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How come anime films can never rival the quality of true cinematic

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How come anime films can never rival the quality of true cinematic masterpieces? Pic related is the closest movie I can think of, but it's still pretty amateur in comparison to the true masters of film making.
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>>117114304
are you telling me this dosent rival alfred Hitchcock's masterpieces
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>>117114304
why would you pick Kon's worst?
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>>117114304
>amateur
And why do you think that? I'm generally curious as this happens to be one of my favorites.
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>>117114831
>Kon's worst
>Not Paprika
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>>117114304
1.Opinions
2.Does it even matter? You cant enjoy something unless is a "true cinematic masterpiece"?
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>>117114304
>amateur
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oz49vQwSoTE
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>>117114831
So what's his best to you? It sure as hell isn't Paranoia Agent or Paprika.
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>>117114304
>How come anime films can never rival the quality of true cinematic masterpieces?
Thinking like this simply means you haven't seen enough.
Which means this is a recommendation thread in disguise.

That aside, animated films are a lot rarer than live action films, and a lot of this "perceived quality" depends on dumb luck, so the bigger number would always provide for better works.
Of course, I'd hardly say there are no animated film masterpieces that I love more than any live action film out there, but I have to avoid giving you recommendations here, so I won't name any.
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>>117114873
>>117114909
>Not liking Paprika
Though yes it's not his best work, his best work is Perfect Blue
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>>117115061
>his best work is Perfect Blue
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The "End of Evangelion" is better than 80% of Hollywood's movies.
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>>117115262
>only 80%
I didn't like EoE, yet I wouldn't dismiss it SO much. I'd say it's in top 10%, which means it's more or less watchable without having to vomit afterwards.
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>>117115061
No, it's Millennium Actress.
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>>117115262
I have to agree with this.
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>>117114304
>true cinematic masterpieces
Like?
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>>117117461
Battleship
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>>117117508
That god-awful Harlock CGI movie was better than that.
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>>117117606
Then the new Nicholas Cage movie: Left Behind. Absolute masterpiece.
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>>117114873
>>117114909
Paprika is my first & only Kon movie so far (watched it a month ago or so) and I'm relieved to hear it isn't his best. It was nice and had some great scenes but all in all the movie didn't particularly resonate within me.
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>>117117508
>>117117715
The ruse is up
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>>117114831
Nigger, this is Kon's best work hands down. The only thing that could potentially rival it was Dream Machine but sadly he passed away...
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>>117115061
Wrong.
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>>117114304
Millennium Actress is much closer to Japanese film than to anime. I'm quite surprised that anime-only watchers even enjoy it.
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>>117117867
>>117117910
Niggas, you high.

Perfect Blue >>>>> Millennium Actress = Tokyo Godfathers > Paprika
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>>117118005
Millennium Actress > Perfect Blue = Tokyo Godfathers > Paprika
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>>117117983
>anime-only watchers even enjoy it
They probably don't. If somebody really watches only anime, he's way too narrow-minded. However, even if you are not versed in japanese live action movies, you have to capability to enjoy good things if you see them.
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RAA EEE YAA RA RA E YO RA
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>>117118005
Wrong again.

Millennium Actress>Perfect Blue>Tokyo Godfathers>Paprika

In MA, Satoshi Kon's narrative effortlessly blends history and film with his signature themes of dreams and reality was simply fantastic; the whole film felt like one huge love letter to both the animated and cinematic mediums; as evidenced by the two filmmaker characters. However, what remained the most compelling element was how the film explored Chiyoko's story through the ages, carefully painting a tale of an unrequited love, social pressures and a journey through time at the end of one's time. All in all, Millennium Actress is what I would consider to be the crux - the pinnacle - of the animated medium.

If you're too busy longing for entertainment value to dignify how good MA was then keep being delusional anon. Sure it wasn't that enjoyable when I was watching it but I had to let it sink in for me to be able to realize just how good it really was. It's like listening to an album which you don't like much at first but then it grows on you once you spot the little details the musician incorporates into his songs.
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>>117118086
Sure, but it helps if you know something about Japanese cinema.
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>all this arguing about which Kon work is the worst
>no mentions of Paranoia Agent
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>>117118586
>Paranoia Agent is his only work I have seen
I really feel like a pleb. All of his movies are in my backlog but I always start new series and never watch movies. I should start stepping up.
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>>117118749
Just watch the damn movies since they're like 2h long at most.
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>>117114304
>but it's still pretty amateur in comparison to the true masters of film making.

fuck you it is not you dumb cunt
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>>117118586
>I haven't seen Millennium Actress therefore I have to right to state that Paranoia Agent is Kon's best work.
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>>117118905
Nigga I was saying it's one of his weakest works
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>>117118950
Welp, shit I really need to stop skimming everything.
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Reminder.
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>>117114909
Paranoia Agent is easily his worst. He never should have directed a TV anime.

I'm not that anon, but Perfect Blue is my personal favorite.
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Better than 2001.
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>>117118305
My problem with MA is precisely how reality and memories start to blend.
If the point was simulating someone "loosing themselves" in someone else's memories, then it seems excusable at first where the filmmakers start vividly experiencing her retelling, but as the film goes on they become involved to the point of interacting with the setting and later on directly with the actress (no, I don't care enough to remember her name) it becomes overbearing and feels jarring as it happens all too easily; it becomes a exercise in "surrealness" without a catalyst agent to at least make it tolerable, like Mima's stressed and tired-out mind in PB (Unless they did coke before visiting her).
And what about the love story? It never evolves into something moving or even relateable since it seems more like puppy-love/gratitude than anything, and I understand the point of the "it was the chasing that I loved" thing, but it definitively didn't help my stance regarding how bland the love sub-plot was.
The filmmakers, specially the fat guy with his unabashed devotion to the actress, were rather annoying, too.

>If you're too busy longing for entertainment value to dignify how good MA was then keep being delusional anon.
Than you for being a condescending asswipe and assuming why I didn't like MA.
You just needed to tell me to fuck off and go watch a Michael Bay film to complete the picture.
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>>117114304
If hollywood is so much better than Kon than why do they keep ripping off of him.

Inception = Paprika (hotel scene a direct rip)
Black Swan = Perfect Blue (subway scene a direct rip)
Bath scene in Requiem for a dream = bath scene in Perfect Blue (same director as Black Swan)
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This is a Kon appreciation thread, right?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYUFBnAmK28
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>>117119660
Christopher Nolan also admitted to being inspired by Voices of a Star for the creation of his recent film, Interstellar, although it's not Kon related.
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>>117119039
Animation > Stills
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>>117119660
What I loved the most about the whole Black Swan/Perfect Blue thing was that Aronofsky actually had the gal to come out and say that PB had NO influence WHATSOEVER in BS. Fucking hilarious.
BS was shit, anyway.

>Bath scene in Requiem for a dream = bath scene in Perfect Blue
He actually acquired the right to PB to be able to shoot that scene.
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>>117119770
I'll have to watch that again before I go see it. Didn't know about that.
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>>117119660
I heard someone got the rights to make a live action Perfect Blue just to legally rip it off.
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>>117119835
>Buying the rights to a movie just to steal one 10 second scene that has no baring on the plot.
Is anime just really cheap to buy, or is he retarded. Or both?
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>>117119660
Kon dick rider, pls.
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>>117119840
I haven't watched VoaDS, but Interstellar was pretty mediocre.
And no, McConaughey will never pull off a convincing role.
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Watch Shinbo's animes, noob.
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>>117120001
Is it wrong that I genuinely enjoyed it and even cried?
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>>117117461
there's no animated equivalent to something like Citizen Kane
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>>117119952
The scene in Requiem was admitted to by Aronofsky himself, and whoever denies the whole Perfect Blue/Black Swan thing is in complete denial.
Can't say anything about Inception, though.
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>>117120051
>Muh lightning
>Muh camera angles
It was a pretty mediocre film otherwise.
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I'd take GitS over the Matrix any day.
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>>117120084
Inception had too much action in it to be anything like Paprika. Just the underlying ideas were similar, but that happens often.

And yeah, Paprika was better than Inception.
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Obligatory KnK5 and Patlabor 2 mentions

>>117120035
Invariably beautiful art, invariably mediocre stories.
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>>117120037
It's your life, what do I know.

>>117119948
He liked it and it was cheap.
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>implying rebellion is not a cinematic masterpiece
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jURnqQLMNvk
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Let's have a cinegrid thread.
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>>117120051
I do not understand everyone's enormous boner over Citizen Kane. The cinematography was great, but I found the rest of the movie simply passable.
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>>117114304
>cinematic masterpieces
Care to tell me what are those masterpieces?
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>>117120761
see >>117117508 >>117117715
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End of Evangelion as a cinematography piece is incredible, but it's not a stand alone movie like GiTS so there's that
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>>117114304
>Thinking Millenium actress is good
Nope, it is a pretty bland movie with a simple concept and message, repeats itself far to often and ultimately fails to establish both an interesting frame story and an introspection of the MC. Perfect Blue is far better in absolutely every aspect.
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>>117114304

Talking about cinematography in an animation is like talking about the photography of a manga. You are clearly doing something wrong.

>>117118305
>>117118005
>>117117983
Why do we dislike Paprika so much? The animation is fantastic and the blendng of dreams is pretty good.

>>117119404
It's because you're taking the story and comparing it to reality. You need a reason "catalyst" for it to become weird when there doesn't need to be one because as a narrative it operates in the world of fantasy and animation where it doesn't need to be wholly bound by our understanding. It's a lot like an experimental film in that manner.

>>117119812
>This will never be completed with a proper release
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>>117120906
People like you are exactly the reason why there are no anime movies that match top tier live action movies. You see a well drawn scene with some pretty colours and think this is what makes a great film, when in fact it's rather the opposite. Most of the time flashy stuff like for example the 5th shot in the left row of your picture is only used in shallow movies that try to appeal with pretty pictures instead of actual good directing, which is usually far more subtle.

Oh and before you get me wrong, I like the Haruhi movie, but that's due the story, the directing is average at best.
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>>117121678
>Why do we dislike Paprika so much?
Not any of the anons you replied to but the story was just bonkers. Plus there was no convincing link between the cops movie based backstory and the dream theme.
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>>117120147
>Oshii's visual masturbation and pseudo-intellectual philosophical rambling
>good
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>>117121799
I'm going to argue that you don't know what you're talking about since there are a variety of reasons that films have been lauded and put on pedestals. Things like Warhol's blowjob or empire are nothing but imagery. Same thing for Koyaanisqatsi. Two or three Things I know about her is considered a radical and influential film, but it has barebones directing or even story.

I don't necessarily disagree with you that some animations might rely too much on simpl background eye-candy, but animation as a medium is characterized by it's own idiosyncrasies and rating of them should not be the same as other types of film.
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>>117121987
>visual masturbation
That's a serious insult that means something.
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>>117122278
Reminds me of "forced animation"
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>>117122386
I don't recognize this but it reminds me on Shin-chan.
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>>117122466
of*
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>>117122466
It's Shin-chan.
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Are their no existing cinegrids of Angel's Egg, or am I going to have to make one?
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>>117120513
>Movie set the standard for modern cinematography.
>People praise it for that
>people who never saw the movie hear about praise
>they assume that must means it's the greatest movie ever
Thread posts: 84
Thread images: 20


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