Which tropes would you ban from the Isekai genre? Personally

>>149534719
>Isekai genre

>>149534791
its large enough to be called a genre at this point

>>149534854
then delete the genre

>>149534719
I'd ban
>Dense MCs
>No god-like powers unless MC can actually become a god
>Lack of clear main girl

Kekkon Yubiwa Monogatari and Death March Kara Hjimaru Isekai Kyousoukyoku are the only two series that are doing iseki right in my opinion.

>>149534719
Male MC

>>149534928
>delete a very profitable and popular genre

>>149534938
>Death March
Uh, what? Thats the series where the MC uses a GM cheat and reaches over level 9000 without even trying.

And he instantly gets a love interest in the first chapter by saving that girl.

And now hes got a harem of demi-humans who are utterly devoted to him.

I wouldn't ban anything. Sure there's a lot of shit, but that's the free market.

>>149535406
thats a common misunderstanding of the free market, often, the free market requires regulation

>>149535151
That's pretty much it. He got to like level 300 something, but people think levels cap at 100 since the required exp to get to 101+ is insanely high or something.

He has his menu unique skill but it completely used for information gathering. It doesn't do anything for combat, not that he needs it since he's over leveled and stuff.

Translations are almost caught up, but he's looking for a way to become a god so he can marry and have children with the high elf Aze. He's looking, but not too hard. For the most part, he and his harem (whom he's acknowledged to hold no sexual/romantic feelings for) just tour the other world playing around, eating delicious food, ect. The usual other world stuff, but without all the forced drama and need for shonen spirit.

>>149534938
See I don't have a problem with main girls, I actually hate series with them more if they're going the harem route. It's already wish fulfillment nonsense go the tenchi route and bask in the fact.

>>149535593
All of those posts look like contributions to discussion to me. You on the other hand have done nothing beneficial for this thread. I have nothing more to say on this matter.

>>149536286
I can see where you're coming from and can agree. I just hate it when the MC is too indecisive to choose anyone at all.

Like, just choose. Choose all of them if you want, just don't let that shit linger and then end without anyone getting together.

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>>149534719
Dirty furry fucks and other freaks of nature.

>>149536449
>>Like, just choose. Choose all of them if you want, just don't let that shit linger and then end without anyone getting together.
I'm completely with you on this much. The relationship drama just eats away from any other significant plot angles, and ultimately detracts from what ever story there is. Unless you're just a gag story, in which case go for it if that's your main joking point.

>>149536217
>He's looking, but not too hard
And this is the reason I fucking drop it, it was fine when the story didn't have a plot but the moment the author introduces an end goal and does nothing to move towards it just become shit

>>149534719
Edgy shit.
There's nothing worse than an isekai that pretends to be deep by having the MC suffer and cute girls get their limbs torn off.

>>149536620
i disagree.

>>149536620
I feel differently. I like that there is a goal now (although whether it's an end goal is unclear) but if the author always went straight for the, the series would be over within a few dozen chapters leaving most of this other world unexplored.

I feel like Death March isn't about the destination or the struggle to get there. It's about the journey and all the joy experienced before you find yourself at the end. Experiencing another world wouldn't be much fun if you're always focused on the end.

>>149536698
so you want a series where the MC never suffers and no girls get hurt?

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>>149536698

Is Isekai a metaphor for the white saviour complex and the trend of white English teachers living in Asia?

>>149537071
no its a wish fulfillment fantasy in most cases

>>149537071
>>149537228
It's definitely not a metaphor, but in most cases it could be an example of, if you consider oriental people, namely Japanese, to be white.

Then again, the MC is usually just the most self insert as can be so MC is usually a white male because many people can relate to or at least sympathize with a stereotypical white male.

>>149534719

MC has a dick

no, I'm serious

part of the reason why Overlord does so well is because the main character doesn't have a dick

>>149537494
What about Tensei Shitara Slime Datta Ken?
What i hate about it is the fact that the guy reincarnated as a slime and had a dragon god give him a name, in a setting where monsters are nameless, and monsters with names are the strongest.

>>149536698
>I hate good storytelling where actions have consequences, give me more meaningless fluff

>>149534719
I would ban instant love interests that appear from the get-go. Or at least not until quite a few heroines have already been introduced.

Re:zero really brought home the point that waifu pandering turns shows into shit.

>>149537608

that, and kumo desu ga suffer from the same flaw

no clear vision and genre

>>149537494
Overlord still has many tropes ruining the series though.

>>149534719
Those aren't just problems with Isekai, they're problems with Light novels.

If anything the whole medium needs to get banned.

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>>149537650
Slime is more about building relations with other races and founding a nice place to everyone.

I'd also molest that slime.

>>149537668
Its not the medium, its the editors that dont enforce ANY kind of quality control.

In japan, for some reason, many editors will simply accept anything as long as it is a shameless copy of something that is popular. This doesnt work often in the west (otherwise everyone would just submit shitty twilight ripoffs). We are not talking about some shitty third bit publisher either, but major publishers in Japan do this.

Eragorn was only published because the author's parents owned the publishing company. In japan, you dont need to do this, just submit it to a major publisher and VOILA.

>>149537693
slime goes to shit after the MC becomes super powerful because he is a special snowflake

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>>149537799

>>149534719
>MC is an otaku
>Harem of any kind

>>149538316
This

Stop that "I'm an otaku" shit. MC doesn't have to be GI Joe, but give him some other defining characteristic other than being an otaku. Maybe be part of the baseball team. Make him like a right fielder or something.

>>149538389
even the series without the MC being an otaku largely skip ove the MC's past.

They just go "oh MC was a salaryman" and thats pretty much it.

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>isekai series never have the MC be a monster girl

why

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>>149539001
Nigga

>>149539240
huh? you lost me

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>>149539932
Niiiiga

Named Weapons

>>149534719
Any sort of magic mind control/manipulation. Maybe, potentially, it could be handled alright if it never happened to a main character. Otherwise, it just fucks over the characters and turns the story into a shitfest.

>>149540121
how does it fuck over the characters?

>>149540121
how does it fuck over the characters?

first girls winning
tsunderes
ban those two from japanese series in general

>>149540164
It screws with their development because it removes most/all rules of how a character has to act after experiencing something. It's basically just an excuse for the author to force any sort of development or scene they feel like regardless of whether or not it makes sense for the characters. See: Tate no Yuusha, Zero no Tsukaima.

>it's another /v/ thread on /a/

>>149536849
>>149536217
>>149535151
>>149534938
Death March is a load of shit. Mc that has an actual loli harem (the bar is very low at this point). Paces itself with dumbass foreshadowing that takes so many chapters that lack a decent build-up. OP protagonist does not help you idiots (OP protagonists like that lack tension in effort and are just snowflakes, great lesson in journey with your arguments). Prostitutes yay (not)! The writing style is pretty jarring (First person is not very good) (Don't say "I think it is good", it is not). Load of horseshit kind of JOURNEY when say that kind of crap. Stop your bullshit. Death March is shit. Face it. And don't get me started on kekkon. And stop your bullshit, COMFYFAGS. No matter how much you try and defend your comfyshit, you can never fool the standard for comfort. Like a pillow, you need the right fluff, material,and softness. Otherwise you are gonna get a jagged rock and people think it is comfy.
> Stuff like this should not take too much thinking
Well anon, sorry you don't use your brain. You should go to the E.R. to make sure that you still have it.
> opinion
Now that is where you come off as wrong from the start. Tell me, the context is fucking terrible from the start and you fuckers should say opinion? This is why you people deserve to be shit on for your bullshit of a notion.

>>149534791
It's a sub-genre of fantasy you dim-wit (science fantasy in some cases). Muv-luv somewhat applies but it made itself science fiction pretty much.

>>149534719
I would ban all kinds of "virtual reality" type tropes.
>no "levels"
>no "i got transported to a mmo that i used to play and my character was too op"
>no "stats/cheats"

>>149534719

>MC instantly gets a harem/love interest with little to no effort

That's not too bad if handled right, my pick would be

>Static\useless\uninteractive harems

If the author wants 3+ girls to hang around MC, he better make them hate\compete with each other, make them attracted to the different aspects of MC, and they all need to have a solid reason to be there in the first place. And be an actual 3-dimensional characters with interpersonal motivations.

>Most of the characters are retarded except for the MC

Self explanatory

>MC has godlike powers compared to the natives

Again, power levels can fluctuate. One of the staples of fantasy and issekai as a sub-genre is the discovery of new broken powers and ways to utilize it So as long as the writer makes MC smart enough to overcome the imminence struggle by experimenting with his powers, but limits it to a single break-points in the story, that would be interesting.

>isekai genre
stop

>>MC has godlike powers compared to the natives
But that was my favorite troupe on Isekai. Making the MC has edgy personality is also nice.

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>The deconstruction came out decades before the genre went main stream

The only one that should be removed is
MC not a skellington

>>149540971
Stats tickle my autism just right sometimes.

Not an overpowered os super special power MC seems good enough

>>149534719
It's too late. Narou was a mistake.

>>149534719
So you hate Overlord then, OP?

>>149541176
Overlord is shit, yeah.

>MC was a middle aged hikki who died in the real world and is now a teenager
stop

If I had to choose one, it'd probably be the "being overpowered" trope. The MC has memories from another world, make him use those to be stronger instead of just getting a cheat power. It's even easier if the MC reincarnated, because he now has the intellect of an adult (or teenager) as a fucking baby.

One WN that does that aspect right is the gun otaku one. It sadly suffers from the harem trope (at least up to where I read), but the explanation of how he makes the guns isn't too far-fetched, and it does take him a long time to make the first guns.

>>149534719
>MC has godlike powers compared to the natives

No, the problem with this is that authors don't know how to correctly scale the difficulty of the MC's challenge.

Sure you can have OP powers and make natives scared of you, that shit is fun to read sometimes.

But its boring when the story has nothing besides that.
Don't dedicate an arc or chapter about some low level monster or thieves getting btfo by the MC. Have a conflict that actually deserves MC's op powers.

>>149540977
>Again, power levels can fluctuate. One of the staples of fantasy and issekai as a sub-genre is the discovery of new broken powers and ways to utilize it So as long as the writer makes MC smart enough to overcome the imminence struggle by experimenting with his powers, but limits it to a single break-points in the story, that would be interesting.

If you look at the isekai genre, most simply make the MC OP from the get go to avoid having to bother with character development and overcoming obstacles.

Overlord is probably the most famous example right now. Part of what makes stories like Lord of the Rings great is because the characters have to find ways to overcome obstacles along the way, and that's completely lost if the main cast can just teleport into Mordor, beat up Sauron's entire army because they are level 100 and the orcs are level 1 and finish by dinner time.

>>149541023
One dimensional evil villains. Victimizing children. Deconstruction my ass.

>>149541176
Overlord has a lot of wasted potential.

MC being a skeleton is a great idea and there was a lot of potential for character development there. But instead the MC just goes "huh im a skeleton now" and thats pretty much the end of it. Aside from a few comedic bits like the MC getting bored because he doesnt need to sleep or having to use magic to conceal his real appearance, the fact that he is a skeleton has almost no impact on the story.

The fact that the MC is worshipped like a god universally by the whole of Nazarick also removes a lot of storytelling potential. Its basically the equivalent of saying "Everyone loves the king in this fairytale". If you just want to tell a simple story where the hero saves the king, that works but anything complex requires something more than a superficial relationship between the main characters.

The entire premise of Overlord is shaky in the first place because the main cast is so powerful that they could scour the entire world, both known and unknown areas in a week, and confirm whether the other guild members are there too, but instead the MC decides to screw with the natives and seems to have little to no interest in his stated goal. It would have made more sense if the MC had just gone "eh fuck it i will just fool around" from the get go.

>>149534719
>from isekai genre
I'd remove isekai completely.

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>>149541372
>the fact that he is a skeleton has almost no impact on the story

>>149541418
>turn into a skeleton
>decide to go out and save some village from bandits
>kidnap a whole bunch of mages who were attacking the village and use them for experimentation
>send a homicidal vampire loli to go kidnap martial artists because he wants to learn more about martial arts
>use magic to disguise himself and sign up as an adventurer to become famous
>find out there are some lizardmen tribes living nearby, deliberately engineer a convulated plan to make them band together and fight an undead army while simultenously testing his subourdinate's capacity for initiative and strategic thinking

Yea, the whole skeleton bit is really high on his priority list.

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>>149541306
_I reincarnated as a sword_
his first wielder is a orphaned child who he helps to escape from slavery. The first person they kill is a member of the crime syndicate who enslaved her. They cut off his arms, use him as a test subject for thief skills, and then dispassionately kill him as he helplessly begs for his life. It's a methodical "adventurer's procedural" story.

>>149534719
All of that isn't the real problem. The real problem with Isekai is making references to RPG logic.

The moment where a character is attributed numbers to describe his abilities or where he's graded from D to S or something you know that it's going to be shit.

>>149541840
Agreed on that. I was about to argue that it's interesting to know a character's abilities, but I realized it would be much more enjoyable to not be certain about the outcome of a certain battle just because someone's numbers were higher.

>>149534938
>Death March
Twice as bad as Re:Zero

>>149534938
This has to bait.
Literally every series is 'doing isekai' better than those two.

>>149541840
I keep trying to figure out why I hate this so much. I think it's because it makes the story feel so much more plastic when you just insert concepts from a completely different genre to use as the main logic of your fantasy story. Not to mention it feels like they pandering to me hard when they make the main character a sudden badass because he's a lonely nerd who plays videogames all the time.

>>149537650
>no clear vision and genre
Literally nothing is wrong with genre mixing. There's absolutely no point in arbitrarily limiting yourself to the conventions of a single genre.

And the Kumo author has planned the story out pretty meticulously from multiple viewpoints even if they sometimes resort to filler while trying to sort out exactly how everything fits together. Like holy shit the elf village battle has been delayed forever. But it's not like the story doesn't have a clear purpose and ending unlike a bunch of SoL isekai.

>>149541256
OP powers are fine as long as the author writes a sufficiently interesting conflict involving them whether it be by throwing equally OP enemies at the MC or MC's OPness causing personal or political problems for him. Like, even if you have the power to wipe out a large nation, if you want to live in peace with other people carelessly showing off your awe inspiring, terrifying powers is a recipe for trouble.

>>149542380
how many authors do that

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>>149541840
Though i loved komosuba i do think they went to far with the stuff like having a hero card and assigning points to skills to learn them and even having the "Quest complete" after doing a mission.

>>149542558
It isn't that bad in Konosuba because Konosuba is more of a parody that doesn't take itself seriously.

>>149540228
zero no tsukaima is stupid.
they had all this background build up saying how the mcs slave/familiar seal more or less was mind control but then they drop the ball later on and say it was nothing. like wtf.

>>149542558
>>149542581
Konosuba is bad contextually. It is a bunch of idiots that fuck around and people think that is good (not). Also, Konosuba does not explore the rpg crap further so it does not do it right. If you think a bunch of idiots that fuck around as a comedy is good, then your taste in comedy is pretty dry. Because parodies do not work in the long run if they lead no where. The characters are literal jokes (you people consider them good characters, ha!). Take Onizuka, he may fuck around a little (never gotten laid, though), may make himself a joke, but he has a silver lining in the fact that he is trying to be the best teacher and instruct his student the hard way.

>>149542814
Oh, it's this sperg again.

I like the ones that gently bullies female protagonists. There's something special about a girl who tries her best but the world makes her fail. But she doesn't give up. What a good girl.

Ascendence of the bookworm
and
I said make my abilities average

though the latter isn't so much bullying especially not in the newest chapters

>>149542443
Like every other shonen manga eventually escalates to the MC having literal earth-splitting powers but keeps stakes high by introducing villains with equally earth-splitting powers.

It's cheap powerlevels inflation but it works.

>>149542983
If Konosuba starred a female NEET being punted around by the whims of Fantasy 'Straya would it still be as popular?

>>149534938
Kekkon Yubiwa Monogatari doesn't feel like an isekai to me.
It just feels like a normal fantasy harem adventure.

Might be because it doesn't have anything game-related in it though.
Or because he could technically leave whenever he wants if the grandpa let him.

I feel an important part of isekai is being unable to return to their own world, but Kekkon Yubiwa doesn't technically have that.
The MC also chose to go there, he wasn't forced/draggen in.

>>149543036
I love Humanity Has Declined and Sabagebu!, so I would definitely still enjoy it if he personality wasn't changed.

>>149542919
Sorry if I pissed you off, konosubafag. Before you say, "you didn't". Because I would call you inconsistent.

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>>149534719
>"I guess I'll just use my vidya knowledge to overcome all the hardships"
WHAT THE FUCK IS THAT SHIT

>>149543036
I second >>149543102 - anon, Watashi-like MC would be great.

>>149542814
>Because parodies do not work in the long run if they lead no where.
Satire can have an incredibly long life-span if done well. It's just really hard to do good satire.

>>149543036
If Kazuma was female Konosuba would so much more vicious.

Kazuma at least has a shred of chivalry in him when he's feeling generous, female Kazuma would just tear into Aqua like there was no tomorrow.

>>149534719
school setting, delete all school setting

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>>149534719
>adventurer guild
>trapped in an mmo
>everything that OP stated previously

>>149534719
MC gets teleported to a fantasy land that clearly looks like it's supposed to be modeled after Europe but all the people still speak not-Japanese and practice not-Japanese customs.

Isekai connoisseur here.

Sevens is harem and mc done right (he starts as a generic dense/incompetent mc but throughout the novel becomes a lot more confident and competent and just overall a nice character.) The harem members actually fight each other and form factions.

Tsuki ga Mibichiku no Douchuu is OP mc done right, but he a bit on the beta side (the novel does explain why his attitude is like that) but even though MC is very op, there is actual tangible conflict in the story and the mc gets btfo.

Mushoku Tensei, Shield Hero, Death March, and all the others like that are kinda your how to get into the genre do they can be good depending on how tired and jaded you are.

>>149543833
Sensei, what do you think of Konosuba?

>>149534719
>MC is a bear
>but everyone thinks he's a human because of his OP bluff skill

>>149543833
>Sevens
Nice to see this mentioned, it was a pretty entertaining read. Some of "those" scenes with the seven were really emotional.
Another WN I started recently and that has been great so far is Saihate no Paladin, it has no harem (in fact no female love interest so far), and a great MC who doesn't have cheats. He's strong sure, but not "killing everything with a blink" strong, and he didn't just get his power on a silver platter.

Mushoku Tensei is still my favorite though, and Kumo my guilty pleasure.

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>>149539240
>>149539978

Not that guy but I'm assuming this is Kumoko? I'n a recent chapter she made her goal to become an Arachne so I guess it's not surprising.

Didn't expect her to be such a babe though. Reminds me a lot of Queelag's sister in dark souls.

>>149543857
>calls myself an isekai connoisseur
>realizes that sevens isn't isekai.
Well that's embarrassing. Well whatever close enough.

I didn't mention popular ln like Overlord, Youjo Senki, Konosuba, and Log Horizon cause they're already popular but they're good.

>>149543833
>>149543857
Stop your bullshit. I've read Tsuki ga and everything is way too convenient for him. Everything was laid out too much from the beginning as well as the moon god giving him power. From the beginning, it lacks tension from how the mc started and a harem makes the bar even lower as there are multiple women after him.

>>149542633
In Znt, the only thing that changed about Saito is how homesick he was as compared to how he'd ACTUALLY be.

It's brought up as a plot thread. Of course, despite the apparent mind melding, all of the decisions he made were ones he would have made anyway.

>>149543833
Reccing more stuff.

There's Dungeon Defense. Although the setting isn't important and only there to introduce the end goal of MC needing to survive. This novel is really character focused as almost all of the antagonists besides the initial fodder are all intelligent and psychotic (and this is shown through their actions not because the author said they are . ) The mc is essentially Lelouch thrown in an isekai fantasy world as the demon lord and forced to act out machievallian acts. Very nicely written

Tensei Oujo wa Kyou. This one has shoujo vibes but I think it's not very shoujo at all besides the mc having a typical nice person as her love interest. Basically femMc gets thrown into an otome game world where all the main cast are broken/abusive/yandere types and the mc goes and fixes them before they grow up like that. It's nicely written and can be very emotional.

I'm forgetting some things prob but I recced some good novels

>>149537772
>This doesnt work often in the west (otherwise everyone would just submit shitty twilight ripoffs).

Ahahaha.

>>149544164
That is certainly true, however the novel does get away from the common tropes and pitfalls that other op mc isekai novels tend to do which is not developing their heroines correctly, not having a goal, not introducing any conflict at all, the mc psyche not really being explored, and is just an interesting story. He does have a lot of conveniences in the beginning but that's just the premise to have his own slave kingdom in his pocket

My only regret is that Joseph Campbell isn't around to analyze all of this.

>>149537668
>>149537772
That is the problem in every single low-barrier-to-entry medium. Prepper fan fiction:
>MC instantly gets a bunker/bug out ranch with little to no effert
>MC has godlike preparation compared to the government
>Most of the characters are retarded except for the MC

>>149536217
Basically is fine when you have a bias to it even though it runs every other shit tropes that the other series run, same garbage tropes is a no-no unless is your series right? Fuck off.

>>149537772
>This doesn't work often in the west (otherwise everyone would just submit shitty twilight ripoffs)
Well I don't that shit but just going into book store proves that you are really fucking wrong right there.

>>149537772
As anons have pointed out, you're actually wrong when you say that that shit doesn't fly in the west. Barnes & Noble is packed with rip-offs of popular works of every flavor. There's usually the better part of a shelf full of vampire erotica. You just don't know about them because you don't care about bodice-rippers the way you care about LNs.

>>149545147

Hell didn't 50 shades of gray start out as a twillight fanfic?

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Post best isekai girls .Pic related.

>>149545284

Got boring after she stopped being bullied in the labyrinth.

>>149534719
>OP makes a shit thread

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>>149545301
Even tough she starts eating Sophia's Sophias?

>>149540478
>Like a pillow, you need the right fluff, material,and softness. Otherwise you are gonna get a jagged rock and people think it is comfy.

Truer words have never been said.

>>149537614
"|Consequences" don't translate to gore and endless suffering with little actual justification.

>>149545382
>little actual justification
Are you one of those faggots who thinks workers didnt deserve death and Ainz should not have attacked an enemy army in vol 9 ?

>>149545259
Yep. The characters were called Bella etc. before she had to change them to publish it.

>>149534719
>medieval world where no one speaks nip
>nip honorifics

>>149545416
No, I mean cases in which all the suffering is entirely plot-induced and characters get fucked over just for the sake of it instead of, for example, because they actually fucked up hard for understandable reasons or because they have earned enemies that have a reason to want to make them suffer.
I don't give two shits about Subaru's suffering because the universe and the plot is entirely constructed around him being fucked over because he either just coincidentally ends up in the wrong time and place or because he's unbelievably stupid and is so narratively inconsistent that he just makes himself suffer for bullshit reasons.

overpowered mc right off the bat is the only one that really irks me

>>149545492
Alternatively, equally dumb shit
>medieval world where everyone speaks nip

>>149545492
>>149545683
You cold use that argument against literally any book not set on earth.
Just because the novel is in Japanese doesn't mean the characters are speaking Japanese (in fact most novels have some explanation for why the character understands the language, or he just learns it as he grows up in reincarnation ones). The honorifics can be explained by just being honorifics in whatever language the characters speak.

There's so many actual issues with isekai, why would you need to resort to the language?

>>149545492
That's a fairly dumb complaint, since honorifics are an important device for establishing context and level of formality in dialogue. Removing them cripples the use of the language. It's like complaining that an English book about ninjas doesn't use nip honorifics. Sure, it's more authentic, but the readers won't be able to catch the nuance if they don't have experience with nip already and will just end up confused.
If you want to bitch about honorifics, then complain to the translators who don't change them to suitable equivalents.

These threads are always the fucking same thing
>why do japamese writers have different writing styles
>this isn't like my superior fantasy novels
>I don't understand what target audience is
>they don't cater to non-japanese prefrences so they are shit

>>149542983
>Ascendence of the bookworm
>gentle bullying

Enjoy that comfy life while you can.

>>149545871

As long as she doesn't die I consider it gentle.

Anyome who reads shieldbro got their copy of vol 6 yet?

> being able to see your stats in something that *isn't* a game
Stop that, Japan. It's retarded. You're in a got dang fantasy world. You should be living the fantasy, not obsessing over your fucking character sheet.

>>149546247
Traditional western-style fantasy emerged in Japan entirely due to the influences of tabletop RPGs and JRPGS. Considering it's at the very core of their understanding of the genre, it's no wonder they're so obsessed with it.

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Would a story with a similar premise as Overlord but focus on the NPCs rather than the Player be considered isekai or just fantasy?

>>149546247
>not minmaxing your build

Pleb please.

>>149534938
By this account Dungeon Defense also does Isekai right.

>>149546447
It did?

>>149546447
DD is great

>>149538444
The only Isekai I've read where the MC went to the other world willingly is Tsuki ga Michibiku Isekai Douchuu

Also the other world's magic is behind where the MC is a mage of the real world brought in a new world

>>149541225
The lazy swordmaster does this actually. He is a hero who died together with the demon lord and is reincarnated in a new world though it suffers from "laying low" trope but he has a reason for it. Only 20ish chapters are translated so its not enough if it is good enough or not

>>149534719
The problem with Isekai is that it's Isekai. The fucking point of the Isekai genre is that any dimwit from the real world can be whatever the author wants them to be in a fantasy world so that everyone can self-insert. Oh, and it being not “the real world” also means that actions inherently don't have “real” consequences. It's just a fantasy world, after all.
Yeah, you can pull bullshit like feedback to the real world, but at that point the only reason why you're writing an Isekai story is for self-insert.

So in my opinion, Isekai itself is the problem. You can write stories with magic in the real world. You can write stories set completely in a fantasy world, so that for all of the characters, it actually is their real world. There's no fucking point to Isekai other than allowing the audience to self-insert, which is exactly why it's such a cancer.

>>149542241
perhaps the only isekai that did this RPG thing good is Log Horizon.

>>149546865
>LH
>good RPG
No. Suffers from same cancer as SAO.

>>149543833
Tsuki ga Mibichiku no Douchuu MC is pretty well developed though he suffers the "lay low" trope of the japanese LN's. His issues in real world actually affects him on the new one and he has a goal that is not easily reached.

Is there an isekai with an ensemble cast and shifting perspectives like Baccano or DRRR, where there's no singular MC?

>>149547007
Does Fate Strange Fake count as isekai?

>>149544258
Dungeon Defense is way too different from the common Isekai.

Too bad the power he chose isn't really utilized in the later chapters and was kinda forgotten.

>>149545910
That bar is way too low and now I am interested in reading it

The only one thing I would 100% get rid of is the "instant harem".

I can live with instant romance or instant love triangle but instant harem means that the author does not actually care about the isekai itself and is just an excuse for shenanigans. Unless you're going for explicit comedy like Konosuba or something, I'm usually out by that point

>>149546888
What I liked about it is that they actually lived in the RPG world and used its systems to create something new while actually being reminded that they are in the game.

It is shit but not as shitty as SAO IMO

Which is worse, Isekai harem or Battle high school harem

I hate both, but which is the most cancerous?

>>149546843
Isekai, in theory, is a good idea. It's just not being used to it's full potential

>>149546888
>No. Suffers from same cancer as SAO.
In what regard?

>>149547329
They are pretty much the same, but battle high school is worse because high school.

>>149546529
The MC isn't dense, he is insane and not quite self-aware of his insanity, so we get some stupidly dumb moments and some great insight ones, the mix is good.
The MC starts with godlike powers in the prologue, but then settles for one, which is to get a perfect read one everyone else's potential. That's it. Sucks at fighting, great at scheming and politics, like THE best... Among people his age, as he gets thrown into century old plans, he ends up way outside his depth.
The main girl... Well, the MC is set on only ever loving one woman, which for now reciprocates, but she could betray him any minute, but his father had a harem, a pretty kickass explaining of why he did, and wondered how many women his son would have in his. MC despises the thought, but the world seems pretty damn inclined on having him meet women he can bond with in ways he never ever imagined.

Si yeah, according to those three points, DD is does Isekai well.

>>149543966
>Mushoku Tensei is still my favorite though, and Kumo my guilty pleasure
I liked both of them especially MT . Some of the better ones out there. The new Laplace spin-off btw is really good.

>>149547007
There is, check out Lazy King(Daraku no Ou)

>>149547151
I think it just didn't work on the queen or barbatos(Our author didn't just forget about it right?) There should've been a notice if their affection had really risen.

>>149547767
>There is, check out Lazy King(Daraku no Ou)

I forgot about that story.

Arc three when? The prophecy isn't finished yet, the story can't end like this.

>>149547767
>Lazy King
Is it really? It is never relevant if i remember correctly and only gets mentioned that he remembers a previous life right?

>>149547908
Only Leigie is an isekai character, everyone else is a native. Unless you were looking for an ensemble cast of isekaiees.

>>149540977

That's why I Eris was my favorite character in Mushoku Tensei. Unlike blue or elf, Eris got actual development and felt like she had real motivations all during her life.

Name 1 trope that isn't made better by the main character being reincarnated into a Vending Machine.

That's right, you can't.

>>149547868
Sadly nothing from the author yet but a lot of people do keep begging for the 3rd part.

>>149547908
>Is it really? It is never relevant
What do you mean?
Every single chapter is written from a different perspective and are all equally relevant. Especially Greed, Gluttony, Wrath and Pride.

Leigie doesn't even appear that much in the second half except near the end.

>>149548220
>What do you mean?
The isekai part.

>>149548240
Being a Japanese salaryman in his past life is why he's so fucking lazy and apathetic now.

Can someone recommend an isekai where the mc doesn't become the all-god of the world but instead remains mediocre from beginning to end?

If possible, the MC not even being involved in important quests would be great, a sort of SOL vibe with small adventuring bits would be great.

>>149548220
>>149547908
Ah if you meant if it mattered about it being isekai Well he was reincarnated so yea I guess.

>>149541561

No, fuck this one.

I don't know if I'm jaded or what but the first thing that the sword decides to do when he learns to move is to indiscriminately kill goblins. What if goblins are a rational race in this world? Sword guy is a homicidal psychopath.

>>149548240
He probably wouldn't get so strong otherwise, you know without the isekai part.

Not a single sloth demon managed to survive and build up that much power even if they were hiding and not doing anything all their lives. But thats also probably because they didn't have pride-boy beside them.

>>149548261
Grimgar

>>149548220

Thanks for reminding me, we should also remove all 7 deadly sins motifs.

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>>149548261
Lazy Dungeon Master

>SOL vibe with small adventuring bits would be great.

Yep

>mc doesn't become the all-god of the world but instead remains mediocre from beginning to end?

Well, he is sort of OP due to the Unforeseen consequences of an equivalent of a Babel Fish (or Aqua-man's powers), witch, to him, becomes apparent only after having a nice conversation with a golem.

>the MC not even being involved in important quests would be great

Yes, instead of saving\destroying the world, he bade a Hotel\onsen\brothel out of his dungeon.

>>149534928

Yes I agree be stupid and say memes

>>149537772

It's all based around the artwork. If people like the artwork the publishers don't give a shit about the storylines made to go along with them

>>149540412

Yup

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>>149541023
>Isekai
>"Went mainstream"

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>>149547262

Sometimes gradual harem is even more fucking frustrating

>>149536286
>>149536449
>>149536567
But most isekai I've read have MC choose all of them though?

>>149549746
Gradual harem and instant harem are essentially the same thing. The point is that a harem forms very clearly early on

>>149549805
>But most isekai I've read have MC choose all of them though?
And how many of those actually ended, ie, didn't get cancelled

>>149549847
Most are still ongoing.

>>149549872
Exactly

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What's even the point of the genre at this point?
9/10 times the MC's homeworld is never mentioned or relevant in any shape or form. It's ultimately just an excuse to insert the "average seemingly unimpressive" dude into a fantasy setting.


And there's nothing wrong about stories that feature an average joe, but why can't it be an average person in respect to that world?

>>149550165
>And there's nothing wrong about stories that feature an average joe, but why can't it be an average person in respect to that world?
No. It needs to be a otaku from nip land. Don't fuck with the laws of nature. Out of 7 billion people it will always be that one guy.

>>149534719
No isekai genre, just make the MC from the same world. Or parody. Or reverse Isekai.

There is pretty much no point in the MC coming from our world most of the time. Drifters is a good example of the isekai'd characters having a real impact to the fantasy world.

>>149539001
As in like Re:monster but with a girl ?

Sounds fantastic. And a trio of girl being transported and becoming different monster girls would be even better.

>>149549886
I don't see a problem with ongoing stories. It's the same regardless of genre; they go on for a long, long time before ending.

>>149548339
He's a sword. It's kinda pointed out that as a sword he lacks any kind of remorse when it comes to killing because he's a fucking SWORD, a weapon made exclusively for the sake of killing shit.

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>>149550165
Because nobody reads the ones that do involve their original worlds it seems.

>>149543020
but it doesn't escalate, that is my point, isekai series usually have the MC start off as OP.

>>149547262
"Because it is a comedy, I will excuse bullshit."
This is what you are currently saying.

>>149544412
If all it takes for you to call a series good based on avoiding tropes, then you have low standards

>>149548062
>Unless you were looking for an ensemble cast of isekaiees.

Why hasn't this been done?

>>149547262
>The only one thing I would 100% get rid of is the "instant harem".
Get rid of "easily purchase loyal cat/dog/elf-girl slave waifu" while you're at it. It has no purpose other than to be one of the common pipelines for instant harems.

>>149551988
Has been:
Chihou Kishi Hans no Junan

>>149534719
Should I feel bad, that my favourite Isekai "Arifureta" has all three?

>>149550216

>Average highschool boy/HikkiNEET
>A library of knowledge about video game mechanics, nevermind the fact that the fantasy world may not even operate on such laws
>The story lacks substance and experience, as if the author gets all his shit from VNs instead of actually reading about the world much less travel it

Lets face it, light novels, especially isekai ones, are just self-insert fantasies of the authors, and otaku eat it up like hotcakes.

>>149534719
>love interest with little to no effort
Is it that strange for one person to fall for another without either of them having to prove their worth?

I can understand banning spontaneous harems but this seems like going a little far.

>>149555163
It's not strange, but it generally doesn't make for an interesting and engaging relationship to read about.

Here's a general rule: Reality doesn't make for a particularly interesting story and there's nothing wrong with discarding realism for the sake of the narrative as long as internal consistency is maintained. This includes things that can be used as an excuse for not making an effort, like instant love interests.

>>149534719
None of them.
I'd put all of them in.

>>149534938
Yamamoto Yohko is probably the best isekai.

>>149556163
>Here's a general rule: Reality doesn't make for a particularly interesting story
Yeah but I'm not talking about reality in the first place. I can't think of a story I enjoyed, EVER, where someone had to "earn" someone else's love.

I'm not even talking about stuff where a love interest says "do X or I can't date you." They're already a fucking love interest at that point. I'm talking about a character receiving a love interest as a reward for doing things. I don't understand that at all. Is he conquering love into them? Is that the appeal?

>>149556512
You're over-analyzing it dude, it's not that the MC has to "earn" the love of the girl, it's just that there needs to be at least SOME interaction between them.

Someone's personality is displayed through someone's actions, which is why "love at first sight" seems really superfluous. If you don't even know the person, or have barely interacted at all, how are you falling in love with him?

Too many isekai (or harems in general) just throw girls at the MC who start squirting themselves at the first sound of his voice. All I want is some decent reasons for the sudden urges to bear MC's children.

Okay maybe one or two of the girls are just in it for MC's looks/yasashii, but not the whole fucking score of them.

>>149556780
Yeah, after becoming an author myself and finishing my first novel with heavy litRPG stuff I figured that out.
Author needs to write lots of stuff off page in his head, then you only see a tiny tip of that through the character's actions. It's a sign of a more mature author, who realizes that you can have decent, realistic characters while still pandering the fuck out of them.
Altina's author does that well with both his series that I read.

It really has nothing to do with the girls, it's just characters. The problem that I don't think /a/ gets, that I didn't get, is that the target audience is too young and hungry for a sexual fantasy to actually care about that.
I realized that after writing a CYOA hypno porn story. Sometimes, they just want a dick in a chick, and as an author you have to deliver.

>>149540644
>It's a sub-genre
It's a setting, dullard.

>>149534719
I'd definitely ban revival, that's the worst mechanic for any kind of genre.

>>149541372
>MC is worshipped like a god
More like a sacred animal. What I hate about Overlord past first volume is that he becomes a pawn in his own followers hands, who have almost no personality besides being evil, not that he himself has any personality to speak of. MC just keep agreeing with whatever his followers suggest and I just keep cheering for people who Nazarick crushes.

>>149558864
It's gonna end up badly at some point in the future

>>149551988
Hero Union BBS kind of is.

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Since the thread is about to end anyone wanna share optinions or criticism on this?

Spent 9000 in paint.net doing this

>>149545284
>>149545324
Or getting her kumos ripped by the eternal loli flat maou.

>>149537632
>I would ban instant love interests that appear from the get-go
This.
Fucking dungeon defender or whatever the fuck it's called.
Entire beginning of the story is MC not wanting to be like his dad, not giving a shit about women and LITERALLY the first female he meets in the story he falls in love with despite neither have a reason for loving each other other than "hurr durr he/she so smart people are attracted to each other based on intelligence and edge"

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i wish the thread lasted a bit more

>>149565211
If you lot talked about LNs other than just isekai it would do better.

>>149565233
Well i got my copy of vol 6 of shieldbro so we could talk about that.
Would you be interested?

>>149565296
Haven't kept up on shieldbro in a long time.

>>149565514
LN or WN? I can get you up to speed if you wish

>>149565569
Was WN probably, wasn't interested enough when they got to the island to keep going.

>>149565771
I see, things change up in the island in vol 5. Wanna hear about it?

>>149563143
>"hurr durr he/she so smart people are attracted to each other based on intelligence and edge"
That's actually a fairly good reason to fall in love with someone, especially considering it took them three volumes worth of interaction before they did.

>>149565841
Not particularly, I've just been keeping up with the manga threads for shieldbro when I see them. I know how you feel though, I've been trying to get some people interested in Blood Sign here and there but I don't want to resort to clickbait threads.

>>149534719
>"All" the girls must love the MC because he's nice.

>>149566045
E tu anon? only ever post in isekai threads, threads about isekai series, gobbo slayer threads and the occassoinal /a/ thread. The only ones i ever started are shieldro threads and i would never sort to do clickbait threads either. I appreciate you coming to the threads makes me feel someone out there likes it. whats blood sign?

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>>149566229
LN by Kamachi. It's about an MC that likely qualifies as a stu and his Great Old One yandere stalker who is try to corrupt him. I'm bad at explaining but that's the very basic summary.

>>149566280
Edgier nyaruko san?

MC's need to stop being boring self inserts who somehow become OP and get all the girls

You want an OP MC? That's fine make him someone who was successful in the real world, You want him to get all the girls? Also fine but give an actual fucking reason as to why everyone's wet around him!!

>>149566601
>tfw Naofumi gets demi-human pussy around him is because he's the shield hero, has latent psychic powers that attract beings with animal features towards him (including demihumans and beastemen), is a good cook, is a jew and overall nice guy if you get past the angsty anger and betrayal thing.

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>>149566318
Pretty different overall, trying to avoid spoilers. It's more urban fantasy with a summoning system that's kind of like trading cards and billiards. That's the backdrop though, the real story is between the Kyousuke (the MC) and the White Queen. The first half of the first volume is a real slog since it's almost purely about explaining the summoning ceremony, but it really picks up when the White Queen appears and the later novels are much better without spending the entire first 1/3 on explaining things.
The MC is alright on his own. Intelligence and skill-wise he's pretty much the second coming of Onii-sama, but the nature of the summoning ceremony means he has no special powers that his enemies don't have and that's all worthless in the presence of the Queen anyway. The Queen really carries the series though.

>>149543286
You didn't

>>149566601
>That's fine make him someone who was successful in the real world
People would still complain about that.

>You want him to get all the girls? Also fine but give an actual fucking reason as to why everyone's wet around him
Didn't he have OP powers?

>>149566727
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEbE3fGfF-o

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Easily MC is the strongest in the universe because he's a human and he's better than everyone.

Why is Overlord the only one to do Isekai right.

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>>149567454
But this is a spider. Literally a spider

>>149541196
How about an isekai where a young man gets turned into an old man with a family and shit?

>>149534719
Congratulations on describing 90% of Isekai to a t.

>>149534719
I would ban bad writing

>no isekai series where the new world is created by the MC

>>149568127
Sounds like it has been done before

>>149568127
It has been done tough, many isekai where mc IS literally the god of the world.

>>149568199
What if he's not a God and plays along with his own rules of universe like everyone else?

>>149568235
Do you mean a GOD mc that makes an human avatar separated from his GOD self and this avatar is basically like other humans?I think that was done too but cant remember name.

>>149568269
Something like that, yeah.

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>>149568235
Closest thing I can think of to that isn't isekai but rather a simulation.

>>149568016
yeah that could be interesting

Probably actually have the authors actually finish their stories. Most of the shit that comes out these days never get a proper ending and either take forever to come out or go on hiatus.

>>149568281
Vampire > Zombie

>>149568016
There is one where a girl finds herself into the body of a married woman who even has a child. Havent read it yet tough, not interested in shojou stuff.
Check novelupdates for name and translation link.