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Why does Marvel have such a Cap beating/fighting Ironman fetish?

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Why does Marvel have such a Cap beating/fighting Ironman fetish?

If they're trying to liken it to Superman/Batman they're forgetting a few things
>Batman is 1-0 against Supermam, Cap is 2-0 against Tony in the 616 (both wins in the last decade too)
>Batmans win was in an elseworlds so doesn't even count
>Batman v Superman is meaningful because they're DCs posterboys, the most popular heroes in the real world, brains v brawn, a dream match for some
>Cap and IM literally aren't even the best selling avengers (Thor) so who is even demanding this pairing?
>Why does Cap even win? Isn't Tony supposed to have more fans?
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Fuck Tony, that's why
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>>77844318
>Why does Marvel have such a Cap beating/fighting Ironman fetish?

Colors.
Blue and red look good on paper.
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Tony won their first fight in Civil War.
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>>77844318
>Batman is 1-0 against Supermam
False
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>>77844359
nah

Cap had him beat, "losing" was his own choice
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It's literally because they want their own Superman and Batman complete with one being a moral archetype and one being morally ambiguous depending on perspective.
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>>77844372
I'm thinking TDKR

but I probably missed something in The Ultimates so it balances
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>>77844318
I mean, if anyone deserves it it's Tony.
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>>77844388
>One was life and one was death!
>And one always wins!
Meh.
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>>77844413
He didn't even win in that. Unless it's New 52 Batman has never won.
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>>77844413
Superman and Batman fight regularly. N52 has made the outcomes more even but prior to that Superman won a lot of the time. Lex Luthor: Man of Steel is the first thing that comes to mind, for example.
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>>77844483
>Johns' Justice League where he fights both Lantern and Batman
>Batman literally just gives up
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>>77844469
He won in Red Son before Wonder Woman helped Superman.

He also won in TDKSA but that probably doesn't count under the same rule because he had Flash, Atom and GA helping him.
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>>77844500
Good, that's how it should be
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>He even had an armour like Bruce would use
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>>77844503
Even DKR doesn't count, then, considering he had Robin and GA helping.
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Storytime? Storytime.
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>>77845543
>Hackman
pls no
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>>77845579
Strap in, son
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>>77844318
>Why does Marvel have such a Cap beating/fighting Ironman fetish?
Because Civil War was successful (for a comic book).

And because they make good contrasts, one being a naive good natured liberty loving poor kid and the other being a slick cocky control freak millionaire.

Did they even fight seriously before Civil War? I know they scrapped here and there once in a while before (in Armor Wars II for instance) but they never had Batman VS Superman heat until Civil War.

The most memorable core Avengers smackdown I can remember prior to that was when Thor was temporarily king of Asgard and was fucking with politics on Earth as a result of fighting some shitty fascist regime
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The Shi'ar are the biggest bitch boys in the galaxy
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>>77845686
IM was a C-lister before Civil War and Cap was/is a B-lister
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>>77845780
All three of them were B-Listers before the movies. Marvel's most popular characters before the Marvel movies blew up were Wolverine, Spider-Man, and Hulk.

Now it's those three plus Cap and Iron Man. And maybe Thor? He doesn't seem as popular as the other two, though. Probably because his solo movies are a bit tepid.
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>>77844318
Any time Steve win against Tony, you can just ignore it and claim it as bad writing. There is no way that Steve in that obsolete piece of shit should be capable of fighting Tony in his suit 1v1. Not to mention the fact that he is an old man that is using a suit that only slightly increases his strength. Probably even weaker than Spider-man and Cage in terms of strength.
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>>77845686
>And because they make good contrasts, one being a
>naive
not really, he has killed people

>good natured
can't think of anything he has done that reflects this, e.g Batman is good natured in that he is occasionally shown to care about his villains

>liberty loving
meaningless buzzword, really, everyone loves "liberty"

>poor kid
sure, doesn't reflect in him these days though

>and the other being a slick cocky
only in the movies

>control freak millionaire.
ok
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>>77845817
Tony was solid C list, he wasn't even included in the first Marvel/DC crossover

Spider-man and the X-men title are still in a league of their own

>Now it's those three plus Cap and Iron Man. And maybe Thor? He doesn't seem as popular as the other two, though. Probably because his solo movies are a bit tepid.
Thor has always sold better than Cap and Ironman, Ironman sells like absolute dogshit
and if you're talking about movies the first Cap movie did shit at the box office

Comic sales
Thor > Cap > IM

Movie ticket sales
IM > Thor > Cap
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>>77845865
The end of the world and this fucker want to spending his last time for a fight with Tony. God, I hate so much this Captain America, even more than Superior dick Tony.
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I don't think Marvel could ever match the homoerotic tension that goes on in a Batman/Superman fight
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>doesn't even count

You can tell this guy cares for the quality of the narrative and definitely is not just lame fanboy.
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>>77844318
Superman is a alien who can destory planets by flexing and Bruce is just some guy who works out a lot. Fights between them represent man vs god and are suppose to show that man can only defeat god when god allows it, even when man prepares his best.

On the other hand, Tony is a smart guy who uses technology to defeat his foes, Steve is a heroic guy who is the pinnacle of humanity. Their fights represent human ingenuity vs human will, and while ingenuity wins most of the time you're often forced to ask the question of if it's a good thing.
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>>77844318
>>Batman v Superman is meaningful because they're DCs posterboys, the most popular heroes in the real world, brains v brawn, a dream match for some
>Brain vs Brawn
ugh how has Superman fallen so badly.
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>>77846316
Superman is brains, Batman is brawn.
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>>77846140
>Steve is a heroic guy who is the pinnacle of humanity.
are you implying Tony isn't?
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>>77845817
Thor is just harder to get a grasp on and reference, but Hemsworth became a sexual icon being a one character actor.
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>>77845822
But IM is a bitch ass motherfucker and Captain has always been fucking R A W and a real nigga.
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>>77845878
You seem to have forgotten all characters in Marvel 616 continuity have been changed to turn into their MCU counterpart.
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>>77845817
>movies

Could you please stay within the context of the board?
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>>77846414
Not OP, but he outright isn't and has never been. He was dodgy at best as a C lister, and in the MCU he's only cleaning up after his own mess. The best Tony has eve been was when he was killing commies by the thousands when we all thought that was the bee's knees.
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>>77846414
Tony is a alcoholic arms dealer who had to explode and get kidnapped by bad guys to decide that maybe living his life selfishly wasn't a good thing.
Steve would've fought WW2 as a ninety pound weakling if given the chance.

One of these is not like the other.
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>>77846000
I still don't see Cap's problem. Everything dies. Everyone knew that from the beginning. Cap would have just rolled over, Tony knew he'd fail, but tried anyway. You can't ask more than that.
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>>77846611
>>77846530
Fine

but Spidey is more heroic
Tony could still be called the pinnacle of humanity due to intelligence

so I'm failing to see what makes Cap special
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>>77846611
That was the young-old Cap. This one is just a superior asshole.
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>>77846654
Then read some Captain America comics.
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>>77846654
>but Spidey is more heroic
>Took his uncle dying to get a message across
>didnt do anything heroic ot brave until he got his powers
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>>77846614
Cap is butthurt because the Illuminati kick him away like some kind of minor character. He is also a character who refuses compromises and in such a situation, his ideals are more important than survival.
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>>77846399
Bless your heart anon.
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>>77846614
I don't know if you've noticed, but Cap's stubborn approach to values can kind of turn him into a gigantic asshole when confronting Tony over stuff they could easily talk over and come to an agreement on.

Marvel tries to play Cap off as the hero too righteous to compromise his values, and to his credit, usually they're successful with that portrayal, but when confronted with actual complex problems, it makes him seem more like a big kid that gets really mad if you tell him he's wrong about something.

There is literally no reason for him to be mad at Tony about anything he did during the incursion events.

I think that's why I'm starting to get hyped about the Civil War movie so much. Adding Bucky into the equation makes Cap's stubbornness about his stance a lot more personal in nature, and Starks less of an asshole and more of a guy that's trying really hard to do the right thing in light of his fuck-ups. It feels a lot more like what Civil War should have been in the first place; rather than a conflict of ideals, it'a a conflict between two men in unique, difficult positions that puts them at odds.
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>>77844318
>Batman is 1-0 against Supermam

He's 2-3-5 actually.
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>>77846909
>Marvel tries to play Cap off as the hero too righteous to compromise his values, and to his credit, usually they're successful with that portrayal, but when confronted with actual complex problems, it makes him seem more like a big kid that gets really mad if you tell him he's wrong about something.

>Cap you can't turn right on that street
>Yes I can
>Cap it clearly says no right turns
>You can't stop me
>Cap you are breaking the law
>NO YOU MOVE
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>>77847018
I kek'd, but simple minded people will not only think this is bait, but will actually have infuriated responses to it.
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>>77844318
>Cap and IM literally aren't even the best selling avengers (Thor)
really?
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>>77844318
What a shit version of TDK.

Also are they still trying to sell the Cap/Tony friendship? Like continuity is a fucking mess at Marvel since Tony is suddenly all kawaii uguu under Bendis, he's a jackass under Waid who mentions him and Steve are in bad terms, and in Uncanny Duggan has him talking to Tony like shit is OK between them.
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>>77846614
He got mad about them wanting to destroy other planets with people still in it, of course Steve wasn't going to be OK with that.

But he also wasn't there when Tony, Panther, and T'challa backed down from that and for some retarded reason no one bothered telling Steve they weren't doing that anymore and that Strange and Namor were the ones who destroyed the pastiche Justice League (and that is coming back to bite them in the ass in the form of the Squadron Supreme)

Of course Hickman wanted to do some stupid Captain Ahab and Moby Dick shit with Steve and the Illuminati whereas in All-New Invaders Robinson had Steve angry at Namor for the Illuminati shit but he was also willing to put that aside and work with him and in the end they ended up having a moment but Marvel Editors give no shits.

But Steve can never win anyway, Tony can shit on things and not get any serious repercussion for his actions and now that Bendis is writing him he did nothing wrong.
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>>77846909
What with Winter Soldier killing Stark's parents he has some personal stake in it.

But really Steve is mostly protecting Bucky rather than not wanting him to face justice, he knows how corrupted governments and organizations can be and if he just hands Bucky over they will have him Winter Soldiering again in no time.

Not to mention some of the people going after him want him dead and no one besides Steve really has Bucky's best interest in mind, if Steve could guarantee a fair trial for Bucky he would be OK with turning him in provided he os permitted to see Bucky as well.
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>Stark is a lazy kek who uses technology to cut corners and keep him out of direct danger
>Steve confronts problems head-on and solves them through sheer exertion of his abilities even though it's possible for him to get killed

>Stark believes the end justifies the means and is more concerned about the big picture to worry about ruining other people's lives
>Steve will flat-out stop being a superhero if it means having to do something that even slightly betrays his values and morals

>Stark is shit because he's a pompous jackass who thinks he knows what's best for everybody
>Steve is shit because he's short-sighted and believes in dealing with problems as they come instead of taking preventive steps to stop them from even happening
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>>77844413
Dude they've fought like a million times.

Unless we're ONLY counting actual, currently canon (or at least post-Crisis)fights WITHOUT mind control. There's been a small handful of those and Superman always wins.
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>>77847294
Been that way for years, since it's relaunch after Ragnarok with JMS period

>>77847705
Marvel continuity always falls apart if you read a character in more than one book
One of the reasons crossovers are so shit
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>>77848305
Before the Phoenix shit, the characterization of Cyclops was pretty solid and uniform.
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>>77846882
>implying Superman wouldn't hold back against Bruce
>implying Batman wouldn't bring out his big guns for Superman
>implying that's not exactly what happened in Miller's book
Thread posts: 97
Thread images: 44


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