>I'll give you a wish in exchange for becoming a magical

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>become a magical girl
>get NTR'd by yourself

>>155486896
I want to punch this hobo in the face.

>>155487076
eat her apples

>>155487353
I am not eating food stolen by street rats. Sorry.

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>>155487444

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>>155486896
In order for a process to finish without increasing the entropy of the universe, it requires an infinite amount of time steps. Essentially in your new world no process would be able to finish in a finite amount of time. In your new world, nothing can happen. All biological processes would cease and life could not exist.

>>155486896
Enjoy living in caves.

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>that wish!
>it violates the laws of karmic destiny!

>>155488894
Can all processes that finish in polynomial time also be undone in polynomial time?

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>>155488894
>>155486896
Alternatively if you interpret the wish as making all processes, even in finite time, reversible, then that has devastating effects on the universe too. I am not an entropy genius, but I think that it would mean you could get things like water spontaneously freezing at room temperature or your blood boiling inside your veins at body temperature. This is also pretty hazardous for life.

>>155489116
That is unknown.

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This is why I din't like Modaka. It has magic and a wish can solve everything - and it did. You knew what is gonna happen in the end since episode 01.

Madoka could make the same wish and add "Wait a moment, and I want to SURVIVE".
She didn't because the show is a forced drama and everybody know that.

Even Bob Sponge made a better wish in one episode "I want to be hit by a flying ice cream car... and survive".

>>155489248
I mean, the point of it was that the wish couldn't work if she "survived". Because her wish made a new law in the universe, and something had to act out that law. In this case the only thing that could act out the law was her.

>>155488894
No one has really satisfactorily resolved Loschmidt's paradox / provided a justification for Boltzmann's molecular chaos assumption (i.e. the one thing necessary for deriving the 2nd TD Law from classical and statistical mechanics).

>madoka will I ever see you again?
>Well, hell, you're not even supposed to be able to talk to me now but you did that so why not

>wish for a world without entropy
>nothing changes because the magical girls are the current way entropy is removed from the world

Nice wish idiot

>>155489351
And why the event of Madoka killing the ultimate witch didn't became an infinit loop?
Modoka kills the witch --> She become a witch
--> She come back to kill herself --> She become a witch again.

>>155489571
watch the show

>>155489607
I wached, many years ago, I can't remember.

>>155486896
Someone post that Kyubey picture

>>155486896
I wish for three more wishes!

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>>155489441
Yes and there are things like Maxwell's demon that suggests that the 2nd law could be violated in some cases. If we take the assumption that the 2nd law of thermodynamics is true in general though the problems I mentioned arise.

>>155489248
Its made pretty clear that your wish can only come about if you are strong enough to enact it with your magic.

Wishing for something like a car is easy. Wishing to essentially remake the universe in your own image requires a ridiculous amount of power. Madoka, due to homura's meddling, was strong enough to erase all witches from existence for eternity because as a magical girl she would have been the strongest ever recorded. Its pretty simple and consistent.

>>155489571
That's exactly what happened and is part of why madoka became conceptual instead of continuing to exist as a simple magical girl.

>>155490646
>>155489571
correction: madoka's wish created the ultimate witch due to the hope:despair exchange, however madoka killed it. she says to homura later that she has no reason to despair, so its explained she'll never become a witch for all eternity, completely eliminating the problem in the first place

most magical girls wouldn't contain enough energy to do that. theoretically madoka could have since che had enough energy to recreate the universe with new laws, she just wasn't smart enough to take the concept of "i wish to fix the problem causing this all in the first place" that far, probably because she is a 14 year old girl

Why didn't Madoka wish for Mami to be brought back to life? Isn't that the obvious choice at the point of her death?

>>155490170
Then I wish the 2nd law wasn't true in general.

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>>155486896

>>155489571
That's what is happening all the time behind the kirtains.
That's why Madoka means "heel" and that's what cycle of Madoka means. She takes all the despair and kills herself then repeat again.

>>155486896
>can my wish be a world without entropy
That's not how this works you little shit

>>155490170
Maxwell's demon doesn't imply a breakage of the 2nd law of thermodynamics because of information. To know which particle to let through, he'd need to know the exact positions of every particle, and so the storage and processing of information would require energy, or rather, to store a specific state would be low entropy, and so that's where it's balanced out.

>>155486896
Why is entropy such a bad thing again?

>>155489074
Violates the laws of thermodynamics, more like.

>>155491746
Because it can't heat can't last forever, and the universe will eventually die because it doesn't have a never ending source of energy.

>>155490170
So if one wishes for the power to arbitrarily impose / remove symmetry breaking on all dynamical scales? God mode, I assume.

>>155491746
Eventually the universe will die when the energy sources (ie stars) are exhausted, the galaxies coagulate into massive black holes which slowly evaporate through hawking radiation, and nothing is left but lonely photons forever travelling through the black abyss of space.

>>155489546
Was it the first wish? Turning the wisher into a fight against entropy.

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>>155491746
Entropy means that unless the universe is infinitely dense with energy eventually we will reach a point where there is so little usable energy left that processes generally cannot occur.

>>155491702
Yes, I had read about that before and thought of another way it could work. If the demon let through particles randomly without knowing if they were high-energy or not there could be situations where it just so happens that things get sorted out neatly as if he had specifically known which to sort. This still doesn't violate the 2nd law of thermodynamics though because it is still based on entropy and probability but if the RNG of the demon was correct it would be indistinguishable from something that violates the 2nd law.

I might just be dumb though. All I know about entropy is what I learned in my physics and chemistry classes. I don't have a whole lot of experience with the more complicated aspects of it.

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>>155486896
Go to junior high school, hobo. You can not fight entropy and will not be in a world without entropy because it's just a term for grasping and explaining physical phenomena. -----"(cf)"

>>155488894
>In order for a process to finish without increasing the entropy of the universe, it requires an infinite amount of time steps.
Are you a moron?
>without increasing the entropy of the universe
It's impossible. Many astronomers assume that the universe continues to expand forever. In that case, the entropy of the universe is increasing unless the unforeseen scenario for the ultimate fate of the universe like Big Crunch happens.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Crunch
Therefore, "without increasing the entropy of the universe" is called "fantasy" from a fundamental physical viewpoint.
>it requires an infinite amount of time steps.
"An infinite amount of time" fundamentally has nothing to do with "a process to finish without increasing the entropy of the universe".
>Essentially in your new world no process would be able to finish in a finite amount of time. In your new world, nothing can happen. All biological processes would cease and life could not exist.
see "(cf)"

>>155489151
>I am not an entropy genius
At least, you do not understand "entropy" at all.
see https://archived.moe/a/thread/137831477/#137843433
https://archived.moe/a/thread/146069169/#146091177

>>155489441
>>155490170
Literally, off-topic.

>>155492438
Fuck off, pretentious moron with pedantry.

none of this has anything to do with the narrative of madoka magica

>>155494662
wew

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>>155494657
Where did I say that it was possible to complete a process with an infinite number of steps? My whole point was that is was impossible.

>>155495515
At least in a finite amount of time I mean. I should correct that.

>>155495515
Read my sentence.
"An infinite amount of time" fundamentally has nothing to do with "a process to finish without increasing the entropy of the universe".

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>>155495596
そもそもお前の見当外れの衒学趣味にはいつもうんざりする。アニメなんかほとんど全部自然科学とは無縁だ。人文科学さえちゃんと描けているかどうか怪しいのに。

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>>155495661
So you are saying that the entropy of the universe is always increasing because the universe is expanding? That really has nothing to do with what I am saying. Unless the specific process causes the universe to expand faster, it has no effect in that regard.

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>>155495828
You are very stupid. You wrote "without increasing the entropy of the universe". There is no need to assume for denial, because "without increasing the entropy of the universe" is "fantasy". You needed "it" for pedantry.

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>>155495982
I don't think you understand what I am saying. We are talking about two different processes.

If process 1 does not increase the entropy of the universe, but process 2 does, it would not be correct to say that process 1 increases the entropy of the universe. Just because one process is theoretically reversible it does not mean that all processes have to be reversible.

>>155486896
Solid state universe, as you have ordered!

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>>155496200
>>155495982
>>155495828
>>155495661
>>155495515
>>155494657
TRIPFAG FIGHT

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>>155496200
リンク先にもあるけど、空想科学読本の議論と一緒なんだよ。著者の柳田理科雄はなぜ批判されるのかというと、面白おかしく「彼の科学」で空想を批判するけど、彼自身が本を売るために「本当の科学」をねじ曲げて批判しているわけ。つまり、柳田こそがアホで彼の言ってることは科学でも何でも無い。だいたいファンタジーは自己の正当性のために空想上の力だったり説明できない近未来的なテクノロジーだったりを想定して科学的な議論をうまく回避しているのに、それを著者は無視しておかしく批判したいだけなんだよ。それを解った上で盛り上がるならまだしも、お前は正真正銘の馬鹿でただの衒学趣味だよ。Fuck you. moron.

>>155496309
Don't jinx it. We don't want Voldemort showing up now do we?

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>Go into the thread expecting to see cute magical girls (boys)

>Scientific discussion of the nature of Entropy

Nani?!

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>>155496393
It's a Madoka thread anon, it's destined to be derailed.

>>155496508
>inb4 ack

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>>155486896
Entropy is a spook.

>>155488894
i.e. the third law of thermodynamics: the entropy of a perfect crystal at absolute zero is exactly equal to zero

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>>155496548
You can never admit your pretentiousness.

>>155486896
>>can my wish be a world without entropy
If you want to basically destroy the entire universe as we know it, sure.

>>155496611
Just like egoism!

How did the first witch came to be?
Did Kyubei just trick some hundreds of little girls until they all went corrupt? I mean, there were no grief seeds back then.

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>>155496897
Okay, I understood you want to read my Japanese sentences.

>>155492324
But where did matter go? Do black holes make things unexist?