Reminder she was a normal child until Kerry's death and instant brainwashing.
Okay secondaryfag here, is this why Berserker lose? because Ilya become a hindrance?
Also having multiple life not enough against sword spammer? looks like their game mechanic is broken as fuck.
It's basically impossible for any normal hero to win if Gilgamesh is serious enough. He's got all the weapons, he's got everyone's weakness, it'd hard really stating what an unfair type he can be in a sense.
Impure heroes have a higher chance of matching him, as in things that really should have never been summoned, like Pale Rider. A true hero shouldn't be able to match him though, because their legends descended from his legend, and thus he has all their shit and their weaknesses.
Her magic not enough to protect herself? also i thought Enkidu is a person? Gil's trump card is Ea right?
I know, but seeing F/Z Rider and Berserker died in the same way is quite boring, but now i know part of it is Illya's fault.
Enkidu was Gil's best friend, and he named his chain after him. It's the chain he used to restrain the Bull of Heaven in his legend, so it's especially good against things with divinity.
By the way, Nasu's Gilboner is immense.
>Her magic not enough to protect herself? also i thought Enkidu is a person? Gil's trump card is Ea right?
Of course not, sword spam is far beyond what a magus that is not specialized in combat could manage. The Einzberns are not suited to fights, actually.
>also i thought Enkidu is a person? Gil's trump card is Ea right?
The chain is also named Enkidu in honor to his only friend. Enkidu is his most beloved NP and Ea is his trump card.
Here's a quick summary of the Epic of Gilgamesh off wikipedia:
The first half of the story discusses Gilgamesh, king of Uruk, and Enkidu, a wild man created by the gods to stop him oppressing the people of Uruk. After an initial fight, Gilgamesh and Enkidu become close friends. Together, they journey to the Cedar Mountain and defeat Humbaba, its monstrous guardian. Later they kill the Bull of Heaven, which the goddess Ishtar sends to punish Gilgamesh for spurning her advances. As a punishment for these actions, the gods sentence Enkidu to death.
In the second half of the epic, Gilgamesh's distress at Enkidu's death causes him to undertake a long and perilous journey to discover the secret of eternal life. He eventually learns that "Life, which you look for, you will never find. For when the gods created man, they let death be his share, and life withheld in their own hands". However, because of his great building projects, his account of Siduri's advice, and what the immortal man Utnapishtim told him about the Great Flood, Gilgamesh's fame survived his death. His story has been translated into many languages, and in recent years has featured in works of popular fiction.
now here's your spoiler:
Gilgamesh just so happens to have TONS of Noble Phantasms in his personal treasury, the Gate of Babylon
One of them happens to be called the "Chains of Enkidu," which also just so happen to be really good at fucking up divine beings
now can you guess which certain servant is the son of a god and half divine?
No magic can protect against Gilgamesh's sword rain
He shoots the origins of all swords at people, the origins of human history and achievement, the unnamed prototypes. In terms of concept that's basically above any other shit.
Outside of Protea level concepts
It's pretty sad then, because what anime and manga taught me so far is determination and nakama is always win, and looks like Berserker really doing his best to win this battle.
Well at least,
Thanks, this Enkidu is not a trap right? because what google image show me is pretty much "draw a girl then call it a boy".
That's because it was used as an actual trump card, with him having no knowledge she had it and no time to prepare for anything. Just at the apex of his strongest attack, she countered with this and got in close to finish it.
Give him too much time to figure shit out, and he'll realize he has the original Avalon in his vault or something
You have to use it as a trump card, and Saber used it perfectly.
>Thanks, this Enkidu is not a trap right?
Not a trap, fully inhuman mimicking the form of a human. Copied the appearance of the first human he came across in part, but has no gender.
Homunculus of the gods.
Shouldn't the "unnamed prototypes" be actually very shit as they're obscure?
King Arthur's sword would be pretty fucking famous and probably stronger than some shitty obscure predecessor.
But there isn't a rule where the copy can't beat the original
to the best of my memory, the nasuverse edition was kinda like this:
Enkidu was a doll made from mud by the gods for the express purpose of teaching Gilgamesh a lesson in humility
He was dumped in the wilds and raised by wolves or some shit before the gods usher him to Gilgamesh's solid gold palace and challenges the King of Heroes to a scuffle, to which Gilgamesh agrees to
They fight for twelve days or something absurd and Gilgamesh gets fed up that he can't kick the shit out of a wild hobo, let a lone a doll that's even less than a real human, so he calls it a draw
Enkidu and Gilgamesh then become best bros until the gods revoke Enkidu's privilege to life for killing the Bull of Heaven
Nasuverse Enkidu's history from CCC
He can become all things in creation, main ability is shapeshifting.
Becomes GoB to match GoB, becomes Ea to match Ea, becomes vagina to fuck vagina with his four dicks he's also growing at the same time.
Something that can't even come close to fighting servants outside of a meme or joke that people take seriously most of the time. Try to inject him into any conversation, and get rabid when denied.
>nobody likes Ryougi
Who is this nobody, anon?
If you say so.
Strawberries are the worst fruit, get that shit out of here with your tiny little seeds and low tier jelly/jam
Grape is the only thing this board will represent, or maybe blueberry.
it's more his boner for old things is insane, seeing as he also let Ryougi curbstomp Araya after she gets her hands on an antique katana simply because the older the artifact the better
Overrated as fuck.
>-Best girl in KnK
Literally every girl in KnK is more interesting to watch than Shiki.
The only good part of her is dead.
>-Will protect you
Just like everyone.
Face it, Shiki is shit. Her daughter is nice though.
You're trying too hard.
That's one of the fundamental concepts of the Nasuverse, old shit is always better, sometimes new stuff can overcome it, but that doesn't stop the old stuff from being better.
This is because humans used to be way better when there were less of them, in basically every way. Original humans were best, whenever there's more of them though that intrinsic value their all share gets divided between them somehow.
Alaya hasn't changed I guess, the spirit of humanity is the same whether its ten humans or ten billion. It's just divided between them.
she has a gameboy
Nah, on /m/ and generally in Japanese understandings of prototypes, they're overambitious testbeds for technology to be mass-produced later. BUT, they're soooo ambitious that they're WAY BETTER.
Or you have cases like /m/'s AltEisen, which was the prototype for the next generation of solid-projectile-using mechs, but whose concept was passed up because the heavy armor, risky defensive combat it promoted wasn't as useful as the cheaper, faster, lighter armored alternative. So the head R&D got butthurt and let the main character keep it so it could get some use.
tl;dr This thing is better because it's more obscure.
It would be a real shame if someone were to steal it.
How did Einzbern forest wolves penetrate the God Hand?
Look at Hercules there, not even bleeding
That's the wolves blood, or Ilya's blood as she hemorrhages out from Berserker moving around too much since summoning him three months early was Kariya level pain.
Wolves keep breaking their jaws on Hercules, and loli just writhing around in blood nearby.
She's still "normal" considering her situation
Went through some shit like Sakura, but manifested it in different ways. Became more aggressive, despite how much the Einzebern's tried she couldn't actually become actually hateful, was prone to secrecy, and even a little yandere
What is it about trauma that really makes someone into DEEP LOVE here?
Just like the other girls, needed the situation to unfold in just the right way to be saved a bit, and show her real self. Comes off as the most mature girl in the cast by the end somehow.
Was this all Ufo here? I can't remember anything like this.
That's not what filler is, there was a scene in the original where Caster talked about her master a bit, they expanded on it.
Nasu said he wrote some new scenes for the anime here, this is one of them. Ufotable isn't making new shit up on their own. They got the creator in here to make new shit instead.
Ilya is always pretty mellow, but she'll still fucking kill you. Considering its a war she is justified enough.
Even in the prologue she gave Shirou time to summon his servant before going after him.
What's so bad about the Caster flashback that people have been calling it out as shit for a few days now, and Nasu is George Lucas because of it? The fact that he uses technology because "All mages should think and believe the same, no one should ever go outside of the mold set", despite how we've seen in about a dozen stories now that there are always different types here? First mages were introduced to are even pretty heretical by normal standards.
Course there are mages that use technology, but they just aren't regarded as well by the old age of magic types. There are many different factions in Clock Tower alone.
You can also see that in Nasu's draft and in what was supposed to happen in the script, Berserker was supposed to have lost two lives versus Archer and Saber. That wasn't just Nasu being shit or making up shit, that was how it was supposed to be, you can even see proof of that in the next episode with Ilya's dialogue. If you want to say it's bullshit that he lost lives there, you can say it was the animators that didn't show it well enough.
What about nukes? The Hiroshima and Nagasaki atomic bombs were the progenitors of nuclear weaponry, but compared to modern nukes (or even nukes a couple of decades later) they were underpowered and overengineered. So if Gil has them in his vault by virtue of being the original atomic bombs, they would be worse than if he had, say, a Minuteman-III
No, THIS is the world I wanted
Yes, but far more advanced in the war and only once. In HF it was at the very start and they talked far more. Also, killing Shinji was like a trigger for Illya to went into kill everyone and win mindset.
The difference is that all of that is human made and many of the originals weren't. Age of the Gods and Age of Man. Humanity is still developing though, and according to Gil in CCC it has the potential to reach to the starts and grow more.
Friendly reminder that there will NEVER be a happy Emiya family
He has ancient Indian nukes from Vimana.
He has all the origins of the NP "even if it is a paradox" because he's the original hero. He also has the everything humanity can ever make from board games to speed of light ships that they'll eventually build.
Except that's entirely wrong, and you're just taking a line out of context as we've been over a few times now. I know exactly what line you mean, because people keep coming in here misunderstanding that line and acting like "Nasu is wanking him further" when it doesn't even say it like that.
He doesn't have "All things humans can ever imagine", he doesn't even have things from outside of his era. Something still has to be created entirely for Gilgamesh to have it, something made from a new humanity cannot be his, something handed down by a higher body to humans cannot be his, and he only has the origins of things. This is all talked about in CCC, the entire idea of "HUmans imagine it he has it" is bullshit and a line taken incorrectly entirely.
He doesn't even have the fishing reel Archer traced in Ataraxia. He might have the original fishing reel, but he doesn't have that one, which is why he wanted it.
Doesn't have shit from outside of his era either unless its an NP, it's just that humans back then basically built anything from the new age, but with magic.
It is basically using the "he has everything in this world" literally and using it as a thematic foundation to how the Epic of Gilgamesh is the "first" legend.
Not really, I have seen a lot of historians considering that many legends share thematic ties with the Epic. Also, Mesopotamia being the cradle of civilization.
No, Uruk built everything humanity will ever build except with magic. It's the magic equivalent of all modern technology including submarines, machine guns, nukes, and planes (Vimana).
>He also has the everything humanity can ever make from board games to speed of light ships that they'll eventually build.
Viamma is not some light speed ship that humanity will one day build, stop spreading misinformation
> If it does not exist in Gilgamesh's treasury, then it is "something produced by a new breed of humanity, according a completely new concept," "something made from the technology of the culture born from the intelligent life from another heavenly body," one of the two.
>For that reason, of course he has airplanes and submarines. The desires of the people from before Christ are not different, and it would not do for the crafts of ancient times when magic was in good health to be inferior to the crafts of the modern age. People generally realize the "tools of hope" that they dream of, and each time that occurs, it ended with them being confiscated by the king's hand.
he doesn't have shit from the new humanity, Viamma was from his age. HUmans already built all shit back in his age, but it was better because it ran on magic.
Gilgamesh isn't still adding onto his vault to this day, shit was all made back in the day with magic. He cannot have anything from the newer ages.
In Fate, she's getting the pain from being a Grail. HF spares her this role and it's given to Sakura. It drives Sakura insane too (which people forget, she can switch off her senses as Iri or Illya).
>It is basically using the "he has everything in this world"
You mean the thing Nasu came up with?
Because that sure as hell isn't in the Epic
>Not really, I have seen a lot of historians considering that many legends share thematic ties with the Epic. Also, Mesopotamia being the cradle of civilization.
It is when you try to sell me Gilgamesh as the foundation and potential of humanity
If you think that's what happened, that's a bit off. After she killed Shinji she started breaking down laughing and crying, unable to process, only way she was able to not break fully was by allowing herself to be less human, convince herself she was a monster, pretend to slip into another personality but really just let all the evils slip out and take hold.
Thing holding her back was the mental link all that time, like a fully inhuman thing pretending to be human as it was breaking because it was still being held down by the container "human". It broke, no longer held down/back, thus a monster was born, but the monster was still her in control compared to when Shadow was eating people at night at it wasn't her because she was asleep the entire time thinking it was a dream.
In breaking down all the way, she accepted a demon to avoid breaking down entirely in a sense. Which oddly allowed to her become whole.
He who saw the Deep, the country's foundation,
[who] knew ... , was wise in all matters!
[Gilgamesh, who] saw the Deep, the country's foundation,
[who] knew ... , was wise in all matters!
[He] ... everywhere ...
and [learnt] of everything the sum of wisdom.
He saw what was secret, discovered what was hidden,
he brought back a tale of before the Deluge.
He came a far road, was weary, found peace,
and set all his labours on a tablet of stone.
He built the rampart of Uruk-the-Sheepfold,
of holy Eanna, the sacred storehouse.
>CCC created all Gil wank, Nasu husbando shit, that's where all the Gate of Babylon stuff originated.
Don't be stupid, it's had literally all shit ever since the original game. Original interviews and original materials both confirm it.
>Q: Does “King’s Treasure: Gate of Babylon” contain things such as rare but weak Noble Phantasms? I noticed he kept wine in there in Fate/Zero, so I was wondering if Gilgamesh’s everyday meals were in there as well.
>A: Anything can be found in there. Like a meat that multiplies in proportion to how much is eaten. He’s definitely the “NEET of Babylon.”
All made by humans. They had the "same desires" as modern humans, so they made everything humans have made and will make out of magic stuff. That acts as the "origins of human wisdom."
>Gil forgets he can just spam NPs and starts sparring with him
Then why does his vault have Perseus's Harpe which was given to him by the god Zeus, the Vajra which belongs to the god Indra, and Dáinsleif which was made by dvergr aka dwarves
Nasu has also confirmed that everything in Extra, all the Mooncell servants line up with the throne. Anything that's in there counts the same as normal. Everything talked about with Gilgamesh here, is the same as in other world-lines.
桜「はい、その通り正しいです。より正確に言うと、ムーンセルが記録している人類史からの完全再現となりま す。ただし、この人類史は仮言的に英霊の座と繋がっているので、一概にコピーとは言えません。要するに、ム ーンセルも自分で人類史を作っている認識なのですが、その人類史はそもそも英霊の座とまったく同じものなの で、同一存在として仮言的には重なり合っている、みたいな感じです。」
I know about the spam thing, I was just pointing out how retarded DEEN made it where both adversaries make almost no use of their arsenal and instead fighting using only one or two weapons at the time
Uh no? Did you read HF? Sakura was losing her mind like Shirou did in the end. She didn't even have a sense of time, her mind and soul were breaking due to the souls she was hosting.
Illya knew what was happening and didn't give a fuck to warn Shirou. So the blame is all on her. Sakura ignored what was happening on the other hand.
>Nasu has also confirmed that everything in Extra, all the Mooncell servants line up with the throne.
Except when they don't
When the Complete Material directly contradicts what happens in the VN than I don't know what to trust.
Or when his interviews contradict stuff in the VN or the Complete Material
Gilgamesh, king of Heroes.
Solomon, king of Magi.
Iskandar, king of Conquerors.
Arturia, king of Knights.
Those titles seem to be relevant (but Iskandar and Solomon haven't been powerwanked yet by Nasu). Any other king?
He doesn't really contradict himself nearly half as much as what people want to rage about, with the memes catching on more and more.
Most of the time I'm just seeing someone not understand shit even if its obvious, so they just blame it on him contradicting shit. Even though it's mostly just them not understanding shit.
Take this as an example. It was something someone made up that sounded like a real quote at one point that caught on, but was proven entirely fake.
To this day people still remember it, and no one took it off that CM website.
>King of Jobbers
He only lost to Galahad who is basically the Gilgamesh of Arthurian mythos, no shame in losing to a Frenchie-wanked super knight.
Mordred killed him, because he was protecting his King and was still carrying the injuries he incurred during his fight with Shitcelot.
Shitcelot beat him once and in a dishonorable way after schooling him for multiple times in fair duels.
On the jobber scale Sir Gawain is ranked pretty low all things considered.
Jesus, King of Jews
Oddly his greatest adversary was also Jewish people and Satan. People that believed in their own righteousness over God, appointing themselves as great in all their ways while looking down as others as they got the finest silks and linens. Instead of helping the poor and sick and shit. Jesus came down to give speeches to everyone often, as they would try to trip him up with their logic since he kept calling them out on their bullshit, as he called them out further each time.
Sometimes he had an easier time with the Romans than his own people.
Shiki is best Shiki. Are other Shikis even trying?
> When Jesus had entered Capernaum, a centurion came to him, asking for help. “Lord,” he said, “my servant lies at home paralyzed, suffering terribly.”
>Jesus said to him, “Shall I come and heal him?”
>The centurion replied, “Lord, I do not deserve to have you come under my roof. But just say the word, and my servant will be healed. For I myself am a man under authority, with soldiers under me. I tell this one, ‘Go,’ and he goes; and that one, ‘Come,’ and he comes. I say to my servant, ‘Do this,’ and he does it.”
>When Jesus heard this, he was amazed and said to those following him, “Truly I tell you, I have not found anyone in Israel with such great faith. I say to you that many will come from the east and the west, and will take their places at the feast with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven. But the subjects of the kingdom will be thrown outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.”
>Then Jesus said to the centurion, “Go! Let it be done just as you believed it would.” And his servant was healed at that moment.
I'd get killed by her if you know what I mean.
Are you even trying inferior Ryougis?
Leo was entirely on the up and up, straight came up and said who his servant was first day you met him even.
Could not ever see himself losing, it was said his battle ability was like Rin and Rani combined at the same time, even if in individual ways they might surpass him.
He's the standard "Maxed stats" master of this war, like Ilya.
Magic in that world is literally cheating though.
All the codecasts are using Cheat Engine but not at full potential.
You literally modify base stats.
>making swords out of fucking nothing but memory
King of Kings is a generic title of amazing-ness that everyone in certain cultures get.
The King of Ethiopia was King of Ten Thousand Kings or some shit before World War II.
It's like "X the Great" in European culture.
That part was hilarious. Gil is gonna lose and then A FUCKING BLACK HOLE IN HIS FUCKING CHEST. Holy crap, just kill him properly without this bullshit. Oh, and also THIS face. It was like a comedy at this point.
He's pretty against wealth, and most forms of ownership.
>Then Jesus said to his disciples, “Truly I tell you, it is hard for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God.”
>You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’ But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also. And if anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, hand over your coat as well. 41 If anyone forces you to go one mile, go with them two miles. Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you.
Talks about ideals
All of it was explained but you need to actually read the VN.
Black Hole was angya looking for a new host after it lost Shinji, but it couldn't use Gilgamesh since he wasn't truly human even with his solid body. Trying to incarnate into full Angya.
>jesus as lancer
>holy lance that activates after he pierces himself with it
>carries a giant cross that activates a reality marble that reenacts his last moments
>all around good guy
>holds back naturally
>only fights when necessary and only for six days
>has knowledge of magic but his container limits him from using it to his full potential
I'd say "prototype" isn't a good word here. They're archetypes. Models. Newer stuff is always an inferior copy. Like a picture of original Mona Lisa.
>tl;dr the average ancient farmer would be match for a trained modern athle
For a student cross-country runner. There is a difference.
The graveyard/first fight was playful banter, nothing to bitch about.
You also kind of need the context of the playground chats in fate.
You can be wealthy and be of God, but he still says it's easy to be misled by such things, and there's honor in poverty. Like the women who gave her last two cents as an offering.
People that are wealthy can often make the mistake of trusting their money or Earthly security over God. There's rather a few Biblical people that were wealthy, but they kept God first. It's important to understand the difference.
Money is not evil, can't ever be evil, but love of money is evil.
Making assumptions is the worst thing about secondaries.
There already has been plenty of liberties they took with the anime, but if they went full retard like you propose and deviate, then might as well not call it Unlimited Blade Works and just Fate/Stay Night : Fanfiction instead
It's like half the shit people don't understand in Fate is them taking stuff too literally or missing out on some of the implications underneath.
Yeah Shirou might have died against Berserker, but that was still just her greeting him a bit in her own way. She waited to attack him after he summoned his servant, not taking it too personally, she was quite interested in him, but she needed to set things off on the right step here since it was a war.
She has a choice of not attacking him during the day unless he attacks first during any route, because "Battles happen at night". If she meets him outside of the war she's pretty chill like "I'm going to win anyway, so lets just talk for now". After the way she was raised some of her actions come off odd.
>At first she wants to brutally murder him
But she never actually did. The Einzberns wanted to. Not Illya herself, she only thought that she was supposed to.
Personally she had hope in Shirou, while also holding the contempt that it was likely that they all just abandoned and screwed with her life like she has been told.
But she always wanted to find out whether or not her last remaining family was actually family or legit trash, in spite of her primary mission being to obliterate them.
The Einzberns really fucked up though. They did manage to raise a super master, but they failed to actually make her loyal to them and their cause. Illya's opinion of the Einzberns is pretty darn poor.
>Ozymandias goes by King of kings
I remember this. It surprised me because of out all the "King of X" titles of TM, I always thought that Nasu had deliberately avoided using the King of Kings title.
what the FUCK?
this is an edit, right?
FSN could've been good if the best masters, Bazett and Klavier Gavin took part in the war. Instead we got teenager angst teh anime. Did we at least get decent Kotomine and Zouken action in it? Nope, it's all in the Heaven's feel shit route.
Just finished the Fate route for the first time since I was always avoiding that one. Now I know why.
>Girls should not fight
>Girls should not wear armor
>Girls should not get hurt
>Girls should not
>Girls should not
Didn't know it was the Tumblr route. And why did I get the feeling that Saber actually likes the UBW/HF Shirou much more.
It's just Fate/Zero manga.
If you want more Enkidu, then read Fate/Strange
>holy grail war with Jesus as Saver and Mohammad as Berserker
To note, they cut that scene out of the F/Z anime, but it was there in the novel. The Enkidu death scene.
Manga put it back in
I only agree for Bazett.