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>Southeast Asian history What's with this region history

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Thread replies: 76
Thread images: 15

>Southeast Asian history

What's with this region history anyway? we rarely heard or know any about it
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>>281796
lots of trading
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>>281796
Wat
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been to Thailand last winter and their old building look like this.They have wars with Burma,Cambodia ( Angkor ) and Malay states in the south.It even have relation with France back in 15th century though

anyway that is probably what I know from that region.
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Oh man get this book it's really great and a part of history that is overlooked so much but is so fascinating
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>>281809
its like i'm really on /int/
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>>281796
what do you want to know op?
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>>281879

/int/ has been one of the boards pushing for a /his/

Are you really surprised that some /int/ellectuals would be here
>>
Long story short

>tribes
>Hinduism happens and trade/architecture explodes
>Buddhism arrives and displaces Hinduism
>More flourishing
>Islam arrives
>Decline followed by European colonization
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The Dai Viet kingdom conquered the Cham people to the south, creating roughly the borders that are Vietnam today.
>>
>>281796

Read "A History of Southeast Asia" by Arthur Cotterell.

Packed with info although the scope is quite broad.

Essentially you got religion from India, government from China, and trade between the two.
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>>282074
>religion from India, government from China, and trade between the two.


where does the muslim fit in these?
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>>282803
trade with Arabs.Thats why maritime Southeast Asians are muslims.
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>>282074
>Essentially you got religion from India, government from China, and trade between the two.
Only Vietnam has a Chinese style government. Thailand, Burma, Cambodia/Khmers were Monarchies. Indonesians/Filipinos/Malay peoples were a fuck-collection of tribal chiefdoms, small tribal kingdoms, Rajs, Sultanates, Hegemonies of the above mentioned, and three historic Thalassocracies.

And then you have the Badjau, who are sea nomads.

Of religion, Viets, Thais, eventually Cambodia and Burmese are Buddhist. Indonesians, Malaysians, and Philippine peoples were animist, and then hinduism arrived, and then said hinduism morphed into localized animism. Islam then arrived and made Ummas out of some of them,
>>
>>282074
>Essentially you got religion from India, government from China, and trade between the two.
U wot.

No, it was religion and government and everything else from India, except in Vietnam where government and religion both came from China (though their religion ultimately goes back to India, they adopted it in its Chinese form).
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>>282847
>>282836
>Vietnam

>religion from India

Pre-modern Viets were Daoists.

And many modern South Vietnamese refugee descendants are still Daoists.

And Daoism...is Chinese.
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>>282847
>>282836
>Vietnam

>religion from India

Pre-modern Viets were Daoists.

And many modern South Vietnamese refugee descendants are still Daoists.

And Daoism...is Chinese.

Source: I live in a neighbourhood full of South Vietnamese
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>>282855
Wasn't it more Mahayana Buddhism with Daoist influences?
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>>282871
No they worship Daoist gods like Caishen
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>>281902
>Decline
Southeast Asia was hardly in decline when the Europeans arrived. Well, most of them anyway

Vietnam is the Mini-China of the region. Burma and Thailand are having the time of their lives with the newly centralized governments and riches coming from trade networks from Japan to India. The Majapahit Empire is long gone but this led to the flourishing of the small city states like Moluccas in Indonesia. Brunei owns the whole of Borneo and even the relatively isolated peoples of the Philippines were slowly crawling to a semblance of civilization, headed by the Muslim Filipinos who were the regional powers.

Then Europe arrived.

If anyone is having it really bad, its the Khmers. They call the period from 1400's-1800's the Khmer dark ages.
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>>282877
That's just filthy Viet propaganda senpai

Khmer empire stronk
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>>282877

Don't pay attention to the person you responded to. Trying to paint the history in terms of religious significance and slander Islam at the same time clearly shows what their agenda was.
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>>282877
>Brunei owns the whole of Borneo


elaborate
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Cambodia is always mad
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>>282891
Bruneian Empire m8.

High times from the 1400's-1500's.

Even had feudal obligations form Filipino Muslim Rajas & Sultans.
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>>281809
don't dis Filipino swag, we r most powerful race
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>>282911
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>>281796
Circles and shit.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandala_(Southeast_Asian_political_model)
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The Philippine-American War was some crazy shit. Like a mini 1900 version of the Vietnam War.
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>>281809
>A literal fucking meme country
>Hating Catholics

Confirmed American and/or muslim
>>
Can anyone recommend any excellent books that cover the histories of SE Asia, particularly of Thailand and/or the Philippines?
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>>281809
Really, why do you even come here?
>>
>>281796
South Asian history is troublesome, because their records are a complete mess. The divergence point between history and myth is much closer to the present in that region than anywhere else.

There are plenty of places that seem to have been built no more than a thousand years ago that people say were built by the gods.
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>>283407
Philippines:
>Boxer Codex: Purdy Pictures of Southeast Asia, according to the Spanish (though the artist they hired was a Chinese guy)
>Sucesos De Las Islas Filipinas: Philippines during the pre-colonial/early colonial period, Spics & Flips adventures with Japanese/Chinese Pirates, Muslim tribes, and meddling in Vietnamese/Siamese politics.
http://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/7001/pg7001-images.html
>Blair & Robertson's Translation of the Philippine Isles. Spain's activities in Philippines/SEA from 1570-1811
http://kahimyang.info/kauswagan/Downloads.xhtml
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How sensible is to put those two areas under the same "south east asian" umbrella?

I don't know much, this I have to accept. But it looks like they're actually two different cultural regions who obviously had interactions but have a different ethos and history. Was this different in the past, before religion separated them?
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>>285973
Forgot map marking the two areas
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>>285973
They had far more interaction and friendliness more than East Asian States or South Asian ones do.

Its like an valley of neighborliness between mountains of hate.
>>
>>285983
Yes but friendliness doesn't mean anything. France and England spent most of their history fighting each other and they belong to the same western european cultural area.
>>
>>285995
Ok then:

In general: pretty much Indian-derived cultures dominated the area that sprouted on their own due to isolation from said indian subcontinent, but then so did Islam, and a huge influence from the Chinese, which heavily fell on Vietnam but also influenced greatly the Thais and the Burmese.
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Ayutthaya was one of the greatest cities in the world until the Burmese destroyed it, and the Thais are still mad about it.
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>>286022
Ayyuthayya
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>>285975
Maybe religiously, but Malaysia has very much in common with Thailand culturally. That's the impression I got from living there at least.
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>>281845
Thank you anon. I'll look for it tomorrow at work.
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Rogers and Hammerstein told me everything I need to know about SE Asia during the scene where the Siamese children are all shouting about Burma being small and weak
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Funny how nobody mentioned Singapore. Colonised by the British and invaded by Japan during WWII. Went from third world to first world in a single generation.
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I think one or two of the Vietnamese dynasties rank among the longest dynasties in history.

But I really don't know much about it, other than there was a thing called the Pagan Kingdom in Burma, the Champa kingdom in somewhere, and the most powerful kingdom in Thailand was the Sukhothai or something like that. And Vietnam was called Dai Viet for a while.

And that the guy who commissioned Angkor Wat was named Suryavarman. It's actually pretty weird how everyone on earth basically has at least heard of Angkor Wat, but basically no one can name the guy who it was built in honor of, or anything about the kingdom and society that Angkor was in. Everything's just focused around that one fucking building complex.
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>>282920
haha wtf I'm filipino and I'm flipping balls
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>>282905
But that isn't the whole of Borneo. That's only the coast of the island.
>>286493
They were put under immense pressure to be developed or they'd become a failed state.
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>>281796

The "women" have penises. Everyone else is too scared to go there.


The end.
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>>286615
Fuck off /int/ and take your epic memes with you
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>>281807
this. kek.
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>>286515
I believe it was the (second) LĂȘ dynasty, but they were only nominally in power for most of the reign. Two families exercised power, the Ngyuen in the newly acquired south and Thanh in the north. It was a fairly similar situation to Japan's where the families legitimize themselves as protectors of the throne.
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>>286515
>suryavarman
>surveyor man
coincidence?
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>>286622
this board wouldn't exist if it weren't for /int/ you fucking idiot
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>>286896
>le dynasty
>le
>>>reddit
>>
wtf even is/was Siam?
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>>286959
This website wouldn't exist without /a/, do you see people bitching about waifus here?

Keep your retarded /int/ faggotry to yourselves

Talking about leaves, loos, and debnts is shitposting
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>>287015
>This website wouldn't exist without /a/
that's how I know you're a retard.
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>>286999
Thailand.
One of those "never been abroad" americans? Would love to see you point it out on a map. Or better, point out your own state on a blank map. Fuck you.
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>>287091
we got a bad ass here
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>>287015
>do you see people bitching about waifus here?
that /int/ guy may be retarded, but actually yes, 90% of the boards have constant waifu threads
>>286604
>borneo

The interior was pretty much just a massive jungle, sparsely populated with nomads.
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>>287132
>implying, that there is alot of jungle left in Borneo
Rest of it will be gone soon too, because in the west we need to have cookies that last forever.
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>>286982
Don't blame me for /v/ietnam being leddit
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>>287178
see the keyword "was"

between the Transmigrasi and forest fires, it's all JUST
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Any good stuff on the Majapahit empire? Or is that not really SE Asia?
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>>281845
Love this book. Actually he does tend to labour the point a bit, but it's a fascinating insight into the region. If you're into critical history that looks at other things except "big men" this is a must.
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Here's the thing about SEAsia in this thread

people are talking about "Thailand, Cambodia, Myanmar" as if these places have always existed and are homogenous.

There are so many other ethnic groups in the region that have rich histories.

The Arakan had a huge cosmopolitan city on the bay of bengal
The Mons are responsible for bringing Buddhism to the region
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>>286042
Ayy lmao
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>>286022
Burmese word for Thailand is Yodeya
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As a Vietnamese guy, I know we're culturally East Asian due to Chinese influences but I hate it when people think we're Southeast Asian in culture just because of geography. Honestly, we're more like the Chinese than other SEA countries.

Pretty much the history of SEA is more local with not too much happening in the world scene, except when Vietnam gets occupied and beats out China 4 times (5 if you count the 1979 invasion). Also, Vietnam did some China tier conquest against the Chams. Took their land and breeded them out. Only 150000 ethnic Chams remain today. Cambodians are also still butthurt today because we took the Mekong area, and muh Khmer Empire.
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>>286022
That's what they get for fucking up Angkor.
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>>286493
Weren't they already pretty developed and prosperous for the standards of the area? Being an important merchant city and all that.
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>>287091
Not him, but I'm not american and I'm 90% sure that most people in the western world doesn't know that Siam is Thailand.
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>>287301
Looks like the successor to Srivijaya, which was essentially a colony of the Pala Empire. That's where their Buddhism came from.
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>>281796
Influence from the Indian empires to the western parts (Thailand, Burma, Malaysia), from the Chinese empires in the eastern parts (Vietnam, Phillipines).

Broadstrokes: It was basically Hindu refugees from the Maurya conquests that migrated there. Later the Buddhist Pala kingdom sent missionaries (mainly into Tibet) and some of them converted them. Later Muslim traders introduced Islam and managed to convert a few dynasties. (This is western SEAsia, don't know a ton about eastern SEA)
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>>281796
Irrelevant until they were conquered by Europeans
Thread posts: 76
Thread images: 15


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