I just watched bakemonogatari, is this series meant to be harem shit?

>>160851790
not really. the only genuine romantic vying/tension is araragi vs. kanbaru for senjo and hanekawa vs senjo for araragi. Rest of the storylines have nothing to do with a girl wanting araragi or vice versa.

>>160851790
I just saw this thread, is this thread meant to be weak bait based on some troll harem comment you saw in the Monogatari thread yesterday?

>>160852253
and hanekawa's arc with araragi is more about their mutually broken personalities and attempts to fix themselves.

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>>160851790
Yes, it's the birth story of Senjougahara's harem.

>>160852253
You don't need romantic tension/rivalry for it to be a harem. That's the usual M.O for harem anime though, sure.

I'm not sure what the issue with the series being a harem is though.

I tried to watch it recently too. Shame it's like powerpoint presentation sometimes.

>>160852306
senpai, im legitimately watching it for the first time and just noticed that conveniently all the females are in love with Araragi excluding his sisters.

>>160852681
>excluding his sisters
Hah.

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Araragi's bros > Araragi's hoes

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>>160853000
Aside from how much, who else are Araragi's bros?

Don't say Meme, he's part of the harem. Hachikuji confirmed it.

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>>160853235
Snail, post hana monkey, doll

tfw no child to play to play twister with.

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>>160853384
forgot the image.

>just watched
Underage b&

>>160851790
Too deep for you?

>>160854871

The harem shit is making it deeper then the Mariana trench

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It's not just a harem, it's a deconstruction of the harem genre.

>>160855598
what fucking appendage is that? it's just a cylinder of flesh

>>160855937
I think it's an upper arm.

>>160855598
pretty big canvas of flesh for Tyrone to look at once this fatbody get jailed for something.

>>160856011
I mean, is 2d considered pedophilia materials? You can certainly be arrested for possessing underage porn.

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>>160856083
In places like the UK its definitely considered underage content, there have already been people arrested for it.

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>>160851790
It's a good harem

>>160852681
Kanbaru is 100% gay and is only screwing with him. There's also another girl later down the line who despises him.

>>160852681
>excluding his sisters.

Objectively wrong.

>>160856721
Kanbaru wants Koyomi's cock and all the main girls do too.

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>>160856673
It's amazing how Senjyogahara hasn't killed him yet.

>>160855598
Poor birb getting left out of the loli-harem

>>160856673
Araragi is so smooth. I wish I was a cute little girl that he was hitting on.

>>160851790
Pretty much every female in the show is into the nice bland MC that solves their problems. So yeah, it's a harem but it's less shit than the average harem.

>>160856809
As long as she's number one in his heart she doesn't give a fuck what he does. She knew he was a weirdo pervert when they started dating.

>>160856806
Kanbaru is just a pervert. The only reason she's a Fujoshi is because if girls should love girls then boys should love boys.

>>160855937
Left thigh, I think.

>>160856920
>araragi
>bland

He's a lot of things, but bland isn't one of them. He does suffer from terminal nice guy syndrome though

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>>160856920
>Araragi
>Bland
Dude is 100% the best harem MC

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>>160856942
>As long as she's number one in his heart

>>160856983
>>160856980
Bland in the sense he doesn't have a meaningful internal or external conflict, he is meant to be a witty self-insert.

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>>160856721
Kanbaru fell for ragi herself

>>160857079
You mean the guy that started the story by basically killing himself?

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>>160857079
>he doesn't have a meaningful internal or external conflict
How do you miss this many plot points?

>>160857079
>Bland in the sense he doesn't have a meaningful internal or external conflict,
The whole vampire-turning shenanigans + knowing about literal ghosts that no one else should be aware = "no conflict"?

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>>160857011
Reminder that Senjyogahara is the only girl to have romantic conversations with Araragi.

>>160856980
>He does suffer from terminal nice guy syndrome though
Nah, nice dont have a crazy tsundere girlfriend and 6 other chicks as back up wanting to fuck him

>>160857274
Are you false flagging to make crabfags look retarded, or are you actually this stupid?

>>160856721
They both admit that if they met earlier on they'd probably be dating each other back in Nadeko Snake, for what it's worth.

>who despises him
Uses that as a crutch to motivate her to keep living, and Araragi accepts that role. She does enjoy hanging around with him, that's what she hates if anything.

Also ends up being the most comparitively 'normal' friendship in the entire series later on, somehow.

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>>160857079
Imagine being this dumb.

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>>160857079
Around 2/3rds of the main series revolves or hovers around an internal conflict of his, keep watching anon.

This series is haremshit through and through, but it does end up fleshing out most of it's cast decently enough.

>>160857180
>>160857140
>>160857422
He is solving girls' supernatural problems and/or mental hang-ups for 95% of the run time because he is the kind harem MC. I like the show, I'm just not being delusional about it.

>>160857155
I still have to watch Kyo, but 50+ episodes I've seen have been like I described.

>>160857522
Which season do you mean?

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Kaka

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>>160857389
Am I?

>>160857677
Try watching the series to watch the series instead of background noise for League of Legends.

>>160857677
>Which season do you mean?
Pretty much everything after Nise. Also Kizu which was supposed to be animated before it. Owari's what ties everything together (you'll see how when the rest of it is animated) but Kizu is very much a Koyomi story (LN more than the anime which cuts out most of his internal monologue, but what I'm talking about is still there) and Second Season is the start of everything constantly backfiring on Koyomi and a character extremely central to the internal conflict of his that I'm talking about showing up.

>>160856920
the only people who genuinely into Araragi romantically are Hanekawa (only for half the show) and Senjo. The rest of it is played for comedy.

>>160857079
see takes like these are why this series fucked up by not just starting with kizu. Really dumb decision.

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>>160857886

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tfw no loli to sexual molest.

>>160857985
saying shinobu is into araragi romantically after kizu seems like a pretty big misreading of their relationship.

>>160858026
even during kizu, she was mostly manipulating him to get him to kill her.

>>160857886
The sisters and Doll are the only ones that were played for comedy.
Nadeko's the only one who wasn't into him romantically.
Hanekawa still hasn't sorted out her feelings for him (you'd think that was the point of Tiger's ending, right?), she may have changed by Musubi though for all I know. Still thinks of him in a romantic sense atleast as far as into Owari timeline wise going by Tsubasa Sleeping, she just won't go for him if he's with someone else.

>>160858215
>Hanekawa still hasn't sorted out her feelings for him (you'd think that was the point of Tiger's ending, right?), she may have changed by Musubi though for all I know. Still thinks of him in a romantic sense atleast as far as into Owari timeline wise going by Tsubasa Sleeping, she just won't go for him if he's with someone else.


Yeah you would, where is the rest of this from?

>>160858026
>>160858070
The romantic interest is there, even if the parts of their relationship they really want at the moment aren't about that.

>>160858215
also, kanbaru and hachikuji are definitely played for comedy.

>>160858341
I think the closest they've ever been to romance was on top of the roof in Kizu, and even that wasn't quite romance imo, due to Shinobu's ulterior motives. It was mostly about the absurdity of their situation and reverie in a momentarily equalized power dynamic.

>>160858307
>It seemed High-Waist had opted to go first, so before Low-Rise, she moved to tear off a piece of my body.
>She casually grabbed my left breast.
>Stop it. Let go.
>"The only one who can touch me there—is Araragi-kun."
This was during her search for Meme.

>>160858343
>Kanbaru
She's into him but it's seen as a moot point because they only meet because he's dating Gahara, so nothing could happen even theoretically anyway. Talked about in Nadeko Snake, cut out of the anime though. Then go look at Suruga Devil which is told from her perspective, the amount and way she thinks of Araragi is not normal for someone who's just a friend. Not talking about the fanservice here, in general for all characters that is for comedy, sure.

>Snail
I mean, Happy Bite's lyrics literally have her saying that she loves him. She says the same thing at the end of Shinobu Time too.

>>160858215
Ougi too but maybe you're not counting her given the sort of character she is and all.

>>160858471
Araragi's subconscious literally manifests and tells him that he's in love with Shinobu. Meanwhile Shinobu has bet her entire life on Araragi and is extremely concerned about being loyal to him, keeping him happy, and being number one in his heart. You can't say that there isn't a bit of romance going on there.

>>160858726
>Meanwhile Shinobu has bet her entire life on Araragi

er, she didn't exactly do so willingly.
and this

>being number one in his heart
certainly can't be interpreted romantically since senjo is araragi's actual girlfriend.

I think they have a complicated relationship that isn't really summarized by "mutual affection", like senjo x araragi. They obviously both care about one another (and have to, given their circumstances), but Shinobu outright says in kabukimonogatari that if she regained enough of her power, she's more likely to just outright betray araragi.

>>160858870
>she didn't exactly do so willingly
You're still stuck in the Bake/Nise mindset. They've already put that little spat behind them.

>certainly can't be interpreted romantically since senjo is araragi's actual girlfriend
You're a child if you think that having a girlfriend stops any other sort of romantic interest.

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>>160858870
>certainly can't be interpreted romantically since senjo is araragi's actual girlfriend.
Shinobu can't be his actual girlfriend, she's a little vampire girl who lives in his shadow. Not even a Batfag but I've never understood this argument people make.

>>160858523
The stuff with Kanbaru isn't really "romance", though it could've been under different circumstances. Shaft downplays the little running gags about how they come off as a cute couple all the time (they butchered Nadeko Snake completely really, you still get people who keep saying that she only likes Araragi because it's the closest she'll get to banging Senjou despite everything she says in this arc about that)

>>160859136
Because there's a difference between having romantic interest and being in a boyfriend-girlfriend relationship. Why are you even watching Monogatari if you're going to take such a black and white view on human relationships?

>>160859219
>Because there's a difference between having romantic interest and being in a boyfriend-girlfriend relationship
I'm not the one saying that there isn't a difference? The person I'm replying to is the one saying that his relationship with Shinobu isn't romantic because she isn't his girlfriend.

>>160858870
>but Shinobu outright says in kabukimonogatari that if she regained enough of her power, she's more likely to just outright betray araragi.
She gets back her full power later on and doesn't do that.

>>160859277
Oh. Whoops.

https://my.mixtape.moe/ryabhj.webm

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>>160852681
> excluding his sisters.

>>160852253
>Rest of the storylines have nothing to do with a girl wanting araragi
What? The second season's final arc involved a girl turned god wanting araragi's dick so bad she'd kill for it. Literally.

>>160859136
>Araragi stays in contact with Kanbaru over the phone after he can't visit her in person anymore during Hana
>Senjougahara doesn't, and Kanbaru lost contact with her completely during this period

>Araragi mentions how he, Sodachi, and Senjougahara became friends during college
>only thing we actually know about it is that Araragi and Sodachi were sort-of close and Gahara got jealous of them to the point of dying her hair to match Sodachi's

I feel like Nisio wants people to dislike Senjougahara sometimes.

>>160853427
shit fucking taste senpai

>>160859516
Remember that Senjyogahara didn't really even want Kanbaru back in her life.

>>160859516
>Gahara got jealous of them to the point of dying her hair to match Sodachi's
Just end the series already this shit is retarded

>>160858107
That face at the end gets me every time

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>>160859374
cat is a walking porno

>>160859433
Yeah but that's the thing, it's honest with it.

The girl wants his dick, and they openly say that. It doesn't dance around the issue and have all the girls go "e-eh ecchi?" They have normal interactions with him and also accept he has a girlfriend or don't like nadeko but she got an arc dealing with that.

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>>160859582
Yes, it won't help her without also adding beautiful twintails.

>>160859433
It was about her running away from her life so hard she would kill for it.

>>160851790
I just finished Snail-chan and I am really looking forward to Snake-chan, who is best girl by default.

>>160851790
It's more or less a harem, but it's more than that.
Generally, harem shows aren't as cinematically virtuous as Bakemonogatari.

>>160859516
Kanbaru was her crazy stalker to be fair. A bit sad when looking at things from Kanbaru's perspective perhaps, but remember that Araragi is an in-canon bona fide weirdo himself and the fact that Kanbaru gets along with him so well (if I remember right Gahara didn't actually expect the two to get along THAT well) speaks for itself in that regard. Best OTP.

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>>160859637
I generally dislike cowtits, but Cat does things to my primitive instincts.

>>160859892
Oh boy are you in for a surprise in a couple seasons.

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>>160859927

>>160857684
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZeCWpKeWfKw

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>>160859945
Oh fuck, I really hope I can cope with THAT

>>160859920
>Best OTP
Agree, they probably have the best chemistry in the whole series

>>160857677
>Araragi
>Solving anyones problems

How does it feel knowing you wasted more than 20 hours of your life by completely missing the fucking point.

>>160859991
>ghost
>loli
>white supremacist
Snail is the perfect woman.

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>>160860128
He did a good job with Hachikuji, who according to Meme no one would bother dealing with due to being such a harmless oddity, The negative effect of that was something borne out of her actions and not his, technically.

>>160860222
He also did a good job with Shinobu- eventually. She definitely had to do a ton of her own work though.

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>>160857886
>>160858026
In Kizu their relationship was very complicated, it was a sad sort of bond between the suicidal monster that was Kissshot and the inexperienced young Arararagi.

However, that all changes from Nise onward. Shinobu loves Arararagi very deeply and he loves her back. The only thing stopping it from being more overtly romantic is that Arararagi still cherishes his humanity and a normal life, and Crab is part of that life.

That said, when faced with a choice, he's consistently chosen Shinobu over everything else. He'll also never be happy with a truly normal life, he's become too accustomed to the paranormal. There's only one logical conclusion to all that.

>>160859433
You missed the point and misunderstood her character

>>160859516
>sort-of close
With Araragi fondling girls he's almost just met, let's not pretend that "sort-of close" doesn't mean something along the lines of "tits suffocation"

>>160860222
>gets Japanese Truck'd
>wanders around aimlessly alone for 20 years until she finally meets a nice guy who helps set her free, decides to hang out with him for a bit
>enjoys his company, loses track of time and results in anti-contradiction existence ball thing to appear to try and destroy her
>has to leave to escape getting erased, gets sent to Buddhist Hell for dying before her parents did
She gets her happy ending eventually thanks to rrragi & Gaen but fucking hell she did not deserve all that.

>>160860514
Sodachi's the only character where that could be argued to be apt, maybe it's different in that stoory but everywhere else Koyomi doesn't even lewd her.

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Do they end up fucking or do they actually finish the innings?

>>160860674
It's left to the viewer's interpretation, they did continue the lewdness but I don't think there was penetration based on Arararagi's later comments. Maybe oral.

>>160852681
based on that I coud say that Haruhi and True Tears are harem

but yes, bakemono series is harem shit

>>160852681
>excluding his sisters.
Oh boy are you in for a surprise.

>>160860644
Araragi never really lewds Sodachi in any story. He even says he doesn't see her as a member of the opposite sex. They basically have something close to a normal siblings relationship.

>>160860892
Well, that's just what she wants.

>>160860892
>normal sibling relationship
You see, if this wasn't about Araragi all of these things you're saying would mean a lot more

>>160860892
>he even says he doesn't see her as a member of the opposite sex

That's just his mental gymnastics for justifying not telling his girlfriend that his childhood crush is living with him

>>160855937
It's a fat girl arm - posterior area, you can tell by the weak shoulders and cellulite. Male fat is more cubic, female fat is circular.

>>160861045
wena nido

>>160861063
We can't really know since all the times they met were told from Araragi's perspective. If there was a Senjougahara college story it would give a better perspective of the other side. Or from Sodachi herself, but she is a very unreliable narrator so it wouldn't say much about Araragi.

That would have to be after monster season though.

>>160858026
>>160858070
>>160858471
She was willing to give up killing herself if he decided to stay by her side. Their relatioship is pretty complicated, but there is definitely some romantic tension going on.

Kaiki was right. People that got tricked by him absolutely deserved it.
They sold their belief for what they considered a reasonable price.

>>160861547
All the people he tricked were dumbfuck pre-teen children anon. It's not a matter of them deserving it or not when they don't know any better.

Not hating on Kaiki here but there's not particularly anything 'right' or sympathetic about anything he does or says. I think he is supposed to be sympathetic in Second Season but I didn't feel like he was personally.

>>160861547
Even he doesn't believe that. He speaks even more self-feeding bullshit than Araragi does (think that's the point with him, he's what Araragi would be like if he kept swallowing his own nonsense and never got close to anyone)

The show distinguishes the funny parts and the serious parts of the show and you need to understand the difference and not mistake the two.

>Shinobu
Partner for the rest of his existence. To say she's his gf or mistress or whatever is taking their relationship too lightly. They only have eachother in their immortality and it's not a romantic relationship in the traditional sense.
>Senjougahara
His actual romantic interest and gf. She's part of his human life and Shinobu is not competing with her. They love eachother and he wouldn't cheat on her.
>Hanekawa
She is/was into raragi but he is together with Senjougahara and is therefore not interested in pursuing Hanekawa. They have had a complicated past but they're just friends, with some friction between her and Senjougahara. When Araragi lewds her (after senjo) it's just played up for comedy and should not be taken as him trying to cheat or having an actual interest. Even before senjo he didn't consider her an actual possible gf.

These are the only characters that could be argued is romantically involved with Araragi. When he is being lewd or suggestive with anyone else it's not like he actually tries to get any. Kanbaru is to Senjo what Hanekawa is to Araragi. The show is self-aware and the harem part is done ironically. Much of the ecchi/fanservice with the other girls aren't done cheaply but either fits the scene, the characters or is funny. Things like the toothbrush scene representing that she actually blew him is ridiculous to me because that would go against the whole show and the way it works.

I think the best example of the contrast between lightheartedness and seriousness is seen in the episode when Senjougahara takes Araragi to see the stars. In the car ride there she's rubbing him and being lewd in front of her father because it would freak him out and it's funny. Later however she reveals how vulnerable she is and it's obvious that she might not be ready for sex, so she was just bluffing in the car.

>>160861674
Isn't that sorta the thing though. They don't know better, they mess with charms in a series where monsters very assuredly do exist and that charms can fuck your day up pretty bad.
In giving Kaiki money, they are saying "My belief in this is worth this much".

>>160861818
I'm sure he believes that people are selling out their belief by using his services. It's the crux of his business.
However your statement about him being Araragi is only half correct. Yozuru, Oshino and Kaiki are all different end games Araragi could have taken had his life gone differently.

>>160861914
>Isn't that sorta the thing though.
Nope. They're dumbfuck kids who don't know any better, can't attribute value to their belief in anything. It's just your more standard case of him taking advantage of their stupidity, nothing more no matter how much he dresses it up like he does everything else.

>>160860892
>Hey, Araragi? If we're still single by the time we're thirty...
>Let's strangle each other to death.
Math fairy a best

>>160862087
Then why give those kids money in the first place to buy charms. They obviously cannot be trusted to make decisions on their own.
If they want to give a shady old man some cash to tell them that they're not actually cursed then by giving them that income you've implied they are responsible enough to spend that cash how they wish.

>>160862090
I want to be strangled by the Math!

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>no doujins where Math and Crab take turns stepping on Araragi
Mrgrgr

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>>160862090
And in shinobumonogatari:
"Sodachi, be my slave tonight too and please handmake a meal for me,"
"Don't think you'll even live till tonight."
Hangs up.

>>160862172
>If they want
Doesn't matter what they want, they're dumbfuck kids who don't know any better. Can't attribute any sort of intentional responsibility to what they're doing if they don't know any better, it's not hard to understand. It's Kaiki taking advantage of them being dumb kids.

The "oddities don't exist" oddity buster who runs away from everything in his life does a lot of mental gymnastics, go figure.

>>160862382
>It's Kaiki taking advantage of them being dumb kids.

I mean I fail to see the issue here. It's easier to get money out of kids because they're dumb so that's just smart business.
By the same token they're also learning a very important lesson about life.

All and all, everyone comes out a winner.

I'm at Shinobu Time right now, should I stop watching Second Season to watch Kizu? What's the best time to watch Kizu?

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>>160862559

>>160862559
Where you are now, I'd say finish off Second Season, then watch it before Owari. Ideally you would have watched it right after Bake.

Ignore the shitty watch order in >>160862605 made by a retarded Redditor.

>>160862654
Why wouldn't you follow release order?

>>160861890
>The show distinguishes the funny parts and the serious parts of the show and you need to understand the difference and not mistake the two
You're not wrong but people readily ignore that to suit whatever they're saying. Hachikuji did love the guy for example, as much as it makes some people uncomfortable evidently.

Also this weird need to insist that Araragi has a "more normal" relationship with some characters as if he's a normal guy himself even after disregarding the supernatural stuff. There you get the opposite extreme of people writing off most of the series as "just for comedy".

>>160862673
Because Kizu was unintentionally delayed for 6 years due to production issues. In novel release order it was right after Bake and the rest of the series was written expecting the audience to have read it at that point.

Anyone know what the transitions mean? Like "Red Scene" "White Scene", Brown, Black, etc

I remember reading some post about how a certain color represented Araragi's imagination or whatever

>>160862528
>I mean I fail to see the issue here
I'm talking to someone dressing up what he's doing with the backwards ass reasoning Kaiki gives to justify it to himself. It's just him taking advantage of dumb kids. Absolutely nothing more.

>>160862725
They're just pauses for dramatic effect. The color is based off of emotions and/or the characters in the scene.

>>160862677
>Hachikuji did love the guy for example, as much as it makes some people uncomfortable evidently.
She absolutely did love the him but couldn't it have been as a friend?

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Why did Hanekawa turning neko do weird things to my peepee?

Should I be concerned?

>>160862810
You've gotta be an absolute social autist to think Snail saw Araragi as just "friends"

>>160862810
That kiss and what she said around that didn't seem platonic to me.

>>160862771
I've always thought they give hit as to the type of narrator bias present in the scene.

>>160862810
t. Araragi

>>160862823
Probably just a common TF fetish.

Or you're just attracted to Black Hanekawa but not regular Hanekawa and find the idea of something you don't find sexy turning into something you do inherently arousing.

>>160862903
They show Araragi's emotional state sometimes, but there's no hard or fast rule to it. Red scenes are sometimes anger, sometimes pain, or hey this scene has something to do with blood. Black is more neutral. Sometimes you'll get a Yellow scene when talking to karen or Shinobu. It's super tenuous to try to pull any solid meaning out of a color choice.

Nadeko's OP is probably the only OP i have ever enjoyed.

Who is the worst girl?

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>>160863097
>He didn't like Hitagi End's
You're the world's biggest shitter.

>>160863146
Probably Doll. I'm not into lolis and even if she was a grown woman nothing about her is attractive to me.

She's still bro tier though. Would "yeah peace" with.

>>160862858
You're right. It's just played up as a friendship through 95% of the show but I rewatched >>160862900 and it makes it clear. Original post was more about how the show isn't a very traditional harem and that there's more to it.

>>160858523

This is a good example from that same chapter:

>As if they’d seen a monstrous apparition, the vampire twins, High-Waist and Low-Rise stared at me through bloodshot eyes—this time, they stared at me, not each other.

“What are you?” “?uoy era tahW”

They accused me.

“A specialist?” “?tsilaiceps A”

“Or a vampire?” “?eripmav a rO”

“No, I’m a high school girl from Japan.”

I answered.
“I would love some help to be happy just being friends with the boy I like…”

Seems she is trying to forget her feelings and stay friends with Araragi, so she is trying to move forward. She's pretty much Araragi's mom to a point, it's not like he doesn't seek her advice a lot too. Senjougahara is still pretty close to her as well.

>>160863151
>>160863146
Hitagi is the worst, every scene with her grinds my gears.

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>>160863400

>>160862721
Besides that, is release order the way to go in your opinion? If you go by novels then Hana is after kabuki and koyomi after tsuki.

>>160863045
I do find Black pretty hot yeah, but that scene seriously made my stuff feel unlike how it has ever felt like before, and I've seen plenty of hot (2D) girls. I'm not even into TF, I think.

>>160863514
Were you more aroused at the Tongue Twister scene or the TF?

>>160863452
The effect of those order swaps on the story is much, much less. You can do whatever is easier for you to remember. Kizu is way further out of order in the anime and the events get callbacks all the time.

>>160863610
TF scene but that may actually be because I didn't expect the neko to appear so quickly now that I think of it.

>>160863826
Well then go on /d/ and see if anything gets your fancy

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>>160863826
Well, I guess Monogatari delivers more transformation.

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>>160863987
Whoops, that was the short version.

>>160864016
This web.m was the original reason I started watching this show.

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shit series, shit for liking said show, etc.

>>160864131
so i shouldnt watch it? i want ecchi scenes though. And its a fucking massive series that is like a requirement to watch to be a jp fag. Is it really that bad?

>>160863987
The funny thing is, that scene did almost nothing to me.

>>160864291
Some people can't get into it. Or they get put off by the style and never give it a fair shot. Plenty of other people love it. Give it a shot.

>>160864291
I heard the show was 2deep4u but after first and second season it turns out everyone who thought that where literally brainlets.

You a brainlet huh?!

>>160864633
nah just had the whole monogatari shit in my massive queue for ages and never starting watching it, looks good though.

>>160864291
It has a lot of banter between the characters and is mostly focused on that in the beginning. If you don't mind that then I say go for it.

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>>160864291
It's obvious bait posting this in a gatari thread.
Go and watch it, anon.

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;-;

>>160865340
Most heart wrenching scene in the whole series.

>>160865340
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-zzGPpju9vs&t=29s&list=PLeC67YIuW2taRcIE9ztMkgOVARDwaj6WY&index=91

It still hurts.

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>>160851790

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>>160865488
Something can be porn and also well written, Anon. I'm not saying it's going to win awards or anything

>>160865944
>I kinda hate lolis
I don't understand how this is possible.

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>>160851790

The Only thing I like about Monogatari is Mayoi(only the personality I kinda hate lolis) and hanekawa.I don't like the franchise it's repetetive, kinda boring, has too much spin offs and episodes

>>160866030
>don't understand how this is possible
I hate lewd lolis even more.Normal lolis are fine if they arent there for the bait or aren't just idk weird..

>>160864050
same desu

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il be autist incapable of googling, but has this whole series ended yet?

>>160866645
It "ended" then the author said "well, just a few more side stories" and fast forward a couple years and he's planned out 10 books past the "ending."

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>>160866645
I refuse to spoon-feed you.

>>160866645
fyi its a shit series, i wouldnt waste my time with it, too late of course for me. Save your self.

>>160857079
yes, because he was a friendless loser because he had no hangups or emotional problems; the whole Kizu arc was about Araragi realizing friendship and empathy wasn't "weakening" his humanity, it was the most important part of being human. The whole central conflict with Shinobu was over this problem.

Its why he hit it off so well with Hanakawa, she basically views herself in the same way, they both have zero self esteem, zero friends, and are completely unhappy with their current life. Araragi to the point he thought he was committing suicide for his "ideals" while Hanakawa wanted to meet and become a vampire to be "special" and break away from her shit life at home, in fact Hanakawa fell in love with araragi (at first) for the same reason stupid high school girls loved the sparkly vampires of the twilight series. He's sexy and dangerous and offers a path out of her mondain life (she thought).

Araragi's growth of a character is gradual from that point, but it progresses in steady steps as he grows the fuck up. and yes, araragi is fucking based.

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I hope Nisio Isin learns from our lord and savior Hammer.

I don't know why I like Senjyogahara so much. I usually hate tsundere.

>>160861162
dont you see all the hair you faggot

>>160867845
Senjougahara isn't a tsundere

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>>160867856
Anon, girls can have arm hair.

please fucking tell me. im watching first ep of bakemono and so far its a fuck ton of text flashing on screen. I literally need to pause to read any of it. Im only 1min40 into the fucking thing. Is this going to continue?

>>160867942
You don't have to pause to read it. It's inserts from the novel. Try to read what you can.

>>160867894
>she calls herself a tsundere
>meme-man calls her a tsundere
>her boyfriend calls her a tsundere
>the only thing Shinobu has said about her is that she is a tsundere
>not a tsundere

>>160867942
It's definitely not something you should be pausing to read. Just let it play.

>>160868020
i will read but please, is this a regular occurrence, like will this occur outside of this episode and beyond?

>>160868089
It's throughout the entire show. It's a stylistic choice, pausing to read it is silly. Anything you actually need to read will linger long enough for you to read itm

>>160868196
i have ocd, i must read all text, i literally am fucking going to die. Rip

Why is Senjougahara shortened to Gahara in the show?

>>160860743
they had anal sex and ara doesnt think that its cheating if its anal sex

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>>160868392
It's not like he isn't cheating on Senjyogahara all of the time to begin with

>>160868392
how do you know that occurred??

>>160868586
After Araragi fucks a girl they have to get their hair cut. Read the LN sometime

>>160860674
have not watched, what are innings?

>>160868224
It does add additional context so it isn't just for style.

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>>160868392
He also thinks anal doesn't count as incest

>>160868637
it's baseball you fucking European
they're saying extra innings as in let's keep going

there is only a light novel besides the anime ova and eps right. how many of the lns are there, ive seen mutliple numbers.

>>160868328
Maybe the same reason why Oikura is shortened to Oira in the show?

>>160851790
>I just watched bakemonogatari, is this series meant to be harem shit?
The author made it clear in a recent interview that Araragi doesn't have a harem.

What Araragi had, is having a lot of women in his life. The author just likes writing interesting girls over interesting boys, so there just are more women introduced. But the author insists that there are no harem going on, that just because Araragi ended up with multiple female co-workers, doesn't mean any of them are interested in him.

>>160868690
Google and IQDB didn't give me shit. Can I get a source?

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>>160868889
Pachimonogatari 10

>>160868328
Araragi mentions in Nisemonogatari that it's just a nickname he came up with. He tries hard to make it a thing but it wasn't catching up very well

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>>160868938
Why is it that all the Pachimonogatari dôjinshi are near god tier?

>>160869354
Because the artist loves both Monogatari and lolis and has the skill to do something about it.

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>>160851790
Considering every character has a distinct personality, quirky traits and developments that are both amusing as well as supportive dialogue to keep every single interaction interesting I don't believe labelling it as a harem can possibly detract from any entertainment value it possesses.
Go ahead, call it a harem. That won't make the show bad, because it's good in every aspect and girls lusting over Araragi's god tier body and mind is entirely justified by him being a great guy.

>>160859516
> dying her hair to match Sodachi's
Proof? I saw different spoilers but there was nothing about it.

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>>160859516
>He doesn't find Senjogahara's clingyness endearing.

>>160869655
>you will never have a qt gf who kidnaps you and ties you up in an abandoned school
why even live t/bh

>>160868876
Interesting. Do you have a link to the interview?

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>>160869700
To jerk off to the idea of it.

>>160869655
I prefer the clinginess that makes a girl treat you like a king, not beat you over the head and kidnap you.

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>>160868876
> What Araragi had, is having a lot of women in his life.
Based Nisio.

>>160869856
> kidnap you.
He could break the chains at any moment. He just enjoyed the bantz.

>>160869940
He couldn't. Only way he got out of the chains was because Shinobu cut them for him

>>160869856
Every day would be exciting. She's unpredictable.
Although I would prefer if she drugged me and didn't hit me on the head. I am terrified of brain damage.

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>>160868876
This is unfortunately something a lot of people seem to miss. The girls like to tease Araragi in their own way (Hachikuji with fake politeness, Kanbaru with lewds, etc), and he goes along with the gags because he's a natural straight man, hence the banter.

>>160869997
> Only way he got out of the chains was because Shinobu cut them for him
And? She could do it for him earlier.

>>160869795
>Interesting. Do you have a link to the interview?
It was actually a sort of humorous interview that was posted on the novel's promotional website. It seems these kinds of sites get closed down when the promotion ended.

>>160870165
Nobody asked Nisio about the most important thing. How does he manage to create the best girls?

>>160870237
And she waited for the moment that made Araragi look the coolest, even though they were having a fight, and didn't grandstand. Best fucking girl.

>>160868876
>doesn't mean any of them are interested in him.
>Senjogahara
>Everything about Hanekawa
>Snail
>Everything Kanbaru says being a lust-filled desire for Araragi's cock.
Do I have to keep going?
Why is this author in denial?
Does he think we're fucking stupid?

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>>160851790
It's meant for you to appreciatie snail.

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>>160870589
This is now a snail thread. Post snail.

I'm watching Nise. The Karen Bee story was OK, but probably the worst of the series so far. Can I skip the Phoenix story? Her character and OP look boring as fuck.

>>160870376
He just does, Nisio is probably the greatest Japanese LN writer of the 21st century. I am sure that years from now schools all across Japan will have his works studied in classes nationwide for their unparalleled story telling and characters. Just count yourself lucky that you were born in the same era as him.

>>160870514
This is how I know you dont have female friends.

>>160870686
No. It has lots of important information and the most legendary episode of the season.

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>>160870686
I think it's more interesting that Bee, so I'd watch it, or atleast try it for 2 episodes. Besides new (2) kind of important character(s) get introduced

>>160870769
>>160870748
Thanks anons, that's mostly what I was worried about, I'll give it a shot while doing cardio or some shit.

>>160870726
Nisio writes more affectionate interactions between Araragi and literally everyone else except senjogahara.
I'm supposed to accept that female friends are more willing to fuck than your actual girlfriend?

>>160870310
Oh, that. I wouldn't take that as serious evidence of anything, it was pretty tongue-and-cheek.

>>160851790
It certainly is shit.

>>160870934
Araragi never talks about his private life with Senjougahara. He even skipped the kiss in HItagi Rendezvous. He is a gentleman.

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>>160851790
I want to hug snail

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>>160871169
Me too anon, me too.

>>160868690
>Pachimonogatari 10
so this is referencing a hentai of the actual monogatari series i assume?

>>160872004
Yes

>>160871169
hug and protect and maybe fug*

>>160872034
i was looking for that exact one though, cant find, it seems that one screen cap isnt in the pachimonogatari i found.

>>160851790
Weak falseflagging lad

>>160872174
https://exhentai.org/s/bac96a4b83/997594-23

>>160872353
after all this time i finally found where this came from. thank.

>>160872353
I'm still waiting on the translation of the part where crab tries to cure Araragi's lolicon.

>>160862605
I skipped the entirety of Koyomi, it's all pointless shorts with no relevance or continuation

>>160872489
Koyomimonogatari 11 and 12 are kinda important tho.

>>160872489
The first half is bad and pointless. The second half gets better and has some very critical events.

>>160872415
>>learned japanese through sheer determination to be able to one day enjoy LNs without waiting. Now i regularly have my friend over in jp send me things and i end up getting tons and its cheaper. Learn the language so you too can contribute to the degradation of jp culture I MEAN read jp shit. All throughout my jp class years i was asked why i wanted to learn japaense. I felt embarrsed for a bit when i always said so i can watch anime without subtitles. Now it has come true. Mind you 7 years of furious studying, near native though.

>>160872823
all as a quote, failure.

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>>160872823
>jp class years
>his university actually has that

>>160860533
fuck sweetest and most bitter ending to a character that ive seen [spoilers] yes, i know about what happens next [/spoiler]

>>160875383
Outsourced

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>>160865611
Do you enjoy having the wordplay explained to you through translator notes or do just really like Commie's puns?

>>160875383
I can't wait for Hachikuji to rag on Araragi for a full episode.

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So what are the best subs to watch monogatari? I want to rewatch entire series and I remember that there was a list with best subs for every entry
is ANE for Bake and coalgirls for rest the best?

>>160876439
Close, but not quite. Commie actually had a translator who gave a fuck for Second Season, so snag those too.

The only reason why there's a bunch of people saying Bakegatari series suck, is only and only because it ended up getting popular.

>>160858026
Read Shinobu house you retarded secondary. it was way back in Kizumongatari implied that Kiss-Shot held feelings of romance for Araragi. So kindly fuck of

>>160858870
Do you want to know the entire reason why Sbinobu did not off herself after Kizu? It's because of Araragi's vow. If she died, then Araragi would kill himself. If by Kabukimonogatari you still.do not understand that Araragi is Shinobu's whole world, then you seriously lack reading comprehension. As the reader you should realize straight away that this is bullshit.
>but Shinobu outright says in kabukimonogatari
Just as proven in Owarimonogatari, Shinobu would never kill Araragi. I could go into a "ton" of stuff and prove you otherwise. In Araragi's life, he values Shinobu's presence the most. And this is not out of responsibily nor debt. It's his selfisb desire to stay with her. Maybe rewatch Shinobu Mail too anon.

>>160876439
Coalgirls stole Commie's subs, so they're sufficient. RH has done a decent job of everything else Coalgirls hasn't.

>>160851790
It's meant to be shit period.

>>160857886
>the only people who genuinely into Araragi romantically are Hanekawa (only for half the show) and Senjo.
Are you serious? I see, that totally makes sense. Let's just disregard Kizumonogatari, where Kiss-Shot expresses bitterness to the believe that she is not special to Araragi. Or to the fact that Shinobu decides to stay alive because she does not want Araragi to die.
>I do not want such a heroic spirit such as yours to die by my hand: "Shinobu's words"
Let's also disregard that Shinobu ran awa out of pure childish jealousy because her most important person was going around showing others more attention. Or the fact that in Nisemonogatari Shinobu secretly in the bath scene wants to reafirm Araragi's vow while telling him the truth about his partial immortality. Or in the shirt story called Shinobu house, where Shinobu gets upset at Araragi and shows pure jealousy over the thought that Araragi does not value her as much as he says he does. Or maybe in Kabukimonogatari where Shinobu totally acts like a kid and wants to be completely spoiled by Araragi. Or the part in Kabukimonogatari where the promise each other they will kiss in 100 years. Or mabe even the part where Araragi uses half a page or even more to discribe how beautiful he thins Shinobu is and where she gets so flustered she kicks Araragi. Or maybe the part in Route X where Kiss-Shot literally confesses her feelings? Let's also forget about the part in Shinobu Mail where Shinobu decides straight away that she would chose Araragi over Seishiro but wa only upset about the fact that she did not want to hurt his feelings. There is also the part in Owarimonogatari where Shinobu back in her full form acts competely dere around Araragi.

To sum this all up, we have to disregard most of the story for your delusion to true. Good ging anon.

>>160878238
As a follow up onthe short storcalled "Shinobu House"
>Aaah, I don't even know anymoooore. I guess in the end your family and your girlfriend or whatever is more important to you after aaaall."

>Shinobu continued without even glancing my way. It almost seemed like she was just talking to her herself, but loud enough that I would definitely be able to hear her. Like she was trying to implicitly say "Can you even call yourself a vampire doing all this?".

>"What was that again, I remember you saying something. That's right, I remember you saying some really cool line. Man, that made my heart beat soo fast. I can't imagine someone who'd say they cared about their girlfriend or their family saying something that would get my heart beating soo fast."

>"W-What are you talking about?"

>"'If you die tomorrow, I'm fine with my life ending tomorrow too' or something, or were you just trying to sweet-talk me."

>Since she had answered my question, it seemed like she wasn't just talking to herself after all. But still Shinobu refused to look my way.

>"But from what I heard at that meeting you just had, it won't matter whether I die. You'll just go on living your normal life. I'm sure. 100%."

>"Well, actually Shinobu-san. That's not true really..."

>>160858215

Hanekawa already got over him when Musubi happened. It's safe to say she was over with her feelings for him when she's travelling around the world and became an activist.

>>160862300
Oh shit are there more translations around for Shinobumonogatari aside from that one chapter mirrored translations put up?

Nisio already stated that Kizu is a story about " A Hypocrite and a vampire who falls in love with him". It was mentioned in his another novel Shōjo fujūbun.

>>160870012
>Although I would prefer if she drugged me
>I am terrified of brain damage.
anon...

>>160880375
I-is there a way to knock someone out that doesn't feature brain damage?

>>160851790
Actually, yes.

>>160870969
>Oh, that. I wouldn't take that as serious evidence of anything, it was pretty tongue-and-cheek.
But it is true that even after the time skip Crab is still the girlfriend. It's just that Araragi doesn't talk about private stuff with Crab. He just hangs out with hot women all the time.

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I'm doing a marathon of it soon

Do I place Kizu before Bake or juist after in viewing order? I'm flexible either way but I wonder which would be better for new folks.

>>160878238
Shinobu and Araragi doesn't have a normal relationship, but it is also true that Shinobu respects Hitagi and Araragi's decision to be with her. The thing is that Shinobu sees no reason to get in Hitagi's way. Remember that she feels what Araragi feels, so she knows how much Araragi loves Hitagi. Shinobu is in for the long run and don't mind waiting a bit.

And Hitagi on the other hand, know that Shinobu was "here first", and understands that Shinobu is part of the package Araragi come with. It's like dating someone who has a child. She knows what she was getting into.

>>160881312
My suggestion is Kizu directly after Bake. Then go into Nise and so on

>>160880606
Not really, no

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>>160881423
Seems fair

Can't wait to rewatch it again

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>>160866686

>>160867063
>in fact Hanakawa fell in love with araragi (at first) for the same reason stupid high school girls loved the sparkly vampires of the twilight series. He's sexy and dangerous and offers a path out of her mondain life (she thought).

Wrong. Hanekawa tells you in Neko White why she fell for Araragi, amd it was because he was a pathetic person who attempted to do something righteous. It had nothing to do with him being a vamp or that he was a "way out" of her life, which she hated not because it was mundane, but because her parents treated her like garbage and her birth mother killed herself over her crib, Hanekawa is legit not well.

"I fell in love with the crybaby Araragi-kun, because I have never cried before."

A quote from Neko White.

>>160882413
yes, because the narrator in this series never lies.

>>160882665

This was in the part of the narration where she was being truthful. Neko White was beloved because Hanekawa didn't BS it and got straight to the point, they go meta about how popular Basa-nee (who the characters call Hanekawa in the meta commentaries) is with how straight and to the point a narrator she is compared to Araragi, who takes a zillion pages to move past scenes.

Besides, her loving Araragi because he was a pathetic wretch who tries his best has been implied the entire series. Gahara loves him and thinks of him as a prince, Hanekawa internally criticizes him when they talk about what they hate about Araragi. See how they talk about Araragi in the commentaries and you'll see what I mean, Gahara may seem like she trashes him, but underlying it all she supports his decisions(which is we see in Hitagi End that causes her not to be able to smack him and tell him to stop futilely meeting with Nadeko), Hanekawa likes the side of him that helps people, but will
criticize the way he does things.


It's basically the dynamic these two have about Araragi. Gahara is enamored with him despite what she says, Hanekawa will seriously call him an idiot and browbeat him while doing something to help. It's why Hanekawa goes so far to save him at the end of Owari, since it's implied she has known what Ougi would be

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>>160883099
I assume Hanekawa was looking for Oshino with the sole intention of dealing with Ougi, since Hanekawa isn't an idiot and is the only cast member who actually wants to get something done.

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>>160879994
No, just spoilers. That was unfortunately the only line Sodachi had, though there were other info about her relationship with Araragi and Senjougahara.

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>>160851790
Of course it's a fucking harem. It's just that /a/ is filled with bandwagoners who jumped on the "harem = bad" meme and they find it hard to reconcile liking Monogatari with hating the genre it belongs to so they try to come up with ridiculous excuses as to why it's not a harem.

>>160883173

It's why Hanekawa is thematically one of the three most important female characters for Araragi. Gahara was totally in the dark about Ougi because she doesn't want to deal with oddities. Shinobu let him go alone to deal with Ougi and that almost cost him dearly because he forgot about the Darkness. Hanekawa, even if people call her a meddler, did the right thing to help in this situation. To the point even Ougi admits defeat, which has funny implications when you know what Ougi is.

>>160883360
What are the implications, anon?

>>160881380
>The thing is that Shinobu sees no reason to get in Hitagi's way. Remember that she feels what Araragi feels, so she knows how much Araragi loves Hitagi. Shinobu is in for the long run and don't mind waiting a bit.

I don't see that in "Shinobu House" or in Tsukimonogatari where Shinobu said that she does not care about Araragi "living a humanly life" and would not think twice drinking his blood even if it turns him completely into a vampire. And guess what, Araragi is fine with what she said.

As long as Hitagi does no cross a line where Shinobu gets to be second place, she is fine with it. Believe me, Shinobu is not that all giving as you think she is. It took her hundred of years to find someone that she could be with. Araragi, on the other hand, would not think twice once Shinobu gave her word like - "break-up with Hitagi!". He might feel bad about it but Shinobu comes first because she is his life partner.

>It's like dating someone who has a child. She knows what she was getting into.

A Child? Shinobu is technically Araragi's live-in partner and Araragi&Shinobu already vowed to spend the rest of their long lives together for better or for worst and death could not even break them apart. The most that Hitagi could be is Araragi's "lover".

>>160883473

Araragi says at the end that Ougi's antagonism toward Hanekawa can be seen as him internally wanting to compete with her, despite him also revering her. Then you have smaller things where in Ougi Travel, Ougi would say things like how it saddened her that Hanekawa will smile at anyone but hee. So lots of hidden implications you can get if you know she is/was part of Araragi.

where can i online read all the lns , up to what has been translated so far of course.

>>160884218

That's why Araragi should call the marriage plans off, for his and Hitagi's sakes. What about if he had a solid family, and something happened to Shinobu? He'd be a failure of a father and husband if he just killed himself.

Hopefully it's something Nisio goes into, because that type of Sword of Damocles hanging over their marriage would be plain stupid to sweep under the rug.

>>160882413
>Wrong. Hanekawa tells you in Neko White why she fell for Araragi, amd it was because he was a pathetic person who attempted to do something righteous

I will quote what she said which say differently courtesy of Bake:Neko.

- I guess Mistress thought the human/vampire relationship thing was so fantastic that it could break her right out of the life she was sick of.
- That's...
- But she never expected a rival to appear. Meanwhile, the girl you're going out with moved in lightning-fast.
- ....
- S girl raised in a cold, unloving family. During her spring break, she has a shocking encounter with a supernatural entity who happens to be in her grade at school. It feels like fate. Her heart begins to stir. Then, later, he saves her life - she's convinced that it's love.

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>>160884218
> would not think twice once Shinobu gave her word like - "break-up with Hitagi!"
Bullshit. She would never demand something like that. It will destroy their relationship. Araragi will never forgive her for it because he really loves Hitagi.

>>160884624
It's true that I see Shinobu not demanding anything like that, but something that simpel would never destroy their relationship idiot. Ever tried reading the novels? I think it's implicity stated that Araragi can live without Hitagi but that Araragi literally "does not want" to live without Shinobu even if Hitagi is alive.

Going by that alone and imagining the scenario that Shinobu does push Araragi to break up with Hitagi because Shinobu literally canot take it anymore or something, then I see Araragi sooner break upp with Hitagi then risk losing Shinobu. And this is according to the translated novel of Owarimonogatari where Araragi says:
>I can no longer envision a future without Shinobu in it. What you are saying is just wrong, something like that would never break them up.

>>160884624
>Bullshit. She would never demand something like that. It will destroy their relationship. Araragi will never forgive her for it because he really loves Hitagi.

After all that Araragi said in Owari

- No, perhaps she really did have no choice in matter. After all, I, at the very least, can no longer envision a future without Shinobu in it.
Shinobu in it".

Araragi concluding in Nise part 2 this.

- Therefore, I will not interfere if Shinobu concluded --- or concessions.
- Whether she'd knocked sun.
- Or desire to destroy mankind.
(I doubt that Hitagi could measure up with the sun or mankind)

As well as in Kabuki where Shinobu really did destroy mankind.

- If you have to shoulder anything, do not shoulder alone. You and I will shoulder it. The more you hide from me, the more it will only hurt me.

I doubt that he would not do anything for Shinobu. In Shinobu Time as well in Shinobu Mail, he already realized the he was cheating on Shinobu.

Even Sodachi said to Araragi that he had been dragged Hitagi over her teens and it would be wrong is he will drag Hitagi too in her twenties. Sodachi who threatened to kill herself if Araragi&Hitagi does not go back together suddenly advised Araragi to break-up with Hitagi. It clearly tells us that something is not right in Araragi&Hitagi's relationship.

>>160884624
fixed this=>>160885091
>I can no longer envision a future without Shinobu in it.
What you are saying is just wrong, something like that would never break them up.

should i watch in air order or chronological. Always thought air order was gospel and should be how one watches things as its how they literally released it, but some say different. Basing the orders from the monogatari subreddit

fuck really wish the lns all were officially translated, sucks we barely get any even with fantranslation, time to learn japanese?

>>160885187
The best order is alphabetical order. Starts with bake and ends with tsuki.

>>160884396
please anyone. i see the fan translated up, the few there are, but of course the few official translated ones are not online, poorfag here please help.

>>160885187
>should i watch in air order or chronological. Always thought air order was gospel and should be how one watches things as its how they literally released it, but some say different. Basing the orders from the monogatari subreddit

"GOSPEL"??? If you word it that way it really sounds unidentifiable but you really just need to tweak it a little to break out of that loop. Instead of

Bake->Kizu->Nise->Neko:Kuro

you just need to shuffle it a bit to get

Kizu->Neko:Kuro->Bake->Nise

It is really just a wrestle between crab & bat. If you love crab, go with bake. If you love bat, go with Kizu. If you ask me, it is always better to start at the beginning. And Kizu is where it all began.

>>160884536

That doesn't mean she fell in love.

The quote I put down was of the her after the Arts Festival in Bake that you put up, where she was reevaluating her life. In White, she plainly says that being with Araragi and seeing how the "crybaby Araragi-kun" did things with tears in his eyes resonated with her, because as she said, she had "never cried before". I'll have to find the full part in Neko White, but it seems to have been pulled from baka-tsuki. The point was that she wanted out of that life, but her liking Araragi wasn't just "he was a vampire, that's cool, I want his dick".

As for her family, that other poster said it was mundane but that's anything but a mundane issue with her family.

Her wanting to be free from an unloving family doesn't equate lust in for vampires, they go on about this in Hanekawa's letter about what she really felt and what the real situation was. Unless you're one of those anime only watchers who somehow thought her family situation was just fine after White.

They went into this at the end of Neko Black and it was told in Neko White. She wanted a place to belong, a home, a family. Not some Twilight nonsense you were trying to spin.

There would be no reason to lie in post arc narration there, since in effect that narration was her telling the story objectively, unlike how Nadeko tried to tells hers in Nadeko Medusa. There was a difference. The narration I gave was her speaking post revelation, instead of speaking while she still embraced the facade. She even went into the "I'll tell the story about when I fell in love later" prior to my quote iirc.

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>>160885121
> No, perhaps she really did have no choice in matter. After all, I, at the very least, can no longer envision a future without Shinobu in it
It doesn't mean that he sees his future ONLY with Shinobu. He loves Shinobu and really wants to live with her that's true But before all these nice things there are some obvious reasons why he can't just abandon her and choose Hitagi for example. You all know why it's not so easy. For example - imagine Shinobu and Araragi started to hate each other for some reason. Even in this situation he can't just say goodbye and leave. He should kill her or find a specialist to break the bonds but then she will become a man-eater monster.
Shinobu can ask him to drop Hitagi, can force him to drop Hitagi but he won't be happy about it. It would be very tough decision for him.

>>160885530

That doesn't mean she fell in love for that reason. You have to remember that Bake was made before Nisio really fleshed out a lot of stuff regarding Araragi and Hanekawa.*

Sorry, forgot to add this part to the post.

>>160884624
He's still petting her head even when she's killed Senjougahara and everyone he knows in Kabuki.

Shinobu would never ask him that, and Araragi would be furious because that's mean, but it's not gonna break them up lmao. Even if Shinobu killed Kanbaru for selfish reasons, she speculates that Shinobu is the one who wouldn't be able to face Araragi anymore, not the other way around.

>>160885187
I mean considering Owarimonogatari 2 is coming in less than a week I'd go with chronological order, even though airing is more easy to understand.

>>160885214
The official translations are probably gonna be finished way before you can actually read in japanese, trust me, it's hell

>>160885686
If airing is still easier to understand besides being the one that better ties the overarching themes as the author intended why even bother recommending otherwise?

>>160885680
>Shinobu killed Kanbaru
]spoiler] not like she'd survive long after that [/spoiler]

>>160885749
Because, if for example you start a rewatch, going airing feels pretty nice. You start with Kizu instead of Bake, in general you kind of mix the whole anime together so it actually makes more sense and you understand more and more as you progress, it's just not really that good for a first time because you don't really know much, though I think it's still more fun than airing.

>>160885686
That's a terrible suggestion, also several episodes overlap and take place over more than one day.

>>160885680
> He's still petting her head even when she's killed Senjougahara and everyone he knows in Kabuki.
It's not like she killed them with her own hands.

>>160885680

It's mainly because nobody has really called him out on it. Yotsugi touched on it in Tsuki, but hasn't really nailed it yet. Hanekawa leaves it alone as long as he doesn't hurt Hitagi. But you can bet when he actually does that's it's gonna be bad.

It depends on how raw Nisio wants it to get between the main characters.

>>160885534
>there are some obvious reasons why he can't just abandon her and choose Hitagi for example. You all know why it's not so easy. For example - imagine Shinobu and Araragi started to hate each other for some reason. Even in this situation he can't just say goodbye and leave. He should kill her or find a specialist to break the bonds but then she will become a man-eater monster.

Araragi&Shinobu already have a test run if they could stand living together. Shinobu initiated the test by living in his shadow 24/7 at the end of Bake. After several years, it has been proven that they will not hate each other.

Also, there is already a test to see if Araragi will be OK being human after Shinobu gets a pass from the specialist. That test was for Araragi to allow Shinobu to be the god of the shrine. If Shinobu becomes a god, she will no longer be a man-eater monster as you termed it and Araragi will completely be human. What did he do??? He said no! I would not allow Shinobu to be parted with me.

At the end of Ougi Dark, the conclusion was, Araragi would not let Shinobu go no matter what even at the cost of going to hell or losing his humanity.

>>160885534
>It doesn't mean that he sees his future ONLY with Shinobu in it.
Retard, learn to comprehend what you are reading. Araragi literally says: "I cannot envision a future without Shinobu in it" Meaning that without Shinobu, Araragi canot see himself a future with ''anyone'' And what happens when here is no Shinobu in his future according to the ending of Ougi Dark? He kills himself to join Shinobu in Hell and this goes both ways. If Araragi could see himself with a future together with Hitagi then he'd maybe fucking reconsider his vows. But he is deadset on ending his life when she dies. And this is not out of responsibiliy nor any debt. This is Araragi's desire.
>Shinobu can ask him to drop Hitagi, can force him to drop Hitagi but he won't be happy about it. It would be very tough decision for him.
No, really it is not a tough decision. If Shinobu ever grows tired of Araragi's indecisiveness and Araragi comes into a sot where he could potentally lose Shinobu then you and I both know that he would chose Shinobu over Hitagi.

>>160885832
Maybe it's better for Hitagi to break up with him for good and find someone more loyal.
Hanekawa for example.

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>>160886031
>no hitagi
>no hanekawa
>only left with snail, doll, bat and monkey
holy shit thats fucking heaven

>>160885816
>It's not like she killed them with her own hands.

She's the one who destroyed the world, and very intentionally at that, anon. Senjougahara was probably one of those dummy vampires or got brutally eaten 100% because of Shinobu. She is the causal link between world and destruction. Not my words, but theirs. In that timeline where he headpat her (without any hesitation, I might add), he did it knowing the weight of her sins. It doesn't mean he'd forgive her for that, but their entire relationship is about moving on together while not forgiving because forgiving someone is not as magnificent a thing as its made out to be.

>>160885832
>It's mainly because nobody has really called him out on it. Yotsugi touched on it in Tsuki, but hasn't really nailed it yet. Hanekawa leaves it alone as long as he doesn't hurt Hitagi. But you can bet when he actually does that's it's gonna be bad.

I'm not really sure what you mean to say here anon. But you're right, Yotsugi did call him out on his relationship with Shinobu and called it childish because, to her, it seems like they've stopped trying to be happy a long time ago.
Koyomi partially accepts this criticism because the truth is he and Shinobu are indeed not happy and their relationship will eventually make most people around them unhappy. Still, despite Ononoki's criticism being valid from her point of view, it's nothing that can truly damage Araragi's. It's not like he doesn't want to be happy, but he wants him and Shinobu to be happy. They have more time than they can do with to forgive each other. And when they finally forgive each-other, maybe then they'll truly be happy. One factor doesn't change, and that is: happy or not, they're each-other's treasure. Yotsugi, while her attempt was poignant and mature, will never change Araragi's mind with such mundane feelings.

>>160886171
This. She even mentioned that she had the plans and that it was pure luck because araragi found her.

>>160886171
I agree with most of what you said, but to me it seems like Shinobu has long since forgiven him. I think this was even touched upon in Kabuki. Only Araragi lives in his little world called denial.

>>160886347
The Owari narration seems to imply they've not forgiven each other for the original wounds (Kisshot trying to kill herself for his sake, Araragi denying her) during their marriage scene in Ougi Dark. Further, every narration about their forgiveness, be it Ougi Dark or Shinobu Mail, says that it'll take about 400 or so odd years, and that they have as much time as a corpse needs to rot to get to it.

>>160886171
In Kizu Araragi stripped Kiss-Shot of her power and her pride as a vampire and transformed her into his pet. Refusing to answer her wish to kill her. But that ending resulted to a blessing to Shinobu. It saved her from her terrible life as a vampire to spening her days together with her most important person, finally not alone anymore.

The "muh" cannot forgive part is from Araragi only.

>>160886030
> Meaning that without Shinobu, Araragi canot see himself a future with ''anyone''
What? You are batfagging too much. Or do you want to tell that he cares only about Shinobu? He wants to have a wife and Shinobu simultaneously. He doesn't think like "I love Shinobu more, I'll drop Hitagi easily because I love her less". He will drop her if there will be no other choice. But he will be mad at Shinobu for forcing him to do it.

>>160886510
I know this all, but this is all Araragi's narration. In Kabuki it was implied that Shinobu really does not care anymore about what happend in Kizu.

>>160886636
You are really an idiot. Are you honstly denying canon to delude yourself? If Araragi vows to kill himself if Shinobu dies and literally says he cannot see himself any future without shinobu in it, then what does that mean to you?

Araragi cannot see himself a future with "anyone" if Shinobu is not in it. Do you know why? Because he will KILL HIMSELF. It's not fucking rocket science you deluded faggot.