What's the word on pack animals? Seems like a goat is

There was an article in backpacker about this once.

Some guy in either WA or OR would let you rent his goats for trailcamping. The author and a friend did it, and they said it was hell because goats are stubborn as fuck. One would only move if you sprayed him with a spraybottle full of water, even though the guy who owned the goats specifically said it was only to be used for punishment, not motivation. The author used it for motivation anyways. I always thought that was really shitty of him.

>>459626

Here's the article:

http://www.backpacker.com/destinations-stories/my-partner-ate-my-socks-a-tale-of-goatpacking/#bp=0/img1

lol I can't imagine how annoying using a goat for a pack animal would be
theyre dumb assholes that just look at you with 3 neurons firing an hour

Goats are the most evil satanic creature on earth and will ruin your entire life.

I was once kicking around the idea of using a donkey for carrying my surveying shit and a horsey acquaintance told me horses are better. Donkeys are pricks but horses will more or less do what you want.

>>459626
oh no
the horror of spraying a goat with a spray bottle of water
that is the cruelest thing ive ever heard of

>>459629
Hence, the pack-horse's enduring appeal.

>>459631
I know, an animal that amuses itself by smashing the top of its skull at maximum speed into any and everything it comes in contact with.

>>459629
>>459626

I dunno, I have 24 horses. The goats we used to keep just stayed in the paddock grazing with the horses and followed you around expecting food

at worst they jumped fences and climbed on top of buildings.

>>459632
horses are a pain in the dick to haul around, especially across national borders

Surely a goat isn't difficult to source locally and for a fraction of what a pony would cost

>>459635
>at worst they jumped fences and climbed on top of buildings
I wouldn't want to trust all my camping shit to a goat out innawoods.

>>459633
>>459631

I didn't say it was shitty because it harmed the goat, it's shitty because the owner spent a lot of time training the goats and renting them out and this dude just totally disregards his instructions.

>>459667
>a lot of time training the goats
>training the goats

That's labor lost.

>>459635
>climbed on top of buildings

how the fuck

>>459670

whether that's true or not, he didn't own the goat and did something the owner specifically asked him not to do

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>>459672
Shit, you for real? Google image "goat on" and be amazed.

>>459673
Reminds me of the way I beat the piss out of rental cars.

>>459675

fucking goat magic

>>459675
why do goats go up

whats up there

are they just dumb

>>459684
>are they just dumb
No, that's the problem. I don't know why they climb, but they insist on being on top of things.

>>459684
food others can't reach
less predators

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>>459694
>food and predators

>>459697
>implying there are any predators on a donkey
>implying you can't reach higher situated leaves on the top of a donkey
this goat is just thinking outside of the box

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>>459697

>>459698
Protip: goats are just dicks

>>459700
Whoa, buzzards are even bigger dicks than goats.

>>459702
>buzzard
looks like a golden eagle, they are known to prey on young mountain goats

>>459703
>golden eagle
meh, just a buzzard with cachet

>>459684
salt in the rocks
lick lick

>>459724
>lick lick

why do I feel violated

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>>459724
they also lick tents or boots at night to get the salt from your sweat. bretty horofic the noise they make, if you wake up at night and don't know what it is...

>>459629
>horses will more or less do what you want.

Providing that what I want is for them to break their shitty, frail legs the minute I go up any sort of rough terrain.

>>459675
If there's a thing and a goat, the goat will usually be on the thing.

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Most people probably wouldn't do well packing with goats not because the goats are unsuitable, but because the people are. You have to have more willpower than the goat, and most people just don't have it in them.

Also, if you want a good rough terrain pack animal, think Pre-Columbian.

>>459930
Goats and cats view the world in pretty similar terms.

>What is that thing?
>Why am I not on that thing?

>>459931
is that an alpaca?

>this thread mayed me lo;z

>>459938

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMYN4djSq7o

>>459724
keked 4 days

>>459936
reminds me of the gif of the kid running up to a woman and ripping her shirt off while backflipping over here

>>459631
It's not because it's cruel to the goats, it's because if they have a specified punishment that's being used to train them, using it all the time for motivation will ruin its "punishing" effect and mess up training.

>goats are dicks
>goats are stupid

i hear the reason they're dicks is they're quite smart. smart animals that aren't treated right become mentally ill and/or cunts.

see: african grey parrot.

>>459931
Alpacas and llamas are great.
Unless they are being stubborn.
Then forget about using them as pack animals.

>>459977
seems like they're punishing them for not moving

llamas look kinda cute from far away and then you get up close and they fucking scary ugly

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>>459672

>>459624

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezBRmeFUFAM

why has no one mentioned donkeys and mules, they are by far the best pack animals, as they eat very little and are very enduring
inb4 they stubborn, if a donkey is stubborn with you, you failed his education and know nothing about donkeys

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>>459697

>>460017
They are actually quite smart, as smart as or smarter than dogs and they have a very dominant social hierarchy.

If a pack goat won't follow you, it's because it knows you don't have the balls to lead.

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>>460098
true, i once was a goat herder for a year, and maybe once a week i had to fight the alpha goat to remind him who was boss to be able to lead the heard. it's pretty easy too, once you grab the horns, just knee kick him in the ribs a couple of times, then make him lie on the floor by pushing his head all the way down.
pic related, my alpha goat looked like this

>>459626
>>459629
>>459631
Yeah, that is just terrible training practices. You get much better with positive reinforcement than punishment. It forms a symbiotic relationship instead of a master-slave relationship.

I mean how hard is it to carry around a pocket of treats for an animal? Once they associate you with the treat and kind attitude they are more apt to identify with you as one of the pack/herd and follow you around.

I've worked with horse, donkeys, mules, goats, and pigs. They are all the exact same in respect to training. Treat them with respect and positive feedback and they well follow you anywhere. But, fuck up the training or have some dick like that author do the wrong training and it screws everything up for the animals and they develop stubbornness very quickly. It isn't cut and dry, but explaining requires a lot of text I'm not writing.

>>460017
Parrots make lousy pack animals

>>460027
I've been told they're stubborn with people they don't know. You can't harness up a strange llama and lead it away. It won't budge and that will lead to a fight ending with someone covered in spit or cud. That pretty much rules out renting a llama.

>>460110
this is partially true, but the opposite also works. if you beat the crap out of an animal it will obey.
i'm not saying you should or that it is right, but to violently dominate animals by force is a technique used in the past and still today

>>460124
They can carry plenty of rimfire ammo.

Also, goats are shitty pack animals.

>>460126
Yeah, they don't recognize you as part of their herd. Usually, if you're renting llamas there's also a guide involved.

>>460099
When I was a little kid aged 7 there was this ram at a nearby museum with horns like that chained with a 3 meter long chain. We used to tease the fuck out of the ram and then sprint away before it headbutted us.


Good times

>>459697
is she pregnant or something?

>>460094
>>460094
horse are pussy ass cowards that flee at the smallest threat, donkeys on the other hand will fuck you up. they doesn't afraid of anything

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>>460184

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>>460184
they don't fucking kid around with them canine folk

>>459684

it's fun

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>>459624
Llamas dude, llamas.

>>460220
if you want to pay thousands of dollars, go for it

>>459684
>are they just dumb
Raised them when I was a kid. The average goat is about as smart as the average dog and just as trainable.

>>459940
Both my younger kids know every word of that song. And so do I.

Tablet
Brick
Potato

Which one of you is this?
>https://www.reddit.com/r/CampingandHiking/comments/2v6a2j/soit_turns_out_that_goat_packing_is_a_thing/

I regularly see /out/ threads pop up on /r/CampingAndHiking and /r/Bushcraft 2-5 days after the /out/ discussion.

>>460503
There's not many, "pseudo-underground" websites for edgy teens, out there and the people that visit them tend to visit nearly all of them.

Case in point, you know the boards for that stuff seemingly rather well.

>>459672
Goats do this. They don't care that it's a building.

>>460184
Donkeys are badass. I would go to war with a donkey.

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Finally!

A reason to post this image has come.

They key to keeping goats in line is to have a wether, which is a male that was neutered young and is less aggressive. You get the wether to recognize you as herd alpha and the female goats will fall in line behind him.

Of course this works best if they are your goats and they've been yours long enough to recognize you as the top of their social order.

If you rent goats, you're going to spend your whole trip trying to establish yourself as head of the herd because to them, you're just a new goat and new goats start at the bottom so it'll be a lot if "fuck you, I won't do what you tell me!"

Goats are great.
my grandmother had goats all her life. then she went crazy and started keeping them indoors. embroided bible quotes on the walls. goat shit between the floorboards.
lovely

also knew a guy who has two pet goats on his boat. he has life vests for them and then love swimming after they learned they didnt sink

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>>460612
Jack Simpson beat you to it.

>http://www.amazon.com/Donkey-Gallipoli-Story-Courage-World/dp/0763639133/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1423436938&sr=1-1&keywords=donkey+gallipoli

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>>459672

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>>460967

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>>460968

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>>460969

>>459698

>implying there are any predators on a donkey

I can't stop laughing

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>>460968
>>460969
>>460970

I-I-I-I....I don't know

>>459936
>>459937

That's some ninja-tier goat power we got here !

>>460655

From what I've seen, non-neutered males are big pussy compared to female goats. They're all like "I'm da goat-king, lemme impregnate you, but hey, it's a dog over here, seeya later when it'll be gone" *troppity troppity far away*. Females seems to be more courageous, but it's from goats that are in an enclosed meadow and have done nothing else than eating and climbing on some stuff.