How do American comics suck so badly at appealing to girls?

>>78335068
You're not a girl

>>78335068
cause American culture can't decide whether they want girls to be strong independent and educated or pretty things to look at and fuck while they make you a sandwich. So it keeps sabotaging itself from start to finish. Strong girls get married and become romance shows halfway, princess shows end up with "GRLLLL POWER" episodes and "every white man is evil" plots.

>>78335089
>GRLLLL POWER
This is the problem, girls don't care about this, Japan has figured it out, they have a huge woman demographic that buys comics and games cause they know all they want are cute boys and or cute boys kissing each other.

>>78335068

Because like 70% of all the writers are men in their 40-50s.

They're not exactly doing a good job of appealing to dudes these days either

>How does the makeup industry suck so badly at appealing to men?
>How does the NBA suck so badly at appealing to asthmatics?
>How does Bollywood suck so badly at appealing to former CIA agents, current one-legged transvestite prostitutes?

because they are not the intended audience

At the moment the trend seems to be... not comics FOR girls (because thats mysogonist pandering) they want boy comics to be about girls for girls but still have the COOL boy stuff. GTFO smelly boys, the girls have taken over now and we're cooler!

>>78335109
>muh cultural appropriation
lol.

>>78335105
>>78335068
>>78335089

Or BEING cute too. Women care about the surface. Hell, look at that picture in OP. Girls putting on make up. Girls being attractive. That's all they give a shit about, no matter how much you kick and scream and cry they don't because you DONT WANT IT TO BE THAT WAY.

Are like this naturally? Are they conditioned? Who the fuck knows for right now -- the point is that being a good looking person who has sex with other good looking people is what women care about the most.

Without accepting that, appealing to women is a fruitless endeavor. If you're not appealing to their vanity you're not appealing at all.

>>78335068
Because little girls should be princesses that follows daddy or else they won't get to play with their toys

>>78335156
In the series in the OP image they are kogals, which are basically the kind of girls who do tend to put on a lot of makeup.

Though the protagonist is the 'pure but looks like a slut' and all into JUSTICE and stuff, because her parents are cops. Been a while since i've seen it.

File: hk.jpg (306KB, 640x1919px) Image search: [Google]

306KB, 640x1919px

>>78335119
>because they are not the intended audience

Yet this isn't true of the medium in other countries to any where near the same extent. Even limiting the discussion to super hero style series, there are still ways to create interesting, human heroines resorting to soapy bullshit or making females feel embarrassed for associating themselves with the culture.

>>78335195
Who cares about other countries? You asked about USA.

>>78335068
Girls don't even read

File: laughing girls.gif (742KB, 200x200px) Image search: [Google]

742KB, 200x200px

>>78335195
>he thinks it was girls who actually watched sailor moon

>>78335220

Or they do but they read romance novels that take me like all but a few hours to read, she's reading it in six months. Meaning she probably reads three paragraphs, takes a picture of herself doing so and captioning it "#SONERDY" and never touching the book again for a few months.

>>78335119
wow you are one food analogy to be fully retarded. how do you manage to not choke on your stupidity?

>>78335068
Because there's no market for it in the US.
You could probably grab a female audience in their teens if the industry started to look at what attracts them to Shojo manga and shows like Attack on Titan and Death Note, but as far as young girls are concerned there's just no demand for it

>>78335250
who is She

File: amethyst01.jpg (29KB, 584x329px) Image search: [Google]

29KB, 584x329px

>>78335308
There's certainly potential, but there's a strong unwillingness to take things with female focuses themes seriously. It's not impossible though and I feel that an influx of web comic creators could help.

>>78335156
the weird part is that boys care about being attractive too. Just because they won't use make up doesn't mean it's ok to wear a potato sack at school

>>78335156
Some times you need to just realize that appealing to a group means appeling to the lowest commom denominator.
After all, look at the video games that are popular with woman:
>Kingdom Hearts
>Legend of Zelda
>Final Fantasy
All feature pretty boys and lighthearted adventures with kawaii ^^~ characters.

File: sandman_watercolour_scan_by_rogercruz-d4nedrs.jpg (476KB, 1024x1481px) Image search: [Google]

476KB, 1024x1481px

they did it pretty fine for me

>>78336194
>mysterious dark pretty boy that will take you on a magic journy throught a magical world.
Did it, really? Couldn't guess why.

>>78336158
>look at the video games that are popular with woman:
nice asspull.

>>78335068
>How do American comics suck so badly at appealing to girls?
Because while Americans are still trying to figure out what exactly girls want to see, girls are getting comics from Japan for free.

>>78335105
Huge is realtive.

Top-selling josei (women) manga magazine - You - 194,791

Top-selling shōjo (young girls) manga magazine - Ciao - 982,834

Top-selling seinen (men) manga magazine - Weekly Young Magazine - 981,229

Top-selling shōnen (young boys) manga magazine - Weekly Shōnen Jump - 2,778,750

Top-selling non-manga magazine - Monthly The Television - 1,018,919

According to wikipedia, in 2007.

Super Gals was so great

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdnUoWIjnsI

>>78335352
>image

I vaguely remember her.

Then better girls showed up. Sorry whoever you are, Star calls to me.

>>78336252
>2007
horrible source

>>78335068
>How do American comics suck so badly at appealing to girls?

American comics suck at appealing to anyone who isn't a hardcore comic fan.

>>78336251
The problem, /pol/ meme aside, is that most comic publishers don't wanna bother to write a book "for woman", they just wanna take a regular book and change the main character to a woman or just make them gay for full SJW pandering. If a chick wasn't buying Thor before Whor, than they aren't going to buy the same book when it comes to tone and action but with a female lead. But Marvel doen't understand that, in their minds:
>Chicks like Thor cuz Hemsworth is a hottie
>Thor movie sells aren't translating into Thor book sells
>Better make him a chick, that'll get 'em.

DC does a much better job with stuff like Batgirl and Gotham Academy. They are clearly made with a female audience (and female sensibilities) in mind and that's just fine.

As as you said, yeah, girls aren't going to wait until America figures that out when Nana, Paradise Kiss, Rose of Versailes, Oniisama E, Revolutionary Girl Utena, etc etc. Already exist and provide them with what they want, and some times with even interesting female characters. Hell, your average shonen series have more manservice than "le Dick has a nice butt" meme

File: siblings_endless__dream_and_death__by_xiconhoca-d5kz700.jpg (851KB, 2526x1641px) Image search: [Google]

851KB, 2526x1641px

>>78336210
Pretty?
Wow, nice one. But you forgot to add strong female characters there.

>>78335068
>How do American comics suck so badly at appealing to girls?
>Why do American comics suck so badly at appealing to girls?
Grammar, for one example.

>>78335220
There is an anormous demographic for HP, Percy Jackson and Game of Thrones, full of girls.

>>78335145
This.

>>78335068
Just popping in to say that Gals! is a really underrated anime, despite its girly exterior. Ran Kotobuki was, and still is, awesome.

>>78336375

Maybe he wants to know the process for sucking. Also I don't think one anon's grammar is a factor in whether or not girls like comics

Because American women are objectively the worst.

>>78335332
My mom. That's the only girl I can talk to.

File: q004.jpg (494KB, 1740x1033px) Image search: [Google]

494KB, 1740x1033px

>>78335068

Because adult men and women are too busy playing gender politics to actually care about what girls want. They're writing what they think young girls want.

Young girls want Sailor Moon, Pretty Cure, Jewelpet etc. They don't care about MUH STRONG FEMALE LEAD and all that other shit. Just like young boys don't really care about Steven Universe singing and wearing a dress. Most young boys just want to see cool characters and cool fights.

Which is why Japan will almost always be a step ahead when catering to these demographics. Shueisha/Jump is starting to move into cape comics and My Hero Academia is better than a lot of superhero shit I've seen come out recently.

>>78337080
Quite a display of mental gymnastics, anon.

>>78337055
>when Russubhumans and Germaniggers exist
No.

>>78337126

You can't prove me wrong though. Western media (see: mostly the U.S) is hung up on gender politics and just like everything else they're using the THINK OF THE CHILDREN tactic.

>I FEEL THIS WAY SO THAT MEANS MY CHILD DOES TOO

>>78337172
It's a fruitless effort to argue against the delusional.

>>78337080
>Young girls want Sailor Moon, Pretty Cure, Jewelpet
Good thing they're not getting it, all of that shit is godawful.

how many of you are women?

anyways i've liked comics ever sense i was 11 and watched the original teen titans - it had young characters that looked more like me and less like buff or busty adults, it had action, it was funny, and it had character development and an overarching plot. young justice appealed to girls for the same reason, but got cancelled because it didn't sell enough toys iirc. the biggest turn off of american comics to me wasn't the subject matter so much as the overrendered style of drawing.

in 2015 there's plenty of comics read and written by women, they're just not big 2 - stuff by people like lauren weinstein, esther pearl watson, lynda barry, etc...

>>78335156
It's hanlf and half. Most people (notice not only girls) do care about the surface above everything. Being and liking stuff that's socially acceptable becomes huge once you hit puberty and young adulthood.

But that's the case for common denominators. Comics have their own niches. They don't need to be aimed at boys or girls separatedly (Tell me one example that tried that and didn't come out as a failure). Trying to target demographics based on gender is way harder, in comics, than aiming at groups based on age.

>>78337230
Says the person with no basis for complaint on account of not watching any of them on account of their baseless complaints. You have the logical processing power of a 3rd grader.

>>78337303
>y-you just didn't watch them
Ebin.
I want 90s nostalgic weebs to fuck off, or at least watch better entry-level shit like Trigun.

Girls are getting exactly what they want in Adventure Time and Stephen Universe.

Those shows kill with the young girl demographic. They move more merch to teenaged girls than the Nightmare Before Christmas.

>>78337351
>don't enjoy what I don't like!
it's even more pathetic when it's an adult man yelling it at little girls.

File: TeamWITCH.jpg (213KB, 800x616px) Image search: [Google]

213KB, 800x616px

>tfw no more WITCH

>>78337388
Nothing wrong with telling the kids to not eat shit

>>78337412
The comic is a proof that women shouldn't be writers at all.
The series proves that Weisman is a talentless hack.

File: 1402810525420.jpg (27KB, 403x371px) Image search: [Google]

27KB, 403x371px

>>78335068
Stop marketing to girls and start marketing to kids in general.

Girls tend to like more character interactions, but you can get the "strong female lead" quota out of the way just by having the females in a show on equal footing with the males, both narratively and otherwise. You don't have to reinvent the wheel or anything or even have the girls be leaders. Nothing screams "forced female presence" more than having 1~3 girls in charge of an action team that consists of almost exclusively boys, unless those girls actually show competence indicating that they should be in that position.

Boys tend to enjoy fight scenes and such more, but they don't dislike a decently-written character scene if it isn't actively interrupting a fight or something else they think is cool. Lot of boys in the marketing tests for LoK didn't care that the new avatar was a girl. They thought she was friggin' awesome and a real asskicker. She eventually turned out to be a massive disappointment, but let's leave that aside for now.

Both genders love stuff that incites their minds. Make kids think. Don't dumb shit down because "lel it's a kids' show". I'm not saying you should go full grimderp and kill somebody every episode in a bloody mess, but don't ignore that death and other such themes exist, don't pretend like everything's happy all the time, and don't write a simplistic plot because you think kids won't get it. Kids are smart little fuckers. They get a lot of shit better than you probably realize.

Also, I know it wasn't brought up, but fucking hell stop trying to make a big deal of interracial or homosexual relationships. Keep them around but don't point them out as "different". Those old "PSA" episodes from the late 90s early 2000s were fucking cringeworthy.

tl;dr: Good writing, solid characters, quality action, and everyone in positions that match their competency regardless of gender or any other shit would make the perfect show.

File: 1448161943517.jpg (30KB, 512x512px) Image search: [Google]

30KB, 512x512px

>>78335068
I wish /a/ or whatever weeb shithole you came from would stop shitposting these "Why does american animation do x wrong" bullshit threads

>>78337412
I fucking loved WITCH but acknowledge that it kinda screwed the pooch in the long run. The writer change sucked and I really wish the original writers would tell us what their plans were, but things like the Light of Meridian and omgcalebismysoulmate were actually interesting. Caleb being a murmurer was a good plot twist and served as the catalyst for Cornelia eventually getting over herself.

A major issue was that around the time that Orube left the team, everyone's character development seemed to backtrack a bit. That's fine; old habits die hard, but when it's 5 issues until the finale and we have Irma doing the same "I'm a shit student" miniarc and Cornelia doing the "I'm a huge bitch" episode, it gets grating.

Also the cartoon was garbage, even if it made Phobos into a real threat again.

>>78337467
American animation has been doing x wrong for a long time though

File: 58fe611b7581df198ba68626e7ed5893.jpg (141KB, 570x865px) Image search: [Google]

141KB, 570x865px

>>78335068
The fuck do you think the comic book industry has been trying to do the past few years?

>>78336252
You know that girls read more shonen than shoujo nowadays right? Cause shoujo had romance and drama while shonen had action, adventure, drama AND romance making it much more interesting.

>>78337806
In other words girls are plebs. As expected of their kind.

>>78337613
It's worked. I know a lot of girls who love Kamala.

>>78337078
You read your mom's romance novel and now you're bitter that she doesn't gobble it up as fast as your faggoty ass did?

>>78335114
Cape comics aren't meant to be bought by people in the first place, so them not appealing to them isn't a problem.

>>78335234
Is it men who are buying all the makeup/dresses/jewelry being released? They didn't even want them there for the SMC premiere.

>>78335068
Male here who liked Gals as a kid. Just because it fails at selling to its target market doesn't mean another demographic won't enjoy it.

... I mean it wasn't good but I loved it

Because you think America comics=Marvel and DC.

>>78338696
That's because they dominate the American comic book scene.

>>78335068
Because fuck girls, they have awful taste in everything. You appeal to women you are dumbing down your material

>>78335068
Because most comics are mostly written by a very small group of thirty to fifty year olds.

>>78337436
No, kids are not fucking smart, they are complete and utter dumbasses who will watch anything regardless of quality, they are stupid, tasteless, and can be easily tricked.

>>78339298
Cartoon Network execs go away.

File: [A-FanRips]Super Gals - 29[XviD].mkv_snapshot_19.45_[2014.11.01_10.46.32].jpg (28KB, 640x480px) Image search: [Google]

28KB, 640x480px

>>78338454
>it wasn't good
Wrong grandpa

American comics don't appeal to girls because it's a backwards industry that has difficulties drawing any new blood in and girls like mostly novels more

>>78339787
Sorry, reality's calling, and it says you are in need of a mandatory check-up. Children are fucking retarded and easily fooled.

>>78339860
I wouldn't call that paperback trash novels if my life depended on it.

>>78337860
but that's because she's a mudslime, not a girl. The USA is having a whole "mudslime are our greatest allies racist europeans are evil and deserve being killed" brainwash campaign running right now

File: Baitcard.jpg (122KB, 419x610px) Image search: [Google]

122KB, 419x610px

>>78339871
This is going to sound really retarded, but dumb children don't need entertainment, they need education. If they're too stupid to "get" the entertainment then they're too stupid to be doing anything but studying. Besides, by allowing and excusing "stupid" entertainment, you're telling kids that it's okay to be self-induced retards.

Of course, that assumes that marketing doesn't work for the greatest common denominator, which it does. That said, I'm a teacher and I see smart kids all the time. They're far from 100% of the populace, but there's plenty of sharp knives in the drawer.

File: sailor-moon-sailor-moon-quiz.jpg (47KB, 670x413px) Image search: [Google]

47KB, 670x413px

Because in America, a woman is strong DESPITE her femininity. In Japan, a woman is strong BECAUSE of her femininity. That is the difference between us, and that is why millions of women across the globe love Sailor Moon, but trying to get Wonder Woman in the mainstream is an incredible challenge.

>>78339920
Call it what girls read then, cause it ain't comic books

>>78335068
We prefer cartoons.
Most of the girl cartoons are unfortunately shit but at least we had powerpuff girls.

>>78340046
Thank god, the writing quality the average comicbook is horrible as is, we don't need it to go any lower

>>78335352
>influx of web comic creators could help
Ha! You're funny.

>>78340039
>but trying to get Wonder Woman in the mainstream is an incredible challenge.
Besides, you know, she's fucking shit.

>>78335068
This is just an anecdote but I was drawing a female superhero yesterday and I needed a reference image. So I hit up my pinterest boards because those are good for reference images, and I go to a board that's all Batgirl poses.

There were more pictures of her standing around with a smug grin than doing anything remotely dynamic, actiony, or heroic.

There were more pictures of her taking selfies than there were of her throwing a punch.

File: tumblr_ls43bjAA3j1qkinreo1_1280.png (181KB, 550x873px) Image search: [Google]

181KB, 550x873px

>>78337252

>>78340098
Wow, you are right.
That is just fucking anecdotal and thus fucking pointless.

>>78340098
Moving is sexist and you are promoting the abuse of transwomyn by wanting female superheroes to take dynamic poses and show off their curves for you to eyerape

File: [Science].gif (2MB, 425x247px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 425x247px

>>78340220
But aren't their curves completely eyerape-able by being stationary, too?

>>78340164
It's emblematic of either what publishers think female audiences want, or given how much of it was fan art, what said audiences truly do want.

File: 1447100422861.jpg (70KB, 405x499px) Image search: [Google]

70KB, 405x499px

>>78335068
Because American comic culture never cultivated the enormous diversity of demographics that the industries in other countries did(e.g. Japan with its shoujo and josei magazines).

But cross-demographic appeal is a big thing too.

In Japan during the 90s you saw many shounen designs drift from the hulking manly man bodybuilder physiques like Fist of the North Star, Jojo's Bizarre Adventure and DBZ to more slender, often prettier designs like Ruroni Kenshin or the later JJBA artstyle, partly to appeal to the female fanbase.

It's not like comics never did this, throwing in "little sister" versions of superheroes like Mary Marvel or Supergirl. Not to mention Wonder Woman, of course.

But they are learning. Look at Midnighter and Grayson.

>>78340494
>Because American comic culture never cultivated the enormous diversity of demographics that the industries in other countries did(e.g. Japan with its shoujo and josei magazines).
That's actually not true. We had divesity of demographics but then Seduction of the Innocent and the Comics Code killed it. Before that there were horror and romance comics, which had adult/female audiences respectively.

Sp the real moral is that we can't have in America because someone gets offended.

>>78340033
Try to remember that Minions are a thing.
Children are fucking stupid.

>>78340039
Well considering women are by defuault stupider, overly emotional, and weaker, than yes, if they have any smudging of competence its despite them being woman.
Masculinity if Success by default, femininity is failure by comparison.

>>78340670
Seeing how the CC was something that one company adapted to damage the other company's business, I'd say the correct conclusion is that you can't have nice stuff because the people in the business world hate the very idea of a free market with the power of a thousand suns.

>>78341135
As much as adults.

>>78335068
Super GALS! is fourteen years old dude.

In the US strong female characters are created because they're empowering to kids. In Japan strong female characters are created because the author thinks it's hot, or because it looks better than guys.

>>78341393
The problem is that the US definition of "strong" characters in comics begins and ends at impossible physical feats. The industry is borked to hell and back.

File: becauseyoudon'tread.png (34KB, 156x255px) Image search: [Google]

34KB, 156x255px

>>78340149
Reminder that Willis retconned Lucy into never actually reading comics in the first place.

Partly I think you'd need more female creators and writers/artists. it isn't that men can not write for women nor that women can not write for men but you're more likely to get a hit from someone who is the same gender as the target audience. Women can relate to women's interests and experiences better. I think there ARE able female writers but they are still bound by male superiors who dictate specific restrictions because they think it will sell better.

Only recently have there been successful female oriented titles to look to for direction, prior the industry lacked examples of success stories so they were still bound to common themes and tropes that appealed to men, "Just add girls".

Lastly I would say that entertainment needs are met by novels. Girls and women read more fiction than their male peers and the disparity is especially notable in the teen years. There is so much fiction being released aimed at them they don't need to seek it out in comics. The profit margins may simply be better and less risky with novels, why bother making comics? That said the comics industry may find it valuable to look at novels to gleam what is popular and interesting to the female demographic.

You're better off cutting women out of it entirely, no one cares about Wonder Woman, she's a meme hero, only given a damn about because people keep repeating she's part of the DC main three

>>78335150
how?

File: FUCK.gif (1MB, 320x180px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 320x180px

>>78335068
Why do comics have to appeal to girls?

I never really got this. Do writers literally have to go out of their way and try to appeal to women by putting in tropes and shit just to gain some dollars from a specific gender? Can good writing appeal to women? Or do we just have to fill it with lesbian tropes or someshit?

>>78340039
Wonder Woman was literally power through femininity, goddamn. Just because a bunch of writers later on couldn't get a handle on that doesn't mean it's not a part of her character.

File: wbbl.png (52KB, 304x170px) Image search: [Google]

52KB, 304x170px

>>78335156

When they hire women they often hire outcasts like Kate Leth who don't know what appeals to girls either.

>>78341885
She's also a bondage vore fetishist and unabashedly believes in the mental, physical and spiritual superiority of the female sex.

File: tumblr_nl2mxuiEcF1qhfir7o1_1280.png (281KB, 680x383px) Image search: [Google]

281KB, 680x383px

>>78337080
>MUH STRONG FEMALE LEAD

My only gripe with the whole "strong female lea" thing is that most of the time the entire story flat out just sucks. If you boot up netflix there is a whole playlist category dedicated to the strong female lead, and almost all of the movies have less than 3 stars. The only movie that doesn't bad ratings on the entire playlist is The Hunger Games.

I hope feminist writers and investors understand making a good story with a normal female lead, furthers the agenda than writing a subpar story with little to no funding and a golden female hero that is invincible.

>>78339298
great to know that you have faith in the future of america anon.

And you guys wonder why comic readers are viewed as a bunch of misogynists.

>>78341999
If I could I would wipe out 70% of the American population and force the remaining 30% living using only 18th century technology and equipment, to be hated and looked down on by all like the disgusting excuses of humanity they are.

>>78342028
I hate women, what of it? They're horrible, monstrous, barely even human, morally vacuous and stupid, unstable egos without a single shred of competence to back things up, they are the inferior gender.

>>78342060
>*We

>>78342099
Most people would just go for total destruction, I wan them to suffer in penitence.

>>78342097
lol

>>78341918
WW is so based.

>>78342097
edge harder, buddy.

>>78342297
Have you seen how they act? Complete sociopaths

>>78342297
>>78342128
Fuck women, fuck anything female. Even a female dog is inferior to a male one. Fuck them all, they can have their cake and eat it, I'm fucking done. I'm not doing it anymore, I'm done trying to impress these heathens, I'm done trying to jump through one hundred hoops to maintain the attention of a 5/10. I'm not fucking doing it anymore. These whores want to create an anti-male environment then so be it, there isn't enough 10/10 males to go around sweethearts so you better start looking up different breeds of cat to find which ones match the paint in your one bedroom apartment where you'll be living the rest of your life.

Seriously I'm fucking done.

>>78335068
Comics are for low life subhuman manchildren trash aka males.
Why would women with their superior tastes care about this obviously inferior medium?

>>78342097
>>78342458
Who hurt you anon?

What was her name?

>>78342623
Fuck off, women are terrible and inferior, there was a damn good reason why our ancestors treated them the way they did.

>>78342659
It's ok anon
I still love you

File: sip 28.jpg (17KB, 300x452px) Image search: [Google]

17KB, 300x452px

>>78342659
Okay love.

because they are trying to aim for the casual / normal girls

Japan aim to the batshit insane fujoshi

>>78342659
So what's her name? And remember you bitchy ass deserved it.

Because the business has become a bunch of pussies.

As a business we're moving towards trying to be inclusive, but if you make one god damn mistake (making a character attractive or a quip about something taboo) you get a bunch of shit.

File: bang.jpg (52KB, 720x480px) Image search: [Google]

52KB, 720x480px

>>78337230
>>78337351
>>78337415

It's honestly hilarious that /co/ is pretty much the only creative board that attracts a crowd who seriously hate mahou shoujo and find it offensive to their manly sensibilities. Pretty much everywhere else you'll find only the highest praise for Sailor Moon and even /lit/ acknowledges that Pretty Cure is secretly decent.

File: 1324259296781.jpg (13KB, 250x250px) Image search: [Google]

13KB, 250x250px

>>78345154
It's like a little boy who hates Barbie solely because it looks girly.

They probably haven't even watched it, just get turned off at anything that looks moe.

>>78335068
Because, no matter what American comics do, they will probably piss off girls in one way or another.