What kind of hero stab people in the back ?

>>152346699
The best kind.

A true hero always ends up becoming the villain.

Stand in the blood of the dead and ask them if heroics matter.
Lin muh waifu cause she shot that fatfuck Greyfield right in his stupid face even after he surrendered.

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>>152346699
What kind of priest cuts off a woman's arm and steals her beloved servant?

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>>152346803

This kind.

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>>152346885
The dead kind?

>>152346699
what if someone has a back on both sides? where do you stab?

>>152346803
Priests who are into their work.

>>152346973
What's his job? Being a dick?

>>152346803
I'm not much inside Fate ... These two will ever have a chance to work together?

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>>152347396
Yeah, sure.

>>152346699
First of all, don't put spaces before question marks.
>What kind of hero stab people in the back ?
Secondly, I am pretty sure that historically, that sort of thing was expected of heroes. It is only in our non-martial times where we have cleaned up the image of the hero to fight with a silly codex that doesn't make sense to people that know actual battlefields.
Sort of like the bushido samurai code was invented long after samurai had become obsolete.

Stabbing people in the back is an important aspect of war.

>>152347657
Random soldier ≠ hero.

>>152347700
No, legendary heroes like Sigurd do it too.

Fucker's almost dead, give him some credit

>>152347855
And random soldiers still aren't heroes, so why are you trying to argue for the behaviour of the latter with acts of the former?

>>152347937
>why are you trying to argue for the behaviour of the latter with acts of the former?
Because the expectations of the people depended on their own experiences.

>>152347973
Except that heroes are the individuals who go above the expectations, actions and capabilities of ordinary humans. That's why they are heroes and not just random mooks.

>>152348012
>Except that heroes are the individuals who go above the expectations,
You are completely retarded.
Nobody back then judged anybody for stabbing people in the back. That was how it SHOULD be done. You would be a coward and a traitor if you DIDN'T stab your opponent in the back. You wouldn't go above expectations, you would fail the expectations.

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>>152348057
>Nobody back then judged anybody for stabbing people in the back. That was how it SHOULD be done
Yeah, that's totally why duels were a thing and why in most heroic sagas and tales the heroes take part in duels, not backstabbings.
Why do you talk so confidently about something you know nothing about?

>>152348095
>Why do you talk so confidently about something you know nothing about?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect

>>152348095
Duels have rules.
You are moving the goalposts.
It's like arguing that taking a corner can't be such a useful move in go, since nobody is doing it in chess.
Just stop talking.

>>152348142
>You are moving the goalposts.
Look who the fuck is talking. First you claim that backstabbing is heroic and that nobody would judge a man for stabbing another in the back, then you start spouting some random shit about chess. Man, you're hilarious. I bet next you'll claim that stabbing another man in the back is a heroic feat.

>>152348198
>First you claim that backstabbing is heroic
Now you are putting words into my mouth. I didn't say it was heroic, I said it was expected of heroes. When an opportunity at an enemy arises and you let it pass then you have failed.
>that nobody would judge a man for stabbing another in the back
And nobody did. That's what cavalry charges did as part of their routine. Stabbing people in the backs as they were running away.
Those cavalrymen were some of the most recognized warriors on the field.

>>152348198
>then you start spouting some random shit about chess.
Not my problem if you can't understand basic similes.

>>152346699
The pragmatic kind

Also, Fairbain and Sykes taught british commandos to do just that that. That's why Fairbain-sykes was so designed, to inflict maximum damage from stabbing from area between the nape and shoulder

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>>152348271
>I said it was expected of heroes
By you, maybe.
>When an opportunity at an enemy arises and you let it pass then you have failed.
If you are a normal soldier, yes. If you are a true hero, you would be able to allow that opportunity to pass and still defeat your foe. Going above and beyond expectations and human capabilities is what being a hero is all about. Any man can stab another in the back in secret, but not everyone can face an army on their own and kill hundreds. It is through these heroic feats that a man is recognized as superior.
>And nobody did. That's what cavalry charges did as part of their routine. Stabbing people in the backs as they were running away.
>Those cavalrymen were some of the most recognized warriors on the field.
SOLDIERS, not heroes. Why are you unable to make the distinction? A cavalryman is not a hero. A warrior is not a hero. Take Cú Chullain as a fitting example, the man refused to kill women even when they were his enemies, would eat dog meat against his geass simply because he was honour bound not to deny hospitality and single handedly holds off armies by challenging their champions into single combat.

Are you stupid or something?

>>152348456
>Why are you unable to make the distinction?
I am not. I am trying to get it through your thick skull (with little success) that
>By you, maybe.
is nonsense. When the soldiers know that this is how war is done, then that is what they expect of their heroes.
What a hero is, depends on what people consider a hero (or what they expect of such a person).
You are denying the historical idea of heroes solely because it doesn't match your own.
It's a bit autistic.

>>152348419
>british commandos
>heroes
At least refer to someone with actual, notable deeds of valour or heroism.

>The Germans scored a direct hit on an M10 tank destroyer, setting it alight, forcing the crew to abandon it.[66] Murphy ordered his men to retreat to positions in the woods, remaining alone at his post, shooting his M1 carbine and directing artillery fire via his field radio while the Germans aimed fire directly at his position.[67] Murphy mounted the abandoned, burning tank destroyer and began firing its .50 caliber machine gun at the advancing Germans, killing a squad crawling through a ditch towards him.[68] For an hour, Murphy stood on the flaming tank destroyer returning German fire from foot soldiers and advancing tanks, killing or wounding 50 Germans. He sustained a leg wound during his stand, and stopped only after he ran out of ammunition.[66] Murphy rejoined his men, disregarding his own wound, and led them back to repel the Germans. He insisted on remaining with his men while his wounds were treated.[66] For his actions that day, he was awarded the Medal of Honor.[69] The 3rd Infantry Division was awarded the Presidential Unit Citation for its actions at the Colmar Pocket, giving Murphy a Bronze Oak Leaf Cluster for the emblem.[70]

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>>152348558
Yeah, go ahead and find me some of these heroes of yours that act like common soldiers. Show me these mythological heroes who utterly lack heroism and are exalted by their common acts of murder and backstabbing. You claim all these things yet you offer no real arguments or evidence for them.

>>152348630
I already pointed you to Sigurd

>who utterly lack heroism and are exalted by their common acts of murder and backstabbing
Moving the goalposts. Again.

It appears that all you have going for yourself is wilful ignorance and logical fallacies.

>>152348662
>Sigurd
When exactly does he backstab or murder anyone? He kills Fafnir with stealth and guile, but Fafnir, being turned into a dragon is no longer a man. Show me these "heroes" of yours that act like normal soldiers.

>>152348728
>When exactly does he backstab or murder anyone?
You are clinging onto your moved goalpost?

>>152348751
Really, this is the extent of your arguments? You fallaciously claim moved goalposts, when your original claim was that stabbing people in the back was how it SHOULD be done? That you would be a coward and a traitor for NOT stabbing your opponent in the back?

You're just baiting now, aren't you?

>>152348800
>when your original claim was that stabbing people in the back was how it SHOULD be done?
No, my original claim was THAT it should be done, implying there are many ways to fight, and if the enemy poses your backside to you in the middle of hostility, then you should take the opportunity.
You are still putting words into my mouth.
>That you would be a coward and a traitor for
Letting the enemy go instead. Yes.
But if you really must know, Sigurd did in fact kill a man in his sleep. Just after the battle that you already noted about the guile that was used within.
It was Regin.

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>>152348921
>No, my original claim was THAT it should be done, implying there are many ways to fight, and if the enemy poses your backside to you in the middle of hostility, then you should take the opportunity.
>You are still putting words into my mouth.
I directly quoted your post, masturbaiter.
>That was how it SHOULD be done. You would be a coward and a traitor if you DIDN'T stab your opponent in the back.
>Letting the enemy go instead. Yes.
Oh, so Cú Chullain is a traitor then? A coward? You are seriously grasping at straws here. Just close the tab and pretend you didn't humiliate yourself like this.
>But if you really must know, Sigurd did in fact kill a man in his sleep. Just after the battle that you already noted about the guile that was used within.
It was Regin.
Oh, really now, care to source that? This look like killing someone in his sleep? Regin was planning to betray Sigurd and so Sigurd slew him.

>>152346699
It's his fault for facing the wrong way.

>>152349116
>Oh, really now, care to source that?
Sure.
Two different texts of the same scene I found with google:
>Sitze nun, Sigurd;
>ich schlafe derweil,
>Und halte Fafnirs Herz ans Feuer.
>Ich will das Herz zu essen haben
>Auf den Bluttrunk den ich trank.

>„Sitz nun, Sigurd - Ich such mir ein Lager -,
>Halt ans Feuer das Fafnirherz!
>Munden mag ich mir den Muskel lassen,
>Nach dem Trunk vom Totenblut.“

In English, Regin is going to sleep while Sigurd is supposed to prepare the dragon heart for him.

But while he's preparing the heart, Sigurd decides to decapitate Regin instead (because the birds told him that was a better idea).

>I directly quoted your post,
Ah, my mistake. I shouldn't have phrased it like that.
>Oh, so Cú Chullain is a traitor then? A coward?
An idealistic fool, certainly. But I don't know his legend really so it would take some research to make a final statement on that.

>>152347657
>First of all, don't put spaces before question marks.

Why ? Because it triggered your personal autism ?

>>152349415
Because of grammar rules.

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>>152349421

Which rule are you referring to ? Is this some kind of britbong thing ?

>>152349468
I'd rather follow Britbong rules than French rules.
>Some writers put a space between the end of their sentence and the question mark. This is thought to come from a French practice and is called French spacing.
https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Question_mark

>>152349468
Not that guy, literally first results on google tell you it's wrong as well.

>>152349297
>Two different texts of the same scene I found with google:
Of the Nibelunglied, not the Völsunga saga. You are quoting the artistic works of a Christian, who edited the tales to fit into a Middle-European courtly setting, removing and adding things just so it would fit his time and place. The Völsunga saga and other, more original sources have no such assassination of Regin.

>>152346699
The one that hated his scumbag master.

>>152349575
>to fit into a Middle-European courtly setting,
Which goes to show that in the Middle-ages, killing people in their sleep seemed appropriate behavior for Sigurd.

>>152349569

Not that guy,but the other day my professor berated me for not spacing before question marks,saying that it hurts his eyes when reading.

Also,aside from this instance of that one autist bitching literally no one cares.

>>152349731
Was it a linguistics professor?

>>152349731
>not putting spaces after commas

>>152346803
Catholic

>>152349642
In the context of punishing backstabbery as an entertainment character, yes.

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>>152349841

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>>152346699
Hero of justice.

What a shit thread.

>>152346699
Depends on your ethics and moral.
People worshipped Hitler, if they won the war, he would've been a hero.

And depends on what you consider smart, a smart man will use wits and opening, you don't call Ezio nothing bad forbackstabbing legit backstab. Or some clever heros for "backstabbing" your definition, all depends.