Square head screws

Have you tried using them? They are so much nicer in that they are nearly impossible to strip, and easy to turn.

>>903042
Pretty much this

>>903042
Literally no benefit compared to Allen
>>903034

>>903054
>he's never encountered a stuck/stripped Allen key screw

That's the most god damn annoying thing ever. Also you can't tighten Allen keys worth a fuck because they strip.

>>903034
can drive them at high speed with a drill and not have it strip the hole.

Are you serious? They're god-tier along with those star fuckers.

>>903073
Seriously why the fuck is the phillips head even around its a shit design

>>903034
>>903034
Personally I hate how fast these fuckers wear out my bit.
Then again, they cant be beat for use with an impact drill

>>903083
yeah they wear bits pretty quick. even expensive bits don't last long so it's better to just buy a bunch of cheaper bits. the nice thing tho is that it's far easier to change a bit then fuck around with a stripped screw

>>903034
>They are just a meme, right?

No. They are dominant in Canada and are spreading through the northern US states for a reason.

>Is there any real advantage?

Lets start with: When you press them into the driver with minimal force, they hold on and you can drive them at any angle, including straight down.

>>903060
Unfortunately shitty screws and chinese pig iron tools will strip regardless of what design you use.

Hardened hex cap bolts are god tier fasteners.

>>903091
too bad it's taken 100 years simply because Robertson got fucked over by some brits and refused to ever license his design again

>>903092
yes but some will be better or worse then others which goes right back to the design. a low quality square is still going to be better then a low quality phillips

>>903034
What's the benefit compared to Torx?

>>903034
Wouldn't a triangle hole work better?
I have a feeling that a square like this could easily wear off into a circle.

>>903122
If 3 points is better than 4 then what about 2 points?

What if, guys, what if, what if we made a screw which was just a straight line?

>>903131
Yeah, that's going to be the best screw head ever. BRB patent office.

>>903122
>feeling
As opposed to all the other screw heads?
Btw, triangle head exists.

>>903095

Cost

funny, I've never stripped a 5/16 with my nut driver, and 80% of what I work on is 5/16 self tappers.

I'm completely open to switching to these, though. a flatter head with more room for torque? I'll take it.

>>903034
Marginally better than Phillips.
I only use hex head. Most mechanical contractors only use hex head too.

>Marginally better than Phillips.

bullshit. they're better than Philips by the same margin as Philips is better than slotted.

you can push the screw into the screwdriver and it will hold like it's glued in place. not like a magnet, but where you can push with 10's of pounds of force at an angle and the screw stays in place. this means you can get into tight places and use one-handed where Philips would need two hands.

Torx master race

>>903091
>No. They are dominant in Canada and are spreading through the northern US states for a reason.

Where are you at? Canadafag here, I don't really see much of them around.

>>903074
it was supposed to limit the torque applied to the screw (now surpassed by those torque limiting gears in the drivers...)

>>903158
External hex is God like, internal hex sucks if either the fastener or driver are anything less than decent quality.

Slotted screws, in terms of torque transfer, and amazing. The problem is people don't know how to properly size drives. A well fitting hollow ground slotted bit will change how you think of slotted fasteners.

>>903186
>He can't do the same with a Phillips.
Pleb level is off the charts!
Seriously though, a magnetic bit holder and/or collared bit holder let's you do the same.

>>903189
Torx are great if its just you in a good environment. Using them in the field after dumbasses have shoved slightly smaller allen wrenches and every size torx but the right one into it is a nightmare.

>>903251
>Seriously though, a magnetic bit holder and/or collared bit holder let's you do the same.

No, it doesn't.

Phillips was DESIGNED to slip out. It's not an unfortunate side effect, that was a deliberate engineering decision. You have to keep the bit pushed in in order to prevent this, something that isn't necessary on a square, torx, or hex head.

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#AsBadAs/g/

>>903122

The tradeoff with more faces is that it takes more torque to strip it in the first place (because there are more points of contact to distribute load), but it's both easier to strip if the tool doesn't fit just right and it's more fucked when it does get stripped.

It's why a slotted screw is so easy to fuck up, but can still usually be forced out afterward, yet a hex socket is likely to be completely unusable (and require an extractor) once damaged.

>>903259
Its not even an issue for slotted if your screwdriver is the right size (it almost never is)

>Its not even an issue for slotted if your screwdriver is the right size

of course, it's an issue. even if you have the perfect size screwdriver, the fact that you have two openings on the side of the screw means the screwdriver can slip out sideways and gouge a hole in your workpiece, or your hand. slotted screws are a menace and should be illegal to sell.

>>903263
Fuck off security triwing fag.

>>903291
Son do you even know how replies work? How old are you?
>insert smug fedora-wearing anime face
I'll teach you a secret - click the little number on the post you wish to reply to.

As a Michigander, I see them all the time on decks, nothing else though. I've never used them.

>>903291
>a menace and illegal to sell

You sir are the menace. Learn to use tools instead of blaming the fastener for your issues.

> Son do you even know how replies work? How old are you?

you're a fucking twit, I'm quoting the post just before mine. if you're reading the thread, you just read the thing i'm quoting, there's no need to link it as well, unless you're a goldfish, with a 5-second memory.

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>Not using white power tools

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>>903305
>you're a fucking twit

Ah, so you're *deliberately* neglecting to use a basic 1-click feature, that connects your post directly with the one you're replying to and gives anyone hovering or clicking them a visual thread of isolated posts; it's not that you simply didn't know. I see, keeping it real and low-level like they used to and so on.

Keep doing your thing, then.

>>903034
You can get more torque on them and they strip less imh experience

>>903310
I ... I ... ummm.
This is the first time I have ever been speechless on /diy/.

What problems would a swastika drive have?

>>903324
not camming out, which is preferred IN SOME APPLICATIONS

otherwise, the perfect drive

> connects your post directly with the one you're replying

somehow, humanity has managed to have discussions for 200,000 years without hyperlinks.

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>>903336
>humanity has managed to have discussions for 200,000 years
Over an anonymous image board where vocal and visual cues can't tell them who talks to whom, right?

Son I just had breakfast so you're much too salty for my taste right now, no wonder you argue that selling a common type of screws should be banned by law. Enjoy your primitive, lacking, lazy-ass approach to online discussions and new skills.

>>903034
God tier for construction

>>903192
Wait, where are YOU at? I see them everywhere. It's the #1 screw head used in most construction. Eastern Canadafag here.

>>903158
yeah, but you can't fit them flush for a flat surface... you need a hole around it for the drive.. other than that yes they're awesome

>>903251
meh I do appliance repair and I've seen torx screws survive in terrible conditions... multiple years in wet conditions.. they do pretty good

>>903324
protests against stores carrying them causing them to be difficult to buy.

>>903305
Who are you replying to?

>>903310
Holy fuck, all that contact.

>>903324

Driver would be kind of a pain in the ass to make. Other than that, not much, actually.

>>903310
A true multi-drive screw design:

flat
phillips
robertson
security-flat

keked beyond belief

>>903388
C U C K is kek?

whatever

>>903135
If it had closed ends unlike a shitty flathead screw driver it would be. Centering flatheads is fucking bullshit.

>>903186
You're forgetting that torx is used by machines. That's its main advantage. The machine can hold the screw straight. This is why so many consumer good have them.

Phillips was god tier with hand assembly though.

Robertson is great for driving deep screws where lots of torque is required.

>>903259
This and most people's buthurt related to them is related to removing fasteners that were never intended to be removed. Shit tier screws can be used when even the shittiest screw is expected to outlast the product its a part of.

>>903331
What are your feelings on the security bowties that are intended to camout in the extraction direction?

>>903391
I've only seen them on urinal walls. I piss on them partly for disgust and partly hoping they corrode and need to be replaced but they can't be removed.

>>903362
Not the guy you're relying to but I'm in Canada too.

For wood screws we use Robertson for everything, framing, flooring, decks. Philips is only used for drywall as you want them to cam out.

I have to settle for Allen for machine screws though. Everything I design at work I insist on Allen as our production staff destroys Phillips.

Q-Tron (locomotive equipment) uses Roberson machine screws in their axle generators. They're awesome but really hard to find and expensive.

>>903310
>making a WWII/Nazi themed device
>use this everywhere
>bragging rights
>sell to skinheads
>profit?

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>>903324
The bits would be expensive and difficult to manufacture, and probably prone to breakage. The recess would also be costly to produce with consistency. I could also see them being tricky to seat the driver in quickly.

Torx is best.

>>903034

I once got 2 in a pack of 12 that had the heads filled in because they suck to manufacture and the manufacturer probably sucked. So, no, they suck. Sorry for adding nothing to the thread.

>>903457
If that shit factory not only had a massive reject rate but also sold its rejects as-is, I don't really see any reason to assume that they a) were somehow representative or b) that their other screws were any better.

>>903324
the jews will screw you

>>903457
I have a small collection of unthreaded Phillips screws, and have had more mis machined Torx and Phillips head screws that I can count. Sorry your opinion is invalid.

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>>903310
You fagged up a Torqset drive.

>>903131
>straight line
has no center

>>903324
>problems
Exactly the same as philips

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I don't mind pozidrive actually. Have the right driver for it makes a huge difference. Don't be an Ameridumb and just try to use Phillips.

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>>903310
you could make nazi screw kits for mausers, /k/ will jizz buckets

>>903158
just wait until your retard helper uses the T20 bit on a T25 screw and then comes up to you and says HEY THIS SCREWS SPINNING WHAT DO I DO

>>903397
Also in Canada.

It's not just wood, Domestically-produced electric components (glorious metal junction boxes) all use #2-size Roberstson heads. Switches are Phillips, and faceplates are Flathead, but everything else is based square Canuck-drive.

>>903762
Its even better than that. A lot of electrical comments use "combo head" screws. Which, while those screws suck when used with phillips or slotted drivers, you can just use a Robertson on them and its wonderful. I wish theyd just drop the everything in one combo heads and make everything Robertson. At least I can now install a Pass & Seymour cord cap with nothing but a pair of dykes and a #1 robbie tip.

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>>903762
>Domestically-produced electric components (glorious metal junction boxes) all use #2-size Roberstson heads
yes. and it's damn annoying when none of your other work requires that tool.

>>903814
Robbie #2 is nearly ubiquitous now in electrical components and wiring devices.

>>903251
>Seriously though, a magnetic bit holder and/or collared bit holder let's you do the same.

I put a tiny slug of blue tack on the end of the bit.

>>904169
for every single screw? my boss would kill me

>>904336
>flat head with stops at the ends of the groove
If only.

>>904336
>Not naming it the correct title.
If you encounter a hex bolt, but you only brought screwdrivers, you can try sandwiching the head of the bolt between two parallel screwdriver shafts, squeezing the screwdrivers together with a hand at either end, then twisting. It doesn't work and it's a great way to hurt yourself, but you can try it!

>>903034
the only meme screws are phillips head :^)
minimum trolling

>>904336
>confusing JIS with phillips head

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>>903034

>>904489
whoever designed this has never tried to tighten a bolt in their life

>>904511
Either that or they have the stupidest design for a stepped hex bit with a slotted end.....

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>>904511
>>904521

>>904528
>triggered

.... I didn't think I'd find something stupider than security Philips... thank you for again proving me wrong... seriously WTF people....

>>904537
Even stupider than Metrinch wrenches?

>>904528
>>904489
i getting a boner from all those hexagons

fuck wood screws, but hexagons get me hard

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Remember children, 1.6 is the magic number when it comes to fasteners

1.6 multiplied or divided by your thread size will give you the internal/external hex size with decent accuracy

>>904175
No just on the screwdriver. There's a knack to getting it to stay on the bit.

>>904563
>thread size
But what if it's only one person bumping the thread?
Do i still divide by the post numbers?

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>>903034

>>904695
I hate people who share good images without links to them http://www.instructables.com/id/When-a-Phillips-is-not-a-Phillips/

>>904938
At least share the link to the full article.
http://www.instructables.com/id/When-a-Phillips-is-not-a-Phillips-Plus-So-Much-Mor/?ALLSTEPS

>>903034
yes

>>904695
>>904945
>>904938
Makes me wonder why no one tried to make a swastika head

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>>903034
You tell me

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The biggest meme drive is spline sockets.

I invented by far the best best screw drive. Why can't others get it right?

>>903091
Okay, I'm from Canada and have really only used Robertson for wood projects. Are you saying in the southern United States they use Philips or some other type for framing and decking etc.?

>>906020
I'm in NorCal. Yes, philips, It's used in nearly everything and it's so bad. So, so bad.

>>906023
That is mind boggling. I don't know if I'd be able to non ironically use Phillips for any major build

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>>906023
I honestly don't know how it became the standard because it's so awful.

>>906026
You can drive a Phillips head into a pilot hole straight even if your drill bit is not centred. This is advantageous in tight spots like around braces where you can't physically line the drill up straight. Try doing that with a locking bit like torx or Robertson where your bit must be at a 90degree angle.

>>906056
I'd just use a flex shaft.

>>903310
This is my first trip to /diy/ and, after this post, I don't think it will be the last.

>>904336
The right sized flat will work on all of these. I don't work without my 3 and 3,5mm flats, they pull 98% of all screws i come across, round heads too, just have to jam it in there good.

>>906056
stop using the wrong tool for the job daren. You're why we can't have nice things like robertson or slotted head.

>>906141
Let me guess you always use vice grips o bolts too.

>>906056
Except your tip lasts for like maybe 3 screws at best doing that

>what is a right angle drill

>>906154
Depends on your driver, I had one i abused everyday for a year before i lost it, the tip held up very well, it wasn't perfect, but it didn't twist or break off. Get a good driver and use common sense, you can feel if you're going to break it. much better than carrying around 10 driver or a set everywhere. It depends a lot on what kind of work you do too of course.

>>906156
Calling absolute bullshit on this.

>>906163
It's honestly not, I use them for everything until i loose them in usually. Tips being bent or twisted isn't a problem. I tend to go trough 2 - 3 a year.

I'm a sales rep for Lowe's primary hardware distributor, ask me anything.

>>906165
What brand you using? Drill or impact driver?

>>903536
That's true, and I think that's really the biggest flaw in flathead screws. However, could you imagine a flathead with a deep, limited width slot? Shit would be a massive improvement.

>>906179
Screw drivers, not a drill.

>>906193

Duh, you are stating you don't wreck bits by using a handheld screwdriver?
What a revelation!

>>906201
I'm not the one who brought it into question, and where did you get the impression that i was talking about drill bits?

>>906193
Hand powered screwdrivers?

>>906204
Are you really that dense that you can't understand that >>906201 meant 'driver bits' when he used the word 'bits'. It's all in the context. How drunk are you son ?

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>>906209
My bad, i got my conversation threads mixed up. Don't know what happened, I thought we were talking about:
>>906141

>>906167
Why do all Kobalt pliers suck?
Why did you drop the impact socket lineup?
Why don't you carry dewalt flextorq square #1 bits in store?
Is there a big metabo rollout coming soon now that hitachi owns them?
How do you deal with all of Home Depots branding exclusives like Milwaukee?
Why did you stop carrying Klein and Knipex tools and change electrical To your entirely Chinese Southwire brand?

>>906167
why do you consistently suck for tools compared to home despot or menards? ....

>>903733
Pozidriv is like a relogious awakening.
I worked in a shop that used only Pozidriv; they felt like they were glued to the bit as i drove it in, and the head let go of the bit as soon as i stopped the driver.

Truly a god teir head.

>>903034
If you've ever used them, you'd know.

>>903034
Robertson head + torque-limited impact driver = best fastener-driver combination on the market.

>>903814
I'm an electrician. I use my #2 by far the most.

>>903034
>Is there any real advantage?
hardware for $400, alex

things that ruin heads
"what is cam-out?"

royalty-free head design that is hard to cam out and thus round out/strip out/have the retard operating the tool fuck it up

>>903074
ok im going to let you in on a little secret

the hardware makers give their shit for free to the manufacturers in order to sell tools

square drives for life

>>903034
Yes you can stop other people from tinkering with your shit

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>>903310

Would buy. Not even white. Just for the lulz

>>906381
>>906386
I work for the company that does fasteners and those blue specialty drawers, the tool companies have their own reps. I do know that Metabo is rolling out since two of my stores are stores they use to test market stuff, but I just know that from seeing the displays.

When I was a young child my father had a screwdriver he brought home from work, and he called his magic screwdriver. It was obviously a flathead in a previous life, but he had filed the end into something new altogether, a driver that he claimed would turn ANY screw. I am currently 24 years old and I'm yet to find a screw this driver can't handle, no matter the shape, or the amount of stripping. I genuinely believe this screwdriver can never be replicated, not by any other man, or machine, one driver to rule them all. I know where it lives even to this day, in my dad's "various useful junk" drawer, in his kitchen, waiting for the next challenge, maybe even an old rusty allen bolt, who knows.

I love my father, but sometimes I sit up at night, wondering how much longer I have to wait. When I will get the call or the letter, informing me that I can finally claim what is mine, my birthright, and destiny. The greatest screwdriver that has ever been, and ever will be.

>>903433
literally worst design.

>>903733
Underrated post

>>903034
Posi 2 is better

>>903303
Fine woodworker here.
In every application, from tool restoration, to adjusting plane irons, to applying tension to a saw, I always prefer a slotted screw for delicate applications that still require firm pressure.

>>903310
this seems like the best least strippable screw flavor possible. why don't we make this

>>907889
what's it look like

>>903034
god tier fastener

>>910383
cost

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>>903034
>come itt to see who the bump from last page culprit was
>nope, /diy/ has just been talking about fasteners for 18 days

>>910507
>you've come to the wrong neighborhood motherscrewer...

Best external Hex (metric catagory):
m3
external hex size;5.5mm

>>910546
>Metric master race
>still needs fractions

>>910930
>>910546
5.5mm is correctly written as 5500µm

>>903310
That swastika is reversed, yo.

>>903034
Anyone who says these don't strip is wrong. I bought a trailer that had been repaired and refit multiple times with the same original screws (a rookie mistake, imo) and almost 33.45% of the square screws were stripped. Luckily, screw removal tools are handy and not expensive.

>>910988
It's always going to be reversed on either the screw or the driver.

If it weren't, the driver wouldn't fit in.

>>911035
design flaws

I use these daily .way better then Philip.less slipage the torx or allen.

>>911058
I guess you could make the screw look like a 田, and the the swastidriver would would be the true, correct orientation.

>>903034
>/diy/
>square head screw
jesus christ. It's called robertson. Is this board real life?

>>903042
you are kidding right? these are the most pain in the ass screws in the world for stripping

>>903536
i believe he means to come full circle and develop the mighty nail

>>903074
allegedly they designed it to not apply too much torque on aluminium bodied cars/aircraft so they didnt get the shit dented out of them, but there's no evidence for that. not 10 minutes ago I removed a TV mount using phillips heads on 3" lagbolts, into an undersized hole drilled as per the instructions. YOU NEED A FUCKLOAD OF TORQUE FOR THAT, WHY USE A SCREW THAT LIMITS TORQUE FOR FUCK SAKES /rage

>>911190
>giving canadians credit

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>>911468
Are you absolutely certain they weren't pozidriv?

It's really, really, really hard to get philips screws in construction, for the exact reasons you mention.

>>911541
Your general location?

>>903192
How far in the tundra are you? I've never seen a hardware store without those in Canada and I traveled from East,West and the North Coast.

>>911541
50/50 Phillips and hex here in Texas.
Set screw conduit fittings do use square and some finer machinery uses torx.

>>903762
>>903814
>>904166


RED ROBBIE IS LOVE
RED ROBBIE IS LIFE

>>903389
No, kek is lol

>>904537
>>904555
I regret looking those up.

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If it not a two piece swaged bit, then it's not a real Robertson.

>>911764
I remember having an asshole physics teacher that interjected into a lecture that 'metric wrenches were better because you could use them on metric and standard bolts'. I was a senior by this point and was tired of correcting teachers so I just let his bullshit sail through the room.

I see the stranger headed screws would be useful for the machines on a food production line.

It'll be a lot hard for Joe public to try and claim they found some masonry nails in their fish fingers when the machines only use one sort of rare hex head.

>>911764
>The patented Metrinch Wall Drive profile drives only on the flats and not on the corners.
>Metrinch open-end spanners always provide a 4-point grip instead of the 2-point grip characterizing the traditional profile.

Sounds like a good idea.

>>912449
>>Metrinch open-end spanners always provide a 4-point grip
How do they, when two of the points are opposed by thin air?

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>>912472
4 sides out of 6 are in contact. And only on the flats.

>>912474
Well sure, they're touching, but how can they exert a force?

They can't pull because they're not welded on, and they can't push because there's nothing on the other side to hold the nut in contact.

It should be obvious that you can cut both the throat nubs off and the spanner will still work, whilst if you cut either of the jaws off it will do absolutely nothing. Ergo there are really only two points of contact: one on each jaw.

>>912484
>It should be obvious that you can cut both the throat nubs off and the spanner will still work
But then the corners would be in contact and the main idea is to avoid this.

>>912484
You push the tool "into" the nut from the side; e.g. in the post pic you reply to, you would be pushing the tool left while also turning it, otherwise it would slip right off. The force you exert holding it on is enough to make the throat nubs engage the bolt

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>TFW work in structural design
>spec pig nose / snake eye bolts
>spec hollo-bolts for open sections
>design for grade 4.4 M16s, but use 8.8 M24s so you site boys have to fix twice as many for no reason

Fuck you site fags.

>>912723
It keeps them in work I suppose.

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wrong wrong wrong wrong WRONG

DONT YOU GUYS SEE, YOU WILL ALWAYS WEAR OUT THE TOOL OR THE SCREW. NOTHING WILL SAVE YOU NOTHING

ENTER MY PATENT SCREW HEAD DESIGN

REPOST IF YOURE TIRED OF THE OLD GENERIC SCREWS THAT LEAVE YOU FRUSTRATED AND UNABLE TO COMPLETE A TASK

>>903310
This would actually work fuckin well.
Please someone with metalwork skills machine this!

>>912801
Hard mode: do it in Israel or Germany.

>>912805
Easymode would literally be anywhere in Asia.

My friend's grandparents are Indian and they have swastikas in tiles on their doorstep to bless you and the house as you walk in.

Mfw they live in the united kuckdom.

>>912776
Actually you are right, but to dumb to know that you are right.
>what's a morse taper

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>>913068
Cracks me up every time, just how nonchalant it all seems.

>>913222
>hey pradesh, i need a new shirt so i'm off to Hitler
>cool

>>913222
Well they've been using the symbol continuously for millennia....why the fuck would they stop?

Its not like you stopped using the word "rouge" because of the Cambodian genocide.

>>913490
Hitler was a symbol there?

>>913523
Couldn't be any worse than the British occupation.

>>912805
>do it in Israel
No one would notice and/or care unless you make a big ad to draw people's attention, then you'd get scolded in the papers.
>or Germany
You'd likely go to jail for a billion trillion years.

>>913490
The swastika was a symbol, hitler was a guy who killed people. Allegedly.

>>912801
You're joking. Right?

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16KB, 213x258px

>>912723

Jesus Christ /pol/ is spilling over into my /diy/. Nothing but white supremists left on 4chan.

>>912484
>they can't push because there's nothing on the other side to hold the nut in contact.
the bolt does that.

>>913686
If the bolt did that, you wouldn't need either jaw.

>>913683
Thanks for letting them win by acknowledging their existence. Get some fucking self control you dense faggot. People like you who give them the attention are the problem, not the autists who can't help doing the same thing over and over.

>>913689
if you only want to apply a tiny bit of force you absolutely don't need the jaws.

Its a "robertson screw" not a square screw....

>>903034
Let's face it, the metal quality of the bit and the screw all play a part in it. Use high quality screws and high quality bits and you are good. Period. Finito

>>913690
>just ignore your problems and they'll go away.

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51KB, 800x1200px

>>913683
>implying this is a bad thing

>>903034
Flat head screws are the superior screw in any situation, I cannot think of a single situation in which something like a shitty ass phillips head beats it.

>>904489
>>904528
If it were rectangular or triangular instead of fucking hexagonal, I'd be all for this shit.
>Dat one tool/bit for many sizes

Bolts and nails. I'm out.