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Makeup

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Had sort of an argument the other day with my gf about wearing makeup/beauty treatments. I tried explaining to her my feelings on it - that it's pointless, especially when you're already good looking, and that I find the idea of wearing makeup itself to be unattractive. Of course she disagrees, and says I'm entitled to that opinion, but it's just been bothering me in the back of my mind.

How am I supposed to convince someone that plucking their eyebrows isn't a good idea? Or that spending half an hour to apply chemicals to your face doesn't make you any more attractive to me, at all? I feel like 9/10 women are brainwashed to some degree when it comes to makeup and it just ends up as a bullshit roundabout discussion.

>Women don't wear makeup for men you pig!
>Women wear makeup to look good!
>....for men!
>....and to compete with other women!
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>>17167166
I like taking care of myself, which includes also using make up and beauty treatments.
It is relaxing, it is time I take for myself.
Once or twice a week, I love spending ha hours putting products on my face to make my skin smooth, my eyebrows look nice, or whatever.
If your girlfriend likes taking care of herself, you shouldn't mind it.
You can ask her to use less make up, but honestly it's her business. You shouldn't ask her to not do what she likes to do because you don't understand/like it.
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>>17167178
Caking makeup on your face is not "taking care of yourself," it's actually really bad for your skin.
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>>17167186
It's nothing to do with you and not your decision. If you can't stand women who put make up on, don't date them. Otherwise, leave them to it. Otherwise, drop your preachy shit about make up.
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>>17167178

Jesus christ. It's not that I don't fucking understand makeup. It's that "taking care of yourself" has nothing to do with covering up what you actually look like. It's insecurity and narcissism having a baby. What blows my mind is when women talk about it being this therapeutic process, while at the same time failing to acknowledge that men don't wear any makeup at all. It doesn't make my life any worse to learn to accept what my fucking face naturally looks like.
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>>17167191

>preachy shit

hahahaha Oh man, the lengths people will go to in order to ignore common sense. Have fun caking chemicals into your skin and then having to cake more chemicals into your skin once those chemicals make your skin look worse. Wow it's like the cosmetics industry figured this out a century ago or something.
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>>17167191
lol never said women can't wear it if they want to. I'm not OP
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>>17167196
I'm male, dipshit. I'm just pointing out you're preaching. You're not supposed to convince anyone. As an example, if you like to wear cargo shorts, that's your decision. You shouldn't have to listen to a nagging preachy bitch gf tell you how they look ugly and you need to stop wearing them because of x and y reason. That's exactly what you are, in male form.
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>>17167200

Except cargo shorts are pretty much universally laughed at, unlike makeup which is pretty much universally accepted by women. And cargo shorts aren't worn to cover up natural features of the face. I guess I'm really arguing against the principle of wearing makeup. It feels very dishonest, and when women start talking about it they just sound completely brainwashed.
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>>17167200
Bad comparison, friendo. Cargo shorts, unlike makeup, don't take hours to to put on, and don't fuck up your skin.
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>>17167186
Depends entirely on which kind of product you use, their quality, the quantity and how often you wear them.
Of course if you use a ton of 5$ foundation to cover your acne, it will worsen you skin problems.
If you use good products properly on a healthy skin, you won't get any skin problem.

>>17167193
I find it relaxing. I like taking 15 minutes in the morning to make my hair, put on some mascara or whatever.
It makes me feel feminine, it makes me feel prettier, I like how it makes my eyes look bigger and my skin look brighter.
I have zero problems with going around without make up, I don't even wear a lot of it or wear it every day, but I feel more comfortable and prettier with it. That's it for most girls.

> It doesn't make my life any worse to learn to accept what my fucking face naturally looks like.
I like how my face looks like without make up, but with a bit of make up my best features look better and my worse features are less evident. So since I can use it, why not?
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>>17167203
>Except cargo shorts are pretty much universally laughed
Which has nothing to do with the point. The point is, it's your damn decision to dress and wear what you want. A gf coming into your life and suddenly telling you not to wear what you want and gets preachy trying to "convince" the person not to do it is beyond retarded. There's no convincing.

>Bad comparison, friendo. Cargo shorts, unlike makeup, don't take hours to to put on, and don't fuck up your skin.
Which, again, has nothing to do with my point so cargo pants is still a valid example. I don't care if you make 10000000 valid reasons as to why putting make up on is bad for you or you shouldn't do it. It's not your decision, that is the point. Wear make up if you wish. Put make up on if you wish. Don't have to listen to someone else bitch about your decisions as to how to dress yourself is the main point here.
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>>17167210

Okay here's what I hear from you:

"It makes me feel feminine"
>Even though I'm already female and have tits and a vagina, I need to spread things on my face people sold to me in order to feel feminine

"It makes me feel prettier"
>I don't think I'm pretty because I pay too much attention to the media. I also place value on "feeling pretty" as if that's not totally narcissistic


In short, get over yourself. The whole "no one is going to love you if you can't love yourself" thing really applies here. And no, thinking you look nice with makeup on doesn't count as "loving yourself".
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>>17167211

>Dude whatever if people want to do stupid shit just let them lol it's not like it affects anyone

This is the most irritating millennial meme attitude
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>>17167214
>>17167213

Okay here's what I hear from you:

"I'm unable to grasp that people are entitled to dress and do as they wish, even if I can't agree with the reasons as to why they do it. I'm constantly looking for a way to shove my point of view down someone elses throat and try and have them enforce it. They have to accept mine and that's all there is to it. I think make up is dumb, and I'm going to push that agenda. So you better fucking listen to me and go along with what I say"

In short, get over yourself.
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>>17167218

Hey dude it would be great if she would respond and not some white knight bullshit, thanx
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>>17167220
Nah man there's no white knight bullshit here. You're just fucking retarded. You somehow think your reasons as to why people somehow shouldn't put make up on count for shit. No one fucking cares about why you think girls shouldn't put make up on, and no one needs to explain to your moronic dipshit why they do. You're like that fucking annoying vegan that tries to shove their own fucking agenda down everyone elses throat. Fuck off.
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>>17167218
That's called taking control as a man, you probably wouldn't get that
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>>17167213
>being female means being feminine which means having tits and a vagina
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>>17167226

?????

>>17167223

>no white knight bullshit
>dude comes in trying to convince other dudes that women wearing makeup isn't fucking retarded

lol uh huh
>>
Media depicts women who use products to enhance their beauty negatively. We are constantly being asked, "is it too much? Men don't need it. So why do women?" When it all comes down to it, Men and Women ARE different. As a man, you will never fully understand living as a woman, and vice versa, even if it is explained, you will not understand because "being" a Man or Woman comes down to one thing- experience. If you have not experienced life as the other gender, you will not understand.
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>>17167234

What the fuck is this shit about "you don't understand"? It really isn't hard to see that the cosmetics industry has been manipulating women for at least 100 years. Not to mention - holy shit - a lot of make up is sold to women by men. They just want your money, and to keep confusing you about how you look. Stop listening to them.

Who is constantly asking you these things? Why are you placing yourself in these situations?
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>>17167226
>>17167225
lol. If you think that's taking control, you're very young and naive. It shows no signs of dominance whatsoever. All it does, is show you as retarded and stubborn. But you can justify it as assertive if it makes you feel better. Like I said above, it's like a vegan spewing their bullshit about why you shouldn't eat meat. You don't need meat to survive, you can survive on vegetables, there are artificial foods that taste like meat, blablabla. The point you and vegan fucks like this miss is, no one gives a shit about any valid reasons you come up with. People will do as they please, and that's all there is to it. You don't "convince" anyone not to eat meat, or apply makeup.

>>17167232
>Thinks disagreeing with retarded statements is white knighting. Is using ad-hominems to debate because they can't debunk what's being said, usually the sign that they can't debate.
>>
>makeup harms skin
Have you actually seen a naturally aged woman who doesn't wear makeup? If nothing else, makeup protects the skin from the sun.

>women don't need makeup
These are usually also the kind of guys who cannot tell the difference between a painted and photoshopped goblin and an actual bare-faced woman.

Look if you feel your girlfriend is shit at or inefficient at makeup, then make THAT known. Don't start shit about how you are apparently fundamentally opposed to the idological issues of makeup.
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>>17167213
>Even though I'm already female and have tits and a vagina, I need to spread things on my face people sold to me in order to feel feminine
Feeling feminine has very little to do with having a vagina and tits. I'd still have a vagina and tits even if I burped curses in front of tv watching football and drinking beer, but I wouldn't be feminine at all.
It's more about cultural construct than about the biological condition.
I really like doing things that make me feel feminine: wearing nice and cute clothes, doing my hair, wearing make up, doing beauty treatments, doing my nails it's something that I enjoy doing sometimes.

>I don't think I'm pretty because I pay too much attention to the media.
I don't pay any attention to the media. I don't watch lots of tv. I had to google who the kardashians were 4 months ago, and I absolutely have no clue about famous people or whatever.

>I also place value on "feeling pretty" as if that's not totally narcissistic
It is extremely narcissistic, I like being good looking, and pretty much everyone does.
Other than this, I'm a med student, I volunteer, I work out three times a week, I have a ton of interests that are completely unrelated to beauty and fashion.
"Looking good" is not my main interest and I wouldn't even define it as a hobby, but it feels nice and I enjoy doing these things and it makes me feel relaxed. Why should I stop doing it?

> "no one is going to love you if you can't love yourself" thing really applies here.
"Loving yourself" is about feeling comfortable doing whatever you like doing. I love myself tons, and I'm loved tons.
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File: sephora.jpg (94KB, 576x360px) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
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>>17167234
>>17167247
>>17167248
>>17167250

Hey here you go, ladies. The CEOs of Sephora. Proudly bringing you the feminine experience since 1970.

If you think these guys don't just want your money, you're dumber than a rock.
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>>17167255
>Ad-hominem
>Ad-hominem
>I can't debate worth shit
>Ad-hominem
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>>17167258
Stop atracking me personally, I get offended easily ;^(
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>>17167242
What is this consumerism shit
Every industry shit or anyone selling shit to you and you buying it means you're being manipulated by them just because? Maybe a lot of women are insecure and whatnot especially when they cannot imagine a few days, let alone a life without make up. But maybe some also do it because they like it, the same waysomeone changes his hairstyle, or his clothes with another
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>>17167250

I'm a man. I rarely, if ever, think about things that would help me to feel or appear more manly. I am what I am. This fascination with "feeling" a certain way is beyond me. It's just a clear indication that, somewhere along the way, you were told that you need to feel this way.
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>>17167255
Make up is used since ancient egypt, mostly by rich women.
I think using make up is common for all women since the 20s-30s at least.
It's not like sephora defined what's feminine.

Also, no problems at spending money on something I enjoy doing.
Like you spend money on videogames or whatever.
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>>17167255
So? Majority of fashion houses are also owned by men, like every other fucking industry out there. If women didn't buy anything that didn't have women CEOs, every woman would be running around naked.
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>>17167242
>Conspiracy theories
>Manipulation
>This level of retarded mental gymnastics because they can't deal with females wearing make up.
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>>17167258
>>17167264

Explain to me, O Internet Wizards, how two men are supposed to have a grasp of this fleeting "feminine experience". They don't even wear makeup. Their understanding of it is entirely based on appearance and money. They manipulate women into buying their products by running marketing campaigns explaining how they're going to help women feel more beautiful.
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>>17167266
>I rarely, if ever, think about things that would help me to feel or appear more manly
Actually, the vast majority of men, including you, do this all the time. Just because you don't THINK about it doesn't mean you don't do it. It's like breathing by the time you sperglords become adults.
>if I cry or show any emotion that is considered to be "weak", does this make me less manly?
>if I show physical affection to another male, does this make me less manly?
>if I dress in certain items or choose certain items in my possession does this make me look less manly?
>if I choose certain hobbies or obtain enjoyment out of certain things, does this make me less manly?

You guys have a dozen slurs about sissies and faggots to keep each other in that crab bucket.
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>>17167267
>>17167269
>>17167270

Wow goddammit Millennials have got to be the most fucked generation yet
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>>17167275

Where did you get your Women's Studies degree??
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>>17167277
>I have no points, so another insult not actually debating any of the things I quoted trying to attack character.
Anybody that uses the term millenial is far too young to talk shit about other age groups. Gj avoiding whats been said again btw. But we both know you're incapable of actually debating whats said.

>>17167274
>Doesn't understand what a CEO actually is.
That's your answer.
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>>17167279
Come back to me when you have developed a color sense better than "brownish-green".
>>
ITT: OP Is worried his girl will attract alphas
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>>17167266
>I rarely, if ever, think about things that would help me to feel or appear more manly.
I don't wake up every morning and think "I'm going to do my hair to fit better into the stereotype of an attractive female, yay!". It's pretty much all unconscious. I get a rewarding feeling when I see myself closer to my ideal of women, which includes, but isn't limited to, being pretty.

>It's just a clear indication that, somewhere along the way, you were told that you need to feel this way.
Most people grow up with a certain image in their head of what a "man" and a "woman" should look like and kinda try to fit it, mostly unconsciously.
My idea of a woman is pretty much a 50s housewife, mostly because I grew up with a 50s housewife (my grandma) who loves doing her hair and make up, cooks marvellous food and wears dresses all the time.
That's what women do for me, that's the image of a woman I've seen since I was a child. It is what is natural to me. To be feminine I have to be kind, cook well and always look pretty. Which is something I try to do.
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Men can also wear make up (face powder and such), actors especially do in movies. Yeah they're buried under tons of it and you don't even realize it.

But make up is basicly enhancing. For the ugly or less gifted by nature, it's covering up faults and looking better. For the pretty, is either playing with different looks or looking every prettier.

It's the same 'improvement' and 'enhancement' people do with other parts of their body. For some it is necessary, for others curiosity or hobby. One day it may be permanent (see make up tattoos)
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>>17167284

I have nothing I can say to you because it's like arguing with a religious fanatic. You will always just come around to say "yeah whatever man just let people do what they wanna do" even though that's completely ignorant. This is like trying to go on /mu/ and tell them Kanye sucks.

I don't wear makeup because I'm comfortable with my face and other people should be too. If I have acne, I don't try to deceive myself and others and cover it up. If I have messy eyebrow hairs, I don't pluck them because it's just my goddamn eyebrows. If you begin with the premise that wearing makeup is unnecessary, then you arrive at many other points. Like, spending 30 minutes a day putting it on is a huge waste of time. Or, spending $50 on it is a total waste of money.
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>>17167295
>You will always just come around to say "yeah whatever man just let people do what they wanna do" even though that's completely ignorant
Not whatever you think it means. Look, I've already countered that arguement.

Vegans could validly go around accusing people that eating meat is unhealthy. That people can survive through vegetables. Do they have valid points? Perhaps. But what you're missing is that just because you have a valid point means shit. People will eat meat because they want to eat meat. It's not your decision, and none of your valid reasoning matters. Do you think Vegans have a right to go around convincing people what to eat just because they may have a few valid points about not eating meat? Because that comes across as overbearing/obnoxious. No one is going to enjoy their company.

Also, stop acting like you're completely innocent. Get off the high horse man. You're acting like you've never smoked before, or taken any drugs or alcohol, never eaten a hamburger or candy or a pizza. People do shit to their body ALL the fucking time that might not be good for them. You don't have a leg to stand on here.
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Yo man just let people do what they want. Do you go to bars and preach that alcohol kills your liver and you don't understand it? I like putting makeup on bevause it's fun and its like painting. Sure maybe it's not great for your skin but its fun putting on blue eyeshadow. But thats pretty much the only thing i use. Do you rail at people who like to dress nice? 'Stockings and tight pants are bad for circulation and so are heels they're just a social construct' 'its so stupid to spend money on things that are bad for you we should just go vegan nudist and never drink alcohol again'
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>>17167304

I'm pretty confused as to why you keep comparing makeup use to things like eating certain foods or wearing cargo shorts. They have nothing in common aside from being personal choices. Do people eat meat to "feel more like omnivores" or wear cargo shorts to "feel more like neckbeards"? Also, food and cargo shorts aren't inherently tied to one gender like makeup [typically] is.

I'm mainly curious why women still say things like "men don't need makeup duh" but then continue to wear it themselves. It's just utter cognitive dissonance.
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OP is either autistic or suffers from some other condition that causes rigid thinking. or he is a troll. but I'm procrastinating right now, so even if troll...

I am a gal who doesn't get a big charge out of feeling feminine. I also don't wear makeup because having stuff on my skin feels gross, and if it's "super light, can't feel it" makeup, I forget it's there and smear it. and I also feel like if someone can't handle the way I look, too bad for them and I'm not gonna spend money and time to do shit I don't want to, just to please a random person's aesthetics.

anyway I actually used to feel the same way as you, OP, and rage against all the women who feel the need to cover themselves up with makeup. then over time I realised
>if they want to put stuff on their face it's their face and their business
>if they want to do extra shit to feel more feminine, it's their business even if I can't relate
>yes it's true that you shouldn't tie your whole self-esteem to your looks; however, there's nothing wrong with wanting to look good, and it's not a waste of time or money if you enjoy doing it and/or are happy with the results
>even if makeup is fake, if they want to be fake it's their business
>if they get cheap makeup and it wrecks their skin, it's their problem - their elective dermatology treatments will not affect my health insurance
>yeah makeup ads prey on insecurities and that's not cool, but most companies do that, so if you point the finger at them you gotta point it at advertising and marketing in general, not makeup specifically

you sound like a control freak who is trying to use the excuse of "taking control as a man" to justify your need to dictate to other people what they should be doing. as a recovering control freak myself, I'm telling you: get over yourself. and as a married person, I'm telling you: you gotta learn to pick your battles or you're gonna have a super hard time keeping a gf. if you hate makeup that bad, date guys.
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>>17167166
Sometimes I think I should used makeup but I'm so lazy. It's a good thing I look good without it.

We have a standard and we're pushing the bar on everything. In all ways. Perfection as professionals and in etiquette, in appearance. Only to the brink of infinity.

At least I think that's correct.
>>
Girl here, i agree with OP. I never understood it myself. Its a lot less work for me to do and there are other things a girl can do that are therapeutic and relaxing. Putting makeup on all the time makes your face age as well. My sis has caked on the makeup since hs, which was 10y ago. She looks older than me even though shes just a yr younger. Im 27 and shes 26. Ppl have actually thought that i was her daughter a couple times. Its a bad habit if you ask me.
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>>17167166
She's not wearing makeup for you, she's wearing it to see if she can reel in a better man. You're sort of like a placeholder.
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>>17167166
You sound like you have control issues. What she does with her body is her choice. Not yours. Worry about yourself
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>>17167166
do you look at women out side with make up? thats probably why
Thread posts: 52
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