55401153
I'm led to believe it's not uncommon for those two to be shown together.
Whiskeyjack
Quick Ben
Kalam
Fiddler
>>55391048
>Barbarian Female
>Barbarian Female
>Barbarian Female
>Sorcerer Male
Prove me wrong
>>55399639
In 5e at least, the same can also be done with bards.
>>55404154
The "future" is a 20 year old game system that every single company and developer other than Wizards and Piazo has moved on from?
>>55391048
fighter
thief
magic-user
cleric
>>55391048
Paladin
Paladin
Paladin
Paladin
>>55405172
rogue seems pretty important desu
someone highly mobile and stealthy for recon/burst damage and also handy enough to open locks and disarm traps
i thought people were of the opinion that the healer is the most expendable?
Tiddies
>>55391048
Summoner
Enchanter
Warrior/Monk
Spy/Assassin
>>55391048
>Tank
>DPS
>Healer
>Utility
Every party needs these 4 roles, can be any mix or match up of them.
>>55391169
>>Ranged fighter
>>Wizard
>same
depends entirely on the game, in some games there is a big difference between magical attacks and physical attacks
I'd say your best team is something like this.
Face
Tank
DPS
Healer
>>55391048
Ratcatcher
Baliff
Hedge Wizard
Tax Collector
Medic (Those who cannot recover will not survive)
Combative (Those who cannot engage the enemy will be killed)
Utility (Not all obstacles can be slain)
Last one is either
Stealth (Not all enemies can be taken on head on)
Face (Some solutions require words instead of arms)
>>55413936
>Stealth
Name one (1) system that handles stealth in a satisfying way for everyone involved.
>>55391351
>eater, dwarf, shota, slut
>>55391595
>DMPC class
>>55391351
Source?
>>55414108
There isn't one, to my knowledge. That's a very good point.
How would you improve it, as a way of solving problems?
>>55414156
Dungeon Meshi.
They eat monsters.
It's cute, until it goes off the rails.
Then it's cute and horrifying.
All fighters/monks
>>55414187
Stop hamfisting it into the same resolution system that covers shit like "carpentry" and "sailing" and make it its own subsystem like combat is.
>>55414108
Shadowrun stealth can be done very satisfyingly if done properly and the GM and players both do a lot of prep and legwork.
There's a bunch of different detection systems and ways of bypassing them, all of which have considerations and implications for the rest of the run.
>>55414237
Ok, that's vague. I kinda assumed that's where we were starting, but also assumed you had a system/solution in mind.
Bard
Bard
Bard
Monk
>>55411240
>>55391048
Tried/hybrids
Archmage Fighter Knight
Psychic Ninja
Shield Knight Cleric
Gunner Alchemist Mechanic
>>55393085
>not 3 Bards and a Fighter Who Thinks He's A Bard
>>55393197
Well who's the Lance? Don't tell me you're doubling up.
>>55391351
What happened to her hand?
>>55391048
>Psychic Magic Knight
Jedi but more dynamic and pisonic can teleport etc
>Ninja Mage
Think of naruto sage, sanin mode
Magic plus fighting skills
>Paladin
Reignhardt + Lucio passive healing
With a bit of holy magic
>Mechanic
Jack of all trades, Alchemist + Thinker gadgetry, Long ranger
>>55417122
It's a frog suit.
>>55414150
Do you even level 2 Survivalist?
>>55391048
with fantasycraft, Id say:
wood elf archer burglar 4/scout x
dwarf fighter soldier (axe, shield, armor)
gnome wizard mage (search, investigate, prestidigitation, cha skills)
crusading human cleric priest (polearms, healing, strength)
That's basically the same as a bard/cleric/fighter/ranger/rogue/wizard all grouped into 4 people.
>>55391048
Fighter
Rogue
Cleric
Wizard
Water Mage, Fire Mage, Wind Mage and Earth Mage of course.
>>55398641
I wonder if they'll be taking risks with 6th edition. Guess we'll know in a decade or whatever.
>>55421837
>Water Mage
cleric
>Fire Mage
wizard
>Wind Mage
rogue
>Earth Mage
fighter
Got it.
This
>>55391048
>D&D
Fighter
Cleric
Magic-User
Rogue
>MMOs
DPS
Healer
Tank
Controller
>>55391048
Fighter
Fighter
Fighter
Wizard
>>55391048
Well if it's a four person party, then going for the four temperaments would likely be a very good idea.
If you mean mechanically, that obviously depends on the system.
>>55391263
>not playing superior ffV
>>55391048
Bard
Bard
Bard
Bard
>>55391292
alchemist/barbarian
how do i into books?
>>55414126
>Slut
i dont even read dungeon meshi but from my exposure she's not that at all, a THOT perhaps at worst, but she's wholesome for the family
>>55391048
Dexter was a good anime, one of the last good western animes
>>55391048
Monk/Rune Knight
Rogue/Alchemist
Time Mage/Wizard
Warrior/Defender
>>55398157
>The hand
I think you mean, the Fist.
>>55391048
Vestal - Plague Doctor - Highwayman - Crusader
>>55391048
Blue Mage
Blue Mage
Blue Mage
Blue Mage
The Monster Mash.
>>55391454
>wizard is utility
>>55425124
They have gunslinger now?
>BDF
>Skill Monkey
>God Caster
>Healbot
>>55424714
You eat them, duh.
>>55425677
If you're talking about the musketeer, it's an alt skin for Arbalest.
>>55391048
>Driver
>Gunner
>Loader
>Commander
>>55391048
Giant Archer
Halfling Rogue
Goblin Machinist
Human Face/Monk/Gunslinger (Essentially, take Van Damme, Steven Seagal, and Bruce Willis and it's their gestalt)
Goblin Machinist provides the vehicles for transportation. Giant Archer provides artillery and far-scouting. Rogue is the infiltrator and close-scouter. Human Face takes the lead as a relatable self-insert Gary Stu that every story needs to later be serialized as a comic or animated short.
>>55391048
Four white mages
>>55427642
It'll never work
>>55401500
>Star Platinum is straight up better than Silver Chariot, anyway
Nigga what? It has one of the highest kill counts in Stardust Crusaders. It's also just as fast as Star Platinum, can remove its armor to become EVEN FASTER, can shoot its blade with damn near pinpoint accuracy, and can even dual wield (though I'm not sure if it's because Anubis was a stand or if he can just use any physical object he wants).
If anything, Avdol is the most redundant because Red Magician only really wins like one fight on its own andends up dying like twice by the end of the series.
>>55391863
>In early editions of D&D, fighters were just as capable at ranged combat as they were in melee, so all fighters were "ranged fighters" as well as every other kind of fighter.
Except for like ability scores, weapon specialization, allocation of resources, and item slot priorities being different
>>55401243
>Idiot complains about cleric being OP
>Idiot plays cleric
>Idiot has fun because they're tanky and still powerful if you forget half their abilities and spells.
>Idiot likes cleric.
>Idiot complains about wizard being OP.
>Idiot plays wizard.
>Idiot dies lvl 1 because they don't understand their spells and angered a housecat.
>Idiot hates wizard.
>>55391048
Tank, DPS, healer, support.
>>55391201
>Four white mages
>>55412561
In any game with perma-death, having a reliable means of healing outside of combat is what separates heroes from legends. The only problem with healing is that nobody wants to play it because a) restoring X HP every turn isn't all that engaging and b) they're going to lose that HP on the following turn anyways.
This is why Clerics became so powerful in 3rd edition, because people remember being the Cleric who sat in the back row healing people , so they decided to buff them so that they actually had options outside of that, which threw off the scale and made them too powerful.
>>55425248
>My Friend of similar complexion
Final Fantasy Tactics Advance had some really good Blue Magic. I made Marche a Blue Mage/Paladin so he could cover allies and then have the damage go to his MP. Plus with Paladin buffs and Blue Magic buffs/debuffs like Angel Whisper, Dragon Force/Off, and Bad Breath he was a total beast late game. Kinda pissed in A2 you couldn't use Magick Frenzy with Blue Magic as Matra Magic or Limit Glove Combos would be hilariously fun to do.
>>55391048
paladin
paladin
paladin
paladin
the evil is so afraid it smites itself
>>55430881
>Cleric
>Paladin
>Zealot Barbarian
>Inquisitor Rogue
Fantasy is easy, but what would be the ideal/most standard one party for other settings? Like sci-fi or post-apo for example? I know it "depends on the setting", but what are some most common tropes and archetypes you would pick for ideal party in other settings?
>>55424804
>>55424804
Wouldn't that be Wakfu?
I would go fighter, cleric, wizard, and rogue. Provides good balance of offensive, defensive, and utility in most any situation. I think everyone should make sure to have a ranged and close combat plan even if it amounts to the wizard retreating a bit or the fighter using a crossbow they are less than skilled with.