>vanilla doujins never
>Japan sure hates Bismarck.
Surely you jest.
Hopefully everything's right this time.
Incorrect. She's for loving tenderly.
>fire up Fighting Steel
>Iowa vs. Yamato - SHIPSLUT THROWDOWN
>set up the scenario as accurately as possible
>Iowa picks up Yamato around 40,000 yards on radar, cool beans
>Hit percentage: 0.79%
>Close to 20,000 yards blazing away before Yamato turns away under smoke at half-speed after multiple belt penetrations
Morale of the day: FC > all.
What's wrong with Naka-chan? Just because she's an obsolete pile of shit with the firepower of a destroyer doesn't mean she's completely useless, does it?
It's honestly the best (read: only) serious simulator for WWII surface combat ever made. You can download it on the internet freely (game makers gave up the rights to it) and it comes with fan-patches that make it as realistic as possible. It's actually a lot of fun; even has a good dynamic campaign. I figure most of the people in these threads play the actual Kancolle game, so:
HAVE AT'EM CHAMPS
Correction; that's a link to the excellent update/mod pack for the game. The game itself is considered "abandonware," i.e. the original devs aren't defending their copyright claim and don't care to, but you can still buy the actual disk from one or two places if you really want to.
>this thread is about the anime
Right, because that's such an interesting topic to discuss.
>this thread is about the anime
And most people watching the anime probably play the game. Your point is?
only if you let me hug you like image related.
same excuse has been used more than the images i use. find a new one
No problem. Be sure to check the game folder for the "gunnery logs" directory; it keeps a detailed record of every successful gun/torpedo hit, and what happened: dud shell or not, where it hit, whether or not it penetrated, what systems it damaged (if any,) how much structural/flotation damage it did, etc. It's incredible how much detail the game calculates; it even keeps track of turret traverse rates; so bigger turrets take longer to swing into position and fire.
Also, if you meet a Japanese DD convoy at night, for the love of Christ, prepare yourself for Long Lances. Holy fucking shit, they will fuck you up fast if you don't.
>implying video proves anything
There is a pretty decent body of historical evidence to suggest that the Yamato gunners had a hard time hitting shit with their 46cm penis compensators. Yamamoto took the unusual step of formally reprimanding her captain early in the war for the ships' poor performance in gunnery drills. She then went on to practice her gunnery quite frequently, yet at Samar she had trouble hitting anything. She needed to close to nearly point-blank range to kill an immobile escort carrier, which...yeesh. You can blame the smokescreens and whatnot, and that's fair to a point, but other Japanese ships managed to land good killing hits. And of course, the US ships with their fancy radar guns were disturbingly accurate.
I would take an Iowa over a Yamato in anything but a point-blank slugfest.
You just don't get out ebin kancolle thread culture posts, man.
Are you guys really this easy???
Of course. You sure trolled us anon, troll of the century right here.
Do you think the episode airing this week will tie in with the event starting on Friday?
I don't even have you
Even if I did I really don't know what to do with you either.
Were you shitposting while doing so?
Beaver got Mk.37 GFCS later on.
Beaver wins da DD game.
Actually, yeah. Ice cream was one of the cultural imports following the Meiji Restoration that really took off. It was seen as chic and modern, like most western things, but it gained a foothold and never went away. Because ice cream is universally delicious.
Yeah, this sums up the issue rather well: http://www.combinedfleet.com/b_fire.htm
The Yamato had the best optical fire control in the goddamn world, pretty much. Problem is, even at equal ranges, radar FC is almost always better. Even in broad daylight, electronics just have more accuracy, and with a built-in timer the better sets could even pick out it's own ship's shell splashes - accurately enough that other splashes from other firing ships wasn't an issue; the set/FC computer knew exactly when it was supposed to arrive. And, of course, the US had the Mark 1 Fire Control Director, pretty much the best mechanical computer for FC in the world.
The Yamato DID have radar of her own, but it could only direct fire out to about 27,000 yards. The Iowa could theoretically engage her over the horizon without her being able to fire back, around 40,000 yards or so - but your hit chance at that range is, like, 1%. It's even worse for the Yamato, however, so there's theoretically no damn reason not to close range and slug it out; problem is that you'll want to be around 23,000 yards at least before the Iowa's guns can really stand a chance of penetrating the Yamato's belt armor (20 fucking inches.) On the plus side, angle-of-fall is still pretty steep up to 30,000 yards, so you'll still have a decent chance of a plunging-fire hit on her deck (the Yamato's deck armor was just shy of 8 inches thick.) Between 30,000 and 25,000, though, your chances of penetrating her deck (or of getting a plunging hit at all) are lousy and so is your chance to penetrate her belt:
http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/WNUS_16-50_mk7.htm (see the AP table.)
Of course, all this goes right out the window if you've got even a single destroyer to lay a smokescreen for the Iowa - or if the Iowa engages at night, or in bad weather, etc. The Yamato can't engage with radar over 27,000 yareds, and even under that her FC isn't as good, so anything that lets the Iowa close the range is good.
For the first part of your question, watch episode 1 your answer can be found there.
The second part, well,
Japan technically did have Air-to-Sea anti-ship missile. It just had a human guidance system, and does not appear in game.
Who's ready to scratch some flat tops this week?
I was tempted to type a big long screed, an ode to how much you suck, but you WERE smart enough to cut your losses, so I guess you're not a complete idiot.
Yamato's radars weren't integrated into her FCS. The ship pretty much depends on the experience of the gunnery officers for the most part. Her radars could do no more than to tell the crew that there's a battleship about 30k yards away really.
Combined Fleet's comparison goes all over the fucking place and is vastly outdated
Yamato's FCS wasn't bad at all, Robert Lundgren argues Yamato shot very well at Samar sea getting hit rates of around 5% on small carriers in squall weather
Kitakami refuses to be armed with them. Devs said that they will never introduce the gear.
In during Kaiten.
Darkest Hour 4 lyfe
I bet Yuubari would shitpost in /gsg/.
I've played the fuck out of Paradox Games, they're great. But I was wondering more about something that was a lot more intensive in details.
I actually think they reduced some of the micromanagment for HoI3.
>I wish there was a similar this intensive for land-based battles
You are looking for the Combat Mission series. Incredibly realistic and accurate land-battle sim, with a game covering every theater; from company to battalion sized battles (smallest unit is a squad.) They just released the first game of the next generation; entirely new engine and shit - graphics are fucking sick.
acquireone of the prior-gen games (Afrika Korps or Barbarossa to Berlin are good, but even the absolutely ancient Beyond Overlord, without many of the improvements they made to later games, is great) and try it out. Wait till you see the detail lavished on the vehicle stats - make sure "detailed hit info" is on; it's hands-down the most thorough simulator for tank-on-tank combat I've seen. Fucking *everything* is calculated; even the relative angles of the tanks (if your tank is on a slope, the armor's slope is increased by that amount, etc.)
Shit, I misread that page - that applied to German sets, not Japanese. Lemme see if I can find what the Yamato's radar was capable of, FC-wise.
>Yamato's FCS wasn't bad at all, Robert Lundgren argues Yamato shot very well at Samar sea getting hit rates of around 5% on small carriers in squall weather
Oh, of course, I'm not saying the Yamato's FC was bad. She had the best optical fire control in the goddamn world, most likely. It's just that the Iowa's FC, with the radar taken into account, was fucking *insane.*
Ehh...I'm not convinced. If you got hit by one of the Yamato's fuck-off shells, I think you'd recognize the fact, especially if you were in a cruiser or destroyer. The fact that everyone was attributing hits to the smaller guns makes me think it probably was the smaller guns doing the majority of the damage.
So often you second-guess those sorts of witness reports and then find out they were right all along.
>Combined Fleet's comparison goes all over the fucking place and is vastly outdated
How can you have outdated data on AP values? That shit was worked out on mechanical calculators in the 40s, dude.
>I called someone samefag and I was wrong
LIVE WITH YOUR SHAME FORE- oh wait nobody fucking cares dude, it's 4chan
HOI4 is looking mad sexy, I'm pretty hyped for it.
It's less of imprisoning them and giving them a safe place to sit/stand. Sort of like having a mast on your head, or looking like your fashion sense went in Fuso and Yamashiro's direction.
Plus they can whisper in your ear easily if they're up there.
That or you can go full /m/ with your shit and pretend you're a mech. For fun.
Combined Fleet is the name of the website, it's essentially an English IJN fansite. The guy who runs it(Anthony Tully) also co-wrote this book
Which is apperantly a pretty good book according to a guy in the historical gaming thread on /tg/
Lundgren mentions those hits being underwater shots that damaged the hull of the ship through explosions, not direct impacts (for White Plains anyways)
The White Plains reported flooding and the hull plates cracked due to the explosion. She was put out of the rest of the war, needing immediate repairs in the mainland
This is pretty disturbing.
Yea it's looking fucking gorgeous. Even though I'll have to steal my friends laptop for it I'm excited. Can't wait to see what changes they have planned.
I'll check them out, these look great. You've got good taste in simulation, you're my friend anon.
>now quit acting like a basement virgin and fuck off.
There you go, that's how to post on 4chan!
make me, motherfucker
>smaller guns doing the majority of the damage.
That was the case for most battleships, the majority of Battleship fights where rather embarrassing. Makes me wonder how any BB in Kancolle can hit anything within their first 10 rounds
I like how that there's really nothing that could be said about any other DD as mc when you bring up Yukikaze, since everyone else had died...
including Akizuki the new MC (TM)
here's what I was looking for
The battle of Guadacanal and Surigao Strait were determined by main calibre, and these weapons were quite accurate. Kirishima reported two hits on her first salvo, and the next few shots straddled the SoDak
it would help if I included the picture
Robert Lundgren has a few articles on navweaps that are worth checking out, most on the battle of Guadacanal
He also thinks Yamato scored a hit on White Plains from 31km out, which...yeah...I don't know if I believe that. Every other piece of evidence during the war suggests she was not a great shooter.
He backs that up by matching the combat logs of the ships, what are you basing your opinion off of?
She never fired another anti-ship round outside of Samar, what other evidence is there?
Yeah but that's nothing compared to the war in general most fights involving BB's where notorious for poor accuracy, guns jamming and generally running low on ammunition before the battle was even over. That's embarrassing compared to the more successful air craft, submarines and small destroyers
Yamamoto reprimanding the Yamato's captain prior to Midway for her shitty performance in drills. A formal reprimand is the Japanese equivalent of flaying the fucker alive, and considering that Yamamoto was in the BB clique (albeit a forward-thinking, broad-minded member), that he would clip his own guys' wings is a pretty good indication that the Yamato must have really fucked up bad.
She did lots of shooting practice after that, and then the conventional story of Samar is that Yamato hit fuck-all. If this guy writes a book and sends it through the academic wringer, fine, but I'm not really going to buy any internet post that makes that bold a claim.
Well, this is the best thing I could find: http://dreadnoughtproject.org/friends/dickson/Japanese%20Radar%20Short%20Survey.pdf
It really doesn't give much more information on those 10cm radar sets; but given the longer wavelength and the low power, it was probably only useful for ranging, not for detecting traverse movement (i.e, speed and bearing.) Most importantly, from what I found on Japanese fire control systems, the radars were never integrated at all; someone had to twiddle a knob and manually enter the range data. One of the biggest advantages of a radar fire-control system is that, since the data you're receiving is electronic, it can be fed directly into your fire-control computer without obliging an operator to check the scope, eyeball the little lines against the target, and twiddle a dial to input his findings. Ergo, it works a lot faster, which is how destroyers were able to turn and dance around like mad and still put shells on target accuratley, whereas the Japanese just couldn't compute solutions fast enough. Everyone brings that up as a big failing of Japanese FC, but that's not really fair; destroyers are HARD little fucks to hit anyways, even when they're not chasing salvos, and it doesn't reflect as much on a Japanese battleship's ability or inability to hit another battleship at range.
... it DOES mean the Iowa-class could make evasive maneuvers without tremendously compromising her own ability to hit, though, which is worth noting.
(Also, a hit percentage of 5% is more than enough, considering that it only takes a few big shells to really fuck up someone's day - and you're firing a salvo of 9, so you can expect at least two, maybe three hits out of the salvo if you're on target.)
>If this guy writes a book and sends it through the academic wringer
Check out some of his other works too
The funny thing about Battleships where the best a and most successful ones where relics from WW1 i.e.
the Queen Elizabeth class closely followed by the Kongou Class and I believe the Iowa class did Okay?
I don't mind historyposting on kancolle threads at all, but is this even a kancolle thread anymore?
>Yeah but that's nothing compared to the war in general most fights involving BB's where notorious for poor accuracy, guns jamming and generally running low on ammunition before the battle was even over. That's embarrassing compared to the more successful air craft, submarines and small destroyers
Playing Fighting Steel for a while really opened my eyes on that point - with battleships, I'll happily open fire if my hit percentage reads 5% or so. Against cruisers or battlecruisers, that's all I need - I only need two or three salvos to connect to royally fuck them up, and with my big guns, stable gun platform and huge-ass, well-developed FC system, I can hit them with greater accuracy much further than they can hit me. The ships have enough AP ammo for at least a hundred salvos, and they fire about once every thirty seconds, so over the course of an hour you can really ruin someone's day.
With that said; that last fight with the Yamato resulted in me "winning," but my Iowa couldn't finish her off - once she turned away under smoke, my hit percentages went to hell, AND I finally ran out of ammo before I could finish her. Between the two best-protected battleships ever built, it seems a lot would come down to a phenomenally lucky hit to a magazine.
Destroyers and cruisers, on the other hand - well, they have to close in closer to begin with due to their smaller guns, and they were much more likely to be used in night engagements. Without radar, especially earlier-war, you're going to find the enemy around 7,000 to 9,000 yards - basically point-blank fucking range. And that's when shit goes to hell in a hurry; fast and fucking *furious.*
It's just the nature of the beast, really.
Oh hot damn, thank you.
Kancolle is about jerking off to warships. I contend that we're doing that right now.
>not knowing your shipfu's armor thickness
>not knowing your shipfu's guns and FC details
>not knowing how well your shipfu could fuck up another shipfu
You're free to post whatever you want, Chinkfag. At least it's about ships that are in Kancolle and it doesn't quite have the "shitflinging" feel to it historyposting in /a/ often.
I concur. We should post more Kaga.
I wonder if I become a bad admiral, would Kaga scold me?
yeah it's the same reason the prince of wales 'nearly' sank the Bismarck but never got the chance, she hit the Bismarck with 2 critical hits and other hits forcing her to take on water and lose fuel but then her guns began to Jam up and she started to run low on ammunition and before it got going again Bismarck slipped away in the bad weather
at least post something interesting other than house wife level whinging
Am I the only person who has literally nothing against any of the ships? I mean yeah I have my least likable ships but I still have nothing bad to say about them they are just not my favorite
Also I translated the Eugen and Hiei non-H.
It was pretty boring honestly.
>With that said; that last fight with the Yamato resulted in me "winning," but my Iowa couldn't finish her off - once she turned away under smoke, my hit percentages went to hell, AND I finally ran out of ammo before I could finish her. Between the two best-protected battleships ever built, it seems a lot would come down to a phenomenally lucky hit to a magazine.
Case in point: Bismark.
艦隊これくしょん -艦これ- 止まり木の鎮守府 第ハ話
Hopefully no mistakes this time.
This is all that's been in Maoh so far. So I guess I'll be back next month or something.
Ok, I was all on board the first time but every thread, every day is too much. For the sake of Kongou, stop.
That hit wasn't so much lucky as it was just good shooting
The reason it destroyed the Hood was because Hood was a battlecruiser with fuck all for deck armor, allowing Bismarck's shell to penetrate all the way to the magazine
The fact that it has Hiei means that you could probably get Stalker to typeset it, if it isn't too yuri for him(I have not read the translation so I don't know if it is or not).
Did no one see this? Sure it's in chink but at least it's vanilla.