I didn't have this image saved. Thanks, senpai
If you only watched the anime you could almost believe that it was based on a good visual novel. It's like someone sat him down and explained that he actually had to write solutions for all the lock door mysteries so he decided to give up.
I really have to read Umineko again. I think I'll start whenever I finish rereading Higurashi
It's too bad that DEEN fucked everything up
The anime is garbage. There actually are solutions to all the closed room mysteries. The answers aren't directly given in the VN but if you go back and look at all the closed rooms with the canonical theory the answers become obvious.
I want to have sex with all of the Erikas!
No he just doesn't straight up give the answers to the solutions in the VN and wrote the culprit reveal in a way that literal retards like you wouldn't be able to figure it out.
I still don't understand how no one realized that Yasu was Shannon and Kanon all along
>wanting to fuck a piece of candy
lmaoing at your life
What's so fuckable about this?
The fact that she'll probably do lewd things to me after wrapping me up with duct tape. She is a pervert after all
>First time listening to Joanna Newsom - Ys
>Get to the Sawdust & Diamonds
>She starts yelling OH DESIRE
>Fucking burst out laughing
This phrase is burnt into my mind forever, thanks Goldsmith.
I've thought about this a lot, and at first I thought the same thing, but after thinking about it there weren't many opportunities for people to notice. Who would have found out? The only people that really could've noticed were Krauss, Natsuhi, Gohda, and Jessica. All the servants besides Gohda already knew. It's almost certain that besides on the October 4th conference Shannon and Kanon didn't have matching work days, so Natsuhi and Krauss not noticing isnt too much of a surprise. Even if they had a slight suspicion, what would they have said about it? "Hey, I noticed you and this other servant of a different gender have a pretty similar face, even though I haven't seen you side by side. Are you by chance the same person?" It's unlikely that the people who live off the island would notice because, as I said, they'd have differing work days. The one person that probably should have noticed is Jessica, it is a bit baffling she didn't. She lived on the island in the first place and its a bit weird she wouldn't notice her best friend and her crush have the same face. Still, it's not like she'd call them out for it. If you knew two people who looked similar, would you seriously suspect they were the same person? It's just too ridiculous to assume without doubting yourself.
I know they had different voice actors in the novel and the anime, but it'd be ridiculous to not notice that they both had similar voices, faces, and possibly body type (if you discount Shannon's massive tits), no?
Yasu was probably changing his voice for his different personalities. See pic, he accidentally dropped his Beatrice voice because he was nervous. Yeah the voices would still be similar, but once again its not like they had them side by side to compare.
Do I have to say read the manga every time?
Eh, I guess. I still find it a little hard to believe, not necessarily impossible though
I still need to read it. I'll start after I finish Oriental Sacred Place
>no Black Battler
it's never revealed what his/her sex is, breasts not growing is no proof, lion being male is no proof cause he looks nothing like yasu, and looking at how much they were cat boxing at the second half no wonder yasu's sex is kept ambiguous
It's never outright stated sure, but there are a lot of hints that lead to the conclusion of Yasu being male and not many to the conclusion of them being female.
In the confession there are lots of instances where they use the term "boyish" and things to that effect, like pic related. I should also add that Kanon was made by Yasu to exemplify all of his traits that he perceived as negative. Kanon is a boy because Yasu dislikes the reality that he is male. Zepar and Furfur are opposing genders to represent Yasu's gender identity issues, which wouldn't even exist if he was female. He was raised as female even though he was male, leading to him being confused about his gender. Obviously his mutilated/missing dick didnt help either though.
It just seems to me that since there a plenty of hints to Yasu being male and not as many to him being female, you might as well assume he's male. I do get what you're saying about the cat box ambiguity though, it doesn't really matter in the end what gender Yasu is. That's just why I say he and not she/they.
I forgot to mention yeah Lion being male isn't confirmation that Yasu is male, but since the only difference between Lion and Yasu is Natsuhi's acceptance theres no reason they'd be a different gender.
Read my two posts above yours and tell me why. liking or disliking traps has nothing to do with this. I'm reaching the conclusion of Yasu being male based on the hints and leads presented.
did nanjo, genji or kumasawa even tell yasu what sex he/she had originally if not then yasu himself/herself think that he/she has boyish body because of flat chest but no proof whatsoever if he/she is a male for a fact
What's wrong with Bern?
>mfw you cant appreciate sadistic characters
Eva is still the best Beatrice
Nu uh, fampai. My taste is the greatest. I'm the greatest
Fragments are just figures of imagination within the world of Umineko. It isn't Higurashi. There is only one truth of the incident hidden in the catbox. Rion is just Yasu's wish for a better life that she was denied by Natsuhi.
One of those posts was a response to someone who claimed that Lion and Yasu's gender should be the same. Saying that with infinite possibilities that Yasu could be either gender. Lion is a representation of Yasu's ideal self. What would have happened to him if he had been accepted and hadn't lost his ability to love and were allowed to live as a human. Fragments that speculate what he would be like as a woman would be speculating about a different person altogether. The whole point of Beatrice's catbox is that there are endless possibilities within the set rules. It was Bern who took it a step further and imagined a world where Lion wasn't ruined.
How about you two fuck off instead.
Shes not flat, see evidence. Pardon the youtube toolbar.
MetaBeato is female but is still Yasu in every other way. It's only an illusion that allows her to maintain her femininity as seen in episode 3 where she is surprised to see she is still female after revealing the truth. Yasu doesn't see herself that way she just wishes for it.
Yeah but the scene is too long. The tracks are all by the same artist if I remember correctly and by the time the scene is over I didn't feel attached to the music the same way. Music was still strong overall in 5.
Well it's been awhile so I don't feel too strongly about it but that's how I felt on my first read at least with regards to the impression the music left. Honestly if you think that scene wasn't too long then it's easy to rank 5 right up with 3 in just about every way, is it your favorite?
It was long yeah but I enjoyed the entire scene, one of my favorite parts in the VN.
They weren't all by the same artist. As for the ones that play first in the court of illutions:
Girls Witch Hunt was by -45
Smile-less Soiree was by Luck Ganriki
Kuina was by -45
Patchwork Chimera was by -45
Resurrected Replayer was by ZTS
Final Answer was by Dai
Discolor was by ZTS
Promise was by Dai
Tomorrow was by Dai
So yeah lots by the same people but those 3 guys are pretty much the best composers on the whole OST so not too surprising.
I was thinking mostly about only the first half of what you said. Thinking back on it the scene must be even longer than I remember but the music is definitely good. The -45 songs were just going back and forth in the first part of the trial too often if I remember correctly.
>Yasu doesn't see herself that way she just wishes for it.
But Beatrice, the persona of Yasu, sees herself as female. Yasu doesn't see herself as female. Yasu wish she was Beatrice, who sees herself as female. The distinction is subtle, but important.
Being a wishful thinking does not prevent Beatrice from existing in the meta-world, and meta-Beatrice is, for all intent and purpose, her own character with her own needs.
At the very least Yasu definitely did at one point want to be blond with big boobs to fit Battler's ideal woman. Obviously that got complicated down the line but its not too much of a stretch to say that Yasu desired to look like Beatrice.
Personas aren't personalities. They're just fronts or masks that Yasu uses to play out how she wants to live/thinks she should live or how she thinks a witch would act. The Beatrice we see in meta scenes is an act Yasu puts on. That was a big point in episode 6. I'm going to sleep right this moment so I don't have the time to defend my point thoroughly but you can tell from the way Meta-Beato acts that she is just a 'persona' for Yasu in the same way Shannon and Kanon are. The way the VN is written you never get to see what Yasu is like and feels really underneath all the lies (barring Claire in 7 and some other small scenes) but the manga makes it clear.
Post underrated ost
Agreed so hard on F Style, that song sounds so mysterious. It evokes an emotion from me I can't quite describe.
I completely forgot about the first two. They're pretty good.
It's one of my favorites, although I prefer the EP7 version. It's not mentioned much in these threads, but I wouldn't say it's underrated. Same with Ridicule.
I feel like I should be rereading Umineko. I was hugely into it when it was coming out. A lot of threads have been recommending the manga, and I'm considering it, but I'm not sure I would ever want to read a version without music.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZd41NMBM4s is really nostalgic somehow
Ah, melting away, thanks, I was looking for this one.
Also, I know The great detective knows is supposed to be Erika's theme, but I can't help but think about her when I hear Resurrected replayer. It fits her character so much.
Ep 5 overall has the best songs, Patchwork chimera, Justice, Totem blume, Proud dust, Discolor, Hello your dream.. So much emblematic soundtracks.
I'd say Erika has more than one theme. Resurrected Replayer is one of them. Then there's discolor, the girl's witch hunt. liberated liberater and maybe even LixAxil. Whenever I hear these I think of her, even though they're not specifically her themes.
>The girl's witch hunt
Dlanor's theme (along with Aci-L)
Arguable, but somewhat more a featherine theme (with Look back) for me
Erika X Battler, not really erika herself
I don't remember when exactly resurrected replayer plays except for course for the ep 8 bern riddle, but it always seemed more of an erika theme. I'll check this later
>Arguable, but somewhat more a featherine theme (with Look back) for me
I hear people say this a lot, but does Liberated Liberater even play during a Featherine part? I don't remember that ever being the case.
Brought up by Erika.
>Dlanor's theme (along with Aci-L)
Fair point, but still closely related to Erika.
>Arguable, but somewhat more a featherine theme (with Look back) for me
The only place where it could play that comes to mind is Featherine vs Lambda. I think Erika's fight was a bigger deal than that.
>Erika X Battler, not really erika herself
Yeah, but guess who made a comeback.
As I said, they're not her own, but very closely related.
>Personas aren't personalities
Meta!Beatrice is not piece!Beatrice. Piece!Beatrice is a persona of Yasu with a very clear role on the gameboard, but meta!Beatrice is the collective conceptual existence of all the Beatrices spurned by Yasu's tales through the age. She's a composite character, a concept, a
waifu, and she's also most assuredly female.
Manga outright states Yasu never got a period, never growed breasts, and even Lion says he cooks because he believes in gender equality. Oh, and R07 also mentioned Lion's hair is not necessarily blonde in-story and is just an artistic choice, so don't even bring up the sprites because aside from Yasu having none, Lion's is not an accurate depiction of him.
Appearance doesn't matter at all because Yasu is confirmed to use breastpads and wigs to change her image, and is safe to assume she also can change her voice according to who she's acting as.
>lion being male is no proof cause he looks nothing like yasu
They're the same fucking person, Lion being male confirms Yasu was born male. Also Yasu is very strongly implied to be androgynous looking just like Lion, and the fact that people can't tell whether Lion is a guy or a girl connects at how Yasu was able to easily play both a girl and a boy without raising suspicion.
>did nanjo, genji or kumasawa even tell yasu what sex he/she had originally
Yes, they did. See pic related. Yasu is deeply disturbed she was raised as a girl, and the whole conflict comes from the fact that by the time they told her the truth, she already spent pretty much her entire life living as a woman and oh, now has a boyfriend. And even if she tries to live as a man, she can't be a full man because she can't fully function as one because of the cliff accident. Of course she becomes terrified of not only having to explain this shit to her boyfriend but also knows that she's fucked either way, and well, shit goes downhill from there on.
>then yasu himself/herself think that he/she has boyish body because of flat chest
Remember that part in the second game where George says that if he's going to die he'd rather spend his last moments with Shanon?
Remember how they were both found dead after that?
George tried to have sex with Shanon, and Yasu freaked out and killed him. This shit doesn't happen just because she might have a boyish body or flat chest. The whole dialogue between Beatrice and Shanon is an allusion to Yasu's fear of being seen naked or have sex.
That's because any hint of Yasu being female would make it too obvious that he/she were female. Giving Yasu a female appearance and some male traits evens it out so you can't tell the gender.
Remember when there was also another allusion to Yasu being scared of people seeing her naked? And how Jessica was freaking out during the whole thing? Yeah, no shit, having a boyish body or flat chest doesn't get this reaction out of anyone.
Have you guys been reading any good mysteries lately?
I just finished Murder on the Orient Express. It had some interesting implications if you look at it through a seacats mindset.
He created two possibilities at the end, and chose the one he thought was "just" not "right". I loved that reveal, it's the kind of crazy solution you stick at the back of your mind but don't come to because it's too out there. 12 suspects, 12 knife wounds.
Otherwise I've been reading lots of Christie lately.
Are you really so offended? It's quite topical and I'm interested in what other mysteries seacats have been into.
I'm currently on Episode 6. I'm intrigued about why Battler is stuck in that creepy room, but otoh the bits with Ange reading and chick Beato are boring as shit. Should I finish this episode or just skip it and unlock the 7th?
Well don't skip anything. I didn't like 6/7 very much but they're still important.
Battler is in the room because he metaphorically trapped himself in that room with his reasoning. He has to find a logical way to escape the room to continue the game.
I'd say the episode gets more interesting around the time the "love battle" starts.
That's blog shit, not anime discussion.
Discussing other novels that aren't by Ryukishi is derailing the thread, not to mention. And no, just because they're mystery novels too doesn't make it ok. Go to /lit/ if you want to discuss anything that isn't Umineko or Higurashi or western novels.
>Discussing other novels that aren't by Ryukishi is derailing the thread, not to mention.
If you had atleast read Umineko, you'd know how closely related the Tokyo Zodiac Murders are. The book is even mentioned in it, alongside others. Stop being such an autist and pretending you know shit, you're the one derailing the thread.
The Crooked House was decent.
Except for the fact that these novels were directly mentioned in the novel and are of significance to the plot.
So best girl wars, Rika-fag shitting up threads in the past and roleplaying is not considered thread derailment?
Either way, I really don't know why you would care about somebody derailing the thread since you obviously haven't read Umineko and are here probably just to shitpost.
It was decent but the conclusion was underwhelming
mostly because I viewed the culprit as the detective since she was the only competent character, which sorta contradicts with Knox's 7th in a way
Either way, I never said her works were bad, just not great.
He's obviously new, otherwise we would've seen more of him in the past.
One of Van Dine's rules says there should only be a single detective. I didn't assume she's going to be the culprit either, but the main character was obviously the detective.
I haven't read many of her works so I can't really judge yet, it's just that I didn't particularly hate the works I read so far.
True, although she pretty much acted like the Watson in the story, imagine if Doyle made him the main antagonist of the series.
I started reading Van Dine's Philo Vance series and I'm liking it a tad bit more than Christie's Poirot, although that's highly arguable.
Please explain something to me: how are we supposed to interpret that scene at the very end of EP8, where Battler is welcomed into the golden land, with regards to the meta world? Is it supposed to be the scene in EP5 when Battler realizes the truth? Is it set after all the meta stuff happened, and now there's two Battlers in the golden land, this one and GM Battler? Or something else altogether?
Luck is for people without brains!
Just finished Umineko and damn it was a comfy ride. "watashi wa dare ?" of Beato is disturbing, i heard that Chiru is pretty bad if you compare to EP1-4 but i really hope that there is a flashback for story.
I find that image to be bullshit.
Battler noticed it was Shannon but Kyrie couldn't in ep 2? Plus, it never happened, it was a story written by Featherine.
I prefer to imagine the ending in which Tohya dies after seeing the painting. The manga just says that Battler moved on, but fuck that shit, no one gets a happy ending.
Ange meets not-Battler, it's anticlimactic and ends up killing him just after they meet.
Rika paradoxically has breast in her original sprite. Just not big ones.
Ep 5 is the best in the series, up there with Ryukishi's best he's ever written.
Ep 6 is a drag but some parts with everyone's favorite detective is good. Everything else without that detective is meh.
Ep 7 is meh or good depending on who you ask.
Ep 8 is underrated fun.
Since there's a Umineko thread, I might as well post it here. I redid the images of Faggot George. Now it looks cleaner and better.
I feel so sorry for Eva. Her family members are a bunch of incestous degenerates, her own father doesn't acknowledge her merits, can't have children for a really long time and when she eventually has one he's mentally retarded, fat and likes dick, her husbando who was the only good person in her life dies and leaves her with the burden of having to take care of the kid of her family's murderers and she has to hide the truth from her for the rest of her life by acting like the bad guy.
Well it's partially the parent's fault for raising such an entitled brat.
But is the implication in ep7 that he just straight up murders his mother in a karate fight because she wouldn't accept Shannon?
That's fucking brutal.
I dunno. Eva really had it hard overall but she was still at fault in a large part. You can empathize with her but still hold her accountable for a good portion of the bullshit, especially concerning George.
On the one hand, George is likely shit due to his father's shit genes but it's Eva's constant need to protect and shield him that really fucked him over a new one.
Something I was wondering recently is why didn't George just start his own business instead of working at his father's company? He'll never expand his wings if he just keeps being protected by his father that way. I just assume that Eva was too fearful of letting him be his own man and convinced him to work at Hideyoshi's company.
I think it's more nature and nurture fucking George up.
>But is the implication in ep6
Not to mention he's the only one who would kill the entire family for Shannon in ep 4.
I still find it hilarious that women refuse to marry into a rich family because of how much of a faggot George is.
At least Jessica has the excuse that everyone's afraid of her because of how wealthy her family is but George is just a complete faggot.
It's funny how out of both sexes who lament not being loved, the guy is seen as being more pathetic. I wonder, why is that so?
Would anyone call Jessica pathetic concerning not being loved?
Parents with single children tend to do that shit, you can't really blame her for everything. Sure, she might have made mistakes, but guess what? People make mistakes out of stupid reasons and having a kid after trying for years would make all rational people love them to a scary degree. Even so, she did not deserve that kind of fate, she had it the worst in the group.
I think she tried too hard? I dunno, I can understand what George felt, since I was a single child for a long time and my mother acts almost the same way as Eva but I feel that she tried too hard. Mère poule, as we call it.
But yeah, Eva had it the worst. I just think that because she gave everything to her son to be what she could never and saw it slowly crash was just terrible for her. You always want your child to be good and having a child growing up to be George must have been the worst.
Marrying a goddamn servant girl. Jesus, what an embarrassment.
Jessica has friends. And I respect her for being rebellious and trying to find her own way, being unsure about herself. George I don't know, but he's off. He's completely sure about himself, he's been taught one certain way to live from his parents and he follows that "monarch" way of life without question. There's no heart there. And Jessica is all heart.
>George I don't know, but he's off.
I can understand Jessica's rebellious phase but it's probably what makes her alienated from others. Maybe it's the culture? I always get the feeling that women, especially before the 90s in Japan, had to be clean, diligent and womanly. You know, the typical idealized silent woman who's only good for sex, bearing children and cooking? By being a tomboy, Jessica doesn't act that way and is probably not seen as a woman, the same way no one saw Mion as a woman in ep 2 of Higurashi.
What's worse, being a pathetic man or not being seen as a woman?
It's a weird vicious cycle.
Am I also the only one who thinks that George's look is inspired by the large amount of boring guys in anime who look the same and act the same too?
I swear that George in the PS3 version looks exactly like that faggot in the Kara no Kyoukai movies, whom his imouto fell in love because at one time, he had a look of 'determination' which is so shallow it hurts. Like, he's so boring that there's absolutely nothing to him in any way.
Yes, it's all scanned and translated already.
It's not really hate, it's just disgust.
I'm feeling really bad about Jessica right now though. She deserves to live happy in that one in two million world with Lion.
George is really cool when he wants to be though.
Huh, I just noticed. Mikiya Kokutou is in love with Shiki, a person who used to be both male and female. Just like Yasu.
TRI and WtC3 are coming out very soon.
I just think that Jessica would whore herself to anyone who would give her any bit of attention. She has a large sign on her head that says I WILL FUCK ANYONE FOR SOME LOVE. Jessica is almost as bad as George though. She would have let a servant boy fuck her.
How embarrassing. The future heir of a rich family, being fucked by a servant.
>in the meta
>when it never happened
George is a fag, meta-George is cool.
Unsolicited claim, her one and only love up until 17 is her lesbo trannie best friend.
It's a better story in my opinion, but much less ambitious. Take out 90% of the meta concepts, it's like just looking at the "board" side of the story.
The characters are some of my favorite in any fiction.
Emotionally there's lower lows but higher highs when the badass stuff kicks in.
Higurashi is a masterpiece. So is Umineko but for different reasons.
It's not fair to compare both. Umineko is large and more ambitious and depending on who you ask, fails or exceeds those expectations.
Higurashi is more a linear story to an extent where more and more questions keeps building up until everything makes sense in the end.
The SoL makes you relate to the characters before they get killed. But it's not like the SoL is just there to make you care about the characters, it also serves as amazing foreshadowing of all the events and themes of the story.
>in the manga, in ep 1, Tomitake tries to shoot down the bear and fails
>Rika laments that alone, he won't be able to do it and that it's impossible
>K1 immediately doesn't give up, tells Tomitake what to do and with teamwork, wins the bear.
deredere is probably the idealized perfect woman in moonland though. It's the perfect womanly state and I always feel that asking women to be subserviant that way is ''sexist''? Not entirely sure how to phrase it without sounding like an idiotic feminist. deredere always lacks personality imo.
Which is better, a tomboy with personality or a deredere who will open her legs for you?
MOTHERFUCKER. No way.
So if you randomly came up to Jessica, talked to her for a bit, and acted nice, you don't think she'd drop to her knees to suck you? Don't tell me you don't want to see Jessica getting so flustered, she would do anything for you.
Don't you want that kind of Jessica?
>check VA on MAL
I still can't believe it. It's like being suspicious that there's oil under your feet and finding a goldmine.
Ah, too much of a gentleman to want her to do that, huh?
Well tsundere is better than deredere of course. I think Jessica would be the kind of person to blush and hit you if you made a move. She wouldn't be comfortable with strangers anyways, she only asked Kanon. It seems almost innocent and schoolgirly the way she only confided in Shannon.
I think Mion is exactly the same way. Except if you dropped your pants if front of her and weren't K1 you'd be found in the forest the next week.
It's never happening, friend.
Hey, it's fine, you don't need to share her. She can be *your* whore. I mean, it's also fine if you don't want to think of her as a whore. Just think of her as ''your woman''. That's good enough, right?
Don't you want to see Jessica with her shirt unbuttoned and her skirt loose, with her legs open, inviting you to make her yours?
I dunno, I always felt that Jessica and Kanon had zero chemistry. She wanted to be loved and he simply didn't want to feel inhuman, so he returned kindness with kindness.
With K1 and Mion, you felt there was good chemistry between the two, even if K1 saw Mion more as a bro than a girl.
>It seems almost innocent and schoolgirly the way she only confided in Shannon.
I think it's because they grew up together. They're like childhood girlfriends. Jessica also laments to her school friends concerning love but doesn't open up because she doesn't want to look weak and get teased. I can't even imagine Jessica asking her friends if they have a brother she can hook up with.
I want to hold Black Battler's hand and tell him everything will be alright.
*BOOM BOOM CRASH*
you wake up to two witches breaking into your house!
[ ]rape the one with the beret
[ ] rape the one with the flatness
[ ] shoot them with your shotgun hidden in the headboard
[ ] shout "WITCHES DON'T EXIST"
[ ] piss yourself in fear and beg them to let you live
[ ] roundhouse kick the pink one then roll into a suplex for the blue one
[ ] other:
Anyone have the video with all of B.Battler's dialogue from CROSS?
Just mild teasing. I always love that Ryukishi is a feminist but also likes to leave enough of a gap in the personality of his female characters that you can imagine them becoming subservient in a womanly way. You end up loving the characters and imagining how to break them. I love it.
Ep 2 sold poorly and might have slowed down production time. Ep 3 is 100% translated and edited. Expect a release very soon.
I know this post is old as hell but I only just got back to this thread. If you're going to write off that interaction between Battler and Yasu because it never happened, why shouldn't you also write off Kyrie not noticing it was Shannon? That never happened either, it was a message bottle story written by Yasu.
Yes, it did. But that was probably because of HYPE. After that, it died down and only really really hardcore diehard Higurashi fans bought it, and maybe even those didn't buy, waiting for the rest to be translated before buying.
He is a feminist in the correct sense of the word. I don't know how you could read his work without seeing that.
Hell, I even felt that Higanbana was Ryukishi saying
>oh, it's hard to write good women in your stories? Well here a collection of interconnected short stories consisting mostly of only women!
I hate feminism as much as the next guy but Ryukishi does it the right way.
I always felt that the male characters are rather less developped than the female characters.
Look at Higurashi.
Irie, Tomitake, Satoshi, K1, with the exception of Oishi, don't hold up well against the female cast of Rika, Mion, Rena, Takano, Satoko.
Same with Umineko.
Other than Kinzo, Battler, Rudolf, Hideoyoshi, George (he's a good character but he's still boring, even if written intentionally that way) Genji, Nanjo, don't hold up to all the female cast.
Just because a story contains well written female characters does not make the writer a feminist, it just makes them a good writer.
As for comparing the male and female characters, despite how great the witches are I'd still say Battler is my favorite character. And Keichi was definitely developed enough to hold up to the female cast in Higurahsi, except for like Rika who obviously stood out more.
I thought it was just because everyone likes cute girls.
>it just makes them a good writer.
That's true. I dunno, it's just the feeling I'm getting out of his writing and I can't put in correctly into words. Saying his female cast is more well written isn't conveying my point across correctly.
>Ryukishi saying on his twitter that Lion should destroy genderroles and be in the kitchen more
I always get that feeling that Ryukishi's cracked the code to write good female characters and hinted at it in Higanbana and Umineko a few times.
Well, yeah, who doesn't? But I always feel it's more than that.
It's all negated by the fact she hid what happened on Rokkenjima (which is pretty bad already) and, sadistically, thoroughly, and fully destroyed Ange's life by hiring dozens of people whose job were to make sure she'd never be happy, before happily telling her she'd make sure she dies a horrible death -which she did, in EP4-.
Fuck Eva, fuck that game's double standards for trying to make her look ok after what she did.
What happened with Ange isn't completely her fault as well. It's not like Eva didn't try either.
Also, ep 4 never happened. Well, the way Ange died in ep 4 never happened. The rest did.
You have to say something controversial for a response.
Forget about him, I've got 10x more Rika waifu love-love power. I'll keep you company baby.
How do you deal with an ungrateful little brat who blames you for her parents death and declares she will never smile.
Can you really blame Eva for acting like Rosa? How can Ange not act as well as the idealized dead George at his age?
6 years old actually. Ange was smart enough to not be an idiot. I'm not really victim blaming, only saying that the blame is passed on both sides with neither admitting that they're both at fault.
They both acted like asses to the other but I like to think that Eva was welcoming to Ange until she started acted conceited.
>How do you deal with an ungrateful little brat who blames you for her parents death and declares she will never smile.
By not actively trying to destroy her life? Do you realize that Eva responded to Ange's criticism by HIRING MANPOWER to ensure she'd live the shittiest life, because Eva alone couldn't make it shitty enough?
>Can you really blame Eva for acting like Rosa?
Rosa had anger issues. Eva deliberately destroyed Ange. She gave her death treats, and put her in a a situation where she had a big chance getting murdered.
In real life, she'd get jailed for child abuse.
It wasn't Ange's responsibility to act nice to Eva. That's her life, she doesn't have to befriend someone she doesn't like, even if the reason is petty.
On the other hand, Eva didn't have the right to destroy Ange's life, because it's not just her life, it's someone else's. She savagely attacked a 6 year old kid, who had absolutely no way of defending herself. She invaded her life.
Look at these pubes. Don't tease me like that anon i fapped 2 times today.
Woah, look at all that Ange defending and Eva bashing.
I'm pretty sure Eva didn't decide to do that shit when Ange was 6. The resentment accumulated over time on both sides.
>It wasn't Ange's responsibility to act nice to Eva.
It's not about responsibility but being fucking grateful. Being resentful to the only living person in your family is just being a dick.
>Woah, look at all that Ange defending and Eva bashing.
That's actually the definition of child abuse and there's a reason why we jail fuckers like that in real life but degenerates pedophiles like you probably wouldn't understand that.
Eva was objectively, morally and juridically wrong and deserved all the shit she got in her life. Trying to redeem her is shit writing at its finest.
I don't know how i should feel about the series.
On one hand i love the setting, and the whole system of red truths which by itself has plenty of potential for spin-offs and games. The characters all have their charms, which makes you become attached to some of them. The music drives the series home with many of the pieces getting your blood pumping over the smallest of events and shed tears every time something by Dai shows up.
However the writing at times is inconsistent and falls flat on itself when pressed. I do understand about making the VN readers figure out the true end but without a canon answer by word of god it just leads to pointless arguments.
Also, Eva could have retired whenever she wanted, just by letting people take care of Ange. She just had to not do anything and everything would have went well.
Ange didn't have any choice in the matter. She was also too young to take responsibility for anything.
Ange goes "oh yeah Eva wasn't that bad man she was kinda nice" in EP8.
Try to understand Eva, you don't have to forgive her. I think that's what Ryukishi wanted for most of the characters. They almost all do terrible things but understand where they're coming from.
Eva was a wreck after she may or may not have had a small hand in the loss of the entire family. She lost her husband and son, and the one kid who survived would always look at her with suspicion and hate. Eva always had a bit of a child inside her and that child came out in full after the incident. It was that child that treated Ange like another child might.
I want to pat her head and hold her hand.
>If you've already read the VN and just want to see the major changes then just read the EP 8 manga
He should probably read Episode 7 as well, since it shows the solutions to game 1-4
I want to dress her up like Rika and stab her endlessly in front of the Furude Shrine until her mind collapses in on itself.
I agree, yet there are still retards that can't infer that stuff on their own and act like it doesn't make sense when really they don't understand it, so you kinda just have to push it on those people.
Wow that's kind of weird.
I want to dress Bern up in a school uniform and have her play around with Rika and Satoko.
I think they would get along, and it would be a guilty pleasure of the super serious Bern. She would visit the HInamizawa kakera as a "sister" every once in a while afterwards and Lambda would tease her for it.
That was just an analogy, I naturally don't actually expect them to say something like "Eva is a nice person" in red. I was just saying you can think about it however you want.
But if you're going to say you can't use red like that, then what about "you are incompetent"?
Basically, you're saying pic related?
To be fair, the red only works inside a gameboard. Saying it's not in red is just too foolish.
>he doesn't state all his opinions in Gold
Bernkastel doesn't deserve a happy life. She doesn't deserve anything. Fuck her. And fuck you for suggesting that she should ever come close to Rika.
Out of all your opinions I think the Bernkastel hatred is most interesting.
Why would you hate what was once Rika? She's not evil. She's the worst part of Rika but that's still a part of her. If the two met then I'm certain they would be friends. Bern solved Rika's problems and cast herself off into the lonely kakeraverse. This is coming from a Rika waifufag.
She's still got a little Bern inside her. Bern is just an aspect of Rika.
If you hate Bern you hate part of Rika. Maybe Rika herself hates that part of her too. But I love all of her.
I'm not that Bernhater anon but for Rika, Bern is just a burden that she had to carry because of the timeloops she went through. It was both a consequence of, and a way to deal with them. When the timeloops got irrelevant, she threw Bern away and that's good for her, because no one wants to have a Bern
I just tested that and I got permabanned from posting in that shithole. That was pretty fucking funny.
He's a fellow Rika friend and a bright guy. I just think this Bern hate is misguided.
Well it might not be 100% clear what she thinks of Bern. Did she throw her away or did she leave? Same action, different way of thinking.
At the end of Saikoroshi-hen all the nakama say they don't mind going through very bad times as long as they're all together in the end. And at the end of Kira there's a special scene at the end where Rika accepts her past. She sends young Rika on her way to go through the terrible hundred years, in a way accepting the events. So I think she would accept Bern as well.
Look, she's not one to hold a grudge either. If they met I'm sure there wouldn't be any revenge fantasies at least. Takano damned her, Bernkastel saved her! In a way.
Chopsticks require above average dexterity and intellect to use. Truly the patrician way to consume produce.
Beatrice does the fugging for the first several episodes. And she's not gentle.
Those are the one's who just finished it. It's fascinating to theorize one you finish it, but once you've seen most theories and discussions it becomes a chore to fix newer anon misunderstandings.
Probably because one year earlier, Yasu wasn't yet at a state of total despair over her gender, and her relationship with George wasn't advanced enough to get engaged, so if Battler had come back, she'd have dumped George's ass for him. One year later, she'd be contented with George.
Yasu would be a pretty awesome Assassin-class Servant to summon for the Holy Grail War. Misleading your opponent that you actually have a Caster and using his/her Noble Phantasm which allows the servant to 'switch' between two bodies will make it really easy to kill masters. Literally only Archers would give him/her problems.
I don't hate what she is. I hate that I foolishly trusted her and had it shoved in my face. I will never forgive her.
When I read Umineko the first time, I thought that Bernkastel was my ally, like she claimed, and was Rika herself in some way, especially since she looked so much like her with some hints that it was her. I completely trusted her during the course of the entire story even when she did some dubious things in ep 5 and 6. And then she turned out to be the biggest fucking cunt and it just made me rage the furry of a trillion suns by how much I was betrayed.
When I read Umineko again with the voice patch, Bernkastel going 'fighto-mii-Nipah'' broke me. I couldn't stand it.
It was like seeing everything I loved come out of everything I hate in that single moment.
I want Bernkastel to die in a fire for all eternity.
The manga version of that image was just an added insult. It was absolutely fucking disgusting. Bernkastel has no fucking right to sound and act like Rika.
Fuck Bernkastel. I want her gone from existence itself. I want her to stop thinking, I want her fucking dead.
I don't hate things by how 'evil' people are, since that's subjective. No, I hate everything she represents and more. She's the absolute opposite of Rika. She isn't Rika at all and I don't want her associated to her at all. I fucking hate everyone who thinks she's a part of her in any way. She was born from her and that's all she is. Bernkastel is simply the worst parts of Rika meshed into one. Nothing more and nothing less. She's not Rika and I will never see her as such.
I love Rika, not the abomination that was born out of her.
They seemed to share a genuine connection by 3 and 4 though, and have actual conversations with eachother by that point. Such as the scene where Beatrice thought she broke battler too badly and wanted to cheer him up in episode 4.
I'd agree with Battler being my favorite over all character. The guy gets shit on a lot for being pretty dumb early on, but he has a really interesting character arc, and I think he and Kinzo are better developed than some of the female characters.
No, I like that small sadistic part of Rika. It's her badge of all the suffering she went through. Bernkastel is simply the abomination created by Hanyuu to have a friend and to help Rika. Bernkastel is like a cancer, slowly eating Rika over time that was taken out.
Oh, but she came out of the person you love, surely you can find it in you to love that cancer, can yooooou? No. Fuck no.
Bernkastel was born out of the accumulated suffering Rika underwent in Higurashi. The massive amount of depression had to be removed to give Rika a fighting chance. Hanyuu collected that amount in the meta for possible future use. In Rei, Hanyuu put Rika into sleep so that she could understand that she must see herself as a single person and not a kakera hopping personality. At that point, Rika accepted her identity as a normal girl and Bernkastel took the name.
Hanyuu intended to use Bernkastel as a friend, but Bern noticed that this was another prison and escaped the meta, lamenting that she never got her happy ending, unlike Rika.
Am I supposed to feel pity for this cunt? The embodiment of the worst aspects of Rika wasn't able to get her happy ending? Boohoo, fuck you.
Here, listen to this song
I only hear a pathetic girl who wants to be hatred, understands what she is and wishes to die. I will grant her that wish. I will never stop hating her. Without love it cannot be seen and I nothing but hatred.
Do it with the PS3 and voice.
The way to read Umineko is
>read with original sprites and no voices, as it was originally released
>reread with PS3 art and voices
>further reading with manga if need be
If you've already done that, why not just stick with the original sprite but add the voices?
>There's just more heart to it
Didn't you know Anon, a story lacks something when it's lacking heart.
It's more ''with love, you start having biases''. The heart has nothing to do with it.
>Ryukishi's art is shit, but with love, you can see that it has more emotion
>you are biased if you think shit art is good
Completely sacrificing logic for heart is a foolish thing you're just lying to yourself, but sacrificing heart for logic creates a soulless story where the people involved don't matter. Neither is more important than the other. Only with both will you reach a satisfying conclusion.
Sorry, man, but I got more heart than you.
True. Plus, while everyone seems to forget, Ryukishi actually went to some art university and designed clothes and underwear before working with social services.
Doh ho ho. This guy has you beat.
Being too cold and logical makes you inhuman though. You have to have empathy and some love.
>Jessica is almost as bad as George though. She would have let a servant boy fuck her.
That would probably have been better for her as marrying someone she didn't love. Think about Kinzo, who never got over Beatrice and never really loved his later wife. And Natsuhi and Krauss were an arranged marriage too (although i think they liked each other).
If Jessica and Kanon would have been happy together, why not?
Then how come Erika failed to solve the mystery but Willard did?
>Being too cold and logical makes you inhuman though. You have to have empathy and some love.
That's not being inhuman, that's doing your job. There's no place for empathy and love in these kind of things.
Because she didn't open that wardrobe.
You didn't need to open "that wardrobe" to find out the truth. There were plenty of hints to it scattered around episodes 1-4, if you just had the heart to see them.
I personally think that it's the right way but you're entitled to your own opinion.
5th from the left here is the best example of the original art being better.
The "heart" is just a word for human emotion, which is, no shit, in the brain. You're just arguing semantics at this point. What I'm trying to say is having emotions makes it easier to understand motivations caused by emotions.
Erika isn't a bad detective by any stretch, it's just that she probably could've been more on point if she had a better understanding of emotions, or "the heart".
Erika mostly just wants to be right on top of all of that other shit. She could have easily tried to pin the crime on somebody else that wasn't Natsuhi, but she became obsessed about proving how her specific theory was the correct one, even when Battler started poking holes in it.
>there are people that actually hated episode 8
How come? I thought it was a great way to wrap up the series. The mystery was over by episode 7, all there was to do was to provide resolution to Ange's arc. Plus the ending really hit hard.
Which is more important, the brain or the heart?
The answer, obviously, that both are important. Literally and metaphorically.
Duality never fails.
I tried Higurashi years ago but it was after I was on an enormous VN binge and Higurashi part 1 is when I finally got burnt out. Is it necessary before starting Umineko, or can I just jump right in? I'd normally be against skipping like this, but I know if I try starting Higurashi again without a second opinion I'll just drop it before I'm even caught up.
>Plus the ending really hit hard.
This. I cried during the credits of the magic ending, and I cried again when Tohya saw Beatrice's portrait in the orphanage.
You don't need to read Higurashi to understand Umineko, but if you were burnt out by Higurashi just from part 1, you won't be able to get through Umineko. It's much more longer.
Are you kidding? Erika is a TERRIBLE detective. She solved nothing. Even Battler managed to figure out that Kinzo was dead. What did Erika solve?
If you say that Erika solved the Epitaph, that's wrong. Tohya only skipped the solving part and jumped narratively to Erika and Battler solving the Epitaph. Which is funny considering that Goat-kun solved the Epitaph in ep 4.
>the brain and the heart are literally the same
What the fuck?
Yeah, same, I also cried. That song is just too powerful.
Can I ask you something???
Why do you hate no-name so much? You know, he's just an stupid clown and an obnoxious piece of dirt just like you, so I don't see why you don't like him. Heh, I actually like you. I think you're funny, but now you're just being very very very VERY VERY! VERY!! VERY!!! annoying and immature, so please stop. Okay? Okay ;)
Think of him like a very grumpy puppy. If you keep pinching his nose he's only going to bark more lauder and lauder.
Oh, and about those pics. Don't believe all that crap. The purpose of that was only to attract attention to him, obviously. He's just a pathetic and boring douchebag, but an inoffensive one. The End
No I meant I was burnt out after reading several VNs in a row leading into Higurashi. Like I think I tackled Muv Luv for the first time right before, as well as Majikoi and a few others. And after I was done with all those I decided to try Higurashi, and that's when I decided I'd had enough of VNs for a while.
Umineko is somewhat tied to Higurashi, but you could probably skip it without missing out on too much. You could also read the manga for Higurashi if you were burned out from the VN. It's missing a few great scenes, but it's still a pretty solid adaptation
>The "heart" is just a word for human emotion, which is, no shit, in the brain
The heart is just the brain. If you're autistic like Erika, you wont know how humans behave and wont be able to solve mysteries
You know, now that I think about it you're kind of right, Erika really didn't solve anything. However I don't think that means outright shes a bad detective, she was just dealt a shitty hand a lot of the time. She managed to come up with an almost airtight theory in ep 5, despite it being wrong. And the closed room in ep 6 she constructed was pretty well made as well.
>being this wrong
>She could have easily tried to pin the crime on somebody else
Excluding Battler, who do you have in mind?
She would've done well elsewhere.
I can get that. Umineko makes a few references to Higurashi, but ultimately Umineko is it's own beast. You might get the full effect having read Higurashi beforehand, but honestly you can read Umi by itself just fine.
The very ending is great, but the majority of the ep is "oh look we're all happy now, no one ever did anything wrong" and shounen fightan, which doesn't provide much emotional satisfaction. Which is what R07 was going for.