does God exist?

Whose God?

What do you mean by 'exist'?

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>2015
>believing in a sky fairy

Which year it is now?

>>290742

Duh, who else created everything

Does 'does' does?

>>290766
>everything was created
Citation needed.

>>290742
Yes
/next question

Christianity stealth won by promulgating the big bang theory. Before then, the argument against a creator was based on the premise that there is no reason to assume reality had a beginning.

>>290766
Everything is every thing
Creation is a thing
Creation created it self
Or
All is

>>290796
If Christianity won then how come it's becoming a relic of the past?

Checkmate

>>290796
Intriguing idea

>>290751
> not believing in santa
hope u get nothing for xmas

>>290766
Who created God?

Why is a divine being capable of always existing while the apparently is an abstract trait for the universe to possess?

>>290829
literally elementary school-tier

read a fucking book jesus christ

>>290742
No
/next question

I think most westerners honestly don't believe in god, but go to church and say they do because it's socially acceptable. Though I don't understand the fedora shit or why people tell you to "grow up" when you say god doesn't exist.

But the real question is who cares? Just keep circle jerking till you die OP

>>290796
The big bang covers the expansion of the universe. Not the origin of all matter and energy.

>>290884
>ur dum red a book if u disagree with me

sweet counterargument

>>291551
I believe in the function of the church, and the influence of divine inspiration.

>>291551
It's all an American thing really.

America is literally filled with bible thumpers, so atheism becomes more than just a plain fact, it becomes some kind of "rebellious" identity of the person, and they start treating science like fucking magic.

>>290742
No.

Idk probably lol

>>291685
>I believe in the function of the church
God is dead etc.

I don't know but there certainly isn't an afterlive.

>>290742

What do you mean by does?

What do you mean by God

What do you mean by exist?

Then we'll talk mofugga.

dunno lol

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>>290796

>the big bang describes the beginning of the universe
>christfags actually believe this
>mfw

>>290742
you need to define 'God', I no not believe YHWH the god of Abraham created mankind, nor the universe, or rules any kingdom of heaven.

The fact is though, the universe exists, or at least appears to. Whatever this experience I'm having is, I'm having it! And something is responsible, It might be some mega alien that just pressed start on the simulator, whatever it is though, it exists outside the system so we can collect no data on it at all, so we have no basis to make any predictions. We can never know.

This also does not exclude some pretty divine, as yet un-described, aspects of nature that appear godly. Like the shared subconscious hive-mind.

What was before time? What was after time?

Was there anything before time? There was no then, here, or when but those things came to be with Time which is Time-space material really. Could time-space really have come from nothing by itself, or would it have to have emanated from something like an essence of timelessness.

Is there meaning in being human? Being self aware? How self aware really are you? How can you see God even if you wanted to?

Thomas Aquinas does a great job arguing the Existence of God through science. I try to tell most people Atheists that feel the need to argue their point that there is some very compelling arguments within there and that it would be to their benefit to read his works, if for no other reason than to broaden their own viewpoints.

The tl;dr is that in the 11th century a man essentially proved the existence of God through the big bang, intelligent design and evolution. He did this by applying the teachings of Aristotle to the Catholic Church.

>>292044

>Thomas Aquinas does a great job arguing the Existence of God through science

So the Five Ways are falsifiable?

>>291874
No. He exists as divine inspiration and I still follow holy script.

>>292077

Holy 7's batman. Much love to u.

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>>292044
Hope you weren't serious about this post.

>>292044
>The tl;dr is that in the 11th century a man essentially proved the existence of God through the big bang, intelligent design and evolution. He did this by applying the teachings of Aristotle to the Catholic Church.
Confirmed for knowing nothing about the Summa

God cannot be 'proved' or 'disproved' by human logic. It would make the concept of faith obsolete if God were 'proven'

>>292246

THANKS POSTER TOP QUALITY POSTER 5 STAR POSTER LIKE LIKE LIKE FAVOURITE POSTER POSTER FRIEND FUCKING 4CHAN BUDDY WELL DONE THANKS THANKS FOR THE INFO SO SUBLIMELY POSTED.

>>292477

GO ON MY SOOOON GO ON MY SOOOOON U FUCKIN LEGEND!!!!!!!!!!

>>292134
are you a gurl?

>>292577

WHAT YOU GNNA DO SON U GONNA ASK HER ON A DATE GO ON SON U CAN DOOO ITTT U CAN DOOO ITT!!

>>290742
Depends on what you mean.
If you mean a being that can make universes willfully, then maybe-probably.
If you mean a thing that paradoxically exists before anything and has always been and made everything "just 'cause", almost certainly not.

>>292276
Lol VenomfagX is still around? I remember watching videos of him getting torn apart by evolutionist back in high school. He filed a false DMCA complaint and had to apologize like a little cuk.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_MYyc-PtH4

>>290742
Why does it matter?

>>292773

mom keeps sayig I have to go to church and I want to stop going

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>>290742
What, you're an atheist?

Isn't that just a teenage angst phase? Maybe you should try to make some friends, find a girlfriend and a job, and get over yourself.

Are you ever going to attempt to become a valuable member of society? Or at least a member of society in some sense of the word?

as in the Judeo-Christian God? yep.

>>290742
Obviously not

Has anyone noticed the rise in right wingers on 4chan is correlated with the rise of internet usage in flyover states?

>>291855
Can confirm

Its a vicious cycle because it does create and encourage rabid fedoras as well

>>293192

yep ;)

there's actually like a couple million gods and all of them are confirmed real

>>290796
>citing the only thing christians had right to declare victory.

please

Stop thinking of god as a super human entity with a human personality and point of view and start thinking of god as the sum of the entire universe. Perhaps on some level there is awareness and perhaps on some level there is manipulation, no evidence of this exist. This is a god that isnt tangible.

But we can apply the same comcept to humans and things they have created. The sum of all human thought and interaction is tangible and does effect the universe, effects that arent conciously controlled by a single individual are all around us, perhaps things like memes are the first thoughts of a higher concious entity.

And so cells come together to form humans, humams come together to form god.

>>290742
Does Yahweh exist?
Does Odin exist?
Does Ra exist?
Does Jupiter exist?

So eager are the religious to screech their praise and demands to their own deity, yet never do they question if the people they label infidels and heretics are any more right or wrong than they are.

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>>293376
>I have no counter-evidence or substantial argument but you're definitely wrong because I say so

noice

>>293393
What evidence? You can't disprove the existence of a unicorn. No religion has come up with shit in the way of substantiating ANY of their claims, such is the nature of faith (which is worthless, faith of any sort should have no place in modern human civilization). Science has been waiting since its conception by humans for credible evidence to support the existence of any god, and still none has come forward.

But please, do go on in self righteous fervor how your religion is the correct one, above all others across all of human history, and is not simply one of countless other beliefs that survived simply because it possessed greater military might courtesy of Rome and Feudal Europe.

>>291994
Reminds of when creationists tries to disprove evolution by saying where life came from, AKA not evolution, but abiogenesis.

>>290742
>does God exist?

No.He was eaten by Godeater.

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>>294710
What kind of taste do you imagine it would be?

>>294717
Godly

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>>294765

Yes and her name is Maya.
Positivists have been worshipping her this whole time.

the existence of more than one religion proves that there is no god(s)

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>>291551
Isn't it interesting that our society only prospered when we learned to ignore all the "practical" aspects of religion?

Separation of church and state? It means we don't base our rules on what the bible says, but on what seems morally right, even though the bible says that "morally right" is defined by religion.

Religious freedom? It means we stopped treating religions like an absolute truth and instead treat them like a personal thing. How does that make sense? If you really believed that non-believers were going to hell, wouldn't you do EVERYTHING you could to convert them? Including invading their countries? We're talking eternal torture here! It's the only moral thing.

And when someone takes their religion literally, we call them "fundamentalist" and we shun them.

>>290742
If he does, he does a piss-poor job at what he does.

the idea of god goes against logic and reason
also this shit does not belong in /his/

>>294803
define logic
define reason

>>294816
logic. reasoning conducted or assessed according to strict principles of validity.
reason. the power of the mind to think, understand, and form judgements logically.

>>294796
>Treating religion like a personal thing
I am an American and who does that? Our politicians say "I oppose this law since because GAWD" and everyone cheers. We don't even think about all the hate x group of people/prolife doctrine originating from the church and shit English translation (of a Latin translation).

Hell people are even saying the country should turn people away based on their religion. But let me reiterate that other thing: it is encouraged in our political system to base one's opinions in religion. What's the point of forcing one's beliefs on someone else? It's not rendering shit unto Caesar, and moreover it eliminates moral choice. Thus we are compelled by worldly reasons to obey divine laws--in other words, we are not morally responsible for our "good" in the eyes of a god.

>>294787
The existence of more than one religion that believes in a force shared throughout all those religions proves that a greater force does exist. Whether it's name is God or Allah or anything else is irrelevant.

>>294821
nice circular logic buddy

>>290742
Yes and no. He doesn't exist ontically (ie as a being in the world) but He must exist (where the word is used loosely) necessarily as the ground for all being ie as Being.

>>294826
no, it proves that the human societies tend to create (invent) answers to what they don't understand. Religion is a natural response of primitive human beings to answer to the questions What created this land? Why is there a drought? Why do people die?

>>290829
The reason the universe needs a creator is because it is temporaly and spacially finite, which means it is subject to causation by a timeless, spaceless being which we call God. God, being timeless and spaceless as opposed to finite, is not subject to causality and thus we have no need to find a creator of God.

This is basic metaphysics but you fucking fedora-tippers can never seem to wrap your fat neckbearded heads around it.

>>294796
>Separation of church and state? It means we don't base our rules on what the bible says, but on what seems morally right, even though the bible says that "morally right" is defined by religion.
I hate to break it to you, neckbeard, but most of your moral intuitions are a result of your being socially conditioned in a Judeo-Christian culture.

>Religious freedom? It means we stopped treating religions like an absolute truth and instead treat them like a personal thing.
With the rise of radical Islam and the creeping Islamisation of European nation-states, how is that working out for you, you gaytheist liberal fag?

>>294834
I see religion as a colar keeping human nature from going down the path of basic animals.

As for God, you need to see God as an abstract concept instead of taking him literally as a giant sky fairy. Any civilization superior to ours is technically God. The atheist way is rejecting anything that doesn't have solid proof (in such a way atheism becomesa religion in itself) instead of embracing the objective that so far there is no clear answer. Many atheists get butthurt over the idea of agnosticism.

>>294855
>I see religion as a colar keeping human nature from going down the path of basic animals.
so you are saying that there can be no morality without religion. That is plainly wrong.

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Idk, but making the sign of the cross makes me feel good.

I think religion is one of those things to keep people happy and have hope no matter what situation they're in.
I don't go to church or anything

>>294863
There can be no morality without belief.

>>294877
you can believe in your moral priciples, that has nothing to do with religion. We don't need religion to tell us that murder is wrong

>>294884
religion is dadrock moral principle

>>294891
morality of religion is obsolete
religions should be attacked, they hold back human progress

>>294884
>>294884
There's also the spiritual aspect of religious belief in addition to moral.

>>294917
Progress for progress' sake is what is ruining societies.

>>294928
we are talking about intellectual progress.
Also not true.

>>294917
Religion needs to be defended, it keeps neo-liberal "progress" under check.

>>294995
social movements are what keep neo-liberal policies under check. Religions are mostly conservative and opressing.

>>290742
Nah.

>>290742
Which one?

>>294851
>neckbeard
>gaytheist liberal fag

>hurr I'm so angry I have to call people names
whatever

And I really don't see wtf islam has to do with what I said. If anything, it's an example of what happens when you treat religion seriously, as I said.

>>294837
>spacially finite
spatially
and no
>observable universe is flat with only a 0.4% margin of error
>flat and therefore infinite

>>294855
I see religion as a way of adding color in the form of hope and belief to our gray world of objective reality.

Going on an endless LCD trip when you die is more exciting than simply ceasing to exist in absolute blackness. Communicating with the deceased through religion is what verifies us as human beings and not just minor animals that exist to eat, breed and feed (or machines if we're going with the muh progress route). Religion makes us human.

>>295075
*LSD

no

>our objective reality

no such thing

>>295079
just because we can't sense it doesn't mean it doesn't exist

>>295083

I bet you say that to women.

No.

>>292223
>essentially

faggot

>>290742
god is a descriptive quality of being you fatfucks
>"nice god body you have there!"
>"Im glad this food taste so godly"
>"stacey's god/legs are so smooth and soft and supple I wish i wasnt so fat and hairy lol."

>>295068
>And I really don't see wtf islam has to do with what I said. If anything, it's an example of what happens when you treat religion seriously, as I said.
No, it proves what happens when you push "freedom of religion" ie religious pluralism. The streets of Europe will run red with blood soon because of your gaytheist liberal retardation.

>>290742
Maybe.

Though the nature of God is up for discussion. Whether a personal God like the Judeo-Christian God, an impersonal god or force or spirit of the universe, or multiple personal/impersonal gods/forces/spirits or whatever.

There are many interpretations of "God", and people seem to just be hung up on the all powerful/all knowing/all good interpretation, without realizing that most gods in non-Judeo-Christian religions and beliefs aren't necessarily all powerful, all knowing, or even good.

>>292044
13th century

>>290742
Yes, the one praised by the Roman Catholic Church.

>>292044
>>292057

Aristotelian Science is not modern Science, it is closer to a system of logic. Aquinas did not appeal to evolution ( that was Augustine), did not believe in intelligent design, and never heard of the big bang.

There are some proofs of God existence, but given that God is infinite we can't demonstrate his comprehensive reality through finite phenomena. Ontological arguments can ground his necessity ( not Anselm's) but Necessary isn't quite enough to ground all of God's other properties.

There is enough to show us that there is certainly something like what described by the Catholic Faith that exists, but it could very well be that we have some of details wrong, that is where faith comes in.

And really, no one has provided a better ontology at this point. So holding on to God is still valid insofar as very few people have the dispositions to just suspend belief in everything not 100% true- atheists who worships "science" without knowing a thing about scientific methodology or the philosophical ideas behind it are certainly worse off in this regard than the Christian who believes on the basis of good but incomplete arguments he finds in the Summa is.

No.

>>290742
Unlikely.

>>292009
Actually El Shaddai was the god of the Patriarchs. Several biblical names, first that come to mind are Israel and Samuel, are based upon the name of the head of the canaanite pantheon, El.

>go to check out new board
>first thread I see is this one
>leaving now

>>293307
God is a human centipede?

>>293438
> faith of any sort should have no place in modern human civilization

Goddamn you're stupid. Guess what: on some level, you have to take everything by faith. Look up the problem of induction and Munchhausen's trilemma.

>>294787
>muh inconsistent revelations

"the existence of more than one political theory proves that all political theories are false". That's how stupid you sound.

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>>298677
Which one? There are three Gods: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Not to mention the myriad of saints that are worshipped as gods.

>>298993
that's not wrong though

>>290796
There's still no reason to assume that there is a creator, because there's no reason to assume that the Big Bang that happened to create our universe was the first Big Bang or in any way a unique event in the supposed nothingness that existed before.

>>299025
Those are three aspects of the same God. It's a paradox.

>>299025
>Not to mention the myriad of saints that are worshipped as gods.
I have tried to get an answer to what the actual difference between praying to a saint or invoking an angel is to worshipping several gods, and the only answer I've ever gotten is that it's not the same because scripture says it's different.

>>299229

They are all channels to the same one God.

You don't pray to Poseidon to get Zeus to do shit for you.

>>299234
So why not just pray to the one god directly?

>>299241

Aesthetic/spiritual reasons most likely. Part of prayer is what the act of praying itself does for the individual. Contemplating on the Virgin Mary gives us something that contemplating on God will not. Not because God is lacking in any way, but our knowledge of God is. And its not like praying gives you beatific vision either way.

>>299096

Even Aquinas agrees that a temporal beginning to the universe cannot be proven to be the case, nor can the opposite. He goes as far as saying as trying to theorize about events we weren't there to experience is misguided. We have no idea what the "laws of nature" then actually were- they could have changed since then. So even inferring the big bang from our current universe is misguided.

Iunno, maybe.

But I feel like if it did, it would be a being humans can't comprehend. And it probably wouldn't look like us, that sounds a little too egocentrist.

>>294799
Oh you mean making the world a misery place?

But think about it. If world is nothing but paradise, then what's the worth in living?

>>290742
People tend to hate on the term God nowadays because muh logic and reasoning.

I believe God is a placeholder for everything in this world that we don't know. Oh, we will understand many things as we go on, but then we discover that every answers has dozens more questions. God is a placeholder of the unknown. Therefore, God is the Universe itself.

>>293307
Actually blew my mind

>>295026
>social movements are what keep neo-liberal
You're a damn fool if you honestly believe this

>>299304
>but then we discover that every answers has dozens more questions
This is not necessarily true, and logically shouldn't be true given that we can find out the entire truth. It appears that way when we still have to uncover the whole picture and are missing vital information so that things that are in reality regular appears to us to be exceptions.

Imagine it as Fate and Chance playing a game of chess that we can only observe sometimes in between moves. From this we can make assumptions about the rules of the game. For example we might conclude that pawns can only move one space forward at a time, but then one day we observe a board state that would be impossible unless a pawn had moved two spaces in a single turn and thus conclude that there is an exception to the previously assumed rule; sometimes a pawn can move two spaces. Later we find out that it's not actually an exception at all; pawns can simply move two spaces forward from their starting position.

>>299333
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Phenomenon_of_Man

>>298766
>atheists who worships "science" without knowing a thing about scientific methodology or the philosophical ideas behind it are certainly worse off
I fucking hate those people. Thank you anon.

>>299368
>logically shouldn't be true given that we can find out the entire truth

Makes sense, but here's my take on this.

Truth is one. But the variable of man's thought makes a truth more than one. Also while truth is one, it will be a task of forever to find one. Because the whole answer is moving as fast as this Universe expanding.

In terms of giving you a yes or no, there's no definite. But with my reasoning I think we're merely a small fragment of 'infinity'. Things simply go on and on and on. Life and death. What do we eat? The life of this earth. That which dies. You die and the cycle turns over. From death to life and over again. The universe might be the same way. It dies, rinse, repeat, and life is born.

It's easy to presuppose a god, but we can only make that supposition on our relative experience. Everything bigger than ourselves is something we don't understand.

We can't wrap our heads around a god, because then you would ask 'well where did God come from?' Same with the big bang. 'How did something come from nothing?'

I think the answer is something we haven't considered. And we're a part of it.

But I can't say whether I'm right or wrong. Because I can only base my assumptions with my own reasoning.

Maybe, and maybe not, regardless, he has no effect on my life and is probably not the one depicted by abrahamic religion

>>295075

>I see making shit up/fiction as a way of adding color in the form of hope and belief to our gray world of objective reality.

Fixed that for you. The mythologies of the world are a great way to tap into the creativity of ancient man however.

>Going on an endless LCD trip when you die is more exciting than simply ceasing to exist in absolute blackness.

Thinking that's going to happen doesn't make it happen.

>Communicating with the deceased through religion is what verifies us as human beings and not just minor animals that exist to eat, breed and feed (or machines if we're going with the muh progress route).

Do you think before you type this? Imagining talking to dead people and believing things that aren't true make people human?

>Religion makes us human.

I will state again, do you think before you type this?

While having a select few fool the ignorant masses is a very human thing, and blindly adhering to dogma has been a very human thing, they hardly "make us human".

>>293199
The rise in right-wingers probably has more to do with the left wing being more popular in mainstream media currently. 4channers are nothing if not hipsters who reject whatever the normies like so they seem more interesting in comparison.

>>290742
Fuck if I know.

>>290742
No

>>290742
I think

>>294837
We can wrap our heads around it. It's just wrong.

>>298766
>There is enough to show us that there is certainly something like what described by the Catholic Faith that exists
Source?