Saying The L Word

Lesbian?

>>8950486
Heh

>>8950481
I call it a Japanese street fashion. If they're curious still, I'll explain a bit more, but I never say lolita. I remember one lady explained to another lady "It's anime." Despite me saying it wasn't, but that was her "ohhh" moment.

>>8950481

I alternate between 'modern victorian' and saying 'gosurori' when I'm with weebier friends.

Street fashion is understandable but totally at odds with what a lot of people might expect of street fashion. Lolita is intuitively a no-no because the book. Saying 'modern victorian' outfit is just enough clarity to make people think 'oh, right, duh, it DOES look like that' and sufficiently clear to avoid rigurous questioning about Japan etc.

Can't dodge the 'where did you get it from?' questions though. I usually just say chinese ebay or namedrop something complicated like meta's full name.

>tfw girl I know calls it 'loli fashion' because I said it was lolita fashion
>she has no idea of what her shortened version means

NEVER AGAIN

I wear headphones and pretend not to hear them

I just say we dress up like this for fun. Most of the questions stop there.

I've been asked about my 'costume' to which I replied that thier just nice clothes.
When asked about them by someone who actually seems interested, I tell them it's lolita fashion and give them an anecdote to associate the term with. They laugh, know I'm not a psycho, and we go about our business.

>>8950481
>I'm a clown
>I'm a party princess
>I'm a prostitute

>>8950546
Fucking with people is the best.

>>8950481
...Clothes? Because we wear them in polite society..? If someone's being a dick about it, I act clueless. Always works.

I rarely ever feel the need to explain what it is, most people are just curious to know why I'm dressed the way I do so I tell them "It's just what I like to wear" or "This is what I always wear"/"I'm always dressed like this" and leave it at that, and most of the time it's enough. I can't even recall the last time I had to explain that it's a Japanese street fashion, not to mention bring up the name. Unless they specifically ask (and they rarely do) I don't think people actually care to know more, to be honest.

>>8950486
kek

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>>8950557
>why I'm dressed the way I do
Can you tell I just woke up

When I talk with americans I call it egl or goth loli, because only with americans I have experienced that they think it has pedo connotations. To anyone else I usually call it lolita, I think the book is not as famous outside america so. At least no one from europe has ever made that connection when I say it's lolita. (I live in the netherlands and my family is spanish, in spain it is just a girls nickname)

However recently I prefer thinking of it as egl, for no reason in particular.

>>8950588
Odd to hear you haven't had anyone make the pedophile connotation, I'm Dutch too and I've had several people make it when I called it lolita.

>>8950594
That is really weird. I have even asked Dutch people (my bf's family and some of my classmates) if they know the book lolita, because I wanted to call my dog that, and none of them knew the book. Only one girl knew about the film. So now my dog is called lolita.

>>8950481
whoa. this is my art!

I usually just say japanese street fashion but I've had people specifically ask "What's the NAME of the fashion?" and then I am always awkward because I wasn't expecting to be put on the spot. I'm never sure what to say in that situation

>>8950494
>I call it a Japanese street fashion.
Same.
>>8950481
Also it depends who I'm getting engaged in the conversation by. If it's some soccer mom or pervert I usually say that we're having a fashion meetup and that we like to go out and do fun things.
I really love it when someone my age (20s) approaches us and wants to know more, because at that point it feels like I'm getting someone interested in an alt fashion and they seem really excited and genuinely curious. These are the types of folks who already have blogs or tumblrs and have seen styles similar or were lolita. They're pretty fun. I'd rather have friendly people to talk with than strangers who are obviously judging me and are asking patronizing questions.

>>8950608
Forgot to mention one girl in our comm got so fed up that she made business cards to hand out to people with the fyeahlolita links on them. But desu, I think this just encouraged more questions since then people thought we were a group aka business/performers at that point.

I don't get why most of you make it into such a big deal when someone asks what it's called, there are other accepted names for lolita. Gosurori, GothLoli, EGL.. It is not difficult to avoid calling it lolita at all.

>>8950599
Several people mentioned the book when I told them...strange. You'd say it'd all be pretty much the same in such a tiny country.

Where I live, people ALWAYS want to know the name of the style, they always specifically ask for it. It's really annoying, especially because if I try to just say "gosurori" or "EGL" like >>8950620 suggests, they keep on asking what it stands for. And then they go all dead-eyed when I say lolita because they think it's a sex thing.
>lately I've been saying it has no name at all

Lolita is so far removed from those Japanese street snaps from the early 2000s now that I can't call it 'Japanese street fashion'. It just seems like I'm trying to bullshit people.

I explain it's a Japanese fashion originally based around Victorian, Edwardian and Rococo clothing that has become its own distinct, evolving style, mentioning the main substyles (if people think it's ALL about sweet they are more likely to think 'age-play' or 'pedophiles').

Giving the explaination BEFORE dropping the L bomb makes it seem less like the fashion is cultivated around the book (or what people mistakenly think the book is all about) rather than being a fashion that just happens to be called Lolita. Not all the looks are particularly cutesy and even if they were, an apparently sexually precocious young child does not look like or serve the same 'purpose' as an adult
woman in a dress that happens to be overtly 'feminine' or cute'.

It's also worth mentioning the Gunne Sax/Laura Ashley vintage shit to demonstrate the fact even 'normal people' liked the period-esque frills and lace. It's not just us crazy kids or becuase of crazy Japan. In fact Teddy Boys and other period-specific vintage revivals are comparable.

If the person clearly isn't actualy interested in your answer but just being a dick asking 'why are you wearing that' or something equally obnoxious, I tell them the truth- that I felt like wearing a nice dress. Why is that so hard to understand.

When someone is unusually dressed or in costume (and you should be able to figure out which is which) it's usually for a reason you could deduce yourself and often the person asking is NOT actually interested in the event or your reasoning- the simply want to point out you look different for the sake of it. I try to just go about my business as normal so people finally realise that it is JUST CLOTHING and shouldn't even need explaining.

>>8950631
I met a guy who asked me about an old school dress, then was so proud of the fact he had learned about 'lolicon' from a friend that he insisted that's what the fashion was called and was for seducing men. I was pretty offended and tried to correct him saying my dress was not fetish gear but he just walked off shouting over me that he obviously knew better. Started out seeming pretty sincere, too...

>>8950481
Yeah, I usually just say that it's a street fashion from Japan. If they ask more specific questions I'll say something like "Oh, it's from a brand called Angelic Pretty" (or whatever I happen to be wearing.)

If they specifically ask for the name of the fashion I usually mention right away that it has nothing to do with the book.

>>8950594
>>8950599
>>8950628

I think the thing is while Lolita is an English (and Russian) novel, USA's media is so pervasive around the rest of the world that cultural tropes kinda come along for the ride. So tv/movie characters referencing Lolita may woosh on other audiences, but they remember the word and the context, and get the connection anyway.

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>call it lolita
get judging looks by the person asking about it
>call it a japanese fashion
a comm member flips because she thinks she will be associated with cosplay and weebs
>call it victorian / rococo inspired
another comm member bitches because it's not the only inspiration and it's "misinforming" people, cultural appropriation etc
>fuck

I feel like there is no way to win this one.

>"These are just my normal clothes"
>"what no hahaha what are you no seriously"
>"yes, have a nice day"

>>8950632
>It just seems like I'm trying to bullshit people.

They won't know any better anon.

>>8950631
when I say it´s called gosurori or goth loli, sometimes people also ask what it means or what it stands for. I say that it doesn´t stand for anything, that it´s just the name.

I mostly wear casual lolita or soft lolita so I dont get comments often. When someone does ask me about it, I say its called goth loli. No one has ever asked me what that stands for or why its called like that. It's pretty weird to me that people would ask that? If you were wearing himekaji or larme, would you have to explain to them that it stands for casual princess or tear?


It has happened a few times that someone was interested in learning about the fashion and buying it, but not often. I actually wrote down the brand name and the name of my shopping service for some girls (I was wearing moitie at that time).

>tfw you will never be able to call your future daughter Lolita
It's such a pretty name, fuck that book.

>>8950714
Well, it's not so much the book as people's stupidity. Usually people who think Lolita is kinky haven't read the book or didn't watch/understand the movies.

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I usually say that its "a japanese fashion called lolita". The fact that its foreign gets the rednecks out of my face (because foreign = weird so its okay apparently) and the rest is for people who might be actually interested - just enough so they can go look it up for themselves or pass along the info to someone that is interested.

Slightly OT but this one old guy that works in my apt. keeps asking what I'm wearing since he likes buying his granddaughter clothes.
>wearing otome
"Is that lolita too? I love strawberries and so does my gd!"
>wearing nanchatte
"Are they calling uniforms lolita? My wife used to flounce around in school clothes too~"
>wearing sweet
"Wait, no. THIS is lolita. You look like so cheery! Have a nice day!"
Sweet old folks are ALMOST enough to make up for the dumb as shit ones you usually meet. Almost.

> out in public with my comm
> someone asks why we are dressed up
> "oh, we just do this for fun!"
> they tell us rudely that it's not nice to lie and walk away


Nowadays, I get more of, "so what time period are you?" because I work in vintage, so I tell them it's all modern clothing, but if I feel like being a dick, I say something like, "Well, today I'm dressed in very 2007's style!" It usually trips them up and they'll mutter like, "Oh.... well.... I thought it looked old....."

Sometimes people are genuinely interested and want to know where to buy it, so I just direct them to the stores. Being able to point them in a physical location kind of helps and will usually satisfy a person.

>>8950727
>they tell us rudely that it's not nice to lie and walk away
That's a really rude response but for some reason I find it hilarious. I probably would've laughed in their face.

I asked about this in lolita gen awhile back I think, or some thread, and got some pretty uninformed responses.

Do any of take ubers or cabs of some kind to meets? What do you say to your driver?
I have yet to wear j fashion of any kind in one, but all the drivers I've had were very talkative and wanted to know where I was coming from, etc.
I'm just kind of assuming they would notice something like lolita, even if it was toned down.

Honestly, here in Spain I could say a few years back it was called Lolita and nobody would day shit or make any further comment.

If it wasn't for the latest comms and every Lolita panel shoving "SEE THIS BOOK?! YOU HAVE NEVER SEEN TI?! WELL, IT'S CANCER. WE HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS PEDOFHILIAC PIECE OF TRASH (DID I MENTION IT'S ABOUT A TEEN GIRL AND AN OLD MAN YET? NO? LET ME REPEAT TWICE" in front of everybody remotely interested in the fashion, I would be able to simply call it Lolita now a days too.

I don't know, It's not like everybody across the world knows that specific book or anything related to it or the kink. If it wasn't one of the first things said about Lolita, even if a few fucktards would still mix it up, it wouldn't be at the back of everybody's mind from time to time.

It was such a relief when my therapist knew that it's a j-fashion and that I didn't have to explain myself.

I wear my daily frills pretty toned down so I've never gotten "why are you dressed like that", but the other day someone did ask where my dress was from.
I mentioned it was from a Chinese lolita brand since I figured that's a more straightforward answer than 'taobao" and she didn't question it, just gave me some compliments. I think using the term lolita around other young people is usually okay since they don't seem to make the Nabokov connection off the bat.
If an older person asked me though I would probably just say that it's a Japanese fashion style.

>>8950481
We ended just calling rorita, the only word we found that doesn't give us problems

>>8950546
made my night

I keep it at modern victorian or neo-victorian
works, old ladies love it, everyone wins
normies then seem to accept sweet

I call it lolita. And then when people make comments, I generally give a run down of what Lolita was actually about and how wrong they are.

>finally my russian lit degree is useful
>this is the only time

I usually say it's Japanese street fashion, and most people make the connection of Japanese fashion = weird so don't ask more unless they're interested in the name.

>>8950714
Just call her Dolores Rori Misako Mana.

>>8950717
>implying the movie isn't kinky romanticized shit

>>8950916
Like what? A grooming rapist and his delusional fantasies? Is is better to have your fashion associated with that?

>>8950734
The few times I've taken while in lolita, my drivers didn't say anything. Straight up silence.

>>8950494
Yup, this is exactly how I do it too. Japanese street fashion inspired by victorian and rococo fashion, and if they are really that genuinely curious I'll explain the name. Usually people who have afflictions with the name will show it, and I can explain. I've only ever had to do that like...once, and they seemed to be chill when I said "no not the book" so. Knock on wood, hopefully I don't ever have to encounter any normiez who freak out over the name just cause it'd make me really uncomfortable for some random person on the street to pass judgement about my sex life in that way, since I really, really detest ageplay and DDLG fetishes.

Other than that though if they aren't outright asking what the clothes are called, like they're just asking what I'm doing or why I'm dressed like this, I just say I like to dress up or, in a group, we're in a fashion club.

>fashion club
>japanese street fashion

98% of questions end there, people nod and smile and are on their merry way. I think some people act a little too bitchy when answering questions like this. I know it's annoying to have your motives questioned 20 times in a row but unless they're being rude, no need to snap at them.

>>8950607
Just call it Otome, normalfags wont give too much of a shit to look

>>8950932
It was made by Woody Allen so what would you expect?

>>8950986
I do that too if they aren't happy with 'japanese fashion'.

>>8950734
Every time I take a cab or an uber they haven't asked me anything, just once the driver said that I looked like an antique doll.

>>8950932
The one by Kubrik or the newer one with Jeremy Irons?

>>8950726
Aw, that's so sweet.

>>8950989
>Woody Allen
You have no idea what you're talking about...

It's a fashion club, we're going to a meeting" usually works for me, since some of us are in other fashions. The "going to a meeting" part also works as a great "okay we're done answering questions now" exit.

>>8950734 #
>if they are polite
Most of the drivers I had were polite and mildly curious, I just explained that I was attending a fashion party with my friends.
>if they are not polite
Some people can be very confused by it, or don't want to risk offending you, and just won't say anything. Don't worry about it.
>if they are rude
"Please no questions, take me to my destination, or I will find another cab." There is a hotline you can call as well in the event that you get a seriously rude, pervy, creepy driver, doesn't matter what they think of you, you are a paying customer and should be treated decently.

I had a guy do 10 under the limit to "safely" get me home (drawing out the ride to talk to me longer, there is no meter running so no extra money in it for him) and asked questions I didn't like, "are your friends pretty?" "Do you live with boyfriend" Told him to shut up and drive, or pull over. That was the 1%, though, most are good and some might even recognize/like what you have on.

>>8950935
>second place my degree is useful

The fact that you only talk about the characters shows that (like most of the world) you didn't actually read the book.

Nabokov was the greatest author of his generation. He set out to write that anyone could fall prey to evil, and he was successful. The book isn't about pedophilia, it's about morality, evil and how a man can quickly lose his way with one wrong move.

In any case, it's a fucking name. Why do I care what they associate it with?

So far nobody has ever asked WHAT it's called, only asked why I'm wearing it, but I haven't figured out what I feel most comfortable calling it yet. I live in an area where using the word Lolita is not a great idea. I'm torn between "maiden style" or "modern Victorian."

I had someone call me out as a Lolita once and they were super loud and obnoxious in a room full of older people and I felt like I was going to die of embarrassment. Thankfully that was a weird one time occurrence.

>>8951111
If you absolutely insist on never using the name, I think that modern Victorian/neo-Victorian is a nice alternative, especially if you're into gothic or classic.

>>8951076
>Nabokov was the greatest author of his generation
He wasn't

>>8950809
I'm Spanish too, but dealing with the people who associate the fashion with the book is just as easy as saying "Y qué si se llama como el libro? También tiene Lolita Flores algo que ver? Se llaman igual de casualidad, y punto", just be nonchalant about it. I've had more problems with the "If you're walking down the street dressed like this then I can totally snap pictures of you whether you like it or not" entitlement shit than with the name of what we're wearing. What comm are you into? I've heard the Southern half gets weirder encounters than the northern comms.

>>8951131
I'm in to old school and don't have love all the styles but currently only own sweet. But I think it would still be appropriate since oldschool has a different feeling than OTT or modern Lolita. Thanks for the imput! I know that modern Victorian is the smartest choice but part of me likes the sound of "maiden" because I read way to many storybooks as a kid.

>>8951148
Wow I am sorry for that mess I swear I know how to speak properly. My eyes are burning and I'm cold and tired.

That should say I love all styles of Lolita.

>>8951076
>Russian lit degree
>doesn't mention the most unique literary device he is known for: the unreliable narrator
Don't be certain about morality when the character isn't trustworthy to begin with.
Source: English lit M.A.

>>8951135
Different anon, but I would be very curious who you think is better.
>>8951076
bless you for being basically the only anon on here who knows what the book is about.

>>8951027
>Woody Allen
The film? Didn't he direct that or am I think of some other Hollywood creep

>>8951172
This is the kind of thing you can in fact google...

>>8951173
Which I did before, and I'm right. So I don't know what anon was on about kek

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>>8951175
The original is by Kubrick.

>>8951171
Kafka, Beckett, Andrić (who won the Nobel prize for literature)...

>>8951182
>Kafka
don't forget William S. Burroughs

>>8951182
It's honestly a pity more people haven't read Andric. I guess it's because of the strong historical element in his stories that few people can relate to because it's not as well known as, say, Nazi Germany or America/UK and the fact that he lived in the Balkans which even most Europeans consider little more than 'that place beggars come from'.

I wonder how many good writers fly under the radar because of things like this.

>>8951182
I have to wholeheartedly disagree, and as if a Nobel prize for literature equates or proves quality. Scores of the best authors in history were wrongly snubbed (Tolstoy, Joyce). But I do appreciate your taste.

>>8951076
>how a man can quickly lose his way with one wrong move.
Sure I guess, if he's a pedophile...

>>8950637
>ignore people who have nothing good to say, knowing that you are satisfied with your response and that you'll never please everyone
That is how you win.

I just tell them it's a Japanese fashion and call it a day.

I just call it victorian doll style, depending on what I'm wearing. Mostly I rock stained glass stuff, so I pass as a kooky goth.

>>8950637
i usually just speak for myself. it comes off as conceited sometimes, but at least that way people can't complain about you "misrepresenting them". how do you even explain sweet to normies without be cringey though?

I usually call it japanese street fashion, but if someone seems genuinely interested I'll call it egl so they can find it if they look online.

Why don't you just call it "lolita." Don't add, "it's not like the book" or explain all that crap about "the Japanese, they didn't know!" Just repurpose the damn word.

It happens all the time. Remember when everyone laughed at Apple for introducing a product called an iPad? "Hur hur pad..." Well, that lasted about a day. Same thing with the Wii. A less "big corporate" example are those goofballs that market their open-source Soylent. When I first read that I couldn't stop laughing. But the inventor flat-out address the "Soylent green is people!" in an interview by saying "it'll will gradually become associated with our product." And it has.

If lolitas had never made excuses, and just did what they did proudly and without any self-deprecating explanations, you'd have owned that word by now.

Never apologize, never explain. Words to live by.

>Hey anon, what are you wearing?
A dress.

This is not so much how I respond as a response I received from another lolita.

>be me, baby lolta
>be in normalfag mode walking down the street
>wild classic lolita appears!
>she's wearing a nice op that i think i recognize but want to confirm
>approach her
>"hey, where did you get your dress"
>she gives me the most put upon sign
>"it's from an alternative fashion brand from overseas. I got this dress from an online store, you've probably never heard of it"
>ok.jpg
>didn't want to press because she clearly wasn't having it

i know i should've been more specific with my question but goddamn, lady. all i wanted too know was if that dress was innocent world.

>>8951536
That's a bit much of a response. I get that people are sick of being asked, but if you just stick to, "Oh, it's a Japanese brand," or something it's short and sweet, and plus is not super rude. Sometimes I'll answer that and someone will be like, "Oh, I know! I wanted to know the brand!" So I take it as an indicator that they know what they're talking about and then we can discuss the fashion, but there's no need to be rude to strangers.

>>8950643
this, usually when people ask "why are you wearing this". Ugh. I sometimes ask "why are you wearing what you're wearing" back.

Fucks sake.

Last week at work, someone asked my interests. I said I really like Japanese fashion. Someone who fucking loves to grind my gears then said "OHHH don't you mean Lolita?". Cue me dropping my spaghetti exactly like OP's image.

Bonus: Another staff member decided to then talk about child abuse for a bit.

I'm sorry gulls, I tried.

>>8951499
I like your attitude, anon.

"High end fashion", "goth" and "brand clothes" are what I use.
"What are you wearing?" "This sir is called a dress."
"What is that?" "Ah thank you for asking! The dress is Moitie, I got a great deal on Y!A, the blouse is some old AatP."

>>8951842
I've told this story on here at least twice, but fuck it, I'm gonna post again!
>get ready for meetup at a friend's house
>she has multiple roommates, but only one is home
>I'm all dressed up and he lounges about the front door
>say hi
>get a weird look and no response
>tell friend I think he's kinda rude
>"yeah, he's a bit quiet but nice!"
>ok
>go to meetup (it was my first, I wore DDC ang got lots of compliments and was super happy)
>get back to friend's place
>some of her other roomates are home, we sit and chat for a bit after changing
>friends talks about meetup
>roomates are like "oh yeah, other roomate saw you before you left and told us all about lolita fashion!"
>ok
>"It's inspired by the movie and 50s fashion!"

That guy never even talked to us about it, he had heard the name from my friend and then just made shit up and educated others. What a dick.

>>8951135
Do you have a better suggestion?

>>8951182
Beckett was a hack.

>>8950481
Not a lolita, but a cosplayer.
A lot of normies will ask me what I'm wearing or what my Facebook pictures are about.
This is when I realize its kind of autistic to be dressed up like a fictional character for a japanese cartoon.
If the costume is casual enough I just say "I have weird fashion tastes."
However, when I'm walking out in giant mecha armor with a huge sword prop and "desu" makeup, then is where I have to admit my power level.
Usually get a "oh...that's nice..."

Spanish people are irrespectful as fuck when I wear Lolita, but nobody really gave me a hard time about the name of it. Like, nobody.

The "Lolita" book is barely a thing here, so yeah, it's shorter to call it like that and walk away than making a huge deal about it and going on about what type of fashion it is or whatever.

>>8951927
Not a cosplayer but imo you should own your passions. Sure, cosplay is "weird" and "out there" and anything but normie but it's something that you like to do, it's a creative outlet, and it's harmless so there's no real reason to be ashamed of it. It's not like your hobby is kicking puppies and punching kittens.
Some people will look at you funny and maybe judge you for dressing up like a Japanese cartoon character and say that you're "childish" or whatever, but honestly, who cares what they think? Take pride in what makes you happy.

>>8951499
This is not the same. If someone thinks I'm dressed as pedo bait they're gonna do things that might make me look bad in front of lots of people.
I don't want to look bad. I want to look cute.
You know why we have to explain ourselves? Because we'll be excluded due to some retard thinking they know everything and telling everyone it's a fetish or some shit.

You know what's hilarious? If you wore larme no one would think anything of it. But that shit is nymphet as hell.

And you know this shit is only a problem for girls who wear sweet. Goth lolitas are just seen as fancy goths.
>what are you wearing
>oh it's goth
You can't just tell someone you're wearing sweet, they won't understand and they'll ask more questions.

You have to say something that will shut the other person down. People are fucking idiotic and like to yell about things to everyone else and that can become a problem real fast.

You know what I don't want? To be asked to leave because some unknowing moron flips their shit cause I'm wearing "lolita".

>>8952036
>this shit is only a problem for girls who wear sweet
kek, sure, whatever you say

>>8951499
Two problems. First of all those are all companies that are household names in the US and have the chance to get that exposure. The same can't be said of lolita brands.

Second a sanitary pad, a word that could mean penis or pee and a cinematic nutritional supplement don't have the same level of negative connotation as a book about a sexualized 12 year old girl. Also "Lolita" doesn't have any other connotations in western nomenclature except for the few that know it as a nickname for "Dolores" or maybe the Lana Del Ray song. Google "Lolita" right now and the first page is only about the books or film though the images show a mix of the fashion and the film/novel covers.

Even my mom who is super supportive about me wearing lolita will only refer to it as "Rufflebutt." I know some gulls don't like that because it sounds like diapers or something but I think it's cute.

That being said, a while ago we had a thread discussing what we would rename lolita if we had the power to do so and I don't think anything really stood out.

>>8952036
>>this shit is only a problem for girls who wear sweet
I wore a really simple black flocked dress with a petti and an ivory lace cardigan to a wedding and got a ton of "Oh you look like Alice!" Wasn't even the same color scheme wtf.

>>8952089
rufflebutt is super cute

I think you'd be reaching to associate it with diapers, because petticoats, at least to me, would be brought to mind


tell your mom her idea is cute

Fortunately nobody has ever asked me the name of the fashion. Most people I know don't even know fashions can really have names aside from really generic descriptions like goth or retro.
It's a good thing too because the one time lolita fashion came up in conversation with normies one girl immediately started ranting about how lolitas are whores who want to have sex with pedophiles. And yes, she was talking about the fashion. Funnily enough she apparently didn't seem to realize I was actually wearing (casual) lolita at the time.

Usually when people ask what I'm wearing I either tell them I bought it online or made it myself, and they're happy with that.

>>8950588
>>8950594
>>8950599
>>8950628
I'm Dutch too and everyone I've ever mentioned the word lolita to anyone they immediately said "oh, like the book?". That, or they were enough into anime to think of harajookoo kawaii gosuroris instead. Lolita was on my English reading list in high school, so even if people never read it themselves they've at least heard of it.

>>8951844
I like to drop brand names without further explanation, too. Especially with Moitie or Meta because if you say it fast enough, people can't tell the names are nonsense and might think it's some fancy French fashion brand.
>tfw after I tried to explain the second hand market, my grandma proudly started telling her church friends that I run a high-end fashion import and resale business
lol sure grams

>>8950734
I think I needed to take a cab only once, and that driver happened to be a talkative type, so he made lots of comments and asked lots of questions. But overall he said it was really pretty and he also joked that people will think he's transporting a life size doll and will stare when he stops at traffic lights. I was amused.

And marginally relevant, I've also had a bus driver comment on my outfit once. I was wearing a longer dress with a fancy print and lighter colours so it was pretty eye-catching. He was just gushing about how pretty the dress was and that I was totally festive (it was Easter).

If you get silent types, they probably won't say much (or anything at all).

I usually say "it's a Japanese fashion" and leave it at that. A few times I was pressed for websites and such, and in that case I did say lolita, but I've non-chalantly put in some quip about how the name was chosen because it sounded cute and girly in Japan. If the person is already a nerd and brings up the name themselves I don't bother.

And likewise if someone says "I like your costume" I don't really bother correcting them, I guess I just ran out of fucks to give. Sometimes I say "thanks, it's a Japanese fashion" but that's about it.

>>8952092
>Wasn't even the same color scheme wtf.
Exactly. People are that fucking dumb.

>>8952089
>Google "Lolita" right now and the first page is only about the books or film though the images show a mix of the fashion and the film/novel covers.
All the more reason gulls need to drop the phrase "Google is your friend"
If anything it's our common enemy.

>>8952047
Well if you're wearing classic or country or goth, there are just other categories those can fit into.
Sweet is so out of the ordinary that people will of course notice. And then lolita just adds to the pedo connotation from the book and films. It's a fucking girls name but no one knows that.
Light pink + the name lolita = omfg in normie minds.

My friends bf flipped his shit cause of the book but thankfully she actually knows of j fashion and was able to calm him down. He is not someone I would call extremely educated and he even knew the book.

Of course it's gonna depend on where you live but where I live, it is extremely important to inform people that no, it has nothing to do with the book.

I just say its lolita. The book is not that well know in my country.

>>8952281
Yeah and straight from Wikipedia: "Its assimilation into popular culture is such that the name "Lolita" is now often used to describe a sexually precocious girl."

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>>8952092
I was in a navy sailor dress and the postman asked me if I was Bo Peep.

>>8950714
If you call her Dolores or Lola or something it would still make sense to use Lolita as a nickname privately/with people who aren't idiots

>>8952309
Or Dolly

>>8952114
This is so odd to me.. I'm Dutch too and I had never heard of the book until I found out about the fashion when I was in high school. When I told my parents and friends about this fashion called lolita none of them mentioned the book, so I don't know if they knew the book or not but they obviously didn't think it was related or they would have mentioned it.

>>8950714
I don't think people actually use it as a name tough? It's used as a nickname for children called Dolores. I'm not fluent in Spanish but I can imagine people would find it odd to meet an adult called Lolita.

>>8950714
Lori

>>8952327
It's more of a nickname. Lola can be used as a name. Spanish likes to stick -ito or -ita on the end of things to signify "this is the smaller possibly cuter version of something"

>>8952089
>>8952036
Look, I know all the reasons. I'm just suggesting, stop letting the rest of the world define you. If lolitas wore their name proudly, and didn't let someone say "get out, pedo," any more than they'd let someone say "get out, queer," then it's likely the first page of Google results wouldn't be all about the book.

Make the world deal with you as you are; don't let them make you deal with them as they are. That's all I'm suggesting. Change the mindset that keeps you on your toes, and instead just own it. The rest of the world can eventually catch up. And if they don't, they're the ones who look ignorant in the process.

tl;dr: lolitas need top stop apologizing for, and rationalizing away, the name.

>Chooses to wear an incredibly unusual, controversial, eye-catching style of clothing.
>"HOLY SHIT I JUST REALIZED I ACTUALLY REALLY GIVE A FUCK WHAT PEOPLE THINK OF ME"

I think this is the problem most people have in this thread. You're wearing clothes that are the complete opposite of your personality, maybe stay to neutrals or black if you're contrived and self-conscious.

Who honestly cares what people think? People are boring and live boring lives, have boring jobs and eat their boring yogurt while watching boring TV. Let them think whatever the fuck they want. Oh no, she's wearing a pedophile dress - somebody call the fashion police. It's such a waste of time to spend your life worrying what people think - trying to balance something as outrageous as lolita clothing into acceptable normality like a square peg in a round hole. And for what? Do you really care about conforming into the very mold you tried avoiding when you started wearing obscure Japanese little-girl street fashion? You might as well have just worn a t-shirt and jeans from the get-go if you care so much about what other people think of you.

>>8950497
Modern Victorian sounds like a good answer for me from now on. Simple and if they ask for more, then I'd maybe elaborate.

>>8950481
I don't have one. I don't speak to strangers for no good reason especially ones who ask me personal questions out of the blue. I don't speak to cab drivers after I give them the address. You'd be amazed at how quickly just a neutral, even stare and 5 seconds of silence shuts 90% of the population down completely.

I just say it's a Japanese street fashion based off of Victorian and Rococo clothing. Even when I'm in sweet it's usually enough of an explanation for people.

>>8952475
Yeah because they assume you're unfriendly (which you are), or unhappy or weird, and if you're dressed unlike the rest of people around you and stick out like a sore thumb, they're gonna definitely assume this.

You probably have a lot of people thinking you lost a bet.

>>8952534
That's just it, I don't care what a bunch of randos assume or think, and no, it's not unfriendly to not answer unsolicited rude questions from complete strangers simply because they are nosey and rude enough to bother me.
I don't bait anyone, reply rudely or mess with them, I just don't feel obligated to answer dumb questions from strangers that decide it is ok to bug me on the street or when I am just going about and quietly minding my own business.

>>8952462
I'm perfectly comfortable with people thinking Im a huge weirdo with terrible taste in clothes, but my problem (which I'll admit results from a bunch of personal issues) is with people thinking I'm a sexual deviant.

Basically
>attention-seeking loser
>weeaboo cosplayer
>satanist
>living doll freak
>escaped mental patient in costume
>omg is she in a cult?!!?
>etc.
I can deal with and laugh about but
>chick with daddy issues who pretends to be a child during sex and wears her fetish clothes out in public
nopenopenopenopenopeNOPEnoooooope

>>8952559
I never said I'm autonomous but neither do I feel the need to blabber on about my clothes to complete strangers who just approach me on the street. It's not a 'problem', I think many in this thread are overreacting with this need to explain. If you WANT to then fine, go for it but it's not really an obligation nor required for politeness. Complete strangers coming up to people and questioning them about ANYthing personal doesn't require a response. If you want to give them one then go for it, who is stopping you? But not everyone does. And that's ok too.

Lived in Japan for a few years, so a lot of my friends think I'm suddenly the Japanese consulate or some shit.

Anyhow, there was some kind of shindig in Phoenix where there were people dressed "nice" (in my eyes), and one of my friends said "Oh that's the new Japanese fashion" ..

I said " maybe in Tokyo. You'd freeze in Aomori in that. Awesome stitching though. That kind of seaming takes real fucking skill"..

Caught a bit of shit for that, but fuck people that cannot appreciate fine craftsmanship, regardless of the application.


I'm an A&P, (aircraft mechanic) and was sewing fabric covers for vintage aircraft at the time.
The stuff I see here takes real skill compared to what I did.

>>8952592
Service workers and drivers are obligated to be polite, talk to customers, reply, make conversation and it's just nice when someone sits down and shuts up or minds their own business and there is some peace and quiet. Strangers might <gasp> be offended if you don't answer their rude, intrusive questions?
That's just weird.
I live in a city where strangers just coming up to you and commenting on your personal <anything> would be considered really very rude.
Maybe you don't.
You are quick to judge. Maybe someday that thinking will bite your ass and you will learn that different people have different customs.

>>8952375
>I'm just suggesting, stop letting the rest of the world define you
Again, no one is completely autonomous. There's a reason why so many people are having this kind of reaction and feel the need to explain themselves.

>>8952552

The thing is, while I do understand that it's a bit rude for someone to come up to me and ask me to justify my fashion choices (It has happened, and I don't like it) >>8952534 is right in saying that you'll just come across as unfriendly if you're immediately trying to 'shut people down'. You personally might not care about being rude, but it's a shit way to live your life - being constantly on the defensive and instigating eye-contact just to scare people into not talking to you. I know how it is because I got physically attacked on more than one occasion for wearing J-Fashion and it put me on the offensive too but it just took the fun out of wearing something that used to make me feel happy and positive so I just got over it and didn't let it change me.

If someone is interested enough in what I'm wearing to approach me with a question then I'll answer them, I don't consider it a dumb question because how else would they learn? Most of the people who come up to me and ask me questions about my clothes are usually older or on their own, most of them are lonely and see bright/unusual clothing as an excuse to start talking because they know you're not a threat to them and the clothes are a good icebreaker.

If people ask awkward questions about lolita the book or ageplay then just tell them the truth, it's not like there's anything to hide or be embarrassed about. What's the worst they can say? "I think you're lying and you're actually a secret diaper fetishist"? Okay cool.

>>8952462
not caring what people think and not wanting people to harass you when you're just trying to live your life are two different things

>>8953049

That's completely unrelated to the post though. Nobody wants to be harassed, it's basically a crime. What exactly is your point with that statement?

>>8953044
>instigating eye-contact just to scare people into not talking to you

I hope someday anon meets someone who just stares right into her eyes while continue to ask her questions because that would be hilarious.

>>8950481
The ones who ask me usually just answer themselves.

>"You look like a Dutch country maid!"
>Yeah! It's like, old European inspired!

>"What are you wearing?"
>Oh it's Japanese
>"I thought so!"

>"Are you an anime?" / "Are you in a play/event?"
>Not really, I just dress like this.

>>8953046
Nope it isn't but I wasn't the one who asked about it, just telling you why. And people here do talk about it in relation to Lolita meets because if we go to the same cafe more than once and some meet attendees are shitty tippers, we all get the side eye on the second visit so it's a bit embarrassing if it happens.

>>8953059
It has happened. They have always broken off eventually. I'm still not going to answer questions for strangers, about fashion or anything else.
They are already staring when they come up to me so they are initiating the unwanted contact. Silence, staring back/lack of response just lets them know they are out of line and need to stop doing the rude behavior.

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I don't see a problem with calling it what it is, if you are scared of the connection than you shouldn't wear the fashion.
>oh no pedos!!

>>8952982
If you lived off tips you'd be bitter about it too.

>>8953114

It's not rude for someone to ask you a question though. You're confusing bad manners for what you personally find undesirable or offensive, but they're not the same thing at all.

>>8953055
nayrt but I see what they're saying - >>8952462 is implying that the reason people don't want to call it lolita is because they care what people think, but the real reason is that they don't want to be harassed (with rude questions or comments) by random people who ask about it. I think anon just worded it poorly

>>8953552

So then stop wearing it. As long as it's unusual people are going to come up and ask questions about it. What did you expect? I think you'd have to be extremely sheltered to wear blatantly unusual clothing and then complain when people approach you about it.

If you can't deal with that then don't wear it. People wear clothes that reflect their personality, you can hardly blame people for thinking that you'll be a sociable person for wearing flamboyant dresses with kitschy prints.

>>8952466

The best part is if you type it into google images it throws up a few shitty 'modern victorian' outfits but every now and then will show a totally extravagant one that is lolita-esque (but is definitely not lolita).

The bad thing about calling it modern victorian is that it actually prevents people from entering the fashion based on it's mere name. Typing it into google won't give lolita fashion very easily.

Additionally it probably doesn't work as an explanation if you're wearing something too unlike gothic or casual styles. Try saying it's 'modern victorian' while you're into guro and you're probably just better off saying 'cosplay.'

>>8953566

You're better off just saying 'Lolita'.

>>8953563
I'm specifically talking about rude/gross comments that would come with calling it lolita, not the standard "bo-peep" or "are you in a play" type comments or just general questions.

I think the point is that calling it lolita can sometimes lead to harassment... i don't think not wanting to deal with that means you just shouldn't wear it

>>8953576
>i don't think not wanting to deal with that means you just shouldn't wear it

I think it does because it's going to happen regardless. You can blame who you want for it but it doesn't leave you with any actionable objective, does it? You can either wear it and put up with the comments or you can not wear it and not get comments, those are your two options.

>>8950953
I think some people act a little too bitchy when answering questions like this. I know it's annoying to have your motives questioned 20 times in a row but unless they're being rude, no need to snap at them.
THIS. I literally do not care what girls in my comm call the fashion to strangers, even if it provokes some "hurr like the book?" answers, but when they're unnecessarily rude to someone just asking a question, I want to scream.

>>8953114
I'm genuinely curious where you live to have such customs as tipping but strict social restrictions for strangers. Can you say? Doesn't have to be a city, but if you don't mind the state or general geographic area ("west coast usa"), I'd appreciate it. Apologies for being a nosy stranger, I'm just baffled.

this is a nice thread.

>>8953583
but you could just avoid or at least try to avoid the gross comments by not calling it lolita... that's the point of this thread. if the weird comments happen regardless then you just deal with them, but there's nothing wrong with trying to avoid them in the first place

>>8953635
>but you could just avoid or at least try to avoid the gross comments by not calling it lolita... that's the point of this thread.

That's not why people make those comments though. It's called lolita because it's lolita fashion, people harass you because you're wearing unusual clothes. Stop lying to yourself and just accept it for what it is.

>"Hey Chad bro look at that chick wearing clothes inspired by the titular character from Vladimir Nabokov's seminal 20th Century novel about child exploitation. Let's give her some shit before we hit this kegger dude"
>"Haha yeah bro, fuckin' nerds"

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>>8952089
>rufflebutt
Omg this is so cute

>>8953662
>It's called lolita because it's lolita fashion
No... it's a french girls name...

>>8953608
>I know it's annoying to have your motives questioned 20 times in a row but unless they're being rude, no need to snap at them.
Yup. I can tell most of this thread hasn't worked in customer service before.
I'm so used to explaining weird unreasonable things to people who are already pissy that it doesn't bother or phase me when someone goes "wait.. it's called lolita?!"

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>>8953740

You've missed the point, I don't mean the origin of the name, I mean we in the west call it 'lolita' because the Japanese use ロリータ and they dictate the fashion. It's stupid trying to do some kind of 4kids localization on the term just because some people can't differentiate between an old fictional book and a dress. The average person on the street doesn't care about the difference between Punk and Goth and those have been going since the 70s. I don't see why it's so difficult to just tell the truth, everyone is getting their knickers in a twist over nothing really.

>"It's called Lolita? Like the book about the pedophile?!"
>"Yeah technically the name does originate from there, but it's not really got anything to do with it, it's just the way the Japanese have interpreted it and applied it to an idealized fashion style."

And honestly, I can't imagine the above scenario even happening unless you like to declare the name of what you're wearing to anyone who asks.

Possible American localizations for other styles:

Mori: - Too Japanese, might remind some people of Pearl Harbor, let's just stick to 'Flower girl'.
Fairy: - Could be offensive to homosexuals. Let's call it '80s Cutecore'.
Hime: - America has no royal family, so we need something that reflects capitalistic freedom a little bit more. 'Blingy Bae'. Perfect.

>>8953662
except the name is one of the reasons that people make those comments

again, I'm not talking about general comments and questions, or people being rude, or people taking photos - that is not the issue. people will do that no matter what. I'm talking about people making pervy comments. that doesn't usually happen if you don't mention the name.

>>8953816

Under what circumstance does a normal, non-perverted person come up to you and then suddenly turn into a lecherous deviant after specifically asking you the name of the clothing style you're wearing? It sounds to me like they already know about lolita fashion.

Please elaborate with examples that have happened to you complete with dialogue of the conversation and how the incident played out. Thank you.

>>8953803
>blingy bae
I want to puke

>>8953824
it's not about what anyone ~expected,~ it's about trying to avoid uncomfortable situations

why are you so upset that people want to avoid perverted comments from strangers, calling it something other than lolita is not hurting anyone

>>8953834
that doesn't answer the question of why you care whether or not people in this thread would prefer to not refer to it as lolita

>>8953848
not that anon but how is calling it a japanese fashion instead of straight up saying "lolita fashion" wrong and stupid

>asspained that you don't have the personality necessary to wear the clothes you like

what even does this mean? you're the one who is mad that people want to avoid possible awkward situations. And I'm not even agreeing that people would be gross if you called it lolita, but who cares if someone else doesn't want to?

>>8953860
I am not the other anon, and I already said that I wasn't agreeing that people would be gross, just that I understood where they were coming from since the word has negative connotations in some places

>>8953803
>Mori
I understand the joke but it doesn't really sound that japanese it sounds just like Maury

>>8953869

It's still pointless to call it something else. Lots of things have negative connotations, you challenging them by using them despite these connotations is what makes them change. You ruin it for everyone by trying to dance around it like it's actually a bad thing when it completely isn't.

>>8953573

Whoa now I'm no babyfucking ageplaying diaper fetishist pisser in public.

>>8950486
The other L word

I hope you niggas don't actually wear that shit outside of cons.

During meetups, whenever someone answers that question, I tell them that my comm is a "Neo-Victorian fashion club". Gets the point across quickly without mentioning the name or implying that it's some sort of weird fetish. I only mention the name when people directly ask for it. Otherwise, if I'm being a lone lolita, and someone asks me what I'm wearing, I look them straight in the eye, say "Clothes", and walk away.

>>8953973
Yeah but you can't really take a niche hobby and try to make it more popular than something that is literally a big part of pop culture. There are two movies for christ sake, and on top of that, the book is considered lit still and ends up on reading lists.

More people know what a hijab is than they would lolita as a fashion and not a Google keyword for "pedo lite"

>>8953827
Not the other anon but, where I live it's not uncommon for men to try and chat up women all friendly and innocent like and then suddenly they're telling you their list of fetishes.
As a woman wearing normie clothes in the US, this has happened to me numerous times, usually on the train or on the street downtown where crazies roam.

>>8953827

>Under what circumstance does a normal, non-perverted person come up to you and then suddenly turn into a lecherous deviant after specifically asking you the name of the clothing style

This is actually really common. If you haven't experienced this at least a few times somethings peculiar about your experience with wearing the fashion.

The uniqueness of the fashion and the fact there's usually stockings + heels + gorgeous hair + princess looks gets people interested then mention 'lolita' and pow there they go. Happened to me once when a guy complimented my gothic coord and when I replied with the usual L word to his 'what's the fashion called?' he began complimenting my feet and 'naughty gloves.'

Lolita is usually just that tiny bit too relaxing for those kinds of people and social etiquette seemingly goes straight in the bin once you mention the fashion unfortunately shares it's name with the book. There's not much wrong in discussing or seeking out names that, while accurate, substantially avoid giving people that kind of blank cheque to talk about fetishes or the book.

>>8950486
Reading this thread makes me wonder if I shouldn't just call it Lesbian instead. Like yeah, I'm wearing Lesbian today. Or like, hey Mom, I just bought this Lesbian JSK do you like it? What kind of shoes do you think are appropriate for Lesbian? Do you know any budget-friendly Lesbian options? That kind of stuff.

>>8953541
A total stranger approaching you out of the blue, asking you personal questions about your clothes (or car, bag, hair, etc) IS rude. My friend with a Mohawk thinks so, another friend who carries an unusual handbag and gets bugged thinks so, my friend with a custom modded car thinks so. My Goth friends think so when randos question their fashion. Same thing with people bugging lolitas who are just minding their own business. Normal, polite people don't just go up to total strangers in public and begin quizzing them about any aspect of their personal business. Where the hell does anyone get off thinking this is an ok thing? In the city, only the drunks and kookoos babble to strangers walking by.

>>8953626
A larger metro area in the southern United States. Women here do not talk to strangers on the street. It's taught at a very young age. So is over-tipping to get very good service.

I think some people are forgetting differences in culture in this thread. What may be rude to you may not be rude in another culture. When I visit the US I've noticed that strangers find it normal to talk to me, even when I'm reading or listening to music or obviously going somewhere. In my country it's definitely rude for a stranger to talk to me for any reason. It has happened a few times that someone stared at my clothes or asked me why I was wearing it, and usually I say it's just my clothes and walk away without saying anything else because that person is the one who is rude for bothering me. Some random dude in the street is not entitled to my conversation.

>>8954582
>Some random dude in the street is not entitled to my conversation.
Asking nicely isn't rude, and your opinion and words aren't anything special for a person to be 'entitled to'. You must be from one of those autistic countries in Scandinavia where people never talk to each other unless they want something. Which I consider rude and selfish. There's a lot of exchange students at my uni from there and they're all mute pricks who haven't been taught to say 'thank you' and 'please' like normal human beings.

Everyone around here knows what "goth kids" are so I say "It's an alternate fashion, like how goth is an alternate fashion focused on modesty and cuteness instead of black and death."

>>8954606
>Which I consider rude and selfish
Oh look, you just proved anon's point. Different cultures mean different social customs, and yours isn't superior to hers just because you want to talk to someone.

>>8954674
Actually it is, because most of the world communicates that way. Her country's an exception, humans are social animals by nature, which is why so many people in Northern Europe end up killing themselves.

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>>8952327
tl;dr: Lolita is not exactly a "girls nickname" as anglophones like to say, it shows endearment but is not restricted to children.

"Dolores" is the actual name, it can be shortened to "Lola" and "Lolita" is the cuter version, yes, but it's not restricted to children.

Adding -ito/-ita to the end of a name is a very common sign of endearment (Ana ->Anita, Elena->Elenita, Jorge->Jorgito) used by close friends, relatives and between couples, nothing weird with that. The ito/ita thing is most frequently used in public when someone shares the name with one of their parents, so people start calling the child that way to tell them apart (kind of similar to the usage of junior/senior), and can carry into adulthood in a friends and family context. What would be surprising is for someone to introduce themselves in a different context (such as work) with their name+ito/ita because it would look a bit childish, although it's not a 100% rule.

Take this example: (Dolores) Lola Flores was a VERY relevant singer and dancer starting in the fifties and sixties and well into the nineties when she died. She's got two daughters, and one is named after her. This daughter goes by Lolita as to distinguish her from her mother, and despite her age no one bats an eye because it's well understood that the suffix here is just carried over from the days she performed along with her mother. I actually use her as an example to normies on how the name Lolita is not only shared with the book, and that very different things can have the same name by mere chance.

1) "it's just Japanese fashion! :)" most people go "OH JAPAN" at this stage and fuck off.
2) "it's called loli :)" this works as I generally dress in sweet, so most people assume I'm saying "lolly" as in "candy", especially as I don't draw out the o sound. Might not work for goths/classics, but worth a try if "lolly" is common synonym for "candy" in your area as in mine.
3) "it's [brand name, dress name, making it as long as possible], it's designer :)" at this point they often ask how much it cost, I generally stick another zero on the end just to get them to fuck off from touching it.

I've found "they're just my clothes" doesn't help much and often invites more questioning, going straight to one of the above 3 usually cuts it to the end.

>>8954582
>In my country it's definitely rude for a stranger to talk to me for any reason

How do you people make friends?

>>8954727
They get drunk mostly

>>8954739
You must be Finnish

>>8954806
If I was Swedish I'd have said 'have interracial gay sex in a public toilet'

>>8954693
So basically "everyone needs to humor me whether they like it or not"

>>8954342
>The uniqueness of the fashion and the fact there's usually stockings + heels + gorgeous hair + princess looks gets people interested then mention 'lolita' and pow there they go. Happened to me once when a guy complimented my gothic coord and when I replied with the usual L word to his 'what's the fashion called?' he began complimenting my feet and 'naughty gloves.'

Evidence of this or is it just anecdotal?

>>8954531
So it's impossible to make friends where you live because no one should ever come up and try to ask you questions to break the ice?

>>8954531
>A total stranger approaching you out of the blue, asking you personal questions about your clothes (or car, bag, hair, etc) IS rude.

Define 'Personal'.

>"Why are you wearing that?"
>"What are you wearing??"

Depending on the tone and inflection, this can be rude.

>"Your clothes are interesting, what kind of style are they?"

This isn't rude.

You're not the only person on the planet to have ever worn something unusual. I've had compliments and I've had literally bricks thrown at me and been punched in the head for wearing weird clothes.

I don't go around with a huge chip on my shoulder and act like a cunt to anyone who tries talking to me, so what makes you so special?

>>8954711
Yeah I would say its not just a nickname but an actual name - someone came into my workplace yesterday and their name was Lolita. It was on her credit card too.

You're talking about the origins which are correct, but now a days, it's a name.

>>8954817
Why is it so hard to wrap around your brain that men love to harass women?
I'm at the point where I don't even say hello to men I don't know anymore because it's happened to me too many times.

>>8954823
Everyone here seems to just throw out the "muh culture" card and while I've not been outside the US, my friends have and no matter where they go, they meet people because, gasp!! Someone they didn't know came up to speak with them out the fucking blue!

I think what's really going on here is that 4chan is inhabited by a bunch of anti social tards who can't properly read social cues or tones and just assume that any normie trying to speak to them is a rude piece of shit that should mind their own business.

>>8954323

Lolita really isn't a big part of pop-culture. Of all the people I've told about lolita (Which is a lot) a very small handful have ever mentioned the book/movie and they've never connected it with the fashion. Almost everyone I've spoken to has either never heard of it, thinks it's a name or has actually thought it was a Japanese word.

>"What's that?"
>"Isn't that a Stanley Kubrick movie?"
>"Oh like the girl's name?"

Have I experienced creepers? Yes, but that's because the fashion is provocative. It might seem 'conservative' to those of us who understand its origins, but it's massively unusual to normal women's casual clothing, and that in itself attracts unwanted attention. I've never met a single creeper who has appeared any more or less of a creeper when mentioning the word 'lolita'. Absolutely nobody has ever made the connection to age-play, in fact I think you'd be surprised how many people aren't even aware of what age-play is.

So much of this fear of using the word 'lolita' comes from a conscience of knowing negative connotations that other people just don't think about, but obviously being into the fashion you hear more about it than they do. You could walk around in a full fursuit and at least 95% of the people who see you won't make the connection to furries because most people have no idea what a 'furry' is.

It's like when you're self-concious about a part of yourself and think everyone else notices it, but the reality is that not only do they not notice it, they have their own lives and really don't give a shit about you.

>>8954815
Yes, exactly. If they don't want to talk they can communicate like a normal human being and say so, as people can't exactly read minds and immediately know what you want and what you mean.

If you want people to stop talking to you, you tell them. But irl you're probably a spineless sperglord scared of confrontation so you'd rather avoid everyone.

>>8954836

Spot on. Not only that, /cgl/ is such a small portion of the lolita community, but they're so insular that they think their experiences speak for everyone. We've had 4channers in our comm before and they're always the most salty and weirdly anti-social, it's not that they're awkward hambeasts, it's just that they come across as having a massive insecurity complex and attitude problem about everything.

My comm is full of itas but they're nice people, we got a member about a year and half ago who was way above them in terms of brand and coord and she would bitch to me in private about how everyone looks awful and how we should start our own comm away from them. She was such an insufferable bitch who would shoot down any members of the public who asked questions and started making threads about how it was everyone else's fault when she found out we'd been making plans without her.

Some 4channers (Not just seagulls) have such a massive superiority complex that they don't realize that everyone else is doing this for fun and doesn't want to spend their free time in the salt mines.

>>8954847
Again, depends on where you live. Where I live, yes it is a huge part of pop culture. I live in Portland where if you say lolita the first thing out of someone's mouth will be "like the book??"
I've had this happen to me a few times. Other times they relate it to the movie or if they're super young, they've often said "that sounds like a name" and they're right, it is..

Again where I live, there are actually negative connotations attached to the name. It is not just in my head.
I mentioned earlier that someone came into my workplace with the name Lolita and the cashier asked her about the book. This is a real thing and a real connection that people do make.
Just because it doesn't happen in your area doesn't make it not so.

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>>8954342
>he began complimenting my feet

>>8954867

Even if it does happen a few times, which is incredibly unlikely - is it really so bad? If anyone came up to me and gave me some shit about it being from a book about a pedophile I would just deal with the situation and explain it. Like I deal with any awkward questions I get about it.

You'd have to have the social skills of a fucking armpit not to be able to tactfully explain to people that what you're wearing isn't related to the book/movie without coming across as a huge sperglord. If people don't believe you then who cares? They're stupid and will not be convinced by anything, these people will give you shit regardless of what answer you offer them.

I have friends who wear skinhead clothes and at worst get physically assaulted and heckled in the street for what they wear and at best have to explain everywhere they go that they're not racist homophobes (In a fiercely liberal city), they don't throw a hissy fit about it because they know that wearing controversial or unusual clothes is going to get them attention. This applies to virtually every subculture wearing unusual clothing - If someone is asking a genuine question about your clothes, they will accept the answer you give them and maybe try to learn more - People who give you shit have a bee in their bonnet and won't be satisfied with anything you say.

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I swear to god they didn't think this through when they named this fashion. Goddammit japs, we get it, you love little girls and you are not ashamed of it, but damn.

>>8954825
Well I'm talking about what happens in Spain, since I'm Spanish and the name most likely expanded from here. I don't know how other places have taken it, but I've seen some pretty unique names when it comes to the US. It doesn't surprise me that someone took Lolita for an actual name, but in origin, it just isn't.

>>8954539

You tip at the start of a meal?

>>8954933

Are you American?

>>8955042
No, why?

>>8954252
...Lesbians?

>>8955076

Ah, must have been a joke then.

>>8954997
Repeat service. Tip well, they remember you next time and treat you well.

>>8954582
This

Also the OP in this thread asked how we each deal with it. You may deal with it however you feel comfortable doing so. My choice to not answer stranger's questions about my clothes. That IS how I deal with it, doesn't affect you at all. If that way does not suit you then you are certainly free to deal with it in a way that you like better.

>>8954930
>which is incredibly unlikely
You think that kind of reaction to the word lolita is incredibly unlikely?
I'm saying the things I'm saying because it's happened EVERY time I've brought up the name of the fashion except for with my close friends who have been to Japan and know about the fashoin as well as all the other street fashion that goes on.

But I'm talking about uncultured normies, here.

>You'd have to have the social skills of a fucking armpit
This is indeed a thing that I have to deal with a lot. I may have social skills but that doesn't mean everyone around me does.
There are people you can explain things to and they will still not understand, even the most simplest of things. I've worked in customer service for like five years now and I've had to explain a lot of really simple shit to people who just didn't understand no matter how I or someone else spelled it out for them.

So yeah, maybe you can properly explain that yes, they share the same name but one is a street fashion from Japan and the other is a book and a film. That doesn't mean they're gonna grasp what you're saying or not misinterpret you. Shit gets lost in translation all the time. Sometimes people over react and there's nothing you can do but you can always do is fucking avoid bad situations.

like people have already said, a lot of them just talk about what it is first, then use the word. That seems the safest way to go.

Hey can we talk about how larme and nymphette fashions are a thing and they actually look and are slightly based off of the film Lolita, including the heart shaped glasses!!

NO ONE IS STOPPING THOSE PEOPLE AND GIVING THEM SHIT. AND WHY THE FUCK NOT.

>>8955381
>hey can we talk about...
Lets stop with the tumblr speak.

No one bothers those stuff because they arent really worn much if at all in the west and they dont immediately bring connections to Lolita. They are normie enough to be normal shit people wear and heart shaped glasses arent as iconic as you think to Lolita since it was only used in promo pics and since then is stuff you see in stores now and then.

>>8955378
>I'm saying the things I'm saying because it's happened EVERY time I've brought up the name of the fashion except for with my close friends who have been to Japan and know about the fashoin as well as all the other street fashion that goes on.

You say that, but can you actually prove it? It does sound like bullshit to me. Your anecdotal evidence contradicts the anecdotal evidence of everyone I know, so you'll need something stronger to support your case.

>>8955378
>That doesn't mean they're gonna grasp what you're saying or not misinterpret you.
>There are people you can explain things to and they will still not understand, even the most simplest of things

That's their problem though, not yours. You can't help someone who won't help themselves. If you find that awkward then you haven't worked in customer service enough, because people like this are easy to deal with.

>>8955381
>Hey can we talk about how larme and nymphette fashions are a thing
>being so socially inept that you actually have to announce your next topic
God, get off of tumblr and socialize with real people for once.

>>8955385
>Lets stop with the tumblr speak.
I've never seen that on tumblr but okay??

>>8955452
Fuck you I have a full time job.

>>8955438
>You say that, but can you actually prove it?
Do you want photographs of the incident? You prove your shit. You can't.
Guess what. Most shit on the internet is a lie.

>>8955476
>y-you can't prove it, nothing online is real
>except stuff i say, that's real
>i'll post pictures!!!
>grasping at so many straws she's going to post pictures of a conversation that happened irl

wut?

>>8955473
>??
>getting so defensive
Okay there young one.

>>8954819
I make friends through mutual friends and at social events designed for mingling and small talk to get to know each other, not by talking to random strangers on the street day to day.

I remember a while back I read that someone thought the name should be changed to Alice kei instead of lolita so when I'm talking with normalfags that's usually what I refer to it as. Seems to work out just fine.

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This edition was published in 2008 which makes it an EGL-Loli-Lolita

>>8955480
....so you really went along with that whole "take pictures of a conversation" part.... yeah...

>>8955482
>trolling people with tumblr memes
>why you gettin so defensive anon
typical

>>8951076
You're so fucking full of yourself for having read a book and distilled some interpretation from it dictated to you by your professors. When it comes to names and whether you want your child to be associated with a work of art it is still a book about a grooming rapist and his delusions and fantasies. You can write about that and still be "the greatest author of his generation". And stop making claims about author's intend that are evidently wrong.

>Teachers of Literature are apt to think up
such problems as "What is the author’s purpose?" or still worse "What is the guy trying to say?" Now, I happen to be the kind of author who in starting to work on a book, has no other purpose than to get rid of that book [...]
>There are gentle souls who would pronounce Lolita meaningless because it does not teach them anything. I am neither a reader nor a writer of didactic fiction, and, despite John Ray’s assertion, Lolita has no moral in tow. For me a work of fiction exists only in so far as it affords me what I shall bluntly call aesthetic bliss, that is a sense of being somehow, somewhere, connected with other states of being where art (curiosity, tenderness, kindness, ecstasy) is the norm.

>>8955524
> change the name from a book about a pedo to a book written by a pedo

ok

>>8955165
What, you know a nutcase who actually behaves like lolita is the fashion embodiment of pedophilia? Spill the tea.

>>8956044
At least Alice in Wonderland doesn't have the pedo connotation.

>>8955476
>Do you want photographs of the incident?

Photographs can't capture dialogue, can they? So a video would be better, yes.

>You prove your shit. You can't.
>Most of the shit on the internet is lie

Yes, everything on the internet is a lie, except what you say - that's the gosh darned truth.

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>>8955524

That's the stupidest shit I've ever heard.

Are you actually a pedophile? I can't help but think only someone with a massively guilty conscience would be this fixated on denying the name of a purely innocent fashion.

If I'm ever in the company of an anon who tries to hide it by calling it something other than lolita I'm just going to chime in and interrupt by loudly pronouncing that it's called lolita fashion and then make a huge point of the fact that:

>"Some people compare it to the book, but MOST of us aren't pedophiles. You don't need to hide it, Anon-chan!"
and
>"It is true to say that some of the girls who wear it are into age-play though..."

Just to watch them get their bloomers in a bunch.

>>8956450
>Are you actually a pedophile? I can't help but think only someone with a massively guilty conscience would be this fixated on denying the name of a purely innocent fashion.

>If I'm ever in the company of an anon who tries to hide it by calling it something other than lolita I'm just going to chime in and interrupt by loudly pronouncing that it's called lolita fashion

Either bait or you're autistic as fuck

>>8956479

Of course it's trollbait, look at the last sentence. This isn't the sort of shit autistic people do, they're more likely to be socially awkward than to purposely make someone feel embarrassed.

>>8956439
You can't take a picture of a conversation you fucktard

>>8956528

Meant for >>8955476

>When people give me shit about the name Lolita

"Football can mean either american football or soccer. The same word has two common meanings. Lolita is a Japanese fashion and also the name of a book among other things. They are unrelated."

An answer that is universally understood immediately. The end.

>>8956566
lolitas are so worried about stupid people misunderstanding them, i don't get why. stupid people misunderstand everything, all the time. and their misunderstanding is literally meaningless. like, are they so insecure they care about what a random person on the street thinks? i mean, obviously since they can't even dress up alone and go out.

>>8956566
I'll also add that any stranger that asks you upon meeting you about your "fetish" had a premeditated conversation in mind, so don't feel bad shutting that shit down and being rude back. Someone genuinely curious will not steer the conversation this way within 30 seconds.

>>8955520
>social events designed for mingling
Are you people so autistic as to dedicate a separate event for the sole purpose of meeting people, as opposed to letting it happen naturally and organically?
Jesus fucking Christ your country must be a nightmare.

>>8956586
>>8956580
>>8956566

Exactly, I've been saying this throughout the thread and had nothing but bullshit answers. I'd like to see what they have to say to such a succinct way of putting it.

>>8956580
>>8956865
I don't really know HOW to explain it and have it makes since and I'm terrible at talking but basically I can't speak for the other people who try not to use Lolita around strangers and family but for me, it's because I'm trying not to burn social bridges and don't really fancy the idea of anyone thinking I'm some kind of fetishists. I'm not particularly insecure because I've always been the "weird" one and learned I'm never gonna fit in anyway, but there's still a line there. The idea of being accused of Lolita being a fetish or me being a sexual deviant does not sit well with me but it doesn't mean I am too cowardly to wear weird clothes because I can handle the other stuff. Also, I am extremely shy. I'm not afraid of wearing weird clothes but again, there's a line. It's not really a black and white thing, you know? I'm sorry I really don't know how to explain it id you can't empathize with it already because I am awful at talking.

For example, I am pretty close with my family and would not want to start drama over a stupid name when I can just as easily say "modern Victorian" instead. It's not a matter of "being insecure" it's more like, I don't know, situational social etiquette.

It's picking your battles.

>>8956844
not AYRT and I do not attend mingling social events but my entire life I have never been able to make friendships "organically" because I don't know what's wrong with me but nobody seems to like me enough to be friends with me and the few people who end up wanting to be my friend are always mentally ill, autistic, or crazy who are taking advantage of my shyness and kindness. I've tried making online friends and it's been a total failure too. While I'm not interested in going to a social event for the purpose of making friends, they are good for people like me, because there's a possibility of actually finding someone with something in common with yourself. They are used a lot by people who move into a new town or city and don't know anyone. People are always joining clubs and classes for things just for the sole purpose of socializing and hoping to meet new friends. It's not as crazy as it sounds.

>>8957306
Also, I just realized Lolita community meets and the literal friending threads on here are two examples of social events designed for mingling that most people here probably attend. And what are conventions? So, yeah. It's really not unusual.

>>8957306
And I want to apologize to anyone on here that has autism for the comment I made because I just relized that sounded really rude and I know many people here have openly admitting to being autistic. It's not that I have anything against being friends with people who are, but I'm talking about people who are either really bad or have never attempted to even try being polite and respectful and stuff. Like, the ones who are absolutely impossible to be friends with because they are too draining to have to deal with.

sage for babbling, sorry for being annoying and making a 3 part post.

>>8956844
Not the anon you're replying to and not even living in the same continent but who the hell even befriends random strangers off the street. Most people meet new friends at parties, social gatherings, through mutual friends or in a work/school environment.

>>8954539
Huh, that's so odd to think that we can be so different. I'm also from the southern US but was never taught anything like that. Catcalling and the like is one thing, but I wouldn't perceive merely asking a question about one's clothing to be rude. It's really interesting how we have these little pockets of culture that seem, idk, unexpected when looking at average norms in our country, especially when, as two southerns, we may not even be that far apart. Anyway. Thanks for answering.

>>8957292

So close with your family that they'll think you're a pedophile fetishist because the dress you wear is named after something tangibly related?

You're either not close with them at all, or you're just immensely paranoid/insecure.

If there was a popular men's fashion style called 'Gayboy' and loads of guys either refused to wear it because of the name or tried to call it something else because they didn't want people thinking they were gay, everyone would laugh them out the building for being so insecure about their sexuality. I fail to see how this is any different.

>>8957306
>my entire life I have never been able to make friendships "organically" because I don't know what's wrong with me but nobody seems to like me enough to be friends with me

Try not staring at them like they're a piece of shit everytime you think they'll ask about your dress.

I found myself coming across this when I was telling a bartender an anecdote about fixing a burst tire while in lolita, and hesitated while thinking of how to put it for what felt like a billion years. Eventually I said 'Victorian princess'.

>>8958221
gay =/= pedo

Tons of people are very defensive of anything possibly pedo related. Even when they let their kids wear heavily padded bras, show off cleavage, watch rated R movies, and listen to "big booty bitches" oddly enough. If you're a teacher or studying to be one lolita could cost you your job just from the way it looks alone, much less the name.

Even if that weren't true why would it matter if someone just said it's Japanese fashion? If someone is genuinely interested I'll tell them and give them brand names or a site, but most people that aren't just being dickheads or creeps just want to know if it's a costume or why you're wearing it. They don't care about the actual name unless they're a close relative and even then they often don't really care.

>>8958255
>gay =/= pedo
>Tons of people are very defensive of anything possibly pedo related. Even when they let their kids wear heavily padded bras, show off cleavage, watch rated R movies, and listen to "big booty bitches" oddly enough. If you're a teacher or studying to be one lolita could cost you your job just from the way it looks alone, much less the name.

You've missed the point. Lolita != pedo. Lolita is the name of the fashion. More people know that gay = homosexual than lolita = obscure book about a controversial relationship, yet we would consider it insecure if someone didn't want to wear a fashion with 'gay' in the name.

>>8958225
What are you going on about? This was the weirdest attempt to rile me up that I've ever experienced lol.

>>8958221
Calm the fuck down. You (I assume it's you because you seem to be really into this for some reason) made a comment saying nobody can explain why people want to avoid the name and someone tried giving you a better answer.

I'm really surprised at the amount of arguing and negativity in this thread. I don't understand it.

>>8952114
>harajookoo kawaii gosuroris
i don't know why i laughed as hard as i did

I typically call it Lolita, and if someone asks if i's related to the book, I tell them that the name started as an insult towards the wearer that designers reclaimed and ran with, much like how 'punk' was an rude name for people that dress in what we nowadays call punk fashion.

It works pretty well, despite the fact that it's purely BS.

>>8958283
Maybe same anon that got all butthurt up thread because someone said they don't answer clothing questions from strangers?

I have to really put myself out there in a group with a common interest to make friends and even so, it takes me a while. I keep trying though.

"My outfit is by a Japanese brand called (fill in the blank with the brand of your dress." Then if they press you can tell them they have a website. No need to mention lolita whatsoever. If they ask the name of the style, I say it is a Japanese street fashion inspired by (insert inspirations).

I always say this, "it's a Japanese fashion with an unfortunate name," and if they press i say, "the creators picked a foreign word that they thought sounded cute and that would sound similar in Japanese: lolita."

Lost in translation it seems...

I usually just call it "Japanese street fashion" when asked directly, and I try to avoid saying 'Harajuku' because I immediately get the "ohhh hair-a-jeeewwwkewwww, like Hello Kitty and Gwen Stefani!" If not asked directly for the name, I just say "I just like to dress up, this is what I normally wear when it's not too hot out." When I'm at meets I just describe it as "a fashion club."
Nowadays, though, people tend to say "Oh, wow, lolita, cool!" without even asking, even older middle-aged ladies know the name where I live. It's still a bit jarring when someone else is the first one to whip it out.
That being said, I don't think the book is very well-known here. (I live in western Canada) I used the name casually with friends and family and not a single one of them batted an eye. If anything, I've gotten more ageplay / pedo responses just from people looking at what I'm wearing and assuming it's pedobait stuff without saying a word to me first, especially in high school; the rumor mill was quite active in regards to my supposed after school activities.
That sort of thing has never bothered me (it's great to laugh at later), but I dodge bringing up the name because I honestly just don't want to stand around doing 20 questions while I'm trying to get on with my day. I've got shit to do, people to meet, places to go, and I don't have time to answer a million unsolicited questions, no matter how well-intentioned they might be. I just give them a polite, short answer, smile, and get on my way.

>>8954836
>I've not been outside the US
There you go. It all depends on where you are. In my country it's relatively normal for people to start conversation in queues or cafes...but not in the middle of the street. I have friends in other places where talking to people in a non-social situation is just not the done thing. I'm not saying being rude to people who ask you about something which is blatantly unusual is good, in fact I think it's quite obnoxious if the other person is pleasant about it, but to presume all cultures have the same social norms is ignorant.

>>8952036
Replace the word Lolita with MLP.

Real shit.

I say it's a fashion from Japan and usually people shut up then because "lol japan and their wacky clothes!"

>>8962412

That's literally all you need to say, everyone else in this thread is autistic.

>>8950481
It's fucking awkward in my current comm because it's full of OTT sweet girls but they still answer strangers with "Oh it's historically inspired, you know, Victorian, rococo?" Like damn, tailor your response to what you're wearing.

I usually say "vintage-inspired" or something when I'm in classic, "alternative fashion, similar to goth" if I'm in gothic, but if I'm wearing sweet I'll say "Japanese street fashion". Whatever is likely to result in the least number of questions, without having to explain the whole evolution of the fashion's history from a porcelain doll aesthetic to loud as fuck prints that don't look Victorian at all.

>>8950497
If you know that girl well, just tell her "loli" is anime pedo porn and she'll probably stop doing it.

I've known some idiots call lolita "loli fashion" because they think it avoids the negative connotations of "lolita". Quite the opposite.

>>8950631
Try naming the brands instead, like >>8950635 suggested. A lot of western fashion looks don't have a specific name, so you can say something like "Oh, this is from a brand called Angelic Pretty, if you look online you'll see they have a lot of stuff with a similar aesthetic." That leaves them to do their own Googling at home if they can be bothered, and they'll find out it's called lolita far away from you.

>>8951927
Just say that you like to make costumes of characters from movies and TV shows, it's not hard. You don't have to even say it's Japanese or a cartoon and look weeby. People might not have heard of cosplay but they know what costumes are.

>>8959352
This is pretty great.

>>8950714
I had a coworker named Lolita. Parents got mad when she tried to read the book in middle school (or maybe high school) because it had her name on it.

Does anyone have copies of lolita info cards to give to normies? I found that egl post from a decade ago but 1. the link wouldn't work, and 2. I didn't like what how they worded things. I'm bad at making things on Word that aren't papers.

>>8968806
I'm doubling that

>>8954606
Actually I'm from France. No matter how nice they ask, they are still taking up my time and keeping me from whatever I was doing.

Bump to save a thread.