Here is the infamous interview of Toriyama from Saikyou; Jump #3, 2014 where he basically said Goku doesn't give a shit about his family:
>Since Saiyans are supposed to have no affection for family or friends, does this actually make Vegeta, who holds his family and wife dear, an even stranger (kinder) Saiyan than Goku?
>Vegeta, whose pride had been deeply wounded, sought help from Bulma, and little by little, his ruthless personality changed. Nowadays, you certainly might be able to say that [Vegeta holds his family and wife dear]. On the other hand, Goku might not have a sense of family members like Gohan and Chi-Chi except as one of his companions.
>Normally, Saiyans don’t have much of a notion of romance or marriage, and apart from the royal family of Vegeta, they aren’t particular about blood-relationships. Being in among all that, I suppose you could say that the pair of Bardock and Gine were those rare Saiyans who were joined by a bond other than for reproductive purposes.
Since then we had such shocking reveals like Goku talking shit about Gohan for not being at the tournament (behind his back no less... like a hoe), not knowing what kissing is, doesn't care that Black killed his family in the manga, and wasn't even around for his unborn children (Goten is understandable but Gohan...?!).
Notice how in Z Goku appears to care a lot for Gohan (at least until the Buu saga, where he barely gives Goten any attention). When Raditz kidnaps Gohan, Goku flips his shit. When Cell shows up, Goku acts fatherly and tries to get Gohan to believe in himself.
I honestly believe that part of why Super is so shit is because Toriyama, after nearly 20 years of not writing Dragonball, developed a distorted view of his own characters and then applied it as if it were the case all along. If you were to show him Z and the original Dragonball, his reaction would probably be "That's not Goku [raughs]".
Blue balls are what happens when you get aroused without release.
Black balls are what happens when your balls are cut off from your bloodstream and develop necrosis.
This makes a lot of sense actually. Even in the original series in the second arc Goku not only befriends an android begging for mercy finding him a better home but also uses his grandfather's that revolved around the entirety of fighting the Red Ribbon army just to wish someone he just met father back to life. In fact when the series was trying to movie on from Goku (after cell sacrifice) he states a lot of the bad things that happen to earth happen because he attracts so much attention and decides to give up his life to ensure a better life for everyone
>LMAO Goku is hiring a hitman onto himself
Toriyama made Super because he was buttblasted after Evolution movie, one thing that bothered him is that in the movie the whole dragonball universe is a backstory and it all boils down to good vs evil, so he wants to make goku "grey area".
Ofc if you ask the fans that is probably the last thing they noticed in Evolution but whatever,.
>wasn't even around for his unborn children (Goten is understandable but Gohan...?!)
This doesn't even make any goddamn sense. There was nothing to suggest that during the timeskip between Demon Jr and Raditz that Goku was doing anything other than being a family man.
Toriyama really fucking hates Goku for some reason and Super has basically been a 90 episode character assassination.
What the fuck is so bad about Goku being a good person? I get that he's not the Superman analog he was in the Funimation dub but god damn. In Super he's oblivious at best, uncaring at worst.
Honestly, I feel like Vegeta is no better off than Goku. Vegeta's character arc was finished in the Buu saga when he finally admitted that he loves his family and that he'll never be as good as Goku, so there's really nothing left for him to do in Super other than be quasi-grumpy and give Goku someone to train with.
Piccolo is arguable but it's probably Vegeta
Perhaps he's upset that people think of Goku as a super do-gooder. He's a heroic character but people didn't note the things about him that made him interesting. Oda got DB well, Luffy is probably the most Goku-esque protagonist in shonen.
>Toriyama, after nearly 20 years of not writing Dragonball, developed a distorted view of his own characters and then applied it as if it were the case all along.
This reminds me of that shitty Green Hornet movie. It played into every lazy stereotype about the source material.
>HEY GUYS ISN'T IT HILARIOUS THAT KATO DOES ALL THE WORK LMAO
The universe in the original Dragonball manga was defined by good and evil morality. Only Vegeta and Piccolo stood out as morally grey because they transitioned from villain to hero over the course of the story.
Goku was going to fucking offer Chichi to Old Kai if it wasn't for the fact that her breasts are sagging and that she was going to yell at him over it. That's why he offered Bulma instead.
Bulma had character development to go with her change in fashion.
Gohan also transitioned from sheltered kid to well adjusted adult who fight to protect his family and loved ones.
Yes, it means he's losing at something. People also forget Goku loathes betrayal, though he would probably hate himself instead of Chi-Chi.
This is all moot because Chi-Chi would never do that, you scum.
>one thing that bothered him is that [...] it all boils down to good vs evil
A pretty weird complaint coming from the guy who made one of Goku's ultimate techniques a literal ball of goodness that would only harm the evil and leave the pure of heart unharmed.
He really is getting senile.
What new guy? That was in both the Toyotaro manga and the Toei anime. If both share this plotpoint, it's almost certainly the idea of Toriyama.
>yfw DBZ Abridged is more canon than Funi's dub
Dubfags BTFO. I knew all along that Goku was a shitty husband and a shitty dad.
Nothing, Goku has always been portrayed as a good person who let his pride as a martial artist and love for fighting override his good judgment, which puts the universe at risk. Super's problem is that it doesn't give Goku a moment where he's portrayed as angry, vengeful, and conflicted, just like when he spared Freeza in Namek.
You're underestimating how much Goku values relationships and overplaying the "Goku is just a selfish retard" maymay. Even a moron like Goku could tell Chi-Chi of all people messing with other men means the relationship has taken an incredible turn. And it wouldn't be hard to convince him to try to fix it in his bumbling, good hearted way.
That's so fucking retard, considering Goku always saw himself as an Earthling. Being carefree and addicted to training doesn't mean he never have a shit about his family.
I hate how modern Toei pretty much made Goku the cliché dumb shonen MC.
>Even a moron like Goku could tell Chi-Chi of all people messing with other men means the relationship has taken an incredible turn
Z Goku, maybe. Super Goku hasn't even figured out that spouses are supposed to kiss.
>how much Goku values relationships and overplaying the "Goku is just a selfish retard" maymay.
Not even talking about that. I'm saying Goku doesn't give a flying fuck about romantic relationships. He sees Chichi (his whole family actually) as one of his friends.
I mean, you could argue that he gave more of a shit about Gohan when he was a kid. Now he's a grown man with his own family who can fend for himself, and that may be why he doesn't really give a shit anymore.
>Super's problem is that it doesn't give Goku a moment where he's portrayed as angry, vengeful, and conflicted, just like when he spared Freeza in Namek.
We can't have moments like this anymore, anon. It would give the impression that Goku is a three dimensional character and not an uncaring simpleton.
Found it. Goku is saying she's "flat-chested" in this translation but in the Japanese version he says her breasts are sagging.
>HURR DURR WHAT'S A KISS
I think Toriyama may have confused this Goku with the Goku that's 30 years older and has two children.
Goku was portrayed as a loving husband and doting parent way before Funi did the dub. The original anime gave additional scenes showing that he does care about his loved ones. Gohan especially acted a little like goku and is shown to wear the same Gi as him as early as the Saiyan Saga, and more eager to go off on wild adventures than study. It came at the expense of making Chi Chi look irrational and too strict.
>Villian who killed your best friend+race/fathers and probably billions is on the ground defeated
>you give him energy out of pity
>stills looks sad after "putting him down" even when he was attacked with the energy he gave out of the kindness Freeza never showed
Blackballing means basically the same as blacklisting.
Goku was just saying that to appease Vegeta. We can see that's not true.
I can imagine him performing a wicked 69 with her. That should be at least something to fall back on with how Goku is written in Super.
The franchise was handled with the subtlety of a Saturn rocket launching.
Goku and Bulma always made more sense, and maybe a more tight and smaller cast of characters would be better.
This scene happened after Goku thoroughly beat Freiza physically and mentally. The ass kicking in that saga was so thorough that the emperor has nam-tier flashbacks whenever another Super Saiyan shows up.
Don't need to. Her bust is visible even with the baggy clothes she wears.
I'd like to point out that this is Goku's reaction to his son being kidnapped.
This is his reaction to his friends being KILLED. He's pissed, but he's not flying off the handle running in half-cocked.
Wouldn't you say that there's a noticeable difference here, and that maybe Goku has a different level of affection for his son?
Weird isn't it, I didn't like GT at all and never finished it, but I really did like Dadgeta and Chadten
>watched Dragon Ball and DBZ
>think Goku and Chichi are a cute couple
>spend the next 15 years getting cucked by how much Toriyama hates both of them
just kill me end the suffering
He's still a valid rival
if it were'nt for plot armor and writers always sucking Goku's dickwhile constantly making it bigger and bigger with different colored hair each time.
>Goku lends his wife to Freezer and
Billsso she can give birth to a strong opponent
GT did Vegeta right. He's no longer obsessed with overcoming Goku but that doesn't mean he's content to just sit back, he still trains and tries to get stronger for his own sake.
Battle of Gods was the last thing that did Vegeta right imo - Vegeta throws away his pride to entertain Beerus to protect his family, because that's his main priority now.
I refuse to believe that Gohan is actually Gokus son. Seeing how much of an ass Goku is, she probably must have fucked some other Saiyan or something and then just made Goku raise him as his own
Also, Toriyama cared enough to change Shin's personality in the manga to make him more serious and presentable than in the Buu Saga. If Goku's personality were off, he'd have done something about it.
He hates his own creation because his famdom is too retarded to stop begging for more shitty fight scenes instead of letting it end with a good end.
I understand him, I would trash talk about my own characters after seeing how retarded the people that likes my creation is.
He is destroying the characters on purpose.