So now that Trump is president does that mean he's going to get rid of Obama Care?
I really don't want to fucking pay $695 for not having health insurance all of last year. (Basically my company didn't set me up with it since I wasn't working full time right away. A month later when I asked for it they said they can't give it too me.) Thanks Obama...
>>720108187 See >>720108302 The penalties were pretty lame, but needed to make the insurance companies act less like monopolies. By the early indications, we're headed back to health care for the wealthy and the destitute, bankruptcy for everyone else.
>>720108464 That's because Obamacare isn't an insurance, it's a bill that regulates some rules to how insurance works. Like being able to stay on your parents insurance till you're 26 instead of 18. So how many of you are about to lose your insurance cause you're on mommy and daddy's plan?
My insurance is great. No deductible when I use it and I can go anywhere. Thanks Obama. Now that Trump wants it out I'm shut out of luck. I barely use my insurance anyways. Unless you're sick or pregnant there's no big need to go to the doctor's.
I think obamacare made people go at least once a year for preventative care. That way in the future we don't have everyone being old fucks with disease and illness that could have been prevented.
I have Medicare. That covers 80% of normal billing. There are some exemptions that it pays 100% [mostly diabetes], even more through the ACA now - free hearing, eye, and dental checks. I had Medicaid to pick up the remaining 20%. Since my State didn't pick up the expansion [FUCK YOU REPUBS] I now have to go to the exchange and can't afford to use my insurance.
My wife recently retired and the ACA was paying the majority of her insurance premium. With this Repub move she won't be able to afford her care either.
So yeah, I/we have it and yeah I/we can't use it now either.
>>720109649 Yeah, I've had healthcare coverage from every job I've worked except for that one year. Every company would automatically take the minimum insurance rate out of my check each week.
In a way it's like I'm spending a lot less for this $700 tax the if I had insurance through the whole year, but it would be just fucking great that since I'm young and am less likely to get hurt I would get bent over and fucked so viciously.
>>720109795 How is it anyones fault, that you didnt plan on getting older. Fucking liberals. You want some 19 year old kid to pay into something he/she dont need, so they can cover your ass. because you wasted the money you earned in your youth on other shit. Fuck you, its not their fault, get a second job lazy ass mother fucker.
>>720109795 blue cross blue shield, second supplemental insurance
it suck your in that position, but i wouldn't lose hope. seniors win elections and have more power in this country than they think
my mother is retired and in NY she can be on like 99% coverage free medicaid and scripts only cost a few bucks. she retired early and when she turns 67 she has to go on blue cross blue shield which she will then pay for.
shes not even worried about her coverage, then again my father died before retirement age so she gets to collect on his social security, meanwhile her pension and 401k are still collecting until she is 67.
>>720110313 not a lazy piece of shit and i'm not the person you replied too,
anyone over 45 started working on the promise that social security would cover all their needs, but when they had a surplus of social security coming in from the baby boomers politicians spent the surplus on other shit when it was technically dedicated to pay for retirement. he paid into the system, social security is not welfare
>>720110688 not to gloat, but she would still be alright. my sister and i do pretty well and would take care of her if needed. she could sell a house and still be okay for a few years unless she lost all insurance and got cancer or something. she still has a pension and 401k to draw from too.
>>720110901 >she could sell a house You gotta watch that shit anon. There's a "Claw back" clause in Medicare/Medicaid that WILL take the "profits" from that. Normally she has 5 previous years to file that before she takes Medicare/Medicaid.
Is that really what she worked most of her life, to lose for needing healthcare?
>>720111173 not if she already signed it over to my sister and myself before she retired HAHAHAHA
we aren't dicks, we know its still hers but its technically ours
untill she reaches full retirement she can only make like $10,000 a year doing whatever, if she makes more than that they take like $5 off her social security for every $1000 over she makes, and that $5 is gone every month forever even if she makes nothing extra the next year.
>be me self employed in 2012 >paying ~$230/month for high deductible health insurance for me,my wife, and daughter >obamacare is gonna save us all >premiums go up to ~$600/month >make too much for any of the discounts and we are white >pay through first year >second year of obamacare premiums go up over $1000/month >nope So we have been insuranceless for 2 years now. Had to take daughter to doctor a couple times for ~$200-300 bills each.
>>720108557 At minimum you had disaster insurance. Yup it had a high deductible but it was capped for every year you were ill. Let's say you have this minimum ins. and you get cancer. That shit cost lots of money to be treated for a few years. Hospital stays, icu, chemo, follow ups..ect...$100's of thousands of dollars they charge for that. Now with obamacare minimum disaster insurance, it'll only cost you $3,000 a year each year deductible. No more. Now with out it, you're going to pay that $100's of thousands of dollars and go bankrupt, loose all your saving, go into life long debt or just die. Which is better?
>>720108944 That's less than what I'm paying. You get a once a year check up for free. Have you even read the policy? If you didn't have it and got cancer, you're fucked. You paying all that money out of pocket for treatment. It's just like car insurance. Think about it.
>>720112242 the thing is most investment companies thought mortgages were a low risk commodity and had no idea of the underhanded dealings being traded around, 80% mortgages who had a good chance to pay back, and 20% high risk hidden in the rest. well some of those 20% faulted it just cascaded and what was once was worth money became worthless and no one wanted to trade mortgages around anymore.
you can site whatever you want as to the cause of 2008, but once something that was supposed to hold its value degraded overnight, it fucked people over. that mortgage shit was hidden, if it was known it wouldn't have been a low risk low gain investment.
>>720109585 Small businesses with less than 50 employees don't have to provide it. That's a lot of people including me. This is why it needs to be universal. Everyone pay equal amounts and everyone get the same care. It's not a hard concept really.
>>720108333 LOL $700 a YEAR and you guys make such a drama? Are you crazy? We have mandatory health care in Switzerland and I pay $400 A MONTH. And guess what I'm never ill. You get it basically for free and cry like little babies wtf
>>720108187 I can't wait for it to be gone. If I want health insurance, I'll get it. I almost never get sick or injured. The last time I want to a hospital was over three years ago. Yet, because I didn't have insurance all last year, they're trying to take $700 from my tax return? No thanks.
>>720111274 >mfw I pay all of this and my obamacare is the cheapest out of all Don't forget my fha mortgage insurance that trump so nicely made cost more just now. Glad I bought my house a few years ago
>>720113755 the only people that get into real estate for profit are the worst scammers in the entire US, their entire goal is to rob someone by upselling or over-charging for rent, nobody should have any sympathy for anyone that lost money in that market
>>720113480 Americans been taught that socialism is a dirty word and capitolism is a good word. They have no understanding how either works. They just believe what their parents, teachers and 6 o'clock news tell them. Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite.
>>720113480 because it is never done right, if it was a flat 10% tax, for 100% coverage, for everyone, by everyone, it'd be golden, instead its "hey your white you should pay half your paycheck so niggers can have health care while you starve"
I find it hilarious that most people don't know why prices skyrocketed. The clause "can not be denied for preexisting conditions". Before, it was really only healthy people, now, with so many ill people, insurances have to jack prices to compensate. But guess what, TRUMP SAID HE LIKED THAT CLAUSE AND WOULD KEEP IT. So prices will still be high if Trump dumps the ACA and introduces his own system.
>>720114619 This is the problem. No one really understands until they get cancer or some shit like that and can't afford $100,000 in medical bills for a few years. It's just like car insurance, you don't plan on getting into an accident but one day you will and if you don't have insurance you are going to be buying someone a new car with money you don't have
>>720114821 Nope mine is $3000. I pay $102 a month. I'm sure the rate changes as income changes though. So let's say $7k deductible every year to fight cancer that cost over $100k a year. That's a big help if you get cancer and we know how no one in America gets cancer or heart disease or diabities
>>720114864 stupid nigger, were talking about coverage, not insurance, a person is not a car, a person is a worthless bundle of flesh, when a person dies a worth is not lost, insurance is more about paying for objects that can't be afforded. health care could easily be affordable with no discrepancy if every other medical facility wasn't a privately owned jewery looking to upcharge for everything from a 1$ piece of gauze to a 1$ IV bag
>>720114864 The point is insurance is a scam when it works that way. Everyone pays, rich and poor equal amount equal service. No one should pay for Jamal cause his mom is on welfare and she's too lazy to work and he just sits home and sells drugs.
>>720115238 yeah, and OP who got his penis straightened in a thread from a few hours ago coudn't get that surgery in the US because it wasn't life threatening, he'd have to go to tijuana or somewhere else
any chance of a true universal healthcare system like Canadians, UK, etc?
any chance healthcare is divorced from employment?
has trump talked about any specific plan yet?
btw I'm all for repealing Obamacare if something better is put in place. can't we just dedicate like 10% of our military/defense budget for free universal healthcare? I have a feeling we are just going to end up with another shitty system.
>>720115994 If it's optional, then people only buy it when they need it. Anyone who is currently unwell or is at risk of being expensive pays out the ass.
When everyone buys it the burden is more equal. Healthy people being part of the pool is the entire premise of obamacare. Or romneycare, as it began.
The problem is that healthy people still opted out and only paid a nominal fine.
What actually works is just making it a progressive tax paying for universal Medicare, and letting the government be the only buyer to keep price fixing down. The health insurance industry serves no purpose and needs to be done away with. The advantages for the economy would be enormous.
>>720116162 It's really not that much money compared to the military budget. It's cheaper to do good than to do evil. It really is. But American is a capitalist society so everything is about making money so.....business as usual
I really wonder what % it would take. but no president, certainly not trump, would ever publicly call for something like this. it would be perceived as endangering the US. kind of how any judge or other elected official doesn't want to fix the prison system because they don't want to be perceived as "soft on crime" or whatever.
>>720116200 So if I'm walking to work and someone hits me with their car and has no insurance? That public trans vehicle needs to be insured. My landlord has to insure the building and have liability. Let's keep going in circles? Somethings in a first world society can be avoided
How do those $3500 deductibles taste? I sure love mine!
Oh, wait. You're just a dumb kid who doesn't pay for such things and thinks he's superior to everyone who does, but is actually too stupid to realize that his age group is being forced to subsidize the care of the older, sicker, and WEALTHIER.
>>720116767 Right now our poor immigrants all go to the emergency room, which is the most expensive thing we can do with them. Shit coverage is worse for the economy, and doesn't relate to immigration at all.
>>720116561 I never said free. You did. That's why you have that mindset. I've been saying several times. Everyone rich or poor pays equal amount for equal coverage. Nothing is free. Have you not been following?
>>720116803 The cost of a funeral and burial can easily run into the tens of thousands of dollars, and I don’t want my wife, parents, or children to suffer financially in addition to emotionally at my death.
>>720108187 He is going to keep some parts and repeal others. The intent is to make the market more competitive, so it drives down the prices and insurance companies have to compete to get customers, which is how the free market is supposed to work, you make or break your business on how you treat your customers.
>>720117166 Estate taxes can be steep, so having insurance in place to pay them is essential to avoid jeopardizing assets or funds built for retirement. Use of insurance for this purpose is most common in large estates, and uses permanent (rather than term) insurance to ensure that coverage remains until the end of life.
>>720116738 you can choose not to have a car, you can choose to save your money and buy a house with cash and thus not be required to have homeowners insurance due to a mortgage stipulation, but not having it would just be fucking stupid.
your alive, you had no choice but to be alive, you can only choose to end your life, just because your happy with your life and want to live in the best country on earth you have to have health insurance.
car and homeowners insurance are choices, no one is forcing you to own a house or a car, but if you do your required to have homeowners insurance as long as you have a mortgage and car insurance as long as you want to drive a car.
(all these threads in different tabs this shit is getting hard to keep track of what side i'm on)
>>720117034 So what you just said is he wants to privatise universal healthcare. Instead of having a system that everyone pays the same regardless of income so you can use it for free when you need. Hurr fucking durr.
>>720117482 Yes, people with lower income will have to buy cheaper insurance, this is generally how wealth works. Seeing as how the majority of people are not loaded with cash, there will be a competitive market for lower tier insurance. I don't see what you're having a problem with here.
>>720108187 Hey FUCK YOU Idiots who don't have insurance and have jobs are cover d by guess who when your money ass goes to ththe hospital? THE TAX PAYER
You have no insurance and a autist walking about and get hit by a car. You get token to the hospital and then treated and given a bill you can't pay - so guess what you have to do? File for personal bankruptcy which means my tax dollar will bay your bill instead of the company you work for.
Great con, really is - corporate welfare through bankruptcy.
At least with all the deregulation I'll make out like a fat rat so enjoy your personal Bankruptcy and\or the financial destruction of your family so my pay check can be bigger.
if someone somehow got their hands on trumps presidential cell phone number and gave it to snowflakes
i don't even know how it works, whether it all goes through a switchboard at the whitehouse like in the movies or if its something completely different.
i'm probably going to end up on a list just for saying i think it would be fucking funny, but it would be funny if mexico's el presidente decided to say " el fucko trump en his wallo" and just give out his means of contact to the internet.
>>720117482 That's entirely possible though. If you stipulate that there is a minimum level of insurance that companies must provide for a set price, and that hospitals must provide care for people below poverty level, it then creates a competitive market for everything else, while insuring that basic coverage is always provided. It's not a great idea, but it is a workable one.
>>720118359 No replacement is the worst case scenario. More likely cases are also shitty, but I don't think they've been number crunched if they've been spelled out at all. Some voucher bullshit, last I heard.
>>720108187 Good luck geting an insurance with pre-existing conditions a few years from now... The individual mandate was there so you, a healthy young adult would get in the risk group. Without low risk people in it the insurance company will get bankrupt if it accepts people with pre-existing conditions.
>>720118505 How is this a problem? Should we offer premium liquor and steak for extremely low price because "muh Marxism"? Should we price sports cars the same as used cars so everyone can feel special, warm, and included? Also you fail to realize that if the cheapest and minimal become the norm, it becomes the largest market, which makes companies compete to provide the most for the lowest cost, how is this not a win for the customers?
>>720118196 You can still get insurance if you have preexisting conditions. You'll just have to get special insurance that covers them. Trump hasn't said anything about making it more difficult to get insurance if you have these conditions either.
Are we ignoring that he's already got a new system going and people will actually now have health care with reasonable rates and he is keeping key concepts such as "you can't be denied for previous health issues"??
>>720112242 Yeah. The banks didn't lose shit. They got bailed out. Where's their responsibility? Or don't you have talking points for that? And you should be old enough to remember S&Ls and how everybody got fucked except for the Keating Five. Go look that up.
>>720119174 I don't think it's disingenuous at all, perhaps my analogy doesn't correlate the product or service precisely, but I think the logic there still holds true. You get what you can afford, people who can afford more get a better service/product. You're assuming that the lower tier means automatic bankruptcy.
>>720119686 >people who can afford more get a better service/product I find this, in regards to healthcare, to be absolutely appalling. Quality of care should not be cost dependent. Coverage maybe, in that only serious debilitating or life threatening conditions should be always covered whereas everything else is optional, but the idea that the treatment you would get would also differ is just awful.
>>720117360 Sorry fucktard, but HOAs and condo associations require homeowners insurance even if you have an unencumbered deed. And in California and Florida (that I know of for a fact, there may be more) you are required to carry earthquake and flood insurance, respectively. Just keep proving that idiocy.
>>720120111 I feel like your argument falls apart when you factor in supply and demand, we don't have the capabilities to provide premium quality service for everyone, it's a sad but harsh reality. The "everyone or no one" mentality also seems a bit childish and naive to me too. Although I do agree that serious debilitating or life threatening conditions should be a minimal requirement that is covered, at least to a good enough degree not to ruin someone.
>>720120461 It might, but then I'm only arguing for same level treatment of said serious conditions. Not necessarily after-care. Basically I'm saying you shouldn't have to worry that because you don't have good enough coverage when you go in for say serious surgery, that they will cut corners. Bearing in mind that I live in lovely socialist Canada, and I in general find the idea of not universal health care rather barbaric. But I get it, americans hate socialism in general, and our system is actually a pretty good cautionary tale of the many ways it can be bad. It also does really suck paying for people that don't actually contribute.
>>720120663 >soon he'll get rid of HOA's too No he won't, and he shouldn't. HOAs no matter how terrible are voluntary associations, and something you choose to sign onto when you buy a home. Even if all the HOAs were banned and dismantled overnight, they would end up being remade in some form or another as people like to protect their property values, and will always find a way of banding together to do so.
>>720120848 I think the middle ground here would be a tax payer or certified disability qualification for a nationwide coverage of emergency and serious condition coverage to a high percentage. I think what constitutes certified disability qualification would need some stipulation of course, to prevent abuse of the system.
>>720121172 Yeah I'm in agreement with that. I also think there should be some sort of minimum coverage available at a set price. Maybe a government run or provided nationally available coverage plan, that covers emergency surgery. You would still have to buy it if you don't fall under disability, but then no one would be without an affordable option, and people who don't get it, well that's their choice.
>>720108187 When it's replaced with nothing, if you're rich enough you'll still be able to get health care. If you're not rich, well, America's for rich people now, so dying is probably not the worst thing that could happen to you.
>>720121854 Well with luck you might. Since all parts of your legislative government is controlled by the same party, it's much more likely that they will be able to pass something like that without the other party forcing "compromises" to purposely make it less effective and therefore make the party and president that made it seem bad. Like what happened with Obamacare.
>>720122118 I really do have hope that Trump will do something great like that with the position he has been given, this is a once in a life time chance to make a real change and possibly for the better, here's hoping he doesn't fuck it up!
>>720122350 >here's hoping he doesn't fuck it up! Same, though mostly in hopes of lulz at butthurt democrats and libtards. His doing well would help to stem the tide of them, not only there but here as well since we are so influenced by your politics and media.
>>720122350 same. so far it's all television, but no one's changing the channel. of all the dumb shit he says stays the exact opposite of what all his actions, we're all gonna be just fine and maybe actually better in 3 or so years.
If not, i'ma go take take a dump in the refecting pool and proclaim Alex Jones said it would make me immortal, ya know? just hang up all fucks left to give..
He's gone back on most of his promises before even entering the Whitehouse publicly letting everyone know he is not going to follow through. No Muslim ban No Hillary in jail No replacement for obamacare in sight, just repeal and take his word for it like always No wall at Mexico's expense. Tarrifs aren't pesos and will most likely end in an embargo No enhanced interigation
His cabinet is all billionaires and terrible choices like Betsy devol and Tom pointer or whatever his name is which probably won't make it into the cabinet. Another first in American history.
Anyone look at his approval ratings? He can't break 36% approvals which is different than pills because that is likelihood to vote, not opinion on the president. Another worst in history
>>720122844 >if hilary actually won the popular vote She didn't though. She only got the majority of the popular vote. Since the popular vote is divided geographically, winning requires getting a majority vote in the majority of districts, which she did not.
>>720125329 They are, but the only way to really change that would be to change the system specifically designed to make the government relatively ineffectual to prevent it having too much power. It's an intentional trade-off, although in their current state it mostly just exists that way so americans can believe they are free and don't have an all powerful government.
>>720113585 Yeah but it shouldn't be the law. I'm not against having health care, everyone should have it but it should be a choice, not law. The government shouldn't make it a law to purchase a product from a civilian organization. It's unconstitutional, plain and simple.
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