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Watched Origin, not bad...but the one thing that always got me

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Watched Origin, not bad...but the one thing that always got me about Gundam.

ANY civilization advanced enough to build these megaliths of human ingenuity would have same said ingenuity to build ships of these same size to act as generation ships. WHY THE HELL DIDN'T THEY?
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Because there wouldn't be any point?
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>>12203229
It's because, despite having advanced into space, mankind is still too busy destroying itself to leave the solar system behind and display its true potential in the far reaches of the universe.
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There's at least one shown in Crossbone, in the Skull Heart stuff.
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>>12203229
Because Earth is the best why would we ever leave Earth to colonise, say Mars. After all staying on and around Earth is Clearly the best course of action as we can see after victory gundam everything is perfect and in now way does limiting our existence on earth ensure a never ending spiral drain on its resources or the cultural collapse leading to Mad Max world
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>>12203229

Earth isn't so fucked up that we need to leave it entirely. The farthest we have to go out is Jupiter to mine (though it's more accurate to say scoop) Helium-3.
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>>12203229
Presumably no propulsion system good enough to get there and decelerate within a few thousand years.
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>>12203229
Because leaving humanity behind entirely is a much greater step than just living offworld. That's a special kind of loneliness and without a pressing need...why?

Also the interstellar gulf is a lot shorter on resources than the solar system.
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>>12203271
>Society collapses on Earth leading to a Max Max world that potentially gets better
>Society collapses on Earth cutting Mars/Moon off from supplies leading to everybody there dying
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Newtypes did though sometime before Turn A.

Realistically, there is not point in traveling to another star system. Except to prevent the extinction of your species by your own star. If you can harness the energy levels needed to build space colonies. You are capable of fully exploiting all the resources of your own solar system. Which means you have no need for anything. As you can simply build more colonies, mine more asteroids, and get more hydrogen fuel from gas giants.
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>>12203311

Unless our population has simply become unsustainable with just Earth's resources.
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>>12203301
>assuming everybody is forever reliant on earth because in no way does air water or fuel exist elsewhere and all plants/anmals magically die when the leave the Earth sphere , and all technology can only be built on Earth because also magic.

>Enjoy your Kuntala stake Earthnoid
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>>12203326
Once you get to Gundam levels of space travel. You don't need Earth's resources anymore.
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>>12203326
In which case we'll probably do better to limit population growth, which we'd have to do anyway if we're planning on boxing masses of people up in cans for thousands and thousands of years during an interstellar voyage.
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>>12203229
Adding to what people have already said, the stations seem entirely dependent on solar and fusion power - two things that are either difficult (fusion) or impossible (solar) to maintain over the several tens of thousands of years' voyage through the gulf between stars.

The colonies also seem to be in a state of perpetual reconstruction and re-repair, not least because of all the fucking wars that keep breaking out around it.

I agree, the fact that there hasn't been at least some discussion of the idea by the time of UC is a bit odd, but that they haven't done anything along those lines is fully understandable.
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>>12203341
>In which case we'll probably do better to limit population growth

At the end of the day, you can't stop people from having kids, short of sterilizing them.
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>>12203347
So how do we stop the people on the generation ships from indulging in geometric population growth?
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>>12203350
birth control implants and computer selected breeding. To keep the effects of inbreeding away.
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>>12203350

Cold sleep. It's a long trip and you can cram more people in that way.
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>>12203344
I should add regarding fusion, I am aware of bussard ramjets and, while intriguing, the general region of space around the Sun is far from conducive to that method of long-term travel.
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>>12203350

Planned parenthood!
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>>12203356
That would be necesary anyway. If the ship is moving with an real level of speed, people would have to be suspended in a gel or something to keep them from being liquefied against the walls.
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>>12203355
If that's acceptable then we could probably do it within the solar system as well.
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>>12203356

Yeah but you'd need a population of caretakers, even assuming your automated systems can handle basic shit like turning the sleepers over so they don't get THOUSANDS OF YEARS OF BED SORES. The initial population would be smaller but the problems remain.
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>>12203365
That would be the result of acceleration. The ship would be able to travel at arbitrary speeds without issue if the accelerations are low.
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>>12203229
Better yet why go to another system, we have plenty of habitable planets right here. I mean sure terraforming takes a while but every planet is an adventure as long as you are not a shut in. On Mars alone you have 1/3 gravity, any Earthman has a superman effect, jump higher,run farther, walk through hurricanes like a gentle breeze. And that is just the start.
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>>12203376

And let's face it, we would probably have Mars completely terraformed before a ship even got to a nearby inhabitable star system.
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>>12203367
it would be easier to manage on a ship. the first generation would of course volunteer for the population controls. They would also be around to stress the importance of it to second and third generations. The ship's society that pops up on the ship will reinforce it. As resources are limited and extra mouths mean everyone goes with less. Eventually even to the point of the mission failing.
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>>12203229

Because any ship that went that far out would no longer be under the jurisdiction of the earth government.

Do you really want another Earth–Sirius War?
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>>12203380
Damn Straight! there is a cliff on one of Uranus's moons that would take 8 minutes to jump down! 8 minutes of free fall, and all you would need is a gentle poof of landing jets to set down on the bottom. http://spaceplace.nasa.gov/cliff-jumping/en/
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>>12203380
>>12203395
I always liked the idea in Cowboy Bebop that because Mars was the first terraformed planet, the only people who can really afford to live there are the rich. Everyone else lives in small colonies or on planetary moons (Ganymede being a major one).

And earth, despite the fact that we accidentally blew up half the moon and that shit rained down, is pretty normal in certain places.
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00's probably the only exception I can think of, and whatever newtypes used to traverse the cosmos in the Black History of Turn A...
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>>12203380
>>12203376
Mars is not suitable. The planet is geologically dead and any terraforming would be undone by solar radiation in 100 years. Also the light gravity would doom anyone born and raised on the planet to being stuck on it.

Venus is a much more suitable candidate. You just need to get her spinning fast enough to generate a magnetic field. You can probably accomplish this by moving the dwarf planet Eris to strike Venus at the right angle. Giving Venus the right rotational speed and maybe even making the remains of Eris Venus' moon. Venus will need a moon too, to stabilize the rotation and revolution. Giant atmosphere processing plants and engineered bacteria/algae will clean the air of the excess CO2 and sulfur. You'll have a planet with earth gravity and a thick atmosphere. Crash in some comets and water ice asteroids to form oceans and the water cycle.
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>>12203411
>The planet is geologically dead

Sure but before they died the old Martians left behind cities and great generators which any human expedition could turn to its purpose, at least according to the nutjobs on my Youtube feed
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>>12203406
Interior view of Sumeragi.
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>>12203402
The Idea that the Rich would abandon Earth for Mars(or a space colony) has been around for a while, only problem is that you always eventually run into the Laputa Paradox
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>Volunteer for first generation ship mission
>Great-great-grandchildren finally arrive at the long awaited destination

>We invented warp-travel, colonized the galaxy and forgot you guys ever existed. Well maybe you guys can go work a job at Space-Walmart or something
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>>12203421

But that's not a paradox at all
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>>12203416
waste of space on a spaceship.
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>>12203421

They didn't leave it by choice, and it wasn't just them.
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>>12203411
>Mars is dead

vs

>SPIN THE PLANET!

honestly id be down for both but they are more or less equal in allot of ways.
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>>12203427

Nonsense, humanity is by nature claustrophobic.
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>>12203336
Enjoy your spooky skeleton body you Venusian cunt.
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>>12203406
>>12203416
>Naming humanities first interstellar spaceship after a slutty alcoholic terrorist
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>>12203440

It's "Venerian", anon. "Venusian" is offensive.
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>>12203429

True enough it was forceful but it's odd to think that such a disaster would leave the class system "intact"

>>12203424

Pic related need i say more?
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>>12203411
>Venus is a much more suitable candidate.
But..
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>>12203447

No I mean it's like

>social elite isolate themselves and become retarded and inbred

That's not a paradox, that's just what happens

Like look at the old aristocracies
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>>12203447

Well Mars was designed from the ground up to accomodate the rich, so it was more like moving into a new house.
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>>12203449
Don't read moonrunes or recognize the art.

What is this? Why does the red head look like a guy in drag?
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>>12203452
Hapsburgs pulled out towards the end.

I think it'd go just fine in this day and age.
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>>12203455
Stupid Martian colonists are stupid then, they should have rightfully fucked over the bourgeois whose companies caused the whole Hyper-Gate fuck-up in the first place
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>>12203460
>moonrunes
>written in english: Shochiku Home Video, The Venus Wars
Hmm it will forever be a mystery
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>>12203461
>Hapsburgs pulled out towards the end

well not pulling out is what caused the problem in the first place
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>>12203271

Mad Max...Gundam

Holy shit that would be awesome!
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>>12203452

the Laputians did not become retarded and inbred though, they simply where existing at a technological level that was meaningless when isolated from the rest of society. After they destroyed the other flying cities they where lonesome rulers of everything that could enjoy non of their spoils because of the nature of Laputa, which required mobile oppression.
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>>12203472

After War Gundam MAX?
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>>12203340

Well how long does it take till you are a fully rounded out type II?
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>no mentioned of quantum physics or warp holes yet
This reminds me of a theory of "warping" where a ship that exists warp would vaporize anything immediately in front of it at the point of exit. Apparently during warp, energy accumulates at the front of the ship in a bubble of some sort during warp and is releases when exiting warp.
Can anybody more knowledgeable tell me what this was?
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>>12203494

Seems like it would be real easy to weaponize that by just warping your fleet in right at the enemy's face
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>>12203380

OP here...funny, GUNNM touched on that. Then again, the 6 ships they planned for interstellar travel turned out to be the reasons for a "solar war" in the first place due to their discovery of AM.
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>>12203389

But the Visitors came to us and wanted water...and food.
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>>12203494
warp travel as we understand it today is limited to 10 times the speed of light. still too slow to get a significant distance out into the galaxy in a single life time.

Star Trek warp travel is exponential. Warp speeds are C, C^2, C^3 and son on.

While the real world warp would be C2, C3, C4.
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>>12203389
>Because any ship that went that far out would no longer be under the jurisdiction of the earth government.

Don't be silly, aerospace rights exist in an infinite wedge above the territory of the sovereign soil. All the claims in the universe are already staked.
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>>12203421

So...Elysium?
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>>12203481

But with like...beat up old mobile suits and and blackjack and hookers!
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>>12203376
Mars also has a shitty magnetic field. Enjoy your AGE cancer.
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>>12203575

You'd think so, but Earth's biodiversity owes itself to Earth's high level of natural radiation, forcing constant evolutionary shifts. On Mars, there wouldn't even be any need to set off dirty nukes in the atmosphere to create a healthy reservoir of fallout.

This is what Feds actually believe
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>>12203494

The concept behind the Albecurrie (sorry if spelled wrong) Drive. Based on the physics...the bubble builds up TREMENDOUS amounts of Cosmic/Gamma radiation and upon deceleration that flux is thrown out.
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>>12203575
>Says the person likely posting from some where in north america, a land colonised by migrants plagued with disease starvation and war, whose sacrifices laid the groundwork for the prosperous civilisation that followed.
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>>12203229
The thing about Gundam is that civilization is technologically advanced yet really fucking stupid at the same time.
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>>12203229
Building Generation Ships is more than an engineering challenge.

And mobile suits take all the resources.
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>>12203229
Because muh resources
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>>12203584
You're making that line sound way stupider than it actually was.
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>>12203641
There really aren't resource problems in Gundam. Greco had to create this artificial condition to make things scarce.

Also in Macross they spread out all over the galaxy to prevent the human race's extinction. They have no resource problems ever.
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>>12203649

Yeah if anything in Macross their population problem was on the other side of the spectrum for a while.
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>>12203812
Just the people on the Macross and 100,000 or so survivors spread around Earth.

Marrying and breeding with the Zentradi was a necessary part of their reconstruction plan. To bring back genetic diversity.
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>>12203649
>>12203812

Kawamori, who made Kill 'Em All Tomino look bad by comparison of having the Zen/Mel combo eliminate ALL of Earth population so that only the clones of the remaining 56,000 odd survivors on the Macross would breed with above said Zen/Mel population. And of course they have nothing to worry about, they have technology that is at least 2000 year more advanced than anything in Gundam save the Turns!
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>>12203957
Kakizaki died from the Macross barrier overloading.

Fokker died from a small wound while fighting off a small attack.
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>>12203539
With Star Trek, it depends on if you're talking TOS warp or TNG warp. For that matter, it also depends on if you take either of the two transwarp attempts by the Federation seriously.
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>>12203389
What are they going to do, take another few thousand years to send a weapon back to us that could very well be an archaeological artifact by the time it reached us?
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>>12203411
If a lot of the CO2 and sulfur were changed into other substances through plants and shit like that. Wouldn't it still be hot as fuck, like melt lead hot?
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>>12203421
Laputa Paradox?
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>>12203229
They do. Sorta.
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>>12203415
This is well shown in the documentary Total Recall.
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>>12203229
that sounds much better than any gundam. too bad you're not tomino.
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>>12203376
the first generation of mars colonists might enjoy their superman strength for a few months or a year, but their bones will deteriorate and their muscles will atrophy, not to mention all the other tiny bodily functions that rely on earth gravity. The children will probably grow up with some weird shit from 1/3 gravity as well.
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>>12204249

>> >>12203479

You Seek power and Control to ensure happiness, but in achieving that you trap yourself from the very happiness you desire while enslaving your self to that level of control and power. Worse yet your descendants will be born into it with no reference, expecting such things they will be dissatisfied voiding the entire process.
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>>12204291
for earthmen it just means we have to work out 3 times as hard, which should not be a problem considering their wont be much else to do. As for your descendants who knows? maybe a bit taller? New types? Mutants?

But you are missing the point it is not about maintaining the comforts of Earth, No, so long as mankind never leaves his comfort zone he will repeat his mistakes over and over. We are born into this eden of a world, an as such we expect it, grow spoiled and destroy it. We are surrounded by billions of unique lives and like wise kill and hurt because of that sense of plenty and in-consequence.

only by pushing ourselves to the limit can we achieve our destiny, by forcing ourselves into some place filled with potential yet hostile, there where we can ONLY be our best, that is where we will evolve, above and beyond. It will be the crucible of our ascension
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I am pleased by the Science here

You'll find all the problem with slower than light problem on the best website.
http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/slowerlight.php

By the way... why would you leave a gravity hole just to enter another one ?

If you had the technology required to terraform a planet or install colony on it, you would already have the technology to make more comfortable home anywhere it please you. If you can exploit the asteroid for material and fuel and even move them, you can live there with station equally as big.
Numerous space colony would give more redundancy and more protection & solutions against extinction events, both natural and artificial one. It is possible to make a planet unlivable with just one asteroid or relativist weapon, but destroying thousand of moving space station would take a lot more time and finesse.

This is especially true in another solar system if you can terraform without all your homeworld industry, you would certainly have technology way more interesting that any planet would be. Think virtual world containing several planets of your linking with all the rideable dragon and sexy elve you'll want.

With such power terraforming a real planet would be just a very costly hobby.

>>12203422
Damn right
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>>12204355
Still doesn't justify you dropping Axis on Earth, Char.
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>>12203946
>100,000 or so survivors spread around Earth.
I thought everyone on the Earth died though
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OP, the colonies ARE the ships.
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>>12203382

There's some classic SciFi out there dealing with generation ships. This one immediately came to mind
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>>12204256
>>12203260
>After finally arriving after how many years of stasis, Judau and his hyper-advanced colony of newtypes decide to send Earth one last term of goodwill. An extremely advanced suit that utilizes all of the Newtype Colony's technological advances. With the hopes that the Terrans of Earth could finally use it to advance their own civilization for the good of man or whatever.

It is called the Turn-A Gundam.
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>>12205952
Maybe he means the zentradi too.
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>>12204242

Space preserves things VERY well.
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>>12205915
But muh could-be-mom!!!
Thread posts: 98
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