Is Flip Flappers AOTS?
We need more intellectual anime like this.
Maybe if you mix her with the other irrelevant girls. She's not featured in enough scenes desu.
It's a bit more than bait though. Even the director's interview confirms.
Can Mimi even read? She never had a formal education at all.
She's probably as dumb as Papika behind that reserved and demure composure
I Mimi hadn't let DarkMimi switch with her and go thermonuclear, the KKK would probably have been able to achieve world domination. Mimi did nothing wrong.
This turned mostly into a fluff collage. Unfortunately most stitches are vertical while my script favors wide images over tall ones.
Side story about PI turning Yayaka into a twin tailed cat Youkai when?
Even better, story about PI revealing that Yayaka was a twin tailed cat youkai all along.
>This turned mostly into a fluff collage.
Nothing wrong with it.
Also that's easily twice as many pictures as Papika?
I looked it up.
>a sci-fi/fantasy mash-up starring black- and brown-skinned main characters
Just saw the card and director's response. Glad to be a part of it. It's been fun, FlipFlappers.
I watch everything Yuasa, this makes me very excited
112 Coconas, 121 Papikas, 107 Yayakas and 77 CocoPapis. OP posted the old Papika one.
Also 47 Yuyus.
No, Mitsuo Iso said the producer is shit, who pushed Oshiyama too much that Oshiyama couldn't do what he wanted to.
Mitsuo Iso likes the FliFla ED, but the anime is a little too moeshit, due to the bad producer requests.
I love Cocona. Best girl of 2016.
>a creative original by an up-and-coming director held back artistically by money-grubbing producers
Sounds par for the course, really. Hell, even the literary world is full of this shit.
If FliFla wasn't moe, it would've been an even bigger flop. Unless they made it yaoi or something.
>blaming the producers
Yeah no. You should be thanking the producers for the fact that FLFL even exists. Sure they may have made requests but the were the reason this show had such a good budget and could afford so much manpower. It's either FLFL in its current state or nothing at all.
If it wasn't part of his original scenario plan, it definitely explains why Papika completely domineered henshin action focus through most of the series. There's a couple battles where you almost ask yourself why Cocona even bothered to transform since she just stands around and reacts to things instead of actually helping.
That dynamic actually makes a lot more sense if you consider it without factoring their henshin.
>Mitsuo Iso likes the FliFla ED, but the anime is a little too moeshit
But the ED is moe as fuck.
Yes, henshin and big guns. Both are quite underused in the show, so them being an afterthought isn't unlikely.
Some scenes would be complete nonsense without the Henshin, though. You'd be left wondering how Cocona could perform feats of strength and acrobatics. The fact that she gains it through a kind of magical power causes you not to question it so much.
How could the whole "fight me in the memory dome" have even made sense without Henshin? Would it have just been a schoolyard fistfight or what?
>Would it have just been a schoolyard fistfight or what?
It basically was already. Cocona did nothing in that fight that couldn't have been done just with fists. She blocks a half dozen times, sweeps once and then gets punted through a field goal.
In fact, the only action sequences where her henshin actually mattered were 3's (which was obviously planned around henshin in mind) and ringing the bell at the end of 5. In 6 she's just a distraction while Papika does the heavy lifting, in 8 she actually just stands around and watches Papika fight and in 9 she just gets bullied by Yayaka.
Even in 3, most of what she did was punch and kick (which she could have done without henshin). The only distinctly henshin moments were pick related and the big laser at the end. Most of her contributions to henshin sequences have just been defending Papika, watching Papika or crying out to Papika.
The ED is too expressive to be moeshit.
Moeshit is what we refer to as bland facial expressions and generic overly cute templates. Maybe the sakuga patrol was right in criticizing the show's lack of expressive faces. Perhaps it was the producers' fault all along considering the caliber of the staff involved.
I wonder if all of Ep 3 was Oshiyama taking some rage out on the producers
>you want henshins and magic guns, fine, but they're fighting a naked dominatrix plant loli with a harem of sex slaves.
Actually this comment is from a talking event Oshiyama also attended. He said those when the topic was complaining about producers only come up with projects that seem to sell well, which is harmful to creativity.
Henshins are obviously a core concept of the show. The whole butterflies symbolism is fucking everywhere. You have to be retarded to believe that producers told him to put it at the last moment.
>Moeshit is what we refer to as bland facial expressions and generic overly cute templates.
Moeshit is a vacuous pejorative thrown around to express a generalized dislike of cute things, or cuteness as a form of appeal. It's not a serious term and carries no serious meaning. It's been used exclusively as a form of shitposting and "us vs them" trolling since it was coined almost a decade ago.
>Stella no Mahou
Dropped that garbage immediately after ep 1. Why would you even consider that insipid shit anything but a time waster is beyond me. It's not even good among similar shows.
At least you redeemed yourself with Musume but putting that garbage above says a lot about your shit taste.
Drifters was even worse. Life isn't all moeshit and manime, anon. And before you go on to accuse me of being a fujoshi with Yuri on ice or some shit, I'll just tell you now that Fune wo Amu and Hibike tied for my AOTS.
I talking about moe from an animation perspective. I think expert animators would find cute faces that are 100% on-model and stiff all the time to be boring and unattractive. I find expressive female character animation to be much more pleasing regardless of how kawaii it is (Asuka during her death scene in EoE). I've never seen an animator praise boring cute faces before.
I hope this doesn't become the next version of Matoi shitposting. I'm a big Kirarafag, but Stella no Mahou suffered greatly from its 100 yen budget. Silver Link can fuck off with their generic character design. But then again, maybe it will be profitable with its 200 sales unlike FliFla.
Is it wrong that I find adult Papika more adorable than her JC form?
L E G S
I would be upset if I actually finished Stella. I'm happy that I didn't bother with it and saddened because anyone is putting it above any title from this season. It's just a throwaway and lazy silver link show.
My headcanon is that cocona couldn't go to pure illusion anymore and committed sudoku in the pipe.
Can we keep these threads going for ever anons. I haven't had this much fun for a long time
Everything must end, anon.
Better to die young than live long enough to become madoka general: homu did nothing wrong edition.
I think expert animators would know the difference between stoic facial expressions and the subtle demeanor of "cute" faces, or any face for that matter, that don't warrant a lot of animation.
Tonight you will be visited by the ghost of threadmas future
You can be spared from this horrible fate, but only if you learn to let go before it's too late.
I wonder if 3hz will get to do a Kirara adaptation someday, or they're gonna go for action manga adaptations like Dimension W. I feel like a light-hearted show with Sorameso-tier visuals would do very well.
And guess what butterflies are attracted by
It's okay anon Matoi is a good anime we all love Matoi
The show's lack of very expressive character animation is objective reality. Especially when you compare it with that Oshiyama-animated ED, which is absolutely wonderful.
I don't think he necessarily called it 'moeshit' though, he said that the final product was kind of moe anime-ish and that it doesn't display Oshiyama's strengths as a creator very well. I'd be inclined to agree considering the very idiosyncratic stuff he did in his Dandy episode. It had a pretty different aesthetic vision from Flifla's more mainstream friendly stuff.
If it was good why did no one watch it?
Even without watching it, I can assure you that Stella didn't match any of Takkyuu Musume's high points.
Besides, you don't need to finish every mediocre show to know it was shit. And in Stella's case there wasn't going to be a big deviation from what it was presented in its first episode. You can find a show like Stella in every season.
I'm glad that you loved it but it's forgettable as fuck.
>What did X mean by this
She meant that you're a shitty poster and should just lurk if you can't contribute to a thread without relying on twitter-sized copypasta templates of stale memes.
God, I want to punch every "sakugafag" wanting ridiculously overexaggerated expressions like in that one Shirobako scene with crying idol chick. webm related shows more emotion than the entirety of fucking Mob Psycho. Look how the tiniest movements in Flip Flappers episode 1 help to define the characters' personalities. The Japanese get it, see this blog for example:
Western "sakuga community" is fucking cancer.
>wanting ridiculously overexaggerated expressions
That's a false dilemma though. And episode 1 does a good job of defining the characters visually, it just doesn't necessarily need expressive animation to do that. That blog's example of Cocona adjusting her skirt works very well in terms of directing and storytelling, but it's not really expressive character animation.
I already had this discussion before though and people who disagree will never change their mind about anything. So it's kind of pointless.
Western artistic sensibilities in general are very stuck on a "the world rolls to the beat of one drum" and think that there's only one way to see a given thing, and only one right way for it to be done, as well as an objective hierarchy of better to worse.
The priorities are mixed up and you see that in any western art critique. It's especially apparent here just because the opinions of sakugafags aligns so poorly with the reality of technical animation that their opinions seem almost absurd at times.
Up there with AOTY as well.
Hibike rushed through the novel and dropped what made the first season great. It also fucked around with the romance and left a huge gaping hole where it used to be. One of my bigger disappointments of the season.
I felt the show used "moe" really well. Moe is only a problem when it gets in the way of the story or action or what the artist is trying to portray. Oshiyama used moe to his advantage and I think made the end result better.
I am not sure if I would have liked this show as much if the girls weren't cute. It also just fit really well with the fairy tale and surreal aesthetic.
Maan, this show is so great from the visual standpoint.
I hope the guy gets to direct something of substance in the future.
Fucking this. The "if it's not over the top or pretentious artsy stuff then it's shit" mentality is pure cancer.
I fail to see how pic related is not expressive enough.
I was never as in love with this show as a lot of you seem to be, but I'm genuinely happy that you all got so much out of it. It's a good, thoughtful show, the kind of work that you could show to an undergrad philosophy class and teach them more than their textbook did.
Thank you anon. I love love LOVE the show, but I myself have a lot of trouble pin pointing what specific elements of it make me love it so much. I think the love and passion put into the show is just rubbing off on me. Its something that can be felt, that resonates with some of us.
It is an anime that loves being an anime.
The visual story telling is top notch. Its fun and tries its best to inject fun into every moment it can. The characters are lovable and likable. Nothing about the show really feels cheap or forced, at worst it feels rushed and like they needed more time, but everything feels and develops really naturally. There is so much POTTERY (poetry/george lucas/it rhymes) going on in the series that its beautiful. So many little details that just add up, so many little moments that they add up into something really meaningful in a profound way. What it tries to tell us is really simple: But the way it tells us hits us hard, and touches with the core of what humans respond to. It also eschews the single biggest flaw with most anime- it focuses on show instead of tell, and it is ok with leaving mysteries as mysteries instead of trying to forcefully explain stuff or make a 2deep4u point with certain things. It simply feels magical. It feels like art. It is flawed, at times messy. It is in no way perfect. But something about it really shines above all of that and makes me love it another to consider it within my personal top 10 GOATs.
More than an anime, it actually reminds me of a game: Wonderful 101. Another project filled with so much love, passion, intensity, that its myriad flaws almost cease to matter. Unlike Wonderful 101 however, Flip Flappers has a ton of POTTERY and symbolism and metaphors that adds so much weight to its story, in addition to being far more serious overall.
Flip Flappers is special to me.
I wonder how many others feel this way.
its good to know I am not alone, thank you anon.
I love the ending. While I wasn't a huge fan of the endgame developments, or rather how they went about it, I do love where the show ultimately ended up.
They could've just phoned it in and went with a generic bittersweet anime ending where one of the two leads dies/ascends to some abstract existence, or everything magical about the setting goes away forever, but they went ahead and did an outright fakeout.
The show got darker as it proceeded towards its climax, but it kept it human, revolving around a girl's relationship with the world and her mother, rather than revolving around something alien, or the characters being so autistically rigid about a nuanced issue that it becomes unintentionally funny. The magical girl genre of late has become prone to this.
But here the girls win, they'll never be broken apart, and they're going to keep going on adventures together for the rest of their lives. It's optimistic, in an almost defiant way.
Its happened. The warm feeling in my heart from the ending has finally left me. Instead its just an empty and cold pain in my heart. Post Series depression is kicking in hard now.
How are you guys handling it?
Like every time a good show ends. Also this >>151661640
Reading, I just reached the 3rd part of Man and His Symbols "The process of individuation." You have to fill the gap with something I figured I should learn a little more in the process.
You can also pick up Japanese, nothing better then studying your anki deck every day
I do need to improve my Japanese, but I have no idea where to go with it. I got Hiragana and Katakana down, and have been learning Kanji with vocab, but I feel like there is still some big element I am missing.
Is she drinking olive oil? That is disgusting
It doesn't feel like the show ended to me.
Maybe because I couldn't understand whatever happened at the end, didn't feel any sense of closure, still don't know the relationship between the 2 main characters, what happens to Pure Illusion or what will the 2 even do from now on.
>Think about what could've been if the anime industry wasn't as fucked as it is.
What could it have been in your eyes? What about the anime industry fucked it and stopped it from being what it could have been?
I usually prefer bittersweet or even sad endings, but for some reason I really didn't want that for this show.
The few minutes in the "real world" PI baited me real hard and I was so fucking relived when Papika reappeared. That was just perfect.
there is only one way to find out
I am the same anon. I usually prefer bittersweet endings. But this shows ending was fantastic, I didn't want to see these two separated no matter what. The only thing that could have made the ending better would be a kiss.
It is the fairest comparison I think I could make. I don't usually like to compare cross mediums, especially with games since they are so fundamentally different from more passive entertainment mediums.
but I think in regards to the sort of feelings both give me, and the amount of love, passion, and little touches poured into each- combined with the fact that what each does so well makes the many flaws almost not even matter anymore: In this regard they are the same, to a degree that I cannot think of a more solid comparison.
I am listening to Find the Wind on repeat. I don't know what else to do on New Years.
Its ok, everything will be daijoubu. I am sad and feeling post ending depression big time, but its only because I loved the show so much. For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. The more you love something, the worse you feel when its gone. This pain and sadness may hurt, but it also serves as a constant reminder of how much joy the show brought me. It was worth it.
>director flat out confirms Cocona loves pussy
Try harder faggot.
You're right, anon. It will all be fine tomorrow.
It will all be fine in Pure Illusion, visit me when you're ready.
I hate how Flip Flappers and Izetta both pussied out of a yuri kiss. I'm not even that huge of a yurifag, i just wish a show would fucking commit to it for once. Didn't gay skaters get a gay kiss?
it was an implied kissu, it was obscured by their arms. technically flip flappers got the same thing
>blown the fuck out so hard he's denying reality
No, they pussied out too. Fujos just have such a huge draught of shows like that that they ate it up anyways. Basically the only reason Yuri on Ice is as big as it is, it’s the first show of its kind that didn’t suck.
If we post it enough it has to be true right?
But it did suck.
Almost every season anymore there's a big BL franchise that blows up and tops the sales charts. The only difference this season is that the show got much more promotion overseas and consequently much more attention from western fans.
Perfectly ok at all knowing we'll have LWA in a few days.
Plus, I might be alone in this, but 9-12 were a disappointment. Not the worst, but I slowly began to like the series less, losing any hopes I might have had for it with each passing week. It made saying goodbye easier. PapiCoco are adorable as fuck, but I'm ok with the series being over and not returning forever.
>Almost every season anymore there's a big BL franchise
No there’s not. There’s a big franchise that fujos buy like crazy and draw tons of doujinshi for, but nothing that’s explicitly homo baiting like that. Free is not a BL franchise and neither is UtaPri, tourabu, Kuroko or whatever. Yuri on Ice saw the market niche and was there to fill it, a niche that’s already plenty filled with Yuri shows that also bait like crazy and go above and beyond with "sub"text.
>9 was a disappointment
>nothing that’s explicitly homo baiting like that.
Are you being serious right now? Watch more anime.
>But it did suck.
I appreciated mappa trying to animate something difficult as ice skating but it just ended up looking weird. And the entire tournament plot felt really cheap.
I disagree with you, 11 was the high point of the series, 12 was a bit of a disappointment outside of Yayaka henshin, and 13 salvaged 12 by having the great dual confession scene, "real" world PI, and pipe scene into ending Over the Rainbow sequence.
I am going to miss this series more than any other series in the past several years. It sucks in one sense, but its also exciting in another sense. It feels like the end of an era, and the start of something new. Looking forward to whatever Oshiyama does next. Hopes he thinks of Flip Flappers as fondly as we do and gives us some OVAs or something someday.
It's really easy to call Japan's taste shit when a show you love isn't as popular as you'd like, but if enough people can come together and make something as wonderful as Flip Flappers, there's hope for them yet.
I watch loads of those shows, anon, because I actually enjoy them. There's actual BL that for the most part sucks (although I do wish more people would watch Love Stage, it’s pretty decent), and there’s vaguely subtextual sports shows with very little inbetween because the guys in sports shows rarely go around declaring their more-than-friends-less-than-lovers love for each other.
Opinions and all. 9 felt melodramatic as fuck, and I never really liked Yayaka, but her henshin scene and buildup made me like her more.
Again not saying these episodes didn't have their moments, my heart loved those daisuki's, and the director himself baited us repeatedly during episode 13 which made the ending much sweeter, I just think it was a bit of a mess.
It saddens me because this show could've been perfect, or close to perfect if they had more time/experience. It felt like something special and got more generic and boring towards the end.
>Opinions and all.
I know. You shared yours so I decided to share mine.
>It saddens me because this show could've been perfect, or close to perfect if they had more time/experience.
There is no such thing as a perfect show, because of Opinions and all.
I didn't find the ending to be generic or boring at all, just felt it had some wonky pacing and a couple missed opportunities.
I know what you mean anon. It gives me hope for the future. Its what I mean when I said it feels like the start of something new. I am sad to see Flip Flappers end, but Flip Flappers also gave me hope for Anime, before Flip Flappers happened, I was almost considering dropping anime for good. It had all gotten so stale, uninspired, and boring.
Flip Flappers, for better or worse, brought me back in, and reminded me of why I fell in love with anime in the first place.
The general idea, but not your specific complaints or areas. I dont think it got more generic or boring, and I liked Yayaka. I do think there were some missed opportunities and some wonky pacing, especially in 12. But I also think 11 is one of the best episodes in the series.
I also think that overall, the show is a masterpiece, despite its flaws.
So we do agree on some points, not 100%
Mob was obviously a better showcase of technical animation, but it was strongly lacking in many areas related to narrative and presentation.
Rakugo was one of the strongest dramas in terms of its characters and narrative, but its presentation was straightforward tv drama fare. Not that its approach to visuals was a detriment to the end result, but it's simply not notable for it.
In other words, neither excelled in the things that Flip Flappers excelled in. I'd argue its excellence was exceptional in that very few shows ever do excel in the same areas or achieve the same things, and I think that contributes greatly to its value holistically.
Before someone cries "muh last 4 episodes," all of those shows, as well as every other highly valued show that aired this season had a multitude of flaws that harmed their overall quality when viewed holistically. Flip Flappers actually self-compromised less than Mob Psycho did despite being significantly more ambitious and tackling more challenging subject matter from the outset, which definitely factors into the overall product. I'd put Flip Flappers above both of them because its highs were higher and the ways in which it excelled were more important for an anime to excel in
Its sort of like FLCL but more serious, with less humor, and Yuri instead of teenage boy hormones. It also has a lot of "poetry" moments where events from earlier mirror or parallel with events later on. It rhymes. It also has consistently great animation until episode 10. Episodes 10 and 11 both have animation more consistent with your average anime, and episodes 12 and 13 have some 'quality' moments mixed with a few Sakuga scenes. The main story is pretty simple and straight forward, but there is a lot more going on underneath the hood for those who love to analyze stuff and get a kick out of symbolism. The show also does a great job of showing instead of telling- but this is a double edged sword, since it caused some people to get lost in what is otherwise a very simple plot.
Its not perfect, but there are also not many shows like it, despite it heavily referencing and pulling inspiration from some classics. People who really dig what it is doing will likely label it AOTY or GOAT, as some people in these threads. Everyone else that is reasonable and has good taste will still likely include it somewhere on their top 10 shows of the year and appreciate what it does and how it succeeds overall as a show despite its flaws.
>The show also does a great job of showing instead of telling- but this is a double edged sword, since it caused some people to get lost in what is otherwise a very simple plot.
Also because it induces whiplash on those occasions where it resorts to telling to try and avoid leaving many viewers behind.
Yayaka said that the world makes people "hot and bothered," which is probably why they went through the loop a few times, and why Papika was putting a bit more into it each time. You can see her putting tongue into it during the final loop.
Saliva has a natural painkiller in it, hence the phrase "licking your wounds."
To that end, it's a kind of eroticism/intimacy they can sneak in without crossing particular thresholds.
>Therapeutic application of opiorphin in humans would require modifying the molecule to avoid its rapid degradation in the intestine and its poor penetration of the blood–brain barrier.
The phrase licking your wounds comes from describing the behaviour of dogs who compulsively like injuries both because they enjoy the taste of fresh blood and because it's a compulsive action to cope with pain and irritation since the animal can't tell the difference between an external source of harm stimulus and aching pain from an injury.
There's no active painkiller in human saliva
This research refers to a newfound method of synthesizing a painkiller that uses a compound found in human saliva as an active ingredient. It has no meaningful effect on its own and doesn't influence the practice or etymology of the phrase (the two of which are unrelated).
People suck their own finger after an injury because blood leaking from the opposable digits you use to manipulate objects in your environment causes a mess and blood stains like hell. With nowhere else to put the mess-making injury, they stuff it in their mouth so the blood doesn't get anywhere else. Typically, superficial hand injuries bleed easily but stop just as quickly, so you only actually need to keep your finger in your mouth for a few moments to solve the issue. It's actually a bad practice in terms of health concerns because the human mouth tends to play host to more infectious bacteria than a used toiletbowl and that's not something you want to envelop an open wound with.
Sucking someone else's finger isn't a real thing. It appears in media simply because finger-sucking is a lurid act of phallic submission and typically associated both with male oral sex and with lesbian intercourse. It's just an excuse to shoehorn sexually suggestive imagery and tension into a scene. There's no real-world basis for it beyond that.
So Papika just enjoys the taste of fresh blood?
Dogs also lick others to show affection.
But yeah, Papika has an established disposition to enjoy Cocona's iron-enriched discharge
I feel like over half of my PPKs are of her in that outfit. It's easy to forget she only wore it for one episode
Yayaka will be dressed up in way cuter outfits in the future.
That's trying to suck the venom out. Which doesn't work since it spreads too fast.
You can't suck out bacteria reliably. Washing with distilled water and using a disinfectant is the recommended method of preventing infection.
We've seen from early episodes that whenever Cocona and Papika went inside Pure Illusion, they were around a Thomasson in the real world.
It follows that, since no Thomassons were spotted in the last 4 episodes, that NyuNyu was a biological Thomasson, created to fulfill this function.
In those last 4 eps, characters other than Mimi were able to go to Pure Illusion at will (incuding PapiCoco) because NyuNyu was around them.
And thus, by becoming, a living, breathing Thomasson, NyuNyu gains a purpose and is no longer a Thomasson.
I'm probaby jinxing it, but I'm impressed that Amazon ranking for regular, and occasionally Amazon edition has stayed consistently in the 300s since the finale aired. At least it can't be explained by someanithing buying 10 copies of each volume anymore.
It also doesn't work because most venom's are potent enough that only a tiny amount needs to enter the bloodstream in order to be effective, while a single bite/sting injects several hundred or thousands of times that amount.
>I feel like there might be some holes in this theory
I can think of a few
Saliva's primary purpose is to lubricate your mouth. Secondarily, it introduces chemicals that will assist digestion in your stomach. Those chemicals are specifically meant to react with the chemicals in your stomach, so outside of your body they're useless.
So Papika was lubing up Cocona's finger?
I'd say Rakugo is better, but Mob is not, but the comparison is pretty difficult. Rakugo is better because it may be literally "perfect", it has no major flaws that I can see, but it's a completely different type of show. Mob is closer, but man if you want to complain about the Flip Flappers story at the end, I'll just reply that Mob's story was worse than that from the start and only got worse. "comedy" is not an excuse for that shit. Mob inarguably has better animation than Flip Flappers, but Mob Psycho inarguably has better animation than pretty much anything on TV.
Lack of ambition is definitely a flaw. Rakugo failed to really utilize the potential of the fact that it was adapted into a predominantly visual medium whose presentation is done entirely through abstraction and constant conjunction.
If it had been a live action drama, it would have probably been above average if not excellent. It gained nothing by being an anime instead and I'd say it lost something in that choice since it certainly didn't take advantage of its medium of choice.
It had strong characters and strong narrative but the presentation was 'just there'. In animation that might as well be a crime.
Promise me these threads'll die when the fumes run dry.
It only takes an overzealous fanbase to ruin everything. My Jojo, Madoka and KLK-related reaction folders are all fucking radioactive, and the Papis are too good.
the fumes are already dying down. This thread has been significantly slower than any of the previous ones.
We may get some threads popping up around BD releases, but its pretty easy to tell that the cancer wont grow as strong or fast as Madoka, nor was it as strong from the start as with Jojo and KLK.
Oh god, this.
Jojo was a goldmine of great faces but they might as well be fucking AIDS for their inextricable association with that awful fanbase.
Don't do this to my Papikas and my Coconas.
Right from the start Flipflappers threads were more restrained then Madoka's. Prime example being the resistance to making charts of all the references and observations, even though those first episodes really needed them.
I was referencing Hume there but to keep it brief and as un-pretentious as possible:
Animation isn't movement, it's the illusion of movement. We see a series of still frames in sequence and intuitively infer action from it. The fact that people knowingly and willingly do this without even thinking about it is huge potential for what you can actually show your audience, because it's an affordance given exclusively to animated media. The artistic freedom of visual presentation is much greater because the audience is already inherently receptive to making links and associations between images in order to make an idea presented visually work. It's why you can see frames like pic related and appreciate that it's a person moving impossibly, inhumanly fast and not just a literal series of coloured lines.
Confirmed by the author later. Good times.
I remember months ago when I watched the first episode because I barely picked up anything this season and I figured what the hell do I have to lose on giving an original a half hour of my time, I'll probably drop it by episode two or three.
Boy am I ever so glad to pleasantly surprised.
The imagery in this show was unbelievably dense, anon. Doubly so now that it's been actually confirmed that it was using a Jungian underpinning as the basis for its extended visual metaphors. It probably deserves page after page after page for each and every episode if you were to explore them exhaustively. I wish I were a brave enough man to make Flip Flappers my doctoral thesis.
If your Japanese is good enough (it doesn't need to be very good at all) to justify focusing on a Japanese work, I'd say full speed ahead. "Analytical psychology as a basis for effective storytelling in animation, as evidenced by a Japanese cartoon about pubescent lesbians " is a pretty damn good dissertation.
>let it sink in over the past couple of days
>rewatch episode 1
>pic related happens
>flashback to their first meeting in dick tree limbo
She really was waiting a long time to meet Cocona again. She confirmed it was her via smell.
You would rightfully embarrass yourself.
But on the other hand, you would be a professional Flip Flapper if you can get away with it.
Creative it was. But a classic? It's more like an example of what not to do in your last arc.
At least it delivered on the yuri I guess.
>. "Analytical psychology as a basis for effective storytelling in animation, as evidenced by a Japanese cartoon about pubescent lesbians " is a pretty damn good dissertation.
Oh to be back in college once more. I would write that up in a heartbeat. Although I don't think i could keep myself from blushing during the defense
I can't even imagine what field I would have to be in for that to be taken seriously.
I suppose psychoanalysis would be the obvious one, particularly if I was a Jungian scholar.
Still, defending a paper like that would be nigh impossible unless you have a young or extremely post-structural leaning panel.
even Jacob Chapman, the guy who made this show popular in the first place and then subsequently started the shit storm about episodes 8-12 being bad, says that the finale was amazing and saved Flip Flappers. He ultimately gave the series only one small notch below a perfect score.
I see you really felt the writer change.
Yurifags have a weird tendency to care about the opinion of ANN.
It was just the same when Pandora in the Crimson Shell aired. They always complained about that girl who bashed kPandora for being low-quality.
Part of me finds it tragically funny that /a/ has so many scholars and former academics content to post ephemeral insight 20 words at a time on 4chan while idiots like this >>151671615
are at large.
I kind of did.
>I prefer to contain my autism
But that's no fun.
All worthy achievements came about through the power of autism.
>I can't even imagine what field I would have to be in for that to be taken seriously.
It would fit into an art degree, you may be able to finagle it into a social science with some heavy modification, but i doubt it
>one faggot always brings up some external critique that nobody gives a shit
>suddenly an entire group is involved with that shit
You couldn't be more retarded if you tried, anon. The fact that you went straight for this cheap yurifag bait is proof that you have no idea what the fuck you're saying. Sadly, there's always that one faggot that does this. No show is safe nowadays.
>She confirmed it was her via smell.
And there's the whole thing about the sense of smell being processed in the limbic system.
>a complex system of nerves and networks in the brain, involving several areas near the edge of the cortex concerned with instinct and mood. It controls the basic emotions (fear, pleasure, anger) and drives (hunger, sex, dominance, care of offspring).
Art might be pushing it.
Actual arts don't take animation seriously unless your school has a faculty for it specifically (which is practically none). The first thing the panel will ask you is why you thought animation had any academic value worthy of analyzing and publishing to the academic community.
In Liberal Arts would be even worse. Don't even bother unless you know for certain the panel will have a prominent scholar of psychoanalisys.
This show and Princess Tutu are the same to me. They both tell a relatively simple story about self-discovery and love in unusual, creative ways. Tutu is hailed as a classic but the first half of the second season seems like something that most would criticize heavily if it aired now with how different it was from season 1. I think Flip Flappers' latter episodes are like this as well. However, both were not complete without them and both had spectacular finales that wrapped everything up nicely.
Both are some of my favorite shows now.
The second post was a joke using the meme about the ANN reviewer that was pretty popular in our threads for a few weeks.
I think the whole "go back in time to change things" idea is dumb and not at all what happened.
But its neat to see that my head canon was cross board posted.
Christ even the title is clickbait.
I can't imagine these people have any confidence in their actual writing or arguments when they rely on the same tactics as tabloids to draw in readers
FlipFlap episodes rank
2, 4, 6, 9
5, 7, 8, 13
10, 11, 12
>go back in time to change things
It does nicely explain why Evil Mimi gave the baby to Papika then exploded and was a thing that Mimi specifically said she wanted to do.
Although that line being there merely as one of the fakeout endings is also a fun idea.
intellectual is the wrong word. FliFla treats its audience like an adult. it tells a story that is engaging on multiple levels. For the person who just wants cute girls and adventure it works, for the person who wants to dig deeper the author left plenty for you to find.
it was also refreshing with happy ending that gave a middle finger to every depressing bittersweet trope that is currently overused
So after the director confirmed that the PIs corresponded to specific characters, we can be reasonably certain that episode 7's PI was either Cocona's or Papika's
The question is which one of them it was.
PIs can also be about relationships, like Hidaka and Bu-chan in ep 8. The world in ep 7 was a representation of how Cocona felt about her relationship with Papika when she was questioning the reasons she went to PI for and if Papika is worth the dangers it entails.
>FliFla treats its audience like an adult.
This is what I want from anything, whether it's fluffy yuri stories, Hollywood movies, politics or whatever. If you always treat people like idiots then they never have a reason to stop being idiots.
Well of course, any reasonable anon would be annoyed by the sheer stupidity of a post like yours because of how transparent your baiting was. At least the others wait one post after the number of their IP is no longer visible to stir up shit.
I guess you're still haunted by that boogeyman.
Extremely off-the-wall theses with a lot of pages can slide through pretty easily in any soft science, particularly if you find a way to demonstrate that there exists a tenured professor who has studied the topic.
>This is what I want from anything
You are in the minority. It appears most people want easy to digest garbage they can watch while sitting on the shitter and posting on twitter.
I hope the new Oshiyama/Yuasa thing will feature adults as main characters considering how sexual it's said to be. Hopefully lesbian too. We don't really have an equivalent to Yuri on Ice
True, but I would argue your level of enjoyment drops significantly. The best part of the series may have been the discussion surrounding the series. Once you find all the little symbolic bits you rematch and its a different experience.
Well that stuff has a place too. Sometimes your brain needs a rest.
Just put some interesting stuff in there as well. Non-non Biyori is an example of something which I think gets this right. It can be brainless and relaxing but there's hidden depths if you want to spend time thinking about it.
No, I think you misunderstood. It was about "switching". Like with Iro, "going back" to when her aunt forgot her name was the catalyst that changed her personality. For Salt, such a catalyst would be his personal mistakes and decisions, and for Mimi, the catalyst is the Birth of Cocona. Its not about actually changing the past, but changing your mindset and how you react and felt towards that past that has the butterfly effect on who you are.
I think writing adult lesbians might be way harder than writing teenage ones, also Yuasa isn't really the yuri type of guy
This anon gets it.
Also, I too greatly enjoyed the segment where it decided to BTFO bittersweet ends- when Salt literally shot one of the bittersweet ends with his gun I almost jumped for joy.
These are the >OFFICIAL< ratings of each Flip Flappers episodes.
Yuasa would be senior on that project right?
The only maybe lesbian thing I can see on his credits is an episode and the ed of Michiko to Hatchin.
Looking grim I'd say.
It's pretty funny how different communities can come to completely different consensus interpretations of this stuff. The SA paywall went up so I took a look at ADTRW's FlipFlap thread, and those guys were 100% convinced that episode 5 is Yayaka's mind - an interpretation I haven't seen being taken seriously anywhere else.
I think this is actually a really important tension to identify.
Episodes like 3 are masturful because, while they contain lots of symbolic meaning and signification which is important in the narrative as a whole, all of it fits so perfectly into the aesthetic of the imagery that it still constructs a complete experience of viewing enjoyment even if you find those symbols completely meaningless.
Is it super interesting that Welwitschia has orange and blue-haired bondage slaves moaning erotically in an open bath orgy? You bet your ass.
Do you need to even ask that question to feel like that scene had a place in the episode? Not really, moaning bondage bath orgies fits in pretty much perfectly with all of the crazy mad max imagery that built up the episode's aesthetic. Even completely meaningless, it still had a place in the bigger picture. You didn't have to think to enjoy it or feel like it worked as part of the episode, but you could if you wanted to.
Most of the visual metaphor in the series worked that way. There were very few points where you had to ask questions to reconcile something.
In fact, those were most notably episode 7 and the finale 4 episodes. The former because it was so caught up in building representing the relationship between Cocona and Papika through its presentation that there wasn't really much to be entertained by unless you were actively interpreting the meaning behind things presented in the episode. The latter 4 because they brought the deeper meanings of those symbols throughout the show to a head, they were the climax of the underlying meanings and the narrative undercurrent that had been backgrounding the entire series IF you had bothered to be actively interpreting it.
Regardless of how well those 4 episodes did of capitulating the narrative, I think one of the biggest issues people have with them is simply that they didn't have much interest in secondary or underpinning meanings and questions in those symbols.
I would argue an anonymous place like 4chan is going to generate the best discussion because the only strength you have is the argument at the time, everyone is equal and the best rise to the top.
a place with names has reputation and people will value some posters above others because of who they are, not always what they say.
I really don't want to defend stuff like this all the time with "well it had to be intentional", but it can't be denied that Flip Flappers is filled to the brim with allusions to "useless" things - Thomassons are only the tip of it. Remember Cocona's glasses in episode 1?
Just gonna leave this here.
Except on 4chan one idiot with an agenda and a lot of time on their hands can also easily shill their point of view until people start believing it's consensus. It's not that simple.
I ran out of space because I'm drunkposting but lemme tl;dr
I think one of the strengths of Flip Flappers was that it was highly enjoyable at face value. I think a lot of people enjoyed it for that strength.
I think the negative reaction to the last arc is largely fueled by the fact that it chose to bring those non surface-level issues to the forefront, so the expectations of people who enjoyed the surface were left unfulfilled.
I agree. I was really looking forward to an anime building a world out of narrative techniques and obscure art references instead of powers and abilities. I enjoyed the show but it could have been so much more.
fair point, i personally have never understood that behavior but it happens. Its a completely different mindset
The world in episode 5 fell apart when the gem was taken.
5 wasn't a single PI, it was an entire series of PIs held together by an incredibly powerful and oversized defense trap. It was a PI nexus caught in an amorphous spiderweb.
It was likely the PI of the entire student body of the school, with the gokingynoids each representing a different mind and incumbent PI enthralled by the trap.
After all, the nature of the structure of a school system is to bring many disparate people together and subject them to a system of standardized expectations, routine and evaluation. In a way, a rigid school is a structural collapse of umwelt into uniformity.
For me it’s almost the opposite. The upper layer is not working well in those last episodes. Where the bondage slaves made perfect sense and the whole episode had a well built up climax, the superficial storytelling in the last episodes was rather shoddy and messy. It didn’t work as a standalone narrative without having to look for deeper meanings. Or rather it did, it just wasn’t particularly good.
Flip Flappers was a masterpiece because of how it managed to marry the face value meaning with hidden symbolism, and that’s what broke down in the last episodes. The symbolism wasn’t exactly hidden any more and the superficial story sucked. (At least its execution did)
That's right. The only consensus here is that anyone who doesn't share my opinion has shit taste.
This is actually a really on point observation. It helps me better understand what the big dividing difference between those who liked the finale episodes and those who did not.
I am one of those who really likes the whole series, finale included. My only real issues with the series is that I feel that the pacing is a bit wonky sometimes in episode 12 and 13, and also that the animation has some more "quality" in those two episodes specifically.
But the animation will be fixed for sure in the BDs, and the pacing issues aren't massive gamechangers- and could theoretically be fixed pretty easy with "directors cut" versions of those same episodes that have an extra 3-6 minutes each.
So I have been confused about why some really dislike the finale episodes, and I think you hit the nail on the head here- some people just didn't look past the surface of the show, so when the show peeled back to reveal its layers, they were upset because they never saw or cared for anything beyond the surface layers.
>some people just didn't look past the surface of the show, so when the show peeled back to reveal its layers, they were upset because
Or maybe they just thought all the stuff involving Mimi wasn't as interesting?
Your argument here is literally, "everyone who disagrees with me just didn't pay attention". Fuck off faggot.
Im a bit drunk right now, so maybe I am not explaining myself real well. Sorry. Thats not what I meant.
What I am saying boils down to "Flip Flappers had many things. At some point, it decided to focus on being only a few of those things. Therefore, the people who were watching for the things that lost focus are understandably upset."
That was kind of my point.
The upper layers of the final episodes were the under-layers of the rest of the series brought to the forefront. If you had been enjoying the show for its main strengths, then it would feel like something else had just suddenly kicked all the good stuff to the curb and taken over.
And in reality, that is exactly what happened.
I feel like a pre-requisite for liking the final episodes is liking the stuff under the surface.
I hate using the "surface" and "under the surface" phrasing because it implies a hierarchy that I don't mean to imply. I think the surface-layer was the strength of Flip Flappers, and the fact that layers beneath it NEVER intruded was what made the first two-thirds a masterpiece. It was there, but it was never there at the expense of anything else.
Then the finale comes along and suddenly those lower layers are right in your face at the expense of everything else. It was a radical shift in the approach and I feel like a lot of people were rightly upset that the lesser part of the show's appeal became the climax while their visceral enjoyment of its quality presentation, aesthetics and storytelling went unrewarded as it took a back seat to Jung.
more like there never really was something to care about salt and mimi in the last arc, and those two were already hinted on the surface level on the earlier episodes that their reveal just felt like a limp dick in the end. Imo it was all about the execution. They were able to make a very emotional arc out of Iroha, then why it is something they werent able to do with Mimi and Salt? And it goes without saying that the last 4 episodes sucks quality wise, so it wont be too far off to say that they had issues with the schedule and whatnot
That actually makes sense to me. The time loop, creepy girls who try to rope you into everyday school life and the dokidoki should all be part of the defense trap and prevent you from wanting to find the amorphous.
Also thinking about the Mad Max PI again, it seems to me that Sayuri may have been in focus there and the world shaped in the way that she feels about the Flip Flap vs. Asclepius conflict. Even with Welwitschia's kinks and kinda similar hair style, the desert planet had low resources, not many inhabitants and had to make due with what they found while the raiders just did whatever they wanted and took what they needed and if they felt like it took it from the desert people. In the preview before ep 3 Sayuri even complains to Hidaka that the electricity bill is too high.