So, just gonna spoil that while we get a very intriguing ending, it doesn't seem to really lead into Robin War all that well. Robin War #1 will likely feature a couple pages about Dick, I'm guessing. Otherwise #15 won't make much sense.
Best variant ever. Also one of two variants this year that actually reference Dick's 75th. Dick deserved his own variant month...
Oh right, I should mention Mooney is filling in. Janin was busy on Grayson #15, what with it coming out the second week of December. Expect both #15 and 16 to look particularly good since he had more time to work on them.
...This page was supposed to go before the splash page. I'm sorry.
This comes after the splash.
Now continues normally.
Is this normal for Ladytron?
The lore is coming.
At first, I had no idea what Dick was doing there. I thought he was going to get knocked out by some gas.
But nope, turns out he's just doing what Tiger did in #11.
Katarina the qt.
Also they're literally so close to just calling her Kathy now.
Someone was at the door, so I had to shoo them away so I could return to qt Kathy.
>"...take me into yourself..."
Kathy does not approve.
Oh right, I forgot to comment on the fact that HE WAS SPYDER THE WHOLE TIME.
>All-out Spyral War is coming
>Dick vs Helena vs Minos vs Kathy vs Elisabeth vs Otto
I can feel it in my bones.
Poor Middy. Also, I bet Malevo is a reference to something that I don't know.
>Yfw you won't be pushed to the ground and dominated by Tiger as he holds your neck in one hand
In this case, it seems pretty clear that #14 is going to lead into #16, with #15 just being a break in the story arc. Makes me suspect that Robin War was supposed to be much smaller, but had Grayson added to it late in development to raise its profile.
So how do you all think this will play a part in the Kathy vs Luka with regards to Dick in #11 and Kathy saying what Spyral wants in #8?
Dropping so many plot and hints and it'll take forever to get the whole picture. ;_;
>Makes me suspect that Robin War was supposed to be much smaller, but had Grayson added to it late in development to raise its profile.
No need to suspect, that's how they announced it. Just the bookend issues, Son of Batman, Gotham Academy, and We Are Robin were part of it then they added the rest of the Batline in.
It was originally even smaller than that. King said it was originally just an annual.
It was probably going to just be Damian learning about the other kids but helping them anyway.
I just want to say Kathy is definitely my "new" waifu. And by new, I mean I've known her character for so long now, but this book goes a long way in... somehow making her come across as endearing.
Have to give it a couple flaws so it doesn't seem so op though
Confusing and hurting the user after so long is a bit more fair than letting them do all that mind control and disguising shit willy nilly
He removes them so Spyral can't see what he's doing. He has to remove them painfully. They actually don't do anything to you when you use it. Again, he just needed to rip them off like Tiger did in #11.
Also the trade-off for having such an OP implant is that one, only people who've had serious training and experience with it (or someeone naturally charismatic and influential like Dick) could use it effectively, and two, most of Spyal's agents prefer not to use it unless necessary (Dick doesn't like manipulating people much, Helena is too good to use Hypnos unless it's necessary, Tiger is supposedly the best of Spyral's agents and he strikes me as the kind of guy who would rather never use Hypnos, etc.).
Issue 6 or 7, whichever one was the one with this
I just hate it whenever someone retcon Morrison's work.
"Frau" Netz, or Dr. Netz is Elisabeth Netz.
Agent Zero aka Luka Netz is Katerina aka Kathy Kane.
Nah, it's more like Dick and the Batfamily now have access to it, as well. This means Dick can actually use it to it's full extent, without being hit with it himself (Minos and Luka have both down this, but as we know, Luka is no longer "immune" to him anymore). Spyral can still see through his Hypnos. There's nothing anyone can do about that, you can do the movie cliche thing and just replay the same scene over and over, Spyral is too smart for that.
Just reread Grayson #6. After reading RSoB #6 and Goliath's origin, I wish Dick took him in as a pet/gift for Damian. Nothing screams good pet like "Bat-zombie-Orca-thing-with-legs-yay."
SeeKing is too based.
And yeah, I read it. I stand by my earlier comment somewhat. I was wrong in that users don't get hurt when using it, but they aren't physically. Hel got hit by post-mental interrogation trauma, which is a direct result of interrogating a crazy Fist of Cain member, so it's not the norm, either. But, yes, they do get hurt when using it sometimes.
>"Marry your noble, young Batman, Katherine."
Kathy is going for the Dick, confirmed!
I don't see much of a retcon aside from the fact that Kathy wasn't given away as a baby. She still hates her dad.
If anything, this simplifies it. It's a lot easier to go in this direction than just saying Kathy was Batwoman, when there is no indication there ever was a Batwoman other than Kate. Another thing, if Kathy is the new Agent Zero, someone so good that Batman is just another pawn in her scheme, then it would be a lot better if she was raised to be a spy from a young age, and stayed that way. Why would Batwoman suddenly be good enough to be better than Batman?
Of course, you could always say he used his Hypnos to make her think she was Kathy Kane instead of Katerina Netz, while she was still young. She went to Gotham, where she was raised there, and even joined Batman and Robin as Batwoman for a time, then the effects of the Hypnos wore off, as Otto instended, so that she remembered, faked her death, and then later received her own Hypnos to go back to Bruce and Dick to make them forget all about her. After that she started her plans. Done.
>If anything, this simplifies it. It's a lot easier to go in this direction than just saying Kathy was Batwoman, when there is no indication there ever was a Batwoman other than Kate.
But i like Kathy as the original Batwoman. It worked in Batman Inc and enriched a lot the Kane family. I'd hate if they retcon out her time as Batwoman and Batman's lover. Heck, that would completely destroy the ending of the second volume of Batman Inc.
>Another thing, if Kathy is the new Agent Zero, someone so good that Batman is just another pawn in her scheme, then it would be a lot better if she was raised to be a spy from a young age, and stayed that way. Why would Batwoman suddenly be good enough to be better than Batman?
But Kathy was a spy... she just didn't knew Otto Netz was her father.
>Of course, you could always say he used his Hypnos to make her think she was Kathy Kane instead of Katerina Netz, while she was still young.
That'd be better for me.
Here. Kathy was a spy before being recruted to Spyral by El Gaucho.
>Kathy was a spy...
Also, I don't think Inc. is really treated as something that actually happened as shown. It's like, you can think of Inc. Vol. 2 as like the story that takes place right in between the last story preboot and first story reboot... except for a lot of the aftermath of course. That makes it hard to really place solidly. I think it should be looked at like a lot of older Batman stories, even including stuff like DickBats: It happened, but possibly not exactly as it did then.
Also yeah, I'm kinda liking the idea of Netz manipulating Kat into thinking she was a Kane, just because I'd like the Batwoman thing to stay. Dick would have a closer relationship with her, in that case.
She owned a CIRCUS? Damn, if she was the same age as Dick, this would be the OTP for me. Actually, I like that idea...
Also, motion to start using super short names for the cast? Dick and Middy can stay of course.
And that's about it for the most important characters, where typing up their full names is tiring.
>Damn, if she was the same age as Dick, this would be the OTP for me
But her being older is what makes it so hot
tfw no milf femdom last issue
You know what would be cool? If King and Seeley managed to include Beth Kane somewhere. I just want to see them acknoloding the Batwoman & Bat-Girl days somehow. It could be something as simple as Kathy watching Beth play tennis from afar.
>Wait, shouldn't Betty/Bette herself at least have a sister called Kat or something?
Yeah give her an older sister, but spell it "Kathryn" or something just to be a little different.
Like Elizabeth vs Elisabeth and Catherine vs Katherine
You know that one time a Starfire thread became a Dick thread the moment Dick showed up?
I feel like this thread is literally moments away from becoming a Kane family thread. I approve.
Yes, I'm really starting to like the idea. Originally, I just wanted the bondage scene to actually happen, as I though it would be hot. But now I actually want it to be more than just
Dick tied to the bed.
>I feel like this thread is literally moments away from becoming a Kane family thread
>But now I actually want it to be more than just
Dick tied to the bed.
All are good ideas
pls no kinkshame anon
And your point is...?
Seriously, though, yeah I doubt SeeKing will come through on this front. But, if they did, remember this is a reboot, and that Batman and Batwoman don't have to be a couple for that part of their history to be relevant to Kat. They still cared about each other and worked together.
Besides, Dick is 21 and Bruce is 32. If Kat is like 26, it would be fine. The timeline is bullshit, but even if they did adhere to it, you could go back 6 years and Bruce would be 26 and Kat would be 20. Weird, I know, but considering Catwoman is 23 while Bruce is 32, it's not that bad.
>inb4 CatDick ship
...Wait, okay, I'm keeping this part in my post, just so I can say this:
>Cat/Dick/Kat: Bruce gets Keked.
Not all of them are Katherine or Elizabeth! There's still Martha. And Adeline Kane Wilson, who isn't officially related to the Gotham Kanes but would fit right in if they did a retcon
I'll stop when they stop making covers like this
But did that happen after the reboot? I feel like if they were to keep her time as a Kane in at all, they would make it easier for themselves by just making her "adopted." Then again, SeeKing aren't known for taking the easy way out. Plus, I don't think they'll try to make Kat close in age to Dick.
>the part of tumblr that loves this book
Bruv, the only part of tumblr that likes Grayson is the small part that is still relatively sane. That part of tumblr won't see this white priveledge shit that you're talking about.
I think you mean the very loud part of tumblr that absolutely hates this book, and that's nothing new. Also, which POC is he fighting in the first place?
>Netz is capable of transferring his consciousness to other bodies.
Well, I'm glad someone was paying attention to what he was saying in Inc,
Literally gave it away for me, kek. Of course, I'd already known Seeley was doing this one while King worked on Robin War, I'd just forgotten until then. I had to stop reading just to make sure I read it right. It was then that I realized only Seeley would've written that.
Nicola Scott. I mean, if it was possible, which it isn't. If only...
Russell Dauterman would also be really great. Loved his Nightwing issues.
I've always loved Karl Kerschl (and so Mingjue Helen Chen would be great as well, their work on Gotham Academy is similar enough, love them both), but it depends on the story of course. Neither really matches Grayson, but drawing Dick as Robin would be absolutely awesome.
Also, just wanted to mention that we need Jeromy Cox on colours, like it's unbelievable how much he actually brings to the table. He is necessary to make fill-in art look consistent with the rest of Grayson.
They get that obnoxious or somethin'? Jesus
I'd read it, though it'd probably be best to start it's own thread, as I was only asking here since it was a Batman/Robin related one, and Dick's a main character in Eternal
Middy is relevant to Grayson right? Here's a (surprisingly early) preview for #7
>tfw Matt's plan is to date/fuck every single super hero to get close to them
Obviously, his plan is to get at Apollo.
>"Hey dipshit, I fucked your bf and then I killed him! Come at me!"
Of course, he won't get that far.
Because Middy has already called in both Dick and Apollo for back-up, and we'll finally get a Dick/Apollo team-up... It'll never happen, will it?And then Dick can make some Teen Titans > Prometheus quip and end it... until somehow Middy gets fucked and ends up as Spyral property as Dick runs to Gotham for Robin War.
Those are a lot of opposing sides. And soon even more characters will be introduced.
We already know that two of them are Grifter and King Faraday, any hints as to the others? Aside from the obvious that they represent some of the various other superspy groups namedropped in the series.
Only one dude left we aren't sure of. Some people said it might be Jack Hawksmoor though, it does look like him a bit and Stormwatch is a secret organization in the New52.
Glad they stopped that with the bat books. It really derailed Nightwing. I liked the concept behind two of the three status quos and bith were wasted.
They never did finish the mask killer storyline did they?
>They never did finish the mask killer storyline did they?
I can't remember which one you're talking about, but I highly doubt they did. Or if he did, it was done in an unsatisfactory way.
There was a villain being built up to in Chicago that killed most of its heroes. It was revealed he was the one cop but the book itself never dealt with him. Wasn't sure if something else did.
How did a comic about Dick owning the circus and a theme park turn out so boring
That was so frustrating. They gave him a home and a girlfriend and then they killed her, so he got another home and another girlfriend and then he left town, so he got ANOTHER girlfriend...
I hope Grayson doesn't end with blowing up the entire status quo when someone decides he needs to be Nightwing again. I mean, it will, but I can hope.
Yeah I hate to say this, because Mooney seems like a great guy, but this issue could've really used Mikel Janin's art. The robo-spider fight and SPYRAL freaking out at Helena could've looked way more dramatic than it did. There were panels I liked, though.
OP here, also the one who said he would storyimte BRE, so I gotchu senpai.
Yeah, I feel the same way.
Higgins revealed all of his future plot points on a Nightwing-focused forum. Most of his ideas were good. Maybe I can find that and post it here.
I mean, none of them are. The point of their characters in Grayson is that they're the most established and badass spies around. By elevating Dick to their level at some point, you're establishing Dick as one of the most competent people in the DCU; if they were new characters, I wouldn't care about any of them, whereas I do care about them as of now because they are established characters.
Does anyone know the list of agencies that these characters are aligned or associated with? I don't know much about these characters.
I am just so hyped for that issue, senpai.
...I hope this is a joke about my joke... :(
He was referring to uploading Spyder (Otto) into their heads, one they're done fighting each other. Winner gets Spyral and gets to be the new host to Otto's brain (kek, sounds like I'm talking about Spider-Man now).
>"ANGEL OF DEATH!"
I actually liked all of Higgins ideas I think they just needed to be presented with a bit more fun and levity. Owning a circus? Awesome. Building up Amusement Mile? Great. Moving to Chicago and building up a set of rogues that have good potential to be recurring? Awesome.
But they all end up just being a bit too mediocre. It was starting to pick up in Chicago though and I would have liked it if Dick had gotten to take that little girl under his wing.
>Owning a circus? Awesome.
>Building up Amusement Mile? Great.
>Moving to Chicago and building up a set of rogues that have good potential to be recurring? Awesome.
Therein lies the problem. Higgins kept changing course, partly because he had to tie-in with Snyder's book. He couldn't make any one status quo stick. By the time the first Chicago arc was over, Forever Evil happened, rendering it all moot. He could never maintain a consistent supporting cast. Does anyone really remember Joey the roommate?
He was too influenced by the DCAU and TNBA's Nightwing. He decided that Nightwing was a character who would be a happy guy (as he should be), but for whatever reason, should also be living a pretty sad life. He realized that it wasn't really working by the time Chicago happened. Even before that.
He wanted a Flash crossover, a Cyborg crossover, a Deathstroke crossover, etc. Got none of it. He wanted to do the "Prince of Gotham" story but that got shat on. His Chicago story ended way too early. Even before the New 52, Higgins helped Snyder come up with the Court of Owls story, which was going to be a DickBats story before the reboot forced them to change it up. That's the reason Snyder was initally fighting to keep Dick as Batman until he conceded and then Higgins on Nightwing happened. I've always felt bad for Higgins, man.
But it's good cross promotion. Azreal was big in Arkham Knight, he's going to be big in Gotham, and he hasn't been in comics in forever. Also, why not continue to undermine Dick's time as Batman, by bringing in one of the other most famous Batman replacements?
I fucking hate that they always try to undermine Dick's character. Can we not just let him be? Why does he always have to be dragged back down after he's already climbed his way up multiple times?
Sonia was in Black Mirror first. She was brought over through the reboot and changed up. But yeah, that's it.
Joey was indirectly referenced in an issue of one of the Justice League Forever Evil tie-in. Although Owlman made it sound like she died.
Thought that I should mention that Bleeding Cool is reporting this rumour that Steven R. McQueen might be joining Legends of Tomorrow in 2017.
Not linking it, because I don't want to give BC extra clicks, but I just wanted to mention that it is possible he could be playing Dick. Don't get your hopes up. There's a thread up on /co/ about it.
I thought Knigtfall had still happened in the nu52 but I think I see where this is going now...
Mother is part of or the head of the Order of St. Dumas. Jean Paul Valley was the heir she built for him.
I'm 100% sure of it now. Just about every single thing fits with it.
Such a boring issue.
Like, this should have been a spectacle, with the burly brawl against the death ballerinas, but it's just dull and nothing happens and Cass does nothing cool. The only stunt is Harper "Fan Favorite" Row dropping a chandelier, which is the comic book writer shorthand for "I can't think of anything".
2/10, try harder.
>Higgins revealed all of his future plot points on a Nightwing-focused forum. Most of his ideas were good. Maybe I can find that and post it here.
Is this it?
>The search for Zucco was originally going to be much longer, delving into the mask killer history/mystery of Chicago. The Prankster-- who was not initially part of the story-- was a wild card. A free agent who came to Chicago/put on a mask because of Nightwing's arrival there. The main "villain" of the story was Ghostwalker... the former sidekick of Aether. He was essentially the Robin of Chicago. In the past, it was going to turn out that Ghostwalker's identity had been found out... which lead some bad guys to kill his family. Ghostwalker hunted the bad guys down... and killed them. This brought Ghostwalker into conflict with his mentor. Ghostwalker and Aether came to blows... and Ghostwalker killed Aether. The rest of the heroes came after Ghostwalker. It's here that Ghostwalker realized how much the "mask" had ruined his life... and how much the masks ruined the city. Ghostwalker vowed no more masks in Chicago... and has murdered every mask that has come to the city since.
>Ultimately, things were going to come to a head in Chicago in a big chaotic third act... that forced Nightwing to SAVE Tony Zucco from Prankster/Ghostwalker.
>The next year was going to feature Tony Zucco getting acquitted for the Flying Graysons murder. My idea was to turn Zucco into Nightwing's Kingpin... with Ghostwalker as his agent/Bullseye.
>Then, as Nightwing's presence grew in Chicago, William Cobb was going to come to Chicago and start a new Brotherhood of the Wing (that was the temporary name)-- a Court of Owls type organization built around Nightwing.
Yes. I like mini-Dick. I want more.
I don't like that Harper can apparently fight now.
Yup, that's it. Most of it's actually really cool and I would've liked it. But Grayson is a lot better. Would've been great if we got all of Higgins' run done with and then got Grayson.
I would have liked Zucco stuff to pretty much equate to him being a mostly changed man and Dick hesitating and essentialy letting him go to be with his son. It's a bit cliche but it would have been nice contrast to Bruce.
C'mon guys, It's tradition for Grayson threads to get over 500 replies. No need to break the tradition
Fill in for this month because Grayson 15 is coming early due to Robin War. Honestly, I feel like this book could get someone better than Janin, too. Nicola Scott or Chris Burnham would be great.
He's back with #15 (Robin War Part 2).
It comes out in two weeks, so he needed more time to work on it, so he did that instead of #14. Expect #15 and 16 to look a lot better since he would have a lot more free time.
Are there more mocap covers like these?
Even if the usual art feels stiff sometimes the panels and composition are really good, but yeah I wouldn't mind different styles once in a while.
>Script: Tom King
Huh, I thought Seeley was writing this one.
And damn with this and the Robin War bookends, King wrote about 100 pages of this one crossover.
Doyle and others must trust him
Not sure what mocap means, but Janin's website has some covers he did but didn't use for #12.
Yup. This event is more or less a King story. It's why I've been excited.
But the fact that the rest of it is basically a Fawkes story, who doesn't seem to care about Dick or the other main Robins much, has me a little worried. Although Gleason is co-writing the RSoB issue so at least Damian will get to do some stuff... I just don't like that apparently Jim is getting focus here. It's unnecessary, IMO...
Unless it includes Dick revealing himself to Jim and getting him on his side, and then giving Jim his blessing to be Batman. I could dig that.
Seriously the flashbacks are the best part of the entire thing so far. Harper, Jason, and Tim have been shaky in the present story, but every writer so far has done a good job with tiny Dick and Bruce.
Also it'll be interesting to read all the flashbacks in one go once the weekly is over
>Dick and Harper at batcomputer with Robin Mask and Batcowl on their respective sides.
>Snyder is still pushing his characters this hard
Ah, I get you now.
>If Bruce actually did it with somebody
Anon, I think Bruce has done it with a lot of people. As for JPV, I agree with your assessment.
But that would mean Bruce kept possibly two different proteges of his from Dick: Cass and JPV. And Dick is the one he trusts the most. That's sad, man.
He's writing the Detective Comics issue and co-writing the RSoB issue. So 2 of the 6.
He deserves some rest, anon. After writing the GL Darksied War issue in addition to his usual workload, I can't believe how much of Robin War he's actually writing.
I'm okay with this because they're at least implying that Dick is good enough to be Batman. They've been undermining the shit out of his character every chance they get, unless Seeley is writing the issue, so I'll take some of this to balance it out. I hope they really are just building up to a finale where Dick kicks Mother's ass and is acknowledged as a rela hero again, because I can't take this shit anymore.
Fucker say that to my face and see what happens.
>for a few glorious minutes Bette wasn't a joke.
Why can't Bette be a badass?
I ship it. She was into him even when he was her brother.
But I have no idea is E2 Huntress is still alive or what atrocities have happened to her since she returned to the hellhole that is Earth 2.
>it's selling better than Prez, Midnighter, Omega Men, ASS8, Gotham Academy, Catwoman, Martian Manhunter, Constantine, Justice League 3001, We Are Robin and Doctor Fate
Just die in my sleep already to be honest family.
It's confirmed for a third arc anyway so that's another 6 or so issues
That and We Are Robin will probably make it to four full volumes desu
Diversity in tone and other areas as well as it being an easily crossoverable book
32k-36k is pretty good for Dick when there's a 3.99 price tag and a title that's not recognizable like Nightwing is.
Even more impressive is that Damian's book is doing better than that with a 3.99 price tag too.
Bump. We need to get this thread to at least 300 replies
They thought it was too busy.
I had a dream like that once. Except I was completely naked and I was at school and my clothes were in my locker but I didn't know the combination or even where it was located so I had to be nude all day.