gothic lolita

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>>9162918

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>>9162921

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>>9162923

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>>9162924

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>>9162928

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>>9162931

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>>9162933

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>>9162938

>>9162938
how longbefore this thread gets derailed over people arguing about whether or not something is gothic?

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>>tagged as 'gothic friends'

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is it too early to start to plan halloween coords?

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love this dress!
anyone know what it's called?

>>9162948
it's never too early for Halloween

>>9162980
This.

>inb4 the same coords get posted that are posted every gothic thread
>inb4 the same coords get contested that are contested every thread
>inb4 someone finally makes a copypasta to explain "gothic vs sweet cuts" and "hybrid coords" (i.e. "sweet dress with gothic themes styled in a gothic coord" or "EGL dress styled in a classic coord" or "black dress in a classic-goth coord")

>>9163014
post examples of what you think is gothic.

>>9162946
>>9163014
This long.
No one cares what you think is gothic anon. Shut up and post pics.

>>9163014
Get out of here with that weak ass bait, homie.

>>9163148
Diff anon but how is holy lantern gothic? It's a sweet dress with a darker motif.

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>>9163174
less arguing more pics

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>>9163182

>>9163182
I'm not arguing I'm asking a question because I seriously don't see it? Especially the HL coord with that sweet bag with the rosette on it?

>>9162918
dress sauce? I need more chiffon in my wardrobe

>>9163014
not this shit again

>>9163202
hot damn, where would I be able to get a hat like that?

>>9163174
Holy Lantern ISNT gothic. It's what sweet lolitas wear on Halloween, same thing with Horror Garden. Think of it as a litmus test for newfags. If they say either of those are gothic they are for sure new.

>>9162948
w2c those fabulous heels?

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>>9163403
Agreed, but I have seen them styled gothic correctly before.
Please note, I am not saying the above examples are those coords.
Also, elements from those series are very fondly used in gothic. Pic related.

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>>9163433
Let's post more questionable coords so we can bicker more!

>>9163433
dang, wish this coord had more poof

>>9162931
is she enchanting a butt plug?

>>9162950
It's Moon Castle by Magic Potion (taobao brand)

>>9163014
Could you detail more?

>>9163578
The word you are looking for is phial.

>>9162948
Can I ask how you wear that hat and not make it look weird? I have it too but it just flops down and looks terrible :(

>>9163652
see >>9163029 and look in the archives for "hybrid" because it is probably the most unique word that recurs in discussions about what is or is not gothic.

or search thread titles for "gothic" and read through the most recent gothic thread.

>>9162928
someone please, sauce on those tights

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>>9163440
agreed. >>9163433 could be so cute with a very fluffy petti.

i'll dump my ott gothic folder also

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>>9164209

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>>9164213

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>>9164214

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>>9164219

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>>9164224

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>>9164230

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>>9164231

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>>9164233

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>>9164234

>>9164234
something about this picture is so pleasing, you don't usually see lolita photos with movement

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>>9163174
>>9163403
Gtfo. Holy Lantern is a versatile dress in colors that are not Lavender or Pink and in cuts different than that nightdress jsk. It can be perfectly gothic, or it can be what sweet lolitas wear for Halloween depending on how you coord it. If you're a newb who's been told that dresses come in styles in which brands are mainly supposed to be, you're dumb, don't project your stupidity on the others.

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>>9164250

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>>9164251

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>>9164254

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>>9164257

Anyone own any of Lumiebre's parasols? Interested in your reviews

anyone know where i can cop one of those massive wide brim hats with a bunch of feathers n shit piled on? I can't find a suitable hat base myself

>>9164250
Just because it's paired with gothic items doesn't mean the dress is. I bet you think that AP does classic too.

>>9164250
Like I said, perfect litmus test for newfags. Thank you for proving my point.

How often does Antique Beast re-open? I'm on the mailing list but I'm impatient and want to shop

>>9164325
Lace Doll can be coorded classic

>>9164469
It's not classic at all. Just because it doesn't have a print and is a little bit more mature doesn't mean it's classic.

>>9164337
This gets asked all the time and is very easy to find out if you try.

>>9164469
it might be used in a classic coord but that does not make it classic.

for analogy: a rock band that does a polka song for charity doesn't become a polka band. they are a rock band performing polka for a special occasion. the polka will be flavored by their skill with rock and polka enthusiasts will probably be able to tell they're not a "real" polka band. that's fine, experimenting and crossing genres is fun.

but without significantly altering the dress, it will always be sweet no matter what coord or non-lolita outfit it is used in.

>>9164530
Anon. Please. If the lines are so clearly drawn in the sand, why do we constanly bicker over the grey areas?

A predominantly associated 'x' item can be used for 'y' coord. It doesn't make 'y' coord less like a 'y' nor does it mean you can no longer make 'x' coords with the item.
You're not wrong, you're just being obtuse.

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>>9164543
>If the lines are so clearly drawn in the sand, why do we constanly bicker over the grey areas?
because of personal beliefs and fiddly semantics, i imagine.

>You're not wrong, you're just being obtuse.
ok well pic related

>>9164543
Anon's not being obtuse though. The argument was never about whether or not 'x' item could be used for a 'y' coord, it was about the item in it and of itself being 'x' rather than being 'y'. If anything it's the other anon who's being obtuse by deliberately misinterpreting the argument. A dress being sweet doesn't invalidate whether it can be worn in a classic or gothic coord, but when the coord is taken away and the dress is judged by itself, it's still sweet.

Sage for meta and lack of contribution. Also could we all just agree to stop arguing about this?

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>>9164557
>Also could we all just agree to stop arguing about this?
part of the gothic legacy is to argue over what is really gothic. gatekeeping is one of the strongest ties EGL has to the broader gothic subculture.

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>>9164571
I personally will never stop arguing about it as long as there are newfags who insist Holy Lantern is gothic.

>b-but crosses!

Well that's just modern AP.

>>9164574
I'll be right beside you arguing with newfags who insist that anything floral or printless is classic. We'll definitely be fighting to our graves and beyond with this shit.

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>>9164574
i use these arguments to deal with my own issues of being a baby-faced goth

>work hard on achieving pale, undead look with hollow eyes and cheeks
>go full Mana with my hair
>"Aw Anon, don't you look cute!"
>mfw i am the IRL Holy Lantern

so here are some faceless gothic lolitas

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>>9164591

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>>9164593

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>>9164594
what kind of phone does Mana use?

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>>9164595

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>>9164597

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>>9164598

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>>9164599

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>>9164601

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>>9164604

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>>9164605
fin

>>9163404
They're Demonia, but that style was discontinued.

>>9163402
The hatmaker goes by Voodooodolly.

I just can't seem to understand what's all the mess is about. It's Gothic lolita thread, not Gothic lolita DRESS thread. If someone wants to post Gothic HL coords, then just why not. If I got it right, >>9164250 were telling that this dress could be used in various ways. My personal opinion is that all those substyles theme is getting real old though, there are too many questionable dresses nowadays. I mean, is there any point trying to categorize dresses in 2016?

>show gothic coord im planning to a normie friend
>he thinks they're quaker clothes
literally what

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>>9164931
>there are too many questionable dresses nowadays
There are a couple solids that toe the line between gothic and classic, but most of the stuff that actually gets posted onto /cgl/ (ie prints) are still pretty clean cut cases.

And there is no way >>9162938 is gothic. Just because HL can be used in a gothic coord doesn't mean all HL coords are gothic.

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>>9164967
I have a question for you. Is this classic lolita or is it sweet lolita?

>>9164967
Congrats, you completely missed the point

>>9165462
how the hell is this sweet?

>>9165462
Why are you posting this in the Gothic thread

>>9165462
It's a dumpster fire, that's what it is.

>>9165462
dude this looks really cheap, don't get it

>>9165462
Judging from the cut and design of the dress, it's 3F.

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I would appreciate a lot if white gothic coords are posted, I need some inspiration. Will dump what I have (sadly i don't have too much in my folder).

>>9164961
>Dress gothic/classic all day erryday
>constantly called a witch by strangers/street vagrants

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>>9165585

>>9165733
i love being called a witch, anon.
witch aesthetics are so good. don't let it get to you!

>>9165762
Nah, I love a witchy aesthetic. It's just when people do it as an insult it's mildly irritating (since I get yelled at on the street and stuff).

>>9165462
It's from Triple Fortune. They consider their style as gothic lolita.

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>>9165780
heads up anon and be the bad witch fancy bitch you were destined to be.

>>9165916
Haha thank you! That is actually exactly what I am.

>>9164557
Actually anon, the original argument was that it was versatile.
This whole thing would have been done if folks would stop splitting so many goddamn hairs.

>>9164574
To be fair, it's typically as gothic as AP gets. I've met too many people that literally only buy or pay attention to AP so this is the most gothic thing from the brand they've seen.
>mfw they completely ignore Horror Garden and better candidates for so-called "gothic AP prints"

>>9162918
Sauce on this dress?

>>9166213
???

>>9162918

Sauce on dress?

>>9164574
Why can't it be gothic-tinged sweet? I know that's not a sub-genre or anything but that's not to say it can't be a 'thing' once in a while/a once off, or at least be a reasonable description of something (arguably) ambiguous.

I actually get more frustrated by the people that seem insistent that grey areas/cross overs in lolita don't exist, rather than the people that claim that a particular style/dress is (arguably) strictly one thing or another. Hell, even the lolita designers have spoken about their designs being a mixture of 'gothic and sweet' or whatever.

Also this >>9164571

Personally I think anything that touches on the 'darker side' in its theme or appearance could reasonably be considered 'gothic', or at least to encompass 'gothic elements'. What threshold exists and what constitutes as 'a touch of darkness' or whatever will forever be the cause of debate because it's an aesthetic sense that's not set in stone. Sure, some things are closer to being unequivocally, full-on shitting bats goth but that look would be at the far end of the hypothetical gothic spectrum.

>>9166213
of everything that isnt gothic lol

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>>9168008

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>>9168009

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>>9168011

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>>9168013

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>>9168015

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>>9168018

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>>9168020

>>9162928
>>9162931
>>9162933
>>9162938
>>9162942
>>9162947
>>9162948
>>9163182
>>9163202
>>9163338
>>9163433
>>9164209
>>9164214
>>9164233
>>9164234
>>9164250
Not gothic.

>>9164251
>>9164254
>>9164257
>>9166213
>>9168011
>>9168013
>>9168015
>>9168018
Also not gothic. At least half of this thread isn't. It's pathetic, it's really not that hard.

>>9175612
>>9175615
No one cares about your stupid opinion.

>>9175615
Stop being so obsessed with our made up rules

>>9167128
The problem as I understand it (and don't quote me, I don't wear gothic) is that gothic lolita encompasses more than just image motifs and encompasses certain cuts of dresses, skirts, blouses, etc. So while a dress may be white, if it has a gothic cut, then it may qualify as gothic, whereas something like Holy Latern has cuts and styles that are much more sweet (the collar and cut of the dress on something like >>9164574 are extremely sweet, despite the gothic image motifs).

>>9176314
Agreed, anon.

>>9167128
Being "gothic tinged sweet" makes it exactly that. SWEET. How is this so hard for people to understand? You can have a sweet dress with some gothic motifs. Holy lantern isn't gothic and will never be. Why are people so desperate to do this?

>>9176369
The point is anon, that whilst not at the far end of the uber gothic spectrum, or even if certain things are still 'sweet', depending on how it's styled, it still can be appropriate for threads such as this.

That is the point. Appropriate for the thread. These threads have never really intended to be about the individual garments, but rather the coordinates/outfits themselves. If it was about that we'd just post stock pictures.

Someone posted a picture of HL styled in a kinda gothic or gothic-tinged way? Suck it up, and if it doesn't fit your personal criteria, post something that does. Job done.

>>9176369
People are desperate to defend HL as gothic because gothic lolitas are weird about liking sweet. Like for whatever reason they CANT admit to liking it and it totally has to be gothic because muh crosses muh black as my soul colorway(which is hilarious because of how strong crosses are in sweet right now)

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>>9167128
>Personally I think anything that touches on the 'darker side' in its theme or appearance could reasonably be considered 'gothic'

Stop.

>>9176517
So what is gothic to you?

>>9176508
So sometimes crosses are gothic and sometimes they aren't?
What separates them?

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>>9176535
If you really, genuinely need this explained Lolita is not the fashion for you. Or is pic related gothic to you?

>>9176531
>So what is gothic to you?

Bats shitting crosses, stained glass in the background featuring Edgar Allan Poe crying, Mary Shelley grasping a charred heart and high fiving Count Dracula with the other hand, the words 'remember you will die' repeated around the perimeter of the skirt in free-to-download horror font

>>9176592
10/10 ign

>>9176592
>not including skulls, old buildings, thorny roses or coffins

2/10

>>9176629

anon those go on your head ffs, get it together

>>9168009
everyone (including me) and their mom has this dress but goddammit I LOVE it

>>9176861
>old buildings go on my head

Anon please, I am not a witch.

>>9176592
Nice. Pretty sure you described a taobao dress there.

However I was actually looking for what you think? Unless you're not even the other anon I replied to.

>>9176592
The 'remember you will die' should be in latin because 'memento mori' is so edgy or perhaps poorly translated French instead...

>>9176314
And that's the same reason why lots of the pictures quoted above aren't gothic. The others are just classic in black. It's mostly about the cut and fine details.

>>9176308
>>9176313
Samefag. Sorry that your Holy Lantern JSK and JetJ isn't gothic.

>>9162923
Incredible! Sauce?

>>9176592
I would wear this

>>9177111
Atelier Boz.

>>9177084
Nah. You can keep thinking that everyone who disagrees with you is the same person if it makes you feel better about your poor choices though.

Newfag question. What defines a "gothic dress cut"? Most of the time dresses that are considered gothic in these threads look very simplistic to me.

>>9177988
Brand association is more an indicator than the cut.
It boils down to how it's styled, but at least the one anon is an autist that thinks a dress only has one specific style, and that anything done with that dress is of that style.

>>9178006
>It boils down to how it's styled
>Brand association is more an indicator than the cut

Are you purposefully trying to misinform people or are you new?

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>>9178006

>>9175615
care to elaborate on why?

>>9177988

That's actually pretty close to what the girls saying x or y pics aren't gothic have been trying to say.

A good deal of gothic lolita follows Moitie style, and a huge part of Moitie is how simple it is. The Elegance in Elegant Gothic Lolita tends to focus on having a clean silhoutte that enhances a woman's feminine silhoutte, instead of burying it in a giant poofball of ruffles and bows the way a lot of sweet dresses do.

Alternatively, if you like Atelier Pierrot, they do male gothic poofy dresses with ruffles, but they still balance it out by making corset dresses that are form fitting, still emphasising the a womanly, adult silhoutte.

>>9178268

Oh God sorry for the typo

*Atelier Pierrot do **make** gothic poofy dresses


Not male gothic poofy dresses. Although there's nothing to stop a brolita from stuffing their bra and wearing one, I guess.

>>9177882
Why are you so insistent on being a moron? If you want something gothic, AP is the last place to go.

>>9178268
Thank you anon. This is really insightful. I want to try gothic in the future.

Would you say AaTP borders on the line enough to be considered gothic?

>>9179173
Different anon, but depending on the print and colorway AatP is whatever the hell it wants to be. They've done fairytale prints, nautical prints, vampire prints, theater prints, and everything in between. They're a bit of a clusterfuck, but they have a distinct style to them. Personally I think they used to be somewhere between gothic and classic in their 2009-2011 era with things like VR or Masquerade Theter, but they've gotten sweeter and sweeter as time goes on.

>>9179263
honestly I left lolita for a couple years and just started looking back into it this week and the first thing I thought was "wtf happened to aatp??"

>>9179284
I've had that same thought. Word on /cgl/ is that Baby/AatP is really short on designers and the one who did the ~2010 era prints is long gone.

how do you do brolita without getting that ironic look

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>>9179342

Yo, take it to the lolita general or crossplay thread. For starters, don't have facial hair; I'm cool with genderfuck as an art form, but anyone who is wearing lolita with a full on viking beard is asking for asspats.

>>9174315

>>9178109

>>9179263
>>9179284
Agreed. The last thing I liked from them was Dance of the Black Cats...

>>9175612
Look out everybody we got the goth police on the case.

>>9175612
>>9175615
If you're going to quote THAT many posts and just throw hissyfits at everyone who DARES disagree with you, maybe you should actually go into some detail about what is and isn't gothic. I agree with some of the things you quoted (HL is a sweet dress no matter how "gotchic" you style it) but disagree with others. So enlighten us all, please, otherwise you just seem to be full of shit.

>>9185731
Oops, *gothic.

>>9164574
I think it can be gothic if it's co-orded with more gothic accessories and outfit pieces.

>>9164233
This is actually my favorite outfit ever

>>9162933
Super pretty

>>9162918
Her makeup is soooo gorgeous.
I want to do this.

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>>9162939
who is she
i'm serious, i need to know

>>9164234
>>9164237
I just wish her leg was angled a bit differently. It makes them look more stumpy than they are.

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43KB, 384x384px

does anyone here own souffle song's choosing cross bonnet? i've been meaning to get a black bonnet for ages and would like to know which are your favs for gothic coords.