How do these big, free to use software companies like Discord

Data mine.

Data Harvesting

They actually don't.
Every startup and technology company started in in the last 5 years has never made a profit and they just rely on continued investments by VCs hoping that their golden goose takes off even though they've released yearly reports that they're never EVER going to become profitable.

Data collecting.

>>61937959
>>61937961
>>61937984
I can't think of any other way these companies have the power they do without charging their users a dime

>>61937981
This is funny to me. Why don't the VCs put any pressure on them? Will the VCs eventually get tired of wasting money and drop them?

>>61938178
They will.
Discord wont last a few years.

Dicksword actually seems to be almost profitable, moreso than Dropbox.

https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2017/08/we-try-discords-new-video-features-ask-if-game-chat-app-will-ever-make-money/
Skip to the part where it has "If 10 people try out a chat app, and just one can't use it, they nuke it." in big red text

>>61938225
Why the fuck would one person be unable to use it?

>>61938254
IIRC he was referring to the voice chat (dependent on WebRTC, which wasn't in a few of the big browsers at the time)

They make most of their money from selling user data (if it's free, you're the product) and surviving off dumb investors.

Once the investments dry up it will either die, start paywalling more and more features, or become an ad-infested shithole.

A few ways. their paid service has a decent useage rate, then like everyone else said, data collection.

They are rolling out video chat soon though so expect it to go the skype route shortly after with forced ads.

>proprietary freeware
Honestly, these two words never mix very well.

>>61937938
>>61937981
They don't make money like this anon said, they only lose money from their investors. Companies like Twitter, Yahoo, Discord GP, etc do not have a way to monetize what they offer. The bet is that they will figure out a way, but the reality is what they offer no one would pay for.

We are currently near the top of a massive tech bubble, when the investors run our of money and courage it's all going to come tumbling down. Layoffs in mass and market free fall man. Worst part is that trust will take forever to come back so startups creating real value won't be funded.

>>61938471
Best option is to get a job on a team that supports an actual product. I'd say Apple's software team supporting their hardware but I'm sure they have high turnover in new hires, regardless of level.

>>61937981
Netflix will
Spotify will

>>61938773
netflix is 15 years old at this point
their initial business model predates internet streaming

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>>61938645
I agree, supporting a tangible product is way less risky. If you are worried about your high paying tech job, just ask yourself if the work you do adds value that people are actually going to pay for or are paying for. If not there is always becoming a trade worker.

I like the theory about using data mining to personalize selling to individuals, but the current way we use it feels like opening a can of soup with rock and by the time we figure out a better way it might not matter. I think we should instead be focusing on personalizing products using the data about customers. What do other anons think?

>>61937981
i can't wait for this bubble to burst

>>61938471
I actually look forward to this day. Silicone valley has become a post-modern ideological shithole that needs to be cleansed.

>>61937938
Whatever it is, it has nothing to do with scraping, crunching, and selling your data

>>61938773
>Netflix
>Spotify
Literally who

>>61938773
netflix is paid only
and spotify has premium (with actual benefits compared to discord nitro)
they have a monetization model. discord hasnt right now

Gathering Data and selling it

>>61937959
>>61937961
This

>>61937938
>Discord
The funny thing is that they would not need to pay for anything if their service was p2p.

>>61939384
then you have teamspeak.

they're CIAware
Just like Yandex is KGBware
And Chinese shit is Maoware

>>61939486
If the KGB is willing to protect Snowden then they're on my side.

>>61939507
>he doesn't understand the usefulness of a political pawn

You know what, just let Ivan have all your data. Why not.

>>61939557
Better than cointelpro interrogating me or having me executed.

>>61939507
This

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>>61937938
they usually lose money
they stay afloat and get rich by showing steady userbase growth to investors, get moneys and cash out at some point
investors play along because they can't into technology and don't want to "miss the next facebook"

>>61939185
>Third world

Literally who

>>61937938
They sell your data.

Dropbox has paid tiers and Enterprise options.

Not sure about Discord.

>>61940180
Discord has premium, which a surprising amount of people actually buy.
Gives you custom emojis and animated avatars.

>>61937938
They're usually funded by a third party until they find a way to monetize themselves or die. It's called venture capital, third party puts money into the service in hopes that it will pay off later.

Dropbox has premium and business accounts, it's probably monetized well, it's been around for a while

Discord has premium accounts too, but I'm not sure if it pays off yet, probably they'll roll out more paid features later

>>61938191
Just like how Skype didn't?
/pol/

>>61942038
Skype was different ranging from it being bought by microsoft from its usage in business environment. It also was one of the first platform of such kind.

also what does it have to do with pol?

>>61937938
Discord is a botnet
Also
>IRC chat
>Can't preview voice for audio levels / static
>Uses a tonne of resources

And people praise this shit and look at you funny if you mention TeamSpeak or mumble

>>61942376
Because Discord got a mobile app right.

The TS and Skype apps for Android suck donkey dick.
With discord it's just easy to text mates and randoms like all the shitty social medias that the normies like.

>>61942515
Brainlet

>>61937938
They provide a service that people want.

>find a market
>get money to bake your idea
>investors throw loads of money
>make great service for free
>attract more and more users
>monetize later
It's an common practice.

They will probably sell "Turbo subscription", stickers, emoticons, badges and shit like that.

They start with funding from VC's. When the money runs out they try to monetize and kill the platform.

I see alot of responses on this thread that free programs like Discord are collecting/selling data (presumably to large organizations or governments) or are botnets, but what does that truly mean? What sort of valuable data can they gain?

I use discord to MMO raid a few nights a week with a raid group. We coordinate the group during boss pulls and bullshit around about chicks, cars, upcoming mma fights....what value could there possibly be in these interactions?

>>61943264
I used discord to unload gigabits of porn on daily basis and download gigs of porn on daily basis from it lol for a long period of time, literally discussing nothing else.

I guess it was just a huge _|_ to their service, it;'s funny that they keep a lot of junk alongside potentially useful data.

>>61942515
Normie fag, do you have a MacBook too?

VC money, not many, especially Discord have a viable plan to make money.

Usual goal is to get big enough to get IPO or enough VC money, cash out, and go somewhere else.

>>61937938
That's how Capitalism works lad, if you don't like it you're welcome to not use any products or services it creates.

>>61938877
The stream of venture capital is gradually beginning to dry up, with funding having decreased by 25% since two years ago. But the tech industry is too lucrative to give up on altogether, so the startups without pants-on-head retarded business models will likely survive a crunch.

About 3% of discord users have nitro, out of the 300k or so I scanned with a selfbot- at 5$/month, that's not insubstantial considering their usercount. Plus, screenshare and whatnot is nitro only too so that will probably drive a fair cut of revenue.

>>61938178
>>61937961
>>61937959
Speaking as a data engineer for a marketing company. Pretty much all the data we work with, the longest we keep anything is usually 60 days for a couple reasons:

a) we don't like dealing with subpoenas/legal, easier to say "we don't have it" so we keep the minimum legally allowed for most types of data

b) we usually don't need metrics/data that far back to do predictions

c) some of the data we have is used to help improve portions of the app, but nothing confidential, very basic info

d) to my knowledge, none of it is sold, because 1) that's bad and 2) we'd have to let customers know

The only thing I think we keep longer than 60 is security related stuff (but that's to 90), and internal metrics from the application itself (e.g. stats, timings, etc, stuff to track the performance that has nothing to do with customer related PII).

I can't speak for the other companies here though.

>>61943864
Oh and typically if you disable your account it just sits dormant for 90 days then gets killed. If you email us asking to remove it we'll just remove it right away.

We do this because occasionally people's accounts get stolen or raided, get removed, then come back and ask to reactivate their account, which we just re-enable or restore from backup if need be.

>>61943864
> d) to my knowledge, none of it is sold, because 1) that's bad and 2) we'd have to let customers know

To 2). Actually you don't, I mean you could always sell it without notifying the customers. Facebook or Google or Snapchat or others for example...I think?

Besides that, how does the "selling" work? Is there a marketplace for that? Like, I'm just interested.

>>61937938
Discord is selling it's voip services to companies, Lawbreakers for instance.
Besides possible data collection, they also sell Premium Subscriptions.

>>61943864
>legally mandated data retention
You must live in yurop.

>>61937938

data raping

>>61943864
> we'd have to let customers know
It's specified in the EULA.

>>61937938
Discord gets its money from investors. The reason it gets investments is that one day it might overthrow steam as the goto pc game sales platform.

>>61945817
They sell games?

>>61943810
Source?

>>61944961
this is interesting af

>>61945842
Except it isn't. Read ToS and Privacy Policies, dumbass.

>>61945856
let's think it like this:
they do sell information for ad provider(a example) we wouldn't even fuckin know our data was sold. what are you gonna do then?

>>61945836
one day they do

>>61945873
If they are ever caught (all it takes is one anonymous whistleblower), they would be liable for damages that would utterly destroy the company.

Believe it or not, ToS is a legal contract. It cuts both ways.

>>61938471
yeeee it's gonna be a big one, the only question is how long

even google and fuckbook are overvalued, in that their ads don't work and people will eventually realise this

amazon, on the other hand...

>>61939935
so how do the investors get money? they have to see at least some return. I'm not gonna keep giving someone millions of dollars if i don't get one cent in return

>>61945920
At least the services I use are either profitable, or on their way to be, without sacrificing privacy/security.

Really hoping Wire is able to successfully monetize before the crunch, as that's pretty much the only service that isn't profitable off subscriptions or individual donations.

Data mining and in case of discord, backing of the chinese government to infect the enemies PCs.

>>61943264
I'm really interested in an answer to this question, I mean it's not like anyone is buying or selling anything through discord, how can advertisers or trackers possibly care about Discord's info?

>>61943809
That's not an answer, "it works because it does," in a capitalist system to make money someone needs to give it to you in exchange for something (or out of charity I guess but I doubt people are just mailing checks to discord). What is discord providing to users or investors that they are receiving large amounts of capital for?

>>61937938
they want to destroy competitors FIRST, then spam you with ads everywhere and selling your data to marketing companies like facebook because you have no other choice and they will be too big to fail at that time

>>61946269
Got me. That said, they can find a way to make it profitable pretty easily. If Tutanota can pull it off, and Wire can pull it off via their Business shit, then certainly Discord could, even if it's putting certain features that they already offer behind a paywall. Enough young people will pay for useless shit that makes them feel special.

>>61946296
What competitors does Discord have?

>>61943264
Discord notes the game your currently playing also. So publishers could use this information to see whats poppin too.

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>>61937938
they sell the userdata.
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE. get off my board, fucking normie.

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>>61945920
>even google and fuckbook are overvalued, in that their ads don't work and people will eventually realize this
1)The ads work
2) Google and Facebook can also sell the data they gather
3) Google also has Android
4) Facebook |POTENTIALLY| has VR.
5) Again they have Ads, they are seen and they work, I remember this interview with this guy doing a niche porn website and when he lost his ads on Google said that a good chunk of traffic was lost too.

>>61946478
Verizon inserts ads? How?

>>61938773
>Netflix will
>Will

>"In Q4, global streaming revenue grew 41% year over year to $2.4 billion, while contribution profit rose 74% year over year to $470 million (20% margin). Operating profit totaled $154 million (6.2% operating margin) against guidance of $125 million, while net income amounted to $67 million, compared with our forecast of $56 million. Net income included a -$22 million foreign exchange adjustment booked in other expense due to the strength of the US dollar. As a reminder, the quarterly guidance we provide is our actual internal forecast at the time we report"

>>61946332
Skype
Teamspeak
IRC
Wire
Actual game chats
Apple's groupchat thing

>>61946554
Not familiar with Teamspeak, or Apple's thing, but aren't they quite different from Skype and Wire? How would one kill IRC?

we need to start moving people to mumble

https://github.com/mumble-voip/mumble

>>61937938

They're being (((financed))). That way they can dictate what happens inside the company.

>>61940561
>Gives you custom emojis and animated avatars.
Their audience is obviously a bunch of idiots.

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Who buys the data? 3rd party to create distance?

Where is it sold? I'd imagine medical records (specifically mental health) are the most valuable

Isn't 4chan a same model as teotter and discoord

>>61943264
>what value could there possibly be in these interactions?
https://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=1031667

>>61946554
Discord more or less surpassed competitors feature wise, that's why it grew so popular

Skype is a buggy mess, Teamspeak's client is subpar and requires someone to host a server if you want personal space, IRC is stuck in the 80s feature-wise

Real competitor for Discord was Matrix, but it's development has been too slow so investors pulled the plug and now it's probably dying

>>61945953
They don't. Most investors don't. Not in the overwhelming vast majority of the products which they've invested cash into, anyway.

The point is that as the user base of the product grows, the CEOs/CTOs can persuade their current/future investors that they'll monetize it ''somehow,'' given the extraordinary user base. Typically, investors fall under this hype and keep giving money to them.

I worked at a startup. I was there during the rounds. It was hilarious to watch. We had a startup that had about 50 active users when we first started (I was 3rd hire), then it went up to about 50,000 active users after six months.
Now the company has had millions of downloads and several hundreds of thousands of active users.

The VCs kept giving us money. I left for greener pastures(read: another startup was offering me more money and it was/is interesting), but if you can show increased user base, you're on the right track.

User base is the new currency in the tech market sphere. Look at YT, for example. That's why YT stars want their pages liked and they yearn for more and more users.

Funnily enough, Silicon Valley poked fun at this model in one of their eps.

>>61943833
>screenshare and whatnot is nitro only
its going to be free after testing. nitro users get early access.

>>61946145
[citation needed]

>>61944961
I don't know; we don't sell it so I would have no idea what to tell you. To add, you're right, but legal and the CEOs would want to notify customers.

Our CEOs are pretty good at keeping things customer friendly and oriented.

>>61945559
Nope, USA, we keep some of it to respond to DMCA requests and to cover ourselves, we operate in Europe (no office, just customers there), so we have to comply unfortunately.

>>61945626
Still, legal/CEOs would want to let customers know and be clear of the expectations.

>>61949110
I'm not nitro and I have screenshare/video

>>61943864
>d) to my knowledge, none of it is sold, because 1) that's bad and 2) we'd have to let customers know
fucking lmao what a dumbfuck. you honestly expect me to believe this complete horseshit?

If I use a card at walmart, google knows about it the next hour.

>>61945920
Isn't Amazon one of the companies that has literally never turned a profit?

>>61951272

Jeff Bezos put the entire revnue into new investments, so the company makes virtually no profit, while he becomes much richer by beating the (((revenue expectations))), what a nigger

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>>61937938
I don't think Discord is making a profit yet. They are still in the stage of growing their userbase and I think they will eventually sell Discord to some bigger company or find a way to monetize the frogs once they are all in the pot through ads and whatnot.