>>7743845 >>7743885 Have neither of you heard of someone being stabbed by a screwdriver? Shit's nasty because it make a huge puncture wound, and it can be driven between ribs. Can easily be considered a deadly weapon.
>>7743790 You're the one acting like a punk on the internet.
Being a cop doesn't make you smart or brave or tough, and just because somebody isn't a cop doesn't mean they're dumb or cowardly or weak.
But for some reason, cops and military are always brainwashed into believing that they have a monopoly on manliness, and everybody else who isn't one of them will be crying in a corner when some shit goes down.
cops can be some of the biggest cowards. the worst part is that our society( I'm a american) glorifies its military and police rather than keeping checks on their power creep. cops believe they are ALL heroes, they shoot people in the street. military think they are ALL heroes, and they urinate on the corpses of foreign soldiers(i understand they were Muslim extremists).
our society needs soldiers to protect us internationally and police to protect us domestically. i don't disagree with that. im so happy and greatful that i live in a country where brave men and women are willing to protect me. but i am not ok with every member of our armed forces or police being called hero and having lax rules around them. the police and military need to be watched MORE than anyone else. Giving power to any individual can make them act stupidly, it doesn't matter who they are.
>>7745871 They do mock executions so many times over the span of weeks to months that the people just think it's another propaganda video where they have to read something condemning the West, Democracy, infidels blah blah blah, also they fuck with them not letting them sleep or keep them malnourished or they've been given a sedative beforehand, then when the blade plunges in they are helpless to stop it, last thing those fuckers want is to have a video of the hostage fighting back, they want to look like they are the masters of their "hostages" and have beaten them down or shown them they were wrong to oppose them. There was a haunting article in The Atlantic from a rescued prisoner and it was some of the same shit that the Vietcong and other terror groups have done over history, same shit, different decade and better cameras/video editing
>>7743586 >'PUT THE SCREWDRIVER DOWN' >Nigger is tazed, paralized, stunned and bleeding on the ground >Unresponsive >'PUT THE FUCKING SCREWDRIVER DOWN' >'SHIT HE AINT PUTTING THE FUCKING SCREWDRIVER DOWN' >'HQ WE NEED REINFORCEMENTS, I REPEAT, WE NEED REINFORCEMENTS'
>>7743742 >>7745165 >>7745720 >>7746041 just kill yourselves they got rid of a mentally unstable violent black man who I'm sure was gonna do wonders for the world if he was alive today fuck off and die all of you
>>7745153 I don't think you understand escalation of force and risk management. When you're put into a position where your life is in danger and you have to make a decision where you let someone rush you with a screwdriver or shoot them to incapacitate them and you make the opposite choice where you remain unstabbed by the man with a screwdriver who rushed you, then maybe you might have a case. Just maybe.
But until then, the least you can do is at least try to attach yourself to reality and the fact that people are put into these "escalation of force" scenarios that are put in place specifically to protect their lives so they can do their job.
I'm with the other anon, there's gotta be a lot of projection going on when you think they do it to prove how manly they are rather than to protect themselves.
>>7746227 oh the irony of this post is delicious >you want police officers to not act rationally when confronting this kind of threat?
so what happens when real criminals start acting violently? I dunno did you watch the webm? the cops were acting very rationally when they shot the guy who was charging at them with a screwdriver in a violent manner after being told multiple times to drop it I was merely trying to state that cops are only human and if you think they're dumb for telling a guy to drop the screwdriver after just shooting him then maybe you should sign up and show them how it's done instead of just flinging shit from behind a keyboard in a comfy safe environment
>>7746227 did the thought every cross your mind that maybe those two police officers didn't want to shoot that guy? Maybe if he had put the screwdriver down like he was told then he wouldn't have gotten shot? Maybe the police could have completed their shift and gone home put their feet up and relaxed like any normal day? no of course not because you're obviously some faggot who thinks cops are blood thirsty mongrels who had made up their minds to shoot that guy as soon as they saw him. Now they have to live down the fact they killed someone and how it will affect his family and loved ones. I wish more people like you would pull their heads out of their asses and actually think for once.
>>7746300 Tough shit. That's part of the fucking job. If he didn't want to be responsible for taking a persons life but still wanted to help people he should have been a fireman or a lifegaurd or even a mall cop.
A big guy like that stabbing you with a screwdriver? There's a great chance you'll be severely injured, and if you're unlucky, he could've hit something bad and you could die. Perhaps a taser would've been better, but you can't deny the cops' life was in danger. Why any idiot would try and attack a cop aiming a gun at you is beyond me. The lady did just tell them he was bipolar but I doubt they had the time to process the implications of that.
It's always interesting that there is actual fucking video of a guy coming out with a knife. The cops say DROP IT more than once. He lunges at them, he gets shot...
It's his fault.
End of story. You don't lunge at someone with a knife. You see idiots talking about non-lethal shit not realizing that tasers don't always work. If both prongs don't hit right you have no effect.
The guy was like 3 feet away WITH A KNIFE. Literally every police officer is trained to treat anyone withing TWENTY FEET with a knife as in lethal range!
Then you have these arm chair tough guys saying OH THOSE DUMB COPS AFRAID OF A GUY ON THE GROUND BLEEDING. Except cops are trained to make sure they have the weapon secured first! You know why? Because people have been shot then got back up and killed the cop who shot them!
ALL POLICE OFFICERS ARE TRAINED THIS WAY AND RIGHTLY SO.
Anyone who disagrees is probably the "He dindu nuthin" type.
There's that word again. And who determines what's justified? And do you automatically accept it when they claim it is? Literally, and I do mean literally, the entire point of a democracy is to allow the people to determine what is just and fitting - and those definitions are constantly changing. Even the death penalty isn't legal in every state, and that's punishment handed out after a lengthy legal proceedings. So why is it that we can't question when police kill citizens?
>>7746358 I wasn't implying anything. I was making the case that your argument is equally valid for both sides of the situation, and therefore isn't grounds on which to defend the officer's actions.
That in no way implies that the man should be allowed to stab someone, and I never mentioned anything about "understanding" although you seemed to imply that understanding the cops mental state is relevant, whereas the mental state of the man killed was not.
Point being, your argument was poorly thought out and is not defensible.
Either way, you seem pretty ass mad since you keep calling me names for no apparent reason, so you should probably calm down, senpai.
>>7746369 >And who determines what's justified? It's not necessarily up to any one person, but whether or not a killing is justified can be debated and an answer can be reached. We (society) agrees that self defense is an okay reason to kill. Perhaps a member of some uber peaceful religion like Janism (where they literally where scarves over their mouths to keep from accidentally inhaling and killing bugs) might not agree, but most reasonable people think self defense is legitimate. The officers were acting in self defense, and there was no other reasonable choice for them to make. They could have tased him, or pepper sprayed him, or shot him in the leg, but objective evidence of the efficacy of those methods shows that it would be a big risk for the officers to take. Thus, they protect their lives by shooting him.
>So why is it that we can't question when police kill citizens? I never said you can't question it. I just answered your question for you: it was justified.
>>7746382 I'll keep this short and just say that I know and understand all of the things you've listed in that post, however, I don't think you've fully understood the purpose of my post.
If tazers are so ineffective then why do they even have then? Clearly they are meant to be used, and the whole point is to incapacitate without taking a life. So if you're just going to shoot, why carry them at all? I completely agree that officers have a right to defend themselves. But deadly force should always be a last resort, yet it seems that it's becoming a first response.
And I wasn't asking you if it's justified, you can not make that determination and you are not the one who investigates or litigates that case.
>>7746379 I don't think that theory exactly fits with the guy who got shot, whether he had a mental illness or not is irrelevant, he provoked the officers which led to him getting shot in self defense it wasn't the officer's fault for opening fire on him from of the state of adrenaline rush they were in because they didn't provoke the man to stab them in the first place so no your case doesn't work in the dead guy's defense plus how where the officers supposed to know he was mentally ill? Only thing I heard the mother say the first time I watched the webm was chopping up people so that's pretty irregardless altogether but it's common sense that police are armed to defend themselves when they need to basically he brought a knife to a gun fight and got what he deserved suck my balls
>>7746402 >If tazers are so ineffective then why do they even have then? For situations with different circumstances than the one in that video. If that guy was 15. feet away and had no weapon, a taser would make sense. It wouldn't make sense if he was 3 feet away, with a taser, running at them (like in the video).
>But deadly force should always be a last resort, yet it seems that it's becoming a first response. Whether or not that's true I don't know, all I'm talking about is this one situation.
>And I wasn't asking you if it's justified, you can not make that determination and you are not the one who investigates or litigates that case. I'm not claiming to be the law. I'm claiming and arguing that it was justified.
>>7746402 >If tazers are so ineffective then why do they even have then? For situations in which their lives are not in immediate danger, but a subject needs to be incapacitated for whatever reason. Take this nutjob for example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WheYXSa61_s
>>7746410 First, I wasn't defending the man. Again, I was making the point that your premise was faulty.
Second, everything you've mentioned is an issue of training. Officers are trained to deal with that adrenaline rush. Not being able to control yourself in high stress, high energy situations is actually a disqualifying trait for being a cop.
Third, you don't understand mental illness or the issues related to it. You don't deserve to die because you have mental illness, however that doesn't mean I'm implying he should have been allowed to go about his business. The "insanity" defense exists for a reason.
>>7746449 Well then to address your question of "who decides what is justified?" I'll say basically the same as what I said before: If we assume a few moral cornerstones that society agrees on (killing innocent people is bad, killing in self defense to save your (or others) lives is okay, etc), I think whether or not a killing is justified is something that can be argued and an answer can be reached. Obviously I don't decide who gets charged with what in a court of law, but I can lay out an argument for why I think a certain killing is justified (and I can be right or wrong). If there is a crazed lunatic spraying at a crowd of innocent bystanders, you and me both know that it would be justified for a cop to shoot that person. It would still have to be judged by officials to see if it was justified in a court of law, but morally we know it was the right choice.
>>7745295 It was literally like three dudes who pissed on some dead bodies. Three out of over two million people.
Not to mention, the dudes they pissed on weren't 'foreign soldiers', they were Jihadis from Jordan and Syria who went to Afghanistan to kill Americans and steal opium. They're terrorists, and those Marines were taking revenge after one of their men was killed earlier that week.
I remember in Marjah, a little ten year old boy had his head cut off and put on a pike by the local Taliban for informing on them, and you're worried about pissing on dead dudes.
>>7746255 Seriously doubt it If it was a white guy charging at them with a screwdriver he would fight and restrain him People somehow think blacks have inhuman strength and can't be restrained or something
After the bomb drops in the vid, they are shooting at them with what appears to be some large caliber bullets. Do these bullets actually have to hit their target directly to kill or do they create shrapnel on impact that can kill even with indirect hit? Because it seems hard as fuck to hit those people directly.
The leftmost guy at the end seemed to stumble when the bullet hit like a meter from him.
>>7746724 Looks like night-vision footage from a gunship, probably an AH-64 Apache. The 'bomb' was probably a Hellfire missile. The Apache's 30mm chain-gun fires high-explosive rounds that can punch through most things short of a no-shit main-battle-tank, and their blast and fragmentation effects are significant (it was mounted specifically for shooting up 'soft targets' like trucks and troops). Getting caught in the blast-radii of multiple 30mm cannon-shells does Bad Things for your health.
>>7743586 I bet this is how most of those "unarmed" killings by police go: some nig won't listen when the cop tells them to stop, and they won't fucking stop talking, then suddenly get aggressive or try to escape.
If he just put the fucking screwdriver down and put his hands up, everything would have been OK. I'm white, and I'd expect I deserve to be shot for disobeying an officer and holding a fucking screwdriver...shit looks sketchy as fuck.
>>7745325 You'd be afraid for your life too if you had to deal with ghetto niggers all day, many of whom won't fucking listen when told to stop whatever it is they're doing...if you see that shit, why would you risk your life in order to idealistically see the situation as non threatening?
Fuck I hate this of Amerifats, I went to Canada last year and we had three Americans in our class, a girl from Oregon, a guy from Arizona and a girl from Cali, the ones from Oregon and Arizona were pretty chill and cool guys, but the girl from Cali was terrible and his dad was a Marine and a Cop and she always told us that his dad was so cool and he killed people (BAD PEOPLE) as if it was something to be proud of.
Everyone detested her, the Canadians an french from our class were the ones that hated her guts the most, specially canadians hate to be confused with Americans and I can see why, either way, not all of them are like that but holy shit, she WAS a walking stereotype.
>>7747980 seriously you americans don't even notice how fucked up your police are... no one should fear being killed by a policeman if he/she is disobeying... da fuck dude what's wrong with you guys...
>>7749401 >I wonder why they can't develop a taser that would work point blank what the fuck are you talking about? tasers come in two versions, the fixed kind you have to press against someone (point blank) and the kind that fire prongs at someone. The second kind can fail by missing or getting stuck in clothing and not zapping someone.
>>7747980 Yeah, often times it's not that they WANT to kill the person; the suspect does something sketchy or gets aggressive and gets themselves shot because at the end of the day that officer wants to go home alive. And in their situation I wouldn't be taking any chances either. I'd rather lose my job than end up dead because of some hippie ideal that everyone is good deep down.
>>7749125 what are the police supposed to do if they are disobeying while the person in question is holding a weapon. most police shootings don't happen unless another weapon is involved or the cop legitimately feels their life is in danger. Most, not all. yea some are fucked up and shouldn't happen. But at the end of the day, would you rather the cop be dead for being to nice?
>>7749639 Google military history statistics. The French have one of the winningest militaries in world history. I'm not a frog myself, I'm an ausfag. I'm just correcting a common Ameriburger misconception about the French.
>>7749653 Yeah look at all the protección they have on their eyes and neck, looks really hard to attack them in those places which could surely cause severe injury and death. One mouth breather less to worry about. You should join him.
>>7749653 Hate to break it to you but stopping a knife and stopping a bullet are two very different things. Nothing is truly bulletPROOF and not all vests are the ones with ceramic plates in them like the military gets. And even if they were there's also the bit where it's, you know, a vest! It doesn't cover the whole body there are numerous other vital points are exposed.
>>7746724 former soldier here. Bullets typically have to hit the target, but ricochets are definitely possible. But, the biggest thing, is that when bullets are hitting near you, especially from a helicopter out of sight, you have absolutely no idea if your next step is in the line of fire or not. The ideal situation if you're the enemy is if everyone ran in different directions - much harder to kill.
That, and when a 50 cal bullet flies near your head, you can permanently lose your hearing. Overall it has a lot of effects like splashing up the dirt and super lucky if shrapnel hits a grenade, but may not kill you.
The bomb was likely either a laser guided missile or a dumb fire rocket. Both can be hard to aim at a small group of people while they are moving in different directions, the helicopter is drifting in air, and you have a second or two lag time to account for.
Training helps but most pilots are not going to get a whole lot of real world experience to sharpen their prediction skills.
>>7750141 turkey shot down the fighter. russians sent helicopters to look for the pilots. one of the helicopters was destroyed by US-supplied akbars (TOW missile system) which was filmed and uploaded by the same guys from that webm.
>>7743586 I don't think most people here know, there is a much longer video of this out there. A black officer comes in later and tells the two cops involved in the shooting that this was a long time coming.
Apparently the lady has called the cops numerous times on her son because of his condition. He would have fits and threaten her and his brother. He had been taken in for treatment and such a few times before without incident. The guy never really had an issue with the police until this fateful day. One wrong move proved deadly. Very unfortunate......
In my opinion, it's hard to tell if the cops overreacted. But I don't blame them one bit for pulling out guns rather than a taser, if they even had one.
Standing back and commanding fallen suspects to drop their weapon is standard procedure. You don't know for sure that they're necessarily going to just lie there when you approach. The safety of the officers and bystanders are top priority.
>>7749369 You lose your right to defend yourself without escalation when you wield the authority to revoke the rights of others upon your discretion. It's called checks and balances. You wouldn't get that, as you obviously have no problem living in an autocratic police state.
>>7746671 Fuck no. Do you think cops risk their lives to protect the integrity of their agressors? Maybe they would risk a fight if the man was unarmed, but a screwdriver is a lethal weapon. Don't think its not just because it was not designed with this purpose.
>>7748671 You know how easy it is NOT to get shot by cops? Very easy. Just don't do any of the stupid shit you see people in the vids do. Accept that you're responsible for you're current situation and you'll be golden. Yet in every video some degenerate is pretending to be a bad ass in some way. These are people with poor decision skills that wouldn't care if they got you killed, so who gives a shit if they get killed. Good riddance.
>>7753831 instead of using a tazer(they're evidently equipped with those) they went the lethal route is it considered normal for american police-force that you default to lethal methods of solving problems even if you could use non-lethal ways to solve a problem?
>>7755012 Its not a bad argument. Its true. Everyone acts like pulling a weapon on or fighting a cop is an inevitablitiy of life. Its not. Study, work, engage a productive hobby, focus on your family anddon't get fucked up on drugs. Congratulations, you will now avoid getting shot by cops. Its noit rocket surgery.
>>7754935 This. This happened in South Dallas, the ghetto. I live 30 minutes away, way too close for comfort. Every home in South Dallas has bars on it, there is trash everywhere, you cannot go there at night. I don't blame these cops one bit.
>>7746613 It's real. The issue was that they were backed up against a car so there was nowhere for the cops to go. A taser isn't a sure thing when dealing with actual handicap negros. So they are forced to shut him down Compton style.
>>7755423 very close to supersonic, The actual launch itself plus the sound it makes in flight isn't usually loud enough for you to notice unless you are actively seeking out incoming TOW missiles. It would be like trying to look for an incoming arrow from a bow only much faster and deadlier.
>>7743742 Pretty sure they're not "afraid" dumbass. They're simply establishing evidence that, even after getting his shit ventilated, the stupid fucker woudn't drop the knife. It's a legal precaution, not a fear response. You bash cops online, but i bet you suck cop dick irl to get off the hook for shoplifting dildos from kmart.
>>7746369 lol dude. the courts decide what's justified. it's not a fuckin ambiguous term. you can look it up yourself, but a justified shooting is one where the "victim" (nice substitute for "perp") posed a threat of serious bodily injury to an officer or citizen. The death penalty has no relevance here since it's a function or possible outcome of a trial and not of an arrest. You know there's a difference between a trial and an arrest, right? If some dumbass is too violent to be taken into custody and approaches an officer with violent intent, the law allows that officer to defend his life. You expect cops to risk death to save some fucktard. >2015 >being this brainwashed by sjw faggotry.
But they DO release helmet camera videos of firefights, they just edit them to remove anything graphic from it, so you just see a group of people firing at what looks like trees or random houses with nothing in view. But then they release gunship videos that show things like the helicopter firing on someone already injured to finish them off and such, it seems an odd double standard. It can't just be because the helicopter footage is black and white, surely.
>>7755598 March 31, 2013. Kevin Ware suffers a compound fracture in the Elite Eight match between his Louisville Cardinals and the Duke Blue Devils. His team goes on to win 85-63. He now plays for Georgia State University.
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