Archived threads in /lit/ - Literature - 4429. page

It's an intense read, it takes a lot of commitment because it's really erudite but also like the third longest single volume book ever written. It focuses mainly on Jim Mayn a middle aged man who has never had a dream. The book jumps between stages of his life and the stories of his grandmothers youth. These stories are intimately linked to almost everything in the book, particularly Grace Kimball who lives in Mayn's building yet never actually meets.

Mayn also seemingly knows about the distant future and something known as simultaneous reincarnation.

There are also sections known as Breathers that are very complex when first encountered that are narrated by a group of "angels" who face an unknown interrogater. They tell the story in a spiral manner revealing more and then a little more each time if you get the idea. These parts can be nauseating as they change focus numerous times during long run on sentences.

I don't think anyone could understand the book entirely on first reading anyway but it is worthwhile I feel because when it's good it's unbelievably good. Highlights include Mayns relationship with his mother and later his father, the chapter on his failed marriage and Grace's masturbation classes and the end. If you're willing to take the time then it's definitely worth it. A very hard book to summarise for a pleb like me but hope it helps

I like to think of the interrogator(s) as the reader trying parse the dense double talk of the Angels so called breathers. Particularly when the Angels are forced to give only one answer to a question and everything becomes clearer as a whole.

The fact Mayn's present is also his past is difficult to initially get your head around and even though for large sections his name is only mentioned fleetingly to show how it all comes back to him, he still feels like one of the most fleshed out characters I've encountered. I love the way his memories of past, present and future slide back and forth. His relationship with his father though barely touched upon in comparison to the size of the novel (a sentence about Mel hitting Jim and not knowing how to say sorry and then nothing for hundreds of pages till Jims visit where through very little actually being said in the text you can feel and see their entire relationship. McElroys subtly is superb at times.

The dialogue is also some the best I've seen since Gaddis; Gordon's story to Mayn of the year he missed, Barbara (Jean!) telling Mayn he couldn't have known a torus was the best shape for a space station years before even Sci fi comics as a child or even Grace and the carpet fitters for comic value.

The book does slip with regards to trying to contain too much with some short stories or side plots complicating or distracting for the sake of it, others are sensational: Ship Rock being a favourite of mine.

This is a hard book to put across to someone else it's as I said the hardest book I've come across but like the final line of the book tells you , just take some time to sit and appreciate it. Don't rush it it's not a competition it's an experience.

>>7653687
It shouldn't be a problem getting a copy once it's back in print.

For starters you want to use something like Scrivener or simple Word Documents & Folders to keep your chapters and snippets organized.

Makes for much easier editing and ease of access.

The rest is really just up to your skill as a writer, avail yourself to some reference materials to help with any problems you may have.

>>7666515
Write out a scaffolding before you start your writing

>>7666515
i think i have adhd and endup getting dis tracted after some time

so i keep a empty note pad open and write what ever my mind has just switched to

then i come back to the original doc and continue on

one of the key things is not to edit as you write, just write out a draft before you edit

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>the current year
>believing eastern "religion"
>believing eastern "philosophy"
>not going full hegel

>>7666150
but i want the nibbana merit badge ;_;

>>7666149
It is unattainable because it doesn't exist.

Even if it is, who cares? You don't have to show anyone at first if you don't want to, and the more you write, the better you'll get, no matter how much natural talent/how good a starting place you're in.

Spend some time learning the history of Western poetry and what's out there, particularly English poetry since Shakespeare and particularly since the Romantics.

The more you know, the more you'll know to avoid pitfalls, the more you'll know of the possibilities for poetic expression (as well as what's considered old hat), etc.

Or just get started writing disjointed free verse like everyone else does. Remember, if it uses lazy Allusive Language 101 and it's stilted, it's poetry!

>>7665799
Poetry is very loosely defined these days so literally write anything and someone will pat you on the back for it.

Laugh and get an A in the class.

What would you do?

realize she just irl trolled you and you are about to fail

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>>7665452
Smack her in the head repeatedly with a copy of it and kill her in the name of Tolstoy.

Don't know what biopunk is but sounds idiotic

Do you have good examples?

I tried to get into Windup Girl but it was just "muh Monsanto boogeyman" in an SF setting, and not much more than a rewrite of his earlier short stories with a bit of hackneyed connection

>>7667001
Island of Dr Moreau
Joe Ledger novels

Unoriginal thoughts dressed in clichéd platitudes, congrats

yup

You are writing as the people you criticize, yet it's still bad

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>reading translations

>>7666165
suffocating levels of smugness

There is basically only MacScottcrief or whatever. Lydia wrote a good Swanns Way though

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>>7665659
start with the greeks

I didn't like the other posts either.

>>7665661
Any Greeks in particular?

Merleau-Ponty is good but Sartre is smartre

Not really the little wonky-eyed Stalinist fuckface

>>7665243
>I tried reading some of his essays, but they seemed much worse than Heidi.
wut? Merleau-Ponty is easier than most philosophers to read, and accessible enough you could put most of his shit as an article in a women's magazine and nobody would notice, they would just think it's the "smart" piece for the issue. Heidegger on the other hand made up new terms which even Heideggerians don't always understand, wrote and taught with a strong accent, and is prone to dropping into Greek at random.
I don't think you've read either and I'm going to bump this so other people can laugh at you too

>>7665243
Pic related is amazing. Fascinating, incredible work.

>>7665168
? The quality of his wtriting is beside the point.

>>7665172

I can't get to the point because it is an unorganized mess.

>>7665207
Oh, I thought you were talking more about his phrasing etc. It's maybe a tough thing to get organized, given the endless variations on the overall theme.

>>7665006
That's quite haunting.

10/10

sit still in silence with your eyes closed

>>7662543
I already go to bed early to be alone with my thoughts I'm looking for actual suggestions on stories to read

>>7662548
horror is pretty pleb

you might like 1408, by stevie king

>>7661420
degenerate liberal cuck

they are upset by him. they cannot get the vision of chuck squatting over their waifu's mouth and squeezing a semisoft shit from his craggy hair pie.

>>7661428
Hey man, that's not even a real criticism

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>>7654227
>The Hobbit cover
>map includes Rohan, Gondor, Osgiliath
>not even one of Tolkien's actual maps