Reminder that there is literally no reasonable justification

>>734431015
i realy started feeling sad about pigs when i heard about pigs being happy with stuff like swimming at an island
meaning when they get killed in thousands on daily, those things feel and think just like you do. it´s horrible

>>734431015
everything lives anon even plants

>>734431015
+ superior health benefits

so tired of these

>>734431256
Plants aren't sentient and they don't feel pain
>>734431414
Well then fuck off faggot. You're obviously too dumb to make any actual arguments.

>>734431015
I was vegan for a year, but uni got me so stressed I took the easy way out and ate meat again. Im vego now.

My question though, why do we need to care about ethics, morality, empathy.. that sort of thing.
Morally, yes its "bad" to make sentient beings suffer, but what makes something bad or good? How do you know these things are real concepts that should be upheld? How do you know everything isnt just a random series of events and it doesnt matter what happens or who feels what?

Another thing I wonder about is where the line is drawn. We accidentally step on ants all day but nobody cares. We dont know how sentient and ant is. Why does it matter "how" intelligent something is if it can still suffer?

How is a plant suffering different from an animal? Just because of a brain? Brains developed from simple life. When does it become classed as non-eatable?

Did you know mushrooms are closer to being classed as animals than they are plants?

>>734431015
Do you think you'd consider eating meat if lab grown meat became an established, sustainable and affordable thing?

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>>734431015
>literally

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>>734431015
Reminder that there is literally no reasonable justification for being a great gaping pussy. Asserting your position at the top of the food chain is the only ethically acceptable lifestyle.

>being ethical
life's too short to be a kind, caring, good person.

That's why I'm a carnivorous, bullying, chain smoking, lager swilling gambler and I couldn't be happier

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Ahh yes, the clucks have arrived.

>>734432431
legitimate question here, any takers?

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Field mice and ground nesting birds die in droves as combines harvest your salad, faggot. You are not innocent.

>>734431015
agreed , oats frozen berries into ppnj cashew milk

>>734432675
you´re not happy at all which is why you´re explaining in detail how ruined your life is
you chose slow death

>>734432431
No

>>734431015
I ate a whopper today, you mad cuckboy?

>>734432846
it would be ok to so but i dont think its going to be cost effective

>>734432984
forgot to say or healthy

>>734432855
>some animals die by accident, so that makes it fine to slaughter 60 billion animals a year

Human teeth are made for meat and vegitation. Meaning our bodies were designed to do so. A living thing is born and adapted to sustain itself on what it's body needs. Thusly eating meat is part of being human.

>>734432950
Why would I be mad that you're a fat fuck and ruining your own health? You should be mad at yourself for making such poor life decisions.

>>734432877
nigger please

if I were unhappy with my life at any point, I'd have launched myself through a car windscreen off a multi story carpark

>>734433105
then explain we are the only "omnivores" that can develop heart disease from eating meat?

>>734433185
Oh, so you're just a weak little bitch that can't handle going through a tough situation?

>>734432934
Why not? Health reasons?

>>734432984
I feel. Just hypothetically speaking, if it was cost effective, could you see yourself eating small amounts of (lab grown) meat? I'm just curious of your veganism stems from health reasons and/or ethical reasons. Both are valid, imo

>>734433185
you´re just getting high at expense of the body and thats it
would your father be proud?

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Guess that this is...

>>734433384
the only tough situation I've dealt with recently was a pub steak that was overdone.

>>734433484
>being interested in anyone else's opinion of yourself.

>>734433403
>Why not? Health reasons?
I can't eat meat, it makes me vomit.

>>734433261
not your guy you're responding to, but I would think it is the excess of meat that lends itself to health issues. We eat meat in such excess in the modern age, don't you think that's really what it boils down to, rather than meat just being bad. "Too much of a good thing" and all

>>734433611
Well I'd say that's a pretty good reason

>>734431015
>no justifiable reason
I enjoy eating meat. That's enough justification for me.
Blow me.

>>734431015
Compretely aglee

>>734433611
vodka used to make me vomit, but I didn't stop drinking it and I can down a fifth in a night if I wanted to

stop being a little bitch.

>>734433737
/thread

I'm fine with it. My point is, faggot that you aren't actually a vegan since you contribute directly to animal death. Violent animal death.

Reminder that being unable to suppress your own emotions makes you less human, as we are the only species that can voluntarily do so.

vegans should be farmed for manure with the amount of shit that comes out their mouth

>>734433918
how much is a fifth

>>734434147
700-750ml bottle

exact definition depends where you are. Where I am, it's 700

>>734433742
get the fuck back to n. korea bitch

>>734433918
I have no desire to eat meat though

It's hard to feel bad for eating animals when you were raised on a farm where your grandparents used to slaughter cows and chickens regularly.
When I was little I would ask my grandma if I can have chicken for dinner and she would be like "well then go catch one and bring it to me". She would proceed to cut its head off with a kitchen knife and I used to play with the head while she prepared the chicken.
Eating animals and animal products is totally normal to me and I can't seem to get myself to care enough that it hurts them.
Like Louis CK said, I know that it's wrong but I don't care that it's wrong.

>>734434338
your loss then, I suppose

Why resign yourself to a life of bland plants and complaining about other people?

abstaining from meat is just totally incomprehensible

literally why would you never want to go near something as fantastic as a juicy, rare steak or fall off the bone, sticky pork ribs?

>>734433261

Because we use the incredibly calorie-efficient, metabolic process called "cooking shit."

Come on mate, if vegetarians were really more healthy then Olympic athletes wouldn't eat meat, strongmen wouldn't eat meat (and fuckloads of steroids), marathoners (some are vegan but most I know, including me aren't) wouldn't eat meat.

If you're super healthy plan was actually super healthy it would be used to get an edge at the highest level of competition. Yes, most anons shouldn't eat the whole chicken, but a shitty vegetarian would be tired from anaemia, lack vital nutrients, and have crazy blood sugar.

So to 4chan this up, vegfag BTFO.

>>734431015
Your ethics are your own construct. What, do you really think anyone is going to remember you being vegan after you die? They might remember the pretentiousness, but you certainly aren't going to go down as some kind of hero to cows.

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>>734431015
>no reasonable justification
Got your justification right here pal

This is most likely b8, but just in case it isn't.
Ethics are a bs thing made by the human mind for justifying the fact that they are massive pussies, besides, veganism isn't natural for a predator type species.

>>734433057
you actually think those animals would be good for anything else?

kek

>>734431015
>Animals eating other animals in wild is okay
>Choosing not to eat animals because you're human
>Implying you're above your animal nature because you have consciousness
Why don't you rise completely above the nature and commit a pointless suicide?

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>no reasonable justification

Yeas there is, cows are fucking delicious. Or do you mean by YOUR standards there isn't? That's easy, I don't give a fuck what you or anyone else thinks.

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>>734431617
pretty funny op, im actually already vegan.
im just tired of these fucking threads on 4chan.

If humans never learned to cook and eat meat we'd all still be cavemen. Cooking food and eating meat have the body the opportunity to revolve beyond needing a complex energy draining digestive system and focus more on brain growth.

>>734436415
And this is relevant today because...?

I bet being vegan just makes your man bun silky smooth and shiny.

>>734436490
Not talking about today, just saying if we didn't cook and eat meat we'd still be apes essentially.

>>734436692
but negroes eat meat and they're still apes?

>>734436765
Spam isn't meat.

>>734431015
meat tastes good bro

>>734436545

It does make you a giant faggot

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>>734431015

I love living in North America, I can get fresh bison anytime I want. Bison is the best meat out there by far, the idiots that settled murica would only take the pelts and leave meat behind to rot...fucking retards.

>>734437456
ever thought about transport issues related to collecting all the meat for commercial purpose?

I'd eat a vegan before I gave up red meat

>>734431015

Remember: vegetables are what food eats.

>>734437793
>hot dog meat.webm

>>734437580
Ever thought about only kill what you need and listen to the natives that have been eating it for 1000's of years before the whiteman showed up?

You sound like a Jew, how can I make shekels...

>>734431617
Seafood don't feel pain either

>>734431015
Meat is what made us advance into modern humans and grow big powerful brains! And evolve into what we are today.
You want to become a cow? Sheep? Goat? You want to become cattle and deevolve and let someone or something else become number 1?
Fine, then youmshould be okay with getting slaughtered and eaten like a cow too, we will have vegan farms where we fatten you up and shove a carrot or apple i youre ass and butcher, coom and eat you.

>>734433057
You sound like the Jews.

>100 gorillion Jews died every day in Auschwitz.

>>734433057
For food!?
YES! ABSOLUTELY!

>>734438036
>natives
>worth listening to about literally anything

>>734438267
But the way vegans talk and think one of those "slaughtered" animals might have come up with the cure for cancer, or figured out string theory.

They never stop to think that if we didn't kill animals that they'd be insanely overpopulated and starve to death, much more humane way to go.

>>734435118
Fuck I'm hungry now

>>734438460
We'll they seemed to survive in some of the harshest climate around for centuries before whitey showed up. Guess they're just super lucky.

>>734438511
Exactly, entire species would go extinct because they are human created by selective breeding and dont have a place in nature to excist, the planet would be full of starving and dead rotting animals and the whole planet would stink!

>>734431015
Read about b12 vitamin op

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>>734431015

>>734431015
They taste good. That is all that matters.

>>734438587
then just folded like a stack of cards when other people showed up.

funny that.

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Kill yourself.

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>>734431015
While I agree with you, keep in mind that there is no such thing as 'ethical consumption' under capitalism. Rather, you have varying degrees of reprehensible and/or morally ambiguous consumption and behavior.

I feel sorry for OP. Obviously never had chicken. The more vegans the better imo I love a cheap meal.

>>734438640
Not to mention all of the farmers that make their living growing food for and raising these animals. Guess vegans don't care about them or the economy, we'll all survive off of free love and good karma from not killing animals.

>>734438511
This has to be too dumb not to be bait but fuck it..there's only an excess of these species because humans over breed them in order to keep up with the demand for genocide

>>734438722
Ravaged by diseases they'd never been exposed to and shot with guns that they'd also never been exposed to...yup just folded alright.

If animals dont want to be eaten then why are they made out of food?

>>734438897
What if they spent their time and resources growing food for the millions of starving people in the world instead inefficiently feeding animals with it..

>>734431015
You're right, but I don't give a shit. Not my problem.

>>734438109

>a carrot or apple i youre ass and butcher, coom and eat you.

you have a stroke at the end there, buddy? If you ate less meat your arteries wouldn't be so clogged with shit

>>734439047

World going vegan wouldn't make people less cunty.

We'd just also be faggots.

>literally no reasonable justification
The ideal diet contains a very small amount of meat.

Meat is also a cheaper, easier way to get all of the nutrients you need.

>>734439047
killing off millions of starving people would be a great way to depopulate our overcrowded planet.

why would you want even more people here? I'd eradicate 4 billion people tomorrow if I could.

>>734439121
that exactly addresses the point I was making. nice debate skills anon

>>734438958
You should learn to think before you speak, bison,moose,deer,elk,goose,duck,turkey,rabbit,caribou are all wild animals and not bred by humans...

But carry on being a pretentious douchebag, most hipster vegans are.

>>734439185
I agree to an extent, but how would you feel if you were starving and poor in a 3rd world country?

>>734432431
yeah I think I would.

>>734431015
~60% of farmed plants by mass is inedible to humans but edible to food livestock
eating animals reduces land area needed to sustain a human population significantly

there are ~1 billion cattle born every year
almost all of these would not be born if cattle were not used for food
as it is better to be alive under any circumstance than to never have been born, it is better to eat cattle than to not

>>734431015
Every time I see a vegan shitpost here, I eat a steak or some barbecue or something. Congratulations faggot, you're having the opposite of your intended effect.

>>734439047
>inefficiently

Don't think you know what that word means and the animals they're feeding feed hundreds of millions of people everyday.

>>734439328
Yeh because bison, moose and elk are really common farmed meats. Obviously not what I was referring to you fuck knuckle stop clutching at straws

But i like eating meat?

>>734439235

Just cos we were now vegan faggots doesn't mean we'd suddenly share all of our food with starving people.

Farmers would still farm, starving people would still starve. Nothing would change, except the guys all die off cos we don't need them anymore.

>>734439336
dunno lad, never been poor, starving or in a third world country.

>>734439510

cows not guys.

How the fuck I fucked that up, I don't know.

>>734431015
i enjoy making animals suffer and meat tastes good. im fine with being an awful human being.

>>734439454
I don't think you realise that a much higher number of people could be fed from the same amount of farmed land if the crops were directly feeding people, not animals. look it up

>>734431617
>Plants aren't sentient and they don't feel pain
they are self aware enough to recognize if they are damaged
trees produce resin when they get damaged
grass when cut down produces chemicals to signal their damage
There are plants that litterally bleed and produce a sound like screaming when harmed
also, there are plants that eat meat (e.g. pitcher plants)

at what sentient level do you consider something "sentient enough to not eat"? There are bugs & worms, even fish, which are less sentient than plants. Can you eat them?

taking damage e.g. being cut, prodoces a chemical reaction in every organism and is, in a way, enough to define something as sentient (aware of itself and its situation). Is that enough to not eat it?

Also, there are species who only exist because we breed them to eat. If we would stop breeding them, they would go exstinct. Is genocide of multiple species acceptable in veganism?

Veganism is a healthy lifestyle but in no way morally better than eating meat because of its flawed viewpoints of "living beings"

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If there was a measurement for how far in denial certain groups are, vegans would be in the top five.

>>734439474
>fuck knuckle

Always so easily triggered son? Don't get mad at me because I proved you wrong. It's ok..everyone is wrong sometimes.

>>734439336
the one time I visited an undeveloped country I wanted to kill myself
and I could leave any time I wanted wasn't even hungry

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>>734431015
True, my family cooks a lot of their food containing meat and I hate it, I absolutely love vegan/vegetarian meals.
I feel so bad physically and mentally after eating meat.

>>734439510
I imagine in the impossible hypothetical situation of the world becoming vegan, people would have a lot more empathy and the distribution of resources would also be radically different

>>734439703

Tell them that you're a faggot then, and make them stop.

Bring your own food, or starve when there.

>>734433261
Our stomachs produce hydrochloric acid, something not found in herbivores as its only use is to help break down meat.

>>734439817
I'm YOUR white sissi faggot.

>>734439703
>this whole god damn post
fuckin hell son, how did you let yourself become such a massive pussy

>>734439673
I'm perfectly calm, I just wanted to let you know how much of a retarded argument that was/retard you are

Shut up meg!

>>734439578
>look it up...

I don't think you realize that not every last inch of field is used exclusively for animal feed crop, it's actually a very small % of farm field. But go ahead and pretend like you know what you're talking about.

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If you want to be a vegetarian or a vegan because you just want to be a vegetarian or a vegan or because you just like the food then I can respect that, but if you're a vegetarian or a vegan because "animals feel pain and their lives are just as important as ours," fuck off.

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>>734439916
Because I'm a white sissy trap faggot.

>>734431015
I agree, but I don't really care though.
I look forward to a world with synthetic flesh you can grow like a plant, but until then imma choke on dat bacon.

BTW what do vegans propose should be done to species that have become dependent on humans and domestication by centuries of selective breeding?
I think Singer proposes something like letting them go extinct, which seemed pretty brutal to me. Or at least hearing it from him.

>>734439945
Here I'll prove you wrong again, there are bison farms in Canada.

So you see anon, you don't know wtf you're talking about and you def are mad, I can tell by the edgy insults.

>>734439703
people aren't obligated to accomodate your voluntary dietary restrictions. not even your parents. make/bring your own food but don't be an arrogant little snot about it. you can do your own thing without having to lord over everyone else for it.

>>734439810


Nah, Empathy isn't what drives most people to be vegan, it's still a self-gain thing. "I feel good" or "I'm allergic" or "I'm a giant pussy moralfag" Whichever, even if the world changed, it'd be a practicality thing, not a moral/empathy thing.

>>734431015
I dated a Vegan and lived with her for a while. She turned out to be nuts so in the end I'd buy bacon, pork chops, ground beef, etc. and fry it up in her "seasoned meat free pans". She went apeshit, it was hysterical

>>734439974
your father should have given you a bloody good hiding.

mine did when I was too scared to shoot rabbits and roos on our farm.

>>734440078
True, thanks for the advice, anon, I'll put this in practice.

>>734439952
I wasn't saying it is, I was saying that land used for crops to feed people is more efficient then using the same crops to feed animals, and subsequently humans. Just keep avoiding my point and resorting to ad hominem, it's obvious you have nothing worthwhile to contribute

>>734440111
"she turned out to be nuts."

Looks like it was the opposite.

Amen OP

>Plants feel pain as well.

>>734440118
>your father should have given you a bloody good hiding.
Did he hide you in a closet, where you obviously still are?

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>>734431015
Animals eat each other but we can't eat them because morality?
>doesn't even pass basic logic
>will continue to eat meat

>>734440069
you're a pedantic waste of oxygen

>>734440156
you don't see a problem with feeding fucktons of millions of third world cunts?

Vegans are murderers! Plants are living things and vegans kill them for food, sometimes they eat them raw which means they're eating them alive! Plants don't feel pain like animals you say? Prove it.

>>734431015
if no one ate meat thered be a shit tone of cows then our atmosphere would truly be fucked

>>734440089
A massive generalization freshly squeezed out from your ass

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>>734440254
Kek, stay mad anon.

>>734439619
Ultimately, veganism is an aim. As your image demonstrates, it is essentially impossible to live without animal products.

By being vegan I'm not saying "I never cause animal suffering" because obviously I do. I drive a car. I wear leather belts. What I'm doing is trying to reduce animal suffering as much as I personally can at the moment.

I know other vegans who get special belts instead. I know others who go back to being vegetarian when on holiday in countries where it's culturally too difficult to be vegan at the moment.

That's all fine because veganism isn't a hard and fast rule. It is an aim which each vegan sticks to as best we can? I don't see any denial in that really.

>>734440210
wrong hiding, sonny.

>>734440214
that's natural and sustainable. How we grow meat is not at all and is destroying our planet. If you want to hunt an animal that is fine, natural. I'm not against eating meat, i'm against how it's made.

>>734436168
mmmmmmmm

The medical community approves of Veganism. It leads to deficiencies that turn into disease, which means more revenue for doctors and hospitals. By all means, go vegan. It's not like we need your money, but if you're all that stupid and in a hurry to get sick and you are dumb enough to ignore evolution, sure, we'll take your money.

>>734440255
not really, universal food and shelter should be a human right in an age like this

>>734440214
Animals do all sorts of things we consider immoral.

Your implication that we should get moral guidance from whatever animals do is what's logically questionable, not veganism.

>>734440431
seconded

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Meat is TASTY!

>>734440214
Logic is OK, don't be a retard.
Animals have no will to do or don't do something. People do and therefore are faced with ethical choices like that.

Here's a tougher legitimate question though:

How is it acceptable to let animals eat each other if we can't eat them because they can suffer? I mean, you wouldn't sit idly while a woman was getting raped - it is your duty to act and stop ethically unacceptable acts. So why do we let animals eat other animals?

>>734440269
Well plants don't have a nervous system.

>>734440310
Cows are bred into existence in order to be killed. If we were all vegan there wouldn't be more cows, there'd be fewer.

>>734440479
we are born a s omnivors although we consume more meat than we should as a species it is natural to eat meat once or twice a week.

>>734440347
I nullified my emotions a long time ago buddy, I insult you from a state of complete detachment

>>734431015
ok i have a question, Vegans won't eat meat so they eat plants but can a vegan eat a venus fly-trap which itself eats meat??? And plants get nutrients from decayed animals. I mean if even plants eat meat why is it wrong for us to?

>>734440466
not when those humans shouldn't exist in the first place.

7 billion people on this planet is totally unsustainable, and it doesn't help that those impoverished, starving third worlders breed like rabbits to keep the cycle going.

>>734440541
But are Vegans bred into existence to also be killed? I mean, what is the point of them?

>>734440515
I can't eat those, they make me jumpy.

>>734431015
What you just said was the definition of retarded

>>734440541
ok but you carnt garentee that they would suvive or that it wouldnt mess you the food chain if we l;eft cows as they are now they would still breed and it would lead to there been more cows we would activly have to kill some to reduce the inital numbers

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>>734440684
To bang your mom.

Your vehgies are fed with animal priducts, you're loterally eating second-hand animals.

Now what you green munching faggot?

>>734440434
"ignore evolution" is just the naturalistic fallacy.

With regards health, the best paper I've seen on this is at
http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/89/5/1627S.full
Vegans tend to be healthier in many important ways, such as with diabetes, heart disease, and obesity. We tend to be worse in one important way which is bone density, but the deficiencies which cause this can be easily made up for with a supplement.

>>734440570
I don't really think trying to be "natural" makes much sense or is achievable? Right now I'm wearing clothes that were somehow made from cotton and plastic by a machine. My dinner included frozen mince from a packet, and if I ate meat it would have been frozen beef mince from a packet. There's nothing "natural" about any of this.

If you want to talk about health, see above, but what we consider "natural" really has no bearing on health.

>>734440684
well when the nukes finally fly and civilisation is eradicated, we'll probably need some fodder to attract the big game animals out.

>>734431015
We quit eating chickens goats sheep cows fish deer boars, do you realize how many of those fuckers are just going to disappear? If we aren't eating chicken and eggs or cow's milk cheese there is literally no reason for them to exist. Typical libtard thinking. Think, stupid. We started producing more bison so we can eat the fuckers. Otherwise they a zoo exhibit and circus sideshow.

NUTRITION
When you look at lifespans of people around the world, it's pretty consistent that those countries/cultures with the reputation for being vegan, or eating very small quantities of meats (often using them as flavoring agents rather than main courses), live longer. It's also pretty consistent that many of them don't as high of quality control pickiness, so products like rice are more likely to have a higher insect count than say the States or EU. If your talking health, lesson is eat mostly plant based with a very small quantity of meat (like <= 10% the States/EU typical diet). If you are going to eat animal, your best source health wise is insects. Vegan isn't perfect, but it's a lot closer to perfect than the diets of many. And yes, insects and insect byproducts are not vegan, I'm not promoting that. I'm promoting near-veganism (vegetarian doesn't count, it's the wrong type of animal protein). It's a myth that you need animal for protein. Protein is in everything, and a lot of people get far too much of it. But there's other reasons of nutritional balance that make small quantities of animal beneficial. I don't eat insects myself, just aware they are more beneficial than what I do eat. Maybe some day.

ETHICS
If you are vegan for ethics, and don't mind a slight compromise in nutrition, it's fine. Your still way ahead of heavy meat eaters for nutrition. But that's only if not eating animals matches your ethical standards. Ethics and morality are personally and culturally subjective. There's a lot of "if"s and "but"s that can muddle the water here.

PLEASURE
If you eat for pleasure, than nothing else is relative, eat all the animal you want.

FUTURE
We will be going in a more plant and insect based direction at humanities current growth rate anyways. So it will somewhat work itself out anyways.

>>734440801
Sweet fuck I'm typing like shit tonight.

>>734440658
Haha, fair enough. Yeah I would eat a venus fly trap personally? Because in eating the venus fly trap I'm not harming anything, causing any suffering, etc.
Another common one is would a vegan eat roadkill? Personally, no, because that is a disgusting idea, but morally I'd have no problem with that at all.

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>>734440850
Point taken

>>734440676
>believing the overpopulation meme
I bet you think ebola is just natural selection

>>734440916

So if the animal dies in any other way than me or another human killing it on purpose, it's fair game?

>>734440980
overpopulation isn't a meme

just because it hasn't bitten us in the arse yet.

ITT, how many different ways can op be a huge FAGGOT.

>>734440816
i get you there and i agree but we still shouldnt be eating as much as we humans do.

and your clothers are made by creating synthetic polymers and stringing them to gether to make a string that is wothen in to cloths.

>>734440719
Good point. If there was like a switch that was flipped and everyone was vegan and all the cows that are currently there just sort of roamed wildly, that would be pretty dangerous?
Of course, that's not really realistic. I think what's more likely is as more and more people turn vegan, restaurants etc. order less and less meat, and so slaughterhouses gradually scale down their operations.
I can't see any problem for the environment with that as the cows are so detached from everything else, they're not really part of any ecosystem to speak of.

>>734441095

Not just cows though, sheep, duck, geese, chicken, Kangaroos, etc etc.

>>734441095
touche

>>734441044
Yeah, I'd say so. Other vegans might give a different answer but I can't see much problem with that? To be honest, I can't see much problem if you have chickens and they lay an egg and you find the egg and fry that shit up.

The issue is that that's not the history of the eggs/milk/steaks at the supermarket.

Genuinely curious:
Given the results of plant life responding to stimuli, why do vegans consider it ok to eat plants when they also "feel"?

>>734440676
regardless of how sustainable anything is, who are you to say what should and shouldn't exist? it is what it is anon

>>734431015
Fuck off niggerfaggot

>>734441248


So, the issue is less "eating meat is bad" and more "factory farming is inhumane and cruel"

I can agree on that.

>>734431015
You again?
Fucking fedora stinking bait (not meant as an argument, so don't even start it)

>>734441248
I think other vegans might say you're unnecessarily stealing and killing the chickens baby

>>734432855
Animals with much lower significance on a moral level (due to intelligence) than many of the animals being killed for meat.

>>734431015
I had butter on my bread

>>734441527
>vegan is ethical choice cos animals have feels
>grinding retard animals into paste with a combine harvester is a-okay

Pick one.

>>734441288
The majority of such studies aren't actually what's reported. I've seen a load of times when a newspaper has put out a story like "plants have music preferences say scientists" and it turns out the paper actually just used "do plants have music preferences?" in order to demonstrate a flaw or nuance in a statistical model, and they used that question specifically because of course plants don't have fucking music preferences.

That said, you've put "respond to stimuli" which plants do. They deliberately curve towards the sun for instance. This isn't feeling pain or thinking thoughts or anything though, as they don't have a nervous system.

>>734441342
Yeah. That's the ultimate crux. That said, I only think dairy/eggs/honey and such can be done humanely. If you're outright killing an animal for food, I wouldn't personally ever condone that.

you know who wasnt a vegan? Darth Plagueis the Wise;: Darth Plagueis was a Dark Lord of the Sith, so powerful and so wise he could use the Force to influence the midichlorians to create life... He had such a knowledge of the dark side that he could even keep the ones he cared about from dying. The dark side of the Force is a pathway to many abilities some consider to be unnatural. He became so powerful... the only thing he was afraid of was losing his power, which eventually, of course, he did. Unfortunately, he taught his apprentice everything he knew, then his apprentice killed him in his sleep. Ironic, he could save others from death, but not himself.

>>734441482
An egg is intrinsically not-fertilised though?

>>734441745

So, the line is drawn at nervous system? (I don't know any vegans and am honestly, albeit embarrassingly ignorant to the philosophy behind it)

Eating meat or not, they are both acceptable lifestyles, and a personal choice. Just because you choose one over the other, doesn't mean that you have to impose your choice on others.

>>734440371
The trouble is, many vegans I myself meet DO treat it like a hard and fast rule. I almost never meet vegans who at least produce some form of rationality and don't act like a last-gen SJW, but I know they are out there, like yourself. Which is why I said "top five", to be generous.

>>734440578
>being this fucking retarded

>>734441291
"it is what it is" shouldn't be acceptable though.

>>734442073
mehhhh. I'd say the line is drawn at suffering.

This is now going down a path of biology, which I always feel is intended to be more of a trick than a genuine exploration? I haven't studied biology since A-level. If you have and you've looked into it and you reckon it's impossible for octopus to feel pain or something, and you're going to be vegan and not eat pork and not eat steaks and eat our revolting vegan cheese but still eat octopus...
then great? I personally am going to err on the side of stuff I know doesn't cause suffering. I've found it to be doable and healthy, so don't really need to look into said biology in the hopes of finding suffering-loopholes I can sneak meat onto plate through.

>>734442116
I've never seen anyone "impose" anything. People encourage others round to their way of thinking all the time. That's just what humans do.

>>734441872
Even honey results in a lot of fucked up practices, bees having wings removed and such. Dairy involves repeatedly keeping cows pregnant until they die to keep up with demand

>>734441955
Well if there's a rooster involved it would be fertilised, I guess unfertilised isn't really causing harm if they're kept fairly

>>734442352
>being this identified with their thoughts and feelings and jealous of freedom

>>734442459

I've seen vegan faggots demand the death of all meat eaters.

Also PETA exist.

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>>734431015
http://goodnature.nathab.com/research-shows-plants-are-sentient-will-we-act-accordingly/

Suck it OP. You're no more "ethical" then us carnivores. Plants do have their own sentience and feel just like anything else. Just because they don't have a recognizable brain does not mean that they do not feel pain or sense danger or feel fear.

But hay i guess I should expect anything less from a bigoted spiciest like you OP!

>>734442389
well what are you gonna do about it other than bitch

Does anybody on this baord actually think that their is somebody on 4chan who honestly believes this? You guys are the type of people who honestly believe "if you don't reply to this post your mother will die"

>>734442469
Yeah all those problems are with factory production of milk/eggs/honey. That's why I'm vegan.

The line of conversation was around "if" these products came about by other avenues - if you found a dead cow out walking, if you found an egg, if your neighbour keeps chickens and found an egg. etc.

I agree with the current state of milk/egg/honey production, which is why I'm vegan, but in theory I think it is possible to eat eggs and honey in a humane way.

>>734442564
There's a difference between "demanding the death of all meaters" and actually doing that.

I'm not sure any exercise in free speech can be called "imposing."

>>734442560
>grasping at straws
Also, you wouldn't know freedom if it bust right in your face.

>>734442653
I believe it, can post my freezer full of vegan food and timestamp if you really want

>>734437101
nice, are they yours?

>>734437626
actually, why not..? Herbivores always taste better

>>734442767
just for a laugh, what is it about my previous post you find so retarded?

>>734442941
The fact that you keep denying you're mad, when you know the only real winning move is not to play. If you're so high and mighty, if I'm really not worthy of your time, then stop replying. You can easily win this right now if you want.

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>>734440515
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>734431015
vegetarian here

go fuck yourself, faggot

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Depicted:
Sausages, chicken nuggets, cheese, vanilla ice cream, protein powder

:]

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>>734443144
do I really need to explain that it's fun to see reactions like yours? I couldn't care less who "wins", I'm playing for keks

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>>734443144

You play, you lose.

>>734443653
>depicted: barf city
I'm guessing it's something of an acquired taste, since I once actually tried a few vegan products just for shits and giggles. I needed a beer to choke this shit down.

>>734443760
>>734443144
You guys are such fags.

This is the Internet, you both win but are retarded as hell.

>>734443653
>depicted: The worst food I could find

>>734440371
go hug a cow, faggot.

https://legionathletics.com/9-lies-vegans-love-telling/

http://time.com/4252373/meat-eating-veganism-evolution/


>By being vegan I'm not saying "I never cause animal suffering" because obviously I do. I drive a car. I wear leather belts. What I'm doing is trying to reduce animal suffering as much as I personally can at the moment.

>>734443653
that shit makes me hate vegans
I like tofu when it is prepared as tofu
trying to make it into faux-meat ruins both the concept of tofu and meat

>>734443760
>tl;dr still mad

>>734443653
>chicken nuggets without chicken
>fake cheese
>...
LOL why?

Do you also enjoy chocolate laxatives and decaf coffee?

>>734443879
kek it definitely is.

The cheese in particular took me ages to find one that didn't make me wanna throw up.

Much much easier is the milk and the mince? If you've not tried them yet I'd definitely say give soya milk or meat-free mince a shot.

After that the chicken substitutes are probably the next nicest.

>>734443995
>I get others to argue for me because I can't myself

>>734444056
Yeah I get that. To be honest though a load of people miss having something similar, at least that you can think is similar. So if I'm making a curry I don't want to put just vegetables in it? I want to put something else, like chicken pieces.

There's also the thing of loads of vegan food being just salads and shit, and sometimes I just want a burger.

>>734444224
>why
see above really? Lots of vegans miss the taste and versatility of certain foods, or we're used to cooking with them and it's weird to go without, so we get this.

>>734443995
Which was also a strawman on that guy's part. I never said vegans cause or don't cause animal suffering.

>>734431015
Ummm. I'm sorry you have problems with eating good food. Dead pig flesh is amazing.

>>734440466
No

>>734443928
>fag
>retarded

I cannot be insulted, even more so by one with a lexicon like yours

>>734444096
>nothing better to do than trying to get the last word on an internet argument you clearly lost

Spotted the vegan

>>734444632
Nigger.

there is no reasonable way to eat takeout and fastfood only and still be a vegan being a vegan requires knowing how to cook and if i learn how to cook other people will want me to cook for them therfor i can never be a vegan and continue to live in a way that suits me

>>734444781
>implying he won
Keep going, bro. You're in the bonus round now.

>>734444807
oooh that one cut me deep anon, you are a formidable wordsmith

>>734444953
Nothing personal, kid.

>>734431300
Amen

>>734444941
>never been to the bonus round
>never will

>>734431015
If we were supposed to eat animals, why are they made from meat....?

>>734445042
>>734431300
what if i have no reason to care about my health?

>>734445061
>too late

>>734445080

You're made from meat too, can we eat you?

>>734445169
mmmm, gobble me up

>>734432339
Would you like to be eaten?

That's a good way to decide whether you should eat someone else.

>>734444866
so no one wants to even try to refute this? am i right?

>>734432558
Sounds like you'd have no problem with you killing and eating you then.

>>734444866
lol. Being drunk and vegan is similar. All your friends are there getting chicken nuggets from a 24-hour macdonalds and you have to just stand there pretending you want a deli salad at 3am.

>>734445080
If meat makes you smarter, how come meat eaters always tell the same shit jokes that Maddox told in the 90s?

>>734431015

If animals arn't meant to be eaten why are they made out of food?

>>734445274

Easy solution. Tell them "no, cook for yourself, lass ass nigger"

>>734433737
Good job

>>734445251
>Would you like to get a blowjob?
Well, Anon?

>>734445420
even than it still means learning how to cook which would make me useful and i am no ones bitch

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>>734431015

Shut up faggot

>>734445393
>>734445373
>>734445080

:)

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>>734431015

>>734437101
That's a beautiful cape