Youtube's CGP Grey just made a video using this book, Guns,

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Video link:

https://youtu.be/JEYh5WACqEk

Map in image is a gag on Civilization V, where starting location is important for the whole course of the game.

The problem with this book isn't that it's wrong but that people try to use it explain away all of human history.

All it really does is show the advantages Eurasia had over the Americas/Australia, and to a lesser extent Africa. That's extremely important, and it does a good job of explaining that.

It does not explain why Europe came to dominate instead of other parts of Eurasia, nor does it explain why some parts of the world developed civilizations while others didn't). That would require reading other books.

Stormfags of course just dumb the whole thing down to something about zebras, while SJWs either love it (because it's anti-racist) or hate it (because they think it's used to justify imperialism), always for the wrong reasons.

There isn't going to be any serious discussion in this thread, it's just going to be shitposting and memes.

How is it even relevant to the Middle East current situation? You can't apply his theory after 1500s when the whole world was connected by trade routes.

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>>289224
>It does not explain why Europe came to dominate instead of other parts of Eurasia

Because Britain has coal so near the surface you can gather some with a basket and a fork, and at the same time has mines so shitty that you need pumps to remove water from them.
A deadly combination for everybody else.

Anyway, Eurocentrism and European domination was because of industrialization, and that doesnt necessarily have to do with the factors mentioned in the book.
The book is more about Old World vs Americas, and about why colonization happened. I guess South Africa can be sort of included, since the desert divides the continent into two separate parts.

>>289230
>How is it even relevant to the Middle East current situation? You can't apply his theory after 1500s when the whole world was connected by trade routes.

They could have acquired such a huge advantage with their wonderful "start" that they would have conquered all other peoples. And that almost happened, first with Assyria, then with Persia.
The Mongols nullified their good early effort, though, just when they were going at it again.

>>289224
So did whites develop to become more intelligent based on their environment compared to blacks

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>>289246
Whites arent more intelligent than blacks. The difference is in culture and environment, not race.

>>289140
Kinda this >>289224 but I will add that Jared Diamond (or his editors) completely fail to make the viewer understand that this is his point. It's shown as a guide to understand european primacy, when it clearly doesn't fulfill this function well. So Jared ends up explaining his papuan friend why his people doesn't have cargo, but that's it. Maybe in the book is different, someone correct me if that's the case.

Also mr. Diamond is an ornithologist, not an historian, and should refrain from trying to write history t.b.h.

>>289247
Don't post things like that. Please.

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>>289255
The image or the factual scientific truth?

Jared Diamond

>Diamond was born in Boston, Massachusetts. Both of his parents were from East European Jewish families who had emigrated to the United States.[3] His father, Louis K. Diamond, was a physician, and his mother, Flora Kaplan, a teacher, linguist, and concert pianist.

:^)

>>289263
The truth. Don't reply to bait.

>>289247
Blacks have been in America for hundreds of years and are still the dumbest race in america by far. You can't just explain everything away with 'muh environment'

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>>289250
>Also mr. Diamond is an ornithologist, not an historian, and should refrain from trying to write history t.b.h.

Doesnt stop people from posting images like this one, where the person doesnt even have high education.
And dont get me on all the youtube "documentaries" and infographics we get posted as sources by right wingers.

Jared is like a history god compared to the usual citations posted on /his/.

>>289224
>nor does it explain why some parts of the world developed civilizations while others didn't
That's the topic of the entire book. It explains why civilizations arose in some places and not in others.

>>289250
He doesn't write about history, he collects prerequisites for the existence of civilization and correlates the presence of them with the "development" in certain regions. To exclude racial influences, he specifically looks at Polynesian cultures, and how they were shaped by the extremely different environments they colonized.

He says some dumb shit about how jungle barbarians must be smarter than whites because they can survive in the jungle, and that all races are equally capable, but that's literally three sentences in the entire book and is not part of his argumentation in any way.

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>>289270
When your culture is "I want to be a thug and a playa, a real G-gansta" and your environment is a single mother raising you on welfare, you dont get to realize your biological potential.
Whites in similar position achieve similar lack of intellect at similar rates.

>>289266
This is the last time, I promise. I wont respond to his next post. I swear.

>>289282
>Whites in similar position achieve similar lack of intellect at similar rates.

This is wrong because there is still a significant disparity in intelligence no matter the income bracket

>>289271
>sticking a random /pol/ logo onto someone else's writing
Why

>>289287
Adoption studies also show that blacks raised by white middle class families don't close the gap to white orphans.

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>>289287
>>289282

>>289271
I agree with you t.b.h. but it doesn't debunk my own post.

>>289277
This is literally writing history. It's also writing anthropology, but mr. Diamond is no anthropologist either.

>>289140
He tried explaining the middle east and north Africa's demise in the book as a result of man destroying his own habitat by deforestation and badly controlled grazing. Which is a pretty good explanation. Then he said that that wasn't as big a problem in Western Europe since the deforestation started later and they have more rainfall which makes vegetation grow back faster.

Then he also added the theory that Europe explored the world, and not China, because Europe was divided and competed among each other, but China, due to landscape, stayed unitary, and therefore had no wish for conquest. Also a good theory, but then what about India and South-East Asia. These lands had the same possibilities as Europe with bountiful land and a states competing with each other.

A good complementary to GG&S is "Why Nations Fail", which explores the institutional argument for why some nations are rich, but most are poor, even though they have the same geographical advantages.

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>>289292
Hey, I didnt make that, just nicked it from another thread up right now.

>>289287
>>289295
>>289299
FUCK, come on man, I promised not to reply, and you do this. Read carefully: culture. Blacks dont aspire to be intelligent.
A black child, when raised by a white family, still watches TV and uses the internet, and is convinced by our popular culture that he is meant to be a thug, its cultural in those cases.
Thats why I said a combination of culture and environment.

This also explains asian and jewish differences. Asians have a "study hard" culture, jews have a "get rich" culture.

>>289301
>Diamond is no anthropologist either
Who gives a fuck?

>>289277
>That's the topic of the entire book. It explains why civilizations arose in some places and not in others.
To an extent, but it seems more than anything to be about why the civilizations that did arise in Eurasia had an advantage over those in place like the Americas. If I remember right the main question he tries to answer is something like 'Why didn't the Inca conquer Spain?'.

>>289299
I read somewhere that the gap disappears when instead of income, you look at actual wealth.

>>289312
>it seems more than anything to be about why the civilizations that did arise in Eurasia had an advantage over those in place like the Americas
He keeps using that as an example, but the bulk of the book is more general considerations.

>>289201
But there were horses in North America. Natives as usual hunted them to extinction.

>>289309
You and everyone should. I can go and write that whales are actually fish like sharks, after all they're both big, live in the sea, etc. If I get some pseudo-intellectual friends to back my claim with similar works, and I convince the media that sharks being whales is good to defend their interests, a good amount of people soon will believe that sharks are whales. Then others will claim that penguins are not really birds since they do not fly, something that would not have worked before, but I opened the pandora's box and now it makes it's way into "common knowledge". 50 years later, biology as a discipline has stopped to be a science and in fact is not even a respected branch of knowledge anymore.

Future me tells someone on the internet that John Smith the random linguist should not be writing a book about crocodiles, and he asks me: "Who gives a fuck".

>>289331
Those stupid fuckers. Why didn't they live in peaceful harmony with nature? Why didn't they become friends with horses like white people did? Fucking savages.

>>289140

Just to throw my few coins into the circle, I think you should not underestimate the power of the free market. Remember what happened to the NAFTA? The more dominant USA market drained the ones around it and nobody but the USA went out with benefits in this agreement. Not saying its the only reason, but I think the European economical prowess certainly had an effect on other markets it influenced with trade agreements and drained the locals already in those times. It is not even about Europeans doing this on purpose, it is just the effect that occurs when some dude comes around with a ton of shiny coins and toys and the locals start immediately selling each other out.


>>289201

God fucking damn it, is it really the level on which you have to explain things to the average American? I feel like watching some kids channel here.

>>289336
Read the fucking book or at least look at his argumentation, dismissing him with "he isn't a trained X" is stupid.

>>289343
It's not for the reasons that I have already explained. He is not prepated to write about those subjects, and whatever points he can make that are correct will be thanks to luck or better prepared advisors that should be the ones writing to begin with.

>>289343
Not him, but he never just dismissed the book. His first post was a pretty good review (>>289250).

>>289346
Yes, that's stupid shit, just because he doesn't have a diploma doesn't mean he can't think creatively and analyze information.


>>289348
In which he states, that he has never read the book. Just shows how much of an imbecile he is.

>>289306
Thanks for sharing all "the factual scientific truth."

>>289201
But Native Americans had dogs too. I know just a dog isn't a ton of different types of animals but still, Native Americans have been chilling with dogs for thousands of years, surely at least one disease could've carried over?

>>289355
You're buttdevastated for no reason. Are you gonna tell me that Diamond made a documentary with the same name and thesis than his book, but that has nothing to do with the book? I'm talking about the actual documentary, the one with almost three hours f duration.

>>289247
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.udel.edu/educ/gottfredson/30years/Rushton-Jensen30years.pdf&ved=0ahUKEwi_5KX7-qbJAhVHpR4KHcuQC7MQFggfMAA&usg=AFQjCNF38zkS42ZJdj9aa9ppYQWTKNwuMw

>>289140
I'm not going to read your thread because I know a bunch of /pol/tards are going to show up and claim all achievements were due to the white race being superior and Jared Diamond is full of shit.

Bad luck OP.

>>289368
I never watched the documentary, I only read the book, which would probably contain several times more information than a 3 hour documentary.

>You're buttdevastated for no reason.
Are you literally 18?

>>289140
It's incomplete. Its biggest flaw is to complete ignore the role of genetic determinism and the role of geography in shaping the genome, but it does raise interesting points about the role of geography in shaping civilizations.

>>289224
This tee bee eytch

>>289306
>Read carefully: culture
Read carefully : you have no evidence to back up that claim, whereas there is ample evidence of racial differences in average cognitive capabilities.

I know saying "culture" is encouraging because it means blacks can be "fixed", but that claim has no scientific basis to it.

>>289375
Jared Diamond is full of shit regardless.

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>>289140
I'm tired and lazy so feel free to dismiss me but I have a special dislike for all the determinist and geography based explanations of human civilization. I spent quite a lot of time in university writing about why I don't like this theory, why it is clumsy and paints with to broad a brush, how it overstates things. Yes I should explain myself more but I don't feel like it. I hate to sound like a /poltard but unfortunately these theories seem to me to be very based around proving a political point that is that Westerners deserve no credit for their achievements. These geography based theories seem to go to great lengths to try and shift the argument away from institutional or cultural explanations of why the west is dominant. Yes geography plays a role but ignoring culture, institutions and individual achievement is just being asinine

>>289443
Geography drove our evolution to a more intelligent race, meaning a seasonal and challanging climate, which in turn allowed us to become the most developed in the world.

>>289467
I think this is a good explanation, but Jared specifically ignores the "drove our evolution" part, unfortunately.

>>289292
It makes /pol/ seem like a smart and reasonable place, when the same subject written by someone from /pol/ would have been unable to toss in their half dozen unrelated biases and come off as manic.

The writer of that article would dump on /pol/ on all of their own historical mythmaking, too.

>>289140
The only real problem with Diamond's book is that he carves a path through history picking only one of many explanations - usually geographic - for certain events and unique qualities of civilizations.

Him ignoring cultural or other explanations don't automatically make geographic ones wrong, it's just unbalanced and biased towards that one kind of explanation.

>>289410
when will we as the white race collectively an hero and leave the world to the chinese ubermensch?

>>289546
>chinese
>ubermensch
pick one

>>289241
Anyway, Eurocentrism and European domination was because of industrialization.


Which is of course why Eyropean domination over the New World and Subsaharan Africa, as well as making signicant coerced gains in China, India, and the Persian Gulf all started in the Age of Sail, long before the Industrial Revolution.

>>289555
there is ample evidence that chinese come ahead in average cognitive capabilities.

>>289331
Those were the size of big dogs, though. Hardly what we would call horse today, and hardly agricultural engine material.

>>289602
They come slightly ahead, yes. They have an average IQ of 102 or 103.

I don't think this warrants the genocide of the white race.

>>289609
why not, when we are inherently inferor to them

>>289609
>I don't think this warrants the genocide of the white race.

Read carefully: you have no evidence to back up that claim, whereas there is ample evidence of racial advantages of chinese over whites.
It is thus factually correct that whites should be exterminated, as to make more room for the chinese supermen to advance humanity.

>>289336
>be wrong
>somebody says you are wrong
>nobody pays attention to you

Wow, that was hard. Meanwhile, Diamond has the support of many anthropologists and historians.
Just because he isnt one doesnt mean he is automatically wrong,

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>>289370
>Brief History of Modern Psychology by Benjamin Ludy
>Human genes and neoliberal governance: a Foucauldian critique by Antoinette Rouvroy

>>289140
>Youtube's CGP Grey just made a video using this book, Guns, Germs, and Steel by Jared Diamond.
But it didn't. Diamond didn't create the theory about domestication of animals between the Old and New World, he just made a popular book about it and other ideas from other people.

>>289270
how about, in addition to
> muh environment
we add
> muh systemic racism up to the 60s and beyond
> muh ghetto culture
and most importantly
> muh poor nutrition in utero because of poverty and awful awful processed foods
Now we have the perfect recipe for dumb american niggers, Through mostly whitey's actions, Also, gtf back to >>>/pol/

>>289618
>why not, when we are inherently inferor to them
Because of the way IQ is distributed over a bell curve. Just because the average is 1 or 2 points lower doesn't change the significant overlap between the asian and white bell curves. By the way, it's possible that the asian bell curve is narrower, which means that there are fewer asians in the "genius IQ range", which would be an ever better counter-argument against genociding the white race.

>>289619
>Read carefully: you have no evidence to back up that claim, whereas there is ample evidence of racial advantages of chinese over whites.
Right.

>It is thus factually correct that whites should be exterminated
Please point in my original post where I used the word "exterminate".

You redditors are hilarious. Anyone who doesn't believe in the blank slate is automatically an evil nazi who wants to kill sixgorrilion PoC.

Go fuck yourself.

>>289650
>Right.

You concede, then? I hope you will share your girlfriend with a chinaman, for the good of humanity.

>>289648
> muh systemic racism up to the 60s and beyond
Ashkenazi jews suffered from a millenia of regular pogroms and exhibit the highest average IQ out of any ethnicity.

> muh ghetto culture
A result of black behavior.

> muh poor nutrition in utero because of poverty and awful awful processed foods
Studies done on dutch children who were born during the 1944 famine shows no great dip in average intelligence. And these were children who developed in their mother's womb during a famine!

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>>289650
>all dem projections
>all dat cognitive dissonance

hhehehe

>>289666
>You concede, then?
I never denied that east asians have a slightly higher IQ than whites.

The funny thing is that, in your wish to show that asians are smarter than whites, you're implicitly admitting that niggers are dumber than anyone else, which goes against your anti-racist goals.

>I hope you will share your girlfriend with a chinaman, for the good of humanity.
I'm afraid I'm not a self-hating c.uckold like yourself. What is it with anti-racists and c.uckoldry?

>>289224
I want to hear about the zebras

>>289673
If you want to point out fallacies, you have to actually show those fallacies. Otherwise you're just committing the fallacy fallacy.

>>289680
>The funny thing is that, in your wish to show that asians are smarter than whites, you're implicitly admitting that niggers are dumber than anyone else, which goes against your anti-racist goals.

No, as I dont think asians are smarter than whites either. i am just showing you the faults of your logic.

IQ is a function of culture and environment, education and care, and not of genetics.

>>289686
>No, as I dont think asians are smarter than whites either.
But they are.

>i am just showing you the faults of your logic.
What faults?

Your "logic" is that, if a race is found to be, on average, of lower cognitive capabilities, it justifies the extermination of said race through forced c.uckoldry. That's not "logic", I'm afraid.

>IQ is a function of culture and environment, education and care, and not of genetics.
80% genes, 20% non shared environment.

>>289669
I don't even know why I'm answering this meme'd up mess. But here we go.
> Ashkenazi jews suffered from a millenia of regular pogroms and exhibit the highest average IQ out of any ethnicity.
because the ashkenazis, especially in western europe, despite opression and pogroms, maintained their foothold in trade and banking, because christianity forbade usury (until the Medici found the golden loophole)
> A result of black behavior.
not even dignifying this with an answer,
> Studies done on dutch children who were born during the 1944 famine shows no great dip in average intelligence. And these were children who developed in their mother's womb during a famine!
So one winter of hunger equals near constant malnutrition? Also, source.

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>>289140
>jared diamond
>credible

muh zebras, muh aboriginals anecdotes

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>>289712
>80% genes

>>289712
>80% genes, 20% non shared environment.

can we get a source on that specific precentage?

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>>289224
>Stormfags of course just dumb the whole thing down to something about zebras

>>289727
>muh zebras

Leftypol has been in this shit for so long, he became a prophet.

>>289727
god damnit, it's *this* idiot again. LOOK AT HIM AND LAUGH!

>>289247
>Whites arent more intelligent than blacks.

Not according to IQ tests

>>289724
>because the ashkenazis, especially in western europe, despite opression and pogroms, maintained their foothold in trade and banking, because christianity forbade usury (until the Medici found the golden loophole)
So because jews were bankers in medieval Europe, modern day jews will score highly on an IQ test? I didn't know that the occupation of your great great great great great great grandfather could affect your test scores!

>not even dignifying this with an answer,
Probably because you don't have any.

>So one winter of hunger equals near constant malnutrition?
We're talking about in utero development, which only lasts 9 months.

http://aje.oxfordjournals.org/content/147/3/213.full.pdf

>>289731
Nice meme.

>>289735
Sure.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heritability_of_IQ

Follow the citations.

>>289619
Just because you got BTFO doesn't mean you should go full straw man.

>>289763
i like how you used the
>I didn't know that the occupation of your great great great great great great grandfather could affect your test scores!
when you literally gave him that argument 1 post ago

>>289777
Just repeating his own claims to him, so he can feel how retarded they are.

>got BTFO
He assumed something, and I played along to show him its stupid.

>>289769
Not him, but linking to wiki for the citations is still linking to wiki, m8

>>289779
>when you literally gave him that argument 1 post ago
What?? Where? I think you might be a bit lacking in the reading comprehension department

>>289686
>IQ is a function of culture and environment, education and care, and not of genetics.

Do u have poofs?

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>>289769
This says that the heritability is 0% if all the test subjects have the exactly same environment, while it is very low if they have vastly different environment.

Its almost as if ghetto thugs and upper middle class white college kids have different environments.

>>289794
Obama is a nigger, and he is smarter than you are.

>>289798
>This says that the heritability is 0% if all the test subjects have the exactly same environment,
What? No it doesn't!

Are you so fucking retarded you are incapable of correctly reading a fucking wikipedia article? Please point out where that is said.

>>289801
Hawkins isn't a nigger, and he is smarter than Obama.

Do u have proofs that apply your notion to the general population without crying about (half-white) outliers?

>>289806
>>289798
Meant to write 100% if the same environment, and low if the environments are very different.
Dont get all triggered, it was obvious from context.

Now address the low heritability in very different environments.

>>289814
Hawkins cant even tie his own shoes, what makes you think he is smart?

>>289763
>http://aje.oxfordjournals.org/content/147/3/213.full.pdf
A study from the 60's. Hm. Anyway, the mother's and nutrition before conception is equally important, Chronic malnutrition is not (slightly) acute malnutrition, Lrn2biology.

>>289832
He can math.

>>289788
> Ashkenazi jews suffered from a millenia of regular pogroms and exhibit the highest average IQ out of any ethnicity.
Here you ginormous mental eunuch and archfaggot

>>289817
>Meant to write 100% if the same environment, and low if the environments are very different.
Still waiting for the quotation from the article, fucktard.

>Dont get all triggered, it was obvious from context.
It wasn't at all.

>Now address the low heritability in very different environments.
First, point to the sentence in the article, you insufferable moron.

>>289835
>A study from the 60's. Hm.
It turns out that in the year 2015 it's hard to measure the IQ of children born in the 1940s.

> Anyway, the mother's and nutrition before conception is equally important, Chronic malnutrition is not (slightly) acute malnutrition, Lrn2biology.
You've been talking a lot yet have not provided a single proof or citation. I don't think that's fair.

So from now on, I'm going to ask you to back up every single claim you make.

Prove that "the mother's and nutrition before conception is equally important,"

>>289852
Jesus, you're not very bright are you?

I was REFUTING the fact that past conditions had effects on IQ, by pointing out that the persecution jews suffered in medieval times had NO ADVERSE EFFECT on their intelligence.

Do you understand now, or is your tiny brain still confused?

>>289869
>Still waiting for the quotation

Sure.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heritability_of_IQ
Follow the citations.

>>289250
>>289250
>Jared Diamond is an ornithologist

>Bachelor of Arts in anthropology and history from Harvard College in 1958 and a PhD on the physiology and biophysics of membranes

lol, please stop posting before you embarass yourself more

>>289879
Good grief, you have just officially triggered me.

I asked for the quote from the article which you claimed said "This says that the heritability is 0% if all the test subjects have the exactly same environment, while it is very low if they have vastly different environment."

If you're unable to provide that quote, I'm going to conclude that you just made it up, because you're a stupid asshurt faggot who got blown the fuck out with facts and reason and thus is forced to niggerish underhand tactics in order to not lose face and be a "real nigga".

Now go slit your wrists, no one will miss you.

>>289140
From what i got from the book the middle east was perfect for the start of civilization due to its climate and biodiversity and then spread civilization to certain areas that would have had trouble developing civilization on their own (like northern Europe for instance)
After the initial spread of civilization some of the same factors that helped early civs hindered them later (such as the overly harsh terrain in the Himalayas, the middle east was very open to trade as well as to invasion,India and china while massive and rich were very isolated)
Europe on the other hand sat right on the Mediterranean and Atlantic which fostered a sea faring culture and remained isolated enough to limit foreign invasion (during the middle ages after the end of the vikings and the Magyar invasions western Europe would be pretty much secure and prospered as a result) combine the security and the sea faring cultures and u get a desire for exploration.
Lastly i would argue the political division of Europe was a major factor in birthing competition and further driving technological developement

>>289895
I am still waiting for a quote about the 80% genetic heridability of intellect.
In fact I am waiting longer, while entertaining your stupidity in the meantime.

>>289895
I'll miss him. He was a good nigga before the white man brought him down.

>>289785
>>289798
>>289895
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.udel.edu/educ/gottfredson/30years/Rushton-Jensen30years.pdf&ved=0ahUKEwi_5KX7-qbJAhVHpR4KHcuQC7MQFggfMAA&usg=AFQjCNF38zkS42ZJdj9aa9ppYQWTKNwuMw
Read it nigga
IQ is mostly hereditary and only effected by pre natal conditions (drinking alcohol or taking drugs; not slight nutrition differences)
Parenting and enviornment has little to no effect

>>289336
>>289309
For fucks sake, how did this even become a thing?

Diamond is LITERALLY educated as an anthropologist and has published many, many peer-reviewd scientific journals and spent months in New Guinea doing anthropology work. The fuck is wrong with you people?

>>289869
This a different study of the dutch famine, it correlates the timing of the famine to its effect on pregnant women and children concieved during different times of the famine.
http://www.nufs.sjsu.edu/clariebh/Dutch%20Study.pdf

Huh. Turns out nutrition is equally important before, during and after pregnancy as well. whoddathunkit. here's the study. You need to login with gmail to view it...
http://psycnet.apa.org/journals/dev/18/4/541/

>>289912
Are you clinically retarded? It's literally in the introductory paragraph of the wikipedia article I linked to you.

Since you're quite clearly of subpar intelligence :
>The general figure for the heritability of IQ, according to an authoritative American Psychological Association report, is 0.45 for children, and rises to around 0.75 for late adolescents and adults.[5][6]

>>289917
Thank you.

>>289936
Does this study show any adverse effects on intellectual development?

>>289917
Read, nigga >>289644

>>289869
>Prove that "the mother's and nutrition before conception is equally important,"

Is this for real? Its like I'm watching Mad Men with the smoking and drinking pregnant women.

>>289939
Since when does "between .45 and .75" mean 80%?
Are you clinically retarded?

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>>289952
>are /pol/tards for real

Yes, sadly.

>>289869
Also, BANG
http://www.genomebiology.com/2015/16/1/118
http://www.nature.com/ncomms/2014/140429/ncomms4746/full/ncomms4746.html
or in layman's terms
http://www.lshtm.ac.uk/newsevents/news/2014/mothers_diet.html

>>289945
Have you not read it? Or do I have to read it for you, and spoonfeed you relevant information?

>>289936
Well, the first study doesn't mention intelligence or IQ at all (not sure why you linked to it, probably because you're stupid) and I can't view the second study.

Hence why I'm asking you if you could copy paste the relevant parts for me, pretty please with sugar on top.

>>289952
important to intellectual development.

And we're not talking about smoking or drinking, we're talking about poorer nutrition.

Linking to a tv show does not constitute sufficient proof.

>>289953
.45 when they're children you fucking retard. In adulthood it's around .75. Most recent estimates put it at .80 which is why I said .80

You could PLEASE try not to act like a complete moron just this once?

>>289969
>http://www.lshtm.ac.uk/newsevents/news/2014/mothers_diet.html
Ctrl+F intelligence, no results

Have any studies actually relevant to the subject at hand?

>>290019
>Most recent estimates put it at .80 which is why I said .80

I would like to see a quotation for that.

>>290021
Sure

http://www.nature.com/mp/journal/v20/n1/full/mp2014105a.html

>>290031
Figure taken from "Genetic and environmental influences on general cognitive ability: Is g a valid latent construct?", where 80% is the outlaying maximum given.
It is UP TO 80%, not an average of 80%.

>>290019


> Ctrl+F intelligence, no results
That wasn't the study. The study was linked in the article. Also, THAT's how you read a scientific paper? ctrl+F?
> Have any studies actually relevant to the subject at hand?
I posted them. I'm sorry that the language may not be the most accessible, but there you have it.

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>>289680
>What is it with anti-racists and c.uckoldry?

I think we both know what group is obsessed with c.uckoldry.

>>290043
>That wasn't the study. The study was linked in the article.
Oh okay, my bad.

>Also, THAT's how you read a scientific paper? ctrl+F?
When I'm looking for a particular piece of information, yes, that's how I look for it.

Anyways, I ctrl F'd the study linked in that article, and once again no mention of intelligence. Showing the existence of epigenetics is not enough to refute the heritability of intelligence...
>>290042
Is english not your native language? Or are you just moronic?

The sentence : "Some evidence suggests that heritability might increase to as much as 80% in later adulthood" doesn't mean that 80% is an upper bound, it means that some studies have shown g to be as heritable as 80%

If instead of being a humongous faggot you had taken the trouble to click on the citation, you would have found this study : http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0160289614000099

whose results show that g's heritability is 86%

Now granted, different studies don't show the same exact result, but they usually average out around 80%

>>290079
Stormfags are obsessed with calling people c.ucks, but leftists are obsessed with engaging in c.uckoldry

>>290092
>whose results show that g's heritability is 86%

If you take the time to read more than the one paragraph tl;dr you will notice that THATS EXACTLY THE STUDY I LINKED YOU IMBECILE.
It says its up to 86% for people raised in very similar environments. So its 86% when environment is taken out of the equation.
For people in different environments its much lower. And unless you suggest that whites and blacks are raised in the same environment - culture, entertainment, diet, money, neighborhood, education, then you should stop posting numbers taken from the summary and learn to read.

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>>290099
Do you have a single fact to back that claim up?

>>290099
Must people here didn´t even know what c.cukoldry was before it exploded on /pol/ and stormfront.

>>290092
I'm not refuting it. All I'm doing is showing that, along with genetics, nutrition and culture are the main factors in determining inteligence of an adult or group of adults. And, as intelligence is both genetic and dependent on socio-economic factors, it's only normal for succesive generations of undernourished and undereducated people to breed increasingly less intelligent offspring. Have I explained it clearly enough?

>>290099
Given the fact that kekoldry, especially the kind that stormfags can't stop thinking about, involves the implicit affirmation of monogamy and of racial stereotypes that basically dehumanize blacks, I strongly doubt that.

>>290079
>me and my bruders watched nick for 14 hours
wat?

>>290113
>THATS EXACTLY THE STUDY I LINKED YOU IMBECILE.
You didn't link anything, you stupid faggot. Your response was "hurr durr follow the wikipedia link". Do you, in addition from having an abysmally low intelligence, suffer from short term memory loss?

>It says its up to 86% for people raised in very similar environments.
Where? Provide quote!

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>>290125

>>290116
I'm afraid I do not. I guess it's speculation.

>>290119
Are you 12? How could you not know what c u ckoldry is?

>>290120
>I'm not refuting it. All I'm doing is showing that, along with genetics, nutrition and culture are the main factors in determining inteligence of an adult or group of adults.
But I never denied that. The important factor, which you're willfully ignoring, is that every single study shows those environmental factors to account for no more than 20% of the variance in intelligence, while 80% of the variance is genetic in origin. That's a pretty big deal.

So yes, if you grow up in a crack den, your intelligence will probably be affected, but this is an extreme case, and most black people don't grow up in crack dens but in reasonably average households. The observed difference in average cognitive capabilities is mostly genetic in origin.

>. And, as intelligence is both genetic and dependent on socio-economic factors, it's only normal for succesive generations of undernourished and undereducated people to breed increasingly less intelligent offspring.
But that's simply not true. Intelligence is influenced by the current environment, not the environment of your great grandparents. Your great grandparents could've gone to Auschwitz, if you grow up in a healthy environment you won't suffer any adverse effect from the suffering of your great grand parents.

>>290142
I like how that pic leaves out how there is any kekoldry in the show.

>>290152
>Are you 12? How could you not know what c u ckoldry is?
Different anon here, I learned what it is on /pol/, too, no one irl, or in other places on the internet, talks about it, ever. You may be living in a bubble.

>>289224
>That would require reading other books.

Like what?

This whole thread is pretty trash so it would be nice to get something constructive out of it.

>>290152
>Are you 12? How could you not know what c u ckoldry is?

Because it´s niche fetish for people obsessed about the fear of race-mixing? Most people over the age of 12 aren´t aware of inflation porn either.

>>289306
>>289648
>this amount of damage control

>>290162
>I like how that pic leaves out how there is any kekoldry in the show.
I know a guy who was in one of the episodes. He said the show was really weird subliminally.
>>290180
Nickelodeon is actually known for pulling subliminal programming, as well as child abuse.
I think in one of the scenes there is a picture of a white infant with a cancel sign over it.

>>290202
>I know a guy who was in one of the episodes. He said the show was really weird subliminally
Oh, ok, if you say so, I guess I stand corrected. You fucking retard.

>>290202
All children's TV is absolutely fucked subliminally. Look at Dan "My Boy Freud" Schneider

>>290152
>>>290125
I can't tell if you're trolling or serious. You posted one study. I don't believe you understood what it said. You keep touting the 80% number which is an absolute maximum. An average would be 60%. And I doubt you know what heritability means. Heritability is a statistic used in breeding and genetics works that estimates how much variation in a phenotypic trait in a population is due to genetic variation among individuals in that population. Genetic variation is different from genotypic inheritance.

>>289140

His videos are very aesthetically pleasing and very informative.

>>289362
Syphilis did. But it's still not a plague.

>>290212
Well, his name is Froy; he was on like a month ago or something.

>>290242
cont.
Again, in layman's terms, heritability is correlation between the population's intelligence and the offspring (individual)'s intelligence. That's why it's variable as the age of the individual progresses.

>>290291
Oh, Froy, of course.
Jesus Christ, it's not like I watched that show, but your case that it promotes...anything whatsoever is extremely shaky, nah, nonexistent.

>>290152
>Are you 12? How could you not know what c u ckoldry is?

Because you fuckers have no idea how isolated you are.

>>290332
In regards to intelligence, of course. Many other threads are heritable.

>>289644
>game of thrones
>atlas shrugged
>pink floyd
>kanye west
>boyhood
>comics, anime, cartoons being considered "great achievements" instead of ideas or architecture

what redditor made this?

It's written from a biased perspective and he looks for evidence that confirms his preconceptions, which makes it trash in its entirety.

I'm not going to make any assertions with regards to significance but cultural and biological absolutely do play a role, you'd have to be delusional to think otherwise. Radicals exist on either side of the spectrum, not just /pol/tards.

>>290354
Giving a personal context m8.
No need to get booty blasted.

>>290396
>what redditor made this?
It's probably made to ruse idiots like you with high opinions of themselves but with an absolute lack of critical thinking skills.

>>290402
Doesn't change the fact that you're claiming things you can't back up.

>>290429
That there is subliminal programming?
Or that the show contains aspects of kekholdry.
I've seen the /pol/ image macros and stuff (spammed here).

>>290242
>I can't tell if you're trolling or serious
I'm completely serious.

>You posted one study.
Among many

> I don't believe you understood what it said.
I do believe I understand quite well

>You keep touting the 80% number which is an absolute maximum.
It's not an absolute maximum, it's the result of most recent studies.

>An average would be 60%
An average would be 80%

>And I doubt you know what heritability means.
Why?

>Heritability is a statistic used in breeding and genetics works that estimates how much variation in a phenotypic trait in a population is due to genetic variation among individuals in that population.
Correct.

>Genetic variation is different from genotypic inheritance.
Sure. How does that disprove anything I have said?

I'm trying to figure out what mental gymnastics are going on in your head which transform "IQ variation is mostly genetic in origin" to "IQ is not genetic in origin".

>>290396
You forgot video games

>>290432
Both.

>>289608
I might be wrong, but aren't modern horses only this big because man domesticated them and selectively bred them? Those natives could have done the same.

>>290449
No, even wild horses of the same species are bigger.
Those were just a different species of the same family, and they were tiny.

>>290440
Ok I've had enough of this. I NEVER said intelligence is not genetic. Also, IQ is a sketchy way of measuring intelligence. You have failed to counter ANY of my arguments. What have you said exactly? That intelligence is exclusively genetic? You've miserably failed at that. That black people are inherently and irrevocably less intelligent than whites? You've failed at that too. The reality of genetic variation does not imply a fully genetic origin of intelligence. I'm tired of arguing with you. You have very lirrle understanding of science and it shows.

>>290490
Can you wrap your head around the fact that heritability is VARIABLE with age? Can you understand what that means? If not (and it appears so), stop wasting my time.

this >>290504 was meant for >>290440

>>290490
>IQ is a sketchy way of measuring intelligence
No it isnt. It is the best measure of actual intelligence we have. But I'm sure some anon on a Mongolian finger painting board says otherwise, it must be sketchy.
>blacks are less intelligent than whites
There is no one unified "black" racial group. Africa is the absolute most diverse continent and American blacks are mixed beyond any recognition.
However I'll link it again,
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.udel.edu/educ/gottfredson/30years/Rushton-Jensen30years.pdf&ved=0ahUKEwifp7PgpqfJAhUQ42MKHWK5D-QQFggfMAA&usg=AFQjCNF38zkS42ZJdj9aa9ppYQWTKNwuMw

>>289140
>babby's first Annales

>>290490
>Ok I've had enough of this.
Me too. Could you please stop shitposting?

>I NEVER said intelligence is not genetic
Assuming you're the person I've been conversing with since the start (it's hard to tell given this is an anonymous board), you have indeed said many times that the environment is the major factor in the development of intelligence.

>. Also, IQ is a sketchy way of measuring intelligence.
It's really not.

> You have failed to counter ANY of my arguments.
Kek, what arguments? A paper about epigenetics, completely unrelated to intelligence is not an argument.

>What have you said exactly? That intelligence is exclusively genetic?
Jesus, no, in case you missed it, I said it was 80% genetic. Do you suffer from short term memory loss?

>That black people are inherently and irrevocably less intelligent than whites?
Yes.

>You've failed at that too
Well I didn't even try to venture down that road, since you're DENYING that intelligence is largely genetic in origin in the first place! I could post any number of studies showing cognitive differences between the races and you'd just respond with trivialities such as "oh but it's because of muh environment!!"

>The reality of genetic variation does not imply a fully genetic origin of intelligence.
What part of "80%" don't you understand? Jesus fucking Christ. 80% is more than 20% THAT'S what's important! Intelligence is OVERWHEMINGLY determined by genes.

> I'm tired of arguing with you.
I suspect it's because you're tired of getting BTFO.

Before you leave I want to once again repeat myself so that these following words stay etched in your brain and perhaps cause you to change opinions : intelligence is overwhemingly (80%) determined by genes.

>You have very lirrle understanding of science and it shows.
Oh please, you haven't disproven a single one of my claims.

>>290504
>Can you wrap ... with age?
That's correct. But what does that have to do with anything?

>>290555
Don't bother.

He's been shown various studies which clearly prove that intelligence is largely genetic in origin, yet he still clings on to the belief that intelligence is mostly determined by the environment.

He's a fanatic, I don't think anything can change his mind.

>>290555
>There is no one unified "black" racial group. Africa is the absolute most diverse continent and American blacks are mixed beyond any recognition.
Of course. Race is a pretty non scientific concept as far as human biology is concerned. But Jensen & Rushton use that terminology and classification for the most part, which makes me kind of look aschew at their work.

>>290645
>Race is a pretty non scientific concept as far as human biology is concerned.
Not really. Could you please not talk about things you quite clearly know nothing about?

>>289331
That actually happened all over the place. Most animals were domesticated in one place, then spread all over. The only problem is that the Americas were too isolated from the rest of the world to get them.

>>290655
Yawn.
http://pages.ucsd.edu/~jmoore/courses/anth42web/CartmillRaceConcept1998.pdf
Could you please tell me what your academic background is? I know we're on an anonymous indonesian crocheting image board please don't say "anthropology" "genetics" or "biology" because it's clear that you have very little knowledge of any of them.

>>290606
> various
> one
riiiight.

>>290598
>What part of "80%" don't you understand?

What part of UP TO 80%, in cases where ENVIRONMENTAL DIFFERENCE DONT EXIST.
Thats an absolute best case scenario in the vacuum of laboratory. Its not something you can expect at the tests for university entry.

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>>290696
>a paper from 1998 by an anthropologist
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAA

What's next, gonna cite Lewontin?

Get with the times faggot.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_genetic_clustering

>Could you please tell me what your academic background is?
I'm a grad CS student.

>"anthropology" "genetics" or "biology" because it's clear that you have very little knowledge of any of them.
I probably have a greater knowledge of them than you, since I don't waste my time reading 15 year old outdated papers.

Anyways, all this to say, that human groups as defined through human genetic clustering overlap (shocking!) with the traditional definitions of races.

And what's your background, btw? And you failed to answer this post : >>290598 (I'm really starting to suspect you suffer from short term memory loss).

>>290645
It actually isnt. The problem is anthropologists over stepping their field, there are quite literally thousands of races, and hundreds of subspecies(closely related races).
Probably tens of thousands of races have gone extinct.
Anthropology is the one fucking racalism up. That and hell bent fascist egalitarianism. >>290701
Mate read the beginning conclusion of wikipedia for the heredibitlity of IQ.
Twin studies also conclude it is predominantly hereditary and pre natal care is the largest "outside" factor.
We're talking about mama downing wine coolers while prego. Or pumping heroine with a bun in the oven.

You claim you've never seen such things but also refuse to go and look yourself.

>>290701
Several are linked to on the wikipedia page alone.

>>290708
>What part of UP TO 80%, in cases where ENVIRONMENTAL DIFFERENCE DONT EXIST.
Again with this! PROVIDE QUOTE! I asked this many posts back : >>290128

>Thats an absolute best case scenario in the vacuum of laboratory
This is absolute horseshit considering the studies in question survey biological twins adopted into diverse environments. Do you even read the studies I provide you? Or do you write your posts based on your "feelings" and "hunches"?

Please make an effort.

>>290715
I'm currently working towards a master's in ethology. Previously studied zoology.
> 15 year old outdated paper
> his main contending points were a 10 year old paper and a 55 year old work on the dutch famine.
> computer science
Well.

>>290761
>I'm currently working towards a master's in ethology. Previously studied zoology.
Well perhaps you should stick to animals, because you quite clearly know nothing about humans.

> his main contending points were a 10 year old paper and a 55 year old work on the dutch famine.
Both of which you were unable to refute. As for the the heritability paper, there is a wide amount of similar papers on the internet, many of which are handily linked in the wikipedia page I linked over and over again.

Do you have anything left to say?

>>290761
Famine is an extreme condition, none of which the "impoverished" blacks in America are in condition of.

>>290730
>This is absolute horseshit considering the studies in question survey biological twins adopted into diverse environments.

And those show different IQs, because environment is important, you worthless sack of shit.
Stop reading only the summary of your article.

>>290774
No. It's like talking to a brick wall. But I will leave you with these:
http://www.researchgate.net/profile/Andreana_Haley/publication/8997472_Socioeconomic_status_modifies_heritability_of_IQ_in_young_children/links/0deec516b9271c1c48000000.pdf
http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/beautiful-minds/the-heritability-of-intelligence-not-what-you-think/
http://www.researchgate.net/profile/William_Dickens/publication/11956815_Heritability_estimates_versus_large_environmental_effects_the_IQ_paradox_resolved/links/0046352bf043bd1665000000.pdf

>>290774
>many of which are handily linked in the wikipedia pag

And many of which circlejerk each other, because there are only 1.5 papers proving what you are saying, and they are all older then me.

>>290843
>blogs

>>289140
From what i got from the book the middle east was perfect for the start of civilization due to its climate and biodiversity and then spread civilization to certain areas that would have had trouble developing civilization on their own (like northern Europe for instance)
But after the initial spread of civilization certain areas that were perfect before lacked factors needed for further development

>>290851
Basically easy start, but limited potential.

>>290774
So now that you've won the shouting match you're free to go back to /pol/ and claim another great victory for the right wing inteligentsia

>>290848
that blog has studies in it, but it's clear by now that you haven't even read the paper you keep shoving in our face too well.

>>290864
Recent studies suggest that family and parenting characteristics are not significant contributors to variation in IQ scores,
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heritability_of_IQ
It's pretty simple m8.

>>290878
*linked from it

>>290878
>>290881
I have read Rushton Jensen many times, at best the critism boils down to
>Das rayycis
Or
>THEY DIDN'T INCLUDE EVERY ASPECT OF ENVIORNMENT SO IT IS FALSE

>>290880
>Recent studies suggest that family and parenting characteristics are not significant contributors to variation in IQ scores

Where is the source?

>wikipedia article linking to 5 news reports that all link to the same heavily critiqued and dated research

Alright.

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>>289264
>his father, Louis K.
>father Louis
>Louis
I wonder if that K is for Kuck

>>290900
>Colbert
>not Oliver
DROPPED

>>290890
Beaver, KM. (2014). "A closer look at the role of parenting-related influences on verbal intelligence over the life course: Results from an adoption-based research design.".Intelligence46: 179–187.

It's not a news article.
Wikipedia is a left leaning site, you'd be hard pressed to find them admitting to the heredibitlity of IQ.

>>290887
I've had enough of this. You keep shouting the same thing, over and over again, You're either a fanatic or a very persistent troll. I've given you articles that counter your paper. You have yet to refute them. Fuck off you IRL griefer.

>>290926
>A closer look at the role of parenting-related influences on verbal intelligence over the life course: Results from an adoption-based research design
By K.M. Beaver, a "criminologist"

>>290887
Are we dropping irrelevant quotes? Here is one:
>the pious hope that by combining numerous little turds of variously tainted data, one can obtain a valuable result; but in fact, the outcome is merely a larger than average pile of shit.

Its from a peer review of your source.

Also disagreeing, a bit more formally, are
>Harpending, H. 1995. Human biological diversity. Evolutionary Anthropology
>Graves, J. 2002. The misuse of life history theory: J. P. Rushton and the pseudoscience of racial hierarchy. In Race and Intelligence: Separating Science from Myth
>Lieberman , L. 2001. How "Caucasoids" Got Such Big Crania and Why They Shrank: From Morton to Rushton.
>Holloway, Ralph L. 2008. The Human Brain Evolving
>Anthropology News, February 2000

Additional reading.
>http://journals.plos.org/plosbiology/article?id=10.1371/journal.pbio.1001071

Regardless, you keep posting the same shit, all the time, despite people disagreeing and posting numerous alternatives.
You arent going anywhere, and remind me of one other faggot who was arguing in the exact same way, always reposing one wiki article. He was trying to convince people that IQ testing is an accurate measurement of all kinds of intellect, including artistic, creative, social and so on. Basically if you score high on IQ tests, you are good at all things, and if you score bad you cant be good at anything.
Are you this same person? Might want to use a tripcode so I can avoid you.

>>290948
You're not even funny anymore

>>290972
The cavalry has arrived. Thanks, m80, I was getting tired throwing studies at the guy to no avail. But don't think you'll fare any better.

>>290972
No.
Low scoring IQ is actually very accurate of initial intelligence
However anything above 110 or 120 becomes wildly inaccurate because you're answering questions faster than you can verbalize them.

>>291240
IQ tests are meant for your logical, mathematical and linguistic skills, which are tied together.
All other forms of intelligence arent tested.

You arent asked to draw, or to recognize and mimic sounds, or to quickly learn to fiddle something in your hands, or to play a new instrument and so on.

Basically IQ tests are there to test if you are good STEM material.

>>291299
You've never taken an IQ test have you?
Also STEM material is pretty primal evidence of intelligence, as math is a universal language science is just applied maths.
There are other "intelligence" tests for "EIQ" or "Verbal IQ", however those with good base IQ can quickly pick up games like chess, and as you said, play an instrument

>>291299
>fiddle something in your hands
That's called dexterity anon. Not intelligence

Jewish scholars can't be trusted when writing about race. That issue carries too much emotional weight for them to be unbiased about it, they will always try their hardest to prove that race doesn't exist, since the last political movement that was obsessed about scientific definitions of race destroyed the Jewish population of Europe.

So you have Richard Lewontin, Stephen Jay Gould, Ashley Montagu, Noah Rosenberg and other scientists who are very good at their respective areas becoming completely retards when not outright malicious liars, when dealing about race and sociobiology. It's a pity.

>>291327
Are you implying that there exist no people who are good at math, but bad at drawing and music?
And that there are no people good at art, but bad at math?

>>291332
Hand dexterity if a function of intellect. Its brainy work like no other and requires great coordination and thinking.

>>291332
This is usually how it is:
Anthropology and Sociology says, IQ is not reliable.

Biology and Geneticists says, IQ is very reliable.


I'd go with the latter.

>>291352
...
I can't remeber his name, but this guy got a doctorate in mathematics and went on to compose some of the greatest music ever written.

Anyway, you're speaking of educated status. Not intelligence.
Anyone can learn to paint or play an instrument, it is simply to any advanced degree

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>>291372
>soft sciences trying to compete with the real stuff

>>289140
>CGP reddit

>>291388
>intelligence
>real stuff

Its a man made thing, to rate men. It isnt some volume of X chemical in your head.

What do they ask you, more or less, on an IQ test? I met this dude who is in mensa and he judged that I should totally try to enter too. "You will meet a lot of interesting people" he said.

To be honest I'm probably too socially autistic to have a real desire to join, but it got me interested.

>>291452
math, logic, and comprehension of english language

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>>291468
I've only seen IQ tests that look like this.

>>291468
>comprehension of english language

I take it for granted that the language changes depending on the country, of course.

>>289644
I don't care if your pic is troll, it fucking triggered me. Thanks for that.
>>289602
Coming from a chink, what sources? IQ tests are just so bullshit. They don't test intelligence as much as education.

As, to OP, I do feel that it is a simplified version of history. I'm not a historian, but from what I understand, some of the facts are cherry picked and others are improperly represented. I don't like the way he put Gun, Germs, and Steel as the Bible of history, when it is pop history. It is a catchy theory, but I don't feel it went far enough, though as it is, it still was over 10 minutes of material.

It's a good video desu senpai.

dem frames

>>291809
>IQ tests are bullshit
You must be mentally retarded then, because that's what it can be used to measure.

>>289224
>It does not explain why Europe came to dominate instead of other parts of Eurasia

To be fair, other parts of Eurasia *did* dominate, depending on which period of history you're looking at. Other than that, good post. Too bad this topic is too loaded for serious discussion.

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>>291452
>I met this dude who is in mensa and he judged that I should totally try to enter too

Mensa is pretty much a scam to take your money in return for making you feel special. Take the test if you want, it's just looking at a bunch of patterns and working out what comes next.

>>289224
Asians and whites have neanderthal DNA, sub saharan africans have no neanderthal DNA.

pretty much ancient human + neanderthal = modern humans
ancient human + dicking around in africa= Africans

>>289241
yeah those brits sure did use all that coal to set up colonies all around the world in their ships that ran on wind power (sails)

wew lad

>>292101
"Look, Mom, I got a 150 on my IQ test!"

Sorry I shit on your one achivement in your life.

>>292414
B-but race is just a social construct!

>>290179

After Tamerlane is a pretty good one.

>>292491
>attend a private university
I have many achivements yet to come.
I'm sorry you can't drop of the hat say "IQ doesn't matter", and expect someone to not call you a retard.
Anything above 120 has no real accuracy btw.
By that point you're answering things faster than they can be verbalized

>>290099
why are stormfags so obsessed with the big black cock? Seems mighty suspicious to me.

>>289140
From a little bit of my time wasted on the web, I've come to the conclusion that this book is popular among upper middle class white liberals and no one else.

Right-wingers don't like it because it devalues culture and their sense of American exceptionalism. Far-right doesn't like it for obvious reasons.

But the Left wing hates this book too. They see it as cleansing history of imperialism and exploitation, simply claiming that Western Europe is the best out of random luck.

Basically no one is happy with this book except some centrist to center-left folk who feel like it puts everything in the past to rest, and by extension the present.

>>292526
>attended a private university
Unless you are on full scholarship, enjoy pissing away your money.

IQ tests are bullshit money grabs that test makers push to make you feel better. The next thing you will be saying is that SAT scores matter.

>>292600
They matter for getting accepted into college.
They tell you how much you've actually learned and retained.
Also it's on my families money, only 32k a year and well worth it as its held in highest regard in the sectors I'm looking at working in

IQ tests are not bullshit.

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>people start in Africa
>migrant groups traverse the world slowly, pockets of people end up in Europe, the Middle East, and Asia
>tens of thousands of years go by
>Europe is cold, mountainous, forested, and largely devoid of the same degree of natural flora and fauna some of the warmer parts of the world exhibit
>over time, only the most resourceful and forward-thinking European tribes survive as they have figured out how to weather the danger and barrenness of winter
>this process takes 50,000+ years and works through an Ice Age that sees the European bloodline severely bottlenecked (and prone to selection stressors)
>the population stays small and meager compared to the booming and lush civilizations that spring up in the warmer parts of the world
>then the advent of agricultural technology happens
>European population begins to climb
>once the population starts to match other global regions technological development begins to skyrocket
>Europeans, bred out of thrift, resourcefulness, agency, and foresight, voraciously work on tech., travel the globe, start colonies to maximize profits, etc.

I don't see why this isn't regarded as a factor. It's right fucking there. It's not that Europeans and, say, Africans are a different species, but if you arbitrarily select one group of people, in one region, put a stake in the ground, and compare them to another arbitrary group of people in another region, one is going to be better than the other at something, that's just it. Be it culture, genetics, a combination of the two, whatever, you can't willingly disregard it just because you want to pursue some butthurt fantasy about blind, random luck.

The only people who are flustered by GGS are people who put it up on a pedestal as if it were the one and only opinion on history.

>>292641
>getting accepted into college
>something to be proud of
Unless you are growing up in an Asian country, where it is actually something competitive to get into, it isn't an accomplishment. You have to try hard NOT to get into college, the way things are in the US.

Find me a single repudable source that says IQ tests aren't bullshit. No, the people selling you the IW test aren't reliable.

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>>289140

>>292659
I don't think anyone but the most "progressive" outright disregard what you stated. Most people just qualify what you stated, into saying that it isn't just due to the "white man" being the best naturally that they came to dominate a huge era of world history. There are definitely other factors at play.

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>>292774
>people still post this even after its been debunked hundreds of times

>>292794
Not him, but what are the debunking posts?

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>>292794
>its been debunked hundreds of times

>>292774
The only point that's actually correct here is #5.

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It ignores the Holocene extinctions and Pleistocene extinctions that line up with the decline of the Ice Age and the rise of humans that caused many extinctions in the Americas (as well as around the world). The Americas had species of horse that went extinct that are generally ignored.

In Eurasia there was the Aurochs which was a large ox that was the ancestor of cows and quite similar to the buffalo in size.

>>292811
Urban populations are less intelligent than non-urban/rural populations? Isn't intelligence, especially back then, based almost exclusively on their environment?

>>292816
What evidence is there that large placental mammals in North America were wiped out by humans and not climate change?

>>292754
Find me a single reputable source that says IQ IS bullshit.
You don't make a negative claim and tell me to disprove it fuck head.

And no, getting into a small classical liberal arts school that accepts no state or federal money is not easy to get in to.

>>292827
I don't have a source on hand, but generally the populations of animals declined as human populations moved in.

I don't need to discredit Jared Diamond as that has been done enough and by people better at it and more educated that me.

>>292829
>google "are IQ tests reliable?"
>literally 100% of the sources say 'NO'

Getting into outright? Debatable. Transferring in Sophmore/Junior year as long as you aren't a fuckup? Easy as shit.

>>292842
It is my understanding that the extinction of large mammals in North and South America coincided with the widely fluctuating climate at the end of the ice age.

>>292847
>literally
Yeah fuck off.

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>>292847

lol

you're fucking retarded

http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/science/2014/04/what_do_sat_and_iq_tests_measure_general_intelligence_predicts_school_and.html

If you hand me 2 groups of 10 resumes, with nothing else but IQ score listed, and the first group outscores the other by 15 points average, I'm taking that group fuckwit

>>292804
I'm not going to type out a whole essay because I don't have the time for that shit, but I will cover some of the wrongest points.

1. Europe and China were not isolated from each other at all, they've had contact via trade since at least Rome. Only by middle-men, sure, but that still allows for the exchange of resources and ideas. Also, the steppe is hardly a barrier, it's been inhabited by nomadic tribes for centuries.

Meanwhile, most of Sub-Sahran Africa is extremely cut off from the rest of the world. The Sahara Desert prevents long-term contact between West Africa and Europe/the Middle East, West Africa can't maintain contact with Central Africa due to the Congo, and Central Africa can't maintain contact between them and Southern Africa because of the Kalahari. You may wonder why they didn't just use the ocean as a trade route, then, but Atlantic waters, especially those around Africa, are notorious for being very rough to sail in. Even European ships couldn't do it until the 15th century.

East Africa did have contact with the outside world, and they developed just fine - until European power shifted world trade away from them. What happened to East Africa is the same as what happens to a small American town when a new highway gets built and no one drives through the small town anymore.

4. Africans did domesticate those sheep, goats, and cattle. And whether Europeans hunted domesticatable animals to extinction is irrelevant, Europeans never domesticated any animals (except dogs) themselves. Pigs, goats, sheep, cows, horses, and chickens all came to Europe from the Fertile Crescent or China.

>>290843
I'm pretty drunk, so just gonna address your first link

>http://www.researchgate.net/profile/Andreana_Haley/publication/8997472_Socioeconomic_status_modifies_heritability_of_IQ_in_young_children/links/0deec516b9271c1c48000000.pdf

Funny how you completely ignored my post where I said IQ in young children is imprecise. It's as if you're deliberately avoiding my posts in the name of ideological reasons!

>>290846
Are you born in 2015?

>>290864
I've won more than a shouting match. I've won a thinking match.

>>292864
The steppe is a barrier as are the tribes that live there.

>>292848
But was it exclusive?

>>292864

1. But you're ignoring the fact that there were numerous and monumental barriers between Europe and the Far East, these middlemen were the same for both Africans and Europeans, so the point is essentially a non-point as barriers aren't exclusive to Africa at all, and arguably were more traversible. You do realize Arabs were involved with sub-Saharan Africans for a very long time, as were Egyptians, by means of the same kind of cultural and national continuity?

>Europeans never domesticated any animals (except dogs) themselves. Pigs, goats, sheep, cows, horses, and chickens all came to Europe from the Fertile Crescent or China.

source: your asshole

>>292878
>The steppe is a barrier as are the tribes that live there.

What the fuck are you talking about? Those steppe tribes are the ones for facilitated trade between China and Europe.

>>292878
What?

>>292881
China isn't cut off from Indian Ocean trade. I don't know what other kind of isolation you are referring to because Indian Ocean trade and the silk road pretty much connected all of Afro-Eurasia aside from Sub-Saharan Africa.

>>289644
BOYHOOD? I LOVE BOYHOOD! IT TOOK TWELVE YEARS TO MAKE!

>>292928

u wot

>>292862
No shit? IQ doesn't have much to with intelliegence, just how much schooling they have gone through. And don't get me fucking started on how worthless the SAT test is. This is coming from someone that tutors that shit for side money, doing well on the SAT is just a matter of forcing a kid through prep that is only geared to test taking. People yjat score over 2k probably have taken the test in mock situations dozens of times. Compare that with a kid that barely breaks 1500 because it is his first time taking that test, and it is a no brainer who would do better.

>>292967

Every bit of moronic shit you just uttered is debunked in that article, with empirical evidence you useless fruitcake

>>292974
I feel that you completely missed my point. SAT scores correlate with how much the test taker's parents care about school. A family willing to spend thousands of dollars prepping their child probably has already nutured with good study habits. A family that doesnt really give a shit about education probably would balk at spending the ~50 dollars for their kid to take the test in the first place. The former family probably fought for their child to be in GT/Honors classes, while the latter family would just let their kid do whatever. It isn't God given intelligence that helps students score highly and do well on the SAT and your precious fucking IQ test in the vast majority of cases.

Aren't black and other minority groups making pretty decent gains in IQ compared to whites in places like the US?

And if your position that "The African race has lower inherent intelligence than any other" is true, what would you do with that if you were a policy-maker?

>>293002
*other minority groups that aren't Asian

While they are making gains, the existance of Affirmative Action pretty much states that some races are better than others by a large margin.

>>289727
People have tamed lions, tigers and bears as pets, how many police bears do we have?

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>>292878
>Steppe is a barrier

You're fucking kidding me right? It's like a fucking highway for anyone with a horse. No obstacles in the way.

>>293002
maybe more of them are actually engaging with the tests. it's pretty bogus to assume that some kid is going to take a test seriously because the dignity of his race depends on it

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>>292997

No. The correlation between income and your score is weak. Furthermore, plenty of poor score highly. Also, in the study they cited students who get prep only scored 30 more points on average than students who didn't, which is tiny.

You're also forgetting another thing. Intelligent parents care more about their kids. Intelligent parents beget intelligent children. Or are we forgetting that it is their fucking sperm and egg that said child is derived from?

It's obtuse as fuck to try to categorically deny the single strongest objective predictor of future income, happiness, and success we currently have in psychology, a field riddled with subjectivity.

And it's very unintelligent on your part to try to hand-wave it without any substantiation. But if you're going to cling to it by all means go ahead, you can join the scientologists and flat earthers.

>>293002

For one thing I wouldn't be ridiculous and push affirmative action based on the presumption of inherently equal ability. It's entirely unfair.

>>293028
life is unfair

>>293034

That was not an acceptable excuse when they barred black people from drinking at the same fountain.

>>293041
that wasn't the excuse though

>>293045

Am I talking to an 8 year old?

>>289201
>cholera
>London


It was from India.

>>293045
Hmm
What if we use reductionism on the original excuse?

>>293047
you're talking like one

>>293052
then you belong on /his/

>>293053

>>>/trash/

>>293061
yeah that's what i get for trying to suggest the other person is at all like an 8-year old. that's the level of discourse you are at

>>293048
The video didn't say it was from London.

>>293022
I didn't say anything about income. I said how much their parents cared about their education. A poor immigrant's child that comes home everyday to his parent's saying education is the most important thing will do better than frat boy whose parents don't give a shit what he does.

Yeah, so if you take the child of two crack addicts, and the child of two engineers, switch them at birth, you are saying that the buological child of the engineers will still do better in life? Nature vs nurture is an actual debate, but you put so much weight on the nature, it is hilarious.

I'm not handwaving it away. Tell me, did your parents ever push you to study? Did they get you into the GT classes, sign you up for some tutoring lessons, any sort of prep? Did they make sure that you did your homework each night, and did they expect you to make alla's?

>>293088

How are you going to quantify that buddy? And, I'll say it again, how can you say that it isn't more intelligent parents that care more about how their children does in school, or taking care of themselves?

I put weight on the nature because that is the single reason we arose from being tree clinging primates to the apex beings we are today. I'm a scientist first, fuck me right.

I didn't get any "prep" and I scored a 34 on my ACT. My parents were fairly poor. I've been working since I was 9 and have always been self-motivated as well as supported by my parents, hence my disdain for any a bloo bloo faggots who put a ton of weight on nurture. I have 3 siblings and all of us are around the same level of ability and naturally took to books.

>>292816
>beleriand.jpg

>>289303
Ottomans. The European states were not just competing with each other for the sake of it. As we all know, Columbus was trying to get to India, and there was a reason for that. The Europeans were once able to get to India, but once Constantinople fell, there was a large Ottoman Empire in the way. The Indians simply didn't care about Europe as much as Europeans cared about India.

Regardless, Indians still managed to get to Madagascar and developed extensive trade routes throughout South Asia. As well, India is a lot farther from the New World than Europe is.

My only question is why nobody, not even the good men over in Demak, Mataram, and the rest of the Indonesians never found Australia.

>>293116
You are a scientist caught up on your own ego and self importance. 10/10. Smarts aren't hereditary, and test scores in no way measure rout intelligence. Your Slate article only talked about college prepardness, and no surprise, children that are more prepped for college entrance tests are better college students. Im sure you think there is a how-good-are-you-in-college gene as well.

And given your reasoning of how we became primates -> humans, you definitely have a poor understanding of human history.

So you are saying the first and only time you looked at SAT/ACT material was on test day? Lol. Um, yeah, I'm a billionaire 6'9 basketball player at MIT.

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>>293222

>Smarts aren't hereditary

At this point I considered not responding to the rest of your post but I'll go ahead and respond for posterity's sake. Yes, they very much are. That is the basis of evolution along a sentient scale. Jesus didn't fly down and teach us how to be human beings.

>Your Slate article only talked about college prepardness, and no surprise, children that are more prepped for college entrance tests are better college students

No, it alluded to a lot more, but you only skimmed it, because you're a foolish dilettante who operates off the basis of his biased worldview first and foremost and hates the unpleasantness of reality outside of his safe space.

> Im sure you think there is a how-good-are-you-in-college gene as well

You might want to kill yourself

>And given your reasoning of how we became primates -> humans, you definitely have a poor understanding of human history.

I'll reiterate the last point

>So you are saying the first and only time you looked at SAT/ACT material was on test day

Yes, it's a very basic test that measures how quickly you can accurately answer questions derived from core concepts taught during the past 12 grades everywhere in the United States.

Why did you ever come here from tumblr again?

>>290396
The image has Assigned Male and Sinfest under comics. I'd suggest ignoring it.

>>293260
Much scientist, 10/10 ad hominem.

Really, please just go back to /pol/ if you are just here to shitpost.

>>293424
Why don't you go back to Reddit with your stale memes you turbo nigger?

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>>292421
Pic related addresses your point and is a decent companion to Jared Diamond, picking up where Guns, Germs, and Steel leaves off. Basically, Britain's shallow coal seams and high water table provided the impetus for steam power to develop there. At the same time, their control of India provided a cheap and plentiful source of cotton to spawn a textile industry, and a separate series of geopolitical accidents led to the institution of patents, allowing inventors to profit from their inventions.

Britain was a perfect storm of conditions for the dawn of industrialization, and their imperial competitors, mostly France and the Netherlands, had to copy them to catch up.

Before industrialization, Spain had a leg up on all the other powers from their New World gold mines. It was that cheap and easy source of wealth that allowed other European empires to overtake them in development, kind of like the effect plentiful oil reserves have on Middle Eastern nations.

>>293424
>>293462
Why don't you both just stay here? We all know that's exactly what you are going to do and there is no reason why you shouldn't.

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Why did no one else ever explore Australia before Europeans there

There were trade routes running through the Indian Ocean and there were many large civilisations that existed through out Asia and yet none of them ever explored Australia

It's literally just next to South East Asia, surely some Asian explorers would have run into it and then turned away and the records of this were lost to History. It just baffles me that no one ever bothered sending ships down the coast to see If It got better before the Europeans

>>293538
They no doubt did but:
A) They never drew maps nor wrote shit down.
B) Australia is a useless hellhole.

>>293507
>At the same time, their control of India provided a cheap and plentiful source of cotton to spawn a textile industry
That's putting it rather politely, the British dismantled the vast Indian textile industry and sought to relocate the production side to England. I believe it was a driving factor behind the industrial revolution, the timeline appears to correlate and it would give an additional impetus for the development textile machinery and ways to power them, though this is not my area of expertise.

>>293507
>Before industrialization, Spain had a leg up on all the other powers from their New World gold mines.
Silver, I think was more important than gold, the vast silver reserves of South America were fed into China, whose paper currency was abandoned due to inflation in favour of silver.

>>293558
>B) Australia is a useless hellhole.

The southern part isn't, and to me that says they never reached the southern part which means that if they ever did discover it, they turned around at some point which If they were explorers boggles my mind

>Discover coastline that goes for thousands of kilometres
>Turn around because you see nothing but rainforests (east coast) or desert (west coast)

>>293559
Right, the Brits were dickholes and applied mercantilism with extreme prejudice. I glossed over that bit to try to avoid various anons' reactions to implied white guilt.

Got any decent resources on Spain vs. China? I wasn't aware of that and always thought they just imported gold and silver directly to Spain, inflating their own currency and surrendering overseas trade to other powers.

>>293571
I think like you are putting yourself in their shoes. Every moment on the ocean is another moment you could die of drowning, scurvy, drowning, the pointy sticks of natives, and drowning. And what was the profit to you personally? NOTHING! It would be best to stick with trading fish for a little spice.

About the only pre Age of Exploration people that routinely discovered and settled knew lands across the ocean were the Polynesians.

>>293571
Well, Chinese explorers visited subsaharan Africa, but found that there wasn't anything worthwhile, so they turned around.

>>293538
iirc Asians did come to northern Australia to either trade or harvest sea cucumbers (can't remember which)

>>293614
*you aren't putting...

>>293619
>subsaharan Africa
Are we allowed to call the east coast of Africa "Sub-Saharan Africa"? In all things they were completely different. The East Coast of Africa was more like any other group of people on the Indian Ocean. "Sub-Saharan Africa" typically refers to the spear chuckers in the interior and on the western coasts.

>>293538

>try find people to trade with
>just savages who can barely construct huts

Hmm I wonder why the traders turned around

>>293994
It's an awful awful continent. All Australia has is uranium, bauxite, and coal. The rest of it is just awful.

>>292876
I've won more than a shouting match. I've won a thinking match.
AAAhahahhahah! No. No you didn't. You got BTF to the O. Drunkenness is not an excuse. Hell I was wasted when I started the discussion. You kept shouting the same bullshit over and over again."Muh Rushton&Jensen!". You said Wikipedia is leftist and untrustworthy but kept linking to it nonetheless. You've yet to adress any of the studies my fellow poster presented. You won nothing, Git out,

>>293196

Supposedly Zheng He discovered the northern tip of it but didn't care and left

>>291383
>I can't remeber his name, but this guy got a doctorate in mathematics and went on to compose some of the greatest music ever written.

Again, are you implying that there exist no people who are good at math, but bad at drawing and music?
And that there are no people good at art, but bad at math?

>>289306
>This also explains asian and jewish differences. Asians have a "study hard" culture, jews have a "get rich" culture.
And who develops those cultures?

>>294627
Environment and relationships.

>>289619
Or if we're going to go full /pol/-mode here, why not just exterminate the low IQ'd people of all races? Obviously blacks are going to be a lot fewer in numbers but the smart ones will still be around.

>>294637
Seeing how you'd need police and army to do this, and police and army are low IQ people, I dont see it happening.

While its possible for the low IQ people to kill off the high IQ people, the opposite isnt true.

>>294753
>intelligence is not heritable

whoever believes genes aren't crucial in intelligence are full of fkn shit

>>294487
None of that has anything to do with intelligence.
That is simply level of education.

>>289683
>saddle goes up, rider goes down
>you cant explain that

>>289724
Ashkenazi are mainly white converts to judaism from the 1st-2nd century BC from northern anatolia and caucasus regions anyway.

>>294915
One can then easily argue that ability in math, or language, or solving IQ tests, are also a function of education.
And since education has to do with environment, that intellect isnt heritable at all.

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Just gonna leave this here.

>>295124
And again, or the N-th time, the zebra is posted.
I really wish poltards would come up with new memes.

>>295124
It's already been posted and debunked, both in this thread and many times before. Please stop posting bad copy pasta.

>>294980
Except there is nothing to support that position

>>295151
Never been "debunked"

>>295164
From what I've seen, yes, several points are bad.

>>295163
The same logic you use is good for it.
Unless you can explain how ability to recognize and recreate music is a function of education and not intelligence, while ability to do math is a function of intelligence and not education.
Especially when music is much more natural to humans, compared to math.

>>295164
I know the point about Pizzaro is bullshit, which casts doubt in my mind on all these counter claims.
For the record, I think Diamond is a hack as well

>>295183
>I've never taken an IQ test
The post
>they are only a function of math
M8, anybody can learn to do anything, it's to what degree or speed.
You're making general claims to try and dismiss the most effective measure of intelligence we have, and it's not going to work.
Your Intelligent Quotient is not how educated you are, it is a measure of capability or capacity.

>>295206
>If I say "no" enough times, it will go away: The Post.

IQ tests are a measurement of capability of logic, math and somewhat language.
There is more to intelligence than those three (or two even, as math and logic are very connected).

You can be an excellent artist and score low on IQ tests, because they arent meant to measure that kind of intelligence.

>>295213
Good christ, you're doing nothing but saying "no" over and over.
Not me.
I hold the position that the intelligent Quotient measures our general intelligence.
Other "types" are highly inaccurate because the "goodness" of "art" is entirely subjective.

IQ is not a function of education.
The best you can conclude is that pre-natal conditions has a profund effect.

>>295230
Nigger, do you hear yourself?

Simple YES/NO questions:

>Do you think that high or low IQ has no effect on ability to produce art or learn skills?
>Do you think there exist people who are good at drawing, but bad at math?
>Do you think there exist people who are good at math, but bad at drawing?
>Do you think that if you take an intelligent person who has never had any form of education he will perform highly on an IQ test?


If when you are done answering those questions you still cant understand why you are wrong, you may have low IQ.

>>295248
None of your questions refute the ability of Intelligence Quotient.
>>295248
>Nigger, do you hear yourself?
>Simple YES/NO questions:
>>Do you think that high or low IQ has no effect on ability to produce art or learn skills?
IQ determines capacity or capability. You cannot quantitatively measure "art".
>>Do you think there exist people who are good at drawing, but bad at math?
Has nothing to do with IQ
>>Do you think there exist people who are good at math, but bad at drawing?
Has nothing to do with IQ
>>Do you think that if you take an intelligent person who has never had any form of education he will perform highly on an IQ test?
How would we know if they are intelligent if we don't test them? Magic? There are means of removing first time testing bias with those unfamiliar with tests.

Some anon on a Mongolian finger painting appreciation board doesn't refute the measure of Intelligent Quotient.

>>295330
You got refuted multiple times in this thread, and chose to ignore it.
And unless I am mistaken, you also got refuted multiple times in another thread, and also ignored it.

>>295617
>I claim you were refuted therfore I am
Look, you're not refuting me, you're trying to refute an instrumental testing process and science. An entire science.
Not just /me/.
Shut the fuck up faggot.

>>289648
>how about, in addition to
> muh environmentwe add
> muh systemic racism up to the 60s and beyond
> muh ghetto culture
>and most importantly
> muh poor nutrition in utero because of poverty and awful awful processed foods
>Now we have the perfect recipe for dumb american niggers
Minnesota Transracial Adoption study blows all of this bullshit right out.