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Capeshit will crash soon.

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http://www.comicbookresources.com/article/tilting-at-windmills-trouble-on-the-horizon

>Events have burnout the core readership
>big two gimmicks are scarring away new reads
>comic shops are closing en masse

It has just begun!
>>
OP is a fag, as always.
>>
>>78297217
>gimmicks
Marvel has events and eternal #1, what is DC's gimmick? Cancelled books because they're not Batman?
>>
Good riddance.
>>
So, why hasn't
>Spaceshit
>War shit
>Comedy
>Action

Crashed yet?
>>
>>78297217
>Capeshit
And nothing of value was lost.
>>
>>78297217
Most comic shops closing will be horrible for every kind of comic, not just capes.

Also, there is a difference between capes and Marvel/DC. You can have capes and not be part of them.
>>
>>78297268
Why did Noir, Western, Musical and Romance crash?
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>>78297261
That or giving Batman and Superman minis to make up for shitty sales or something.
I wonder how much DKIII helped them
>>
Good. Fuck LCSs, Diamond and floppies. Both Marvel and DC are just glorified IP farms now.
>>
Probably.

I saw the Civil War trailer and Batman vs Superman trailer and gave 0 fucks. After AoU, I just knew it was gonna be the same shit.

Thank you based JJ
>>
>>78297376
Well, DKIII sold a lot, fuckton of variants helped.
Old Superman and Lois on the other hand...
>>
>>78297268
Because those can be about anything. They don't NEED men in tights. They're far, far broader than superhero stories.
>>
>>78297366
That was a thing of the past. Romance (50 shades of grey) is still big.
What you guys don't understand is, capeshit is immortal. 75+years.

It can also take many forms such as, cape adventure, space cape ect
>>
>>78297476
Random one offs don't discount the near death on a genera. Les Mis doesn't mean Musicals aren't dead compared to their peak.

And the same will happen to Cape movies too if things keep going the way they do, they won't vanish completely but it'll be few and far between.
>>
>>78297217
Seems like a lot more than capeshit will be affected, OP you dumbass.
>>
>>78297550
Next year will just solidify capeshit being the boss.
>>
To summarize the article, since I bet OP is CBR Staff Writer Brian Hibbs advertising his own work here on /co/ as a means of viral marketing:

>Most retailers[...]are looking at a mediocre Christmas season, and what looks like, so far, to be one of the weakest first quarters of product[...]in 26 years of selling comics. This could be really rough for a lot of participants going into 2016.

> DC Entertainment[...]took two months off publication of "regular" titles in order to smooth a cross-country move from New York to Burbank.

>DC came back in June with "DC You," an initiative that launched 21 new series[.]

>On the October sales charts, which represents the fifth issues of the initiative, only two of the 21 titles have sales over 30,000 copies. [...]At the same time, the changes to the core titles ("Batman," "Superman," etc.) appear to show the stalwart characters bleeding readers[.]

>We're too early in the process to see the actual impact of the "All-New All-Different" initiative at Marvel reflected in the published sales charts[...], but[...]the anecdotal reports[...]from retailer after retailer is that ANAD sell-through is generally pretty bad, with many of the books essentially just picking up at or below where they left off before the break[.]

>Marvel did something similar to DC: they took several months of production "off" on the regular titles for "Secret Wars" and a series of "SW" related miniseries. [...C]ustomers seemed deeply engaged in the entire "SW" experience... at least until "Secret Wars" started hitting unconscionable delays. "SW" sell-through then fell off the cliff, leaving many retailers with lots of unsold (and unsalable!) books[.]

>Marvel actually was starting to attract [new/young readers with] books like "Squirrel Girl," "Ms. Marvel" and the Jane Foster "Thor" title[...]. But that new/younger readership [doesn't] understand why you would start a book over again at #1[...a]nd that confusion appears to have shooed a number of them off.
>>
>>78297272

>>>/tv/
>>
Like the article says, it's just kind of a perfect storm of bad things happening.

Secret Wars went on too long and caused too many readers to check out but for a while it was an enormous success, especially in the face of Convergence.

DCYou was a valiant attempt at broadening the audience, but everyone knew at least half the books were gonna do poorly, DC is targeting the graphic novel buyers. That's where the money has been for them for the past few years.

With Marvel I'm surprised sales are down, because casuals eat up #1's. Maybe it really was a dumb idea to have multiple #1's in a year. I had anticipated Marvel continuing this pattern every five months for at least two years.

I'm not around teens enough to know anymore but I get the feeling that there's a little bit of burnout after Age of Ultron, not that I think it was worse than Hitler like /tv/, but I can sense that it didn't resonate with people nearly as much as the first one.

It's sad, because regardless of actual quality both companies are pursuing growth in the market and the audience for the first time in over a decade and they're not only being punished for it, they're losing the predictable drone like audience that kept them afloat during that decade.

I hope this finally motivates both companies to ditch fucking Diamond and stop relying on comic shops in general. Their core titles NEED to be in toy stores, book stores and grocery stores, where all their other products are selling. Specialty shops should be where hardcore fans go to get creator-owned books and less mainstream books, the way they were originally intended.
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>>78297476
Nah son see, Muslims, those fucks faggots like you are trying to defend? They don't read comics, it's absolutely harem.

Comics are trying to your fucking progressive faggot fedora wearing crowd and Muslims.

Which in turn alienate the loyal fanbase for a bunch of faggots that do not read comics.

Thus the crash is ensured. Congrats.
>>
>>78297476

>50 Shades of Grey is romance

No it isn't.
>>
>>78297683
>That's where the money has been for them for the past few years.
Didio actually said something about this a little while ago. He said something like digital grew a lot over the past few years but it's began to stagnate. However TPBs/bookstores are still the growing market now.

I imagine if DC and Marvel were allowed to lower the prices on digital issues, it wouldn't become stagnant. Paying 3.99 for something you don't physically own or paying for it at all may turn a lot of new readers away.
>>
>>78297806
>Paying 3.99 for something you don't physically own or paying for it at all may turn a lot of new readers away.
Imagine if digital costed more because they don't have ads.
>>
>In an equivalent sales period, our sales of the first issues of all of those series are actually below (dramatically so in the case of "Thor!") the final issues of the "old series" -- which was only on issue #8 for two of the three! But readers appear to be treating the relaunches as simply "issue #9." That's not typical consumer behavior.

Holy shit. Has the #1 bubble finally burst?
>>
>>78297461
Not really.

Uber for example, is capeshit.
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>>78298004
I fucking hope so. The constant re-launches are a pain in the ass.
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>>78297278
Good. Comic books are inherently shit, so the medium finally dying will only benefit the world.
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>>78298107
>>
>>78298052
> nazi DBZ with power levels
That can die, too.
>>
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>You have lived to see the sweet release of capeshit and the rise of mango/animu
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>>78298143
Wut
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>>78297278
It is nothing but good news for independents if the mainstream comics that have been dominated for 70 years by the same genre finally go down in flames.
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>>78298189
Is it really? Or is it just news? People not buying Capes doesn't mean they're buying your shit.
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>>78298143
>>78298167
He's a time traveler. Obviously, he's in the late 90s/early 2000s.
>>
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Thank god
>>78298230
Not that anon but manga and anime keeps getting more popular everyday, not mid 2007 levels but it's rising.
>>
>>78298189
People will still not buy their shit.

Don't be delusional.
>>
>>78298189
>independents
Indie-fags, fuck off. Indies are worthless garbage made by sweaty neckbeards in their basements.

All comics are bad, but indieshit is THE worst.
>>
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>>78298306
>>
>>78298221
It's not about short term sales, it's about perception. Comics are all seen as pulpy kids stories because that's what the mainstream presents them as, and because of the innate campiness of caped crusaders, no matter how much grit you sprinkle on over top.

Maybe breaking that image means breaking down the pillars enforcing it.
>>
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>>78298306
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>>78297268
those were obliterated 50 years ago already what worse could happen to comics that don't exist anymore?
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>>78298052
Only if you claim anything with superhumans is capeshit is Uber remotely a superhero comic.
>>
>>78297278
>Most comic shops closing will be horrible for every kind of comic
no they wont idiot

do you think people like thurber or santoro or deforge make their money from comic shops?
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>>78298143
>>78298288
>Hollywood making GitS and Death Note movies
I'm relieved that they're going to be a failure I don't want anime to be the next capeshit
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>>78298452
What you classify as superhero comic?Because Hellboy, Uber and Lobster Jonhsin could count in most definitions.
>>
>>78297376
>I wonder how much DKIII helped them

It sold 450,000 issues for 1# and wont experience the same drop offs all the "on going" Marvel titles have as it's a mini finishing off one of comics biggest stories (Even if the TDKSA WAS SHIT) it will do 150,000 all the way to the end
>>
>>78298143
>there are anons on /co/ right now who can't enjoy both manga and comics

Let me guess, you're here for the cartoons and only read storytimes.
>>
>>78298473
I want Japan to start making movie adaptation of American comics.
>>
>>78298516
I enjoy both I just hate how fucked up is the comic industry.
>>
>>78297217

I've been saying the MCU will die after Infinty war for ages now but faggots are like "But they have movies planned after it!" You know why Peter Jackson cut the scouring of the Shire? Because it's anticlimactic. Do you think people are going to care about "Black man argues with white man about metal" and "The not mutants" after that? They may still make a profit but we're looking at Ant-Man levels or less
>>
>>78297683
marvel burned the casuals who were loving avengers now by trashing all their new series then putting them on hiatus for months before it had even been the standard 12 issues.
>>
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>>78298516
> capeshit == all comics
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>>78298366
But at the same time that's not so much enforced by actual comics but rather a stereotype propagated by noncomic readers. The perception isn't just comics are capeshit the perception is comics are capeshit from 50 years ago.
>>
>>78297217
This is actually a really interesting article. It's nice to hear from a retail operator on what's working, as opposed to a random guy on 4chan or a blogger pushing diversity.
>>
>>78297626
Good to know that Marvel isn't totally invulnerable from making mistakes
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>>78298506
The #2 issue and probably onward have a 1:500 variant too.
>>
>>78297217
Didn't a buncha people say this shit like ten years ago and the industry didn't give a shit and just continued the harmful practices?
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>>78298729
I think you mean invulnerable from their shoddy ass tactics.
>>
>>78297278
>Most comic shops closing will be horrible for every kind of comic, not just capes.

No, it'll just be horrible for Diamond Comics, and they fucking deserve it. Comic books are considered a segregated geek thing in the USA because of capeshit and because you can only buy them at dedicated comic book shops. At every other part of the world, you can find comics at a news stand or in a library and they are culturally accepted for every age. Heck, Archie still manages to sell as much as capeshit because they are available everywhere, not just comic book shops.
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>>78298143
>>You have lived to see the sweet release of capeshit and the rise of mango/animu
> and then you lived to see the mango/amimu bubble burst in the middle of the late 00s recession due to their own shitty marketing gimmicks and oversaturation
>>
Launching number 1 every time was a stupid idea and people finally caught on.
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>>78297217
>taking CBR clickbait seriously
>>
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>>78298845
>Stu Levy will always be in control of Tokyopop until either he or the company dies
>>
>>78298815
The general public perception is that with the film adaptations being as hot as they are, they can do whatever the fuck they want with the comics and people will still lap them up, regardless of quality
>>
>>78298845
Yeah, I don't think people realize just how badly the bubble burst for the anime/manga back in 2006. It has recovered and even improved in a lot of areas, but it's nowhere near the level it once was.

I foresee another crash coming. The similarities to the 90s bubble are there. (especially with all the variant covers.)

The only way I see the industry surviving long term is a massive digital push combined with getting key books back in general stores, supermarkets, and places like hot topic again. Plus Diamond can't keep the stranglehold/monopoly they currently have.
>>
>>78298845
The American manga market's actually had a pretty healthy resurgence in the last two or three years. Not as ridiculous as the late aughts obviously, but the market's in a very good place right now.
>>
>>78298965
Was Secret Wars not the worst event since Civil War, perhaps even eclipsing it in pure awful?
>>
>>78298819
90% of the bullshit that is considered "KEWL" by the Ellisians and the SJW thug sect would NEVER fucking fly on newstands or at retail. Fuckers and their violence, explicit sex and swearing, and fag agenda pushing snobbery would never fly at Wal-Mart or local grocery stores.

You'd need to purge the entire comic industry of the cancerous degeneracy to get comics at non-comic shops to work. Which means killing the entire indie system of comics and only doing safe for nerds and fanboys bullshit
>>
>>78299051
Yeah because of AoT
>>
>>78299056
SW5 was pretty good.

The delays, #5 (the infamous filler issue) and fucking cancelling the entire Marvel Universe line for 8 months killed the momentum halfway through.
>>
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>>78298845
>cine-manga
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>>78299026
Diamond won't let them put their books in those places.
Plus Didio said that while the digital market rapidly grew, it has started to stagnate. Bookstores and trades are the market that's still growing.
>>
>Capeshit will crash soon
That's fine.
>>
>How about the new and young readership? Marvel actually was starting to attract some of them at our stores -- books like "Squirrel Girl," "Ms. Marvel" and the Jane Foster "Thor" title were racking solid sales for us outside of the "traditional" Marvel customer. But that new/younger readership? They literally don't understand why you would start a book over again at #1. It makes no sense to them! And that confusion appears to have shooed a number of them off. In an equivalent sales period, our sales of the first issues of all of those series are actually below (dramatically so in the case of "Thor!") the final issues of the "old series" -- which was only on issue #8 for two of the three! But readers appear to be treating the relaunches as simply "issue #9." That's not typical consumer behavior.

This pleases me.

Restarting everything but not really restarting it is going to fuck over some audiences, especially those not interested in the core titles.
>>
>>78299131
AoT on is old and busted Tokyo Ghoul has been the new hotness for a while
http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2015-12-18/new-york-times-manga-best-seller-list-december-6-12/.96689
>>
>>78299261
>Tokyo Ghoul
To me that just reads as a less inspired version of Pre-Soul Society arc Bleach
>>
>>78298516
>implying I'm here for the storytimes
>>
>>78299105
>Fuckers and their violence, explicit sex and swearing, and fag agenda pushing snobbery would never fly at Wal-Mart or local grocery stores.

Well maybe it's time that they should start doing good stories, not edgy bullshit.
>>
>>78297217
All they have to do is put out a new round of #1s
>>
>>78297626
>>Marvel did something similar to DC: they took several months of production "off" on the regular titles for "Secret Wars" and a series of "SW" related miniseries. [...C]ustomers seemed deeply engaged in the entire "SW" experience... at least until "Secret Wars" started hitting unconscionable delays. "SW" sell-through then fell off the cliff, leaving many retailers with lots of unsold (and unsalable!) books[.]
I saw a few retailers say that almost all the Secret Wars tie ins (except obvious fanboy bait like Renew Your Vows) had really bad drop in, and the trade collections for these came out so fast that now they have trades they can't sell sitting next to issues that didn't sell
>>
>>78299568
Next month just start every comic at issue 1. Don't interrupt or change anything about the story just restart the issue number and maybe change the title.

Instant dosh.
>>
I don't know what the hell is going on, but it seems like more and more companies -- across all types (video games, comics, music, some TV/film) -- are just completely out of sync about who their [target] audience is and how their audience consumes their product.

Comics are down because -- in the eyes of the new target audience -- they're a horrible investment. Not investment in the sense of reselling, but investment in the sense that I'll probably enjoy a $2.99-$3.99 cup of coffee more than I'll enjoy a comic book at that same price. And it just feels like they're pulling more and more away from making a single, individual issue a fun and complete thing to read.

This dance of "Here's a one-sixth of story! Read it and you'll keep reading this series forever!" would work if:
1) There were fewer competing distractions (e.g. if we weren't in a Golden Age of television, if Netflix didn't exist, if the internet were less addictive).
2) Reading a comic were less of a painful experience -- going out of your way to a comic shop is already a pain in the ass, but add in the fact that you're not going to get much bang for your buck and that you have to do this on at least a monthly (but more often weekly/bi-weekly basis) and you've got a recipe for, "Fuck this, let's just stay at home."

These are all genuine fucking concerns to someone who's brand new to comics, but they may not consciously voice them. Comic companies seem to only listen to the people who are already hooked enough to buy comics in the first place, but -- as you can clearly see with Marvel and DC -- that's not their only target audience anymore.

Put simply, when these comics sold at their best, they weren't just affordable: the average person (and this "average person" was really a normal person, not just a normal-ish comic book aficionado) felt that their money was being well-spent.
>>
>>78299584
>the trade collections for these came out so fast that now they have trades they can't sell sitting next to issues that didn't sell
Hilarious
>>
>>78299627
Might as well release every comic as a #1. Even multi-part stories get one-shots with a decimal point after the "#1".
>>
fwiw all of the people I know read independent and local comics or webcomics either for lack or funds or lack of time//bc i wanna read shit my friends are making but only really have time for that.
>>
>>78299744
>1) There were fewer competing distractions (e.g. if we weren't in a Golden Age of television, if Netflix didn't exist, if the internet were less addictive).
>2) Reading a comic were less of a painful experience -- going out of your way to a comic shop is already a pain in the ass, but add in the fact that you're not going to get much bang for your buck and that you have to do this on at least a monthly (but more often weekly/bi-weekly basis) and you've got a recipe for, "Fuck this, let's just stay at home."
Both of these are probably why the trade/bookstore market is growing

With a trade you DO get a complete story, even if one trade isn't a complete run on a book it's still a bigger, better chunk than single issues, and you can get a trade really quick off Amazon or whenever you're at a bookstore, you don't need to head to an LCS once a week or month
>>
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Yessssss, soon we will grow from the ashes. stronger better.
>>
>Books meant to appeal to the "core" audience don't appeal to new readers and different demographics
>Gimmicks meant to move books with the core audience and casuals also don't appeal to new readers and different demographics
>Books meant to appeal to new readers/new audience don't appeal to the core audience and the core audience doesn't want floppies anyway
>the core audience just seems tired of everything and new readers aren't growing at a fast enough rate

what do?
>>
A comic shop opened right next to me recently and I feel bad for not going there but I know I'd feel worse to actually go and see it totally empty.
>>
>>78299970
Just go in and buy something. Your life isn't a Seinfeld episode. Nothing will go wrong. Buy a trade, buy a pack of Magic cards, start a pull-list, whatever.
>>
>>78299871
>>78299217
>>78298143
>le dead industry maymay
>>
>>78298965
Idiot, Hibbs has been writing that column long before CBR existed and he actually runs a comic shop for the past 20+ years.

He knows his shit far more than most on CBR.
>>
>>78298062

Marvel has been doing it too often as of late and with too much at once.
>>
>>78299970

I feel bad about never going to mine anymore the guy is chill and one of the few friends I had in high school works there now. Digital and trades is just so much simpler and takes up a lot less space than cabinets and boxes.
>>
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>>78297388
>equating local business with Diamond, Marvel, and DC
>>
>>78297626
Nah, OP just posts on that other gamergate-related chan and Hibbs doesn't kowtow to Marvel like CBR does.
>>
>>78297476
>50 Shades Of Grey =/= Romance

Its literally a kink movie
>>
>IPs that generate billions in multiple formats will die soon


Yeah, nice wishful thinking there anon, but no.
Thread posts: 99
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