How do HSTS sexual fantasies look like? Any blanchard certified

HSTS here, I fantasize about blanchard himself.

>>8472926
amazing

I fantasize about tricking Chad into dating me and sodomizing him in his drunkenness.

>>8472922
Probably the same as any homosexual male bottom. I fantasize about light bdsm (spanking, scratching, rough rough fucking), my boyfriend dirty talking me, and general bottom things.

>>8472934
What are general bottom things? You never fantasize about Chad fucking you right in the pussy, just ass? Or are your fantasies just not specific about your anatomy?

>>8472922
like gay porn

I still don't get how being a gay bottom makes you also desire transitioning in to a woman.
like I've known some hyper gay femboy types that talk with a lisp and wear cut off midriffs and stuff like that. is that what HSTS's are?

>>8473005
It's literally just trans people attracted to their original gender

You can attach any bullshit reasons for why they transitioned that you want (like Blanchard)

>>8473025
yeah, I don't take blanchard seriously I'm just curious about what a self described HSTS's thought process is like

>>8472992
So straight FtM fap to lesbian porn?

>>8473005
From what I've seen HSTS are primarily shy fujoshi but I generally don't ask girls irl what they masturbate to so I have no clue if it comes from being super gay or being a super straight girl

I've never met any HSTS before transition so I don't know how gay they were acting but knowing the ones I've met they were probably much closer to 4chan agp (introverted, nerdy, socially awkward, doesn't like standing out, plays video games all day etc.)

I imagine when blanchard described HSTS as naturally feminine he meant the shy and soft type of feminity and not the outgoing stacy flaunting her sexuality kind
>>8473034
Yeah same OP here

>>8473054
straight cis girls masturbate to vampire bdsm literotica and stuff like that

File: 1496709504217.jpg (88KB, 576x589px) Image search: [Google]

88KB, 576x589px

>>8473005
not all people are trans.
not all gay people are trans.
they are different things.
having a feminized brain is different than being sexually attracted to men.
in other words, seeing yourself as a woman is not the same as being attracted to men.

>>8473164
we're specifically investigating the claim that half of trans fit in to this HSTS category

>>8472926

so brave

>>8472922
>Tall handsome fit guys
>Confident and a little bit aggressive "flirting"
>Scenarios of building up to sex
>foreplay
>Things he'd say and sound like
>Him really wanting to make sure you don't get hurt, and keeping you safe, but it taking him effort to hold himself back
Then the actual sex fantasies gets a bit meh, since my body is meh, and I don't have a vagina, and never will, so it really doesn't get that "hot"... usually it just makes me feel bad, at that point of fantasies.

>>8472922
HSTS, like women, don't have fantasies.

>>8473469
>I don't have a vagina
what about your poop hole?

>>8473524
Not exactly hot, and dick is still going to be there.

A chocolate dick that ejaculates money.

>>8472922
>nice guy
>expresses interests similar to mine
>challenges my opinions
> moderately fit not needed to be super fit just not completely out of shape
>have several fantasized that just deal with me blowing them and cuddling
>eventually fantasize about them and me waking up in a bed and doing morning sex things. He rolls me over and just does it. Kisses my neck makes me talk a bit sorry whole he fucks me. Comes inside of me. Kiss.

And if I really like him I jump to this shit
>imagine proposal
>imagine being married
>callingneach other husband and wife while we stare longingly impeach other's eyes.


Idk it's all pretty vanilla stuff for me

>>8473817
>impeach

>>8473828
But I don't hold an elected office?

>>8473817
What are morning sex things? You ever picture having PiV sex or anal or are the fantasies all vague and nonanatomical?

>HSTS
>A real thing

>>8473005
Supposedly they're so triggered by how society rejects them for being gay that they go tranny for privilege and to better tempt men to fuck them. This is Blanchard's theory. Not even kidding.

>>8473844
Morning sex things was anal.

I have fantasized about or is and vagina, where like he holds me up and pins me against a wall and shit like that. I try not to dwell on yhem. I'm pre-op so in a best case scenario vaginal sex is like five years off for me.

I don't mind anal though. The biggest sexual pleasure for me is knowing that he's getting pleasure from Me, and that he wanted me, and I'm giving him what he wants physically. I just want to help make him happy physically and emotionally, and ideally he does the same for me.

>>8473854
Typing this and the other comment out has me all hot and bothered. Bleh

>>8473859
that's normal
and adorable

HSTS is the most retarded idea in existence

>>8473883
Up their with agp, but I general just interpret these threads to be asking for opinions from straight trans people.

>>8472922
I fantasize about getting pulled aside in public by the man of my dreams who's too tall and strong to resist him forcing himself upon me. It's basically light rape.

Then I freak out and cry about the realistic possibility of not being able to conceal a raging lady boner and scaring him away.

File: 1385208252460.jpg (20KB, 361x371px) Image search: [Google]

20KB, 361x371px

>>8472922
>How do HSTS sexual fantasies look like?
Hopefully they look like me :^)

I met a hot HSTS girl from here a couple weekends ago and the sex was amazing. Being with a hot trans girl that is super into guys is deeply satisfying, wanna meet more Tbh but AGPs seem so much more common :(

Hot HST in the Midwest hmu so daddy can destroy you.
The Carthaginian#4454

>>8477595
How do you tell the difference between HSTS and AGP ?

>>8473883
>>8473903
Don't let these fuckwits get away with using that term. Otherwise they'll think it's fine.

>>8478206
He can't, he just uses AGP as a slur against any tranny he doesn't find hot.

Look at what he says
>a hot HSTS girl
>a hot trans girl that is super into guys
That's his definition of HSTS: hot and into guys. Ergo, to him AGP = transbian hon.

I don't get off on visual porn very much, though dick pix can be fun to look at, but not enough by themselves. It's always been things like erotic stories, reading other people's sexual experiences, replaying my own etc. that get me hot. I fantasize about guys I've been with or wanted to be with, had/have a crush on, always someone specific.
I've had SRS so I fantasize about sex with my current body. I like neovag sex better than anal so I fantasize about PIV more. I like being manhandled a bit, though not hurt. Like if I'm sucking a guy off then he pulls out, pushes me down and starts banging me while pinning me down so I can't move.
Before transitioning it was a mix. I would sometimes imagine I was a woman having vaginal sex, but I'd also fantasize about anal with my male body, though I'd kind of mentally edit my boy parts out. It's kind of embarassing but I'd sometimes fantasize about getting hammered from behind by a few of the bullies who tormented me. Before and after transitioning I'd fantasize about having sex with a preop body too. Like I said before though, I'd edit out the boy parts. I was sticking things up my butt a lot too, but I never actually had sex until after I transitioned.

>>8478206
>How do you tell the difference between HSTS and AGP ?
Probably the most simple way for me to explain it is HST are genuinely attracted to men, and almost exclusively so. AGP are predominately attracted to the idea of them being a woman, which may involve some level of sexual interest in men.

It may seem like a minor distinction, and it is kind of hard to put into words but there is an unmistakable difference in the two groups. In my experience HST are much better at makeup and female presentation, and socializing as a female. AGPs almost always are a little "off" because everything they do is put through this odd filter to enhance their own perception of their female self. Probably the most common well known examples of this are things like striped knee high socks, frilly dresses, sissification, infatuation with anime characters (which they self insert to) shit like that. HST are more naturally feminine and always where, they tend to be effeminate in a more "natural" way like being skinny, weak, talking with a "gay lisp", wearing clothes that show off their bodies; pre-transition they were always that kid that E V E R Y B O D Y knew was "gay". Think Blaire White (Robbie Faggotron) vs Kaitlyn Jenner (Bruce Jenner).

AGPs tend to need a lot of "props" that they use as designators of their femininity to show you how feminine they are because they typically arent naturally very feminine, whereas with HSTs their femininity is more "natural" and comes from within, not external props.

I do want to say that AGP and HST like everything else with sexuality are a spectrum, not all AGP or HST are the same and their sexuality does not manifest in the same way. Also I do not think there is anything intrinsically "bad" about AGP, and yes I date AGPs, but I certainly prefer HST girls. Obviously I am not approaching this from an academic standpoint, more as what my experiences dealing with trans girls are and I am pretty experienced in that regard.

>>8478813
The HSTS/AGP divide is bullshit desu ne androphiles can be AGP (though it is less common) and not all non-androphiles are AGP. Furthermore most AGPs stop being AGP after transitioning for a few years. Meta attraction is real and part of AGP but genuine attraction exists in non-exclusive androphiles just as regular bisexuality does in cis people.

>>8478833
>The HSTS/AGP divide is bullshit
>androphiles can be AGP (though it is less common
Well I am not here to have an academic debate about typologies and shit like that. I am a chaser and I like my trans girls to be extremely androphllic so guess what? HST/AGP divide is an important distinction to me. You typing words on your keyboard cannot undo my 7+ years of experience dealing with hundreds of trans girls IRL.

I have seen a lot of trans girls and I know what I like so call bullshit on that if you want to faM.

>>8472922
Straight trans guy here. Pre-op.

When I'm cuddling or whatever with my girlfriend and I look at her body, I'll get a "dick twitch" where my clit throbs for a minute, and then I stay turned on. I'm somewhat visual but that's been waning recently since we've been getting more and more physical.

I'm into bdsm so my fantasies revolve around that. I think about being tied up and really roughed up. Or being sat next to her feet and pretty much ignored.

One of the sexiest fantasies recently involves me kissing her feet and up her legs, and then I eat her out.

I just want to make her enjoy herself, I don't think I'm too sexy but if my actions can bring her pleasure then I can feel alright.

>>8478886
Okay, like, there IS a difference between androphiles and gynephiles. Androphilia correlates with femininity, regardless of sexual identity. Gay guys are more feminine than straight guys. Lesbians are less feminine than straight women. The same applies to trannies. Androphilic MTFs are more feminine than gynephilic MTFs, but this is not down to bullshit ideas like AGP. It's fine for you to like the girly girls but please don't spread this meme.

File: 1481088883058.jpg (63KB, 960x720px) Image search: [Google]

63KB, 960x720px

>>8479033
>When I'm cuddling or whatever with my girlfriend and I look at her body, I'll get a "dick twitch" where my clit throbs for a minute, and then I stay turned on.
That sounds like a regular female arousal, I'm the same and I'm mildly AAP

Do you ever fantasize about putting dick in her vag or something like that?

What I'm interested in was if HSTS fall into either of these camps
>fantasizes about having sex using the body of their target gender
>fantasizes about having sex using what they've got (not necessarily about using a dick when MtF but getting fucked in the ass and stuff I guess)
>some kinda mix of the first two
>fantasies never involve their body (ie. fantasize exclusively about pleasing their partner like you or some vague stuff)
I should've said that in the OP but I was lazy


I have a hard time warping my head around the last camp, but the first one is supposed to be occupied by AGPs and the second one would be kinda weird for someone who wants a vag, I figured everyone could fall into the first one and the focus would be slightly different (body for AGPs and person fucked for HSTS)


I'm reading about the whole theory and I get AGPs but HSTS sound like some bizzare mythical creatures but I met 2 offline and they did exist so there's that at least

>>8479053
>Okay, like, there IS a difference between androphiles and gynephiles
Thank you Mr. Fuckin Wizard for that groundbreaking tidbit of knowledge you just dropped on me.

The problem however is that you are talking yourself in circles. AGP exists, there are hundreds of people that come to this board that will admit to having the condition, it is something I have personally observed in my interactions with trans girls, it is also something that Blanchard observed in his studies involving trans women. Now you might reject Blanchard's work if you do thats fine, I dont really give a fuck, I dont care about trans gender/sexuality topics on an academic or medical level myself personally. Even if you disregard everything that Blanchard has ever stated; if you can understand the concept of "gynephile" then you should be able to understand the concept of "autogynephile". It is not a myth, or a made up meme, it is a reasonably common condition that you can find described in first person accounts throughout this board in numerous threads.

Not sure why you want to argue such a ridiculous point. Anybody that interacts with a large number of trans girls will begin to see "types" emerge and probably the most easily identifiable split is along the lines of androphilic vs gynephilic ones. Calling the divide "bullshit" or "a meme" doesnt really refute that it exists in fact by definition it does exist.

It sounds to me like you are one of these people that wants to get caught up in a stupid debate about Blanchard's work and how accurate his descriptions of the typologies were, but that isnt the point. HST and AGP are just useful terms for discussion, but I will say from what I know about Blanchard's work (I dont know a lot) his observations and mine regarding HST and AGP are similar.

File: 1385208252442.jpg (13KB, 216x173px) Image search: [Google]

13KB, 216x173px

Oh also wanted to say thanks to the girls that added me from this thread. There are some straight up fuckin hotties here. I like chatting with y'all from wherever, just wish there were more from the Midwest here LOL :D

>>8478813
>HST are genuinely attracted to men, and almost exclusively so. AGP are predominately attracted to the idea of them being a woman, which may involve some level of sexual interest in men.
>It may seem like a minor distinction, and it is kind of hard to put into words but there is an unmistakable difference in the two groups
Describe the differences further please?

>>8482726
Thanks for making us AGPs feel superior to bimbos who are attracted to people like you.

>>8482731
>Describe the differences further please?
Nigga how autistic are you? I am not a tranny scientist, I dont have a PhD in Trannyology. I think I have given you more than enough, what am I supposed to do write your dissertation for you?
SmH Tbh faM

>>8482735
>Thanks for making us AGPs feel superior to bimbos who are attracted to people like you.
Uhhhh I have slammed more AGPs than HSTs faM, but I am glad I could at least make you feel better (:

>>8482743
>how autistic are you
spoiler: you are talking with a clinical autismo who was told all the things from your other post many times just in last few days

>>8482743
Please anon, I just want to get to feel like >>8482735 does. I just want to be able to imagine why someone would consider me a superior gf.

>>8482758
Link? I think you're confusing me with another poster.

>>8482759
>I just want to be able to imagine why someone would consider me a superior gf
Why? I cannot relate to that way of thinking, why is it important to be able to "imagine that someone would consider you superior?". Simplify your life, just be the best person you can be and find somebody that you like that likes you back. Having to be able to imagine superiority and all that other nonsense seems like wasted emotional energy Tbh.

>>8482764
are there more of you making almost exact same posts allover blanchard/agp threads lately?

>>8482779
It's hard to explain. It might not be something a non agp can understand. It's not really superiority like the other anon said, at least not for me, it's just knowing how someone else can see and love me. How the ways we're different from hstses could make me someone who's loved by another person and not only myself. Does that make sense?

>>8482784
I don't know what you mean. I've seen agp threads lately but I haven't talked to Carth about it.

>>8482792
>Does that make sense?
No not really xD

I think AGP is very difficult for people to understand because it is quite bizarre if you stop and think about the mental complexity it takes to fall in love with your own projection of yourself that probably doesnt match your physical form very closely..... its kinda fucked up Tbh.

I am not a mental health professional so I cant give you any super solid advice other than you should probably talk to one. My meme tier advice would probably just be to practice accepting yourself, having AGP doesnt make you a bad person. Dont fixate on the fact that you have AGP, focus on making progress in life and being a successful person. If you feel AGP is overtaking your life and preventing the formation of meaningful relationships all you can do is talk to a professional to come up with a plan so that you can manage the condition and still have a fulfilling life.

>>8482759
>I just want to get to feel like >>8482735(You) does
Build up self-confidence and contempt for other people.

>>8482823
>Build up self-confidence and contempt for other people
Ahhh yes the mentally healthy mind of an AGP ....fueled by hatred and anger (:

>>8482826
>by hatred and anger (:
Not even close :^)

>>8482792
AGPs spend their whole lives being told wanting to be cute is wrong and having nobody stroke the fire, any acknowledgement of such thus reawakens the long suppressed happiness from within. Most people will see it as perversion and never stroke the urge, instead use such urges as rationale to kill partnerships or spread vindictive rumors about AGP.

Non-AGPs can understand it but only an AGP can understand what it feels like.

I wish I had another AGP with me so we could tell each other we're cute. :3

>>8482822
>No not really xD
I'm sorry. I want to know how other people see and understand agps, so I can get an idea of myself from their perspective. Then I'll see how they could love me and knowing I can be loved like that will comfort me.

Thank you for the advice. I do try to accept myself and I don't think I'm a bad person, just weird, but because their weirdness is so different from other people it's hard to imagine being loved the same way an hsts or a real girl would be.

>>8482823
I don't want to have contempt. I just want to be able to feel happy after reading something because it tells me how people see us.

>>8482881
Blanchardfag shouldn't be telling anybody they're cute, though I can sense the desperation in your ellipses you disgusting fucking faggot

I'm going to cut off my dick and there's nothing you can do to stop me!

>>8482822
She says it well I think >>8482877

>>8482877
Yes I want to be acknowledged as just a different kind of girl, no better or worse, just unusual.

>I wish I had another AGP with me so we could tell each other we're cute. :3
Me too but I feel like a man could understand me as well.

Goodnight y'all (:

>>8482933
Good night daddy

>>8482933
Goodnight. Please do talk about it more one day.

>>8482677
>It is a reasonably common condition that you can find described in first person accounts throughout this board in numerous threads.
Yeah, the condition of having a fetish. Not all of the made-up bullshit about how having a fetish turns you trans and dictates your personality.

>Not sure why you want to argue such a ridiculous point. Anybody that interacts with a large number of trans girls will begin to see "types" emerge and probably the most easily identifiable split is along the lines of androphilic vs gynephilic ones. Calling the divide "bullshit" or "a meme" doesnt really refute that it exists in fact by definition it does exist.
Whoa it is as if gay people are different from straight ones stop the fucking presses.

>It sounds to me like you are one of these people that wants to get caught up in a stupid debate about Blanchard's work and how accurate his descriptions of the typologies were, but that isnt the point. HST and AGP are just useful terms for discussion, but I will say from what I know about Blanchard's work (I dont know a lot) his observations and mine regarding HST and AGP are similar.
They are incredibly specific terms. Homosexual Transsexuals are not just "feminine androphile transsexuals" but gay men who can't deal with society rejecting them for being gay and so transition for privilege and to make straight men more attracted to them. The only supposed difference between them and regular gay men is that regular gay men have the mental fortitude not to break down and go trans. Is that really what you believe they are? Autogynephilia as a cause for transsexuality is a whole other level of stupid given that both groups have natally-determined "feminized" brain patterns.

Don't want to have "academic debates" about academic terms? Maybe consider saying gay and straight.

>>8482726
>tfw from the midwest

>>8483074
>They are incredibly specific terms
Yeah I knew you were just some angry AGP hon that wants to have an academic debate. Sorry faM this is 4chan, not a Gender Studies academic journal. Miss me with that shit..... actually do us a favor and miss everybody with that shit. If you want to go to every thread on the board that uses stereotypes, incorrect definitions, faulty data, etc, etc and devolve it into a bitter shitfest of nitpicking and citation posting well have fun with that, some of us actually have lives.

AGP and HST are good enough categories for layperson usage. I am saying that as someone that has interacted with hundreds of trans girls IRL on an interpersonal basis. I am not some 20yr old psuedointellectual that has read a bunch of Google Scholar studies. You dont have to be a Physics major and have a deep understanding of Nuclear Radiation to be able to tell another person that sunscreen is a good way to prevent a sunburn.... even if in many scenarios it is completely inadequate.

In the real world you dont need to be exactly right, you just need to be close enough. For most purposes here on 4chan AGP/HST is useful and close enough..... but I am sure no lifers like you will think up some more fancy acronyms that everybody needs to remember sooner rather than later.
xD xD xD

>>8483495
>tfw from the midwest
Well if ur trans, attractive, and into masculine guys then u know what to do baby girl :^)

>>8484303
Cool. I'll let your future romantic prospects know that you think they're just mentally ill men who couldn't deal with society hating gays and snapped :)

>carth will debate academic terms but not share his observations

>>8484348
Daddy only likes cute girls

>>8484479
Neither HSTSs nor AGPs are girls according to Blanchard :^)

>>8484348
Dis nigga xD xD xD

Have a nice weekend y'all, I will be busy, but I will try and drop in if I can. Always looking for hot girls that wanna hang out (:

>>8484303
What's that username for? I didn't see anything on kik :/

>>8487879
He posts his kik and Discord in literally every passgen. Carth is OK but he can be a bit much in a lot of ways. Be safe anon.

>>8487931
>but he can be a bit much in a lot of ways.
???

>>8485146
>xD xD xD
are you having a stroke

>>8487939
Imagine a frat bro that got older but never got married or had kids, that's Carth. He is very entitled and always gets his way.

>>8487969
Did he get at all wiser or more sensible with age?

File: 1498076311073.png (528KB, 998x717px) Image search: [Google]

528KB, 998x717px

>>8487931
>>8487969

That's... That's good to know.

>>8487969
> always gets his way.
So he's borderline rapist?

>>8487989
That's what it sounded like when I read it :/

>>8487989
>>8487997
>Be safe anon.

File: 1385208252453.jpg (107KB, 693x712px) Image search: [Google]

107KB, 693x712px

>>8487879
>What's that username for? I didn't see anything on kik :/
Kik: The_Carthaginian
Discord: The Carthaginian#4454
Pics: http://imgur.com/a/XOa3V

If you arent fem, subby, and into masculine men it wont work.

>>8487931
>>8487969
>>8487989
Yee Carth the entitled, spoiled, fratbro tranny rapist, you got me faM
LUL xD

>>8489264
you could make a cute girl desu

>>8489264
I didn't call you a rapist I said you are OK but a bit much that's all.

>>8489264
I'm not mid west, sorry daddy, I'm far away
But could I still add you?

>>8472922
Its basically gay bottom fantasies. Less focus on vaginas and boobs. Assfucking is hot af.

killing niggers

I don't fantasize about situations with myself in them; it feels too weird. Besides that I just don't get off on it.

>>8489264
>Carth the entitled, spoiled, fratbro tranny rapist
QFT

Being gangbanged by an entire football team

>>8490021
>I'm far away.... But could I still add you?
If you are young and hot thats fine, as long as you are within the United States....otherwise whats the point? I am looking for the one tranny to rule them all, not an internet pen pal just sayin.

>>8490577
>Assfucking is hot af
You like it when your top pulls ur panties off and pushes you down and fucks you vs tells you to bend over? Face to face vs Doggy? Being cum in vs cum on? Plz go into greater detail about how you like getting fucked, I need this information for scientific purposes :^)

>>8490622
>Being gangbanged by an entire football team
I bet you couldnt even handle 2hrs 1on1 with me tbhwu faM

>>8484485
MtFs aren't real girls according to MtFs themselves. Hence the dysphoria and suicidiality and the need to transition in the first place. Blanchard did nothing but concur with what every transgirl would tell him in the first place.

The typology was designed to fracture the transgender community from the beginning. Divide and conquer. Individually every last one of you falls.

Remember that.

>>8492841
>I bet you couldnt even handle 2hrs 1on1 with me tbhwu faM

I already have ;)

>>8494989

Scale of 1 to 10?

File: 1385208252433.jpg (98KB, 508x619px) Image search: [Google]

98KB, 508x619px

>>8494989
>football team
>I already have ;)
Welp that was awkward, now I know who you are :3

To be fair tho you did tap out a couple of times, but considering you went for 4+hrs with only one short break and one long break I cant really complain. That was good sex tho ngl. Answer >>8495053 and be brutally honest. I have a rating for you in my head but I dont want to influence your rating (:

>>8495759
8/10 for the dickings in general
9/10 for making me almost mistake you for my boyfriend when u were hitting it from behind
9/10 for the way u grope me
5/10 for sticking it in when i told u my bp was too sore
5/10 for almost being too rough w/ the spanking which i didnt know was possible for me
9/10 for fucking me through the peak of my high
10/10 for having the most stamina out of any guy ive been with

Averaged out thats 7.86/10. All grades are final :)

Btw Daddy, am I the HSTS u mentioned earlier in the thread? Be honest, if not i wont get jealous or anything.

>>8495907
Ehh ill scratch the 5/10 for the spanking since i didnt say anything and wanted to test my limits. So then thats 8.3/10 :)

>>8495907
>5/10 for sticking it in when i told u my bp was too sore
>5/10 for almost being too rough w/ the spanking

Jesus Christ carth....

>>8495907
>sticking it in when i told u my bp was too sore
The poster saying he was a rapist wasn't joking after all.

>>8495907
This is hot as fuck

>>8495907
>5/10 for sticking it in when i told u my bp was too sore
totally not rapist

>>8496110
>>8496127

Lol nah he was good he took it out pretty quickly afterwards i think he was just trying to see if we could ease back into things cause sometimes that happens with bottoming, u get a second wind

>>8495053
Where to begin..hmm..well, overall one of the best fucks I've ever had to be honest. After all the countless times I've gotten dicked by you, it never really gets boring. You always exhibit high levels of stamina and push me to my limits in the right ways. Sessions are always spread out over long periods of time and it always leaves me laying there on my back, a quivering mess, craving more. Always a dominating presence in the bedroom, and even outside of it too. Always straight to the point and technique is well practiced, never disappointing. You're always willing to express exactly what you want, and that makes giving it to you that much more fulfilling for me. All around feeling of comfort around you in bed has surpassed all previous partners and has made sessions even more satisfying.
As daddy's favorite AGP slut, I grant the respectful rating of 8/10.

>>8497504
Im >>8495907 and yeah i have to agree 100% to all of this

>>8497504
>>8495907
>>8497601

Holy shit O.O

>>8495907
>>8497504
>being raped for hours at a time by a subhuman ape
disgusting

>>8495907
>>8497504
What's the benefit? Why not just find an average nerdy guy that loves you and treats you well?

I just want someone pretty to grope and kiss me without really asking or too sit way closer to me than socially acceptable. Do those count as fantasies. I don't know what hsts is

>>8479327
I do. I fantasize about fucking her like any other man. But real quick I get sad because it won't ever happen so I tend not to. I get dysphoric too.

It's better to focus on the pleasure of my partner. That way I can feel good about myself and not have to think about my body.

>>8498017
>waahhh wahhh what about nice guys?

Sorry I'm HSTS, I only want Chad's dick not a weak beta nerd's

>>8498055
>Sorry I'm HSTS
Maybe Blanchard really is right that you're bunch of gay bottoms that transition to better attract men.

>>8498010
Everything sounded consensual in there. There was one questionable bit but itnwas explained in later comments.

>>8498088
>It is impossible for a really gay man not to transition as a kid
wew

>>8499359
Sounds like somebody believes in feminine essence theory.

File: 1385208252470.jpg (14KB, 242x300px) Image search: [Google]

14KB, 242x300px

Damn y'all daddy got home L A T E
Beautiful day out on the prairie today 70f, mostly sunny, and 25mph winds, sure wish y'all was here (:

>>8495907
>9/10 for the way u grope me
Yeah I think that is probably the biggest thing that trans girls will notice with me; that I genuinely love their bodies and am extremely turned on by them. Trans girls arent just a hole for me to fuck, I am legit passionately attracted to trans girls. Most slender trans girls (Elves) have bodies similar to female swimmers or track and field athletes and it turns me the fuck on like no other, it literally drives me fucking crazy. Its not just about fucking, I love to feel your shoulders, arms, back, legs, stomach..... especially you babe, ur bod is crazy fuckin hot tbqh :3

>10/10 for having the most stamina out of any guy ive been with
Yeah well everybody wanna be pussy destroyer, but nobody wanna do 2hr fullbody workouts or 26.5mile full throttle bike rides like I do. This shit dont happen by magic.

>am I the HSTS u mentioned earlier
Uhhhh yahhh ofc :P

>>8496096
>>8496110
>>8496127
Maaaaan I dindu nuffin xD xD xD
I let up off her and let her tap out. C'mon y'all I like pushing girls to their limit, but I wont break trust, not worth it Tbh.

>>8497504
REEEEEEE AGP in HST safe space ! Get out, get out, get out !
Nah thx for kind words babe, you are a good lover even though you actually only like girls and are just meta-attracted to me :^)

>>8497680
>Holy shit O.O
I'm committed not addicted
but it keep controlling me
All that pain now I can’t feel it
I swear that it's slowing me
Yahhhhh (:

>>8498010
>>8498017
Ay faM open up your eyes I'm a blessing in disguse :^)

If you would stop crying like a bitch and actually push yourself, and compete you will make progress js familia.

>>8498088
>you ignored them when you could have learned from them.
LOL nah Cara. Commie-chan and I are still cool, but she wanna act crazy....aint nobody got time for that shit faM xD

>>8498088
>>8500281
Commie-chan is AGP though?

>>8497680
>>8500281

I never said you were an addict I was just impressed

>>8472941
I don't have a pussy, and however wrong that feels that I don't have one, I can't fantasize as if I actually had one since it's too painful. It makes me more sad than aroused.

>>8500881
Then who?

>>8500826
I did have a mix of vag sex and gay bottom sex fantasies. My penis is what was painful to me and I never fantasized about doing anything with it. Other penises are great though. With srs it's always just the body I have.

>>8500291
>Commie-chan is AGP though?
Fuck off

>>8500881
>I wasn't talking about her
The other "early transitioners" I have spoken with got off on the wrong foot with me (acting crazy as usual) so Commie-chan was the only one I spoke with for any length of time to begin to get to know, because I just dont have patience for bullshit. Actually we dont even really talk anymore Tbh. I am not gonna put her on blast rn, and I left the door open for her. Some people just cant get out of their own way tho..... im sure you know that feel Cara.

All the good look faM

>>8502159
What's her orientation?

>tfw no frat bro rapist chaser bf

File: 1492184254232.png (85KB, 388x218px) Image search: [Google]

85KB, 388x218px

Y'all not gonna let my favorite thread die are y'all? No more HST fantasies? For real?

:(

>>8507541
Maybe there are too many AGPs on this board. I already posted.

File: 1498328959140.png (92KB, 467x455px) Image search: [Google]

92KB, 467x455px

>>8507541
Right! I posted mine but I like reading everyone elses. Helps keep me entertained.

>>8507737
Is there a demand for more sauce?

>>8507756
There is demand. More detail the better :)

>>8507770
like others have stated in the thread, my fantasies were/are mostly gay bottom fantasies. Usually involving "Daddy" types, guys who could more than easily overpower my slender body with just one hand, guys that are 1.5x my age minimum and have beards and hairy chests. Deep, gruff voices that feel so heavy and dominating that they make my eyes roll to the back of my head. I've never fantasized about myself with a vagina cause it's just.. not accurate I guess? and would also not make me feel good. This place fucked up my thinking to the point that that made me worry I wasn't "really" trans. Turns out all that means is that I'm not AGP.

I use to have fantasies about a really hunky, hairy red-headed irish guy with a kilt propositioning me to suck him off under the table while he drank and talked with his bros. Then when I finished him off he'd get me to suck off everyone else under the table without telling them.

Also had prison """rape""" fantasies where a guy would slam me against the shower and make me his bitch after repeatedly presenting to him and tempting him. Grabbing my hips with one hand and shoving my head against the wall with the other. Only spit for lube. Then he'd move his strong, broad hands down over the arch in my back, up again towards my neck and start choking me as he reaches climax, only letting me breathe again once he sees his cum dripping out of my pretty bp.

Countless fantasies of being fucked by a jock/jocks in the locker room, forced to smell their sweaty after-practice pits, balls, and ass.

tame stuff

File: hqdefault.jpg (14KB, 480x360px) Image search: [Google]

14KB, 480x360px

>>8508094
>tame stuff

I wonder what counts as not tame. Not to far off how I pictured it, but I never envisioned myself as male in any of the scenarios, and I guess my imagination was a bit more boring.

>>8507770
OK, I hope this is good. I have to keep this a little short though. I was in femboy mode at work and had a huge crush on this guy. I never told him I was trans, but if I had...

We're working late, everyone else is gone. I'm doing some work on the computer and I need help. He pulls up a chair next to me. I'm leaning into him while he's working and I put my hand on his thigh. He doesn't mind and moves closer to me. When he's done he asks if I understand. I say yes and give his thigh a little rub.

He gets up, goes behind me and puts his hands on my shoulders and asks if I need help with anything else. I lean back into him and he starts rubbing my neck and shoulders. I say there's something I want to tell him. I ask him if he noticed anything unusual about me. He says he noticed me wearing femmy clothes and wearing makeup. Why was that? Because I'm trans. Are you OK with that? Of course I am. I could tell. Then he leans over, puts his arm around me and gives me a kiss. Then he starts reaching under my shirt, and I reach for the growing bulge in his pants. He steps back, takes my hand, and says let's go in the back.

He leads me into a back office with a couch. He pulls off his shirt and we start making out. He pulls my shirt off then works my pants down leaving me wearing only my panties. We make out some more, then he gets up and pulls off his pants. I get up and grab his cock, then take it into my mouth. I work my tongue around the head then he starts thrusting into my mouth. Before he comes he pulls out, turns me onto my stomach, pulls off my panties, and rubs his cock around my boipucci. I lean into him and tell him I want it. He eases into to me and goes easy at first, I moan harder, harder. He hits the right spot and I cum. Then he keeps going, pulls out, and comes all over my back and ass. He rubs the cum into my skin then cuddles me from behind. Then we laugh about needing to clean up the couch, and he asks me out on a date for tomorrow.

>>8508235
I didn't exactly imagine myself as male or female, in those scenarios my representation was more abstract. It was more about what the men were doing to me than what I looked like.

>>8508094
Were you ever female in your fantasies, or always male/femboy like irl?

>This place fucked up my thinking to the point that that made me worry I wasn't "really" trans. Turns out all that means is that I'm not AGP.
Recognizing the two types helps both of them.

>>8508277
refer to
>>8508253
it's always anal and not vaginal, but that doesn't really indicate anything genital-wise. My dick never comes into the picture, it may as well not be there

>>8508238
more pls

>>8508253
>>8508346
Interesting. I wonder where the line is exactly between AGP and HSTS fantasies, and if there's some fantasies where the difference can't be spotted from that fantasy alone.

>>8508358
agp fantasies focus on the girl you wish to be rather than your partner

in reality its probably a blurry line between them, blanchard focused on individuals that fit within his groups but not much about people outside

>>8508238
That was hot as shit honestly. I want that experience.

>>8508253

Yeah I feel ya. I'm kind of a mix of that and >>8508346 . Like my fantasy has a version of me in it but generals aren't a part of it really and it always revolves what the partners doing with/to me, or having me do to them

>>8508609
>I want that experience.
I wish I'd had it too. I should have said something. He was really sweet to me and who knows what would have happened.

>>8508703
I should probablynleave my apartment sometime and interact with people so I can actually have a life experience.

:/

File: 1492123388637s.jpg (2KB, 120x120px) Image search: [Google]

2KB, 120x120px

>>8507751
Wait hol up........ huh? I know I am just getting trolled by Cara's purposefully vague attentionwhoring, but I cant resist...... who exactly are we talking about here? I need to speak with this person, and by speak with them I mean sleep with them xD

>>8508094
Hiiiiiiii pls add me on Kik or Discord so we can meet up and I can rape y-.... I mean help you live out your fantasies :^)

>>8508238
>super nice guy
>porn scene sex at work
>cuddles after having sex at work
>getting a date afterward
I think that is one too many fantasies in your fantasy familia :^)

>>8509963
I know a couple who ended up living together after porn sex at work. I don't know if they cuddled though.

>>8478206
while he's right in his definition in >>8478813, he's kinda shit about applying it in practice
then again, i thought commie-chan was hsts too at first and she was playing it up when she interacted with him, so i guess that mistake was understandable

>>8510913
Trent what are your sexuak fantasies like?

>>8510913
>and she was playing it up when she interacted with him
???

>>8510921
http://archive.loveisover.me/lgbt/search/image/8-4MQZAnvNXx5n3DeM3RVA/

>>8510921
cute girls
idk, it's always been cute girls
before i realized i was trans it was cute girls with a super agp female stand-in for me, then i realized the term for 'super dysphoric butch' is 'trans man' and got rid of the agp girl (with occasional exceptions) and just sort of started fantasizing about me, with a non-fucked-up body, having heterosexual sex
[shrug emoji]

>>8510921
I didn't know I wanted to know this until now.

File: bdsm test december 2016.png (143KB, 409x515px) Image search: [Google]

143KB, 409x515px

>>8510930
i think i've mentioned this before, but the autogynemimetophilia thread wasn't entirely serious
the sub thing was weird as hell though, i'm pic related otherwise

>>8510931
Whoa, so AGP in HSTS FtMs can be a coping mechanism for HSTS dysphoria?

How did it go away? What are the exceptions?

In your non-fucked-up/cis male fantasies, is your body the same as irl but cis, or very different from your real body besides genitals, etc?

>>8510933
Why are FtMs often subs and MtFs like always subs?

>>8510947
Just to piggy back in this I wonder if there are many mtf who's who are doing the same thing and eventually end up hsts?

>>8510957
The MtF version of that would be AAP fantasies, so they wouldn't be confused with AGP MtFs. They'd seem like femboys or twinks before realizing they're trans.

>>8510947
>Whoa, so AGP in HSTS FtMs can be a coping mechanism for HSTS dysphoria?
not just that, but survey anon and i think there's a whole cluster of people we've labelled 'metacis' (by analogy to meta-attraction) who are gnc natal-sex-attracted people who would otherwise have gender dysphoria, but are a*p as a coping mechanism and so have much less desire to transition. we've found some pretty solid anecdotal evidence for this on the natal male side, including one guy who spent a lot of time literally describing his aap fantasies and then yelled at survey for calling him metacis
>In your non-fucked-up/cis male fantasies, is your body the same as irl but cis, or very different from your real body besides genitals, etc?
i don't really focus on my body in those fantasies at all, i guess irl-cis
>>8510950
the sub tendency of trans men is probably overstated, in that the only study i know of on the topic found hstses to be doms and aaps to be switches
on the other hand, androphilic natal females are absurdly submissive as a category, so aap trans men being mostly sub is to be expected (with the slight dominance increase probably being because men are more sexually dominant, and aaps will consciously or subconsciously want to imitate their cis male peers in that way)
on the mtf end, hstses are subs for the same reason women are and agp generally seems to be a submissive fetish -- it strongly correlates with masochism and other forms of submission

>>8510966
>but are a*p as a coping mechanism and so have much less desire to transition
Doesn't that mean you consider A*Ps to be inherently less trans than HSTS, since A*P can't apparently fully switch gender identity?

>>8510966
>but are a*p as a coping mechanism
That's not a necessary part of the metacis idea. If a minority of male brained people are AGP then it stands to reason that if HSTS FtMs have the same gynephilic brains they'll have the same AGP minority. A*P as a coping mechanism for HSTSes is different.

Why do you think it appears as a coping mechanism?

>i don't really focus on my body in those fantasies at all
Can you describe what a fantasy is like without a focus on your own body sufficient to distinguish it from an A*P fantasy?

>with the slight dominance increase probably being because men are more sexually dominant, and aaps will consciously or subconsciously want to imitate their cis male peers in that way
Like the sub fetish for AGPs. That makes sense. But I've seen FtMs talk about femdom fantasies. What's the deal there?

>>8510981
If a metacis person doesn't transition because of their A*P then that's the A*P trumping the HSTS and giving them a natal sex identity.

>>8510950
Because men are usually subs while women are almost always subs
Most people into BDSM are subs
Even doms are sometimes just subs to embarrassed to admit they're subs and for some bizzare reason don't want to label themselves as switches
Being kinky is suffering

>>8510966
>>8510987
So suddenly AGP can be a coping mechanism but that idea is ridiculous in other contexts.. :^)

>>8511045
You're sharp but let's hear his explanation before leaping anywhere.

AGP as a coping mechanism for MtFs would only make sense for gynephile HSTSes, so find one of those if you want to compare MtFs and FtMs this way.

>>8511061
>AGP as a coping mechanism for MtFs would only make sense for gynephile HSTSes
I contest the whole HSTS/AGP division so

>>8511067
Ok but that wasn't the point you raised and if you want to go there you have other questions to answer, like what motivates non-GNC transitions.

>>8510930
what the fuck this is me

>>8510933
What do you mean by not entirely serious?

>>8511061
>so find one of those
If you assume main characteristics of HSTS is not orientation but early transition and early childhood gnc behaviors there would be quite a bit of people who fit that profile
Didn't Jazz say she's pansexual?
Also Trent what exactly made you think you are HSTS rather than AAP? Besides the orientation but from what I recall you're in the camp that thinks it's possible to be a gay HSTS and straight AGP anyway

>>8511088
fuck the trent question was supposed to go under the trent quote

>>8511075
>That wasn't the point you raised
I've argued with Trent many times. He consistently denied that AGP as a repression mechanism makes sense. I was making fun of him.

>If you want to go there you have other questions to answer, like what motivates non-GNC transitions
Gender dysphoria, caused by neurointersexuality. Androphiles are more feminine than gynephiles because androphilia correlates with femininity and vice versa. This can be seen in the differences between straight and gay men and straight and gay women. I didn't mean to hijack the discussion, just to call out Trent.

>>8510987
> >i don't really focus on my body in those fantasies at all
> Can you describe what a fantasy is like without a focus on your own body sufficient to distinguish it from an A*P fantasy?

Not them, but even though I think all of this belief in Blanchard's stuff is kind of idiotic, if I had to put myself in a box I would call myself HSTS.

My fantasies usually aren't that complex or I start getting dysphoric about my genitalia, but I'll generally fantasize about making out with a hot guy, tracing his muscles, getting fucked by him and cuddling.

Occasionally I fantasize about being held/tied down, and if I'm feeling really masochistic I have rape fantasies. Usually its more vanilla stuff though.

I feel like if it were an AGP fantasy, I'd be fantasizing about having girl parts that are getting fucked, but instead I usually am imagining what his body looks like and how I would feel, if that makes sense, e.g. the feeling of pleasure, not the mechanics.

From actual experience, that's not to say I wouldn't rather have a vulva. There's nothing quite as bad as getting rimmed and your junk blocking your view of their face, to put it bluntly.

>>8511088
AGP and HSTS are distinct even ignoring orientation and when both are early GNC.

>>8511093
Can we talk about gender dysphoria over email?

>>8511105
How?
I thought the main difference was that AGP is kinda invisible from the outside while HSTS are naturally feminine

But I'm struggling to get the whole concept of HSTS desu

>>8511101
>making out with a hot guy, tracing his muscles, getting fucked by him and cuddling.
Some of that obviously emphasizes him, but cuddling is mutual. How can you be thinking of your body less than his there?

Being held down involves you a lot, more than him even since only his hands are essential to picturing that, and rape is very much about you. That fits AGP.

>but instead I usually am imagining what his body looks like and how I would feel, if that makes sense, e.g. the feeling of pleasure, not the mechanics.
So when cuddling you're imagining his body doing the cuddling and your feeling of being cuddled rather than actually imagining yourself? Same with the rape, his body doing the raping, your sensation of being raped without your body?

>>8511045
kill yourself on livestream
the world can only be saved if everyone who's ever been wrong dies, but people keep not dying and it's because they're trying to hurt me
like how i keep thinking i need to start talking to kitty again because i was wrong to treat her the way i did, but then i see her and realize she's trying to steal my soul

>>8511112
That's right, but AGPs can experience their AGP internally before puberty, so they can know they're AGP even if nobody else can. Other people can ask them questions or spot their behavior to tell that they're AGP. Also I don't think even an early GNC AGP would be as GNC as an HSTS. So wanting to be a girl more than she might be expected to be dysphoric could hint at a GNC MtF child being AGP.

>>8511157
idk why i wrote that, shit's weird
anyway, as the other anons said, 'coping mechanism' is probably a misnomer -- i don't really understand words or language or anything
it's the same a*p transsexuals have
anyway, how do we stop kitty?

>>8511157
>the world can only be saved if everyone who's ever been wrong dies
[citation needed]

>>8511162
>AGP and HSTS are have differences unrelated to being GNC and orientation
>i thought the main difference is that AGP are just less gnc
>that's right!
???????????
I don't understand anything but that's how I got it

>>8511166
Answear me >>8511088
>>8511088
>What do you mean by not entirely serious?

>Also Trent what exactly made you think you are HSTS rather than AAP? Besides the orientation but from what I recall you're in the camp that thinks it's possible to be a gay HSTS and straight AGP anyway

>>8511174
GNC is the big difference but not the only difference. And even if both are GNC, there may be differences in their GNC, such as the AGP being less extremely GNC.

>>8511186
But what are the other differences?

>>8511190
The AGP has her AGP fantasies and gets a thrill from being girly. It might be dressing up in secret or cartoons with genderbending scenes.

>>8511206
But that's sexuality

>>8511178
there are no gay hstses, i was wrong about that
straight a*ps are pshet
what about me seems aap? inb4 typing style
>>8510987
>That's not a necessary part of the metacis idea. If a minority of male brained people are AGP then it stands to reason that if HSTS FtMs have the same gynephilic brains they'll have the same AGP minority. A*P as a coping mechanism for HSTSes is different.
yeah, as i mentioned, this is the actual correct thing
>Can you describe what a fantasy is like without a focus on your own body sufficient to distinguish it from an A*P fantasy?
i don't really think about myself when i'm jacking off, i guess? there's a much more important aspect (girl, any relevant kink), i don't really need to pay any attention to the less important aspects. maybe i don't have enough understanding of tru-a*ps who are a*p for any longer than the time they take to realize why they're dysphoric (keep in mind i realized i was trans at 13/14) to conceptualize my experiences as the opposite of that -- when i see the agpg ops that are a female pov image, i don't understand why someone would get off to *being* her rather than *fucking* her. i mostly just wonder why they're taking the pic from a shitty angle.

I'm not posting any more fantasies here if Blanchardians are just going to dissect it and argue definitions to death. This isn't fun.

>>8511210
Nothing specific I'm just asking why you yourself thought you're HSTS, not implying you're not

>>8511157
>kill yourself
>the world can only be saved if everyone kills themselves but they're not because they're hurting me
>help people are trying to steal my soul
what

you need to get off 4chan and to a therapist's office.

>>8511207
Yes but it's not orientation. A hypothetical gynephile HSTS wouldn't have the same fantasies.

The identifying features of AGPs must be sexuality because AGP is a sexuality.

>>8511215
Woman up and post anyway and just ignore it. Laugh at how silly it is to believe such thoroughly debunked theories.

>>8511215
Yeah. The fun part of the thread was reading all fantasies. I don't really care for the rest of it :/. I'll post another if I have time today.

>>8511221
>hsts-type dysphoria (primarily social, genital avoidance)
>was gnc female, not gnc male
>gynephilic, not meta-attracted (gynephilia obvious from early childhood)
>assumed all other trans people were equally gnc, constantly surprised to find out they weren't
>did not experience aap, and at some points thought i was falsetrans because i didn't do a*p-type things like always playing as characters of the opposite sex in video games before realizing i was trans

>>8511250
>a*p-type things like always playing as characters of the opposite sex in video games before realizing i was trans
you what how is that a*p

>>8511210
>there are no gay hstses, i was wrong about that
Why did you think there were?

>i don't really think about myself when i'm jacking off, i guess? there's a much more important aspect (girl, any relevant kink)
If you're just picturing a girl in a vacuum, sure, but if you're imagining having sex with her you must be in the scene. How can you only be thinking of her and now yourself when the two of you are fucking?

>tru-a*ps who are a*p for any longer than the time they take to realize why they're dysphoric
Maybe it's impossible to conceptualize A*P if you aren't and vice versa.

What's the etiological difference between tru-A*P and A*P like you had?

Why does the amount of time before realizing they're dysphoric come into it?

>i don't understand why someone would get off to *being* her rather than *fucking* her.
Here's the answer to >>8511221's question!

>>8511259
because HSTS don't concentrate on their own gender. They just grow up liking the own sex and being confused by everything they do and like, while AGPs are so focused on their own sex, that they ERP as the other gender as much as possible, whithout actually being gender nonconforming

>>8511259
there's no real reason for hstses to play characters of the gender they don't currently identify as unless they want to, same as cis people, while a*ps will often play characters of their desired gender pre-transition because they're crossdreamers and idealize a world where they're the opposite sex
in overwhelmingly a*p communities things like e.g. trans girls always playing girls in video games, long before they came out, are considered normal trans things that everyone did
>>8511261
>Why did you think there were?
people like eli erlick and commie-chan seemed pretty hsts to me mostly on the merit of their transition ages, but later research and insight led me to the conclusion i was wrong
>
If you're just picturing a girl in a vacuum, sure, but if you're imagining having sex with her you must be in the scene. How can you only be thinking of her and now yourself when the two of you are fucking?
i don't really know how to explain it. if you're a meta-attracted a*p you 'should' (stereotypically) imagine a 'faceless', mostly insignificant person in your meta-attraction fantasies, because the real point is the affirmation of your gender -- i guess this is the opposite of that, where *you're* the person who isn't the focus of the scene. that's the best way i know to explain allosexuality to someone who's primarily autosexual, anyway.
>What's the etiological difference between tru-A*P and A*P like you had?
[shrug emoji]
>Why does the amount of time before realizing they're dysphoric come into it?
i mentioned how young i was when i started identifying as male so it would be clear that i didn't exactly have a fully developed sexuality before

>>8511264
>>8511275
But those people don't yet know they want to be the other sex in most of those stories. Preferring to play characters of the other gender just sounds like a universal trans thing. I know for sure a lot of HSTSs roleplay as girl characters when playing pretend as kids.

>>8511250
What were your GNC behaviors?

>gynephilia obvious from early childhood
How?

>>8511275
>i mentioned how young i was when i started identifying as male
Isn't 11-13 late onset, with 6-8 being early?

>>8511288
>But those people don't yet know they want to be the other sex in most of those stories
but that's exactly it, anon -- that's the egg narrative, which is inherently a*p
>i didn't know i was trans, i repressed all my thoughts about it...all i did was roleplay as a girl online, and play girls in vidya, and imagine how cool being a girl would be, andalsojackofftotgtf, and in retrospect that was just my female magical innate gender identity shining through!
cue confused 14 year old wondering why he didn't imagine being a guy that much before transitioning

>>8511288
An HSTS would like female roles in social play but that's different from choosing female characters to represent herself. She's no more do that than any boy or girl would. An AGP on the other hand has her own specific reason for playing female characters and loving playing female characters, but not necessarily feminine roles which she might or might not care about.

>>8511301
>that's the egg narrative, which is inherently a*p
???
You can like men and not realize you're trans until later. Realizing you're trans heavily depends on social factors, such as whether you even know that's a thing.

>>8511306
That hardly matches the stories of the trans people I know.

>>8511298
i mean that, to put it in cara terms, that was the age when i began to completely and openly contextualized myself as male and started the path to full-time social transition (completed at age 15)
some hstses start to 'contextualize themselves' as children, some as early adolescents, some later in adolescence -- the latest seems to be about mid-20s
>>8511291
i had gynephilic crushes for about as long as i could remember, mostly on female friends (in retrospect, my not-as-tomboy female friends were selected for how cute i thought they were, and i was inappropriately romantic with them a lot) but sometimes celebrities or fictional characters

>>8511310
So you felt like a man earlier?

>>8511275
>i guess this is the opposite of that, where *you're* the person who isn't the focus of the scene.
Of course! And of course that would be the difference, because it's the same phenomenon.

>[shrug emoji]
Ok, what's the difference in practice between tru-A*P and A*P like you had?

>so it would be clear that i didn't exactly have a fully developed sexuality before
I see. But your experience wouldn't be the opposite of that. It would be a mix of the straight male and the AGP male experiences, not exclusively the allo experience.

>>8511309
What doesn't match?

>>8511310
>in retrospect, my not-as-tomboy female friends were selected for how cute i thought they were
Hah, and you'll have got away with having them as your friend circle, and perhaps the inappropriate romantic stuff too, because you were natal female!

>and i was inappropriately romantic with them a lot)
In ways adults could have noticed?

How did you express your crushes on celebrities/characters?

>>8511336
>What doesn't match?
No matter the type most-everyone seem to report signs of wanting to be girls early on. The pair of you are making it sound like only AGPs have an innate female gender identity which is really weird. If I didn't know better I'd think that you were trying to push some strange "only AGPs are trutrans" propaganda.

>>8511345
Tfw never got to wear a dress in high school

>>8511345
>most-everyone seem to report signs of wanting to be girls early on.
First you need to distinguish the kind of want, second you might only know AGPs anyway and perhaps misinterpret the most feminine/meta-attracted of them as HSTS.

>The pair of you are making it sound like only AGPs have an innate female gender identity
AGPs want to be girls as soon as their AGP kicks in. HSTSes act like girls from the start. Note the distinction, want vs act. If anyone wants to push either as trutrans then they make out that wanting/acting is the defining feature, according to which one they are trying to make tru. Both are trans in their own distinct ways. If you interpret describing that as pushing AGP = tru, then that's because it's the AGP wanting that you already consider tru. But HSTSes are different and have their own way of being trans.

Not sure if fit into hsts or a*p noe. Sometimes my fantasized involved an insig ificant person and sometimes they involved very detailed imagined partners or people I've crushed on in real life. What does it mean to have both? Fantasies that just focus on the physical sensations I get from sex but also fantasies that detail my attraction to another person?

I've always considered myself more hsts because I to have emotional attachments and feelings for men outside of sexual contexts but now you guys are confusing me.

>>8511403
What sex are they when insignificant, detailed and irl people? How GNC were you as a kid?

AGPs can have emotional attachment to men like that too, it's just not universal and usually combined with liking girls too.

>>8511375
>First you need to distinguish the kind of want
The stories were pretty similar..

>second you might only know AGPs anyway and perhaps misinterpret the most feminine/meta-attracted of them as HSTS
That seems unlikely.

>AGPs want to be girls as soon as their AGP kicks in. HSTSes act like girls from the start.
I'm not sure about either part. I recall people talking about wanting to be girls before being AGP, and I recall male-attracted transsexuals who were not particularly feminine.

I don't think wanting to be something is the crucial point. I think identifying as something is. Otherwise a feminine man would count as trans while a masculine woman wouldn't count as a woman.

>>8511422
Both the insignificant partners and detailed partners are men. I never have sexual fantasies with women partners. I find some women cute even moderately attractive but I don't enjoy sexy time with them.

Kind if as a kid. I did some stiff but my parents stopped it. Like i had a doll and wore some girl clothes and atuff. Cute when your young enough but as i got older they stopped it. Then I went to youngnearth fundamentalist Baptist school through elementary - high school and repressed because I was scared. Eventually I just did drugs to cope until I found out hrt was thing and then I just worked towards transition.

>>8511446
>The stories were pretty similar..
I didn't hear them so I can't comment.

>That seems unlikely.
Same.

>I recall people talking about wanting to be girls before being AGP
The wanting to be girls was the AGP.

>and I recall male-attracted transsexuals who were not particularly feminine.
Red flag for "seems unlikely" being exactly what happened. Describe them.

>identifying
That's something that happens to both types when their etiology turns them trans.

>>8511449
Sounds HSTS to me. I don't think the detail in the fantasy partners is a key clue.

Did you wear your girl clothes in secret, alone? Did you pretend to be a girl online or play in games? Was dressing up or imagining yourself as a girl ever arousing? Do you find girls hot/attractive, enough that you'd put a poster of a sexy girl on your wall instead of a guy?

>>8511482
>The wanting to be girls was the AGP.
Is that so? I wouldn't think a desire divorced of any romantic or sexual context would count.

>Describe them
Male hobbies. A love for video games. Unfeminine mannerisms. I think you'll probably write them off as being pseudo andro but that honestly didn't seem like the case. Most andros seem more femme for sure though.

>That's something that happens to both types when their etiology turns them trans.
Personally I think people are trans all along and just take time to realize this.

aren't HSTS actual trans who we should be protecting and AGP degenerate fetishist trash

>>8511482
I spent a time trying to convince myself my tranness was fetish so everything got muddied up with weird trans porn for s little bit. But the biggest thing for me i think was just the sub aspects of it. I.e. you will do this to this man because we say so but the jokes on them because I would have done it anyway haha

I never dressed alone much because I didn't have siblings with clothes to steal and I couldn't steal my mom's and I was a pussy so I never shopped for them.

Initially dressing involve a bit of arousal but always short lived. For a minute I could kind of feel like myself but once I got slammed with body dysphoria again it ceases to be. But after a couple of times I didn't really get aroused anymore(from what I remember). I only dressed alone a handful of times before starting social transition. I just started wearing female clothes 100% of the time with makeup and stuff and didn't give a fuck. I was in the south so I didn't bother getting the school to change my name and stuff(still hiding it from parents) I didn't have hrt yet but I honestly didn't give a fuck.

I think those first couple times i was just excited in general because I felt like I had repressed so long.

For games:
Sometimes I would play as female sometimes I wouldnt. The times I did i wouldn't tell people because I was afraid they question why i was doing it and I didn't want that. So I would play as a male character a lot of the time especially if I was going to be in a voice com. Most of that stage of my time gaming was during repression. Noe if I game I play a female character when given the option but I honestly don't game as much these days.

I would have a picture of a girl I think is cute or is from a show I like because I like the show but I've never had one of a girl for sake of "sexy"ness. I never had a poster of a guy either(except Damien from vampire diaries but that was my roommates although I did enjoy it). But I've never been one to own posters in general.

File: 1385208252451.jpg (208KB, 693x712px) Image search: [Google]

208KB, 693x712px

WOW come back to the thread and autistic fucking retards ruined my comfy HST slut thread. smH fuck y'all niggas. Especially you Trent, I just want you to know I am gonna fuck your MtF crush faM. I am gonna fuck her until she passes out and then im gonna send you the video.... must suck knowing that you will never be able to satisfy a woman like I can (:

>>8511957
lame

>>8511957
You brought this on yourself mate. Use Blanchard words? You summon typology retards.

>>8512174
To be fair this was a Blanchard word thread before he even hopped in.

>>8511535
Aren't they both supposed to be valid but different? I mean most of Blanchard stuff is bs. The terms are only really useful to describe two very general groups that aren't even all ecompassing. I don't think you can say that one is more valid than the other.

>>8511535
No, HSTS are just homosexuals who transition due to lack of societal acceptance.

File: meta attraction.png (56KB, 575x517px) Image search: [Google]

56KB, 575x517px

>>8511957
what kind of loser do you need to be to feel sexually threatened by an 18 year old dickless autist?
>>8511514
what made them seem 'truhet' rather than pshet? i'm not sure that in practice untrained observers can distinguish between meta-attraction and 'tru', even in themselves (see pic related)
>>8511535
no, both types are equally valid/invalid (depending on your point of view)
both have 'trutrans' traits and 'falsetrans' traits, and the 'trutrans' narrative is a bizarre mix of hsts and a*p traits that few to no people in real life have

>>8514039
>i'm not sure that in practice untrained observers can distinguish between meta-attraction and 'tru', even in themselves
What is the distinction? How come meta-attraction can become so allo-looking?

>and the 'trutrans' narrative is a bizarre mix of hsts and a*p traits that few to no people in real life have
What are the A*P traits?

>>8514039
pic related just makes me think Lawrence was wrong but eventually convinced them lol

>>8514827
>What is the distinction?
stereotypically, as i mentioned earlier, meta-attracted people won't be focused on the actual traits of the person they're attracted to past the gender-affirming aspects of the fantasy and so don't find male (or female) traits attractive simply for the sake of it as 'tru' attracted people do. however, as time goes on, some meta-attracted people begin to resemble 'tru' attracted people, especially if they choose to focus on that side of their attraction. i have a really good essay i like to use as an example of this, but the site that hosts it is down (it's from the early 2000s and so goes down regularly)
one trait extremely common in pshet/psbi trans women who pursue relationships with men is the men they date being agp themselves, a trait noted in the only studies i know of that have been done on meta-attraction (albeit with tiny sample sizes) and discussed in one of brown's essays:
https://sillyolme.wordpress.com/2013/03/13/going-to-the-chapel/
>What are the A*P traits?
the most obvious off the top of my head is that the hypothetical 'trutrans' person has a strong cross-sex 'gender identity' that has been present for a long time, even before they transitioned. as discussed earlier in the thread under 'want vs act', this is not a common hsts experience, and hstses are more likely to be confused regarding the concept of internal gender identity at all or not develop a strong cross-sex one until they transition
(on the topic of the thread itself, this underlies the 'but obviously trans people will have sexual fantasies where they're the opposite sex!' confusion -- hstses have no reason to have those fantasies *before* realizing they're trans)

>>8510966
>but are a*p as a coping mechanism
Since when did the A*P of MetaCisses become a coping mechanism, rather than being TruA*P?

>>8514858
as i mentioned later, 'coping mechanism' was wrong, i'm just bad at words

>>8514845
>His most intense erotic arousal came from engaging in sex with men while presenting himself as a woman.
How is this not meta-attracted as fuck?

>>8514849
>however, as time goes on, some meta-attracted people begin to resemble 'tru' attracted people, especially if they choose to focus on that side of their attraction.
What's the distinction at this point then?

What does it mean when meta-attraction develops like this?

>but the site that hosts it is down
Link anyway or just name the site and describe the essay, and I'll find it when it's back up.

>the men they date being agp themselves
Is there a particular reason for this besides both being willing to tolerate a fellow AGP (which for her doesn't specifically mean AGP men) and him being attracted to trans people (not specifically AGPs)?

>the hypothetical 'trutrans' person has a strong cross-sex 'gender identity' that has been present for a long time, even before they transitioned.
>hstses are more likely to be confused regarding the concept of internal gender identity at all or not develop a strong cross-sex one until they transition
What's the distinction between the hypothetical-trutrans gender identity and HSTS kids who insist they are the other gender?

>>8514869
>How is this not meta-attracted as fuck?
Because a HSTS would report the same thing

>>8514878
An HSTS wouldn't care about presenting as a woman.

An HSTS might like something about sex with men in particular but it would not be "the best times ever are when I'm presenting as a woman".

This person on the other hand probably doesn't even have sex with men when she isn't presenting female.

>>8514869
http://annierichards.com/mysexuality.htm
the essay describes her as being exclusively gynephilic before transition (and indeed turning away from transition in her 20s after getting extremely close to srs due to a relationship with a straight girl, a common latetrans agp narrative), but deciding that as a woman she wanted to be able to enjoy and reciprocate male sexual attention, and so intentionally focused on her meta-attraction and fantasized about scenarios involving it until she enjoyed male attention enough to find male features attractive in general (a conditioning response, if you will, though i'm not a huge fan of conditioning explanations as they're usually applied)
she ended up marrying a man, so it worked out pretty well for her
aside from countering the 'but i'm attracted to male features as well' argument that some bisexual trans women use, i'm not sure what the actual course of these experiences means or what we can draw from them, though they're interesting and a lot more research needs to be done on them
>Is there a particular reason for this besides both being willing to tolerate a fellow AGP (which for her doesn't specifically mean AGP men) and him being attracted to trans people (not specifically AGPs)?
gynemimetophilia doesn't just present as attraction to trans women, it presents as attraction to the entire sphere of feminized natal males (though to greater or lesser degrees depending on the individual), and as we know agp and gamp are strongly correlated. a relationship between a trans woman and a crossdresser or some type of 'femboys' is sustained by mutual gamp just as much as it is by meta-attraction.
>What's the distinction between the hypothetical-trutrans gender identity and HSTS kids who insist they are the other gender?
very early childhood gender identity has more to do with what gender your friends are than anything
it's a decent marker, but that's it

>>8514884
>An HSTS wouldn't care about presenting as a woman.
I don't think so. Gender dysphoria would prevent a HSTS from enjoying themselves while presenting as a man. After all one of the supposed causes is feeling guilty due to being a homosexual. If you're woman "it's no longer gay". That's one of the supposed motivations behind HSTS transitions.

>>8514895
>and indeed turning away from transition in her 20s after getting extremely close to srs due to a relationship with a straight girl, a common latetrans agp narrative
But 20s isn't latetrans?

>and so intentionally focused on her meta-attraction and fantasized about scenarios involving it until she enjoyed male attention enough to find male features attractive in general (a conditioning response, if you will, though i'm not a huge fan of conditioning explanations as they're usually applied)
That would explain the distinction , 'natural' androphilia and conditioned androphilia. Why aren't you a fan of it as an explanation usually?

>i'm not sure what the actual course of these experiences means or what we can draw from them,
They can teach us about bisexuality and perhaps the meaning of 'natural' orientations by comparison.

I wonder if there's a limit to how similar 'conditioned' attraction can be to 'natural' and if there will always be ways of distinguishing them with the right observation or questions.

>a relationship between a trans woman and a crossdresser or some type of 'femboys' is sustained by mutual gamp just as much as it is by meta-attraction.
Wouldn't those two attractions from the AGP MtF conflict? As much as the crossdresser/AGP femboy is a feminized male, he's a worse partner for her meta-attraction, and vice versa.

Is this comparable to the conflict between AGP and normal gynephilia?

>very early childhood gender identity has more to do with what gender your friends are than anything
But that still makes it an HSTS trait even if it only applies to some HSTSes, not an AGP or fantasy one, no? And it's a case of HSTSes indeed having a strong cross-sex gender identity, even if they don't perceive it the same way an A*P would?

>>8514903
Guilt is nothing to do with how extremely erotic you find something. Look at repressing/pre-transition AGPs.

>>8514929
>Guilt is nothing to do with how extremely erotic you find something. Look at repressing/pre-transition AGPs.
Dysphoria would still be an issue either way. I don't see why this claim is controversial.

>>8514929
>But 20s isn't latetrans?
that was when she *didn't* transition, she ended up transitioning for real in her early 30s
(i'm not even sure if before 35 is trulate, but by /tttt/ standards it certainly is, and i hear the narrative from many midlife transitioners)
>I wonder if there's a limit to how similar 'conditioned' attraction can be to 'natural' and if there will always be ways of distinguishing them with the right observation or questions
intuitively it seems that there is, though due to these narratives being rare in general i don't have specific evidence to support that. it'd be greatly interesting to collect more narratives and the women who experience it to test if there *is* some kind of observation/questioning that gets it.
>As much as the crossdresser/AGP femboy is a feminized male, he's a worse partner for her meta-attraction, and vice versa
that's assuming all meta-attraction reaches the 'conditioned' point, whereas most don't seem to (especially amongst younger trans women, likely for the same reason they're more likely to be psbi than pshet -- greater opennesss towards being a gynephilic woman). the trans woman in question is likely to still lack 'tru' attraction to male physical features, so the gamp takes over and allows for the maintenance of a long-term relationship that might otherwise not be sustainable. hon-attracted gamps seem relevant here somehow, though i'm not sure how -- gamps who are open to even more masculine signifiers in their partner than usual might be more likely to develop meta-attraction and enter that kind of relationship, maybe
(might answer other parts later -- this post got longer than the character limit pretty rapidly)

>>8514935
Read what Trent said about HSTS gender identity >>8514849 >>8511275

>>8514982
I did. It just doesn't connect with Blanchard's own conception.

>>8514992
How so?

>>8515013
I think Blanchard would agree that presenting female during sex is something both groups are interested in, but for different reasons. AGP in one, dysphoria mitigation in the other. When you're suffering you're ~probably enjoying yourself less, yeah? So that line upthread isn't a telltale sign of AGP because a HSTS would say the same. You need to focus on the why rather than the what. The experience would be different for a genuine androphile and for someone who is only AGP.

>>8514976
>the women who experience it
Not just women. I've seen narratives of "gay men" who are AGPs.

>to test if there *is* some kind of observation/questioning that gets it.
What observations or questions do you think might work?

>that's assuming all meta-attraction reaches the 'conditioned' point
I means baseline meta-attraction, not enhanced. Any meta-androphilia would conflict with a feminine partner, no?

>so the gamp takes over and allows for the maintenance of a long-term relationship that might otherwise not be sustainable.
Is mutual gamp likely to be as sustainable 'conditioned' androphilia on her part and 'natural' attraction on his?

>>8515033
>I think Blanchard would agree
What you think =/= "Blanchard's own conception"

>When you're suffering you're ~probably enjoying yourself less, yeah?
Yet AGPs can still enjoy sex with women while projecting themselves as the women.

Why would an HSTS specifically need to feel female in bed? She's more comfortable presenting as a woman but when you're naked you don't need to present as anything. Why would an HSTS feel dysphoria about that? An AGP on the other hand would want to feel specifically feminine through things like lingerie and being called female terms of endearment by the man.

If an HSTS gets dysphoric in bed it's from her male body, which presenting female wouldn't do anything about.

>>8515046
>What you think =/= "Blanchard's own conception"
I don't understand what you're trying to say here. I'm repeating what, to the best of my knowledge, Blanchard believes.

>when you're naked you don't need to present as anything
I think I understand the issue. Presentation is not just about clothes. It has a social dimension.

>Why would an HSTS specifically need to feel female in bed?
Gender dysphoria..

>Why would an HSTS feel dysphoria about that?
What?? Being perceived as male by others. Acting male. Presentation is not just about clothes.

>If an HSTS gets dysphoric in bed it's from her male body, which presenting female wouldn't do anything about.
Identities are about more than bodies. HSTS dysphoria tends to be heavily social.

>>8515078
Where does Blanchard say anything suggesting what you've said?

>>8515081
Everywhere. I don't know how to approach answering this question. Dysphoria having a social dimension is kind of at the core of many of the ideas, such as it being socially induced due to rejection.

>>8472922
reminder to not use blanchard terms if u want a thread free of blanchard autism

>>8515108
So he didn't say anything that specifically applied to this situation you say it applies to?

File: 1484016944266.gif (4KB, 650x220px) Image search: [Google]

4KB, 650x220px

>tfw apparently not AAP but late-onset HSTS pseudoandrophilic AGP FTM
wtf im feminine essence now

>>8515134
Explain this.

Also late/early onset are different for FtMs.

>>8515153
this post has to be a joke

>>8515156
Idk...

>>8472922
sex
alternatively, kissing

>>8515153
I just identify with all types on a lot of aspects, I'm not even sure I'm trans really, this was mostly confused shitposting

I can't apply the typology to most people I've seen either, the most stereotypically AGP person I've seen was strictly androphilic in a true sense (though more like a gay man than a straight woman but I don't even really have any cis female friends so I'm talking out of my ass, maybe they're all really just gay guys with boobs and vaginas, like very visual and stuff)


>Also late/early onset are different for FtMs.
I actually don't even really get the whole early/late onset divide and just used it a shorthand for the ashamed repressor stereotype, it wasn't very serious

Like is it
>first age you had trans-related thoughts
>first age you began actually consciously feeling distressed about not being the opposite sex/conceptualize yourself as one
>first age you started transitioning socially
I've seen it used as all 3 in different contexts
DSM from what I recall goes for the first time you met their criteria (I think... my memory is shit)

>>8515330
>Early-onset gender dysphoria starts in childhood and continues into adolescence and adulthood
>Late-onset gender dysphoria occurs around puberty or much later in life. Some of these individuals report having had a desire to be of the other gender in childhood that was not expressed verbally to others.
Nevermind they actually don't explain shit

>>8515330
Just describe your history of trans feelings/experiences please.

You're natal female and not transitioning, right?

>the most stereotypically AGP person I've seen was strictly androphilic in a true sense (though more like a gay man than a straight woman
Describe how they were AGP?

>>8515113
>implying that would change a thing

>>8511514
>but that honestly didn't seem like the case.
???

>>8511540
>trying to convince myself my tranness was fetish
>the sub aspects of it
>I didn't have siblings with clothes to steal
These are all AGP. Nothing you said sounds clearly HSTS. I think we can be pretty certain you're AGP.

The bit of arousal from dressing is AGP and the fact it was only slight I put down to you being an AGP of the less sexual/erotic/transvestic kind.

Enjoying female characters in games but being scared of getting called on it is also typical AGP.

I've been taking a trans sex friend to the gym with me so she could "Get a booty".

She takes forever in the changing room because she wants to look at all the dick.
Her fantasy is to be gang raped in the locker room.

Yes, she's weird but she's a good lay

>>8521116
>>8521116
>Enjoying female characters in games but being scared of getting called on it is also typical AGP.
Observer here, I've never seen anyone mention the 'being called on it' part, so I'm curious now. If she HADN'T been afraid of being 'called on it', would that still be AGP? Like, if her normal guild chat was female, everyone thought she was female (and not for leeching items from people!), other females confided in her and invited her to their circles, etc?

>>8521600
That would have been ambiguous. IMO there isn't really an HSTS answer to the gaming question, just AGP and unclear. Not caring about the character's gender is the most HSTS I guess but it's not incompatible with AGP either. It's specifically wanting to play a girl that's AGP, plus the shame.

>>8521645
Thank you for the clear answer.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ul_nuZcW_d0

We're all in agreement that Nikita is the purest form of HSTS, right?