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St. John's Wort and Depression

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Hey /adv/. I've been struggling pretty badly with depression for the past few years, and only recently has it been starting to get better. I've worked through a lot of it solely on my own - I've barely talked to anyone about it, and I haven't taken any medications. Recently, for the first time in a while, I've had a few social outings where I felt like my old self again; actually social and upbeat.

However, that state of mind is hard for me to achieve. I actively aim for it now - I realized that I don't HAVE to be sad, which is an improvement, but it's still hard to actually do. This is why I've been considering taking antidepressants, just to improve my mood enough to the point where I can actually function.

However, I'm a senior in high school and would like to keep it somewhat discrete from my parents. I'm considering going out and buying St. John's Wort and trying that out. Any reason I shouldn't? I smoke weed, too, in case that has some adverse reaction to the other, though I've been considering quitting.
>>
stop smoking pot for a while
yes, pot does alter your brain chemistry
furthermore, your brain is still developing and smoking pot has been proven to exacerbate symptoms of mental illness in people with anxiety, depression, or schizophrenia. going back to the brain still in development, the brain can be easily damaged but also easily healed and you don't want it to ultimately get wired in a depressed state because you chose to smoke pot, right? smoke when you're older and not depressed, that goes for drinking too, worst thing you can do is self medicated with recreational drugs.

and before I get a durr pot is harmless maaan!
maybe if your brain is healthy it wont fuck you up too bad (but it does effect hormone levels and brain chemistry no matter what, don't you fucking dare say it doesn't or risk having your opinions disregarded), but if your brain isn't healthy you are going to make it worse.

so there you have it, a two step process. Stop smoking, then watch your condition improve.
if after that is all said and done you still feel dumpy you should look into further treatment.
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>>16470371
This is why I've been considering quitting. I don't know if it's really been a longterm thing (though it could be), but it's mostly because at the time it makes me even more anxious.

I really do think these antidepressants could improve my mood just enough so that I can finally shake this off. I'd like to at least try them, and this is what I was mostly looking for: is there any reason I shouldn't at least try it?
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>>16470381
if you want to take nutritional supplements that's fine, but if you are talking about real hard anti-depressant medications you need to explore all your other options first.

people often look to medication as a cure for these things, but they only exist to manage the symptoms, they don't treat the cause.
if its a true chemical depression that's all you can do, but if it isn't then some lifestyle improvements could be all you need.
stop smoking, stop eating as much junk, exercise some more, stop masturbating so much (yes even this) and your hormonal levels could balance out and make you not depressed anymore.
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>>16470391
Do you consider St. John's Wort considered a hardcore antidepressant?
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Are you on any other medications? Even though it's herbal St. John's Wort is a potent enzyme inhibitor. As well, remember it takes around 4-6 weeks to take effect and you have to take it three times a day. Literature suggests it's less effective than SSRI's but may be effective.
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Weed is great for depression in my experiences, but not overdoing it.

Imo people shouldn't smoke weed more than once a week (as in a full day or night or both dedicated to being stoned probably on the weekend or during a social event) - but even that is a lot.

I would say stay away from antidepressants. This is just my opinion. I don't like the way they work. Research them and decide for yourself.

I take adderall, which helps with my depression.

I've heard good things about St. John's Wort, and also about Curcumin which is supposedly better.

Everyone is different, try them and see what works for you.
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>>16470399
if you don't need a doctor to get it it's not hardcore. Even better yet since I think you can get that stuff in the grocery store, probably the same tier as caffeine drug wise
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>>16470371
Also this guy doesn't know what he's talking about, ignore him.
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Exercise. When I was super depressed, suicidally so, I decided to run until I effectively died. I couldn't, of course, but when I collapsed of exhaustion there was this profound sense of "Whoah. I'm fucking alive!"

Stop smoking pot, too. It makes you complacent with doing nothing, which likely contributes to your depression.
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>>16470381
If you aren't taking any other meds then sure, try these but it's not a miracle pill and the problems you have now are not going to magic away. You need to be aware of that. It sounds like mentally you are prepared to try and fix what you have going on in your life and talking it out with someone could really help you out. Also exercising is like free self-made antidepressants and always a good thing to throw into the mix. Like the other anon said, cutting out the pot-smoking (which makes a lot of people get stuck in their head or stuck in a rut) will help you with it. Anxiousness (paranoia) is a known effect of weed, and it's not benign. This stuff may work for some people with mild to medium-tier depression but you have to take them (like 2-3 pills daily or whatever the bottle says) for like 3 weeks and literally if you take any other drugs like antibiotics if you get sick, SJW can muck with them.

You are stronger than your depressed mind will let you think you are, anon. Stay strong.
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>>16470430
420blazeitfaggit!!!!!

please do go on about how depressed people should use drugs and alcohol as a crutch?
really, you seem like a smart person, tell me all about it
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>>16470437
Only other medication I take is Claritin. I should be good then?
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>>16470450
You realize antidepressants are a drug used as a crutch, right?

You obviously don't know what you're talking about. You say marijuana causes anxiousness when only certain strains, Sativa, do - which are strains that people with anxiety know to avoid.

Depression is helped by indicas and low sativa content hybrids. When used correctly, marijuana can be more effective than commonly prescribed pills without the side effects or dependence - and with much less frequent use (you can smoke once a week instead of taking a pill every day).

If you don't know how marijuana is used to treat mental illness kindly shut up about it and don't spread misinformation.
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>>16470461
Claritin is OK.
>>16470465
Literally what high school senior has the capacity to get these special hybrids for depression? Literally who but those who've been around weed way too long know what weed is OK and what weed is not? Weed is weed for underagers.
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>>16470476
Again, you don't know what your talking about? You can ask your dealer what they're selling you.

Stoners usually know what strains they're smoking. Weed is weed for casuals.
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My psychology textbook cautions against most "natural remedies" but says St. John's Wort is actually an effective antidepressant. Can't remember the exact quote but I could try to find it again if anyone's curious. It was from Introducing Psychology by Schacter, Gilbert and Wegner.
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agreed with other anons about quitting weed. people don't think it be like it is but it do. weed will fuck with your mind and you'd be far better off learning how to live life without that dependency. your health, physical and psychological, will thank you.

source: wish i didn't start smoking in highschool.
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>>16470465
>If you don't know how marijuana is used to treat mental illness
you mean like a doctor would give you with a prescription?
you fucking imbecile, we are talking about how he can try to make himself feel better before he resorts to getting medical attention, and here you are telling him to go buy street drugs because "lol doctors give it to people bro"
maybe he can just ask the dealer for some prozac too, much easier than trying to learn about strains.

different strains might change the way your high feels, but they are all altering your brain in the same way, you ignorant clot.

you say I'm here spreading misinformation, meanwhile you are saying to a depressed person"don't worry brah pots good for ya!! fuck trying to exercise or examining and reassessing your life choices to make yourself feel better, jsut smoke up like me! the guy who doesn't know a thing about addiction but will pretend he does!"

get the fuck out you insufferable cockchaffer, before you hurt someone with your retardation.

>>16470480
oh god...I was making fun of you earlier but you actually did go and tell him to ask a dealer for medication..ahaha holy shit


OP. ignore that retard please and listen to what literally everybody here except that bozo is telling you
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>>16470484
Found the quote. The review is not as stellar as I remember, sorry: "...some studies have shown that St. John’s wort (a wort, it turns out, is an herb) has an advantage over a placebo condition in relieving depression (e.g., Lecrubier et al., 2002), but others show no advantage (e.g., Hypericum Depression Trial Study Group, 2002)".
I guess you'd have to look up those studies and make your own opinion.
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Btw exercise and speaking with a counsellor at school are also discrete options. Plus, they're free.
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>>16470519
>Ignorance: The post
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>>16470535
says the guy who doesn't think people develop a dependence on marijuana
>doesn't know the difference between physical and mental dependence
>calling other ignorant

I told you to get the fuck out, now leave, you aren't allowed to be part of this discussion anymore
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Just went out and bought 100 capsules of St. John's Wort. Really appreciate the advice - I only recently found out about it, and it sounds like it'll be able to help me. I probably will stop smoking for a long time.

>>16470530
Counselors are pretty useless at my school, they don't even help kids with academic shit, much less emotional shit. Most high schools are like this now.
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>>16470543
Holy fuck, did your mom drop you when you were a child or something?
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>>16470519
Lol wow. You really shouldn't be given anyone advice if you're so fucking lazy about doing research.

>and here you are telling him to go buy street drugs
I never specified where he should get the drug. For all I know, he has a friend that's a grower or has a green card that can buy for him. That's besides the point. I didn't necessarily tell him to smoke weed, I refuted your claim that weed makes people with depression worse.

>different strains might change the way your high feels, but they are all altering your brain in the same way, you ignorant clot.
Top lel. Antidepressants alter your brain chemistry a fuckton more than taking medicinal doses of marijuana. St. John's Wort alters your brain chemistry. Exercising alters your brain chemistry. You realize that statement means nothing, right?

When you're dealing with depression you're /trying/ to alter your brain because the way it currently is is fucking broken.

> fuck trying to exercise or examining and reassessing your life choices to make yourself feel better, jsut smoke up like me! the guy who doesn't know a thing about addiction but will pretend he does!"

Only I never said that. My original advice to OP was this >>16470426

Dickholes like you come into every fucking thread about depression going "exercise brah!!! You're unsatisfied with something in your like so you should fix it!!! These things will cure your depression!!!"

If you actually knew shit about depression you would know its different for everyone. Exercise is only effective against mild depression. True major depression is something independent from "life choices".

You sound like an underaged dewb. Please don't go on /adv/ to talk about things you don't fully understand.
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>>16470587
listen here, cuntrag
I made it very clear my recommendations are tentative and he should explore them before resorting to more extreme methods.

maybe his brain is broken from smoking pot, hmmm? nah thats impossible, right? he should just keep smoking pot and explore how more drugs can remedy his problem instead of trying to let his body heal itself.

I can't deal with morons like you, you really twist my nutsack with how stupid you are.
Fucking Fact, Nigger: Marijuana consumption causes anxiety and depression in some people, not just when they are under the influence.
And at his age the changes can be cemented permanently as neural pathways are being established, his brain can literally wire itself the wrong way if smoking is a contributing factor in his condition.

OP did the right thing and took advice from the adults instead of the pot heads or the guy reliant on amphetamines to get through the day
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>>16470648
You clearly have poor reading comprehension. I even mentioned in my original post that he shouldn't overdo smoking weed, but recognized that it can be an effective antidepressant. Giving it up or not is something that's entirely his choice.

>maybe his brain is broken from smoking pot, hmmm?
And maybe it's not?

>let his body heal itself.
That's not how it works. And OP likely started smoking weed to cope with his mental illness issues, meaning that stopping it wouldn't change anything other than to potentially worsen his depression. It could also make him better if it is the cause. Unlike you, I'm not claiming to know what's best for him.

>Fucking Fact, Nigger: Marijuana consumption causes anxiety and depression in some people, not just when they are under the influence.
Again, can you not read? I already mentioned sativas can cause anxiety and aggravate other conditions. Indicas treat anxiety. You're badmouthing an effective plant that can help people because of your stupid bias. You can say OP should take a break from weed to see if it is exacerbating his condition, but you shouldn't say "WEED IS BAD IT ALTERS YOUR BRAIN CHEMISTRY ALL WEED MAKES MENTAL ILLNESS WORSE YOUR BRAIN IS BEING DAMAGED AND YOU ARE PERMANENTLY WIRING YOUR BRAIN DIFFERENTLY WHEN YOU SMOKE POT" and other bullshit.

>And at his age the changes can be cemented permanently as neural pathways are being established
Completely ignorant and something that has been proven wrong time and time again in studies. People who ABUSE marijuana have detectable differences in their brain, but this can go away in as little as a month when they abstain - even if they have been abusing marijuana for years. Again, do some research and stop basing your opinions on propaganda.

>the guy reliant on amphetamines to get through the day
Nice way to show that you have no fucking clue about mental illness and need to stop giving advice about it.

Research before you speak, or be a moron.
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the whole argument going in this thread is like watching a bunch of retards trying to fuck a doorknob

just google scholar the effects of st johns wort on depression and boom. seriously 4chan is the last place to go to for medicinal advice.
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>>16470724
>>16470724
>mfw not the guy you're talking with but I live in Colorado where the weed culture is out of fucking control and have seen peoples lives already completely destroyed by dependency on marijuana

>mfw i don't give a shit as this poster is gonna get up my ass about "physical vs mental addiction" like every self-righteous stoner does in the face of this argument

>mfw anyone suggests that sativa vs indica strains are in any way medically discernible beyond whatever Rooster or fucking High Times says

>mfw medical dispensaries actually will correct you if you try to perpetuate this fucking nonsense about strains treating different things. They could be legally accountable if they even suggested it.

>mfw stoners get absolutely butt blasted when anyone suggests their substance might not be god's gift to mankind, often firing back with canned responses like "hurr durr legalized drugs alcohol, etc. etc."

>mfw this is some kind of tragic comedy
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>>16470887
>never said weed couldn't be abused or the users develop a dependence, like almost any other prescribed drug.

>sativa and indica are physically different looking plants that have obviously different highs.

>there are actual scientific studies on how they are effective against different things. Sativa is bad for anxiety because it is a hyper head high, indica is good for it because it is a relaxing body high - same reason why it is effective against pain.

>mfw when people against weed just pull shit out of their ass

>mfw these idiots keep a money making plant with a million beneficial uses illegal.
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>>16470945
here's another fact for you. If they focused medical efforts to isolate the helpful properties pot has and turned it into a medication to manage symptoms but didn't get you high, suddenly all of you would stop the push for medical marijuana.

you are a drug addict that just wants to get high, we all know it, you aren't fooling anybody. It's great too because you guys are so brain dead you don't realize how retarded you sound, you just sit in your echo chamber and your damaged brains are too clouded up to see reality anymore.

all of you are the same, you aren't smart, you are weak junkies dependent on a substance to feel good because you have so little going for you otherwise.
the only people who respect you are other pot heads. You are a group of idiots stomping around oblivious to how foolish you appear to everybody else.
your entire life is basically the equivalent to someone walking around with a piece of toilet paper stuck to the bottom of their shoe and thinking all the looks you are getting are of approval when in reality its people mocking the retard
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>>16471051

>Getting this buttmad

Who hurt you?
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>>16471051
I literally smoke two or three times a month, if at all. You don't know how stupid you look.

You're brainwashed to be a straightedge asswipe, you don't know how stupid you look to anyone who at least bothered to do five minutes of research in their life.

> If they focused medical efforts to isolate the helpful properties pot has and turned it into a medication to manage symptoms but didn't get you high, suddenly all of you would stop the push for medical marijuana.
They have done this and its what they use to treat children for conditions like epilepsy, you fucking moron.

And the "high" is what helps with certain symptoms, so suggesting people only want weed legal to get high... um, yeah dumbass. Painkillers get you high and that's what numbs your pain.

If you were an intelligent person you wouldn't resent people who have drug problems in the first place. Sorry you got bullied by the skater kids in high school but it's no reason to be such a buttmad idiot.
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>>16470887
>"hurr durr legalized drugs alcohol, etc. etc."
How is this not valid? Explain the exact reasoning that makes alcohol and tobacco okay.
>>
Guys, guys, phenibut. Phenibut!
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>>16471051
>>16471143

If I still had depression, you guys would have fucking cured it with how insanely hilarious this thread has gotten.

kudos
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For those of you claiming that pot is an effective treatment for depression based on it's chemical properties that influence neurotransmitters, give me some evidence of exactly what biochemical response it has in the brain and how this response is positive for people with depression. I hate to tell you, but you go to school and learn a bit about neuroscience, all your stupid stoner arguments get thrown out the window. Cite some peer reviewed articles if you're so sure.
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>Weed gives me anxiety
>Should i go to doctor to get prescribed another drug to combat said anxiety
Truely cringe worthy thought process there. Quit smoking pot and get your life together.
>>
> I smoke weed,
(so do I)
>I've had a few social outings where I felt like my old self again; actually social and upbeat.
I don't know about depression but social anxiety and weed go hand in hand for me, that's why i only smoke at home, but still the days after, you're a bit affected.
would recomend at least taking it into account as a troublemaker!
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