Traveller General: Luxury Edition

>>55319938
Discord link has expired

Was the Irresponsible Captain Tylor based on somebody's traveller game?

>>55320219
Not that we know of, but it wouldn't be a surprise.

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The map I posted last thread
Background: This area was once the fringes of the Old Empire. During the Civil War that fractured said Empire, it got off fairly light - just some raiding, a blown up naval depot, and a brief few years as part of the front lines that got abandoned after being wrecked.
During the Long Night that followed (according to some specialist scholars, it was less of a Long Night and more of a Medium Nap, since the old Imperial Core regions were fairly fine), it slid even further, despite keeping a few working examples of quarter-jump drives, and a decaying fleet of capitol ships in the hands of pretentious raiders.
The area known as "The Daughters" consists of Bellatine (0404), which provided colonists, supplies, and tech aid to the other three worlds (hence the phrase "daughter worlds"), in exchange for completely dominating them economically and culturally. This has eased up somewhat, but not much.
The Rendival Dukes are raiders, descended from Navy deserters. Pretentious shits. Fun parties though, and you can get "moderately worn" starships and parts from them for fairly cheap.
The Usubet Compact was founded by a ticked off Blue Noble a few hundred years back. Fleeing with a fleet of colonists, he forgot to bring adequate tech support, and now that the border of Blue has caught up with his descendants, they realize that they haven't caught up with his dream...

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>>55322699
Now, right next door (the trade route from RedvsBlue at 1004 leads to 0104 on this map),
we see the borders of Blue and Yellow. Same origin story as Red - the descendants of the factions that the Old Empire split into.
The only multi-world government here is the Marakiyu Federation, which is... Rather generic right now.

>>55322758
More Generic than the blue and yellow empire?

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Anybody watching Dark Matter here ?

The Premise would be fun with experienced players.

Just hand them basically blank sheets, besides names and apperance and let them find out what their abilites and skills are during play.

>>55323566
the show is good, but the sudden introduction of some of the more fantastical scifi tropes seemed out of place in the last few seasons.
Is it anything like finding out about the Ancients in Traveller?

>>55323391
For now, yes. Those have history, and enemies. Marakiyu doesn't have that. Other than pirates.

>>55323675
Well, i'd assume that some more well traveled travellers would've heard about the ancients.

And there are a few "gold digger" type of people who make a living off their remains.
Probably the most well versed about them, next to imerial researchers.

But unless you live near a site of them or have some important ruin of them in your systen, chances are that you have never heard of them.

>>55323717
Well let's change than. First, what Basic culture do they have?

>>55323566

Yep, I'm sad to hear it got cancelled just as things were ramping up.

>>55324033
aw shit, not again, I'm just at episode 4.

Be gentle, how much more time do i have ?

>>55324057

Up till the end of season 3. The cancellation was just announced like a week and a half ago.
Still too early to tell if it might get picked up by somebody else, though I wouldn't count on it.
OTOH, a graphic novel continuation seems likely, since it was born from a graphic novel in the first place.

>>55323941
http://www.chaoticshiny.com/culturemixgen.php
is pretty good.
So I'll pick
>ancient Greek fighting style, ancient Italian death rites, ancient African cuisine, modern Australian language, and historical Korean fashions
With this, we can say base culture would be Italian/Korean via Australia
Via World Builder's Handbook
Conservative/Advancing
Unaggressive/Neutral
Discordant/Xenophilic

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>>55319938

Anybody who is into the asethetic of the 60's/70's Space opera look should look into getting the videogame "Prey". it is absolutely OOZING with that feel, and the soundtrack matches it too.


I aint much of a videogame guy, but I'm loving the shit out of it so far

>>55323867
> chances are you've never heard of the ancients
All it would take is one documentary on treevee, or one lesson in school. There woould be planets where the Ancients wouldn't fit with the local dogma; there they'd be forbidden lore.

I'd also imagine that the Ancients would feature in some forms of entertainment, think of the 3I version of Indiana Jones movies. Surely the film Ancients would be very much unlike hte real thing, but the idea of looking for their relics would stick in the mind of adventurers.

>>55325960
Man that's like your opinion and all.

Also it takes only one short documentary to learn the basics about many things, people are still uneducated.
The Average person in Traveller is still just a Farmer, Office worker, Artist and will not pursue that knowledge unless by personal interest.

In general >>55323675
depends on your traveller universe, both flavours are legit and fit into the OTU.

Are all ancients droyne? or were there other races who'd qualify as ancients, were the droyne/ancients just that divergent from one another? and is it true that some droyne can still create/maintain ancients level tech?

>>55326467
>Are all ancients droyne?

Nah, there were other races all over the place. If you find some weird old gizmo, it might be the Ancients, or it might be pre-Maghiz Darrian, or it might be First Imperium or Rule of Man stuff, or something else entirely.
Also I maintain that Grandfather is a liar, and his story about the Ancients is a nice fairy tale he's telling the neighbor's kids

>>55326590
Cool, so the ancients were just...the MOST advanced then?

>>55326590
>>55326467
The Ancients (capital A) were an offshoot of the Droyne who used Humans, created and used Vargr, and built and used robots as servants. That was about 300,000 years ago.

About 15,000 years prior to OTU current, a few of the transplanted humans and at least one other race started to re-civilize. At least one effort made it to space and began expanding, but is was not until the Vilani and Geonee (two of the transplanted Human groups) developed jump drive about 9000 years ago that things really got going.

So you have Human or other recent remnants from the last 10,000 years all over the place, and a more scattered and much older collection of Ancients stuff.

There are some Droyne worlds that can make and maintain some amazing stuff, but none of the really old super tech Ancients stuff is within their reach as such.

>>55326951
Let's just say that archeology is way more profitable in traveller than one might think at first.

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>>55322699
And as we move spinward of here, here we see the edges of the Red Empire, and see why they're not that interested in the first map. Here is a rich area, full of taxes.
And thanks to Captcha, we have a name! The Kempjack Empire, heirs of the Old Archduke Kempjack!

>>55327221
It is certainly more interesting. Thousands of worlds have millennia of settled history, sometimes interrupted several times.

>>55327791
That's why I went with a long "Antiquity" period as part of my setting, right after the ancients.
Of course, I'll probably cut out all the major pulpy bits, but at the same time... Pulp.

>>55326821
>Cool, so the ancients were just...the MOST advanced then?

That's a good way to think of it, but >>55326590's answer is both wrong and right. Let me explain.

There have been many technological and even starfaring races before the Ancients, after the Ancients, and before the various Imperiums. Forex, in the AotI novel, the hero comes across a gadget which is 3 million years old. What sets the Ancients and the Vilani/1st Imperium apart from all the others is they had JUMP DRIVE. The Ancients were the 1st to develop, the Droyne kept it after the Ancients fell, the and Vilani were the 1st to develop it again. Everyone before the Ancients and most after them were STL only.

The Ancients were Droyne, but Droyne with a twist. The Droyne were a pastoral race which had reached TL 5 or 6 and stayed there. A "super genius", Yaskodray or Grandfather, was born among them and took over. He needed better servants than the run of the mill Droyne and so he made about a dozen children and had those children make children. Yaskodray ran things, kids/grands were his viceroys, and normal Droyne were the labor force. Yaskodray and his kids/grands then fought a war, Yaskodray "won", and retreated to his own dimension. Or so Yaskodray claims.

All that happened about 250,000 years before the OTU's current date. There were non-Droyne starfarers before that and after that, but they didn't have jump drive. We've a name for one race that came after, the Kursae, but little is known of them.

>>55327884
cool, and a bump before bed

jump-1

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>>55323566
Honestly my man, it looks like an off-brand Expanse.

>>55327221
>>55327791
Also it probably has curses on how to discern houshold items from doomsday devices.

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>>55332567
I havent watched the expanse to i would't know.
I currently finished episode 5 and i like how much they do with so little plot elements. Also that they rather show who the characters are, rather than exposition.
They use new elements they introduce, instead of just throwing in more and more new, to distract the viewer from the stuff happening.

but fuck the zombie episode, i mean i get it that a new show has to catch new viewers, but fuck zombies.


So i know what people think about Vargr around here on /tg/ but what about those that choose to life in Humaniti space ?
They are apparently more capable of recognizing social structures, and might even respect a formal contract.
Humaniti space Vargr, just as bad as their jump drive stealing brothers or cool bros with the attention span of a goldfish ?

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5897EB, 42 year old Star Marine Brigadier with TAS membership.

Why can't I make these rolls in a real group?

そんな糞船と一緒にされるのは侮辱だ、ゴミと一緒に捨ててしまえ

>>55332900
>Humaniti space Vargr, just as bad as their jump drive stealing brothers or cool bros with the attention span of a goldfish ?

While I can only imagine the horrors the douche nozzles at Mongoose inflicted on the Vargr, you'd be better served by ignoring ALL canon published by Mongoose and sticking to older sources. There's a Classic AM and a sourcebook for MT called Vilani & Vargr.

The Vargr did not steal jump drive. They developed jump1 on their own. They may have developed jump2, they may have been given it by rebellious Ziru Sirka provincial governors, and, given comm lag & distances, both things could have happened. They either stole or were allowed to steal jump3 from the Zhodani. The records there support both interpretations.

As for Vargr in the Imperium, Vargr and Human share planets in many more places than the Imperium. Let me suggest you read about the Julian Protectorate. It's a group of coreward sectors which had been part of the 1st/2nd Imperiums and which the 3rd Imperium failed to reabsorb. The Protectorate is a confederation of polities ranging from multi-world governments down to individual nations. While exceptions do exists, a hallmark shared by nearly all of the polities making up the Protectorate is Human-Vargr coexistence and cooperation.

TL;DR - Ignore Mongoose, read the real stuff.

>>55333232
Which ship you are talking about ?

>>55333248
> The Protectorate is a confederation of polities ranging from multi-world governments down to individual nations.

Sounds neato, will look it up for future reference on co-existence between species.

>The Vargr did not steal jump drive.
This was intendet as a joke on my side, like, stealing things of high monetary value.

>>55333625
>Sounds neato, will look it up for future reference on co-existence between species.

The Julian Protectorate received a a fair amount of attention in MT. "Vilani & Vargr" is a good source as are several articles in various issues of "Challenge".

The Traveller Wiki linked above should have a list of "Challenge" articles so you can which one you need to download from the Archive.

On a final note, the Imperial Archduke of Antares is Vargr.

>>55333797
But also a line from the Wiki i was refering to.
>Assimilated Vargr Enclaves: Some Imperial Vargr live in Vargr enclaves. Others have adapted to living among Humans and other races. These are often referred to as assimilated Vargr. Assimilated Vargr have all the physical advantages and disadvantages of ethnic Vargr, but many of the typical Vargr mental traits are less pronounced and sometimes completely absent.

>Scientists disagree on how much these traits are inborn but suppressed by association with Humans, or not inborn and just not learned in the first place. The comparison between dogs and wolves is highly impolitic, if difficult to avoid.
>Assimilated Vargr react very poorly to the suggestion that they have been "tamed" by Humans or, even worse, are just "Humans in Vargr suits" -- claims that ethnic Vargr are quick to make. Assimilated and ethnic Vargr often react very poorly towards each other.

>>55334052
>the Wiki

Sadly, the Wiki is mostly shit. If a sentence or passage is not directly quoted from a published work, ignore it. The Wiki's editors spend more time uploading their own "fanon" than anything else.

>>55334162
Aw shucks. gues i will dig for some non-mongoose Vargr books.

>>55334177
>non-mongoose

As a rule of thumb, any canon source takes precedent over anything published by Mongoose. The only time Mongoose is "right" is when it repeats previous material.

All the sources you'll need are in the Archives.

>>55334207
Got Alien book 1 from GURPS Traveller, yay or nay ?

>>55334162
>the Wiki is mostly shit.
One of its more useful functions is to point at the published sources.

>>55334222

It's good, if "GURP-ified". The writers stuck to Classic/MT sources and SJGames' Traveller line editor was the late Loren Wiseman, a GDW alumn and one of the creators of Traveller.

Unlike the douche nozzles at Mongoose, SJGames and Wiseman didn't feel the need to change stuff just for the sake of changing stuff. Nor did they think, unlike Mongoose, that by twisting the Vargr into some sort of violent wolf stereotypes they'd attract furries to the game.

About the mistaken Vargr = Wolf/Dog assumption so many make. From the first it was explained that samples definitely from the family Canidae and almost certainly from the genus Canis were used. Those samples would include dogs, wolves, jackals, foxes, and other species. The Ancients first geneered that mix and left the result to evolve on lair for 300K years.

300K years is a LONG time and plenty of evolution can take place during it. It's about as long ago as archaic homo sapiens developed. So the species the Ancients abandoned on Lair is exactly what the Vilani encountered.

All this means that the Vargr are not "dogs" any more than we are chimps. They don't automatically chase thrown frisbees, chocolate doesn't kill them, they don't fly air/raft with their heads out the window, and all the other stupid shit lazy referees and players have saddled them with since the beginning.

>>55334274
>One of its more useful functions is to point at the published sources.

And that's about it's only useful function.

>>55334426
>So the species the Ancients abandoned on Lair is exactly what the Vilani encountered.

Stubby fingers and potato phone. That's supposed to read:

So the species the Ancients abandoned on Lair is not exactly what the Vilani encountered.

>>55334426
To be fair, if i HAD to strike a comparison between anything and have only one to two sentences to describe their behaviour boiled down, i'd choose people with moderate ADHD

And i say this as adult with ADHD.

To set them on the same level as Dogs/Wolves is missing the damn point.

>>55334550
>To set them on the same level as Dogs/Wolves is missing the damn point.

Exactly. And your moderate ADHD analogy is a good one.

I'd go with that ADHD-ish behavior and being slightly more credulous than average humans.

They are more likeey to get distracted and they're more likely to get talked into things.

>>55334550
Eh, hyperactive storage Wilkes with a love for gaudy colors and lack of commitment to social roles ?

Not the nicest comparison but I can see where it comes from & brings a point across.

I want to rent a used ship to my players, but the table in MgT 1e is sorta shit for a 50 years old 100dton ship. Do you guys have any hombrews or alternative sources for old rust bucket traits ?

>>55334454
>So the species the Ancients abandoned on Lair is not exactly what the Vilani encountered.
True. Much of the variety Mongoose overplayed was already present from MegaTraveller days, though.

>>55334996
>Much of the variety Mongoose overplayed was already present from MegaTraveller days, though.

MT's V&V talked about Vargr 'races" in much the same way we currently have human "races". There are outward physiological differences like hair color etc. but nothing really different under the skin.

V&V talked about two subspecies which were also presumably interfertile with the general population. Sadly, both subspecies were the usual tired tropes:

- A larger, stronger, dumber, warrior type
- A smaller brainy type which is born blind and has weird psionic powers.

Maybe three sentences out of the entire sourcebook were devoted to them.

Of course, Mongoose took that millimeter and stretched it out to a parsec or more. If you're going to fuck up, it pays to fuck up BIG.

>>55334938

An anon in the previous thread posted a zippyshare link to a document detailing starship quirks. Give me a minute...

Here it is:

http://www15.zippyshare.com/v/saT89fBl/file.html

Thank him, not me.

jump-1

>>55335142
>- A larger, stronger, dumber, warrior type
>- A smaller brainy type which is born blind and has weird psionic powers.

>Maybe three sentences out of the entire sourcebook were devoted to them.

>Of course, Mongoose took that millimeter and stretched it out to a parsec or more.

So, mongoose is good if you need more info on the subraces, if nothing else?

>>55337343
Yeah, basically. Sucks that they took over the license and are trying to run it into the ground. I'm also surprised that they haven't decided to replicate the civil war and virus yet either - a clear wipe of the board and canon would fit perfectly with their style.

>>55339811
"And then we introduce space elves, orks and wizards."

All of this leaves me mostly with one questions.

Can Vargr actually use human language ?
I'd assume they could thanks to ancient fuckery, but with a strong accent.

>>55339831
>Elves
Darrians. Seriously, that's what they are.

>>55339895

Sort of. They're also a little bit not-Vulcan/Romulan guys too, as they're not at all mystical, but rather 110% about the SCIENCE!

>>55339965
Seriously, as soon anything happens that could be of scientific interest, there will be a darrian closeby stroking his pants.

>>55339811
>Mongoose Virus/Civil War

I am morbidly intrigued...care to speculate anons?

>>55332900
I like this picture.
Has sort of a samurai feel to it.

>>55341533
I think of it like more of a mexican standoff, but i get what you mean.

>>55319938
anybody want to meet up to discuss traveler on Rolz?

room name: dasboot

>>55341658
AKTUALLY

a mexican standoff is when 3 parties have shared hostilities. So basically the first one to shoot kills the first party, and the third to shoot kills the first and is the only one left standing.

No one can leave or back down and no one can fire first. Its an odd paradox.

>>55341839
>So basically the first one to shoot kills the first party
*second party

>>55341839
Well today I learned something new, thanks traveler.

Sooo then what is the right term for the vibe I get, "cowboy duel" ?

>>55342093
I don't know that there is any particular term for it, other than the vanjarl looks honorable and his opponent is obviously sneaky and underhanded.

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I'm new to Traveller and trying to get into it with the possibility of running a short campaign for my group. I'm a huge fan of the character creation process, it's the first time I've had fun making a character for an RPG. I've been using http://www.munsondev.com/chargen/ for it, can anybody comment on how attuned this site is to the rules?

Which is the best ruleset for a group new to Traveller?

Is there a ruleset for playing as an android or cyborg?

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A few missing files for the T4 folder. Still haven't found either the big Milieu 0 Campaign book or JTAS 25 & 26.

T4 - Central Supply Catalog.pdf
http://www118.zippyshare.com/v/IaoQ5bWx/file.html
T4 - Emperor's Arsenal.pdf
http://www118.zippyshare.com/v/LcVyfKbD/file.html
T4 - First Survey.pdf
http://www118.zippyshare.com/v/FaoUuLvE/file.html
T4 - Milieu 0.pdf
http://www118.zippyshare.com/v/e21gVGKp/file.html
T4 - Naval Architect's Manual.pdf
http://www118.zippyshare.com/v/Tkq3pnYD/file.html
T4 - Psionic Institutes.pdf
http://www118.zippyshare.com/v/ffMKH0Av/file.html
T4 - Starships.pdf
http://www118.zippyshare.com/v/yhML5HTx/file.html

>>55341839
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IHQr0HCIN2w

>>55341839
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XP9cfQx2OZY

>>55342093

That's usually called a "walk down." The first one on record was supposedly between Wild Bill Hickock, in his duty as sheriff of Abilene, Texas, and Phil Coe.

>>55342226
>Which is the best ruleset for a group new to Traveller?

Probably Mongoose 1e or its clone, the Cepheus Engine. It's all-in-one, (unlike most of Classic) pretty well edited, (unlike most of Mongoose's stuff) and has good third party support. (Unlike Mongoose 2e.)

>Is there a ruleset for playing as an android or cyborg?

In Classic you've got JTAS Robots and the much crunchier official Robots supplement. Mongoose has an official Robots supplement, but it sucks bad; The third party book Traveller Robots is much better.

>>55342226
In case that everyone speaks English in your group, try cepheus engine, it's free an basically tried to take the best from CT and MgT 1e. Overall pretty streamlined.

Mongoose traveler 1e got actually translated into different languages.

As far as cyborgs go in the system, there is like one line of rules for augmentation and sine great for that. Traveler as system handles super human cyber shenanigans not as well as dedicated systems, but it's definitely possible.
It's mostly something your character just hat and not something he or she is centered around. Same goes for psyonics

Mobility enchantment and subdermal armor are pretty neat for melee fighters tho.

>>55342829
Also keep in mind that design comes after function in traveller.

One dermal senior night be ceramic plates booked onto your skin, another might me a mesh of bucky tubes between your muscles.
But in the end both can have the same TL, cost and effect.

Same goes for every other piece of equipment.

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Streamlined Far-Trader moving in code 3 (very thin) atmosphere. Does it impose any disadvantage?

We are playing 2nd. Ed. Mongoose Traveller and our destination planet for the next session has an atmosphere with this code. Our Referee said that he's not sure what kind of modificators he should give us depending on the different kinds of atmospheres, so i figured i could ask you guys for advice. Could you give us some tips?

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>>55343370

A streamlined ship is good for space, and atmosphere. A thin atmosphere is just inbetween, there shouldn't be any trouble for that.
Now an insidious atmosphere undergoing storms... Then you have to watch out for the Jaggies.

>>55343370

Mods and disadvantages for what?

>>55343519
...atari? amiga? what is that from?

>>55343595

Atari 8 bit. There's a 64 port, but the faster CPU on the Atari makes that version play a little smoother.
If you download it, grab a copy of the manual, the manuals for the early Lucasfilm games were awesome.

>>55340631
>I am morbidly intrigued...care to speculate anons?

He's referring to the original OTU timeline as published by GDW, knucklehead.

Classic - "Static" 3I with 5th Frontier War
MT - Strephon killed, Rebellion/Civil War
TNE - Virus "slate wipes" Charted Space, era of rebuilding

Apart from some work by the 3rd party publishers Avenger, no one has touched the TNE or post-TNE eras. T4 went back to the founding of the 3I, GT started an alternate timeline where Strephon wasn't killed, and MgT returned to the Classic period.

Considering how much Mongoose fucked with Classic canon, >>55339811 was suggesting they could really fuck things up if they tackled the Rebellion and Virus too.

>>55343691

And the anon you're talking to was suggesting we speculate on how they would fuck it up if they were to do it. A knucklehead is you

>>55343677
what game, anon?

>>55343762

Oh, derp! Rescue on Fractalus.It was the first of the four Lucasfilm fractal-based games. It's pretty cool, though it maybe gets a little repetitive after a while.
(I think Koronis Rift was my favorite of the four, though Ballblazer is pretty ace if you've got someone to play with)

>>55343851
thanks

>>55343851
>Fractalus

Love it.

I've been going over some the 3rd party stuff for Classic thanks to the Archive and holy shit is there a lot of stuff to borrow. Ideas, plots, animals, NPCs, ships, trade goods, planets, you name it.

While production values for most of it are low even by 70s/80s standards, the materials themselves are crammed full of stuff to borrow.

>>55343590
Maneuver at speed, I would guess.
>>55343370
Very Thin is equivalent to the top third of Everest. Airliners fly higher than that, so you can assume that there is still too much air to pull stupid physics tricks that work in space. A hot turn-about to bring a different turret to bear will still need to be carefully considered, or you'll be ripping bits off. You could presumably design a ship to handle such maneuvers, probably as a sphere or saucer.

Attempted to build an AKV using MgT1e, based on the fact that the fact the 30 dton hull can hit the highest acceleration, at 16g.
Did all the math, filled all cargo space with lead, and... At one turn of thrust, it hits with over 915 kg of TNT per kg of ship weight.. At over a million kg it comes out to 763.9 million kg of C-4, the plastic explosive listed in the core book.
At this point, damage is irrelevant, but if I did the math right, about 160 million points on average.
Jeez, that's just 10 minutes of acceleration. Imagine if it went for the full hour of fuel I gave it...

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>>55343952
>>55344211

Oh here's the manual for it.

>Don't worry about being taken prisoner, the J'Hagga Ri Kachatki don't take prisoners.

>>55344430

Thanks, but I was just commenting on the name Fractalus. It must have been a great in-joke among the coders back then.

>>55344374
AKV?

>>55344374
And it's 42 megatons at 1 hour, or over 2 times the Tunguska event.
It's a shit ton of damage. Not enough to crack a planet, but enough to completely wipe an Empress battleship.

>>55344358
>Maneuver at speed, I would guess.

That's mine too but, as you correctly note, even a thin atmosphere is going to prevent or preclude "physics tricks".

>>55344480
Autonomous Kill Vehicle.
What happens when you pull out the math and realize that any drive fast enough to be interesting makes a good weapon
And that any vehicle that has a velocity of 3km/s is it's own weight in boom.

>>55344516

Have you read David Drake's Lt. Leary/RCN series? The main weapons for ships are missiles pretty much like the AKVs you designed.

>>55344559
No, I haven't.
But the damn things are expensive as fuck - almost MCr30 if you count 5.5dtons of lead as almost MCr1. Maybe cut MCr5 if you drop the drone cockpit to Remote Ops or the non-combat variant.
I'll try the 10dton variant, see how that works out

>>55344792
>No, I haven't.

They're fun reads, but the tech is very different from Traveller.

>But the damn things are expensive as fuck - almost MCr30 if you count 5.5dtons of lead as almost MCr1.

Instead of lead, try plain old water. Drake's AKVs use water as fuel and generally still have lots aboard when they impact. They also split into 3 segments after thrust stops to increase the odds of a hit.

>I'll try the 10dton variant, see how that works out

10dTons is closer to Drake's version. His are unguided too because his ships have relatively little in the way of thrust compared to Traveller.

>>55344941
Sorry, lead is the payload. Most of the actual cost comes from the drone cockpit.
Tried a brief experiment with fuel-heavy, M-drive ships (instead of reaction drives), and, well... Good news, you won't crack a planet with a small craft. Bad news: it's still a shit ton of damage.

>>55345173
So I need a velocity calculator than give me non-ftl speeds. But I think it'll take about 500-1000 dtons, almost entirely fuel, to crack a planet. But anyways.
10dton standard hull MCr1
1.5dton Drone Computer, TL13 (for combat piloting) MCr10
Reaction Drive sF 1.5dtons 3MCr 12g
Chemical P-Plant sA 2dtons 1MCR
P-Plant Fuel, 1 Hour, 0.17dtons
1 Hour Reaction Fuel (2.5%*12g) 3dtons
Final payload space: 1.83dtons
You know what, let's have some fun: with 1.83 dtons, it can hold almost 22 missiles, so 21 with 0.96dtons left over.
If we assume a missile is 40% warhead (drive, 20%, fuel 25%, guidance 5%, battery 10%), we can stick almost 55 warheads in there - 54.9 to be exact We'll take the multi-warhead option, so when it hits, it also deals an additional 54d6*54d6 (1e, remember?), for an average of 35,721 damage.
As a barrage, that's 54d6 damage, average 189, with an autohit based on the fact that the damn AKV just rammed you.
But anyways, that's just not necessary, since the actual damage from the kinetic kill, assuming 1 turn (10 minutes) of thrust to create minimum usable relative velocity (AKA, match velocity then add one turn of full thrust), yields about 1.9*10^20 points of damage, average.
Yeah, an empty hold would've been just as useful.

>>55346153
>But I think it'll take about 500-1000 dtons, almost entirely fuel, to crack a planet.

Near-c rocks, or kinetic kill weapons, are a long standing bugbear in Traveller. There were flame wars over the issue back in the dial up BBS days.

You're calculating nothing which hasn't already been calculated for 40 years. You're building nothing that hasn't already been built for 40 years only to be built again with each new rules set.

The math works, the weapons are relatively easy to build, and it all amounts to nothing. For whatever, the various species in Traveller don't smash each others worlds with near-c rocks or KKVs. Use whatever excuse works for you to explain it, but the truth of the matter is it isn't a FUN part of a GAME.

>>55346153
So, AKVs will wreck everything. So why aren't they using them? Cost.
A drone rig capable of dodging in combat, and then picking the optimal point of impact, is TL13 and MCr10.
That AKV is MCr15, plus fuel costs. And that's a lot of money.
And you can take it out quick too. If you ignore the 1dton minimum for armor (since we're planning on adding as much as possible, I think we can), at the armor available for TL13, you get 13 points of protection (and have 0.175dtons remaining), adding MCr0.65 to the cost.
And still have enough space to fit five missile warheads in there. Or 26.8 metric tons of lead, your choice.
But still, for that cost you could get a reusable fighter that can do so much more for your investment.

AKVs are what you use when you really want something gone.
Pretty, ship-obliterating explosions are for civilians and bad movies. A Real Military want everything captured as intact as possible, because intel wins wars. Captured ships can get overhauled, modified, and put into place on your side. Wreckage can be combed for parts, survivors, and intel. No spacer wants to leave another, no matter how hated, to die in the void, or to be taken out in an instant because his pilot couldn't dodge a drone. It's more than honor to them, it's more of a religion that you joined when you first worked a ship.

Total war is for politicians who have never seen anything worse than a bar brawl.
You go to total war, the rest of the galaxy drops everything to respond in kind to you, because you've just established yourself as a threat to every one.

>>55346894
>You go to total war, the rest of the galaxy drops everything to respond in kind to you, because you've just established yourself as a threat to every one.

Exactly. MAD is one of several reasons why planet busters aren't used.

There was a thread many years ago at COTI in which some simpleton using the threat of biological warfare as a deterrent. In his example, a single planet thinking it's being pushed around by the 3I lets it be known that they've secreted biowar assets on various nearby 3I planets and will push the button if threatened. (apparently the planet was home to several fatal diseases only it had cures for.)

The thread then turned into a tag team beat down in which several posters explained slowly, at great length, and with small words that the biowar threat guaranteed the 3I would not only terminate the planet with alacrity but would have help from everybody else in doing so.

>>55346986
>terminate the planet with alacrity
Having read Agent of the Imperium, I suspect the 3I wouldn't have any compunctions about wiping the offenders down to glowing bedrock.

>>55346986
Bingo. If someone threatens everyone, they get hit with overwhelming force.
And as I said, a fighter is a better investment than an AKV.
The fighter can always ram anyways.

What level Kinetic Kill weapons are permissible in the Imperium? Can you use them against asteroids or small moons?

>>55347295
The general attitude is "None".
Now, deflecting an asteroid is a legitimate use of a kinetic kill weapon. Nothing else is.
In setting, you can point it out that almost everyone considers the use of Kinetic Kill weapons (other than tiny ones, like railguns) to be an act of terrorism, and most terrorists consider it beneath them.
You can build an adventure around it, but most of that adventure consists of "Terrorist launches Kinetic Attack with stolen scout, heroic belters drop raw ore in his path. Light show in 24 hours" while your players shepherd satellites out of the way of the incoming dust cloud the debris field turned the bastard into.

>>55319938
I love traveller chargen, are there any fantasy games that use a similar system?

>>55347549

There's actually a couple of fantasy conversions of Traveller floating around.
Outside of that, there's a small lifepath system in Beyond the Wall, and there's the extensive and crunchy lifepath system in Burning Wheel. I'm sure there are others, but I can't think of them right now.

>>55347295
>Can you use them against asteroids or small moons?
>>55347464
Depends on the "you". AotI shows their use by the Imperial Navy on a member world.

>>55347549
Lifepath elements can be found pasted on to several fantasy games as options. There's one for PF, for example, as well as a much older generic one from, IIRC, Flying Buffalo.

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>>55347739
>a much older generic one
Central Casting.

>>55347589
I have yet to see any of these fantasy conversions of traveller

>>55347589
REH's Conan (the 2d20 one) has a lifepath, because all the 2d20 games do.

>>55347803

Well, Wanderer was just a mockup, but a guy named Doc Gronard made one based off of Classic's 3 books called Adventurer. Google for his blog.

>>55347803
>I have yet to see any of these fantasy conversions of traveller

Go to COTI and ask for the "Mercator" rules set. They even divided it up into Three Little Black Books.

>>55347295
>What level Kinetic Kill weapons are permissible in the Imperium? Can you use them against asteroids or small moons?

Define "permissible". The 3I is ruled by men and not laws, something which is hard to grasp for most players. Precedent is cited more often than legal theory, so there isn't going to be some tidy little list or formula that a sperglord can reference to figure out where, what, and when they can launch a KKV.

If you can explain/defend your actions to your superiors and their superiors, you can do damn near anything.

As >>55347714 explained, AotI shows us that the 3I itself uses KKVs and even fields a class of warships called "bombards" to manufacture them onsite and launch them. Why? So the 3I can "scrub" incredibly dangerous worlds right down to the bedrock.

In AotI, the Agent scrubs a world on which a plague has appeared which makes people waste away in perfect contentment. The Agent scrubs another world which is the site of a colony of von Neumann machine style robots. If the threat on hand is dangerous enough, the Imperium WILL nuke, KKV, and otherwise slag a world right down to glowing bedrock.

It's a matter of proportionality however, something else many people have a hard time grasping. The Agent in AotI doesn't solve every problem he faces by "scrubbing" the world in question.

>>55347937

I believe Mercator's in the archives, too. I don't think Adventurer is, though.

>>55346894
Putting armour on a relativistic projectile is a bit, well, silly isn't it? Remember that any pebble of point defence they put in the path of your speedy vehicle has the power to obliterate it.

>>55348065
>Putting armour on a relativistic projectile is a bit, well, silly isn't it?

It is. You can "explain" it by saying it adds to the mass of the KKV.

Anyway, the near-c rock/KKV topic and Traveller are old old OLD "friends". I remember a guy trying to figure out how to build a planet-buster with Book 2 rules back in '78. Every new set of ship design rules dredges up the question and every wave of new players does the same.

Nothing posted here, the designs, the explanations, the reasons, the excuses, none of it is new and none of it hasn't been repeated over and over and over again for 30 or 40 years.

>>55348125
It all stems from people interested in Scifi often having an interest in worlds that are logical and make sense. They eventually realize that if Traveller drives exist and e = 1/2 m V^2! Then big boom! It is sort of inevitable, since the drives seem to be designed based on what makes for convenient travel between stellar bodies, rather than based on what kind of performance you could reasonably expect from a drive.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that all of this will be repeated over and over and over again for 30 or 40 more years. Assuming the game maintains its appeal and manages to draw in new players.

So for someone who's completely new to Traveller, where's the best place to start?

>>55348228
Cepheus engine in The OP archive.
It's a fusion of classic traveler and mongoose traveler 1e and a comprehensive read.
You can then just keep using CE or switch pretty painless to either CT or MgT1e

>>55348228
>So for someone who's completely new to Traveller, where's the best place to start?

Your question is too vague to answer. What do you want to do? What is your style play? Do you have a group? Do you play solo?

You might as well be asking for someone who is completely new to music, where's the best place to start?

>>55348191
Also to the AKV topic. Some honorable grognard already calculated the highest possible speed for traveller ships, which is around 0.2 C because of the low density plasma and the structure of the ships.
Again, that's pretty fast. But not un-interceptable for a setting with FTL drives.
I'd rather stick with my crazy Russian space potato gun, also probably cheaper.

>>55348274
I've been playing and running Pathfinder, but I want to run something sci-fi for my next campaign and Starfinder's rules are a dumpster fire. So, I've been looking into other games.

>>55348314
>I've been playing and running Pathfinder

So you're used to shitty rules then? T4 is the game for you.

>>55348314

See>>55348264

T5 is not of a reference document
Mgt2e just changed things for the sake of changing them. Playable but pretty generic and unpopular here.
No idea about T4

Mega traveller also exists and is alright.

>>55348309
>But not un-interceptable for a setting with FTL drives.

A FTL drive which takes a WEEK to move any distance.

Believe me, you're not intercepting shit in normal space with a jump drive.

>>55348362
So we are talking about in-system KVs ?
I'd still place my money on the planetary defense that probably exists.
Setting up some ship bay weapons on the ground should actually be even cheaper than having then fly around.
If all else fails, spinal mount.

>>55348361
I meant to say that T5 is not a system but a reference document.

>>55348391
See >>55347464
You can stop them with a debris field. If you really want to get fancy (my example has the stolen scout, which might be souped up to 6g, accelerating for two weeks - and covering about 248AU. Lot of time and space), you wait until about the halfway point, when his velocity is high enough that dodging can fuck his vector over, and have him run into a cone of debris. Build the cone right, and it will intercept a lot of the expanding debris that was the ship, wearing it down even more, until the combination of vector, size, and velocity makes a pretty light show.
And causes a Kessler cascade. Maybe. Better get the math right!

>>55348228
Just grab Mongoose 1st edition core rulebook and have a look through.

Either that of check out the first 3 (very short) books of Classic Traveller - known as the little black books. They are from the 70s but pretty cool and simple to work out how to play

>>55348602
>the first 3 (very short) books of Classic Traveller - known as the little black books.
Or the single-volume version of them (and some other bits), called The Traveller Book.

>>55342760
And today i learned another thing, thanks anon.

>>55348409
The advice I heard from some was to use either the modifiers to rolls (like most systems' +/- adjustments) OR to use the variable dice mechanic (more difficult = adding dice) but to avoid mixing them in most cases.

>>55351928
I prefer 68A. Applies just about anywhere you can roll 2d6

>>55348314
Would you like to run the Starfinder setting with Traveller rules?

Are there any good D20 system to Traveller conversions out there worth recommending?

>>55353522
There's a traveller d20 in the trove.
Its kind of... Interesting, but still keeps the midlife crisis in space. Tried character creation once, 3-4 terms dropped me at level 6. But the sheer number of skills that depend on a feat for you to be able to use them...
And oh yeah, there's no training rules from what I saw.
It was a good attempt, and one of the best attempts to adapt d20 to a specific property that wasn't built with D&D, but all it proves is that if you want to convert a property to d20, you better have been using D&D when you made the property in the first place.

>>55353522
>>55353809
But there really isn't any good conversion.
For PF to traveller, grab Flynn's guide to magic, or Adventurer (both in the trove, adventurer is in... Mongoose 2008, settings (other) or third party content), then get busy converting skills. Class skill (eligible for the +3 bonus) is now a Skill-0 (no untrained penalty, which can get nasty on the bell curve). Play it by ear after than, but every 5 ranks or so should be Skill+1. Or something like that.

I looked up the Cepheus Engine after seeing it mentioned a few time in this thread. I'm not sure I get why people are recommending it. It's almost the exact same as Mongoose Traveller but with less content for character gen. I do like the extra careers, but the lack of events just kills it for me.

So, lasers, missles, railguns, all three? depends on the race/polity? what's traveller naval combat like?

>>55353517
68A?

>>55354958
So grab the events from Mongoose. It's that simple.
People have been homebrewing this game since day 1.
If you really want a big table of events, Mongoose 1e Book 10 Cosmopolite has a great one.

>>55355051
Rule 68A, in the Classic section of the trove.
Basically, rather than a sliding scale of +/- for how difficult a task is, choose 1 of 3 numbers:
>6
Fairly easy. A routine task for a professional, the average difficulty that a non-adventurer faces.
>8
The average difficulty that an adventurer faces. Combat, something with a good chance of failure when a professional attempts it
>10 (A in the pseudoHex Traveller uses)
Pretty damn hard for a professional. Rather big chance of failure.
And for each, you can slide it +/-1 either way. One of the examples is reviving people in a low berth. It's a routine task, and fairly easy for a trained medic - the difficulty is 5+

>>55354958
>It's almost the exact same as Mongoose Traveller

Well, yeah, that's its purpose.

...would it be viable to make a traveller (OTU) mod for a game?

any game specifically people would like to see an OTU mod for?

>>55355319

Yeah, you could do that. There was a dude who was making Traveller ships in Minecraft for a while. (I don't think Minecraft is particularly suited to Traveller, though.)

>>55355195
I guess I'm just not sure why you'd use it instead of MgT.

>>55355398

Eh, I suppose it's cheap, and it's a good base to build your own rules on. And it doesn't give Mongoose any more money to shit up the OTU with, tee hee hee

>>55355432
You can just pirate the MgT books, you know.

>>55355033
Rather it depens on the prefered naval tactic.

Which depens also on culture, which depends partial on race.

The question is rather what you want with your weapon.

Missiles take up space but can come in a wide variety, also amateurs can use them almost as well as pros.
Can be blocked by lasers, pebble casters

Lasers/Beams
A Laser does exatly one thing, fire a laser.
Nothing more, nothing less. Doesn't take up extra space and can be fired as often as you want.
Can be blocked by sand casters.

Railgun
Short range (only know the mongoose version, maybe handeled different in others)
Can't be blocked.
Also can have automatic fire and vause damage on multiple targets.
Needs ammo, and therefore extra space.

>>55355398
>>55355432
>>55355461
And you're not subject to the ridiculous licensing agreement that mongoose came up with.
I'm surprised that they haven't declared playing the game at home to be subject to the licensing agreement. It would seem to fit their new style

>>55355953
Well, they are morons...

How would one roleplay a Hiver or a Droyne?

I'm adding to the pastebin, particularly training rules. I'm working on the effects of Instruction and JOAT right now, but here's the first part
Modified skill training times
<snip shit ton of math and running through Miller's logic in CT>
Skill training takes a number of hours based on the desired skill level, training one level at a time.
Gaining a Skill-0 takes 50 hours, Skill 1 through 4 takes 500 hours a level, and Skill 5+ takes 1000 hours a level.
A character may simultaneously train up to INT DM skills at 1+, while up to 6 skills may be trained at Skill-0 at the same time.
At the end of the training period Throw 8+ on 2d, adding the higher of the INT DM or EDU DM, and subtracting the level of the skill to be trained (thus increasing levels gets harder).
If successful, add the skill at the level trained.
If failed, another 100 hours of training is required per point of failure before another attempt to keep the skill can be done (200 hours per point of failure when training Skill-5+).
Voluntarily adding 50 hours to the training (100 at skill-5+) adds +1 to the roll, and may be done a number of times equal to the skill level being trained.

>>55356438
Now, I'm looking at JOAT adding bonus hours of training (so even JOAT-0 or 4 can be useful), but not to the point of reducing it to 0.
Instruction is used to train another in any skills you have at 1+, and can train up to skill-1. It's main use is giving the student a bonus to their training roll (which is why you can train skills higher than your level in instruction, since their roll is penalized by the skill level being trained).
I'm also looking at porting over the training type rules from GURPS, which creates the distinction between hours of study and hours of training.

>>55356279
A Droyne scout living in a Human community would be actually rather simple,
You are just a chickenölizard-insect dude who has no sense for music but likes choreographics and gets a real stron gurge to visit your family from time to time.

Other droyne, you really don't because those are alien xenophobic bastards whodon't really care about not droyne that aren't part of their clan and their Job is hardwired into them.

Hiver.
well... i don't know too much about them but i don't think that they would be easy... or possible either. They are more of an event than a player race.

Is naval combat exceedingly deadly in traveller?

>>55356774
It can be, depending on edition.
Of course, Mongoose 2e, in their corebook, completely failed to mention how many hull points a ship has, leaving that information to High Guard (so yes, you need high guard to figure out how much damage your ship can take. Not needed for gameplay my fucking ass).
Oh, and it treats Hull as HP, with system hits being "criticals".
In previous editions, space combat is less about slugging it out and more about resource management - damage from attacks hits systems in addition to your hull and structure. It's all about managing to keep the systems you need up.

>>55357088
ouch...

Has anyone ever tried a Battlestar Galactica conversion for Traveller? why not?

>>55357367
because mongoose did it, badly?

>>55319938
>want to run a sci-fi game for a group that almost exclusively plays DnD
>Both this and stars without number seem neat
>Traveler has 7 editions (maybe more, I didn't look too closely)
>I haven't even looked at stars without number yet
Which edition do I pick?

>>55357684
mix traveller's chargen with SWN's GM tools, profit

>>55357684
Classic, Mongoose (either 1e or 2), or Cephus Engine (Mix of CT and MgT1e).
Homebrew to your heart's content.

>>55357734

I'm a Classic guy, and I recommend The Traveller Book, with the simpler ship combat from Starter Traveller. Throw in Citizens of the Imperium for like 12 civilian careers, and you're good.

>>55357684
Would suggest Mongoose Traveller. Classic will also work if your players lean grognardy.

How is the mongoose vehicle supplement for building vehicles ?
Are there any better 3rd party supplements ?

>>55358212
not to my knowledge, but they're all broadly compatible

>>55353912
Thanks. My Pathfinder/D20 system knowledge is much less than my Traveller side.

The whole 'feats' thing (as a special ability) looks interesting from a story and character building perspective, but it seems (in practice) like all the characters are superheroes and only get more 'special' every time they level up.

But I've probably got it wrong because I'm more of a Classic Traveller guy.

>>55358790
Feats were a really shitty thing - their entire basis is specialized rulings with limited access. SO rather than "this is a cinematic game, I'm going to run along the wall, what's my roll? Balance? Okay", it became "This is a cinematic game, I want to run along the wall, what's my roll? What do you mean I didn't pay for access to that content?" Because you had to take the feat, using a rather limited number of slots, before being able to even attempt it.
Anything that wasn't part of the basic rules became a feat. TEAMWORK became a series of feats.
That's right, taking the door requires a feat from everyone.
It's like how in T20 every type of vehicle was its own feat - and you couldn't operate the vehicle if you didn't have the feat.

My take on that for Traveller? Design a maneuver or activity, hand it to Referee, Ref decides skill and difficulty, along with any downsides or benefits, then your character practices it until they can do it outside of "OH GOD I'M PANICKING!" moments.
SO running along the wall (assuming a cinematic Traveller game) could be Athletics or Strength 10+ and you can't take cover, or fire a ranged weapons (thrown are okay), and you use your full movement for the round, regardless of success or distance (up to 75% of movement) moved. Failure leaves you prone and a bit stunned.

Or Dual Wield (which would require a shit ton of training)
When using two one-handed weapons, specified during training, the character may attack the same target with both without penalty, or may attack two separate targets with a DM of -2 per attack. The character may not aim at two serparate targets, and aiming at one with both weapons applies the aim bonus to only one of the attacks - the other suffers DM-2 from the lack of concentration. Training for this requires 100 hours of practice with the two weapons specified, skill-1 or higher in both weapons used, and a throw of 10+ on both weapon skills to gain the ability.

>>55358790
it is and they do

>>55359088
Basically, "Can I do X?", if it required a ruling, was answered by "Do you have the feat?"

Wow. Feats sounds worse than I thought it was.

I guess if I wanted a simpler way to do more cinematic action characters I'd go with D6 Star Wars and go full Jedi.

>>55359088
Sounds neat in general, just let people train little unique skills so they can repeat them.

To two weapon combat.
I always ruled, in MgT 1e, that it counts as taking two actions, so each attack would take the -2 DM. Which really sucks unless you are a pretty decent shooter and isn't that rewarding considering how armor works and that additional success adds to damage.

I just considered it "shooting in quick succession" which mostly hit the tone I wanted.

>>55359243
Feats are hot turbo bullshit.
I think I once saw one that lets you use your whip like a swing like Indiana Jones.
So of course now you need that feat in PFS if you want to do that just to validate the feat some intern wrote.
They have become the opposite of what they should be and limit your options

are social statuses mutually exclusive? (would, say, an 18 knight maintain his 2 social status black marketeers? as an example)

>>55359619
Status has to do with how society sees you. In the Imperium, 11+ comes with a title. SOC increases increase how positively society at large sees you.
Oh, and SOC 18 is for the Emperor. Really, you should pick a level and convert the rest of the SOC into 2 ship shares per point.

>>55359619
A 18 knight ? Son, about which version are you talking ?
In CT, CE and MgT a SOC of 18 is reserved for the emperor himself.
Not some fake nobility title like knight.

>>55359709
...I picked a number at random, I'm asking because low status seems to go with shifty, corrupt criminal types, and higher status seems to avoid that if at all possible, unless I'm reading the book wrong

>>55359709
I would say that status is just as much about how other people outside you as well as how you manage your image.

>>55359739
A noble can be just as shift and corrupt as a drug dealer, just with more leaf gold.

A researcher with a soc of 3 could be a genius in his field but fail at basic etiquette and let his appearance go bad.
Basically a science hobo

>>55359739
No, SOC is basically your socio-economic status in the psuedo-feudal society that is the Third Imperium. As in, it is how closely related you are to the nobility, or how famous you are.
Shifty, corrupt, criminal types can be found at any status.

>>55359823
...Welp, I know my next character concept (not necessarily for traveller, for anything)

>>55359843
I'd also like to think that a position with force over others can require/improve your social status. That's why IMTU army men need their social roll to become officers.
So it's a mix of force/presentation of personality, fame and nobility.

>>55359851
Why need prestige, social contracts and a loving family when you can have SCIENCE!

>>55355051
The maunderings of a self-important tinkerer.

>>55360282

A "self-important tinkerer" who managed to reverse engineer the logic behind Classic's default skill entries. The 68A article is good stuff, IMO.

Do the major human races build their ships differently?

>>55361096
They have different aesthetic preferences, but the science brings most of the working bits into symmetry pretty quickly.

>>55360282
>The maunderings of a self-important tinkerer.
>I didn't think of it first so it's shit.

>>55359843
>No, SOC is basically your socio-economic status in the psuedo-feudal society that is the Third Imperium. As in, it is how closely related you are to the nobility, or how famous you are.

Or your demeanor and overall behavior. You get SOC buffs in chargen, so it's something which can be "learned".

I used to try and vary SOC by location. A PC could have a relatively high SOC in one situation and a low SOC in another. It was too much bother for what it brought to the table.

>Shifty, corrupt, criminal types can be found at any status.

An excellent point.

>>55361927

I suspect he's jealous that the guy's stuff (like the UGM and Rula 68a) are fairly popular over on the CotI forums.

>why do they like his posts and not mine?
>clique of insiders circlejerk circlejerk circlejerk!
>those grapes he makes are sour, people!

>>55359619
>are social statuses mutually exclusive?

I'd say no. It's hard for spergs to grasp but SOC is more of what society as a whole perceives you to be rather than a precise measurement of an individual's standing in each and every possible situation.

The Beggar King of Startown is going to have a high standing among all the other beggars, but he's still going to have SOC 2 as far as society as a whole is concerned.

Conversely, Sir Asshole may be a persona non grata among all the other knights for various reasons, but he's still SOC B in the eyes of society as a whole.

For a while I channeled my inner sperg and tried out "sliding" SOC levels with PC having varying SOC ratings relatively to where they were and who they were dealing with work. I stopped for 3 reasons: A) it was too much bother, B) it didn't work and C) it was fucking retarded.

In MT' World Builder's Handbook, DGP went full sperg and "expanded" a world's TL into something like 15 different subcategories covering all sorts of tech. When you first look at you say "Cool!". Then whee you think about actually using it, you realize it's just more pointless details. Worrying about relative SOC levels is much the same.

>>55362026
Pfft. nah. Ken's just an ass, that's all.

>>55362616

Sure, if you say so, but Rule 68A is still a damn fine bit of work.

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>>55362690
So fine that his pushing it *every time* someone discusses rules tinkering is somehow not annoying as fuck? If he's active (and he has been banned a few times), he'll try to shut down any variant discussions that aren't his.

He also doesn't accept criticism.

>>55362616
>Ken's just an ass, that's all.

>>55362690
>Sure, if you say so, but Rule 68A is still a damn fine bit of work.

That's pretty much how I view things. Whether a rule or game works is more important than the person who wrote the rule or game.

Look at Richard Berg for example. Phenomenally gifted war game designer and personally one of the despicable you'll ever meet. How bad is he? Well, he's a disbarred lawyer among other things. Do you know how fucking awful you have to be for lawyers to kick you out?

I enjoy Berg's games, I check out each new title he releases, and I wouldn't cross the street to piss in his mouth if his teeth were on fire.

>>55362864

I'll take your word for it, but I really don't care what the guy's like, 68A is good.

>>55362875

Yeah. Someone's failings as a person don't reflect on their work unless you let it, and there's no reason to disregard a useful tool just because the maker is himself a tool.

>>55362864
>He also doesn't accept criticism.

Says the guy who can't accept opinions differing from his.

We get it, you dislike Ken/S4. Despite that, Rule 68A is still good.

>>55363242
>Says the guy who can't accept opinions differing from his.
Remember where you are.

>>55363324

Very true, sadly.

>>55358212
There is the vehicle design book for Cepheus Engine. IMHO better than the several different vehicle design books that have been produced for MGT 1e and 2e.

>>55362024
You can get soc buffs in char gen because your socio-economic standing can improve in char gen.

For Mongoose 1e, is there any way to start with Battle Dress?

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>>55365804
No.

>>55365804
Is there for any other edition ?

Everything from CT up to MgT 1e treats them as ultimate form of infatry.

>>55365992
>Is there for any other edition ?

No. The only way I know to 'start' with it is to play as marines in an active duty campaign. BD isn't something to be handed out randomly and the skill needed to use it is rather rare too.

>Everything from CT up to MgT 1e treats them as ultimate form of infatry.

It is the ultimate form of infantry and that's why it's rare.

>>55365992
>Ultimate form of Infantry
>Dies like a bitch to the first time it ever sees gauss rifle
???

>>55366058
Given that our time period has demonstrated an increasing proclivity for conflicts to be asymmetrical in nature and characterized by a marked disparity in terms of the technological sophistication of weapons and armor used by differing sides, fighting people with gauss rifles may not actually be what Battle Dress infantry are intended for.

>>55324507
The game looks great. But unfortunately its too fucking expensive over here and I also don't have the hardware to run it.

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>>55365992
They're the ultimate, which is why you don't get it at chargen.

>>55366037
MgT 2e did a great thing and merged the Vacc Suit and Battle Dress skills.

>>55323566
It's... decent? Not really particularly amazing, but it holds attention well enough, and desu for it being a sci-fi series that's a lot better than most can say.

>>55366228
>MgT 2e did a great thing and merged the Vacc Suit and Battle Dress skills.

Classic did that nearly 40 years ago.

>>55355877
Don't recall railguns being a thing outside of Mongoose, certainly not in Classic, Mega or TNE.
But then, Mongoose did like adding lots of extras to make Traveller generic.

>>55366413
Their limited rage gives them no worth of mention.
They literally do nothing if the target is further away than "short".
But that's pobably because even a Mach 7 round would take solid 8,5 Minutes to hit a target 1250 km away.

>>55366588
Don't forget, even within their range, they're worthless because they take up a full hardpoint plus extra tonnage, only do 3d6, can't be put into triple turrets, and have physical ammo with weight.

And Bays are extremely overly expensive and huge, rendering them impossible to mount on smaller ships.

>>55366864
Basically, just get a rocketlauncher and this list.

http://www.travellerrpg.com/CotI/Discuss/showthread.php?t=30883

>>55366942
It's honestly funny that missiles do 1d6 damage only, since it means that they are literally irrelevant to 99% of ships.

>>55366942
Huh. How would you implement the extra damage for more thrust thing from CT to Mongoose 1e?

>>55366964
I like to think that the baseline rocket it the "Civilian" version and their reason for existing is similar to the reason why .22 ammo exists.

You don't plan on using it regulary, it's just a mean of seld defense and a fixed turret mount is rather cheap to come by. It's intend is more for self-defense against would be attackers and opportunist pirates.
Sometimes you just want to show that you mean buissnes, but don't want to straight up kill somebody/blast them into space.

and in MTU the navy uses armor penetrating ones to deal with most things, and if they aren't enough they bring the multi warheads to the table.

>>55367218
Yeah, but, see, the thing is?

For a more economical cost, you can just... get a Triple Laser turret of Pulse Lasers. 2d6+4. Tada, you automatically do your minimum as a missile's max.

Realistically speaking, assuming that you have a party of six, and ~104+ Ship Shares, what is the largest size of ship a crew of six could actually operate and not overstretch themselves, without having to resort to NPCs? Drones/robots are acceptable, but with a preference towards keeping them minimal.

Mongoose 1e.

>>55365804
>>55365926
>>55365992
Unless you can muster out with an "Armor" result and convince your Ref to allow it, no.

Battle Dress isn't so much rare as tightly controlled. The game is also focussed differently, being a game that *has* combat instead of a game *centered* on combat (like most D&D variations).

If you want the cool hardsuit look, go for Combat Armor. Most of the protection of BD without the powered STR buff.

>>55367617
Basically, through some shit happening, the GM ended up using a picture of Griffith for the main antagonist to the party. I'd already been looking at doing some sort of heavy-armor character for once, and because this'd give me an excuse to make something roughly inspired by Guts, Battle Dress seemed like a good fit for it. Put in a weapon for the arm cannon, gives enhanced stats for the berserker armor, and just all around fits decently. Definitely able to work up to it over the course of things, though.

Also Str is shit and so is melee, please kill me. Just end my fucking life.

>>55367272

Merchant or paramilitary?

>>55367662
Under CT STR was still useful for carrying capacity even if you were a ranged trooper. It also added to your HP, of course.

In most cases BD is only necessary for a couple weapon carries. Several of the plasma/fusion guns require the raw STR of BD just to lift the weapons, compensate for their recoil, and slough off the waste heat.

In SOME cases, even Combat Armor has some power, but only enough to counter its own weight and run comms, sensors, and life support.

>>55368306
Pirates.

>>55367272
>Realistically speaking, assuming that you have a party of six, and ~104+ Ship Shares
>Realistically speaking
>and ~104+ Ship Shares

What, how ?

>>55368423
Independent Operation: Independent Operation: The character may set up his own business
or group that works with the navy, such as a mercenary group, spy
network or private think–tank. The navy will pay up to 20 ship shares
or 1d6 MCr towards initial start-up costs, as long as the character
agrees to favour them as a client.

Rolling this five times as a benefit, plus getting TAS Membership twice, the second of which gives 2 ship shares, and just normal rolling 2 ship shares.

>>55368462
Uhm, i don't think that the navy will take it kindly that their resources have been turned into a pirate ship.

>>55368597
I never said this was a sane idea or likely to end well, anon. I'm just asking details that'd be possible.

>>55368620
True, well the adventure "pirates of drinax" has actually some rules and suprisingtly good (it comes from mongoose) ideas about how to handle piracy and pirate ships.

What you want for your ship.
4 points armor.
4 points of thrust, minimum, the more the better since you need to catch up to other ships.
Jump 2
And still enough space for a crew and loot.

>>55368726
And also you will at least need an Extra pilot and some expendable meat shie... errrr... marines as a pirate .

>>55368726
Yeah, we'd been working with a budget of about 280 MCr to build a ship. The original plan had been a 400 ton gunboat, but that worked out a bit fucky.

>>55368804
Try 200-300 dTons, those are usually more easier to handle and for extra space there are shenanigans like docking clamps and modular cargo space in high guard and i think in scoundrel too.

>>55368948
Basically my idea would be something like this.
Go big and buy a 300 dTon frame, standart should be enough, but standart is for space hobos so you get the streamlined version.
Buy 200 dtons of external cargo clamps, for one that's way cheaper than a 500 dton hull and also let's you pass as a frighter on a quick glance.
Now we buy a rating H power plant and M-drive. that costs us 96 million credits but enough thrust to be able to escape when the ship is fully loaded.
Jumdrive class E will do it, you can pull a jump 2 fully loaded and 3 when empty: 50 mcreds.

So now we got the rough basics down.
159,2 million already gone and 230 dTons left on your ship.

>>55368413

Okay. Six is going to make things tight because of your need for gunners; one per turret.

Looking at military/paramilitary designs, Classic's Type-T patrol cruiser, forex, needs at least 10 because of the 4 turrets, the Type-P corsair needs a crew of 5 without counting 4 gunners for her turrets, and the Type-CE Gazalle needs at last 8.

Looking at armed merchants, the Type-R "fat" trader needs a crew of 5 not gunners for her two turrets. She also has "short legs" at jump1. The 200dT A2 "far" trader does jump2 and can be handled by a crew of 3 not counting gunners for the two turrets. The last is probably your best bet if you want to avoid hiring NPCs.

As for the navy helping pay for a "pirate" ship, your group could be privateers or pirate hunters. The lines tend to blur the further into the boondocks you go.

If I were the referee and my group was looking at this question, I'd suggest the Type-T patrol cruiser despite the need for NPCs. The patrol cruiser can carry a crew of 18; pilot, navigator, medic, 3 engineers, 4 gunners, and 8 troops. I'd put the 6 players in 6 command positions - pilot, nav, medic, chief engineer, chief gunner, and troop commander - and fill out the remaining positions with NPCs. The Type-T pulls 3gees, can make jump4, has 50dTons of cargo space, and a ship's boat. Depending on which combat rules you use, 4 weapon turrets isn't too shabby either.

>>55365804

Not really. It'd be like the army letting a retired major take a tank home with him. Those things cost the 3I's armed forces millions of credits a pop, and they're not legal for civilian use.

>>55369772
Fire Control can handle the turrets, thankfully. Maybe not super GREAT at it, but it can do it.

>>55370128
There are multiple careers that easily allow you to pull in multiple millions in benefits. Ship Shares, Combat Implant three times gives 5MCr worth of augments, and many of the Cybernetics careers offer several MCr worth of augments too.

Shit, Battle Dress is actually CHEAP compared to the other stuff you can acquire.

>>55365804
>For Mongoose 1e, is there any way to start with Battle Dress?

If a player wants battle dress, make him EARN it. Don't be a pushover and just hand it to him on a silver platter.

Make it a campaign goal, make it the focus of several adventures, make it fun instead of a "gimmedat". Hell, stumbling across a deliberately misrouted shipment of BD is part of the plot in Classic's "Spinward Marches Campaign".

>>55370217
>Fire Control can handle the turrets, thankfully. Maybe not super GREAT at it, but it can do it.

Yeah, but that means you're firing all four turrets at one target. Classic's High Guard lets you group turrets into batteries which then only require one gunner. You could group 2 triple laser turrets into a "hammer" controlled by one gunner while giving the other 2 turrets a mix of sand and missiles controlled by a gunner each.

>>55370308
Wait, what?

Where the hell is this and how would I do that in MGT1e? That's basically exactly what I want.

Also a way to make Railguns not suck massive dong.

>>55370239
>Ship Shares

Can't be sold, last time I checked.

>Combat Implants

They're custom-made. They can't easily take those out and put them in someone else, so yeah, they let you leave with them.
The alternative is to take them out and break them apart for the materials to make implants for someone else. But if they reactivate you due to an emergency act then they'd have to redo your implants to bring you back to your old fighting shape, too. To the bean counters, this is clearly worth letting you walk out with, whereas Battle Dress belongs to the military and stays there.

>Battle Dress is actually CHEAP compared to the other stuff you can acquire.

Not so cheap when you have to cross the sector in order to buy it from the black market via a high-tech, low law level world. Also, name a career that lets you start with a couple of MCr in your pocket.

>>55370357
Noble. Anything that ends up rolling decently on Cosmopolite's Life Events tables and has decent Gambler. Any career that gives Cybernetics as benefits or on their tables.

>>55370379

Sounds like Mongoose bloat. Characters shouldn't be entering play with millions of credits, IMO. Noble is at least a logical exception and a special case.

>>55370330
>Where the hell is this

Classic, MT, and other good versions.

>>and how would I do that in MGT1e?

You can't, which is why you shouldn't be using MgT1e.

>>That's basically exactly what I want.

Then either A) use another rules set or B) house rule it. House rules and home brews have been part of Traveller from the very beginning.

If you do house rule the ability, make sure your NPCs can do it too. This isn't D&D/d20 where only PCs get to do cool stuff. Traveller is different because Traveller assumes NPCs are just as good as PCs, if not sometimes better.

>Also a way to make Railguns not suck massive dong.

Railguns suck because they suck. Mongoose added them because A) Mongoose sucks, B) Mongoose's writers are mostly morons, and C) Mongoose was hoping you'd be too stupid to notice.

Railguns DO NOT WORK in space combat. Stop wishing they should and accept the fact that they never should have been added to the game in the fashion Mongoose added them.

>>55370515
>Characters shouldn't be entering play with millions of credits

Try telling that to some sperg with a Mongoose splatbook in his hands.

"B-b-b-b-but it's right here in the RULES...."

>>55370675

That's why you have to be really careful what splats you allow if you're using Mongoose. Some of them are ludicrous.
LIke the guy on Close the Airlock who, being a veteran minmaxer used to D20 stuff, happily minmaxed his MGT1 PC with stuff bought from the Central Supply Catalogue with his ample mustering out cash, only for them to discover in play he had wound up with something ridiculous like +30 on attack rolls.
They all agreed it was terrible, minmaxer included, and had the character dramatically killed off and replaced with a more reasonable one soon after.

>>55370675
Well, I remember seeing a group playing Classic in 1987 or 1988 which had, due to good rolls, started with two ships. They sold one of them and bought battle dress and suchlike

>>55370829
>bought battle dress

Yeah, you just go down to the 7-11. Battledress is usually next to the Cheez Doodles.

>>55370737
>They all agreed it was terrible, minmaxer included

Now there's a rarity: A sane minmaxer.

Nice to see he dropped his d20 play style for something more suited to Traveller. Too bad so many others either can't or don't even realize it's a problem.

>>55371025

Yeah, making his character broken wasn't even intentional, he had never played MGT before and was just going through making what he figured were the optimal choices for gear purchase, but stuff in the CSC was like +2 here, +3 over there, and it added up fast. When it hit the table it was blatantly super broken.

>>55370558
Rail guns make sense in one context: ortillery, but they better get a lot more damage for their buck.
And maybe fighters at really close range. But in that case (using 1e), why not a particle Barbette?

>>55371132
>When it hit the table it was blatantly super broken.

It's to his credit he recognized that fact and ditched the PC.

It also doesn't say much about Mongoose or their rules when an absurdly minmaxed PC like that can be rolled up and tooled up essentially by accident.

>>55371132
The only things that add to the game from CS are the laser pointer errata and special rounds for your slugthrowers.

The weapons and armors are nice, but do not really add something to a game whichs design philosophy is "you could do it like that, or don't i'm a book, not a cop".

>>55366182
Aussie? Truly, international price points are suffering

>>55371208
I for one do not think that every itemn needs to be specifically balanced with cost and use.
So it might have something to do with the planets available TL.

Also a railgun should be able to fire different types of rounds. including some that allow do defend against rockets.

>>55371208
>Rail guns make sense in one context: ortillery

Yup, which is why I specified space combat.

Railguns have their uses. Ortillery like you mention. As a weapon for an interface CAS craft is another. Maybe even aboard armed/armored shuttles dropping troops 'hot'.

But in space combat? Pull my other leg, Mongoose.

So railguns in space combat (beyond the infantry level, I mean) didn't exist in traveller before mongoose?

>>55371303
>CAS craft
What's that ?

>>55371454
Close Air Support craft

>>55371264
Laser sight errata?

>>55371425
>So railguns in space combat (beyond the infantry level, I mean) didn't exist in traveller before mongoose?

No, they did not. Not even as anti-missile weapons >>55371294 suggests. Railguns were never space combat weapons because their range was far too small.

Mongoose is stupid - for example, the staffer who wrote Mercenary 1st edition thought the term "merchant marine" referred to armed guards on ships - and Mongoose counts on you being stupid too.

>>55371513
There is a laser pointer mod for guns in the CRB which dubles your aming bonus. Which is pretty broken once you think about it.

The CSC has also a laser pointer for the same price and TL but this one just adds a +1 bonus for attacks up to medium range.

>>55371577
>merchant marine

Mongoose cuck here, what is a merchant marine ?

>>55370899
Probably bought it from an arms dealer - you know, the kind who equip high-tech mercenaries, but I dunno - I wasn't playing in the game or running it. And you're entirely missing the point, which is that millions of credits at the tail-end of character gen is neither new nor unique to Mongoose.

>>55371586
>Which is pretty broken once you think about it.

That's part and parcel of using 2D6. You're looking at only 36 possible results spread across 12 whole numbers, so there isn't a lot of "room" for a lot of bonuses, modifiers, and the like. Add too many and you might as well not roll at all.

The innumerate assclowns at Mongoose merrily shoveled a dTon of mods, bonuses, and whatnot into every skill, gadget, and piece of gear they could without ever stopping to think they were distorting any die roll past the point of irrelevance.

What's worse, along with not caring about how their flood of DMs was making a mockery of their own rules, Mongoose was planning on you being too stupid to notice.

>>55371731
Literally just +6 means you cannot fail outside of modifiers.

>>55371656

noun
1.
the vessels of a nation that are engaged in commerce.
2.
the officers and crews of such vessels.

>>55371656
Basically, all ships of a particular minimum tonnage, registered out of the same port or nation, which maybe called upon by that nation to serve in times of war as transport auxiliaries.
Yes, that includes your free trader, but it definitely includes all subsidized merchants, and all mega corps.

>>55371679

I dunno, it was pretty rare that a group could muster that much. Which is why your story is "one time back around '88 I heard" for Classic, versus "just roll up this career" in Mongoose.

>>55371880
I didn't say it was common, just that it happened. And there was always the sorts of GM around that let you get far too much stuff. And I saw them play one session, which was hilarious, because someone shot at something they shouldn't have and there was a massive explosion

>>55371679
>which is that millions of credits at the tail-end of character gen is neither new nor unique to Mongoose.

The point is that the FREQUENCY at which it happens is new and is unique to Mongoose.

Don't get me wrong. Over the years I've rolled up some "monsters" with Classic, characters whose stats, skills, money, and/or ships meant they were too powerful to be PCs and so were popped into my NPC pile. Those 'monsters' were very rare though.

MgT produces monsters far too often and hand out far to many "goodies" in chargen like Ancient and other alien artifacts.

>>55371745

Exactly and in >>55370737's example from "Close the Airlock" a player new to Traveller managed to get something like a +30 by minmaxing stats and buying the "right" gear.

If that's not a hallmark of a broken system, what is?

>>55371880
It's more "Just roll up this one career and get lucky on about six different things all together", but sure.

>>55372013
It really doesn't? And the Artifacts are entirely undefined and up to the GM. In order to really make anything crazy, you either need to take an obscene amount of terms, or you need to get extremely lucky multiple times in your Events.

Like, sure, yes, you can get a 100% free ship of up to 500 tons, weapons/addons and everything COMPLETELY FREE.

To do that you'd need to get a Life Event, then roll a 65, then roll a 6. I don't know the exact odds, but it's damn well not likely.

>>55372074
*A player new to the system that explicitly sought out things that looked like they'd be optimal for him.

>>55371679
>you know, the kind who equip high-tech mercenaries

You mean the hi-tech mercenaries who are bonded by a megacorp and require Imperial licenses?

>>55371994
>there was always the sorts of GM around that let you get far too much stuff.

So it was the result of a piss poor referee and not, as >>55371880 points out, Mongoose's shitty career tables.

>>55372074

To be fair, that's more just the case that the CSC was broken as fuck. MGT1's core rulebook is generally fine.

>>55372089
>but it's damn well not likely.

There's a big difference between "damn well not likely" and "impossible".

>>55372132
>To be fair, that's more just the case that the CSC was broken as fuck. MGT1's core rulebook is generally fine.

Agreed. Mongoose's desire to write more splats to sell to more fools substantially harmed their version of the game.

>>55372134
>Thing has happened in both Mongoose Traveller and Classic Traveller
>Only complain about it happening in Mongoose and ignore it can happen in other places

>>55372172
> Thing happens in both Mongoose and Classic, but at very different frequencies.
> Ignore the frequency at which thing happens because you're a pedantic sperg.

>>55372172

>there's a difference between "very unlikely" and "impossible"
>but no diffeence at all between "very unlikely" and "sorta uncommon"

Are we gonna have to get all autistic and work out numbers for the likelihood in each system or something? 'Cause I got other shit to do today.

>>55372132
>>55372153
Mongoose also started with writing D&D stuff.
See what was said above (>>55359088 ) about feats for a taste of D&D, and then realize - if all additional capabilities that are not a class feature are feats, where does that leave equipment?
Bonuses. And usually combat ones at that, since that became the focus of D&D rather quick (they took away all incentive for anything but combat)
To the best of my knowledge, Traveller was the very first non-d20 system that Mongoose had ever touched, so they went into it with the D&D mindset: equipment is for bonuses, not additional capabilities.
Of course, if you look through the non-combat chapters of CSC (especially survival gear) you see not that many bonuses, but a lot more capabilities - which means that it was written by someone different, who probably understood Traveller better than the fool that wrote the stuff that effects combat.

>>55372288
>Different frequencies
>Cites no information on how often it happens in Classic

>>55372318
>'Cause I got other shit to do today.

Then go do it, Matthew.

>>55372325
>To the best of my knowledge, Traveller was the very first non-d20 system that Mongoose had ever touched, so they went into it with the D&D mindset: equipment is for bonuses, not additional capabilities.

That's very cogent point. It was apparent from the first that the assclowns at Mongoose didn't quite understand Traveller, nor did they really try to understand it.

...is Mongoose's D&D stuff AS bad?

>>55372427
Well it's DnD we are talking about.

But their DnD mindset really shows in Traveller 2e and their splats.

So i'd assume that their DnD stuff could be actually okay-ish, besides editing.

>>55372427

Generally, yeah. Making fun of Mongoose's shitty writing and editing has been a popular sport since the mid '00s at least when they published a lot of terribly written OGL d20 stuff.

You'd think they'd get it together eventually, but no.

>>55372480
D&D isn't inherently bad, anon, it gets shoehorned into a lot of shit, but it's not inherently the fault of the system

>>55372799
>D&D isn't inherently bad

I'm not saying D&D is bad and I'm not saying Traveller is good.

I am saying they are different. They're built differently and they have have different thinking behind them. A mechanism which works well for one, may not work well for the other. If you only have experience with one, that experience will not translate 100% to the other.

who're the IISS, and what do they do?

>>55373404
Scouts. Run the x-boat system, explore the area beyond the borders, update survey maps, run census checks, render aid anywhere they can, and, in my 3I, generally check in with every single system they can at least once per year.
Yeah, they actually have the highest approval rating of any Imperial Service.
Have some non-canon hilarity related to them:
>A representative democracy, as a matter of tradition, elects the CO of the nearest scout base as an advisor to their president
>On one planet, which saw massive aid efforts from the Scouts during a disaster, members are granted an effective +1SOC during their stay. Children play with toy Suilemans and often ask visiting scouts to sign theirs
>A primitive world has a cargo cult based on visits by scout ships. Someone left the textbooks used during training, meaning the priesthood makes excellent recruits. The often return home to train the next generation in Scouting.

Speaking of character backstory generation, has anyone used Central Casting - Heroes for Tomorrow?

mega<dot>nz
/#F!XhJkTTxL!Nu3J65Q1s_T-fcRXo3bFqg!rh53UBqB

>>55319938
>What to do with all those credits?
Improve the ship, buy power armor, live off of it for 8 weeks staying at a beach resort and studying up on how to use Heavy Weapons... Plenty of things.

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Okay, here's the dump for the modified training rules. Look over them before I update the pastebin with them.

Modified skill training times
<snip shit ton of math and running through Miller's logic in CT>
Skill training takes a number of hours based on the desired skill level, training one level at a time.
Gaining a Skill-0 takes 50 hours, Skill 1+ takes 500 hours a level.
A character may simultaneously train up to INT DM skills at 1+, while up to 6 skills may be trained at Skill-0 at the same time. If the character swaps which skills they are training, throw EDU 9+ to keep half of the trained hours so far– failure means you lose all of them and must start from 0 on your next attempt.
At the end of the training period Throw 8+ on 2d, adding the higher of the INT DM or EDU DM, one-half of the current skill level (rounded down), and subtracting the level of the skill to be trained (thus increasing levels gets harder). Attempts to learn Skill-0 do not suffer the untrained penalty.
If successful, add the skill at the level trained.
If failed, another 100 hours of training (10 for Skill-0) is required per point of failure before another attempt to keep the skill can be done.
Voluntarily adding 50 hours to the training adds +1 to the roll, and may be done a number of times equal to the skill level being trained. For skill-0, only 5 hours needs to be added per +1, and there is no limit (thus, an 80 hour training period grants an automatic pass – 50 hours base, 30 hours for +6 to the training roll).

(cont)

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>>55373870 (cont)
The Difference Between Study and Training
Not courses of study are the same, and thus the training gained from them is also not the same. A character can use any of the four methods during their training period – to make it easier, simply note down the final number of hours training hours gained, regardless of
-On the Job: since this involves lots of repetition of stuff you already know, this allows 2 hours of training to be gained every 8 hours of work – 1 hour if you work for 4. The character must be intent on learning the skill in order to apply this
-Self Training: With no teacher, but teaching resources, every 2 hours of study equals 1 hour of training. You may study up to 12 hours a day, less if you have other duties or a job. When training Skill-5+, this is the only option (along with On-The-Job) available.
-Teacher: Someone with Instruction 1+, and the skill to be learned at 1+ (must exceed level to be trained by 1), must be available for this option to be used. Every hour of study counts as 1 hour of training. This rarely exceeds 8 hours every day, but can go to 12. This option is not available for Skill-5+. This course costs Cr20 per hour, multiplied by the skill level being taught (skill-0 costs Cr50 per hour).
-Intensive: Usually available on in the military, a few corporations, and some really strange organizations, this method takes a teacher (with Instruction 1+), multiple assistants (with Instruction 0+), and takes you in hand for up to 16 hours a day (almost nobody goes below 12). Each hour of study counts for two hours of training, but the student must also throw END 8+, DM+1 if studying 12 hours a day, to avoid falling out of the program. Intensive training is an exception to the limits on the number of skills that can be trained simultaneously.

>>55373870
>>55373900
(Why does boot camp take so long? Because your character is also being trained in a large number of background skills that are not relevant to your character sheet – teamwork, recognizing bad tactical situations, regulations, and multiple others that are not listed, and should not be listed unless everybody in the group went through the same training and are adventuring as part of that organization. Additionally, training times in boot camp are extended to ensure that everybody who goes through automatically succeeds in gaining their basic training)

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>>55373870
>>55373900
>>55373917
The Effects of Jack-Of-All-Trades on Training Times: Each level of JOAT, starting at 0, provides a 10% reduction in required training times, until JOAT-4 for a 50% reduction. JOAT-5+ grants an additional 5% reduction per level. JOAT may not be trained. With the Referee's permission, upon every four years of active adventuring, a throw of INT 10+ may be done to gain 1 level of JOAT.

The Effects of Instruction on Training: Instruction-1+ allows a character to teach their skills to others, while Instruction-0 allows them to serve as an assistant or tutor. To teach someone, you must have Instruction, and the skill to train them in at one higher than the level being taught (assistants require the skill at the level being taught). At the end of the training period, they add your level in Instruction to their roll. Instruction-0 may be taught, Instruction-1+ may not. Rather, teaching someone counts as Self-Teaching for the purpose of training Instruction (thus, you will gain half the number of hours that you taught someone as training for Instruction), with the same roll as any other skill.
Instruction may be used to train groups: Instruction-1+ allows 10 students per level to gain your Instruction level as a bonus to their training roll, with an additional 10 gaining one-half (rounded down) of your Instruction level as a bonus, and allows an effective class size of 30 per level (students in excess of effective class size count this training time as 1.5 hours of study to each hour of training, and do not gain a bonus). Each assistant (Instruction-0) allows an additional 5 students to gain one-half (rounded down) of your Instruction level as a bonus, an additional 1 to gain the full bonus, and adds 10 students to your effective class size.

>>55373930
(note going from Instruction-0 to Instruction 1: Yes, the rules on training Instruction means you have to spend 1000 hours as an assistant teacher, or in ordinary self-training. Too bad)

This is very good, Grognard. You should submit it to Jeff over at Freelance Traveller.

Okay, pastebin updated
https://pastebin.com/vVRyWCFm
>>55374088
I think I'll let someone else submit it
That's my cover story and I'm sticking to it!

>>55373740
So...Couriers, Explorers, Surveyors, Anti-Piracy, etc. they're a general purpose 'do anything' branch?

>>55374293
>they're a general purpose 'do anything' branch?

Basically yes. Classic's Book 6 is in the Archive. Pages 5 through 8 will answer all your questions, if you can be bothered to read them that is.

>>55374293

Some of them are also spies

>>55374474
Dude, keep that shit in the fiction section of this fine Scout fan site

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Rolled 2, 6, 6, 3, 3, 2, 6, 2, 4, 5, 5, 1 = 45 (12d6)

rollan up a UPP

>>55374629
UPP 895896

So I watched some shows and got interested in generation colony ships. my idea was that they might be a pretty interesting setting for campaigns, being a flying micro planet bubble and all. So I stumbled over O'Neil cylinders
>"it's HOW big ?"
So how would live be in a giant tube that's flying with 1g acceleration through space ?
The biggest hurdle I see would be crossing the space between systems, because of the lack of sunlight.

How would it be for the people?
Would unemployment even be a thing ?
What couldn't they do we take as given and vice versa.

tl;dr
What do you think about generation ships as setting ?
Maybe even a swarm of those.

Rolled 1, 1 = 2 (2d6)

>>55374648
lets enlist in the scouts..
dm+1 for intelligence 8+

Rolled 6, 4 = 10 (2d6)

>>55374763
dammit.
lets try for Navy

Rolled 6, 2 = 8 (2d6)

>>55374788
term 1 Navy
enlist ok

rollan survival

Rolled 2, 1 = 3 (2d6)

>>55374818
term 1 Navy
enlist ok
survival ok

rollan for commish

Rolled 5, 4, 5, 3 = 17 (4d6)

>>55374844
term 1 Navy
enlist ok
survival ok
commission fail

rollan for skills

Rolled 6, 2 = 8 (2d6)

>>55374876

term 1 Navy
enlist ok
survival ok
commission fail

whoops, was using wrong ruleset and forgot to declare. Rollan twice and selecting from table 4, advanced education.

Rolled 2, 6 = 8 (2d6)

term 1 Navy
enlist ok
survival ok
commission fail

skills
navigation
administration

rollan to re-enlist

Rolled 1, 5 = 6 (2d6)

>>55375007
UPP 895896

term 1 Navy
enlist ok
survival ok
commission fail

term 2 Navy
reenlist ok

skills
navigation
administration

rolling commission

Rolled 4, 4 = 8 (2d6)

>>55375033
err. oops. that was for injury.

UPP 895896

term 1 Navy
enlist ok
survival ok
commission fail

term 2 Navy
reenlist ok
survival ok

skills
navigation
administration

rolling commission

Rolled 5 (1d6)

>>55375052
damn, should have joined the army.


UPP 895896

term 1 Navy
enlist ok
survival ok
commission fail

term 2 Navy
reenlist ok
survival ok
commission fail

skills
navigation
administration

rollan skills on table 3

Rolled 5, 4, 6, 6, 5, 6 = 32 (6d6)

>>55375099
UPP 895896

term 1 Navy
enlist ok
survival ok
commission fail

term 2 Navy
reenlist ok
survival ok
commission fail

skills
navigation
administration
gunnery

I'm just going to roll 6d6 in order for reenlist, survival and commission.

Rolled 5, 2 = 7 (2d6)

>>55375137
Holy shazbot, I made Ensign!

UPP 895896

term 1 Navy
enlist ok
survival ok
commission fail

term 2 Navy
reenlist ok
survival ok
commission fail

term 3 Navy
reenlist ok
survival ok
commission ok

rolling for promotion

skills
navigation
administration
gunnery

I'm just going to roll 6d6 in order for reenlist, survival and commission.