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SE Asia History

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Thread replies: 70
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File: SE Asia.png (83KB, 400x353px) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
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Let's talk about the history of SE Asia. It's a topic that is HEAVILY glossed over in most history courses, yet there are centuries of history in the area before the modern era.

Please contribute with interesting information of the region if you're familiar with it, as I'm interested in learning more.
>>
What's there to say other than Hindu/Buddhist kingdoms and Chinese vassalge
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>>80078
How did Islam end up spreading there?
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>>80117
Indian ocean trade
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>>80105
It would be interesting to learn more about their early interactions with Europeans.
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>>80105
Dumb chink.

>What's there to say about Chinese history other than civil wars and constantly being conquered by nomadic horse archers

Southeast Asian history is actually great.
>>
rightful dutch workers.
>>
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The movies about this dude are cool.
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Thoughts on him?
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nice architecture, comparable to china and japan, but less known
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>>80078
Thai anon here. Something that I found interesting that literally no one knows anything about was Thailand's participation in WW2.

Thailand actually declared war on the Allies much before Japan made it its puppet. Knowing that France was a little preoccupied, we actually succeeded in taking Laos from France. Japan helped, in fact, by organizing the armistice which basically made France hand the Laos over. Japan still attacked after that but we ended it quickly. If those dumb nips didn't lose in the end then Laos would've been our clay.
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>>80078
Thats because for the bulk of history there are no documents, especially in Indonesia and Malaysia. It's more archaeology than history until the 16th century. Even if we know some of the empires and the kings, there's relatively little data. And nothing until the Indians, Chinese or Europeans write it down.
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>>82569
Pretty sure Thailand kept the parts of French Indo-China the Japanese gave them.
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>>80078
Siam ruled that shit until Europe got fresh.

But even then Siam stayed independent.

Rest of SEA isn't worth mentioning.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEiZz4hApb8
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>>82569
>>82696
>dfw Thai and still not sure what my home country did in World War II
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>>83035
คุณเป็นคนไทยจริง ๆ หรือ
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>>83169
I guess not. I was born in the US. Can't read it, can barely even speak it ;_;
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>>82725
Siam has always been a vassal to Chinese dynasties
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>>83614
Ur mom has always been a vassal to my dick
>>
>>83675
It's true though.

Siam has always been a vassal to Chinese dynasties. That's why the Chinese always left the Siamese alone to do their thing in the region.

On the other hand, the Chinese always invaded and conquered the Vietnamese because the Viets refused to be vassals.
>>
Mulan was gr8 9/10
>>
>SE Asian history
>everyone is fucking sweating
>it's hot
>hot as fuck
>Mexicans of Asia
>oh jesus it's fucking hot hold on i need to take my shirt off
>why do we live in a jungle holy fuck this is horrible
>i'm burning up here fuck
>go homu GI
>>
>>83811
>tfw you learn that Mulan was actually a Hun (or whatever nomadic people that was in power at the time) and fought for the Khan
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>>80078
>death from humidity
>silkroad online
>jungles
>eating insects
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>>80078
The only city that left some sort of impact on human history in SEA is Bangkok, the rest are all meme cities

Yes that includes Singapore, Hanoi and Kuala Lumpur, and all the rest of the even less important cities
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>>84006
There's nothing really historical about Bangkok. It's a fairly new city.
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>>84006
Thai culture is basically just stolen Khmer culture anyway.
>>
im surprised why malacca used to be a thriving port last time unlike right now
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>>84214
I think it's more of a bastardized version between Indian and Chinese cultures. Same goes with the language as well, kind of like how English is bastardized French and Germanic.
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>>84243
>unlike right now
Uh, it still is right now?
It's just that people is using Singapore right now instead of Johor Bahru.
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>>82670
>And nothing until the Indians, Chinese or Europeans write it down.
That's not true. Ibn Battuta, a Berber, wrote about his travels to modern day Aceh, Malacca, and some part of Vietnam before stopping in China.
>>80078
If you get the chance to, you should take a course on SE Asia. I really enjoyed mine.
>>84006
Modern day Hanoi was the political center of Dai Viet which took over the declining Champa culture. Singapore is extremely important for obvious reasons. I don't think you know what you're talking about, baka senpai desu~.
>>84243
Once the Dutch defeated the Portuguese, they invested in modern day Jakarta and the British and Chinese worked to build Singapore.
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>>84006
>bangkok

not malaka
not selurong
not mandalay

fall of ayatthuya best day of my life.

mingalabar nii lii ayen nene
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>>83614
>>83749
Vassalization doesnt mean shit in the context of imperial China.

In order to trade with China a state had to recognize China as the center of the world. Only China was allowed to have an emperor, and the Chinese would give the trading nation a rank, king, duke, etc. The Shogun of Japan was ranked the title of king, and the fact that Japan had an emperor was never really spoken of to the Chinese.
Any nation that traded with China entered into this "vassal" relationship.
The nation would send "tribute" and then receive a "gift."

Only in the cases of Korea, the Ryukyu and Vietnam did the term vassal really apply. Although Thailand did offer to send troops to China when the Japanese invaded in the 16th century.

>>84731
OK so some Berber wrote a bit in the 14th century, it still basically true
>>
>>84984
>The Shogun of Japan was ranked the title of king, and the fact that Japan had an emperor was never really spoken of to the Chinese.
Not really true. Japan broke off formal relations with China, even went to war with China over Korea. They traded through Okinawa that was a puppet state of the Japanese, and at the same time a vassal state of the Chinese. And no Ryukyu (Okinawa) was not a "real" vassal state of China. The government was firmly in the control of the Japanese.
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>>85033
He's talking about pre-19th century Japan.
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>>85033
kek you dont know shit.

The title of King of Japan/ King of Wa was awarded numerous times throughout the 10th to 19th century by the Chinese.
The Japanese went to war with China twice during the Tang and later under the Ming. But relations were restored both times. Later China developed elaborate trade rights which limited the number of times a country could send missions to China. Only Korea and the Ryukyu were allowed to trade each year, Japan was like once every three years.

Ryukyu wasnt founded with the Shimazu invasion, it had existed before as a vassal. And after the Shimazu invasion it existed both as a colony of Kagoshima and a vassal of the Chinese. The Japanese invasion and rule was kept a secret so Okinawa could remain a vassal and the Japanese reap the reward.
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>>85594
This is pre 19th century Japan.

>>85763
That doesn't mean the Japanese didn't break off formal relations. Relations were normalized, not "restored"

> And after the Shimazu invasion it existed both as a colony of Kagoshima and a vassal of the Chinese. The Japanese invasion and rule was kept a secret so Okinawa could remain a vassal and the Japanese reap the reward.
Wow, so basically what I said.
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>>85823
Okay, in that case pre-17th century Japan.
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it's more pre-history but the austronesian expansion is pretty interesting
>>
Why did they fell?
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>tfw no more Srvijaya
It was the Carthage of Asia
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>>86082
Srivijaya was pretty great but too bad they don't leave much temples like Hindu Mataram did.
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>>86135
Didn't they(or one of their subject kings) build Borobudur?
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>>86151
Borobudur was built by Srivijaya under the Javanese Sailendra dynasty. Pretty weird considering at that time most Javanese are Hindu and Buddhism was only embraced by the upper class.
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>>80409
>sukarto
soeharto is a lucky bastard
>>
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Candis are cool.


I'm glad Indonesians didn't bomb or tried to destroy Hindu-Buddhist heritage nowadays.
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>>80409
>>86207
Did you ever read this cool paper, "How did the generals die?" by Ben Anderson? The autopsy reports are attached at the end.
http://cip.cornell.edu/DPubS?service=Repository&version=1.0&verb=Disseminate&view=body&content-type=pdf_1&handle=seap.indo/1107009317#
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>>85823
Ryukyu was a vassal of China before and after the Shimazu.
And the Shoguns were granted the title of King of Japan.

You saw a problem with these statements for some retarded reason. And wanted to interject with a very shit that was limited to a certain time frame that did not negate my original post.
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>>80409
G30S/PKI is still mysterious until today, how does Soekarno actually got overthrown and is this guy the perpetrator?
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>>86511
soeharto did nothing wrong
he did not have the power to lead such a massive revolt
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>>86673
So he's a dindu
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>>86511
The CIA and MI6 helped undermine Sukarno and Suharto took advantage of that. The answer depends on who actually had the generals killed. If it was Sukarno who ordered their deaths, then he made the big mistake of not killing Suharto. Otherwise, Suharto did it all by himself with some help from the CIA and MI6.
http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/how-we-destroyed-sukarno-1188448.html
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>>80117
Peacefully I presume : ^ )
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>>86819
>then he made the big mistake of not killing Suharto
because soeharto was a cockroach
noboy thought he got big influence and power
that's why i said he was a lucky bastard
he became a president was a pure luck opportunity
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>>87085
I think that depends on who ordered the generals' deaths though. If it was Suharto that had them killed and not Sukarno, then it wasn't pure luck. If it was Sukarno who ordered their deaths, then why didn't he realize that Suharto, who aligned himself with the anti-communists and made himself well known to them with his killing campaign, was a serious threat? Was Sukarno oblivious to cold war and unaware of what was going on behind the scenes?
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>>87085
butthurt communist spotted

it's true though, Suharto only got to be the Big Man (TM) by luck and happenstance.
But he did bet all he has into couping Sukarno AFTER G30S (seems to have no relations with PKI top management).

>>87185
It's more likely that the generals killing is a low-level conspiracy by Untung and co. (communist card-carrying members of Air Force).
Sukarno, Suharto, and PKI were all blindsided by it.
Suharto just draw his luck first. And won.
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>>86135
that's because we burned them, unlike you (we) Javanese who got scared off by long-dead djinns abodes lol
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>>84006
dumb post.

barely anyone ever talks about Mrauk Oo of the Arakan kingdom, which was a huge cosmopolitan trading post in the 17th century,
They dealt with the Burmese, the portugeuse etc, the dutch etc.
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>>87315
but yeah it's (a bit) of a shame.
What's done is done, though.
If you want, in Musi river's source we've found an untouched temple/palatial complex of late Srivijaya, go there and see.
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Soeharto did nothing wrong
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>>86418
Kek, the Chinese might say that this and this is the King of Japan, just like the Portuguese say that the Shoguns are Emperor while the Tenno is Pope, but all the Japanese say that the Tenno is their (temporal and spiritual) ruler while Shogun is (just) a court position and Field Marshal.

It's a bit funny.
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>>87185
pki was a big threat because pki was supported by armies from kodam diponegoro (central java) and kodam sriwijaya (east java)
how could soeharto, only a panglima kostrad, has the influence to make those armies betray their general?
it doesnt make any sense
>>87238
>But he did bet all he has into couping Sukarno AFTER G30S
nah soekarno had already lost before g30s pki happened
seoharto became the president because ah nasution couldnt be
if a h nasution became the president,the public would be suspicious because he was from kodam siliwangi (west java)
public would assume that g30s pki was kodam siliwangi inside job
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a h nasution is the real snek
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>>87427
Didn't Soeharto at first only become temporary president?
I forget how he became a president.

>>87455
PKI vs army was probably internal conflict between armies at first.
I believe A.H Nasution did a good job for this. Fuck gommie.
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>>87031
Yes actually.
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>>87031
Yes, actually, it was mostly Arab explorers and traders who brought it.
>>
What was the deal with the Philippine-American War?
>>
>>88694
It started from a misunderstanding, if I recall correctly?
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>>88694
>Philippine natives want to cross bridge
>American soldiers yell "Halt!"
>Natives have no idea what the fuck those white foreigners are yelling about and continued walking
>American soldiers open fire
Thread posts: 70
Thread images: 11


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