This is the only Rebuild movie that is actually good. You can

>>146830661
Kaworu is a fag, so no, you are wrong.

2.0 had better fights and more emotional impact

3.0 dragged on a bit, and Kaworu is fucking boring. It also had Misato acting like a cunt.

The film follows logically as a significant part of the dialectic established by all earlier Evangelion releases.

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EVA is in essence just a harem wish fulfilment show.
The movies (yes all three of them) show us a more grown up writer handling his fanfic in less obvious ways. I agree on the third movie being the best one, but it's kind of dubious to rate them when the story isn't finished yet.

>>146830954
>The movies (yes all three of them) show us a more grown up writer handling his fanfic in less obvious ways
But he did exactly the opposite you dingus. It's not subtle at all.

>>146830954
>story

>>146830661
3.33 is easily the worst. Everyone either had what made them good characters in the series and either excised it or fucked it up beyond all reasoning. You can't name a character that isn't worse than they originally were because the movie is more focused on flashy fight scenes.

>>146831062
Define worse

>>146830977
elaborate

>>146831062
>3.33 is easily the worst

That would be 1.11, which was largely just a clip show version of redrawn frames from the show

>>146831100
The one that acts least like arbitrary impositions of what a film should be like

>>146831185
Try putting it into words or neither of us is getting anywhere

>>146831100
>elaborate
Damn it man I'm lazy. But in rebuild you have Rei and Asuka learning to cook just for Shinji. In NGE Asuka's only after Kaji's dick, and Rei develops feelings towards Shinji, but not to the same extent and in the same rushed manner.

>>146831218
Rebuild of Evangelion 3.0 is nerd garbage for hipster geeks and losers, and basically is not epic in any way

>>146831250
>In NGE Asuka's only after Kaji's dick
Rewatch NGE if this is the conclusion you drew it's the wrong one.

>>146831272
Try putting it into words adults would use.

>>146830661
>You can (not) prove me wrong.

Good thing you left the not in parentheses. Because everyone can.

3.33 has objectively the least character development and the most pandering, and not only that, it's characters, it's plot and setting are also the most unrealistic.

What's worse, it turned a story that could be understood by all that watched it into a piece of fiction only consumable by escapist otaku.

In many ways, it's the ultimate betrayal of everything Evangelion stood up for and did right.

>>146831218
>>146831100
>>146831334
That's ironic. Here you are, a fat, raging weeb loner who's making a post on 4chan making a boastful claim that you think 3.33 is the best Rebuild movie and that you cannot be proven wrong.

Do you know exactly how many words, adult or not that it takes to prove someone like you wrong? None. none at all. All you're looking for is (you)'s, because even the biggest fan of 3.33 knows in their heart that it's the worst Rebuild movie.

>plotfags
Americans away from Evangelion franchise, there can not be anything for you there

>2.0 fags still exist even after it got BTFO by based colonydrop

http://www.colonydrop.com/hideaki-anno-is-trying-to-kill-anime-and/
>Evangelion 2.0: You Can (Not) Advance isn’t just a terrible movie, it’s a terribly offensive movie and one of the worst animated films in recent memory. It is a disgusting testament to the most shamelessly commercial aspects of the Japanese animation industry, the ineptitude of Hideaki Anno and the crippling stupidity of anime fans. It is a movie made for those who have fooled themselves into thinking that just because it’s Evangelion, and Evangelion is “intellectual,” that they aren’t buying into a scheme of shallow merchandising and pathetic fan-pandering bread and circuses resolutely devoid of any artistic or creative merit.

>>146831164
At least it had a decent plot by virtue of being a remastered version of the original.

>>146831556
Literally who?

>>146831556
Further proof that Americans fundamentally cannot appreciate cinematic art.

>>146831556
t. butthurt Asukafag author

If there's anything bad about the Evangelion fanbase, and particular the fans of Asuka, it's their complete lack of self-respect and integrity in peddling their opinions.

>>146831587
It was substantially worse because it removed every scene that implied Shinji had mental problems and turned him into a generic whiny protagonist

2.0 and 3.0 redeemed the movies by emphasizing the fact that Shinji was fucked up

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>>146831372
>I missed the point entirely the post
3.0 is foreign and depressing because the world is foreign and depressing for Shinji. The characters are unfamiliar and unappealing because they're unfamiliar and unappealing to Shinji. The plot is a jumbled mess of unexplained actions because the events of the story are a jumbled unexplained mess for Shinji. Anno has so masterfully placed you into the mindset of our main character that you didn't even notice it and end up hating the movie for the same reasons Shinji ends up hating the world, desperately wishing things would go back to the way they were.

>>146831677
There's something fundamental wrong with people like you. You have such a warped and delusional view of reality it's downright disturbing.

You realize that 1.11 is more or less a carbon copy of NGE's first parts, and that it actually added a scene where Ritsuko and Gendo openly discuss the fact that Shinji is mentally unstable?

I mean, how do you even live with yourself on your throne of bullshit? You're sitting in shit and can't you even smell yourself? It's disgusting!

>>146831726
>I got BTFO so I'll make up some lame headcanon excuse

Not how it works, unfortunately. All you achieve by setting pandering to the max and making the characters unrealistic is making the viewer disbelieve the entire story and the seriousness of it, in other words, they are far, far from Shinji's shoes.

Then don't forget the pandering portion - because by catering strongly to e.g female otaku as 3.33 does, it's providing them with a strong sense of familiarity and downright inviting them to accept and settle in this new story. Unsurprisingly, they accept it and love it, which would be directly against your made up authorial intent.

>>146831460
>fat
It's a little too early for ad hominem isn't it? How about you actually attack my argument instead of dropping your Freudian spaghetti all out of your pants.

>>146831778
>it actually added a scene where Ritsuko and Gendo openly discuss the fact that Shinji is mentally unstable?

You should probably actually watch the shows before you spout bullshit, because there isn't a single line of original dialogue in the first movie until they change the angel battle at the end.

They skipped over multiple scenes showing Shinji's inability to function with other people, deleted every line referencing his spineless need to go along with what other people tell him to, and edited the scene of events to make it appear that he threw a tantrum and ran away from home rather than being forced into a corner by NERV's bullying

>>146831913
Here's the problem fatso: You never had an argument. You just made a wanton claim and screamed "PROVE ME WRONG". So yeah, you're getting far more than you deserve, you ugly sack of shit.

Wanna argue like adults? Wanna join the big boys club? Then delete your evageeks account and bring some motherfucking arguments to the table, and make them well-thought out ones because I guarantee you that you WILL be ripped to shreds and called out for your bullshit within seconds if not.

Otherwise, start working out you pathetic piece of otaku filth.

ITT: Mentally unstable people

>>146832004
Right now you're just going full on denial. I cited a scene found in 1.11 which has Ritsuko and Gendo directly mention the fact that Shinji is mentally unstable, as if his attitude didn't make that abundantly clear already.

You can't bend your delusional head around this one.

>>146831905
That's my first post of the thread.

>Then don't forget the pandering portion - because by catering strongly to e.g female otaku as 3.33 does, it's providing them with a strong sense of familiarity and downright inviting them to accept and settle in this new story. Unsurprisingly, they accept it and love it, which would be directly against your made up authorial intent.
You mean exactly in the way that Kaworu is the one reprieve for Shinji in the story only to have him die leaving him (and the fans) with nothing?

>>146831556
Why do they say this about the movie that is less harem than it's original? It feels like they just noticed how pretentious EVA is and blames the 2nd movie for doing the exact same thing its predecessors did. Kind of weird.

>>146830661

Are you like, 15?

Then yes.

>>146832028
>you're fat haha
If that's what makes you feel more secure then have it. Now can you actually counter my argument or?

>>146832140
or fujoshit

>>146832078
>That's my first post of the thread.
I know, you appeared as a new post. Doesn't mean you didn't get BTFO and had to make up some irrational and illogical excuse as a response.

>You mean exactly in the way that Kaworu is the one reprieve for Shinji in the story only to have him die leaving him (and the fans) with nothing?
No, having Kaworu die there fulfills the fan's fantasy. 3.33 sells Kaworu as a "looper" akin to Homura from Madoka, and overloads the movie with references to other tales involving starcrossed lovers. Then add in the insinuations from the previous movies, comments from Anno that they should consider NGE Kaworu as the same as Rebuild Kaworu, as well as comments from voice actors concerning the number of "cycles" Kaworu has gone through.

Pandering to otaku is first and foremost about providing a platform from which the fans can take possession of the work by fictionalizing it themselves. Providing fully detailed stories with proper conclusions serves against the purpose of pandering to otaku because it robs them the ability to stick to their own headcanon.

When 3.33 made it so that Rebuild had dedicated a full 1/4 of it's story to this, with possibly more. There's been a long grace-period for otaku to frolic in their own headcanon, with ample merchandise to go with it.

>>146832170
>p-please don't c-call me fat
>c-counter m-my argument!
HAHAHAHA

What argument, fatso? YOU HAVE NONE

>>146832308
Otaku really want to self-insert as Shinji. Don't they?

>>146832078
So you don't think someone dying for their lover plays right into the hands of shippers?

>b-but they will never see each other again!
>oh wait, they've added the mechanic of repeating events so that his death is now completely inconsequential because, and I quote: "they'll meet again"

There's nothing that turns fujoshi on more than repeated tragic love stories like these.

>>146832488
Some do, others only want to use him as an accessory to a ship. 3.33 is taking that to it's logical extreme, e.g leaving Shinji out of the story and abusing him into going to Kaworu whilst ruining everything else he liked.

>>146832308
Otakus like homoshit?

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>>146832560
Delicious Reifag butthurt

>>146832564
You think they don't? Otaku is a catch-all term that includes fujoshi and fundoshi.

For those who don't like "homoshit", it's overloaded with character-less cute girls, in particularly Asuka and Maria are pandered to high heaven.

>>146832634
>reifag butthurt
>post an image of Asukafags being butthurt

What?

>>146832634
>>146832678
I was going to ask the same thing

2.0 > 1.0 > 3.0

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>>146830661
>show my friend the rebuild movies
>loved the first one
>loved the second one even more
>warn him about the third one
>he says it's too great nothing can change his opinion
>watch it
>he doesn't like to watch anime with me anymore

>>146832723
>>146832678
Asukafags are so deep into the shipping game, that when they tried to get images of Reifags shipping they got pictures of themselves passive-aggressively criticizing it.

>>146832308
>Doesn't mean you didn't get BTFO and had to make up some irrational and illogical excuse as a response.
I made up an irrational response to something blowing me the fuck out when I hadn't posted yet? Not really sure how that works.

>3.33 sells Kaworu as a "looper" akin to Homura from Madoka, and overloads the movie with references to other tales involving starcrossed lovers. Then add in the insinuations from the previous movies, comments from Anno that they should consider NGE Kaworu as the same as Rebuild Kaworu, as well as comments from voice actors concerning the number of "cycles" Kaworu has gone through.
If this is your gripe it isn't unique to 3.0 since it deals with the overarching story of Rebuild which will almost certainly not end in a way they want. As I said before Anno is obviously very aware of how this fans perceive his work and uses that to put them in the mindset he wants.

>Providing fully detailed stories with proper conclusions serves against the purpose of pandering to otaku because it robs them the ability to stick to their own headcanon.
This sounds more like spite than anything. People always will fill in the gaps in stories and have their own interpretations of events. Trying to avoid it by going into obsessive levels of detail doesn't do anything but drag your story down in unneeded explanations.

>>146832634
No one would would think Rei would win when Shinji doesn't even like her romantically.

>>146832751
the only true answer

>>146832355
You can call me fat all you want, it's just a baseless projection and not part of the argument. I wouldn't have cared if you actually presented an argument but all you do are pity attempts at bringing down my person.

So are you going to attempt countering my argument or do I need to provide evidence of my BMI before you are capable of adult conversation?

>>146831726
Woah...

...really makes you think

>>146832937
Your noggin better be joggin if you're on the master's wild ride.

>>146832809
>fatso wants adult conversation
>didn't provide an argument
>couldn't even link to it

Just how ugly are you anon?

Haha retards you all fell right into Anno's plan, this is 9deep11u

>>146832790
>I made up an irrational response to something blowing me the fuck out when I hadn't posted yet? Not really sure how that works.
It works exactly like described.

You see something that blows you the fuck out, you can't handle it, and throw up in the form of the comment you made.

>If this is your gripe it isn't unique to 3.0 since it deals with the overarching story of Rebuild which will almost certainly not end in a way they want. As I said before Anno is obviously very aware of how this fans perceive his work and uses that to put them in the mindset he wants.

I'm sorry, but you're hypothesizing some future event to happen as a counter-argument and that doesn't work. Especially since it's been almost five years now of aggressive merchandising and pandering, so the fans have already gotten their fill and more to it.

The facts are that 3.33 gave them what they want in 2012, and nothing has changed since then. FYI it's soon 2017 and Rebuild began in 2007. You've been wrong for almost four years now, and every tick of the clock is another second you're wrong.

>This sounds more like spite than anything. People always will fill in the gaps in stories and have their own interpretations of events. Trying to avoid it by going into obsessive levels of detail doesn't do anything but drag your story down in unneeded explanations.

You're clearly exaggerating because you lack an argument. 3.33 is exceptionally vague, and simply adding some substance to it wouldn't suddenly make it obsessively detailed. 3.33 is a work designed for otaku to obsess over. A non-otaku simply does not have the time, nor the obseession required to delve into it, and if they forced themselves, they'd find nothing but well planned nonsense.

In conclusion, 3.33 is a deeply flawed and pandering work only an obsessive otaku would like. It's shallow by design and requires self-delusion to enjoy. Which is why you're struggling to cope with the facts, just like any junkie..

>>146833012
Still no argument and still just meaningless ad hominem.

Can you actually counter my argument now?

>>146833109
>fatso still pretending he has an argument

Waiting for pics to be honest.

>>146833145
Why are you so obsessed about one's weight? You don't fucking know me. It's just insecurity because you have no argument. Now counter my argument or don't bother posting.

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>>146833230
>>146833145

Holy shit, stop feeding each other.

Post pictures of Asuka.

>>146833230
>lardass still thinks he has an argument
Wow, how grand, and I'm not talking about your fat ass. I'm talking about how amusing it is that you think you have an argument when you haven't posted a single argument yet.

In fact, "prove me wrong" posts are so shitty they're bannable offenses.

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>>146833353

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>>146833403

>>146833466

>>146833097
>You see something that blows you the fuck out
I see. You're just misusing the term based on an understanding acquired from seeing bait posts.

>>146833097
>I'm sorry, but you're hypothesizing some future event to happen as a counter-argument and that doesn't work.
If we're going to go that route you're doing the exact same thing by using statements from the cast that haven't been confirmed as evidence.

>3.33 is exceptionally vague, and simply adding some substance to it wouldn't suddenly make it obsessively detailed.
If you had more information you wouldn't be able to understand Shinji's position as well since you've moved from following his POV to an omnipotent viewer. Anno absolutely could have shown us more perspectives but he didn't because it wouldn't have worked as well for the movie.

>It's shallow by design and requires self-delusion to enjoy.
I'm advocating taking the movie at face value. Getting dragged down in the fandom is what ruins the movie for people.

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Aesthetic ship/

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Rebuild 3 had the best Asuka suit.

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>>146833588

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>>146833633
>I can't afford her statue
PAIN

>>146833647
Damn I didn't have this one.

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>>146833647

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>>146833671

Which one are you trying to get?

I plan on buying 3 of the Sega statues. They are all around 20-30 dollars and look good considering the price.

>>146833568
>I see. You're just misusing the term based on an understanding acquired from seeing bait posts.

No, I used it completely correct, and the fact that you're still butthurt about it gives me nothing more than joy.

>If we're going to go that route you're doing the exact same thing by using statements from the cast that haven't been confirmed as evidence.
Except, those statements I've mentioned along with the elements in 3.33 are actually real, and exist in the past. Your fanwank however, does not. You do not have an argument.

>If you had more information you wouldn't be able to understand Shinji's position as well since you've moved from following his POV to an omnipotent viewer.
You already are the omnipotent viewer, who is given information Shinji isn't. There's many scenes in 3.33 still which doesn't include Shinji but explains things he does not know. You know more than Shinji, and that's a fact.

Your argument is gone.

>Anno absolutely could have shown us more perspectives but he didn't because it wouldn't have worked as well for the movie.
On that we agree, but for entirely different reasons. It wouldn't work because it wouldn't allow him to pander to otaku as effectively.


In conclusion, 3.33 is a deeply flawed and pandering work only an obsessive otaku would like. It's shallow by design and requires self-delusion to enjoy. Which is why you're struggling to cope with the facts, just like any junkie..

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>>146833647
>>146833687
I can't into runes, but I need to know what this is from.

>>146833364
And you still think I'm fat for some reason because you're so obsessed by the weight of the person you don't know.

>>146833353
Yeah stop discussing EVA and go back to posting the same pictures we've already seen. That sure sounds like a good time.

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>>146833743

>Yeah stop discussing EVA and go back to posting the same pictures we've already seen

>counter my argument
>s-stop calling me fat
>ad hominem

Not really discussing anything, fatty.

>>146833825
If it's so clear shouldn't you have provided evidence already?

>>146833858
you can samefag all you want

>>146833879
Last reply you're getting: You've yet to post a single argument. There's nothing to argue against, and you lose by default.

So fuck off fatty.

>>146831372
3.33 isnt pandering because it actually changes the plot significantly from the original series. That isn't pandering, its calling making it its own.

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>>146833723
This is my Asukollection.
Link to the statue I want inbound.

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>>146833980

Aren't you the dirty fuck who hot glued his Asuka figure?
Shame. On. You.

>>146833727
>No, I used it completely correct, and the fact that you're still butthurt about it gives me nothing more than joy.
Ok bud.

>Except, those statements I've mentioned along with the elements in 3.33 are actually real, and exist in the past.
Those statements haven't shown up in any tangible form in the movies. I don't know how you can say they're real when it's still completely unconfirmed.

>There's many scenes in 3.33 still which doesn't include Shinji but explains things he does not know.
I'd like you to point out what scenes these are. Shinji is always in or very close to the focus of the current scene minus a handful of brief cutaway shots that don't tell us any real information.

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>>146833729
EVANGELION Defenders mobage

>>146833956
Okay, please tell me whether or not I'm describing NGE's or 3.33's plot:

>Shinji feels alone
>He can't get to Asuka
>He can't reach out to Rei
>He's afraid of Misato
>He meets Kaworu
>They bond
>They descend into Terminal Dogma
>Kaworu dies, Shinji cries

This is why I don't take 3.33 supporters seriously, they are entirely incapable of understanding simple ideas like "plot", "story" and on a broader basis, "quality". What 3.33 did was to pick out NGE's plot and twist it into irredeemable pandering minted at the worst sort of otaku, the otaku who not only takes pleasure in shallow wish-fulfilment but also desires to destroy the enjoyment of others.

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>>146834044
NO DRUNKEN KINK SHAME THANK YOU VERY MUCH

>>146833723
Pic related

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>>146834118
Got more pics?

>>146834100
>Those statements haven't shown up in any tangible form in the movies. I don't know how you can say they're real when it's still completely unconfirmed.
They're real because they have been stated. If you went to watch 3.33 in the cinemas, or bought the BD you'd get pamphlets which contained the interviews. It's part of the package, literally.

Not only that, you're trying to weasel your way out by ignoring the elements in 3.33, which I also mentioned. Those are part of the movie even if you are to dishonestly dismiss proof.

>I'd like you to point out what scenes these are. Shinji is always in or very close to the focus of the current scene minus a handful of brief cutaway shots that don't tell us any real information.
>minus a handful of brief cutaway shots that don't tell us any real information.

I'm sorry anon, but downplaying the scenes which shows us what e.g WILLE thinks, characters think, what NERV and Gendo thinks and what they've been planning doesn't make them suddenly cease to exist. You're being shown things that Shinji isn't, and so your whole argument is null and void.

Deal with being wrong like an adult, please. You've been wrong about everything so far, and you need to take a break and accept that your initial argument really was nothing but butthurt nonsense.

>>146834044
kek

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>>146834263
Nope

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>>146834219

/c/ or /a/, you will be shamed. I cant believe you would even think, even while intoxicated, to hot glue Asuka.
That being said, that is a really cool Asuka figure.

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>>146834317
But I need 'em

>>146834335
The shame is real.
It hurts.

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>>146834353
Khara is stingy.

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>>146834335
Yeah, it's a neat figure. Rei's imagery and aesthetic is so good that even Asuka fans want a piece of it over Asuka's original style.

>>146834439

Nah.

Asuka > Rei

>>146834478
If that was true, Asuka fans wouldn't be as jealous of Rei as they were. Nor would they swallow neo-Asuka like they have.

>>146834275
>They're real because they have been stated. If you went to watch 3.33 in the cinemas, or bought the BD you'd get pamphlets which contained the interviews. It's part of the package, literally.
You obviously have a problem with understanding that supplementary information does not equal and in universe confirmation so I'm not going to argue about it anymore.

>I'm sorry anon, but downplaying the scenes which shows us what e.g WILLE thinks, characters think, what NERV and Gendo thinks and what they've been planning doesn't make them suddenly cease to exist. You're being shown things that Shinji isn't, and so your whole argument is null and void.
I'd like you to name those scenes. Shinji is present with WILLE when they're discussing him. The only time we see them without Shinji is the brief scene when they see Unit 13 is activated and several shots of the bridge during the final battle. One of the only things we know that Shinji doesn't is that Gendo kills SEELE. This is pretty much useless information without context and doesn't help to explain any of the events of the movie.

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>>146830661

>>146834395
Post the glue.

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Wait so why does anon think 3.33 is bad or good? It's pretty obvious from what Kaworu says that the rebuilds are sequels and not 'rebuilds'. I feel like all the things people are complaining about not being canon and messing with the feel of the show are actually very canon if you assume Anno is following the Re-Take style storyline. Instead of using the shadow angel as the reboot point, the entire universe restarts each time Shinji 'fails' and initiates the Third Impact. From there all of history in the NGE universe takes place and repeats over and over again. Shinji/Lilith literally become the beginning and end. The ending of EoE is one way Shinji could 'win' in his life, but the rebuilds are another manifestation of how things could have gone differently and the Third Impact avoided. Anno is trolling all the hatefags with Quantum Theory lmao.

Asuka is the canon romantic interest. Rei is the representation of a female maternal friendship or motherly love. Kaworu is paternal, male friendship and love. If you notice, Shinji tends to put these relationships on a pedestal, which is why Anno destroys them. Shinji is using those relationships, they are not healthy. I think people ship those relationships because they misunderstand the love being shown here, and self insert instead of trying to understand Shinji as a character. He has never had anyone show him love in a meaningful way before Misato, aside from the love given to him by his mother before being asborbed into Eva. Because of this, he has no idea who he is (which is why he just does what he's told), so when he feels love from anyone, no matter who, he is drawn to it like a starving animal.

Asuka is a mirror image of Shinji, she just deals with the same pain in a different way, hence why she's the love interest. Rebuild Asuka, I will guess is the one who will help Shinji find his balls. I'm unsure of who Mari is, and why Asuka's name has been changed, but I'm sure there is some significance.

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>>146834592

The first time I watched the third rebuild, I didn't even realize unit 2 turned panther mode.

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>>146834408
I would pay good weeb bucks to have this stuff localised

>>146834592
I like it.

>>146834676
I didn't even take a pic.
I panicked and cleaned her ASAP

>>146834720
>I like it
It would be pretty neat in Zoids.

>>146834516
>You obviously have a problem with understanding that supplementary information does not equal and in universe confirmation so I'm not going to argue about it anymore.

So this is the second post in a row where you're ignoring the fact that 3.33 has built in pandering elements, and you try to evade unskillfully by just focusing on one of the many pandering elements you get by watching 3.33.

You obviously have a problem with escaping your fantasy world.

>>146834516
>I'd like you to name those scenes.

-The entire first battle, Shinji is unconscious and not present visually either.
-Arguably the bits before Shinji even wakes up as well, where Sakura is speaking.
-When WILLE is attacked, Shinji is locked out. From thereon, Misato, Ritsuko etc.. takes over giving us information about their enemy, and shows us Asuka starting up the Wunder by sticking something into it
-When Shinji arrives at NERV, we get a scene with Fuyutsuki and Gendo planning forward. They explain that they are rewriting the SEELE scenario, and comments on Shinji and how Shinji might have interest in seeing how Gendo lives.
-Another scene with Fuyutsuki where he admits doing something mean/foul to Shinji
-Several scenes with Mari/Asuka that names the various elements in play, such as anti-at fields, vessels of adams, angels and more - info that Shinji doesn't have
-A near full debrief with Gendo/Fuyutsuki at the end

In other words, this is information that would have been crucial for Shinji to know, that we as the viewer are being let in on. That it's a setup in particular could have prevented the entire disaster at the end.

Either way, your conception of the viewer as not being more in the know in Shinji is categorically false, because the viewer already knows the franchise and thus knows basics Shinji yet doesn't.

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Rebuilds are unironically better than series and EoE because they are well animated and not boring

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>>146834896
Zoids were neat too. I wonder if Unit-09 can go beast.

>>146835116
You stop that.

>>146830661
Rebuild sucks in general

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>>146830661
No. 3.33 is nearly always considered the worst.

And since Anno recently came out and said he has made no plans at all for 4.44, it's clear that there was no plans for the rebuilds to begin with.

The whole thing is just a cashgrab.

>>146834679
>Wait so why does anon think 3.33 is bad or good? It's pretty obvious from what Kaworu says that the rebuilds are sequels and not 'rebuilds'.
Reason enough, retcons are bad. 3.33 is particularly a shitty one, and turning a good series into wish-fulfilment looping nonsense where nothing has consequence since it'll all start over is disgusting.

>Asuka is the canon romantic interest. Rei is the representation of a female maternal friendship or motherly love. Kaworu is paternal, male friendship and love
Opinion discarded, you're a otaku who's lost in his own delusions.

Asuka is just asuka, a pathetic child who never amounted to anything besides being a damsel in distress.
Rei is just Rei, an brainwashed god that eventually rebels and accomplishes self-realization and revent.
Kaworu is just Kaworu, a monster of the week that exemplified Shinji's desperation.

>>146834802
Pussy.

>>146835167
>The whole thing is just a cashgrab.
I'm down with that. I get my Eva fix either way.

>>146835157
I am serious lad

>>146835167
It's worse than a cashgrab. Rebuild 3.33 an expression of a manchild's butthurt, of pure jealousy and frustration that the real world doesn't agree with him.

The pandering to otaku coupled with attacking Rei's character makes it evident that Anno is enacting his childish revenge on the audience for liking Rei more than his favorite.

>>146835179
Try watching them again and using your brain weeb

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>>146835206
Cleaned up now anyway

>>146835268
Try not being butthurt for getting the red pill, dweebio. Had you used yours, you'd instantly connect the dots and realize that acknowledging a romantic interest as "canon" as if that were the point of the series is inherently self-contradicting to the idea of anti-escapism.

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>>146833633
The suit design was better.

Shame about the character, the setting and literally every aspect though.

>>146835206
If you like the movies to begin with, of course that doesn't change that.

It's more about delusional fags who say that it is all the world after EoE, and Anno is secretly planning a amazingly deep resolution. When there isn't one. He's just a hack. It's a depressing truth.

Pic related, some of the stuff which Anno put in to pretend he cared.

>>146835249
Yeah his thing with kaworu was frankly badly done. Like, I'm not even sure what he was attempting. Whatever it was, it was deeply meaningless.

>>146835386
Not a fan of the whole Sequel theory thing. It's just an interesting fan theory so far as I'm concerned.
It would be pretty funny if Anno actually did loosely tie it all together. The war would rage for eternity.

Is there anywhere I can get a script transcription for the rebuilds?

>>146835495
Yeah.

Although him basically saying, after working on Godzilla, that he was extremely close to just coming out and saying he was never going to do 4.44, and that he hadn't even begun pre-pre production on it, disproves it.

>>146835057
>The entire first battle, Shinji is unconscious and not present visually either.
Shinji is technically present and actually ends up saving
Asuka. We also don't get any information related to the plot from this beyond Shinji being imprisoned in space which he is later told about.

>When WILLE is attacked, Shinji is locked out.
Shinji is still on the lower deck and sees all the major elements of the battle after hearing what the situation is. All we see that he doesn't is dialog about the operation of the ship. Again no plot related information.

>They explain that they are rewriting the SEELE scenario, and comments on Shinji and how Shinji might have interest in seeing how Gendo lives.
This is one of the handful of scenes that gives the viewers hints Shinji doesn't have. It's plot related but also without context for the viewers.

>Several scenes with Mari/Asuka that names the various elements in play
The cuts to Mari during the final fight are also scenes that give the viewer small amounts of information although it's again without context making it minimally useful in explaining the plot.

>A near full debrief with Gendo/Fuyutsuki at the end
More cryptic suggestions that something is going on that we have no context for.

>Arguably the bits before Shinji even wakes up as well, where Sakura is speaking.
>Another scene with Fuyutsuki where he admits doing something mean/foul to Shinji
These two are basically irrelevant as far as information and could be omitted entirely.

All in all we have the viewers getting a combination of information that could be inferred if Shinji was smart (Gendo is scheming) and tidbits of information about events that had happened but we have no context to put them in. None of it creates a clear divide between Shinji and the viewer as far as information about the world goes.

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>>146835386
>Yeah his thing with kaworu was frankly badly done. Like, I'm not even sure what he was attempting. Whatever it was, it was deeply meaningless.

It was more or less perfect for the intention of pandering. It follows every rule, every book, open any book on otaku or simply observe them and you'll know exactly what I mean.

If you're too impatient, the basics are that an open-ended story invites otaku to self-insert and take posession of it, to endlessly fictionalize the story and use it as a form of escapism. So by making 3.33 shallow, empty and whatnot, it allows people to obsess over filling in the gaps. The fourteen yeas before, what happend in the meantime or off screen, and generally, what's going on. At no point does it deliver full, well-made characters.

What's worse is that it affects other characters - since 3.33 really aims to push kaworu and shinji as a pair, it has to destroy competing characters in the story like Rei. Which is why she's written out, spat on in the form of a powerpoint, and castrated in the form of making her Yui's clone.

So yeah, thanks a lot Kaworu fans. You may not care, but your obsession and approval of 3.33 more or less ruined a whole character. Ever think of how that would look like if we turned the tables? Don't even try to rationalize it. You know what you did.

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>>146834896

>>146835558
Not that I'm aware of.

>>146835570
True enough. But I'm a bit of a gormless chump. If he made 3.0 + 1.0 I would lap it up.

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>>146835655
ANIMAAAAAAAAAAAAA
Give me that canon cat loli

>>146832636
Asuka had better characterization than Kaworu ever had and I don't even like Asuka.

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>How to ruin a classic; an Anno story

>>146835752
I would say that every single character in Eva had better characterization then every single character in the rebuilds.

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>>146835655

>>146835641
>Shinji is technically present and actually ends up saving
Everyone is "technically present" since they exist at some point in the universe.

Point being, Shinji is not on-screen, nor is he conscious of anything that goes on.

>We also don't get any information related to the plot from this beyond Shinji being imprisoned in space
Sure we do, artificial angels, Asuka's state of mind, the defenses put in place to ensure he was there - all informationw e know but Shinji doesn't. At most he knows he was in space, but not of the effort required to get him down there. Which we know.

>Shinji is still on the lower deck and sees all the major elements
Nope, he's locked out. The fact that they are being assaulted, and the fact that Wunder needs to be activated IS part of the plot. Shinji is not present, the focus are on other characters.

>More cryptic suggestions that something is going on that we have no context for.
Bullshit, we are directly told that they had planned this down to a fine detail, even Misato's actions, we get to know that they were indeed planning on making EVA13 awaken.

>These two are basically irrelevant as far as information and could be omitted entirely.

Also bullshit, because we get hints that e.g Shinji isn't Shinji, and that his memories are a factor. If Shinji knew that Fuyutuski was fucking with him intentionally, then his reaction would likely to be different.


You acknowledge these:
>The cuts to Mari during the final fight are also scenes that give the viewer small amounts of information
>This is one of the handful of scenes that gives the viewers hints Shinji doesn't have. It's plot related but also without context for the viewers.

Which are enough to make you wrong anyway. You claimed that the viewer never knew things Shinji didn't, and these disprove it, as does all of the above.

That "maybe Shinji could have guessed it" is a nonargument (not even true by the way) because this is about what we the viewers are given.

>>146835752
If you're a fujoshit doing damage control, fuck off.

>>146835810
>literally who
FUCK YOU

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>>146835655
>>146835744
makes you think, right?

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>>146836108
Probably a lot of bleed between the two. For real though, I wouldn't be opposed to the Rei family Foursome ie - Quad entry plug system.
Anima is bonkers.

>>146835947
>Shinji is not on-screen, nor is he conscious of anything that goes on.
He is on screen and he's obviously conscious of the events going on around him to some degree because he saved Asuka. Either way it's irrelevant because there's nothing said about the plot that he isn't later told.

>Sure we do, artificial angels, Asuka's state of mind, the defenses put in place to ensure he was there
This is all discussed either while he's standing right there on the lower bridge with the crew or later in the interrogation room.

>Nope, he's locked out.
Only after Asuka leaves the ship and he sees her at which point the entire situation has been discussed.

>we get to know that they were indeed planning on making EVA13 awaken.
And we have no idea what that actually means. The only solid information we have on Unit 13 comes from Kaworu which is told to Shinji.

>If Shinji knew that Fuyutuski was fucking with him intentionally, then his reaction would likely to be different.
What? He was saying he was doing a cruel thing because he was telling him about Rei and Yui. That wasn't a scheme it was just a shitty thing for him to have to hear.

>You claimed that the viewer never knew things Shinji didn't
We don't know any of the things being referenced, we just hear them and can infer based on what we've seen of the series so far. It doesn't do anything to actually explain the plot in a concrete way.

>>146836299
Let's make this simple, you claimed that 3.33 always followed Shinji's POV. These many examples, every one of them are scenes in which we leave Shinij's PoV, and are told things that Shinji do not know.

That really is the end of the discussion right there, and downplaying the scenes just shows that you're desperate.

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>>146836277

>>146835744
>>146836277
Rei and Mari loli? Is there an Asuka too?

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>>146835179
Lol, you're objectively wrong doe.

Asuka, although appearing to be a bitch, is just like Shinji, and just wants people to like her. They both reason that EVA is the only reason they have value. Asuka becomes a slave to this value, which is why she goes coma mode when she can't pilot. Shinji chooses to not pilot, because he wants to see if anyone cares about HIM, not just the fact that he can fight. The answer is, they don't. You're only worth what you can offer others, a tough pill to swallow.

You're right about Rei, but only half right. She originally believes she is useful only because she can pilot Eva, but eventually realizes that it's really the relationships with people like Ikari that makes living worth it. She realizes this as she makes the ultimate sacrifice so that Shinji can have the possibility to be happy. Kaworu does EXACTLY THE SAME THING, choosing to let Shinji kill him instead of initiating the Third Impact himself.

Kaworu is the male God Adam, Rei is the female God Lilith. Shinji's relationship with them represents the dual nature of reality that man deals with at every level of existence. Shinji himself is the vessel the story uses to move within duality. Opposite of Rei/Kaworu is Yui/Gendo, the parents that chose their dreams over their son, or Anno's parents, or everyone's parents.

Asuka (to Shinji) is more female duality. He likes her but he cannot deal with the pressure she puts him under. It makes him feel less free, which scares him because he doesn't want responsibility, failure, and subsequent rejection. But he still wants to kiss her, the balancing act.

>cont

>>146830661
It was too gay IMO.

This is coming from a gayfag

>>146836384
Go ahead and quote the post where I said "3.33 always followed Shinji's POV" it's going to be hard.

And before you point to
>If you had more information you wouldn't be able to understand Shinji's position as well since you've moved from following his POV to an omnipotent viewer.
I'm going to preempt that by saying that statement in conditional on being shown information related to the plot.

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>>146836605
>> cont


Shinji is male duality to Asuka. Always comparing him to her ideal (Kaji), constantly belittling him so that he'll try harder, not realizing that he needs gentle love and not tough love, which is why he's drawn to motherly Rei. Her anger is a defense, to determine strength. When Shinji becomes stronger than her, it mindfucks her. She's become attracted to her competition, while at the same time making herself feel totally useless (which is where all the 'invincible Shinji' shit comes from).

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>>146836445
Evangelion Anima (3 years later)
Not really, just a picture of her younger that I cant find.
Also in anima, she gets contaminated by an unknown ancient life-form on the moon. shit's crazy

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>>146836753

I enjoyed the parts with Kaworu and the music (I'm a kaworufag).

Everything else...Yeah it was kind of a clusterfuck.

>>146836441
OH SHIT I FORGOT ABOUT THAT!

>>146836753
>>146836790
Life is good when you smoke a bowl of Evangelion.

>>146836635
That is what you're saying in your quote, whether you realize it or not. I'm sorry but this debate is lost for you.

We the viewers know more than Shinji, either by virtue of the movie telling us stuff he doesn't know or the audience knowing the franchise from before.

>>146836605
>Asuka, although appearing to be a bitch,
There is no "appearing", she is a bitch.

There is also a world of difference between Shinji and Asuka, since like you said, Shinji is not a slave to piloting the EVA. That they all have EVA-piloting in common is a given.

>You're right about Rei, but only half right. She originally believes she is useful only because she can pilot Eva,
Projecting, Rei never expresses this thought at all.

>She realizes this as she makes the ultimate sacrifice so that Shinji can have the possibility to be happy.
Rei doesn't express this either, she doesn't sacrifice herself for Shinji in NGE but for the more common greater good, which she mentions as part of her de facto motivation in an early episode.

>Kaworu does EXACTLY THE SAME THING, choosing to let Shinji kill him instead of initiating the Third Impact himself.
Which isn't the same thing because even if you were right about Rei, Shinji isn't killing Rei, the Angel is. Moreover, Kaworu is a canon idiot who has no idea what he's doing. He could just walk away.

All in all I fail to see the point you're making. I hardly say you're making one at all, in fact.

>>146830661
GAY
PIANO
DUETS

>>146836888
>We the viewers know more than Shinji, either by virtue of the movie telling us stuff he doesn't know or the audience knowing the franchise from before.
Knowing the franchise doesn't tell us anything. We can speculate or guess but we don't actually know.

Effectively all of the information related to the plot that we know comes from Kaworu telling Shinji about what was happening. Beyond that we effectively know nothing even with the small hints we're given that Shinji isn't.

>>146836869
You're not wrong

>>146836952
That was the best part.

The ending and roll to credits on 2.22 was incredibly emotional.

>>146837006
>Knowing the franchise doesn't tell us anything. We can speculate or guess but we don't actually know.

Which puts us a million steps ahead of Shinji. We're able to tell what is wrong and what is right merely by crossreferencing, and even if we're wrong we can suspect, again putting us ahead of Shinji's PoV. The viewer is observing the events from an outside perspective. You can say we follow Shinji for most of the movie, that would be true.

We've already disproven this:
>Effectively all of the information related to the plot that we know comes from Kaworu telling Shinji about what was happening.

In fact it's extremely self-contradictory of you to mention since Kaworu himself is not privvy to all the information, such as them being set up. In fact, regarding Kaworu, we are since the start of the film in a scene being let in on the fact that Kaworu has been waiting for Shinji, and even knows him. Shinji is never let in on this fact.

So can you be an adult now and accept that you're wrong? I get that you've built up massive pride around defending 3.33, but you've been running a fools errand. You have to understand that what I want, is for Evangelion to be as good as possible. I think it's possible that you may want that as well, although there are plenty that isn't.

The only way for Evangelion can be as good as it deserves to be, is if all characters, storylines are given as much respect and honest development as possible. A movie like 3.33 which aims to destroy characters and openly cater to otaku by reducing the characters to walking glorifications or hateful travesties like Rei Q, is not going to do that.

It's not how NGE did it either.

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>shipfags, butthurt Reifags, blogging, elipses, capslock abusing newfags, animaposting and retarded faggots being retarded faggots
156 posts and we've already hit a plethora of shit. I really wish all this gaiafag esque refuse and obvious crossboarder newfags would all just drop dead.

>>146837235
>Which puts us a million steps ahead of Shinji.
No it puts us exactly where Shinji is. We don't know what the real intent for Unit 13 was, we don't know when the lances were switched, we don't know how an angel got into Central Dogma. You acting like hints to future and past events explain any of the reasons the events in the movie were happening when in reality they don't.

>A movie like 3.33 which aims to destroy characters and openly cater to otaku by reducing the characters to walking glorifications or hateful travesties like Rei Q, is not going to do that.
As always Reifags live in their own little world.

>>146837475
>No it puts us exactly where Shinji is.
This is wrong, because Shinji does not suspect something is wrong as early as the viewer does either.

I can do this all day and still prove you wrong at every turn, because I intend to do nothing but speak the truth and to arrive at factual conclusions. You're merely spinning up fiction to protect 3.33.

You think I don't notice how you ignore arguments or move goalposts, but I do. Someone like Shinji isn't even aware that there's a plot brewing against him, or even the names of the plot elements in 3.33, but we the viewer do, as we're constantly let in on private moments behind the character that not only name these elements and explain their function or dangers, but also hint that they are plotting against Shinji or each other. Something Shinji doesn't know or suspect.

Moreover, you also let out that we, the viewers, know that Kaworu is from the get go aware of who Shinji is and has been waiting for him. Shinji in this movie is entirely unaware of all these things, but we aren't.

Reifags aren't living in their own little world, you are. A world in which you can spin any lie, any fantasy and think we don't see right through you. My best defense and offense is the truth, and that's why you are one hundred percent in a defensive position despite starting the entire debate yourself.

>>146836939
Lmao, dude they're the same. That's why at the end of EoE it's only Shinji and Asuka. Asuka PRIDES herself on being the Eva pilot, Shinji RESENTS it. It's because they both think they are only valued for piloting. Shinji is a slave as well, he never leaves, and if he does the world ending will be on his shoulders, and he can't bear that guilt or HE WOULD HAVE LEFT.

DUDE WTF ARE YOU EBIN. REMEMBER THE SCENE WHEN SHINJI GOES

"Hey Rei, Y U Pilot Dis?!"

And she's like

"It's a bond with everyone"

What she's saying here, is that she has relationships because of Eva, and those relationships are valuable to her. She's the third option, unlike Shinji or Asuka who give their power to Eva, Rei just sees it for what it is. She has a much smaller Ego if you will. Stop saying I'm projecting when you can't back it up. You're projecting.

Rei is quoted as saying she'll fight so he doesn't have to. She's referring to Shinji dude... At first she just thinks she's piloting for all humanity but she really doesn't give a shit ("if I die I can be replaced"), and it's really for Gendo once the Unit 00 tests go haywire (Because of Rei's extremely disturbed subconscious) and he shows her compassion. This shifts to Shinji after he opens her entry plug and burns his hands as well. Rei didn't need to die, she could have ejected. Instead she chooses to die so that someone else can live.

Your arguement about Kaworu doesn't make sense.

I think you're just butthurt that you don't understand Eva breh. Kaworu was sent by SEELE, and is an undying being who transcends the potential time loops. He had been programmed since 'birth' to carry out his mission, but chose not to just because he met Shinji and saw that Yui had planned around SEELE's project.

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>>146836843

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>>146835655
Wolfpac is massive

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>>146836843

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well now

>>146837761
>Lmao, dude they're the same. That's why at the end of EoE it's only Shinji and Asuka. Asuka PRIDES herself on being the Eva pilot, Shinji RESENTS it.

"Lmao" do you not see the glaring contradiction here?

>Stop saying I'm projecting when you can't back it up. You're projecting.
But you are. That Rei says she has value "just because of EVA" isn't right at all, when we clearly see Rei find value in questioning herself and others, beginning with Gendo. It's obvious that Rei knows piloting the EVA is important, but if there was no EVA, even in episode one, it wouldn't bother Rei at all. The EVA is a tool to Rei, nothing more.

Anyway, I get the misconception:
>Rei is quoted as saying she'll fight so he doesn't have to. She's referring to Shinji dude..

That was from Rebuild, not NGE. Rebuild rewrote the characters a lot. They're no longer incompatible with their older selves.

>At first she just thinks she's piloting for all humanity but she really doesn't give a shit ("if I die I can be replaced"),
That's not her "not giving a shit" about humanity, it's her realizing the facts - that she can and will be replaced should she die. It's a mercilessly pragmatic point of view, it's not untrue but I'll be damned if it isn't depressing.

>This shifts to Shinji after he opens her entry plug and burns his hands as well. Rei didn't need to die, she could have ejected. Instead she chooses to die so that someone else can live.
This is always the case with Rei - even before Shinji burns his hands, where Rei says "goodbye" as if it's the last time they meet before Ramiel.

It's your argument that doesn't make sense. You're mixing Rebuild with NGE, and in the original there were no time loops or anything with Kaworu looping. There is no information about Kaworu being programmed since birth either, that is not present in the series or even Rebuild.

The facts are that Kaworu is a highly powerful but unintelligent Angel. That's why he makes all the mistakes.

The first is a visually spectacular remake of the first few episodes of the anime that only suffers from trimming down the screentime of secondary characters.

The second is visually spectacular horseshit with poor writing and that panders almost as hard as fucking Anima does at times while completely missing what makes the series interesting.

The third has very poor direction and questionable overuse of CGI along with an incredibly poorly paced story filled with characters acting unreasonable more out of plot contrivance rather than due to their personal issues, but it's far more true to the core of the series than the second was and is less of a pandering mess if only because only one fanbase gets shipper fuel given to them.


1 >>> poop > 3 >>>>>> 2

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>>146837761

Also forgot to mention in EoE when Rei rejects Gendo, she says "Ikari is calling me"; THIS IS THE MOMENT OF HER SELF ACTUALIZATION. All the bullying by Asuka of being a doll combined with having a pleasant relationship with Shinji pushes her to FINALLY DO WHAT SHE WANTS, BECOME ONE WITH IKARI. Yui predicted all of this somehow, she's the real MVP.

Asuka is the catalyst that pushes Rei to become herself and Shinji to become himself. Ironically Asuka learns the secret of the Super-Ego, gets over her mother, and gets her mojo back just in time to let circumstance defeat her, poop. It's all just lessons for the characters leading up to instrumentality. It was meant to happen that way, as only after Asuka is defeated does Eva 01 break the Bakelite which allows Shinji to pilot. The metaphor for him was, sometimes right before you win you get stuck, and there's nothing you can do, but something unexpected can happen and move obstacles so don't give up.

Rei actualizes as Lilith, but Shinji rejects her (on both levels), and instead chooses to exist in the world that was defined by ASUKA'S CRITISISM. Asuka's character becomes a slave to the story here, she represents the hard truths that we must meet and exceed as humans over and over again.

>>146838190
Poor logic. The first and second can't be construed as pandering like the third, because they still function on their own as stories, they have merit in their substance. This is why even non-otaku can derive joy, entertainment and get some food for thought out of the first two, but the third they dismiss due to it's impenetrable layer of pandering. It is something for "eva-cultists, acolytes and hardcore fans only".

Moreover, it's obviously more than one fanbase that gets their fill from 3.33. Any fanbase which can derive pleasure from empty projectable characters will love 3.33, and that is more than the obvious Kaworu fanbase. In specific, Asuka fans also fall into this category, being one of the largest producers of fanfiction (ss in japan), despite not being fans of the most popular character.

I don't see how your argumentation towards 2.22 holds up, any way you look at it it's just a baseless insult.

>>146838424
2.0 doesn't deserve more than an insult.

If you don't already see think it's utter trash and an insult to what the original series stood for in a way that even 3.0 couldn't manage to match for all its awfulness then I ain't arsed discussing the series with you since we're very clearly never going to see eye to eye.

I was just throwing in my 2c before skimming the thread and leaving anyway tbqh

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>>146832762
Am I doing this right?

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>>146838583
Well, if you can't argue for it, then it's safe to say that you're irrationally upset it for a reason so shameful you're not willing to divulge it. You're clearly an upset Asukatard angry about minute stuff in a movie.

>>146835370
You just need to watch it a few more times

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>>146834148

Fun game.

Now, tell me if I'm describing NGE's or 3.33's plot.

>Shinji does stuff

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>>146838326
Rei's questions herself far before Asuka calls Rei is a doll, and Asuka represents escapism itself, and the dangers of it.

If you were to ignore 99% of the story and insert fanfiction, what you wrote may be true. But I prefer sticking to 100% of the story, so let's see how that pans out:

Rei's development away from Gendo has been taking place all the time, especially since episode six or arguably, earlier encounters with Shinji. Rei demonstrates that she's aware that Gendo doesn't favor her as much as one would think, claiming that she's not her favorite at all. This is something Rei can say without thinking, as she's known it all along. Rei's character is further defined by an intrinsic knack for introspection, which is why Rei demonstrates the capabilty for abstract thinking in early episodes where they gaze over the city, or when Rei has a long monologue questioning her own existence.

Relating to others like Shinji speeds this along, and it's here we see that Rei now starts to accept that she's been truly grateful to Gendo at all.

So when Rei rejects Gendo, it is in no part due to Asuka who is merely insulting Rei, who right in hand denies her insults as they come. She knows the real situation, she doesn't. Asuka's understanding of Rei is first and foremost based on her own insecurity. She wants to attack Rei to feel superior, and as Asuka's backstory reveals, it's her that has fears of being a doll. Rei is a realist and knows she isn't one. Asuka doesn't understand that Rei is a clone that can be revived, and therefore doesn't understand why Rei undervalues herself.

This brings us to Asuka herself, who has since birth been brainwashed to believe she's an elite pilot. Asuka can no longer separate reality from fiction. She will always try to cling to her fantasy of being #1, and that delusion brings her down.

On the other hand, Rei is the one that supplies truth, which is why Asuka attacked Rei in the elevator - she couldn't handle it.

>>146838817
See how I had several points outlining the general plot in a chronological order, whereas you just posted two words?

So yeah, there's no need to take 3.33 supporters seriously. They are hopeless otaku who can't be reached with facts, they are overtly invested into a fantasy.

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>>146838160
It isn't a contradiction. They both believe Eva is the only thing that gives them value. They just deal with it differently. Asuka takes control of it and Shinji rejects the control. You are failing to see that the power they give EVA (or anything) over their identity is what the series is about!

That quote isn't from Rebuild. It's from the Zeruel fight with the N2 bomb I believe, or the Angel that appears as a string of light that infects Unit 00.

Rei is clearly depressed, which is why she acts the way she does and Anno is literally here trolling pragmatists. Rei as a character goes from no nonsense pragmatist to choosing emotions over programming (in EOE). She's also on antidepressants (the pills), and combined with the fact her subconcious is proven fucked up by the Unit 00 testing (till she meets Shinji) it's obvious that she is a person that is extremely out of touch with her actual emotions through abuse and being kept at arms length by everyone including Gendo since birth. Her disregard for her own life is a symptom that she is searching for a reason to live, and is finding refuge in the service of others for now. Eventually she chooses Shinji.

As for Kaworu - I'll concede you're right we have basically no info on him, however it's assumable that he knows more than us, so who knows. it can be assumed he has knowledge of the timeline, from how he speaks in rebuild. However, watch His episodes after watching rebuild, it's arguable he speaks like he knows more than he's letting on.

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>>146838987
>>146838326
I can keep adding to this, because it really is without question that Asuka represents escapism and the dangers of it.

Like earlier mentioned, when Rei confronts Asuka in the elevator, what Rei did was tell Asuka the truth - that the EVA's did have souls, and that it's she who needs to open her heart. Asuka doesn't like to hear that, because she projects herself onto the EVA and sees it as a doll, if it were to have a soul it'd ruin her. The fact that Rei is lecturing her from a superior position is also something Asuka can't deal with.

This isn't the first time this happens either. Rei is first and foremost, a realist. When they are to train against the angels using the twister-like setup, Asuka blames her own failures of cooperating on everyone else - that it's not her fault, but everyone elses. She is retreating into her fantasy of being the best, when she is in reality failing. This is when Rei Ayanami shows up, and shows Asuka how it's done, without any delusions, but straight hard work. Asuka runs away, her delusion being shattered.

In a similar fashion, when they are alone and the power has gone out, Asuka again fashions herself the leader, despite not knowing anything. Here Rei emerges as the natural leader, by virtue of skill and knowledge - something Asuka resents. She will even follow Rei's advice as long as she gets to be the leader she's been brainwashed into thinking she is.

Rei also confronts Asuka after Leliel swallows Shinji, giving her the real reason she pilots - only to get praise and recognition.

Asuka's delusions lead to her downfall, as is the fate of any otaku who chose Asuka, and thus delude themselves. What Arael does is show Asuka the truth - she couldn't handle it. What Armisael does is show Rei the truth, and she handled it with acceptance.

This is why Rei makes progress in real life, whilst Asuka is only salvageable through instrumentality. Rei's truth is what sets them all free.

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ITT: Autists overanalyze a hack's rip-off of Gundam, Ideon and Devilman

>>>/evageeks/ is that way

>>146838067
>>146838106
Those two at least are leftovers from the show itself. Magorox appeared in production material and FAR were first described as a civilization of Earth destroyed by Eva.

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I want to talk if you're here.

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>>146839442
>pictures of random characters side by side, without any context

good point, anon, I never thought about it that way.

>>146839134
> Asuka takes control of it and Shinji rejects the control.
No, not quite. Shinji is perfectly fine accepting that he can live without EVA, and on his own terms. Asuka never reaches that conclusion on screen.

You're overgeneralizing their situation - they're all EVA-pilots, and that is a role that intrinsically have power over them.

>That quote isn't from Rebuild.
It is from Rebuild. Rei doesn't say that in either episode 19, or 23.

>Rei as a character goes from no nonsense pragmatist to choosing emotions over programming (in EOE).

It's Rei's emotions that form the basis for her loyalty, or as you might have meant it, her programming. So that can't possibly be right. Rei does feel appreciated by Gendo and seeks to repay the favor, and she does realizes that is all she has. Emotions make part of her basis for her decisions since the beginning.

>She's also on antidepressants (the pills),
we don't actually know what the pills do. This is you making stuff up.

>and combined with the fact her subconcious is proven fucked up by the Unit 00 testing (till she meets Shinji) it's obvious that she is a person that is extremely out of touch with her actual emotions through abuse and being kept at arms length by everyone including Gendo since birth.

I don't disagree here, but:
>Her disregard for her own life is a symptom that she is searching for a reason to live, and is finding refuge in the service of others for now. Eventually she chooses Shinji.

Isn't quite right. Rei's disregard for her own life comes from a horrible trauma: that she's been proven to be replaceable. There is no bigger horror than to be trapped in the belly of a machine which can kill you the second you step out of line. This happened once, and Rei knows she can be replaced. She chooses to use this for good - Shinji can't be revived, but she can. Thus it's only logical that she should die in his place, she can come back. Depressing, but pragmatic.

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>>146839591
Is there more of this set?

>>146837955
What the fuck...
Legit?

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>>146838987

See this is where you're wrong. Rei as a character changes over the course of the story, because the point of the entire story is to have Rei programmed to choose Gendo, and instead choose Shinji based on her own experiences knowedge of things and how she felt about them. Anno is a feminist.

Asuka isn't right about a lot, but she isn't wrong about Rei. Rei is acting like a doll and has been for her entire life. Two realized this but didn't think she cared, until adult started to attack her for it. That's why in the original elevator scene, Asuka slaps Rei and Rei takes it all, but in the rebuild where Rei has more of an identity, she stops Asuka's slap and gives her a small piece of her mind. Adults gains some insight and Rei is pushed towards actualizatio, they are complimentary.

>>146839536
Fuck off.

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>>146839442
Demonstrably wrong.

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>>146839618
>posts Mari

Even if I had more I wouldn't give them to you now.

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>>146839766
Be nice to soft pink.

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>>146839921
And to think I was considering being nice and giving it to you anyway.

And I recognize you. I've talked to you before. No one likes Mari.

>>146840000
Literally the Jar Jar Binks of Evangelion.

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>>146839618

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>>146840000
I like her.
Good numbers though.

>>146840097
Thanks anon.

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>>146840153

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>>146839675
No anon, the "point" emerges from the character, not vice versa. A character isn't like something because it's the point - a character makes a point by being something.

I don't disagree that Rei ends up favoring Shinji over Gendo, that is what happened. However:

>Asuka isn't right about a lot, but she isn't wrong about Rei. Rei is acting like a doll and has been for her entire life.

Au contraire! She is exceptionally wrong in fact - because Rei has demonstrated the will to accept negative things about herself, and to question her own existence. That isn't acting like a doll, that is proving that you aren't, no matter how low in life Rei might be from being abused mentally and physically by NERV.

That Rei can accept knowledge contradicting her own programming once she uncovers it, shows that Rei has none of the workings of a puppet beneath her pale skin. If Rei was somehow unable to accept these things, and didn't reflect on her own position, you may have had a point. But Rei does just that, and more than any other character.

This brings us to Asuka, who can't do that even when prompted. She is programmed to be an EVA-pilot, and she says she will rather die than cease being one. Cutting her from piloting the EVA is the same as cutting her strings, she can no longer move - like picture related.

Rei was attempted turned into a puppet, but Rei's inner self remained pure and whole - it couldn't be remodeled. This is why Rei prevails in her fight against the patriarch, while Asuka is at all levels subject to the male in Evangelion.

>>146840174
Cute as fuck. Appreciate it friendo.

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>>146840259
Okiee buds.

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>>146839617

So instead arguing you point by point I'm just gonna focus on how everything you've extrapolated from a single point has caused you to make incorrect assumptions.

Shinji cannot live without Eva. He is told to leave if he doesn't not want to pilot. He doesn't leave, he almost does. This is supposed to be allegorical to deciding to kill yourself. You either want to live, or you want to die. If you want to live, you better start fighting because if you don't, you're gonna die. It's that way for Shinji, it's that way for all of us. Half the series is people being like 'if you don't really want to be here please get the fuck out of here'. If he left, it's suicide, because he knows Rei and Asuka can't do it all. He doesn't want to have to fight to live, he just wants things to be easy, just like any of us. But we all have to fight, and do things we don't want to do. Anno makes Shinji's thing piloting a giant robot, so that all the otaku's he's secretly making fun of are all like "wtf if that was me I'd get in the robot", when they are refusing to metaphorically get the the robot in their own lives.

He stays because he wants to live. Asuka undergoes the same self pity when her sync ratio sucks and she becomes apathetic. She is escaping as you say, by keeping everyone around her at arms length and avoiding painful truths. But that all comes crashing down during EoE when she screams "I DONT WANT TO DIE MAMA", discovers the secret of the AT FIELD, and fully self actualizes. She finally faces her fears and actualizes. It's the same reason Shinji wants to pilot, to protect himself and those he holds dear, same as Rei too. She fails at destroying the Eva series due to circumstances beyond her control, which serves as a way for the universe to hold Shinji responsible.

>>146830661
You have to prove yourself right first.

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>>146840431
You argue that Shinji cannot live without piloting, but he has been doing just that for almost his entire life. He hasn't been piloting it for more than a couple of months, and he's 14 years old.

Not only that, in this time he actually has left his post. When he for instance leaves in episode 19, it is only by mere chance that he is convinced to return. He had at that point, given up on piloting it and taken a decision to distance himself. It was only when he saw that by leaving he was leaving others to die that guilt and fear got the best of him. The situation didn't allow for him to leave, he didn't return because he was emotionally dependent on it for praise or recognition, or value. At this point, Shinji saw the value in protecting others.

Since we compared with Asuka, then this is something Asuka never does. Not even once. Rei does it, but not Asuka - Asuka would gladly die and let others die in the process to keep her dependency on the EVA. Picture related - Asuka has no regard for human life, only her status.Rei and Shinji however, have both shown that they would rather die than let others die in their place, or because of them.

>She fails at destroying the Eva series due to circumstances beyond her control, which serves as a way for the universe to hold Shinji responsible.

Not true at all, that is something an Asuka fan or Asuka would say, to blame Shinji for Asuka's failure. Asuka's failures in NGE is her own. It is Asuka's fault that she couldn't aspire to be more like Rei and Shinji, to find value in herself and others. It's Asuka's fault that she didn't listen to the advice she was given by Rei, and it's Asuka's fault that she couldn't cooperate well with either Rei or Shinji.

It's Asuka's fault for escaping into a fantasy world, not the world for being what it is - reality. To show that escaping reality is not the answer, Asuka was humiliated and eventually murdered doing what she imagined herself as, "an EVA pilot".

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>>146840431

Also, getting back to Asuka/Rei. The reason Asuka thinks she's a doll is because when Asuka tries to befriend her, she says she'll do it if she's ordered to. She does this type of stuff throughout the series.

You want Rei to be a sociopath, when she's in fact just a hyper autist (from neglect/abuse) that has a heart of gold. That's why her and Shinji get along so well (and the whole clone thing)

>>146840875
That's not the real reason. Asuka has a documented nature of projecting her own problems onto others. She is taking any excuse whatsoever to lash out at Rei to hide her own flaws.

In her youth, we had the doll incident. We also had family members calling Asuka a doll, because her life is in fact orchestrated by NERV. Not only that, in the Arael flashback, we see the fears of Asuka: "I'm not a doll!". She knows what she is, but can't accept it, which is why it hurts her.

She even calls her own EVA a doll, and refuses to heed Rei's words of wisdom.

Rei saying that she'd die if ordered to isn't untrue, but it's easy to misunderstand. We the viewers know better, but Asuka doesn't, and this is Asuka's chance to get back at Rei for being better than her. For lecturing her, for being the favorite.

This is also why Asuka fans in real life so often use the d-word, because like Asuka, they want to get back at Rei for being better than Asuka. They want to sully Rei's good image because she's the favorite of others. They hate that Rei is the "First".

Rei fans and Rei can only take the slap, even if they take no pleasure in it.

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>>146840802
Lmao for all your talk of escaping into fantasy and projecting...

It isn't chance that he returns, it isn't chance that he chooses to stay, it's a decision. Based on understanding that if he doesn't he knows everything will end. He's saying one thing and doing another, you have to focus on his actions. He chose to stay, he chose to give his own life and the lives of others value. To say it's a 'situation' is an incomplete understanding of freedom. He could have left at any time. He said he didn't care, and didn't want to, but he never left either. He just procrastinated until the last minute where he'd swoop in and try to save the day when he realized no one else could. He's being a lazy, childish, brat.

You're point is proving me right about Asuka. She started to treat everyone like crap, started to think she really was better than everyone as a reaction to pain, and her Eva stopped working for her. Only when she broke free from her trauma and exclaimed "IIIIIIII WANT TO LIVE", proclaiming her first, undiluted by others, truth does she regain her power.

As for the Eva series stop trolling lol, who knew the weapons would turn to lances, or that the Eva series could regenerate. And to be honest, I still worked out for her in the end.

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>>146841317
>even responding to textwall-kun who has been proven to samefag
It even uses the same rhetoric and trashed arguments time and again. Stop wasting your time with that inbred autist. Given enough time, it'll kill itself.

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>>146841421
Leave them alone, I want to see how long they go back and forth even though I can't really be bothered to read these books they are posting.

>>146841317
>It isn't chance that he returns, it isn't chance that he chooses to stay, it's a decision.

A decision that could only happen by chance. Shinji had already taken on a passive role, sitting in a shelter. Miraculously, his shelter is destroyed without killing him, and the chaos of the situation allows Shinji to return. Shinji HAD left, but the Eva-world haunts him and brings him back.

The point is that Shinji isn't dependent on EVA-piloting like Asuka. Rather, the Eva is dependent on him. Everyone depends on Shinji in some way, but Shinji was willing to walk away from that. Asuka could never do that, and that makes your point moot.

>You're point is proving me right about Asuka. She started to treat everyone like crap, started to think she really was better than everyone as a reaction to pain, and her Eva stopped working for her. Only when she broke free from her trauma and exclaimed "IIIIIIII WANT TO LIVE", proclaiming her first, undiluted by others, truth does she regain her power.
>As for the Eva series stop trolling lol, who knew the weapons would turn to lances, or that the Eva series could regenerate. And to be honest, I still worked out for her in the end.

You haven't understood the tragedy yet. Her power to do what? Serve her last, dying breath as a puppet of NERV? All that was, was reactivating her strings.

That they had lances or regenerating bodies doesn't matter. It's always against these odds, and it's not the first time Asuka loses a fight. In fact, she constantly loses without Shinji's help, and owes her life to him. She is soundly defeated in NGE, and in EoE she was brought out just to make it happen all over again.

If you seriously thought Evangelion, a character-heavy series would "fix" a character like Goku goes SSJ, you are very wrong.

Asuka is escapism incarnate, and the wrong way to go. In the series, her piloting the EVA led to her defeat, and so it happens again in EoE.

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God bless official art books.
This is clearly a loli butt

>>146841047

You're failing to see that they trigger one another's insecurities as a means to drive their character development. Rei is having an existential crisis at the beginning of the series. Pretty much everyone is, but I digress. Rei is aware that she is being used, and in exploring life outside of Gendo's plan (where she is a doll), is where she finds happiness. It begins the process in which she questions herself, if she is a doll, and finally realizes that she is not and chooses to become.

Asuka is triggered by Rei's inability to be affected by her. Rei disrupts Asuka's image of herself because she isn't interested in her. It obviously triggers the mother issues, as does Shinji getting closer to Rei than Asuka, and various other small things. She ends up alone, and useless and finally looks at herself, and decides she wants to live. It's all the same lessons, but they look individual pre instrumentality. Asuka's new found understanding of where her mother's soul resides is indicative of a changed opinion of people, it is no longer Unit 02, it is Mama. Shinji, Asuka, and Rei all go through similiar self actualization.

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>>146841701
Who's that cutie?

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I forget sometimes that Jar Jar and Poochie mean Mari when NGE already had a character with no background or arc, who the plot was rewritten to accommodate, was given part of another character's role to give them something to do, and merchandise pretended was important.

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>>146830954
>EVA is in essence just a harem wish fulfilment show

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>>146841828
Mikasa Ackerman, duh.
It's the Mini Tokyo artbook.

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>>146841833
Kaworu was like a million times better than Mari, still. I'd honestly rather have beers with him than that stupid smug bitch.

>>146831372
>most pandering

I don't understand why people say this about 3.33 when 2.22 is Pandering : the movie with Shinji going full Reifag mode and Asuka being the ultimate tsundere

>>146841421
You're so tsundere. These argument can't be trashed, they're merely retellings - accurate ones at that.

>>146841743
>Rei is aware that she is being used, and in exploring life outside of Gendo's plan (where she is a doll), is where she finds happiness. It begins the process in which she questions herself, if she is a doll, and finally realizes that she is not and chooses to become.

The problem becomes in establishing as a fact, that Rei was a doll. With the original series, that can't actually be done. The only place for it is from Asuka's statements, which we all agree is her projecting. Maybe Rei feels and acts like a "doll" because she's quiet, but we all know that basing it on that would be merely judging the dog by it's tail.

>Asuka is triggered by Rei's inability to be affected by her. Rei disrupts Asuka's image of herself because she isn't interested in her.

Not only that, Rei is reputed to be "The First", the "honor student" and the "favorite", as is all names Asuka uses for Rei. She sees Rei as an alleged superior she needs to defeat, something Asuka never does. Rei in her innocence and honesty, doesn't care about such stuff - only pointing out that she's not actually anyone's favorite.

>Asuka's new found understanding of where her mother's soul resides is indicative of a changed opinion of people, it is no longer Unit 02, it is Mama. Shinji, Asuka, and Rei all go through similiar self actualization.
They don't. Nor is this any deep change in Asuka, it's merely placating her for a small moment, to give her a carrot to fall back into her old junkie habits, the piloting of the EVA.

Let's be straight here. NGE drops any pretense of developing Asuka's character by the end of the series. It doesn't actually make the character change or develop like Shinji or Rei does, even Misato. It gives up on Asuka and simply provides those quick morale boosts, which is removed as quick as it came.

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>>146841883
Fucking
PURE

>>146841908
I only hate Mari because she's absolutely unnecessary plotwise, but she seems like she'd be fun to hang out with.

>>146841628

So why didn't he just run to another shelter? The point of the crashing into the shelter, is that if you want to die it's not gonna be peaceful. Life is gonna come crashing through your roof if you ignore it. His safe space is gone and he's again faced with "fight or die". Being haunted doesn't matter, he still chooses to return even though he knows he'll experience pain. If Shinji really had the control as you say, he'd leave, because he wouldn't care if he died. The thing is, he does, and he cares about the people around him, and he can't help it. His attempt at running is really just an attempt to see if someone else can do it, because he would rather not. Essentially he's being a child.

Lmao, apparently you don't understand the tragedy of Asuka. It's a tragedy because she rises and struggles and falls and ends the series in the grips of depression and Alone, and when she finally breaks free and becomes herself and almost saves the entire world (which wouldn't work, because then Shinji can't face the music), she loses in a manner out of her or anyone's control, because Shinji couldn't even get to unit 01.

>>146841927
Pandering is more than just showing specific character traits. Consider how a "brave" person can also be a well developed and realistic character. What 1.11 and 2.22 achieves is make their main characters realistic, it has concrete value in it's development and characterization. If it did not, if we were merely served images of Shinji going full reifagmode or tsundere Asuka, we would have had pandering indeed.

But it was developed, well-reasoned, and acceptable.Ironically, it is otaku and otaku ONLY who take issue with 2.22, because they are e.g shippers who fear the implications of Shinji getting close to Rei. That is that age-old Asuka ugliness showing itself.

3.33 can be said to be pandering, because it merely presents desirable images and outcomes without any development or realism to it. 3.33 is the equivalent of being handed a prize for doing nothing, it's the equivalent of sucking up to someone with lies and exaggerated flattery - it's pandering to that person, and just like that, 3.33 is pandering to various types of otaku.

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>>146842119
Have you seen that smug bitch? Fucking crashlands onto Shinji and starts sniffing him like a dog and then just leaves for a whole movie. She literally spends the final battle eating potato chips in the Eva cockpit.

I hope she's a secret angel too and Shinji crushes her.

>>146842141
>But it was developed, well-reasoned, and acceptable

Opinion

>it is otaku and otaku ONLY who take issue with 2.22

And here it is

Asuka is barely in 3.33 so I don't get why people say that either, and sorry but Shinji and the whole story feels much closer to NGE than the shitfest that was 2.22

>>146842126
>So why didn't he just run to another shelter?
The question is easy to answer, and that is because Shinji understands, both through observing his comrades seemingly dying on the battlefield, that other people do need him. So he doesn't return because he needs the EVA to feel validated, but because he is being guilted into piloting. He doesn't like piloting the EVA, nor does he get much praise for it, and the only person he wanted praise from (Gendo) he has rejected.

At any rate, he is not dependent on the EVA like Asuka is.

>Lmao, apparently you don't understand the tragedy of Asuka. It's a tragedy because she rises and struggles and falls and ends the series in the grips of depression and Alone, and when she finally breaks free and becomes herself and almost saves the entire world (which wouldn't work, because then Shinji can't face the music), she loses in a manner out of her or anyone's control, because Shinji couldn't even get to unit 01.

Which is entirely untrue. What you said is a censored version of the truth, a delusion you've created to soften the blow of reality, that Asuka is indeed a failure. Because it's not out of Asuka's control. She had the entire series to improve on herself, and failed. Rei succeeded, and Shinji made some progress, but Asuka only regressed - why? Because she lost herself in escapism. Shinji came to accept parts of himself, and Rei did that also.

If Asuka had chosen reality of fantasy, she would not even have been in that position. If Asuka had grown up and not been a symbol of escapism, she would have retained her ability to pilot, and thus might have been able to save Rei, just like Rei saves Asuka in the previous episode. With more pilots, with Shinji not unstable for losign his friends, they could have stayed together.

Asuka's weakness and escapism brought the entire group down. It's not because the fight was "unfair", they were always against dangerous enemies.

>>146842012

You don't get it. Rei is questioning "who am I" when the series begins. She has no context. Asuka puts her in a context for the first time. She refuses this context, and that becomes the basis of refuses Gendo's context, and finding her own perspective by choosing Shinji.

Refusing Asuka's context gives her the battleground to test her new identity before she reveals it to Gendo

>>146842261
>Opinion
It's not an opinion. We can show, for each change various scenes that make a foundation for it. We can objectively show the time in minutes and hours the time 2.22 spends on developing it's characters, by featuring it. We cannot do so for 3.33, which starts by obfuscating the characters, giving them minimal screentime and then ultimately not developing them.

>Asuka is barely in 3.33 so I don't get why people say that either, and sorry but Shinji and the whole story feels much closer to NGE than the shitfest that was 2.22

Yes you do, because for the average Asuka fan, their fandom consists purely of shipping. Seeing 2.22 made you feel threatened, despite that 2.22 vastly portrays Asuka as nicer. The otaku like Asuka fans don't require a good character to be satisfied, they require room for fanfiction. This is what 3.33 gives them.

>>146842368
>You don't get it. Rei is questioning "who am I" when the series begins. She has no context.
Why do you think she has no context? The fact that Rei asks those questions and answers them before Asuka says anything about her being a doll (which is like, episode 22 or something) just shows that you're wrong.

Rei never needed to refuse any context, because Rei never believed she was part of that context to begin with, and had by virtue of being introspective already proved that.

Rei is the truth Asuka is unable to deal with, this is why Rei is the one who explains to Asuka the truth, not vice versa. Rei sits on the knowledge, the ability to understand that Asuka doesn't have. Rei's progress forward is not to listen to Asuka's insults, but to accept that there is value in relationships.

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>>146842200
>Illegally comes into Japan thanks to IPEA
>Gets a false identity and presumably attends a school
>Reveals to the awkward boy that she likes LCL and by extension is actually an Eva pilot, has a secret call in front of him and then uses his awkwardness to conceal it.
>She infiltrates NERV and with help from the IPEA swaps out Unit-02's core and fucking steals it.
>Get's Shinji to get back in the fight
>Forces Unit-02 to go Pseudo Beast
>Is generally hot as fuck
MARI IS COOL and she's going to be super important. Just you wait and see.
I have nothing to back up this claim.

>>146842438
>This is what 3.33 gives them.

But HOW ? We almost don't see her.

>We cannot do so for 3.33, which starts by obfuscating the characters, giving them minimal screentime and then ultimately not developing them.

Except for Shinj and Kaworu that we see for the major part of the movie playing piano before shit hits the fan

>>146841908
Karl is the only version worth anything and he's only better than Mari by like 1.3 times. And he's the most Poochie, he directly complains about not being the focus and people not liking him.

>>146842261
It's true though. Normies love 2.22, and they literally have no reason to dislike it on any reasons of "pandering" because it's not something they're even aware of. They see a perfectly reasonable story involving characters from the sequel, set in touching scenarios. 2.22 builds on top of 1.11 and creates a world they can understand and even like.


3.33 does the exact opposite, in providing no context but only pure finished product. It's not something they can truly comment on besides as a series of moving pictures with music. In fact, they're very unlikely to put up with the bullshit 3.33 deserves, they simply don't have time nor the wish to engage in insane theorycrafting or fanfiction to fill in the gaps.


There's a reason why 3.33's defenders claimed 3.33 was only half a movie, because it really has no content or substance to offer. It was natural for people to think a new one would arrive, the other half - despite the fact that 3.33 is a full length movie.

>>146842356

No, he piloted because he realized he didn't want his friends to die. Not because he felt guilty of his friends died, they are two different things. He is dependent on EVA, it's the only thing that gives his life relevance besides cello.

Let me tell you about Asuka and people like her. They are ignorant of what they need to do in order to become happy. Just because you can see it, doesn't mean they do. How they act doesn't matter, but how you treat them reflects everything about you.

Anon-kun, your cognitive dissonance is strong, as is your will. I hope that one day you use the desire for truth to see past your AT field. You remind me of a certain fiery redhead I knew once

Sincerly, Rei

>>146842717
I love the fact that when people talk about the rebuilds, they talk more about the supposed views of the public and the fact they're otakus or normies, more than the movies themselves.

>>146842683
>But HOW ? We almost don't see her.
What you see of Asuka is the pandering. The millions of new cute outfits, the extremely powered up ability set from NGE, this is all pandering. It caters to the exact type of fan that couldn't accept NGE's Asuka and substituted her with fanfiction.

3.33 has made Asuka an extremely irrational tsundere that for some reason, even this is highly realistic for a normal person, to have an attachment to a boy she met for a few weeks ago. It's not just about having the attachment, but it is also about the fact that it's the movie's only focus, rather than Asuka's life, thoughts or opinions. There isn't a character here besides an Asuka that wants to have some sort of archetypical relation with Shinji.

>Except for Shinj and Kaworu that we see for the major part of the movie playing piano before shit hits the fan
Yes, these are two characters out of a dozen. Even then, Kaworu has less lines, less development and less diversity in opinion than he had in a single episode of NGE. 24 has him doing more than just being Shinji's extradimensional stalker.

Even the piano scene is an actual montage. They are skipping the hard part of showing the effort of self-improvement, and even here Shinji becomes unrealistic by learning how to play piano in what seems like no time. For free!

This is because focus is taken away from character, and onto pandering to the otaku.

>>146842823
>No, he piloted because he realized he didn't want his friends to die. Not because he felt guilty of his friends died, they are two different things. He is dependent on EVA, it's the only thing that gives his life relevance besides cello.

Now you're simply saying the same thing without realizing it. If he lets his friends die, he will feel guilt. Kaji's speech is more or less guilting him into action, saying that Kaji does whatever he can do, "but what about YOU Shinji?".

>Let me tell you about Asuka and people like her.
Let's not project what you think of other people onto a fictional character. NGE is the canon, and that's that, and your rejection of it and how you now run away from the harsh truth of Asuka's failures and Rei's success, is precisely the Asuka archetype.

Only by confronting the truth, even if it hurts you, can you gain understanding and improve yourself. This is what Rei Ayanami does throughout the series, while Asuka is punished for not doing it.

>>146842897
>3.33 has made Asuka an extremely irrational tsundere that for some reason

You mean 2.22 ? I can literally take all of what you said and revert it to 2.22. It's crazy how it almost seem that we saw two different movies

>>146842823
That's because you're deflecting, my post also contains commentary on 3.33.

>>146830661
3.33 is the only rebuild that's objectively bad. 1.11 and 2.22 were good. 2.22 especially. I don't know why autists want the rebuilds to be exactly like the original series, we already have that and it's perfectly fine.

>>146843109
>they see
>they
>they don't have time
>they, they, they

Yeah sure

>>146843054
>NGE is the canon, and that's that, and your rejection of it and how you now run away from the harsh truth of Asuka's failures and Rei's success, is precisely the Asuka archetype
>Rei's success

Rei's success to do what exactly ? And what failures about Asuka ?

>>146843056
You actually can't. You want to tell yourself that "noo, 2.22 is the bad one", but logic and facts tell you otherwise. It's true that 2.22 was set up to cater to Asuka fans, and it had much success in doing so, as Shikinami is more popular than NGE - something only true for Asuka by the way. But it didn't cater to Asuka fans in a way that wouldn't leave it impossible to further develop Asuka's character into something better.

But 3.33, in creating such a large cleft and essentially redefining Asuka's character to have no development but plenty of action pandering scenes and shipping implications, absolutely trashed that possibility of a good character.

The truth is that the only people who hated 2.22 were indeed Asukafags who ship, because Shinji saving Rei made them insecure.

>>146839668
Legit.

>>146843216
>The truth is that the only people who hated 2.22 were indeed Asukafags who ship, because Shinji saving Rei made them insecure

And people seeing the movie as completely off in atmosphere, and characters behaving completely different or reduced to the archetypes we now so well, and that is the case for both Rei and Asuka, and Shinji for getting full shonen mode

>>146841861
If it was wrong don't you think more people would've pointed it out? I think that's enough proof that it is in fact the truth.

>>146843171
Rei's success in understanding others, herself, and eventually saving not only herself, but also others. Rei manages to triumph where Asuka fails.

Where Asuka becomes a damsel in distress to be saved by Rei while fighting Arael, Rei overpowers Armisael and saves not just Shinji and Asuka, but also all of mankind.

Asuka only deteriorates because she is NERV's doll and plaything, a pathetic creature that cannot live or even move without serving NERV as their pilot. Once Asuka is refused piloting, she attempts suicide and goes catatonic. Only by putting her into an EVA again, and thus restoring the relationship of master/slave between Asuka and NERV, does she move.

Rei ends up only improving because she is capable of accepting reality for what it is. From accepting that she's replaceable and not going insane from despair to understanding herself and others, Rei only got more and more stable. Even after Rei dies, she is refocused with greater intent to overthrow Gendo, now that he didn't even show up at the hospital, but Shinji did. She now fully acknowledges Gendo as an oppressor, and by the end of the series successfully foils his agenda, and liberates herself.

Rei's liberation also ends up saving Asuka, who had died.

>>146843329
Sick.
Added to the library.

>>146843385
Or people were wiser than me and ignored your bullshit

>>146843421
If anything I've said is 'bullshit' feel free to back up your claim with proof.

>>146843363
>and people seeing the movie as completely off in atmosphere

Which are no one but the otaku, and the Asuka fans who routinely lie to themselves as they try to come up with reasons to hate it.

2.22 continues where 1.11 left off, and in the series this marked the start of the most juvenile, carefree and downright cliche moments of Evangelion - there's everything from dancing to defeat Angels to jumping into magma, sexualized teenagers galore and fanservice hot spring scenes.

2.22 retains this quality, but actually becomes more serious in developing it's characters, while also adopting a darker tone. More people's lives are threatened and main characters are put in serious danger, not the case in NGE's equivalent continuation of episode 6 where all danger was dramatic tension that often only lasted mere seconds.

>>146843516
>Which are no one but the otaku, and the Asuka fans who routinely lie to themselves as they try to come up with reasons to hate it

Can you please shut up about this "argument" ? You made nothing but repeat this since we started talking. Everyone who complains is nothing but a mad asuka fag for you, because how could it be any different right ?

Jeez

>2.22 retains this quality, but actually becomes more serious in developing it's characters, while also adopting a darker tone
>darker tone

Are you serious right now ? The movie felt like a drag with no fucking tension whatsoever, save for the end with Rei

>>146843054
Lmao you're officially dumb.

They are not the same, they just appear to be. One is future tense, one is past tense. They're entirely different, and the thought patterns surrounding them are different. I'm not gonna get into explaining this, it's self evident if you think a little bit. With Kaji's speech you half prove me right again. Shinji is beginning to understand the power he wields and why he should wield it. And then he makes his choice.

And for your Asuka segment, all the characters improve. If you were truly right, Asuka wouldn't have been able to pilot 02 in EOE. The lesson in her tragedy was that sometimes things are out of your control.

LOL YOU ARE THE MANIFESTATION OF REIFAGS THAT HATE ASUKA CAUSE THE ONLY GIRL THAT LOVED THEM WAS THEIR MOMMY.

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Butthurt Reifags will never stop being hilarious.

>>146843638
>Can you please shut up about this "argument" ? You made nothing but repeat this since we started talking. Everyone who complains is nothing but a mad asuka fag for you, because how could it be any different right ?

That's how it is, I'm afraid. When you, the Asuka fan cannot provide reason for your opinions or claims, it becomes clear that you don't actually have one. It would be in your best interest to show us the proof for your claims, but there never is any. There are only delusions, fueled by an intense insecurity.

Just the other day, we had an Asuka fan raging about how Rebuild 2.22 dared to include a "breast comparison scene", to which the proof he had for that scene existing was a collage he had made. He claimed that the scene existed purely to showcase the difference in the character's breasts, and that this was in fact low-brow entertainment. He also seemed mad that Rei was bustier than Asuka, but that's another story.

So what was the problem with that critique? The problem was that the scene never juxtaposed the two characters, in fact, they are the furthest away from each other. It shows clips in a sequence, which flash by too fast for anyone to size up the character's breasts, and when they're several flashes apart, any comparison is directly impossible.

So in other words, the otaku of an Asuka fan had immersed himself into it, mined it for data and rearranged it, and then convinced himself that the scene's intention was to communicate to the viewer, the difference in breast size. He had rewritten his own memory to believe that they showed it side by side, in a panning shot. Similarly, the same type of Asuka otaku also believe there was some sort of cooking contest involved.

>Are you serious right now ? The movie felt like a drag with no fucking tension whatsoever, save for the end with Rei

Sure it did. Just like it did all of all those other bad things you can't quantify. The sooner you realize your lying to yourself, the better.

>>146844038

Ok.

Just gonna say this.

Asuka is canon.

Rei is motherly love.

Stay mad forever

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>>146844131
>Rei is motherly love.

>>146844131
That is what you keep telling yourself, this interpretation of yours is necessary to defend your own escapism, your shipping. But in the progress, you're shitting on the characters you pretend to love. You are, as otaku critics woudl put it, essentially raping the story and taking possession of it, and then forcing your rape-child onto others.

That is why there are disagreements, because you cannot accept NGE for what it is on a fundamental level. For you, your own interpretation takes precedence over the canonical work itself.

>>146843421
still waiting

>>146844038
And now I'm relegated to the low category of the Asukafags.

You're the fucking worst, your stance is nothing but a paranoid terminal case where anyone who dares to like 3.33 and dislike 2.22 is nothing but an Asukafag. You've been doing nothing else but talking about how Asukafags said that or did that while sucking your own dick.

I'm not an Asukafag, I'm not a Reifag. Now take your head out of your ass and try to imagine that people can dislike 2.22 wihout being stupid butthurt waifufags

Jesus fucking christ

>>146843925
>I'm not gonna get into explaining this,
This being the recurring problem that always shuts down your arguments, you want to have your cake without paying for it, or even asking nicely for a slice. You have to understand that understanding and good argumention doesn't start with the conclusion, it ends up in a conclusion.

We've made it sufficiently clear by now that because Asuka is dependent on the EVA to even remain a functional human being, Shinji is not as dependent on the EVA because he can, and have left the idea behind. Asuka is incapable of considering that, Rei doesn't care about the EVA as anything but a means to an end. If she doesn't have it, she can still go on, and so can Shinji. They have understood that piloting EVA isn't necessary for their own happiness.

>And for your Asuka segment, all the characters improve. If you were truly right, Asuka wouldn't have been able to pilot 02 in EOE. The lesson in her tragedy was that sometimes things are out of your control.

Like I said earlier, it wasn't actually out of their control. Asuka could in the series have stopped being a bitch, she could have made that decision by accepting the hard truths, just like Rei did. But Asuka was too weak, and so she chose to fail. Everyone knows it, that when you refuse to work on yourself or make the effort, that you are choosing to fail. Asuka is a failure of her own choice.

The only reason she is able to pilot for a short five minutes or so, is because the EVA reaches out to her. Again, all this proves is that Asuka, unlike Shinji and Rei, is incapable of self-improvement outside the EVA.

>>146844236
And keep waiting, retard

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>>146844359
Asuka's not a bitch though, she's a lovely free spirit.

>>146844230

Take everything you just said and apply it to yourself. I am not a shipper. Asuka is canon, you're literally just too autistic to see she likes him in the context of her character. And Shinji likes her back, there's an overwhelming amount of facts that prove this; as well as the fact that all the characters cannot have healthy relations due to the same traumas that play off one another in the series. But that's also why ITS MOTHER FUCKING ASUKA AND SHINJI AT THE END OF EOE LITERALLY SIGNIFYING ADAM AND EVE HOLY SMOKES.

I can see now you're just trolling lmao you can't be this retarded

>>146844448
Finally someone sane in this thread, jesus

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>>146844332
Everyone has their right to dislike something, or like it. I'm not trying to make you like 2.22 or hate 3.33.

I've only shown you that your alleged reasons for disliking it and criticisms don't add up. Your criticisms are based on fallacies, on lies, untruths or otherwise misrepresentations of the truth. Now, I've never seen anyone else but Asuka fans do it, and what I'm doing is only piecing together a motive.

I and you, have to do this because you're unable to provide reasoning, which leaves us with only you and your dearly held opinion. So when you say "2.22 only panders and 3.33 doesn't", that is something you're saying because that's how you want it to be, not because it actually is that way. It's classic otaku delusion, found precisely in Asuka fans since they for very shallow otaku reasons, were threatened by 2.22.

Head over to evageeks, Asukafag country, and see for yourself.

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>>146844448
heh. Haven't heard someone say Holy smokes in a long while.

Quite the bodacious expression, you son of a gun.

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>>146844556
Ah shoot, wrong one. The thumbnails look the same, I should really use names for things.

>>146844359

You're just capitalizing on the fact I said that. I'm getting tired of explaining things to you. I have explained everything up until that point, don't try to manipulate anon I see right through you :).

Anon you sound like a very bitter person. She didn't fail, she didn't see the same things you saw. If she could, she would have changed. Just because you see something doesn't mean that person does, and if they didn't, how can they be held accountable for failing? She saw her route as the only route, you don't understand.

Your soul is showing through your posts. I hope you forgive yourself and the others you project upon. And your mother, who you most likely resent.

>>146844515
> It's classic otaku delusion

The level of irony pains me to an uncomfortable degree

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>>146844632
>Your soul is showing through your posts

MFW when it turns out 4chan is human instrumentality and all the AT fields are disappearing.

>>146844448
>>146844499
Cry me a river.

Your entire fandom or adoration for Evangelion is based on shipping, rather than the qualities of the characters themselves. This is why bringing up the canonical traits and facts of the original then becomes cognitive dissonance for you, just like it does for Asuka. You need the two to be an item, so you will recolor the entire series just for that purpose.

The truth is simple and elegant:

Asuka spends her entire life escaping reality by engrossing herself in the fantasy that she's the most elite pilot that will ever be. For this, she is punished, her escapism was her downfall.
Rei spends her lfie trying to challenge reality by taking it apart and understanding it, Rei is willing to accept the truth and use it for her own gains even if it hurts her. She is rewarded with godhood and liberation.

Because Asuka cannot save herself, it lies upon others around Asuka to save her. People who care, people who have overcome their own issues to some degree. This is Misato, who safeguards Asuka in NGE and EoE, and it is Rei who saves Asuka multiple times and even in the end, provides a means for her resurrection from death.
>>146844432
Heh, that's a new one. She's just a good ol' B. She's not even free, she's a slave to her NERV masters.

>>146844646

It doesn't pain me at all the irony is makin my night.

O
I
M
LAFFIN

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I LOVE ASUKA.

>>146844730
>Your entire fandom or adoration for Evangelion is based on shipping, rather than the qualities of the characters themselves
>projecting this hard

Go back to masturbate to your Rei doujins, anon

>>146830661

What's amazing to me is that this is the 3rd time the Evangelion story has been told and it's been controversial and provocative every time. Usual sequels and remakes are just forgettable shit. These movies are definitely not forgettable.

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>>146844632
>You're just capitalizing on the fact I said that.
Why wouldn't I? Even if you hadn't said it, there's still the fact that in your previous posts, you haven't done as much explaining as you think. It also takes more than explanation to give your theory validity beyond being an Asuka fan's delusion, it takes argument.

It's simple, for your theory and interpretation to ring true, you actually DO need to disprove parts of the canon, which both of us know you can't. Therefore, you must discard your interpretation no matter how much you hold it dear. You can't reason with hypotheticals like:

>She didn't fail, she didn't see the same things you saw. If she could, she would have changed
The canon is that she did fail where Rei succeeded. She didn't change, and couldn't have changed - she is what she is in the canon. Not in your fanfiction. Rei provides the example of someone who accepts the truth and doles out truth, representing dealing with reality no matter how harsh. Asuka represents the negative consequences of otaku escapism, because she lives in her own fantasy world and refuses to give up on it, until reality catches up with her and she crumbles.

So I'm not the least bitter, but I imagine you must be. Your fandom, a lie, exposed.... just like that. No excuses like "but she COULD have changed" will ever work. You're attempting to hold Asuka responsible for successes, but not her failures?

It's time to accept that the canon disagrees with you. Your romantic conception of Asuka isn't real.

>>146844897
So, how am I projecting for denying shipping, while you are claiming the point of Evangelion is to create an Adam and Eve? The original series ended with no such point, and EoE is a fantastic movie that doesn't deign itself to satisfy the perversions of the likes of you.

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Rei is obviously the best pilot I don't know why they didn't just clone her three times instead of the farce that was trying to make Shinji and Asuka compatible.

Of course, reitards confuse pilot ability with quality as an individual. All they can ever say is hurr durr, she's the best pilot and also a god, that makes her better.

Who even wants to date a god? Being able to cook is a better trait.

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>that glorious feel when Rei is canonically superior to Asuka in every way

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>>146845034
Okiee buds. Sure you are.

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So are we posting Rei now?

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>>146845063

>>146844991
I was not this anon, but denying the Adam and Eve metaphor when the series is full of christian symbolism is kinda funny. Also you claim to deny shipping, but we both know full well that you're a hard battled Reifag who cannot understand that people can think differently

>>146845015
>Rei is obviously the best pilot
>when the story explicitly tells and works as a story precisely because it's not the case

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>>146845015
>Of course, reitards confuse pilot ability with quality as an individual. All they can ever say is hurr durr, she's the best pilot and also a god, that makes her better.

No we don't. That'd be Asuka fans, who have for years claimed Asuka as a "the best eva pilot" despite how she fucks up and literally RUINS everything for everyone, including herself. Being the best eva pilot, which I won't even call Rei, has nothing to do with quality as an individual.

Rei is a better individual because she's more of a realist, she's reflected and doesn't take out her hatred on others like Asuka does. Rei may be screwed up, but there is so much hope in Rei's eyes, hope that Asuka can't ever hope to match.
It's these traits that make Rei a competent pilot, because she's able to focus and make the right calls, which is far more important than having the newest Evangelion model.

Rei's competence as a pilot emerges from the strength of her character in the same way Asuka is an inept pilot due to the weaknesses of hers.

>>146845125
What.

>>146831372
>a story that could be understood by all
Rebuilds were made for people who DIDN'T understand, at least at first.

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>>146845126
It's funny that people try to push "Adam and Eve" despite the fact that we already have an actual Adam in the anime. That spot is sort of taken.

I understand that people think differently but I also grasp for what reasons they do. Look at the reason you gave me, it's obviously not because you took from the series that they were Adam and Eve, as Adam is already named and shown. It's because Adam and Eve is a couple, and you want to project this psychological schematic onto Asuka and Shinji, since you ship.

In this delusional otaku sense, a scene in which Shinji tries to choke Asuka to death, to which Asuka responds that Shinji is disgusting, is somehow a declaration of love.

>>146845160
She gets a lot of extra points for not moping around like a whiny bitch like the other two. If I were assembling an army, I'd say, yeah, I'm going to want more reliable Rei's than those wildcards.

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>>146845125
Wait..

anno should have made Shinji age during the time skip while everybody else stayed the same
then we could have gotten a decent ending with misatoxShinji

>textwall-kun hasn't been doxxed yet and shot in the back of the head

>>146845295
Oh sure, Rei wins alot of points for being shotblocked by Zeruel.

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>>146845189
Just like End of Evangelion.

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>>146845189
The only motivation Anno has is to pander to Kaworu fans and Asuka fans, and woe to anyone else.

>>146845295
>>146845015
Which is a great point.

Between 3x Rei's and 3x Asuka's, 3x Rei's is the way to go. Even if we gave Rei a shittier mech.
Asukas would menstruate on each other while Rei would be like having a mini borg collective.

>>146845285
>Story has an actual Adam
>so you can't have a new one

Notice the world "new". Also have you ever heard about the term "cycle" ?

>>146845410
Yeah, that is pretty much what it means man. No new Adam, the spot is taken.