Tomino on Evangelion

>>150577824
>and to encourage them to work happily until they die
He's a cuck

Yoshiyuki "I sold my soul to Bandai" Tomino makes toy commercials for a living, and people are more likely to buy toys if they aren't depressed.

>>150577914
No, just a japanese.

>>150577824
He's a collectivist brainwashed idiot. If he actually said this, which I doubt because it looks like bait, he's a fucking retard. If this isn't bait, Tomino must be a fucking retard.

Man, who doesn't know Optimus Prime?

>>150578106
Y-you too.

>>150578106
>He's a collectivist
So, again, a japanese.

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Shinji learns to love himself at the end though?

>>150577824
Is this the ideology behind moe shit?

>>150577824
>Doesn't even care that Evangelion ripped off his works
Truly a humble man, as expected from the master.

>>150578211
You shouldn't love yourself if you haven't got my robot toys you piece of shit.

>>150578235
hahha you may have shit taste but at least you're funny.
Are you the same guy who always talks about Ideon in every Eva thread?

>>150577824
Tomino is an old fashioned japanese men. He's from a time when men were expected to perform their duty without complaining and dwelling in self pity.
>I think that we should try to show people how to live healthier, fuller lives, to foster their identity as a part of their community, and to encourage them to work happily until they die.
showcases perfectly his point of view.
If Shinji was on the White Base, he would have been slapped to death until he got on the fucking robot and stopped bitching about how his dad didn't love him.

>>150578331
Shinji would either have killed himself or gone full school shooter with his Gundam.

>>150578387
That's exactly what he does in EoE.

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Why is the average Nip so plebeian?
>It's not entertainment for the masses(...)
>(...) I don't think that's a real work of art.
>(...) I think that we should try to show people how to live healthier, fuller lives, to foster their identity as a part of their community, and to encourage them to work happily until they die. I can't accept any work that doesn't say that.
From this I infer this retarded "anime personality" Nip isn't familiar with the novelists from his own country or that he doesn't consider them artists?
WHAT A FUCKING SURPRISE.

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>>150577824
It means he created a superior work with superior characters like pic related

>>150578498
>Tominofags mistaking inconsistent characterization as complexity
Always funny.

>>150577824
Dunno if this actually true but that's bullshit, I don't know what kind of idiot takes to face value everything they watch, it's almost as if he was telling people are stupid and cant think by thelmselves.

He is kind of right though, but fuck that

evafags are the worst fanbase here. lord Tomino(PBUH) showing them their rightful place

>>150577824
It exactly means what he said. Tomino sure isn't senile at least.

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>>150577824
>This from the man that made Zambot 3 and Zeta

>>150578440
What Dazai would say?

>>150577824
>Instead they tried to convince the audience to admit that everybody is sick, practically in the middle of a nervous breakdown, all the time.
>tomino being this retarded
>surprising
pick one.

>>150578387
Well he did kinda go "fuck the free world" in EoE. Admittedly he was at least partially insane by then and everything was going to shit, but yeah he totally did.

He's saying that he likes works which tell people how to live rather than ones that acknowledge the way we actually live.

He's a product of his time. Thankfully his era is long past.

>>150578498
>superior characters
More easily likeable, perhaps. But not better written. 3deep5me memes aside, Eva has what are probably the best written characters in anime, and high up there for even fiction itself. In fact, Evangelion is more true to the human condition because it does not deny human sexuality or silliness. These too are just as much a part of humanity as serious things are. Few stories have such an honest portrayal of humanity. Even other works praised for being a "deep" study of humanity are often pretentious because they only touch on certain sides of individuals, due to a mistaken belief that a work with serious things in it must always be serious to be good. Regardless of what you think of the mecha, the lore, or whether or not you like Shinji personally, the characters in Eva are true to humanity in a way few stories ever have or will show.

You're going to kill me, but I honestly think that Evangelion is better than LOTR in certain aspects.

>>150577973
Link at least 5 studies that prove your toy-buying demographic theory

>>150578554
Zeta was perfect. Char's Counterattack ruined his characterization.

>>150578439
>>150578696
Well, yeah. Anno doesn't, or at least didn't, shy away from making a character do things that people don't accept.

>>150578765
But it was perfectly consistent.

Do you think Char was just going to sit there and chill while the Federation litearlly did nothing? Zeta directly makes him into CCA char.

>>150578694
>implying he's wrong about eva

>>150577824
He sounds like a massive faggot

>>150578765
>Char's Counterattack ruined his characterization
Retard.

>>150577824
>-it's much more interested in admitting that we're all depressed nervous wrecks, I thought.

But isn't that true?

>It was a work that told people it was okay to be depressed, and it accepted the psychological state that said if you don't like the way the world works, then it's okay to just pick up a gun and attack someone.

What? Fuck off. This is beyond the average 2deep failure to grasp the show,

>>150578818
>Goes from joining A.E.U.G.
>to fucking dropping asteroids on Earth
explain why didn't he just join forces with Haman Karn then? They both had the same goal in making Zeon great again.

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Doesn't take away from the fact that Eva is literally top 5 anime all time and Tomino wishes he could even make a film as great as EoE.

Not bait, not troll.

>>150578823
He isn't wrong, it's the fact he thinks something like that shouldn't be made that makes him a retard. He's telling people not to make stories that don't portray humanity in an optimistic light.

>>150578498
Char did nothing wrong
SIEG ZEON!

>>150578866
Wasn't Eva actually optimistic? I feel like the characters displayed negative personality traits for the express purpose to show how NOT to act

>>150578823

>implying eva is wrong about humanity

>>150578868
You're a ADHD retard, Char fall to grace was hinted many times during Zeta final episode.

>>150577824
I look forward to Tomino's utopia where nobody is sad and everybody is happy

>>150578934
Well, it wasn't saying "Look at this, you're all horrible pieces of shit". It was saying "This is what people are like. It's up to you to choose to accept them or reject them". I feel Eva wasn't trying to tell you "this is bad" or "this is good". Eva completely ignores any preconceptions of what is good or bad, it shows you things and lets you decide. It wants you to think for yourself, that's the whole point of EoE.

>>150578868
But they didn't. Haman was after domination, Char was after forcing everyone off Earth.

Char wanted to end the earth-centric political class from fucking spacenoids over, to help everyone become newtypes and to let the planet recover.

He spends a bunch of time in zeta trying to convince people, seems to get some positive results and waits.

6 years later not only is everything the same, the federation literally made a colony just to hold refugees in a hurry and people are living there as a perminent residence now and there are 0 plans to do anything about this becuase the Federation do not give a solitary shit.

>>150578907
None of his works portray humanity in an optimistic light.
All his stories are about the hope that the newer generations won't repeat the same atrocities as the old ones.

>>150578666
The fantasy side of Evangelion would definitely throw him off, but if he'd manage to finish the TV series, he'd understand the psychological themes and be okay with it. You might say Ep26 would bring him to tears even.

>>150578934

Well, yes? Yui's speech at EoE works with the rest of the movie/show to essentially say "we're all depressed fuckups, and that's mostly because we want to believe we are". It's all self-inflicted.

Among other things, of course.

Get in the fucking robot, Shinji.

>>150578640
>Zambot 3

That fucking ending man.

>>150579061
t. Ikari "I turned my wife into a giant monster" Gendo

>>150578970
nowhere at all was it hinted at. unless you're talking about that Z Gundam end cutscene. In that one they show Char undergoing a change and understanding that Earth is doomed in his view after watching Kamille become a veggie.

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>>150579106
>killed even the dog
lol

>>150577914

Maybe he meant working as a Marxist saboteur?

>>150579164
>lol
>tumblr

Fuck off

>>150577824
Didn't Tomino also say that people owning video game consoles was a major contributor to global warming or something?

>>150577824
Brain Powerd? More like Brain DAMAGE.

I think the real deep part about Eva is how most viewers reacted to it and treat the series. People still can't understand humanity. It's an interesting reflection of everything shown in the series.

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>>150579061
You hit me! Not even my father ever hit me!

Tomino is awful. As person and as writer. He was jsut in the right place at the right time. He's lorious dialogues are magnum opus of retardism

>>150577824
Tomino should read Ayn Rand

>>150577824
>It was a work that told people it was okay to be depressed, and it accepted the psychological state that said if you don't like the way the world works, then it's okay to just pick up a gun and attack someone.
What the actual fuck? Did he even watch the show?
Also
>show people how to live healthier, fuller lives
>work """happily""" until they die
Pick one.

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>>150579234
Are you upset?

>>150579339
I don't think he read anything

>>150579346
You are trying to make sense of Yoshiyuki "Garzey's Wing" Tomino.
You are better off saving your time.

>>150579275
What do you mean?

>>150579244
He said that video games were a waste of time.

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>>150577824
>encourage them to work happily until they die
Is this one of those nip double meanings?
Did he basically tell all depressive people everywhere to just do it?

From an earlier thread I remember people saying the message behind Brain Powerd is that feminism is the root of all evil, and women belong in the kitchen? inb4 edgelords saying it's true
I'm watching Brain Powerd and I'm worried if it's true that it has a message that stupid.

>>150579492
He's saying that media should help people fit into their communities and the expectations the community has of them and help them be fulfilled while doing this.

He means it quite literalyl when he says happily work rather than "suck it up"

>>150579435
People obsess over Asuka and Rei, yet both sides fail to understand their own waifu. People hate Shinji, who is the representation of the everyman. In hating Shinji, they are hating themselves and the rest of humanity without realzing it. People look to and focus on the "deep" parts of the series about religious symbolism, and all that shit, when that isn't important at all.

>>150579541
When he's depressed Tomino blames women for everything, that wouldn't be anything new.
But in most of his works that's not the case.

>>150579554
By fitting in you mean stop being depressed? Because as much as some people can get a tattoo removal or a fake pinky to fit in better, it's not like I can go online and buy a human brain.

>>150579589
>In hating Shinji, they are hating themselves and the rest of humanity without realzing it.
I've met a ton of those people, I had no idea why I was disgusted by them until now. Thanks, anon.

>>150579848
Stop being depressed in the sense of media helping depressed people to develop a healthier mindset yes, remember Tomino went through depressin himself, he's not going to just be like "hurr depressed people should just stop being depressed"

>>150577824
Bitter old man whos rarely even allowed to write in his own franchise because he's so shit at it, you could get away with sloppy writing in the 80s but not today.

>>150580064
>Tomino the man who has trid to end gundam like 6 times
>wanting to write regularly for it

>>150578311
Ideon (the movie) was miles better than anything Eva though.

Tomino certainly deserves more respect than Anno. He has a message, and he is true to his ideals.

Turn A > shit > NGE

>>150579151
>nowhere at all was it hinted at
>can't fucking read between the lines
>can't fucking recognize symbolism
>can't interpret lines

Stick to IBO.

>>150580396
more like IB SLOW

Seriously that show is fucking boring even though it has all the componenets needed to be good.

>>150578666
Dazai would just kill himself without saying anything. That's what separates a genius from the hacks.

>>150578554
>implying anything about tomino's characters was inconsistent
G-reco aside, everything else was consistent

>>150578717
You might be right, actually

>>150578921
You're a good man

>>150577824
Sounds like hes bein a cunt.

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Did anyone else feel incredibly disgusted at the Instrumentality part? It's the most perverted thing i've ever fucking seen in my entire life and it isn't even real.

Then when watching the rebuilds I couldn't even fucking sympathize with Gendo or Rei because they're both fucking disgusting for even wanting that to happen.

So my point comes to this, Why didn't the nip government just nuke the friggin NERV site to stop it?

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Navel-gazing overly cynical shit is easy to praise because it takes the negative impulses everyone already feels and glorifies and legitimizes them. It makes people think "yeah, I'm not a lazy directionless fuck, the world is just too dark and sinister to ever really care about anything".

Stories about people who actually overcome their problems are infinitely more valuable than stories that make you sympathize with failures.

>>150578717
Peanuts by Schulz is a better work of fiction depicting the complexity of the human experience (with all the serious and silly moments it comprises) than Evangelion could ever hope to be.Charlie Brown in particular, is a much richer character study about the psyche of a depressed young boy trying to figure out his place in a society that rejects him than Shinji Ikari.Stop talking about silly giant robots and get to read that instead, you pleb.

>>150580681
>Did anyone else feel incredibly disgusted at the Instrumentality part? It's the most perverted thing i've ever fucking seen in my entire life and it isn't even real.
Implying it isn't and you aren't in one right now.

>>150580694
>Stories about people who actually overcome their problems are infinitely more valuable than stories that make you sympathize with failures.
But that's exactly what happens in NGE.

>>150580790
I'm not in one because i'm not dead. That a good enough reason?

>>150577824
Tomino jelly that he couldn't dethrone Eva with Brain Powered.

>>150580820
It sort of happens in the Rebuilds. Shinji doesn't overcome anything, he just finally does what he's told in the original.

>>150580120
They need his name in the credits, they don't need his input.

>>150580836
But how can you be sure?

>>150580681
I thought Instrumentality was beautiful. A total breakdown of the self in exchange for inclusion in the bliss of a collective consciousness literally sounds like Heaven. To recognize the self is to recognize the other and its differences, most of which run counter to the self. Why do you think Asuka said that she felt sick at the end of EoE? For the first time in her life she felt peace and contentment. One moment later, she's being choked by the cowardly asshole who removed her from that peace because he was too afraid of change.

>>150580325
>Turn A
Couldn't even make it halfway through that shit.

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>>150577824
If you use Evangelion as a model for what your morals and goals should be there are other problems that need to be addressed. Like some kind of seriously debilitating autism.

I wouldn't be surprised if this guy was equally brain dead, though.

>>150580947
What a fucking commie.

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>>150577824
>based Tomino does it again
Well, he didn't really get what Eva was about I guess. He falls into category of people who watch the show and then complain what a shit protagonist Shinji is.
Evangelion wasn't trying to show us pretty characters, it tried to show us people, it's quite relevant as a sort of coming-of-age drama. I never actually understood how it became popular. It's arthouse as fuck. I mean, dream sequences, long walks, long shots, disastrous couples and all.
>It was a work that told people it was okay to be depressed
Not really. I guess he didn't get it in the end

>>150580728
>implying
I've been reading peanuts since I was a little child. And I mean the original comics too.

>Shinji fucking Ikari is happier in the end of Evangelion than Tomino is in real life

Tippity top tier lel, GG Anno truly the master

>>150581055
So you agree, right?

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>>150580947
>Shinji removed Asuka from Instrumentality
nice meme

>>150581085
Shouldn't the question be if Anno is happier than Tomino?

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>>150580941
Because the only thing that is sure in life is death. I can still see this, As I have been dead before and I will be again. Just not now, And deep down I think we all know what death feels like.
>>150580947
You disgust me beyond belief. You would trade yourself, Your exact fucking being and all peace in life for cheap fucking pleasure in hell. I swear to fucking god, Reach down deep inside and say that you wouldn't fucking grab one with tooth and claw to any reality left. You are worse than any human being I have ever met. To die is one thing, But to be defiled in a limbo of life and death? That's my hell.

>>150579589
What do Reifags represent?

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>>150581244
>To die is one thing, But to be defiled in a limbo of life and death? That's my hell.
d33p

>>150580694
>Admitting the world is a shithole and most people are fundamentally unhappy is a bad thing
I'm sorry but most people will never have the ability or the means to substantively change the world, no matter what naruto or luffy tells you.
It's better to admit the world and and people are on the whole shitty with some good parts then bury your head in the sand scream about friendship and try and punch the world into a better place.

>>150581156
To an extent, yes. Evangelion was more pertinent to Japanese culture though, Shinji is not just a depressed boy but specifically a japanese depressed boy. Charlie Brown is an American in an American society, the two stories have different audiences in mind. I would agree Peanuts is better on some points.

>>150581275
Reifags fail to realize Rei is just as much a troubled individual as everyone else, perhaps even more so than anyone else. Rei is someone removed from humanity struggling to understand her place in existence, she may be a better pilot than Asuka, but she is just as conflicted by her own mental constructions and roadblocks.

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>>150581324
Nope. The idea of being stuck in an eternal purgatory is my hell, Being stuck in the middle line is the worst thing possible to ever happen. Ever. At least death grants you solace and peace at your purest form.

>>150580256
are you senile?

>>150581244
Is it possible to remember? More important, is it possible to not forget? The only real Experience I ever had was completely random and unexpected.

>>150581330
You have been a good sport, so I will admit I was trying to bait you to an extent in light of your LoTR remark.My issue is that LoTR pursues a completely different goal than Evangelion, so saying that Evangelion is better in some unespecified regard isn't really saying much. But yeah, Peanuts is great, specially the mid-sixties early-seventies stretch.

>>150581486
Yes, but that is unrelated.

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>>150581523
>Is it possible to remember? More important, is it possible to not forget? The only real Experience I ever had was completely random and unexpected.
It is possible to remember. But not entirely, Imagine memory like one big cloud. One big cloud that stores all the memory in the world from other peoples experiences. It's possible to remember, But many things will be "skeptical" to you. Experiences are incredible feats from your mind, It varies with people.

Gundam has better mechs than the "mechs" in Eva. Therefore Tomino is superior.

>>150577824
Gathering from what he said, Tomino is just an emotionless autist. That why the Gundam series have always had retarded drama and convoluted conversations about politics.

He would be the kind of guy who would slap his kid for being emotional and who think differently, much like what Bright did to Amuro in his anime.

>>150581733
Gundam mechas are generic pew pew trash. The Zaku are cool for being more like mass produced tanks, but that's it.

>>150580499
>he thinks suicide is an act of a genius

How about you try doing that?

>>150581244
I some days feel like instrumentaly would be the best thing ever and others feel like Shinji, realizing that ultimately there's no other choice but to be and reafirming my desire to be.
I think they're both somehow two faces of the same coin but I'm not so sure as to how.

>>150581022
>I never actually understood how it became popular. It's arthouse as fuck. I mean, dream sequences, long walks, long shots, disastrous couples and all.
It's not that weird when you realize what sort of stuff was popular twenty years prior to NGE.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5D9Uv-4sgsQ

>>150582009
I wouldn't like instrumentality at all. I get annoyed just being in the same house as other people, having be the same mind with everybody else would be hell. My self is the only thing I have really, I wouldn't trade it for the universe and more.

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>>150582009
I have a short answer to you.
Without pain, Or sorrow, Or blight, Or distress, worry, coping, management, redemption, anger, revenge.
What would make the bad days good? What would make them heavenly or serene in the first place? There will always be two sides of things. Like Ying and Yang. We exist always on the middle line.

>>150582095
I agree, I would prefer to suffer for all eternity while still being me than being at peace while being everyone.

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>>150577824
Wonder what Miyazaki thinks of eva, I know he and Anno are buddies

>>150581932
Well, I'm obviously no genius.

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>>150582161
Heaven is your own little bubble where you still are you, Living in what you would live in normally but feeling as though you are at a peace of mind. There is no suffering needed, Unless you go to hell. Which is the polar opposite of heaven.

>>150582186
Man, it's so annoying when some people take what Miyazaki words seriously.
>pure planefag
>I'm not otaku
>weeee pew pew

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>>150582186
Same. I wonder whether Miyazaki actually admires Anno's work beyond his animation skills, especially considering how fundamentally different their work is.

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>>150582009
I honestly think Instrumentality would be worse than hell. Imagine having a million voices, none of which are your own, all rambling in discord in some meaningless void where there's no you or her. Contact without contact and pleasure without pain. I remember reading Childhood's End when I was 15 or 16 and thinking: Oh shit not this again. The very idea sent shivers down my spine and made my hands sweat, even though I was already exposed to it because of NGE.

>>150579589
Thanks.

Isn't with Instrumentality you achive full empathy?

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>>150582579
This nigga get's it.

>>150582579
I read childhoods before watching EoE, I was pretty pissed off at the idea. It's basically collectivism taken to it's final form, and I hate collectivism.I've always felt humanity needs to take a step towards individuality. Well, I guess that is up to individuals by the nature of it, but as Kars said "the ultimate lifeform would be an individual, because being immortal and invulnerable, it would not need to reproduce". Now, Kars wasn't a very deep character.

>>150582579
It's a pretty horrible place indeed, What kind of fucked up and failure of a person you must be to accept Instrumentality?

>>150581471
But you are stuck in reality. I don't get it.

>>150577824
>nobody should innovate and should only stick to a narrow set of themes that I approve of
Said the guy whose whole career is retelling exactly the same damn story over and over again.

>>150582579
Its reminds me of nightmares I had in childhood during colds with big temperature

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>>150582613
Yes but there is no one to feel empathy because there's no you anymore. It's death for the dead.

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>Evafags
Kill yourselves

>>150582754
I don't get it either but I think if you look at it sideways like a battlefield you'll understand it a bit better.

>>150582752
I think thinking of people as failure or success is far more stupid.

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>>150577824
He meant that shinji should just get in the fucking robot, like it, and keep killing shit until he dies. Whatever problems he and his father have or gripes he has with the organization are stupid and insignificant in the face of danger. Its not okay to be a little bitch when people need saving, or when things need to get done. Get over your fucking self, do your job, even if you don't like or never asked for it, because thats just how life fucking works.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

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>>150582838
Well, That's the point isn't it. There are always going to be two lines and one middle line.

>>150582838
Failure is there for a lack of a better word, unless you could provide one, to justity why would you accept Instrumentality, I mean, it sounds like someone who failed at everything and has Instrumentality as it's last resort or something like that.

>>150577824
he is actually correct
but nevertheless g-reco is a huge pile of shit

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>>150582752
Well I know I would accept it in a heartbeat.

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>>150582776
>Eva
>innovate
Pick one

Tomino, Ideon, at least the anime series, was basically the same thing, though.

>>150578106
If he did say that, the quote has been attributed to him falsely for a very, very long time. Like at least 15 years.

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>>150582826
>nearly all 'fanservice' is intentional to mirror characters' personalities and actions
>waifu faggotry
just accept the fact that Eva is a masterpiece

>>150582890
You don't need to "fail" to be miserable or to suffer to much to bear your individuality.

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>Mfw people are actually realizing Instrumentality is hell and there were no good guys in EVA because everyone was edging towards it.

>>150577824
>Local toy salesman confused by art

>>150583012
we still don't know how many people actually returns from pee state in final of EOE.

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wasn't Instrumentality a kind of a place where everyone can imagine their waifus and just live in peace? therefore representing otaku culture of isolation?

>>150582777
Remember your dreams, even creepy or embarrasing ones. They can show you, just for a moment, who you really are.
Checked.

>It was a work that told people it was okay to be depressed, and it accepted the psychological state that said if you don't like the way the world works, then it's okay to just pick up a gun and attack someone.

I know a couple of anons here and in other threads have already said it, but what the literal fuck did he mean by this?

>>150577824
I think he meant
>So I was very upset when I saw Evangelion, because it was apparent to me that the people who made it weren't thinking at all about making fun for or gaining the sympathy of the audience. Instead they tried to convince the audience to admit that everybody is sick, practically in the middle of a nervous breakdown, all the time. I don't think you should show things like that to everybody. It's not entertainment for the masses--it's much more interested in admitting that we're all depressed nervous wrecks, I thought. It was a work that told people it was okay to be depressed, and it accepted the psychological state that said if you don't like the way the world works, then it's okay to just pick up a gun and attack someone. I don't think that's a real work of art. When people see that, they begin to realize they are the same way. I think that we should try to show people how to live healthier, fuller lives, to foster their identity as a part of their community, and to encourage them to work happily until they die. I can't accept any work that doesn't say that.

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>>150583025
>Evangelion isn't a toy commercial
It's even worse that it panders to waifufaggots

>>150583120
It was "Night Terrors". I had this shit untill 14 yo. Even without cold

>>150577824
An optimist that doesn't like depression.

>>150582861
But that's a stupid way to think. I shouldn't have to save everyone else if I don't want to be saved myself. If people want something done, they should do it themselves, it's far more cowardly to force other people to do your work in the guise of telling them to man up. Just because you require someone to do something for you in order to get what you want doesn't mean you're entitled to it. You can't just tell people "that's how life is" and expect people to obey you. If you really believed that and weren't just trying to make someone else work for you and do your job, you'd get in the fucking robot yourself.

>>150577824
I don't suck Eva's dick but, assuming this quote is legit, what the fuck is he talking about?

As if Eva is the first and only piece of fiction with a cast of sad sacks. I don't know why a specific handful of depressed fucks is supposed to represent the whole world, rather than being what it is: an examination of depressed fucks.

>>150583089
Yes. But, It's supposed to be all souls in one.
This is the fucking hypocrisy of SEELE.
It's supposed to be everyones paradise with everyone in it!
>>150583228
I still have night terrors of the mortar sirens in Afghanistan, It's a good thing to remember. Because eventually you'll look back and say "Hey, I had night terrors that made me incredibly scared! Thank god that's over!"

>>150583089
No, it was the exact opposite. It was a state where the souls of everyone, living and dead, fuses into a singular being (the orange tang) and loses all sense of identity. This was appealing to Gendo because it would allow him to reunite with and become one with his dead wife, and appealing to Shinji because he's an autist who has always felt alienated and isolated from others. Whereas Gendo gave into that temptation, Shinji stood strong and decided that humans having individuality and being able to connect through sharing their individual experiences was more precious than everyone being connected all the time.
Which could be said to be the message of Eva overall:
>Working hard to connect with others is more rewarding than just wishing for everyone to be connected tp you.

>>150583025
This post is already overrated.

Tomino is 100% correct. Evangelion is the product of a sick mind. It has no artistic merit.

Does it have a coherent themes? No.
Does it impart wisdom or insight to its viewers? No.
Does it explore any new ground? No.
It is it original or novel in conception/execution? No.
Does it represent a pinnacle of artistry in its genre? No.

Evengelion is the aborted result of a depressed individual yearning for love and success. It is a completely masturbatory splash of low budget animation hyper-focused for otaku merchandising. Self-referential to the point of parody, this anime is chock full of near plagiarist homages in a hodge podge of diluted and undirected plots which ultimately collide into an unimpressive and ambiguously empty finale. The ensuing End of Evangelion movie only furthers these repulsive traits, a Frankenstein patchwork of references and lifted imagery that eventually ends like a certain manga that deeply impacted the director's youth. A fitting conclusion to a self-indulgent series made by a man who just can't grow up. Its passive-aggressive jeers and jerks at its own audience only further solidifies the repulsive nature of Evangelion.

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>>150583451
>Gendo spends the entire time behind a desk and hundreds of layers of armer
.Shinji goes out in an insane monster many times weaker than his enemies multiple times and defends the entire human race with only an autist and an angry cunt to back him up
>Gendo was a pussy in the end and gave in
>Shinji decided to man up and face the world
Don't ever say Shinji was a bitch ever again.

>>150583517
I meant underrated.
God that went really wrong.

In Ideon, the main robot decides to kill everyone because they can't stop fighting.

>>150583555
Man, is this a copy pasta?

Anno is 100% correct. Gundamn is the product of a sick mind. It has no artistic merit.

Does it have a coherent themes? No.
Does it impart wisdom or insight to its viewers? No.
Does it explore any new ground? No.
It is it original or novel in conception/execution? No.
Does it represent a pinnacle of artistry in its genre? No.

Gundam is the aborted result of a niave individual yearning for fighting and glory. It is a completely masturbatory splash of low budget animation hyper-focused for otaku merchandising. Self-referential to the point of parody, this anime is chock full of near plagiarist homages in a hodge podge of diluted and undirected plots which ultimately collide into an unimpressive and ambiguously empty finale. The ensuing Chars Counterattack movie only furthers these repulsive traits, a Frankenstein patchwork of references and lifted imagery that eventually ends like a certain manga that deeply impacted the director's youth. A fitting conclusion to a self-indulgent series made by a man who just can't grow up. Its passive-aggressive jeers and jerks at its own audience only further solidifies the repulsive nature of Gundam.

>>150577824
Tomino is a hack, for every great show that he has made, he has also made a dozen mediocre, bizzare or terrible shows.
Not defending Anno here tho. He has talent, and he is wasting that on pointless Evangelion remakes. He should have made more original projects, instead of re-doing his magnum opus for more money.

>>150577824
The simplest explanation is that Tomino is from the generation before cynicism conquered the human condition. He's from a time where people believed the world could be good with the evidence of their own lives, instead of from a time where people are convinced that the world is shit with only a handful of standout examples and massive misinterpretations to support that view.

For instance, if Shinji had just stopped focusing on how much his life sucked and tried to be happier, he would have been. This is literally proven by the best modern medicine and science on human psychology. You give people medicine to stabilize them, and then use therapy to fix it, and the therapy is getting them to realize that their own psychology is a by product of not controlling reactions to their environment.

So, to tl;dr Tomino's argument for you since reading is apparently difficult:
>if we convince ourselves that life is shit, of course it will be, so artists have a duty to not go around convincing people that life is shit for no good reason

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>>150577824
This quote was taken from an interview made way back in 2000.
I wonder if he's changed his mind since then.

also this thread reminds me that I have to get started on King Gainer.

>>150583721
yeah, I bet we could totally convince all the people getting killed, raped, overworked, and left unloved that their life isn't shit! It's just in your head, stop being upset by this!

There were people who lived through the worst wars, in the worst countries, experiencing the worst tragedies who all were able to not be pathetic sacks of shit like Shinji. A kid with very little problems in his life he was a depressed idiot before the robot, you shitter

>>150583721
In reality all those optimists are but a handful of successful people. They're just a mirage, not even human or real anymore i'd dare to say. The minority to whom life and this system has simled.
But of course they're the ones whose voice is heard the most. They're the most powerful after all.

>>150583855

Those were socipathic outliers and you know it. They are not an example of anything.

>>150583855
Just because some people are okay with shit doesn't mean anyone else has to be. If i hate the way something is, you're not entitled to me not disliking it.

>>150577824
> I think that we should try to show people how to live healthier, fuller lives, to foster their identity as a part of their community, and to encourage them to work happily until they die. I can't accept any work that doesn't say that.

This is so fucking retarded. I bet he doesn't even know who Oscar Wilde is and what he fought for but hey, this is probably why anime is such a shitty repetitive medium without any artistic value

>>150583346
They're kinda unique experience because it's supposed to be rare disorder. I can't even describe those dreams because they wasn't' like a nightmare.
>hearing loud sound of like when you close both ears
>nothing to see
>feeling of presense that rising
>"you should falling faster that it rising"
>it's rising
>next day mom said I cried and screamed while my eyes were open

>>150577824
wtf i hate gundam now

>>150582921
>Make the right choice. Go Gundam

I don't know why but that made me laugh

>>150583721
>The simplest explanation is that Tomino is from the generation before cynicism conquered the human condition.

It was always like that, people just weren't aware of it because there was no internet. Just use your own childhood as an example, how many misconceptions did you take for granted until you found out years later that people and places were always completely different than you imagined them. How many things you saw on (non-fiction) TV that turned out to be complete bullshit with no basis in reality whatsoever?

>>150583985
Mine is different about.
>Wake up half asleep
>Hearing sound sort of in memory
>Ears start ringing
>Fall out of bed
>Feels like me head is shaking
>Loud ringing fades
>Sirens start blaring
>All of a sudden sirens stop and i'm asleep
It's getting better. But the first time it happened I woke up in bed tied to the headboard, With blood all over the carpet and a big dent in the wall.
Apparently my ex said that I had rolled over onto the floor and started trying to crawl my way to the right of the bed and I sort of motioned that I was banging on something. It was four weeks later that I realized that I was doing the procedure in case of artillery or air strike: IE Get up, Crawl to the right of bed and unlock your locker and get your helmet on.

>>150577824
Did Tomino miss the entire point of Eva and the ending?

>>150583592
true, Shinji's a true warrior desu

>>150577824
Regardless of Evangelion's or Tomino's works' qualities, he is a fucking retard.
But he is an old japanese man so it's not like this is unexpected.

>>150583985
Those are the worst. I'd rather be up against something I know and go through the worst of suffering, than have to face the unseeable.

>>150584181
It's not about strenght of friendship and hard work, it's enough for majority of japs to hate it, the underaged girls in tightsuits attract the other ones

>>150582861
I don't think whether you support the actions of a character or not is something to judge a story on.
Bad decisions can lead to interesting stories.

Been a while since I read that one. When kill em all Tomino tell you your anime is too dark....

>>150583721
>you're unhappy only if you think so
you're basically quoting the message of EoTV

>>150582861
>>150584377
Regardless, the whole "do what we tell you and shut the fuck up" mentality is pretty fucking shitty and stupid.

>>150582861
>every story must ha ve a likeable character who always does the right thing, otherwise is shit
Fuck off, Shinji is the best written and most interesting anime character ever, he's a teenager and acts as a teenager

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>>150584459
this
fucking normies

>>150583721
>Buying the psychology meme
Don't do that.

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>>150584377
T
H
I
S

HOLY FUCK HOW IS THIS SO HARD TO UNDERSTAND

>>150584365
Its not about the "horrors of war", so Tomino doesn't understand it. And by "horrors of war" I mean that the Gundam MC sort of just gets casually and conveniently roped into a space adventure and sometimes shit blows up before he has a crisis that "Oh my god, there are people inside of those?!"

>>150584558
Normalfags are reactionary and can't look past their surface emotions to save their life. Just look at /r9k/, hating women one moment and orbiting them in the same moment.

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>>150584459
While I wouldn't go as far as to say he's the best, I agree that he's one of the most realistic characters and can't comprehend how some people don't get that his character faults make him a better character.

>>150583972
I don't see why'd he care about some literal faggot.

>>150578868
Char started slipping up some 12 episodes before Zeta ended. He manipulated Reccoa from the very early episodes when her "I just want to be seen as a woman" shit started rearing its ugly head.

Hell if it wasn't obvious enough the entire theatre scene with Haman and Char was about Char being a hypocritical, selfish jackass.

Which he was since he gave fucking Anaheim the psycho-frame just so he could fight Amuro while also bombing the shit out of Earth cause he lost faith in humanity ever getting off the damn planet and becoming "muh true realized space adapted ningen my daddy talked about"

>>150584817
Char pretty much lost his mind.

He got so far up his ass that he couldn't see past his own shit and decided to just kill everyone for reasons that didn't make sense to anyone but him.

>>150584691
>hah, I'll call him GAY. This'll prove any arguments he has invalid
You know, I know Tomino is a manchild but I don't think he's retarded.

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>>150584817
>>150584883

>>150584909
This is why you lost, Casval.

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>>150584921

>>150584909
Nasakenai yatsu! CHAR!

>>150584939
Seriously man, you need help. Like, serious help.

You're like that kid who brings a gun to school because he doesn't have the ability to reason out his problems in a healthy manner, except rather than a gun you brought an asteroid and tried to kill all life on earth.

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>>150584952

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>>150577824
>evangelion is bad because it is introspective and makes you think rather than spoonfeed yourself fun
k

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>>150584983

>>150585030
>missing the point

Hey now, if we're going to discuss morality we might as well stop because it's all in peoples heads. Saving the entire human race isn't any more moral than killing them all, but at the same time killing everyone is just as meaningless. Don't bother with morality, it's just a bunch of bullshit. You're wasting your time trying to uphold some false code, no matter whether it says to sacrifice yourself to save old people or to bomb infidels. Just live for your own life, and let other people deal with theirs.

>>150584983
You sound like a normalfag to me. Char was just a tad utilitarian in his methods.

>>150584897
That isn't what I'm saying and you know it. I just don't see why'd he care about Oscar Wilde.

>>150585120
Have you read any of Oscar Wildes work?

>>150585146
I have, my question is: Why should Tomino care? You have yet to answer that.

This seems like a good thread to ask this:
I wanna watch Gundam just to tick it off my anime bucket list, but aren't really interested enough to sit through 50+ episode series. I've heard the Zeta movie trilogy is bad, but is it so bad that if I'm not gonna watch the Zeta TV series anyway, I should just skip them altogether?

>>150585170
>I wanna watch something just to fill a list, not for actual interest or passion
Could you announce you're a poser any harder?

>>150585170
Watch 0079 TV and then the movie trilogy.
Follow it with 0080
Watch Zeta TV
Follow it with 0083
Watch CCA
Follow it with 08th team
Watch Turn A
You're done

>>150585170
The movies pale in comparison to the series. Zeta isn't the first in the UC time period chronologically either.

If my shit was organized I'd post the timeline and what can be watched and stuff and not.

>>150585237
I do have actual interest in it. I want to watch it so that I can see the impact it had on anime as a medium and understand discussion about it, but I know that it isn't really my kinda genre in the first place and that I probably won't enjoy it that much. To put it another way, I want to watch it for educational purposes rather than just for entertainment. As such, I want to view it in the quickest way possible.

>>150585245
Already seen the 0079 movie remakes and the 0080 OVAs, but as previously stated, I'm not going to watch any of the overly long TV series.

>>150585256
I could guess that it pales in comparison given that it's a condensed version, but that doesn't mean it's completely worthless in itself. I'm asking whether it's still worth watching anyway if I'm definitely not going to watch the original, full version.

>>150577824
Daily reminder that Anno loved CCA and would suck Tomino's dick if given the chance

>>150585564
If you truly cared about educating yourself you'd watch everything as it was meant to be watched.

>>150585564
>I could guess that it pales in comparison given that it's a condensed version, but that doesn't mean it's completely worthless in itself. I'm asking whether it's still worth watching anyway if I'm definitely not going to watch the original, full version.

If you're intent on not watching the original series, then sure watch it. I'd suggest just watching the original series though, even if you split up over the course of like 3 months or so.

You'll basically be missing tons of stuff because of how condensed it is, it is basically worthless in all honesty. But like I said, if you don't want to watch the series, then just watch the movies.

>>150585564
Watch without watching and enjoy by not enjoying it? Have you considered making someone watch it instead of you and just provide you with conversation cards whenever the subject of Gundam comes up?

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>>150577824
He meant that he's butthurt that Anno used his ideas for Ideon and made a better and more memorable show.

>>150585581
Anno has shit taste then because CCA sucked. Would've been much better as an OVA series than a movie.

>>150582386
Apparently he gets super pissed when you call him a plane otaku

>>150584498
>>150584639
>>150584426
>>150584558
>>150583267
>>150584377
>I am flawed and want media and art to reflect and propagate what is wrong with me
This is exactly why tomino is right, art has always been about pursuing perfection, finding motivation to do better and press forward, not about being content with failure, imperfection and not doing what needs to be done.

Things get done because people can move forward, follow instructions and overcome pain. Wallowing in it is a mental illness.

>>150585564
>le anime historian
Kill yourself. You can't become knowledgeable about anime history by picking and choosing compilation movies and select series, you fucking twat.

>>150583267
>I shouldn't have to save everyone else if I don't want to be saved myself.
God fucking damn, I really hope you guys aren't in charge of ANY FUCKING THING in life and that you are currently starving in front of your computer waiting for your final hour to come shortly. I absolutely refuse to share society with useless creeps like you. If people are in your debt and you are the only one who can help them, you can't just "NAAAAAH I DON'T WANT BECAUSE I HAVE PERSONAL PROBLEMS YOU WOULDN'T UNDERSTAND MATEY LIFE AIN'T FAIR DEAL WITH IT" your way out of it. Don't be a fucking asshole and don't make unrelated people pay for YOUR problems because that's just you becoming another part of the problem. Of course, if ANYBODY could do it in your place, asking for the person to help you out is perfectly okay. Asking said person to do it in your stead is selfish and cowardly. Not doing anything will cause more damage and in the case of Eva, you'll anyway get in trouble yourself one way or another so it's fucking stupid to think retracting into your autism shell will allow you to ignore the situation.
The world exists, you can't just "NOPE" it into non-existence because you are a sheltered kid.

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How did Tomino manage to make pic related? Was it a fluke?

>>150578891
>what is be invoked

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>>150585808
>le duty

>>150577824
Bloody Nippon collectivism

>>150585794
You're saying uneducated shit.

Just an example: art wasn't about perfection in the middle ages,it was about elevating the viewer to the divine plane for a bit and move him.
Now do the same with every other artistic period.

>>150585828
Broken clocks and all that

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>>150586225
>le life wallowing in self-sufficience, sloth and egocentrism
Reminder that Earth only happened to gather the necessary conditions for life to exist, that humans only got to evolve because a stellar rock happened to get rid of persistent reptiles, and that you are nothing but a human in more than 6 billions with millions of other species. You are not special, you are not precious, you're just an accident and nobody cares about your personal issues.

>>150585794
Art isn't propaganda. It isn't supposed to tell you how to live your life.
Depicting something doesn't mean you support it and neither does being interested in it.
Is the concept of being interested in anything else than your own ideals so hard to grasp?

>>150583675
This attempt falls apart on the last paragraph,but nice try.

>>150586480
Well, I can rile someone up just by existing. If that's not an accomplishment, I don't know what is.

>>150583012
>Yfw you realise those soldiers that raided Nerv were the good guys

>>150586673
Minding your own business would spare people the annoyance of your nonsense and would save brain cells.
A much more worthy accomplishment.

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>>150586480
>You are not special, you are not precious, you're just an accident and nobody cares about your personal issues.
And for that reason no one should feel personally obligated to "just man up" and "be themselves"

At the end of the day, anon, we aren't Eva pilots, we're just a bunch of useless NEETS and Freeters. We're Nietzche's Last Man not necessarily by choice, but by circumstance. As far as I'm concerned if you choose to not play with the shitty hand you've been dealt, that, too, is a valid option.

You see, anon, you lack the wisdom of the ages. In life, there has always been the outcast, prototypical or unconventionally so, since time began. It's just that in older days, we were far more likely to be culled by the environment instead of kept around to stagnate. Might as well be comfy while we do so, no?

>>150586795
>we're just a bunch of useless NEETS and Freeters
Nice projection. I think it sums you up quite tidy.

>>150585794
Art is entertainment, what you're talking about is propaganda.

>>150586795
I'm SKYNET, speak for yourself flesh body.

>>150586838
I never denied the allegation. After all, I did use "we're", so by default it can't be a projection. Do try to learn the meaning of buzzwords before tossing them around carelessly.

You mean to tell me you're some super affluent normalfag Adonis just deicing to grace /a/ with your presence?

>Noooooooo red pills are bad
>Take all your emotions and put them in a tiny box where nobody will ever find them, then preted to be happy!
Jesus this fucking guy

>>150586894
>I never denied the allegation. After all, I did use "we're", so by default it can't be a projection. Do try to learn the meaning of buzzwords before tossing them around carelessly.

You are this stupid. It's projection because you're forcing the assumption that everyone is like you. That's what PROJECTING is. Holy fuck you moron.

>>150586965
And then work yourself to death 24/7 so you can be a productive member of your fucked up culture, before you inevitable drink yourself into oblivion one faithful night and jump off a bridge or slit your wrists in a forest.

>>150586988
>because you're forcing the assumption that everyone is like you
>forcing
Where do you think we are?

>>150577824
I've seen a lot of wildlife conservation and liberal bias in new fiction, but I haven't seen a fascist make an anime before.

Which one do I start with?

>>150577824
>I think that we should try to show people how to live healthier, fuller lives, to foster their identity as a part of their community, and to encourage them to work happily until they die.

Now enlighten me, how is Anno Miyazaki's best friend?

>>150586769
I'm pretty sure those were SEELE soldiers.

>>150578717
Someone's I forget how stupid EVAfags are. Thanks for reminding me.

>>150588062
They bond over how great post-occupation Japan was instead of anime.

>>150578554
>MSG: Char is against the Zabis and against the Federation
>Zeta: Char is against the Titans and the Federation
>CCA: Char is against the Federation
inconsistent as fuck wtf wooooooow tomino

>>150588320
JSSDF. Seele got Japan to attack by telling them Nerv was staging an Impact and it worked because Japan was always suspicious of Nerv. Also because the proof was real and Seele didn't reveal themselves or their own involvement.

So yeah the guys with flamethrowers thought they were stopping a doomsday cult and it had to be done brutally because they could actually pull it off.

>>150581327
>the only way to can be happy is substantively changing the world
you're a special kind of retard aren't you

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>>150585808
>>150586480
It's not my "stead" just because some asshole decided to force it upon me. If i don't want to have anything to do with it, I'm not going to. If you try to force me, I'll just fight back until one of us dies. I'm not asking anything of you, so don't ask anything of me. Fuck, you people are so fucking arrogant
>WAAAA THESE ARE THE PROBELMS WITH THE WORLD I WANT YOU TO PERSONALLY FIX THEM
If you don't like something, change it yourself, faggot. Don't come whining to me about how it's my duty to do jackshit for you. The universe doesn't owe me anything, you're right, and I don't owe it anything either, so fuck off. You're not entitled to my help just because I would be useful to you. Yeah, I'm selfish, but I'm still better than people like you because I won't force other people to deal with my shit. How the fuck can you accuse me and other people of wanting other people to deal with our problems when you're the ones telling us to do shit for you? How fucking retarded do you have to be to think it's okay for you to force someone to do something, but they're being selfish if they don't want to do it? How fucking stupid can you be? Fuck off faggot. There's a difference between asking for handouts, and just asking to be left the fuck alone. I don't care if I would be really fucking useful to you guys, I don't owe you shit. If I want to die, fuck off and let me die. Find someone else who is willing to do it, and if you can't find someone else, do it yourself or shut the fuck up.

If no one cares about me, don't expect me to kill myself to save all of them. I'm not a fucking hero, save yourselves.

>>150583721
>le drugs can fix your mental states
now we're talking delusion

>>150585564
>wants to watch for educational purposes
>can't watch a fucking 43 episode anime
jesus christ

>>150589124
found the mentally ill not taking their medication

>>150589189
As someone who likes watching long series, watching the series they're inspired from and inspire themselves, and then taking about then here, that guy is a tryhard faggot.

>>150589231
couldn't find an argument in this post

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>no one cares about you, faggot
>but you still have a duty to care about the rest of the world
Really faggot? Really?

>>150577824
I had to google that just to make sure and I can't believe anyone would actually say that, especially someone who is revered as a creative mind.

It's like he barely skimmed the surface of the show without thinking at all about what he was watching. I'm sure he changed his mind since that interview but holy shit how can someone who actually watched Eva not take away a positive message.

>>150589968
Because even if the conclusion is forward facing, it paints all of humanity in a negative light by default and assumes we're all fragile, mentally ill and afraid of or confused by relationships with other people.

>>150577824
>It was a work that told people it was okay to be depressed, and it accepted the psychological state that said if you don't like the way the world works, then it's okay to just pick up a gun and attack someone
What the fuck.
What fucking part of this show did he misinterpret and take this away from it. I'm trying really hard to figure out at what point anyone said or did anything that could possibly be construed as this, but I'm drawing a complete fucking blank here.

>>150590047
>Shinji is the only character in NGE
Also in Japan that is very much true, why do you think the birthrate is dropping?

>>150590178
Every character is portrayed like that if they get more than 10 seconds of screentime.

No, Japan is not like that. I live here, it's pretty nice.

>>150590047
Evangelion is intended to show depressed people that there is a purpose in living, and to show people who aren't depressed how soul-crushing it can feel. Mental illness is a stigma in Japan, it's why the suicide rate is so high: because people don't seek out treatment when they desperately need it.

Only a handful of the characters are actually fragile and mentally ill. Another handful are spiteful and manipulative. A good deal of them are just doing what they have to in order to get by. Some are even genuinely good people. Evangelion specifically shows us that people are different, and that anyone around you could have a problem that they're scared to talk about.

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Read this book anons.

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>>150577824
wow this guy is a fucking moron

>>150590407
The protagonists are all borderline mentally ill and unstable, the antagonists are all super manipulative and scheming. It's got a very black and white, pessimistic view of humanity brought on by Anno's mental state when he created it.

>>150590524
Stop spouting bullshit

>>150588062
Miyazaki isn't anything like Tomino.

>>150590573
Literally not an argument. It's ok, I don't expect much from EVAfags.

>>150578211
He loved himself as a depressed piece of shit, It's still pretty negative.

>>150590524
Like 90% of the side characters aren't mentally unstable. Shinji's classmates, the bridge crew at Nerv, Kaji, Fuyutsuki, and even Ritsuko (to an extent) are fairly stable.

And there's also the fact that the setting is post-apocalyptic, so many of the characters just behave negatively because the future is so bleak.

>>150590981
Anyone with any sizeable amount of screentime that allows characterization, you can't really comment on transient characters.

>Ritsuko
>Stable
Oh fuck off.

>>150582026
god damn that scene is so fucking good

>>150577824
>says the guy who made shit like ideon and victory gundam

>>150580947
Asuka could have felt sick for a variety of reasons, but you have to willingly exit the sea of LCL, so she clearly was not satisfied with being connected to everyone else.

She wanted to be an individual, even if it meant having to face Shinji after both of them had seen the depths of each other's psyches.

>>150590258
japan is pure zangyou and suicide, shut up.

>>150577824
>I think that we should try to show people how to live healthier, fuller lives, to foster their identity as a part of their community, and to encourage them to work happily until they die.
literally the speech of a brainwashed wagecuck.

>>150591600
Kimochi warui does not mean felling sick. That's a terrible translation that's overly literal. It means gross. As in, Shinji disgusted her.

>>150591677
t. Every Japanese cultural expert on the internet who is sad that no one here or there likes them

>>150591749
It means something made her feel disgusted. Not necessarily Shinji. She had just been through a lot of shit, including having every other human being who was alive or had ever lived see every single thought and feeling she had ever experienced.

This thread shows just how twisted those of you who cannot understand Tomino's message are. I have nothing but pity in my heart for you sad lot.

Tomino is a child of WWII. He has lived through the experience of post-war Japan and has reached the conclusion that every sane person that has ever been in terrible circumstances understands: there is no point in wallowing in self pity more than what is appropriate for your circumstances. All you can do is pick yourself up and try again. You need to focus on living and happiness will naturally come your way. Everyone faces difficulties, but we must always strive to be better.
Good media reflects this attitude. It strives to tell a story, interweaving both good and bad to create the bittersweet tapestry of life. Ultimately, a great story will teach you something or imbue a new sense of self within you. The point is to bond with the characters and inspire emotion.

Evangelion is ultimately destructive. It brings in the viewer and teaches them to forever wallow in self pity. It teaches them that it's okay to be a neurotic mess. To lash out at people. To hide and to hate. Evangelion is the anime of sick individuals, not healthy people.

>>150592277
Evangelion taught me you are a faggot.

>>150578985
Underrated post.

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>>150590407
>Evangelion is intended to show depressed people that there is a purpose in living
>purpose
>in living
Good one.

>>150592277
I refuse to believe you read through this thread.

>>150580947
Kimochii warui could also be translated as disgusting or you're sick
She could be talking about Shinji and his almost chocking her and overall pussy behavior.

>>150592580

I think there is, just people here will never know such pleasures.

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>>150592277
I had a whole big response typed up because of how garbage your post is, but all you deserve is:
>fucking normalfags
I question if you've even seen the TV series or EoE. Perhaps they're all just 2deep4u.

This whole thread is spooky as fuck.

>>150581275
Rei seemly emotionless state and face is perfect for projecting one's emotions into her and thus making it easy to feel connected and emphatic.
Never mind she's a clone of Shinji's mom and thus linked to the reconquest of the lost paradise, the feeling of belonging a baby and child experiences with the mother, and learning about dealing with sexual desire from a familiar source.

>>150581456
Rei isn't even allowed to be her own person, considering she's a clone and trained to have "EVA pilot" as her unique and most defining identity.
It's really sad, because she's kind of the same as Shinji. Just a tool that Gendo uses to project his desires and dreams into.

>>150592768
>2deep4u.
Not an argument.

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>>150592768
Productivity is a spook.

>>150582579
But just imagine the deep feeling of belonging and correctness and how good and comfy that would fell

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>>150577824
But the final message of the series is pretty much flat-out stated by Yui
>As long as you're alive you have the chance to be happy

In other words, even if you're a wreck like Shinji that doesn't make you hopeless.
> I think that we should try to show people how to live healthier, fuller lives
Evangelion does exactly that. It tells us not to give up on life, even when it seems hopeless.

So either this guy's fucking retarded, or needs to rewatch Eva. If he's ever seen it at all.

>>150583451
The eternal hedgehog dilemma.

>>150577824
I love Tomino, but shit like this is why I don't take his opinions very seriously.

>>150577824
Anno>>>>>>>>>>>>>This faggot

>>150592848
It's okay. Plenty of people have misunderstood the concepts and themes presented in Eva, so you're not alone.
Explain to me how Evangelion teaches any of the things you mentioned.
Protip: you can't.

>>150583721
How much far should it be ok to conform in order to be happy though?

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>Every moral of the story revolves around improving interpersonal relationships and keeping yourself together even in the worst of times because things can always get better
>Hurr Eva tells people they suck!

I don't understand why some people think Eva was meant to be a negative story.

>>150589332
If you love the world the world loves you back
just look at meme magic

>>150577914
That makes him based you dumb neet

>>150590108
EVA is like a mirror, you see what you want to see.

>>150590524
Well, to be fair they are living with a very high level of stress and most of them suffer from some degree of complex PTSD.
Monster are coming from the fucking sky and ending the world while a crazy guy wants to melt everyone into orange slime.
What normal person wouldn't be on edge in that kind of situation?

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If this bitch thinks Eva was 2sad4me, I wonder what he thinks of NHK.

>>150577973
Toy collectors are depressed pack-rats looking to fill an endless hole with overpriced plastic..

>>150592277
>Ultimately, a great story will teach you something or imbue a new sense of self within you
But that's what EVA is about.

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>>150577824
>It's another "senile old men talking shit" episode

>>150592715
What makes you think you know about the capabilities of anonymous people at a Chinese cartoon image board?

So how would events have changed if Asuka hadn't gotten fucked by the consistently annoying plot device known as the 5-minute battery?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0AY27gLWhtM&t=193s

Seriously, this was the most annoying thing in the world. Need Asuka/Shinji to lose a fight? Alright, just turn off their robot at the climactic moment. Need them to win? Okay, let the robot turn off just a few seconds after the Angel dies. That may actually be one of my biggest gripes with Eva.

>>150592937
This. Evangelion teaches you will get hurt and that trying to connect with other people is painful, but running away and secluding your self is not the answer. You have to accept suffering to have the chance of being happy.

I think we have to remember EVA was released during the peak of the hikkikomori epidemic by a depressed individual, that's why it resonated so much with a lot of people as the decade went. Shit was so bad the government even reformed the whole education system to try avoiding creating more depressed recluses.

Tomino was already a grown old man at the time, there's no way he could understand the generational feelings that made EVA ressonate with people.

>>150593203
I just watched Spirited Away again and I'm becoming increasingly convinced that Miyazaki is a pedophile. The deal with No Face is his own struggle

He's allowed his opinion, I too wouldn't say I 'enjoy' Evangelion, though I have a lot of respect for it for the exact reason that Tomino complains about it. Its bold for a show to truly, honestly end up in such a bizarre, sincerely negative place.
Animu and Mango needs more variety, that's kinda the biggest thing it has going for it. Inevitably there's going to be sides of the spectrum that you disagree with and others you gravitate to. For instance, I'm horrified by Oreimo and that even what it was bastardized into was something that people found genuine interest in (let alone the implications the author was actually going for) but clearly a lot of people did enjoy it so I can respect it for doing something unique. Likewise I can totally see how other people might think the stuff I enjoy is too simply or not 'edgy' enough. That's the beauty of it though, you can really run the gambit on this stuff thanks to the versatility of the medium. For goodness sake, the same industry that produced Mononoke also produces corporate cash grab stuff. And its all good.

tl;dr anime and manga find themselves in a unique place where there can be a lot of variety, and by no means do you gotta like all of it but that's okay

>>150593473
Indeed, it's just that for some people is hard to grasp that not every piece of media is aimed at them of will fit their tastes and ideologies.

>>150593234
Retake (well-written but non-canon) has a scenario where Shinji gets in the fucking robot and saves Asuka, after which they avert Third Impact by destroying the MPEs. But that's just a fever dream and he ends up waking up on the beach later.

Anima (official but not canon) has a scenario where Kaji manages to deliver a message to Gendo warning them that SEELE will mount a full-scale invasion with the JSSDF, but then some stupid shit happens and for some reason they let the autistic mech designer write the story.

>>150593561
>of will
I meant
>or will

>>150593601
It's bizarre how the
>it was all just a dream
troupe fits in really well with Evangelion story and Shinji as a character.

>>150577824
Where is the source, it doesn't seem legit. But then again Tomino and Miyazaki are the grumpy old men of the anime industry.

>>150593731
Miyazaki is tomodachi with Anno tough, he wouldn't talk shit about his work.

>>150592277
Judging only by the quote cited in OP's post, Tomino is like a baby with no understanding of the world.
He needs to read more philosophy

>>150593561
Aye, and that's the biggest part of the medium that I feel people like Anno get pissed about
I know its joked around about here and there's some rough edges but /a/ is actually one of the more inclusive communities as far as allowing people to have their separate tastes. Everything from the obscure to the ultra-popular gets posted here, and very rarely is there a sincere amount of people going in to threads of stuff they don't like and saying 'this all sucks and you suck for liking it'. But it does still happen and what's more it happens on a larger scale out there.
I think the biggest worry though is when people twist the meaning from works that are meant to have a certain takeaway. To reference Eva again, as a lot of people have mentioned in this very thread, the point of it to some simplified degree is that even if things get really shitty you can still strive to have a better life if you're alive and can embrace comfort with yourself to press on. But a lot of the very people who recognize that message even here probably would be called hypocritical if they took a step back and looked at what they've done with their life since learning that message. Worse, some people have used EVA as a gateway to become total shut-ins, without realizing the irony that dotting their room with a thousand EVA figurines and never going outside to stomach through the real world is exactly the thing it was trying to tell people to avoid doing.
Not every EVA fan is like this, obviously, but a fair amount are, which can illustrate how out of context the message of these stories can be taken

>>150577824
Real robot man miffed by send up of real robot, film at 11.

>pursuit of truth and acceptance of reality are undesirable if they don't lead to people perpetuating society as I want it to be
>anyone unhappy with a state of affairs I deem desirable is defective and the solution is to get in line and do what I want you to until it makes you happy
>society owes you nothing but you're obligated to support it
Fucking normalfags I swear.

>>150578717
Have you watched Keion? The characters in that anime and subsequent movie are a tier higher in characterization than Eva. Highly recommend watching it if you want to learn about the deep interrelationships of the human species.

>>150593801
You can understand the message of NGE without applying it to your livelihood.

>>150593801
Sure, I understand the irony you are speaking of.
But I'd argue that the shut ins and otakus using EVA as a means of escaping reality would just latch some other topic or series if Evangelion didn't get created or popular.
The problem at it's core is the dissonance between the tradition values of Japanese society, or baby boomers in general, and the inadequacy experienced by a lot of the newer generations that ar caught between conforming or being their own individual as the current culture dictates.
Japan is also very bad at dealing with mental illness and tends to just hide everything under the rug, so I can see how people deeply fragilized mentally would feel comforted by a piece of media that can relate to them and accept that what they feel is real and warranted.

>>150593801
Yet recognizing a message is not always a strong enough push to propel personal change.
If it was so easy people would be a lot healthier and happy in general

>>150584459
The asshole protag in the shitty Linebarrel anime was more realistic than Shinji.

>>150582890
Even as a miserable failure, Instrumentality sounds like a next level hell. Suddenly everyone knows of your failures, all the horrible thoughts and things you did. Even if it's supposed to be blissful I can't help but think I'd take death over such a thing any day of the week.