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Tesla Powerwall

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Thread replies: 145
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So, this is a massive-capacity UPS for the whole home?
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>>47823157
Yes
/thread

Now, OP. If you wanted the /g/entoomen to discuss this, don't start with a simple question.
>>
>>47823157

yes.
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>>47823157

the real question is how long can it run my gaymen station on battery power if i'm drawing about 350W from the wall with pc+monitor while gaming.
>>
>tfw want this because electricity goes out for no reason every couple months where I live
>tfw Ontario electricity price is so low, avoiding peak pricing can't pay for $3,500 purchase cost
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>>47823209
>7 kWh
>350 W
diy
>>
>>47823221
just get a generator
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>>47823209
>10kWh model and 7kWh model
bout 28 or 20 hours, depending on model. probably a bit less because of padded stats and energy loss
>>
>>47823241
A generator has to be outside.

It's going to conk out during the winter.
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>>47823209
7kWh = 7kw for one hour or 1kW for 7 hrs etc
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>>47823260
Make a little shelter for it, it should be fine once you get it started.
>>
So Tesla is enabling the future of weed dealers and home grow-ops

based tesla
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>>47823248

that's not bad, during a black out i could power on my tv, sound system and htpc to watch some movies while the power comes back on.
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>>47823286
How would this help, the battery wouldn't last that long and don't you need lamps on 24/7
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>>47823307
You can stack the batteries.
>>
>throw it in the back of a trunk
>charge it off company's power while at work
>power house at night
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>>47823157
Has price been discussed at all?
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>>47823337
It's significantly less expensive than just about all competitors, which is what makes it exciting.
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>>47823324
Yes but that doesn't help if you are running lamps constantly.
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>>47823337
$3,500 for 10 kWh
$3,000 for 7 kWh
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>>47823350
What are the competitor's prices? Is it something you can just buy or does it need some expertise installation?
>>
Hi there.

Tesla stockholder here.

Anyway, the idea behind this is that you've got a unit that can charge itself via solar power- then, during the night, that power can be then recalled. Or, you can charge it during non-peak times from the power company, then pull power off of it at peak times, thus saving you money, and also reducing strain on the grid.

It's the last key ingredient that's plagued a lot of solar installs. Instead of selling power back to the grid for shit, you can keep your power.

For places that get a lot of sun, this is an excellent thing.

/shill
>>
This isn't a new or innovative technology at all, Tesla is just marketing it in a way that has mass appeal. Basically the Apple of solar/electric power, the difference being instead of peddling vapid consumerism, they're peddling a habitable earth.
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>>47823393
Tesla is making it cheap
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>>47823373

I hope solar installations are going to go down in price/be more competitive. the prices are fucking ridiculous right now where i live. People claim to be able to retire after doing solar installation for less than 10 years.
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>>47823393
The innovative part of it is that it has some kind of technology shit for solar panels and is more easily scalable compared to other solutions. Or something.
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>>47823393
It was available, but expensive and only marketed to businesses that really can't deal with power outage like data centers, IT companies, and healthcare providers.

The fact that they can produce it so cheap is real innovation.
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>>47823356

Why is this better than a cheap UPS rigged to a stock of batteries.
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>>47823286
I don't understand.
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>>47823157
They're not new things.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ka0MfipmdBw
This one's a /diy/ home UPS, exact same idea, but made by an EE for his house.
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>>47823393
>electric power
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>>47823579
it's not about making something new
it's about making the technology simple enough for normies
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>>47823545
>stock batteries

You've answered your own question.
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>>47823639

stock OF batteries

As in I have a APC ups and a fuck ton of large batteries that I got for free and hooked them all up.
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>>47823629
this. it doesn't seem like /g/ appreciates this fact, like... ever.
>>
Generally designed to work in conjunction with solar panels or such, so instead of selling your excess power to the utility, you store it into this. If you don't have solar panels, there is some utility in that you can charge them up during non-peak hours when your electric utility charges less, then draw off of them during peak times.
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>>47823815

Can you hang your batteries on the wall?
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How much will cost the battery replacement? In APC ups you have to change it every 3-4 year normally...
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>ain't no fire like a lithium battery house fire.
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>>47823286
>>47823307
>>47823324
>>47823353
How will police ever find a way to combat these futuristic criminals?
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>>47823894

>does it have round edges

Macfags incoming
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>>47824670
They won't, if you aren't a shitter.

>put fence in your backyard
>build a greenhouse
>plant weed

they can't do anything because it's not against the law to own a greenhouse
>>
>>47824670
This picture is wildly inaccurate.
First of all, black people don't grow weed, it's actually not the easiest thing to do and niggers just can't do it. Niggers will definitely SELL weed on the streets.
Secondly, there's no way some nigger can afford solar panels and a bunch of Tesla Powerwalls.
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>>47825874
>Secondly, there's no way some nigger can afford solar panels and a bunch of Tesla Powerwalls.
Selling drugs is really lucrative.
Problem is that they don't save any of it. Money they get is blown on stupid shit like jewellery, fashion, or the usual dumb nigger shit.
They could if they wanted to.
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>>47823363
A Winston WB-LYP1000AHC costs around $1300 for around 3.2kWh in retail.

You also need an additional battery management system / "charger" in that case though, and it may be built-in here.

So the pricing seems quite okay if >>47823356
is accurate.
>>
I wonder if this is really going to be more cost-effective than selling back energy to your power company.
Of course it's probably cheaper to use your own power instead of selling it for a low amount of money, but storing energy is less efficient than using it directly, and the batteries will have to be bought and replaced at some point.
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>>47826052
>I wonder if this is really going to be more cost-effective than selling back energy to your power company.
If doing this is subsidized 'cause it's renewables (like in much of Europe), then probably no.

>but storing energy is less efficient than using it directly
Yes - getting it up to 120/220V or whatever from ~4-12V or such and transporting it elsewhere also is less efficient than storing it in a modern Lithium battery at ~4 or ~12V, though.
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>>47826090
Then I wonder if this Tesla thing can be directly hooked up to your solar panels, because that would be efficient indeed. I don't know how far the transport is though, it could still be more efficient if you're basically powering your neighbours.
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>>47826130
You still want a MPPT or battery manager in between, but maybe that is included.

> it could still be more efficient if you're basically powering your neighbours.
If you have an "off grid" equipped household with all 12V device, you can save yourself the voltage step-up conversion there.
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>>47823157
>exploding walls
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>>47826153
It would be cool if you just had a big super efficient 5kW PSU in your house, and just had 12VDC everywhere. I can't really think of anything that doesn't convert power anyways, especially now that led lighting is cheap as fuck. Maybe stuff like a vacuum cleaner actually has a 230VAC motor, but I don't think 12volt motors are necessarily worse, right?
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>>47826130
PS: If it's not efficient, it's not going to be very viable at all.

Obviously you don't want 25% more panels and inverters or whatever (depends on your setup) just 'cause your expensive battery *requires* 120 or 240V.

Panels and inverters still aren't this cheap yet.

So I'm probably also wondering more about what kind of electronics are in there than the battery type (which I assume is going to be LiFePo4 of sorts).
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>>47823373
The way my parent's solar works they actually get paid more for putting power into the grid than buying from it. So they do any power intensive things like pool pump and washing at night to get more money. >power companys in charge of common sense
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>>47826205
Yes, 12V is quite viable overall.

> Maybe stuff like a vacuum cleaner actually has a 230VAC motor, but I don't think 12volt motors are necessarily worse, right?
Actually, I don't know about that, but you CAN still use an inverter for individual devices that require it, especially if you buffer off a lithium battery it shouldn't be much of a problem as such.

Just a little lossy, but I hope vacuuming isn't amounting to much of your total energy budget anyways... it should work.
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>>47823373
Over here in Germany its actually better to sell your solar power than use it on your own.
Completely retarded and financed with taxes.
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>>47823629
It's about reducing the cost.

That battery requires an inverter, it's not an all-in one build.
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>>47826233
>>47826252
Subsidies / very different rates for renewable energy will make selling this power to the power company more efficient, yes.

> Completely retarded and financed with taxes.
Semi-retarded, this is the easy way to financially compensate owners of solar installations. Power companies aren't going to be interested to send someone over to look at your additional in-house power meter (and be it to inspect it's not rigged) and pay you for using that one too.
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>>47826286
So it just has a charge controller inside?

Maybe one with balance function 'cause apparently you can stick those batteries together?
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>>47826090
You can use an automated system that redirects energy: if the solar power is not used then it will be stored in batteries. If the solar power is not used and the batteries are at full charge then it will be uploaded to the smart grid.
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>>47826356
Hm, certainly an option if you want to produce 120-240V of sorts anyways.
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>>47826153
It has to be included for battey life reasons.
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>>47826402
> It has to be included for battey life reasons.
No? Why would it have to be?


Either way, I think that will be a bigger installation than what you need to use "efficient" 12V, and have a different layout with typically more inverters and fancier controllers.

Of course you could just put an inverter at the end...
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>>47823331
>>charge it off company's power while at work
>>power house at night

I liked idea of stealing electricity at work so now I have 4 antminers S1 in bolier room running 24/7. It's not much but it gives me some satisfaction.

Big battery is also cool idea but not really practical. Electric car is another story. Even if I had money for Tesla I would still steal electricity just for the feels.
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>>47825905
But if they did, they wouldn't be stupid ass niggas.
It's what separates them from the human race.
>>
Man I hope this technology will make it's way into rack mounted UPS systems. I hate racking UPS systems full of lead acid batteries.
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>>47826313
see next post->

>>47826411
Maybe you are right, high currents MPPTs are quite expensive and the price of the tesla batteries is very low.

So, for a 10KW/h implant you should pay 3,5k for the batteries, and at least 5k more for the controller+inverter+installation.
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>>47826420
>stealing
>satisfaction
>>
I'm pretty new to this whole thing

So, is it possible to install solar panels and actually store that energy into these batteries

Anybody went with the numbers? Can i waste 500kwh/month, with only solar panels and this battery?
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>>47826526
Sure, with a 2000 watt solar array.
>>
That man's name sounds like he is one of Isaac Azimov's characters.
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>>47826526
for 500kWh/mo, you'd need 16.67kWh per day, for which you'd need MANY solar panels.
>>
Anyway, just like for the cars, Elon Musk is pushing a market not for greed (he has the money) but for good.
I don't like Apple analogies because Apple is exactly the opposite: they do useless things for greed.

>>47826546
The problem for us is still the price though.
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>>47826552
>for which you'd need MANY solar panels.

How much is that in m2?
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>>47826564
14
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>>47826590
Really or just fucking with me?

I doubt solar panels are that standardized so that you can give me exact number
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>>47826598
Of course it will depend on the panel, I just pulled the stats from some random 250W panel which was ~1.7m3, of which you'd need eight probably.
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>>47826612
14 m2 is pretty much, i expected kinda less

But still, my roof would be enough even for that

Let's say in theory i get those panels and tesla battery, would i need anything else for completely self sustainable home, in terms of electricity of course
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>>47826626
Depends on where you live. You'd need more in the winter because of less sunlight. If you get snow you need some way to keep the panels clear, heating them would of course require more power.
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>>47826612
>Of course it will depend on the panel
latitude and average cloud cover is probably more important
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>>47826500
>So, for a 10KW/h implant you should pay 3,5k for the batteries, and at least 5k more for the controller+inverter+installation.
Yep, something like that.

And if you use micro-inverters close to the panel rather than one inverter per string (has a bunch of advantages again - efficiency and reliability gains, easier fault isolation, ...), it costs even more.
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>>47826626
>would i need anything else for completely self sustainable home, in terms of electricity of course
MPPT or other battery charge manager.

Micro-inverters close to (groups of) panels for efficiency and reliability.

Wiring (obviously).

And probably a lot of 12-48V appliances for the efficiency gains that lie in not having to use 120-240V most of the time.

12V-48V is closer to what you'll get with common lithium battery arrangements & common solar panels...
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>>47826780 (cont'd)
Maybe a hose up to the roof so you can easily clean the panels.

Mounting racks / spacers of sorts so you can mount panels them "air cooled".

~20-30% extra panels or a conventional generator maybe so you can at least run all the essentials on the 30-50% power you might get on cloudy days (which may come in sequence).

Probably a good inverter or two so you can draw 120V or 220V or whatever with the more common household appliances anyways. (12-48V are great, but not everything is that, and buying a lot of exotic devices will cost more than the inverter).

Well, basically something like that.
>>
I have a question not directly related to these Tesla batteries: do new phones alimentate themselves while attached to the ac line other than charging the battery? (I mean, like in newer laptops the battery is not constantly drained and charged..)
Because if so, if I wanted to charge my phone directly to the solar panels how does it manage to know I just want to charge the battery and not fry the internal circuits with an instable voltage?
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>>47823157
>no blank between number and mm

triggered
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>>47823393
and it's also just $3500 which could pay for itself in a couple of years for a normal family that doesn't want to change its habits
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>>47823373
>Tesla stockholder here.

What are you in at? I bought some at 170 basically just speculating on an earnings release. Of course it was wrong but I didn't mind as I was willing to let it ride. Sittin on a tidy profit but nothing out of this world compared to the potential
>>
I woul've bought some stocks if I was american.
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>>47827376
How does $3500 here pay for itself?
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>>47827376
how does it pay for itself at all?

this isn't a generator
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>>47827990
>>47828006
You store either solar power if you're a hippy or cheap energy at night (costs half as much here during the night) to use during the day
>>
around 2010 in Canada there was a huge push for renewable energy. there were a ton of grants available for anybody installing solar panels, wind turbines etc. A bunch of independent contractors popped up demanding big bucks for panel installs, then pocket all of that delicious government money.

that only lasted about a year. they stopped giving out grant money and all of these contractors went bankrupt. when the dust settled, homeowners realized that their solar installs were actually costing them money and not saving any energy.

a bunch of people got sued. it was great.

if the power wall takes off, possibly in combination with some better solar panels and power management, we could have a really good thing going.
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>>47828220
Tax payer's money in Italy too even before 2010.

The biggest photovoltaic plant, wich is in my city, was built by an american company only to benefit from incentives.

Italy was never been indipendent from the energetic point of view and the fact we are even paying americans is very sad.
>>
>>47829171
Nonostante abbiamo un bordello di progetti di successo per la ricerca nelle energie rinnovabili. Riusciamo ad importare anche l'unica cosa che abbiamo
>>
>>47823157
>try to design ups for third world countries where blackouts still exist
>hey lets not make it square/stackable, lets get people to hang it on their fucking walls like art or something.

>>47823324
who needs wallpaper jesus fuck
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>>47829171
>The biggest photovoltaic plant, wich is in my city, was built by an american company only to benefit from incentives.
well, hopefully the solar plant is paying for itself.

>In December 2010 SunPower has completed the sale of Montalto di Castro solar park to a consortium of international investors
hmm.

here in canada, most of the big companies (not just energy) are now owned by international investors. the government is trying to privatize a bunch of services to save money and cut taxes, but old white people keep saying they're "selling everything to China".
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>>47829568
>lets get people to hang it on their fucking walls
So it saves space.
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>>47829594
what houses don't have cupboards any more?
what's space saving about rounded edges? fuck all because nobody makes spherical batteries.
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>>47829530
Like patents. We invent, they profit.
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>>47829593
Yeah but the point is our taxes were used to give profits to american companies. This is nonsense.
>>
>complaining about the design
like literally take the battery out of the chassis hahaha that was so hard ohohohoh
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>>47829568
>they don't have walls in the 3rd world.
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>>47827376
>it's also just $3500

But need some other equipment/modifications as well.
In total it's probably double that.
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>>47823221
>want it to mitigate power outages
>think it has to pay for itself
Brah, I'd get one if my power kept cutting out.
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>>47823324
so 90 kWh backup for 35,000 USD? not bad I think
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>>47823301
>living in a country where power black outs are a thing

Top kek maybe move to a first world country
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>>47825905

Drug dealers make less than minimum wage when you take their hours into account. Now drug DISTRIBUTORS make bank.
>>
>>47830276
A first world country like USA where the infrastructure is over 50 years old on average and collapsing almost every day, where you have a whole dozen inspectors states with a few thousand dams that can't inspect shit and manage only a 5% quota?
I'd take a country where power outages are due to infrastructure being updated over a country that doesn't even have money anymore, or will, to repair its infrastructure and waits for everything to go to shit at once.
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>>47830276

I think he means like in Baltimore, where all the blacks are out
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>>47823157
>1,3x0,86x0,18m
>1,3 METERS
WTF.
how can you consider this shit usable.
And it only lasts for 1000 charges.

Not usable at all.
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>>47830330
lel
>>
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>>47830369
>how can you consider this shit usable.
Household wall mount? It's not a portable battery pack, anon...

>And it only lasts for 1000 charges.
Not sure if this is true. That would mean they use and fully charge Lithium Cobalt Oxide batteries or something like that?
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>>47823157
What if it breaks? Who is gonna fix it and how much is it gonna cost?
>>
>>47830878
Judging by the crazy safety and financial policies Tesla has on their cars, and the crazy ways they go to ensure the everything in their shit is safe and destruction-proof,
i'd say you can feel safe in those regards.
>>
>>47823157
When, realistically, can I get one of these?

I mean, Elon says they're shipping next year, but I presume that doesn't include the shitton of solar panels you'd need to make it workable
>>
>>47830992
It's not hard to get a solar panel system these days, You can even DIY install it if you're a man who has a basic understanding of how to work tools, but if you've got ovaries, someone can install it for you.
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>>47831038
Derp-de-dur-dur-derp
>>
>>47831038
This. All you faggots make putting solar panels up to be some feat of engineering or some shit.
>>
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>>47831128
>>47831038
>>
>>47831190
>because it costs a lot means it's hard to install
Literally fucking off yourself.
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>>47831246
Don't be mad at me, kid. Blame Google.
>>
>>47831274
How about I blame your parents poor decision making and inability to raise you properly?
>>
>>47825788

You realize the police and Feds fly helicopters over farmland in rural areas "sniffing" for pot farms with multispectral and IR gear right?

If they're suspicious they'll just do a flyover and sniff if out.
>>
>>47831315
Please tell what "multispectral" and "IR" gear is going to find about a fucking greenhouse full of plants? Fucking moron, do you know what a fucking greenhouse is?
>>
>>47831303
You sound upset. You should submit your grievances to Google support.
>>
What i want to know if one of these is small enough and light enough for me to strap it to my back to power a mobile tesla coil gun/pulse ruby laser/railgun...
>>
>>47823615
as opposed to mechanical/chemical as currrent automobiles are
>>
its a huge waste of money for the entire home.


its supposed to kick in during peak or critical power use when cost per Kwh goes up, saving you some money by not drawing power from the grid to run your 5Kw air conditioner.
but i think this tiered service is only mandatory in california. all other states either dont have such a thing (its a flat rate) or they give you the option to opt-into a tiered service (TECO does this)

also you really need to understand math if you are going to figure out if this will save you money.
>there is power lost when charging the battery
>there is power lost when discharging the battery
>the battery will need to be on a trickle charge to maintain its efficiency longer


depending on your set up, this might cost you MORE money than save.
its also designed for solar in mind, so thats another expense to consider.
>>
>>47830002
nigger, for the exact same price you can get a real generator that can run the whole house for as long as it has fuel.
>>
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>>47834348
>>
>>47834348
>>47834362
How does the gas cost compare with the battery though?
>>
>>47834301
solar
>>
>>47831346
Marijuana respiration has an id that you can identify by measuring the refractive indices and absorbtivity of columns of air relative to a point in the sky.

But you are a pot head, so what was I expecting, an intelligentsia?
>>
>>47834382

Thats the question.
we know the battery is $3500, but what we dont know is its efficiency, and life span.

that generator could last 20+ years easy provided you dont neglect the fuck out of it
also they make natural gas generators which would remove entirely the need to keep a huge tank of fuel lying around to go stale/bad
>>
>>47834474
Supposedly the tesla batteries will last 10+ years and have a 10 year warranty.
>>
>>47831346
"IR" = infrared you fucking dipshit.

Those lamps you use for growing weed? They are hot. Really hot. Most big grow ops are found by helicopter with IR cameras and are perfectly concealed to the human eye, but when hit with IR imaging, are glowing hot on their roofs.

They literally fly over homes and look for who has the hottest roof on IR, get a warrant with that alone, and raid the shit. Why else would someone's roof be so much hotter than the surrounding buildings?

>but muh greenhouse is hot

Not that hot. And more to the point, just having a greenhouse could be probable cause for them to raid your shit and search it if you don't have a commercially zoned property or a permit for selling agricultural shit.
>>
>>47823157
Isn't that called a generator?
>>
>>47834574
It's called accumulator.
>>
>>47834556
>They literally fly over homes and look for who has the hottest roof on IR, get a warrant with that alone, and raid the shit

maybe in freedom hating countries they can raid you by simply using a FLIR.
http://m.nydailynews.com/news/crime/dutch-police-bust-marijuana-grow-house-snow-melts-article-1.2110709

but in the US, the police CAN NOT point IR cameras at houses looking for grow-ops.
http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=93127


try again.
>>
>>47834603
BTFO
T
F
O
>>
>>47830303
My buddy paid his college loans off just dealing weed all the time and shrooms/LSD every once and a while
>>
>>47823263
it only discharges at 2 kw max.
>>
>>47830303
a weed grower, for 2 plants can potentially make $3000 (if both plants produce about 6 ounces dried) in 3 months for very little work (soil).

hydro is a bit more work, mainly because of the cleanup involved at the end, but all told, you might spend 20 minutes a day(averaged out) tending to the plants (for 2 plants remember) which works to something like 30 hours total worked for the 3 months
>>
>>47823412
No, it's just a Tesla Inverter(tm) integrated with a Tesla Battery(tm) licensed from some other inventors with Tesla Improvements(tm) tuned specifically for Tesla Modular Solar Panels (tm)

To obtain Tesla DC Electric Devices(tm) certification, your computer must run its OS under UEFI with TeslaSecureBoot (tm) and may run no other kernel than Tesla Linux++.

Attempting to use a Tesla Battery with non-Tesla equipment will cause the battery to lock off 70% of its memory banks and permanently disable its builtin TesVidia PhysX technology unless you remove all your AMD graphics cards and replace them with Tesla.

Attempting to use the Tesla Car with an Apple Battery, or an Apple Car with a Tesla Battery, is illegal.

Attempting to replace the Tesla Battery case with a rectangle violates Apple-s patents on rectangles and is illegal.

Attempting to chemically and electronically tune a Tesla Battery to work on a cycling schedule different from Almighty Musk's dictated 24-hour or weekly cycles is illegal and subject to execution.

Attempting to require more than 100kwh or more than 3kw is illegal.
>>
>>47827635
stocks are international. You can buy any stocks from anywhere
>>
Would I potentially be able to put this and some solar panels on an RV of some sort and live out of it?
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