Post people who did nothing wrong and still got fucked over

his fault for summoning the king of cunts

What sense of the word 'wrong'? Mistakes or moral violations?

>>162232098
Moral violations yeah

>>162231905
Tokiomi is wrong because he's fucking retarded

>>162232191
He's just too much of a mage is all

>>162231905
It's funny when you thin that, had Kariya studied magecraft instead of turning his back on it he would've probably been able to protect Sakura or maybe even married Aoi instead of losing her to Tokiomi.

His biggest mistake was trying to do the right thing.

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>>162232903
>Kariya
>doing the right thing

>>162231905
me irl

>>162233028
I said trying, can you read?

He cut ties with his family out of disgust from their magic, he thought it was the best thing to do because he didn't want to continue that going, and that ended up leading to his downfall.

I never said he did the right thing, the way he conducted all of his actions was just retarded.

>>162233170
Why didn't he just studied magecraft under someone else? There's schools for magi, after all. Even a poorfag like Waver managed to get in.

>>162233696
The family magics are the most powerful. Pleb magic just cant compare to the rape worms I guess.

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>>162233696
It would have taken him too long to get powerful enough to compete in the 4th HGW.

>>162233696
He probably didn't have much of an understanding of how the magic world works, Zouken DID take a while to start teaching him and Byakuya doesn't have much of an understanding either, or maybe he just didn't want to bear the Matou magic crest at all out of disgust.

>>162233822
The moment you get your crest all your family magic gets transferred you, you can't really prevent that, see Kiritsugu.

>>162232191
Tokiomi was a heartless bastard. He knew how fucked up Zouken was but he sent Sakura to be adopted by him anyway just because he wanted both of his daughters to learn magic. He didn't care that he basically ruined her daughter's life and put his ideals as a mage before his family. That and he was blind to how Kirei was basically a psychopath but so was everybody else. He was also easily made into Gilgamesh's bitch.

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unforgivable.

>>162234030
Even Kirei himself was blind to how he was a psychopath, he tried to make a family and live a normal life even though he was unable to do that, it would be pretty hard for someone to notice that because Kirei wasn't hiding anything, he really didn't understand who he truly was.

I'm not sure if Gilgamesh was able to see him as a psychopath because he was also a psychopath, or if he just noticed Kirei didn't understand who he was or what he wanted and pushed him to the limit.

Nah they were both fucking retarded.
Tokiomi did literally nothing but twiddle his thumbs when he could have fucking won the war early on - lets not even discuss his bullshit in regards to Sakura.
Kariya was a delusional white knight thinking he could save Sakura from Zouken, however he was only doing it under a shitty pretence of wanting to cuck Tokiomi lets not forget, he failed anyway and died like a dog.
Excluding Waver, everyone in zero was pretty much an asshole and deserved exactly what they got.

>>162234327
>could've won the war early on.

You'd die in the first day of a Holy Grail war.

>>162233945
Kariya cut ties with Zouken and the Matou family because Zouken's plan was for him to marry Aoi and produce an heir to inherit Zouken's magic crest. Kariya was like "OH FUCK THAT" because he knew that it'd mean his kids would endure Zouken's torturous training and Aoi would die, so he abandoned his training and cut ties with Zouken. Aoi ended up marrying Tokiomi since her family wanted her to marry into an esteemed family of Magi. Kariya was heartbroken since he was always in love with Aoi, but he was ok with it since he figured that Aoi would be safe.

Little did he know, Tokiomi and Aoi conceived two twin sisters who were capable of becoming Magi. However, the Tokiomi family mage crest could only be inherited by one sister. Tokiomi thought it'd be a waste for one sister not to receive anything. Zouken came along and offered to adopt Sakura. Tokiomi agreed in a heartbeat despite knowing full well how fucked up Zouken was since it'd mean both of his daughters would inherit the crest of esteemed Magi families.

So Kariya's efforts to keep Aoi's kids safe backfired since he had no idea how horrible of a father Tokiomi was.

>>162234415
Maybe, but at least i wouldn't get feed to worms or stabbed by a shitty priest.

>>162234152
Gilgamesh just kinda gradually figured it out after his many conversations with Kirei.

>>162234030
Tokiomi might have known about the worms but he believed Sakura would be raised as a magus rather than a tool.

>>162234030
without the protection of magic crest, the Mage Association would have the authority to use Sakura for Experiments

>If only he would be able to pass the treasure that he got from his father onto his daughter –Tokiomi thought sadly.
>However, that was already impossible to be achieved.
>For Rin and Sakura, there were no choices for them in the first place.
>One of them has all elements, having five multiple elements as her alignment. The other has no elemental alignments, having Imaginary Numbers only. Both sisters have a rare potential that can be equated to miracles. This had surpassed the limits of so-called natural talents or inborn skill; it is almost like a curse.
>A magical nature would equally gather magical powers to it. Prominent people who are far outside the rules inevitably ‘gather’ equally extraordinary experiences. This can not be controlled by the person’s own will. There is only one way to deal with this kind of a destiny – consciously walk away from the rules yourself.

>Apart from understanding and practicing the way of magecraft themselves, there are no other ways to deal with the magical powers hidden in the blood of Tokiomi’s daughters. Moreover, the protection of the T?saka house can only be endowed on one of them. This fact tormented Tokiomi for a long time. The one who did not become the inheritor would get mired in all kinds of odd evens due to her own blood, and trouble wound find her. If the Association found this kind of ‘ordinary humans’, those guys would definitely gladly put her in formaldehyde as a specimen in the name of ‘protection’.
>Precisely because of that, it was nothing better than a godsend for the Mat? house to hope to have Sakura as their adopted daughter. He had obtained the way to have both his beloved daughters inherit first-class magecraft, unconstrained by their bloodline’s consequence, and carve out their own lives. At that time, Tokiomi could be said to be freed from the heavy burden of being a father.

is there really nothing deeper to kirei than him being a sadist
disappointing considering the build up

him smiling as Rin cries at the end of Zero is a pretty great scene though

>>162234480
Rin and Sakura aren't twins, though. Rin is at least one year older.

>>162234694
So it was either rapeworms or Magic Association Fun Time. I'm genuinely not sure which is worse.

>>162234694
Tokiomi was too conservative for his own good. many noble families at clock tower create branch families through marriage and giving second children a bit of training. But he refused because he takes the rules literally which almost no one else does anymore.

>>162233945
You don't need the magic crest to be able to perform magic, though. All you need is magic circuits. Even if he rejected the Matou's magic crest, he was still capable of becoming a decent magus because of his lineage.

Though maybe you're right, Zouken didn't teach him enough about the magic world and he probably didn't knew about magic schools.

>>162232903
Anon, you've got me thinking.

> Kariya studies under Zouken rather than jumping ship from the family trade.
> Thinks "Makiri magecraft is just stupid dickworms but whatever, at least I know what I'm getting into, unlike whatever hookers Zouken will inevitably chain up in the basement if I don't do it."
> Looses pretense of holier-than-thou moralizing and just admits he hates BasementDad for getting the girl.
> His path to villainhood begins to open.
> Sakura becomes inconsequential and stays with the Tousaka household.
> 4th grail war.
> Zouken similar to Zero, urges Kariya to go for the hail-mary and summon a Berserker, but Lancelot gets to show off a bit more as his master isn't palsied and bleeding out just trying to keep his servant afloat.
> Insect-man doesn't win the Aoi-bowl, but actually gets amoral closure from strangling her to death rather than further sanity slippage.
> Becomes pals with Kotomine after the war, gives him a high five for deep-sixing Tokiomi.
> "Congrats Shinji, you *get* to learn bug magecraft."
> Matou Shinji remains outwardly the same but for very different reasons.
> 5th war starts. Shinji gets Hassan, or some heroic spirit famous for a "bitches and whores" mentality.
> Kariya becomes a tertiary antagonist, serving as a foil to Shirou by way of "this is how magecraft fucks your shit up, both body and mind; are you still sure you're doing the right thing?"
But would it be good?

>>162234792
Part of the reason is that the three families wanted to keep their power base alliance do deal with outsiders for the Holy Grail Ritual.

>>162234088
good riddance
what a piece of trash

>>162234771
Well, if Zouken raised her as an orthodox magus her life would have been painful but not much more than any other heir. Unfortunately he only planned to use her as breeding material, then as a puppet

>>162234695
He spent his entire life trying to be a good man but was ultimately fucked over due to genetics. Watching people suffer was the only thing that could bring him happiness.

>>162234792
That' wouldn't have protected Sakura, she needs to be an heir for the Mage Association to have no standing in taking her for 'protection'.

>>162234919
I dont think he is implying that she would get a sealing designation, which are actually super rare. rather any magus who encounter such a rare specimen would take them.

If Sakura were fully trained she could protect herself even without the crest, but Tokiomi would never do that because its unorthodox.

>>162235013
>Sealing Designations (封印指定, fuuin shitei?) are edicts handed down by the Mage's Association to maintain and protect special thaumaturgical abilities which cannot be acquired through study. Said to be a title of the "greatest honor", those marked are deemed "precious", causing the Association to mobilize the greatest effort to secure their flesh and blood, their body's potential. Those designated are to be incarcerated, becoming samples preserved in their present conditions and levels of ability. It is an outrage to those who are designated not because of it being the equivalent of a death sentence, but rather because it is an affront to their status as prominent magi. They who have spent their lives devoted to their research will automatically reject a situation in which they will be unable to continue.

If the family goes against the sealing designation, the whole family would have to be on the run. and The Tohsaka would lose their authority and holding over the land of fuyuki, and lose all their clout within the mage association.
Which means neither of the sisters could learn at the clock tower and build connections and power base.

Rin and Sakura's duel where they were wielding fragments of True Magics was literally Tokiomi's wet dream.
He got what he wanted in at least one route.

>>162235013
The quote from the LN: >>162234694

Already suggest a sealing designation would very likely be put on her.

> If the Association found this kind of ‘ordinary humans’, those guys would definitely gladly put her in formaldehyde as a specimen in the name of ‘protection’.

>>162235136
Yes but I am not sure Sakura, minus Zouken's tampering would qualify.

If something is worth a sealing designation, they wont like something like a sixth generation family stand in their way.

>>162235184
>>162235191
Ah but it does say "ordinary human" a magus is something different.

>>162235175
Its more about Tokiomi's dream that both Sisters would reach their potential.

Both Sisters making to the end of the final rounds would be confirmation to him that both have lots of potential and both lived up to it.

>>"This is especially so since my wife is very outstanding as a mothering body. Both Rin and Sakura are born with equal and rare natural talents. Both daughters must have the protection of a house of magi. Robbing away one's potential for the other's future － no father would hope for such a tragedy to occur."

>>162235216
There's a reason why its in quotation marks, mages that don't have the magic crests are basically comparable to muggles.

and its definitely referring to her:
>The one who did not become the inheritor would get mired in all kinds of odd evens due to her own blood, and trouble wound find her. If the Association found this kind of ‘ordinary humans’, those guys would definitely gladly put her in formaldehyde as a specimen in the name of ‘protection’.

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Poor grandpa. ;_;

>>162235284
So he's one of those "live up to your potential" parents

>>162234480
Basically this, also to >>162234694, I don't remember reading about this but is there any reason to why you can't give your magic crest to two children besides that it's unorthodox? Is something like that even talked about in the Nasuverse?

>>162234794
You do need the magic crest to become a decent magus, even though the lineage can give you more magic circuits that might make your magic a little stronger, you would basically be a one trick pony, and your trick would probably suck. At least compared to anything a crest can give you.

Also he would never be able to transfer his crest to his children, he would be just transferring all the Matou magic anyway. I still think the best course of action would be to take the crest and change the Matous magic himself.

>>162234852
I think that's impossible to happen, even after being broken by everything that happened with him in the war it's pretty obvious he felt nothing but regret, he's too much of a goody two shoes.

>>162235321
Makes me wonder, where did Shirou get his magic circuits? Given that his blood family were completely ordinary humans, and only descendants of magi can have magic circuits... just from where did he got his shit?

>>162235447
Because you are transferring the total sum of your family's circuit and research. And the heir basically over time give part of their own circuits to the crest.

>>162235476
You don't need to be belong to mage family to have magic circuits.

Ciel was an example too.

>>162235476
Normal humans are sometimes rarely born with magic circuits. Just means they had a mage somewhere in their bloodline, could be generations back.

>>162235538
>You don't need to be belong to mage family to have magic circuits.
Wait, where was this mentioned? IIRC Fate's prologue was all about explaining how only children of magi can have magic circuits.

>>162235567
>Q: Kirei's wife Ortensia is covered with wounds in the design draft, is it because she has a body similar to Caren's? Also, Command Spells appeared on Kirei due to the fact that he somehow possesses Magic Circuits despite being born in a non-magus lineage. Does this mean Caren also has Magic Circuits?

>A: Kirei's wife is an albino, and is immunodeficient. As a result, she can die from even a tiny wound, thus her body appears tattered. What Caren inherited is the aspect of "prone to be plagued by illnesses". This is truly an ordeal given by God.
>About the Magic Circuits, a normal person rarely acquires Magic Circuits. You can consider such cases sudden mutations. However, Kirei is not of this type. Kirei's Circuits were a gift from the divine sacrament, rewarding his father Risei's years of pious worship. Kirei was born with "the right to recreate the miracles in the divine sacrament". This "right", in other words, was the Magic Circuits. Caren did not inherit the Circuits.

>>162235618
Ah thanks, that answers a question I've had for some time.

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>>162234792
>Raising two equally talented and high potential daughters to become magi
>Only give one of them the magic crest

Yeah, cause we've seen that work out so well with another pair of sisters

>>162235512
Is that something that can only go one way instead of two ways?

What would happen if he put a magic crest on Rin and then on Sakura?

>>162231905
>left
Just because you truly believe you're doing the right thing doesn't mean you are.

>right
You're wrong because you failed. Doesn't matter that your intentions were good.

>>162235768
I don't know. What would happen if you transplanted your heart into one person and then another?

>>162235722
Touko also received a Sealing Designation. And guess what she doesn't have? That's right, a magic crest

>>162231905
me

>>162235618
I think it's a really shoddy explanation saying that "normal humans rarely have magic circuits", since there are cases of humans like Shirley and Waver grandmother performing magecraft for that to be true, this is either a plot hole or a good amount of humans actually have magic circuits, they're just really garbage and in small quantity, like, one or two shitty circuits, instead of the average 20 good ones a mage usually has of or exceptional 27 of a human like Shirou.

But hey, maybe Shirley and Waver grandmother are super rare exceptions too, I don't know everything about the fate universe so I can't really say much else.

>>162236148
Shirou's magic circuit quality was low though

>>162236280
Only because they degraded from neglect. If Kiritsugu didn't fuck Shirou's training, his potential would be a lot higher.

>>162236280
Yeah but he had a lot of them, more than the average magus. And like >>162236333 said, it's probable Shirou finds some way of restoring his circuits, since Archer is a much better Magus than him.

>>162236333
Quality is nothing you really improve in magic circuit

>>162236521
He didn't say it would improve from training, when he said neglect is that what Shirou has been doing his entire life while "training" alone was destroying his magic circuits, that's why they're crap, not because they were born crappy.

>>162236333
Quality is not something you improve. Aoko for example only have a circuit quality rank of C

>>162236566
He wasn't destroying his circuit.

What his training was doing was temporarily turning his nerves into makeshift circuits

>>162236280
Yes but that is still better than the average magus without a crest. If they were not so hopelessly tied to his dual element/origin he would probably be a decent magus, at least for a 1st generation.

Even Rin's ancestor Nagato is said to have sucked so much his master never expected anything from his family

>>>162235722
Well yeah, mages slaughter each other all the time. Tokiomi never cared if his daughters came to conflict as long as the family reached its goals.

>>162236004
That was more because of what she created

>>162234695
>is there really nothing deeper to kirei than him being a sadist
He says he's envious of normal people and has awesome manly fist battle with Shirou in HF.

>>162231905
where did it all go so wrong for miles edgeworth?

>>162235722
You can't divide magic crest between the two, unless you're the Eidefelt with their Sorcery Ore.

>>162236004
That's because of her puppets though.

>>162234480
Sakura and Rin aren't twins. They made Sakura because Rin was at risk of dying after her birth.

Tokiomi however, did have an affair at some point and spat out a half japanese spawn, whose daughter is blonde Rin from Extra.

>>162234695
Kirei's role is a foil to Shirou in Heaven's Feel, he's a bit of a Hannibal-esque figure. Just as how Shirou can only feel happiness from the happiness of others, Kirei can only feel happiness at the expense of others. He's not terribly complex, but his interactions in Heaven's Feel were top notch.

>>162236586
Isn't it quantity C? The Aozaki are known for their super high quality circuits, but low quantity. In terms of efficiency, Aoko's circuits are much more efficient than Shirou's above average 27.

>>162235772
His intentions weren't good. He's a chuuni who entered the war because of his delusion of "if I kill Tokiomi and rescue Sakura, Aoi will jump on my dick". He's literally a /r9k/ greentext with Tokiomi as the chad.

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>>162234030
A lot of the explanations gives are just hollow excuses.
There's god knows how many magus families with thin bloodline willing to accept fresh talented blood to rekindle their glory.
Hell he could've probably found a talented magus willing to "adopt" her if only to have a talented pupil.
Even better make a deal with the association to have them take care of her without her becoming a test subject, he had the fucking connections.
But no, let's hand her over to the creepy old man with rape worm magic.
The fact that the Tohsaka family went into ruins is just karma hitting them in the balls.

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>>162231905
>did nothing wrong
Tokyo was a weak cuck who was too scared to give any real orders to his servant.
Wormdude chose an impossible mission instead of just grabbing Sakura and running.

>>162231957
Isn't the character, the servant gets random according to how he was in life?
Like Diarmuid rather could have been a cynical barstard, instead of the honorable knight he was summoned.

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>>162231905

>>162241342
Yeah, probably Caster Gil would be much less of a cunt. Doesn't change the fact that Tokiomi tried to summon the strongest hero, and that's Archer Gil.

>>162231905
nah, they just got stuck in shit story.

>>162234852
>>162232903
You're fucking stupid, "Zouken's magecraft/heir" is just "become my next fleshbag vessel!" code. Kariya's smartest move was to get the fuck out there and cut his relationship with Aoi because Zouken wanted to use her as breeding mare. He didn't count on Tokiomi being a fucking retard and a callous bastard to sell Sakura like that. A lot of his hatred for Tokiomi was because Kariya honestly thought he was a decent human being and was fine with him as long Aoi and her children were happy and safe.

>>162240885
>grabbing Sakura and running
From what? Zouken is literally inside her.

>>162234919
It would, read Case Files, it telegraphs that Tokiomi was a fucking twit. The issue wasn't Sakura's well being, he wanted Sakura and Rin to fight to death as accomplished magi.

>>162236004
>>162235722
The sealing designation to Aoko and Touko was lifted, they are with the Clock Tower in the short story about Lev's suicide Nasu published in 2014.

>>162243992
He wasn't yet. But the worms would have killed him if he tried.
There was a specific set of circumstances in Accel Zero event of FGO written by Butcher and supervised by Nasu which saved Kariya and Sakura because Iskandar got involved and acted swiftly.

>>162243985
Well, at least the fucker eventually dies in Heaven's Feel.

I like to believe Kariya's soul was able to rest in peace after that.

>>162235844
Andre tried to rape Oscar.

>>162244066

Zouken literally tells Kariya when he busts through the door that it was top late, and Sakura was already full of his familiars. Don't know how you missed it.

Also see the extra stuff they had in the HF manga for what Zouken did to Kuzuki. There are logical, very practical reasons for why Kariya couldn't just run with Sakura. Sakura is disposable meat for experiments to Zouken, if he needed to kill her and jet, he would do so.

Tokiomi screwed over Sakura because of his carelessness and Kariya was silly for his envy, but the difference was that Kariya did have reasons beyond jealousy and bitterness for Tokiomi in not seeking aid from him. Tokiomi on the other hand only functioned on very obtuse magus values and honestly thought a four year old could topple Zouken with no training.

Kariya was silly as fuck, but her father was downright delusional and symptomatic of what is wrong with magi.

>>162234919
but if that's true, how can other mages, like waver, escape experimentation by the association?

>>162246060
They have no interest in Waver, he's just an uninteresting chump with circuits to them.
Sakura on the other hand has the Imaginary element as her affinity, and that makes her a lot more valuable as a guinea pig.

>>162246060
Waver has 0 talent beyond teaching.

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did nothing wrong

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>>162235722
She was also well above Sakura and Rin.

>Had fucking EX tier circuits,numerous too
>Magical prodigy and became one of the youngest masters
>Makes clocktower her bitch and easily shits on strong magus
>Has an eye for every occasion
>immortal
Also
>Touko achieved Heavens feel before anyone else, all alone and without cheats
>Saved Shirou,Shiki,Shiki,rider and others

It worked pretty well anon

>>162247742

We don't know how strong Sakura actually is, given Nasu makes it a point to be as vague as possible with her abilties, unlike Rin.

He and Takeuchi say cryptic things about it like, "Sakura's abilities are more fitting for a boss" and when comparing her and Ilya in the UBW anime Q and A, said, "the dark girl who contaminates the environment itself is the strongest" when she talked about Tokiomi, Rin, Ilya, and Fastwheels.

Plus, we know that the majority of the Shadow's abilities are just Sakura's. And Medea in Hollow says that her inner abilties are incredible, and we know from canon that Medea blows Aoko out of the water as a magus unless she has anti-spirit equipment from a sealed part of the Association.

Hopefully the HF movie will give Nasu cause to actually explain her powers better.

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>>162231905

>>162248447
>Medea blows Aoko out of the water as a magus unless she has anti-spirit equipment from a sealed part of the Association.
isnt aoko above servant level?

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>>162248484
Despairfags aren't welcome.

>>162248535
She's strong enough to fight Servants, but as a magus, she's nowhere near Age of Gods level. And don't even get me started on Solomon and Merlin.

>>162248662
>Solomon and Merlin
solomon is basically one step below big G od- so thats cheating, and merlin isnt too far behind

>>162248535
Nasu states any servant could kill her.

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>>162248547
I am Future

>>162235618

>Caren inherits all the BS, with no circuits as compensation
>gets raised in convent that treats her like a heretic and sends her out to accosted by demons as a makeshift dragon radar
>they won't even teach her to read

Kirei just keeps adding onto his karmic retribution list.

>>162235447
>he's too much of a goody two shoes
But the point is if he had studied magecraft under zouken his entire outlook on life would be different. I can totally imagine kariya being the way the previous anon described if he had been studying under zouken for quite a few years.

>>162249346

It said in one of the material books that he left the Matou's because their magecraft practices were distasteful, and that Kariya would have taken it up if Zouken wasn't such a corrupt bastard.

Zouken just ain't teacher material, the understatement of the year there if there ever was one. Hell, even in Hollow Sakura goes, "fuck this" and trains with Dilo and finds great success in only six months on the way to fixing Zouken's 11 years of damage.

>>162244017

see:
>>162235284

>>162233696
he was disgusted with Magi in general

>>162249647

You have to also consider though that Tokiomi basically had Sakura as a failsafe for Rin possibly dying to an illness when she was young. Therefore when Rin survived, Sakura lost the safety net she had right when she was born just for being special and unfortunately being born second.

As far as we know, Tokiomi never really looked for a suitable place either until Zouken offered, so you have bad family planning and negligence under his belt.

I mean, give him all the excuses you want, but he just put her in a no win situation from birth, and then tossed her away to some family he had no earthly idea would even bother training her, was by his admission corrupt, and he assumed they'd never waste her potential, but magus thinking blocked him from thinking in any alternative way.

"What if they DO use her as research material like they would at the Association, maybe keeping an eye on the Makiri would be smart, Zouken has a history of rather distasteful methodologies." is actually a logical thing to think. His flaw, which is a genuine flaw, is that he thought just because Matou declined that she would be made their heir. That was all his mind was on.

Sakura's whole thing is that pain is one thing, but her life has been pain with no benefit or worth to it. Tokiomi would really have nothing he could say to her even if he lived. But she herself found her own mentor, and reworked her life in spite of that negligence, which is great.

Why was the mother okay with Sakura being raped by worms?

>>162250539
Aoi was a fucking doormat, she just agreed with whatever Tokiomi said

>>162250171
Then marry Sakura off to a prestigious family, then their family line can carry on through her child. Tokiomi's just a retard who just wanted as many people as possible to be on his family's side during the next Heaven's Feel

>>162252372

He wasn't thinking of Sakura bring on his family's side, he was thinking of her as a stepping stone. By having his genes, he lives vicariously through her.

Which makes it much more insulting that many people who argue about Sakura's agency, forget this part when they defend Tokiomi. She was a cog in the machine.

Rin, fortunately enough reaped a lit of the benefits of that archaic mindset, while Sakura, well, didn't.

Marrying her off doesn't protect her from people wanting to exploit her in that world, she needs to be the head of the family, not just the wife. The issue is again, Tokiomi didn't think about the long term of what he would do if he had more than one talented daughter.

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Pitou did nothing wrong and deserved better

>>162231905
Even if you ignore everything else that went on, the guy on the left was conspiring with the referees to game the Grail War. Wasn't that the wrong thing to do?

>>162241342
>Isn't the character, the servant gets random according to how he was in life?
That's only if you summon without an artifact.

Tohsaka went out of his way to find the first snake skin ever shed (after it ate Gil's fruit of eternal life).

Summoning without a catalyst will get you a servant who's personality/character/life is like your own. Sakura summoned Rider like that. In a way it's good because the servant emphasizes with the master. However, you don't always guarantee to summon a strong servant and thus isn't advised.

>>162253723
Why is this ant so cute?