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You are currently reading a thread in /x/ - Paranormal

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Shills, demons, and arrogant anons welcome; but only to spectate. Scientists, magicians, monks, scholars, mathematicians, philosophers, free thinkers, etc. pious or neutral: Get in here!

I'll try to get right to the point, it is widely accepted that there must be "good" and "bad," a neutrality that is existence. The main question I would like to ask you is how do we divert the "bad" away from active sentience - completely. And by completely, I mean no possible repercussions on humanity. I have been speculating on the principles behind converting negativity to neutrality with minimal to no effect on the positive, and obviously been having some trouble in making a practical conclusion. Come speculate with me, and present your own ideas to the most supportive and non bias community of Anonymous beings in existence.

Inb4 non /x/; we are incorporating both real world and paranormal values in this discussion

Inb4 non-tested or un-testable conclusions

Inb4 Black Tourmaline
>>
Good and bad are human constructs, and subjective most times. Much like moral ideas such as right and wrong.

Since they're always subject to interpreter's bias, there really isn't a way to get rid of "bad".

Consider the following:
>murder
To take someone else's life is generally considered bad. Yet we can decide that murdering a criminal is a good thing, so we get things like the death sentence. So murder is ambiguous, depending on situation in which it occurs it is either good or bad.

Refer to mill's utilitarianism for a better sense of how good and bad is decided (much law is actually based on his premises).

This is without even going into the moral "right or wrong" aspects of murder.
>>
i will be posting in this thread.

basically what i am fighting for are these 3 ideals:
truth, freedom, love.
>>
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>>17319897

But we don't need murder, essentially.

We are equipped to optimize reality yet we aren't currently reaching our potential, in my opinion... And I don't mean potential as a limitation.

>>17319930

Welcome anon, care to explain what you do or how you fight for these ideals? Maybe include what you believe others that have the same goals should be doing.
>>
The problem of evil in humans is the result of our evolutionary history. "Evil" and "bad" are sometimes advantageous or even necessary. Consider when one is forced with the choice between starvation and murder / theft. Those who are virtuous die off, those who are not survive, and so evil persists.

As social animals being too "evil" / antiscocial / psychopathic would be unadvantageous, and so we're a bit good and a bit bad.

The only way to completely eliminate evil is to develop situations where it is always unnecessary and unadvantageous, where it is truly an act of self-destruction, and cooperation for mutual benefit always wins. This is tremendously difficult because social structures, traditions, and ideologies can be very persistent.
>>
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>>17319996

So what do we do?
>>
>>17319897
Good and bad are human constructs, and subjective most times. Much like moral ideas such as right and wrong.

Like chaos and order.
HAIL ERIS
>>
>>17319961
basically i preserver morality in people and i dont do drugs or smoke or something like that. i also dont hurt people irl. i am a pretty nice guy. people keep hurting me but thats just something i have to live with. if people hurt me, i dont attack them back.
>>
>>17319961
We aren't equipped to optimize reality. We're equipped to survive and breed. So long as you reproduce you are essentially living up fully to your evolutionary potential.

Murder isn't necessary? When it comes to necessity much of human nature isn't necessary. Love isn't necessary either. You don't need love to reproduce. You dont need anger. Etc etc and this is taking into account the whole optimizing reality and potential thing.
>>
>>17320094
That's just being pathetic. There's an acceptable level of being a pacifist. You have to defend yourself or stand up for your ideals at some point.
>>
>>17319750
If that illustration is supposed to represents polarity wouldn't having exclusively positive attributes draw negatives like a bitch?

Now the nature of reality is nothing like that obviously, but to cut to the chase in such a scenario the solution would seem to be to acquiring purely negative traits, but in fact the solution should be creating a "dummy" positive pole away from humanity that draws potential negatives safely away. This has nothing to do with anything, I just felt the need to address it.
>>
>>17320358
>gives the fucking solution
>says it has nothing to do with anything
Erm...
>>
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>>17320042

>>17320332
> Love isn't necessary

>>17320358
Black Tourmaline
>>
>>17320339
which i do.
>>
step 1: ban food science. they are selling shit that makes people sick

step 2: ban psychiatrists. they havent cured one person

step 3: ?
>>
>>17319996
Basically this.

Evil can't be stopped. It will always exist somewhere in some form, but it is possible to blot it out.
>>
>>
From a scientists perspective you have a ton of terms without clear definitions. Your statement is pretty much a vague description of an even vaguer system.
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>>17319750

I will have you know, I am a chaotic neutral shill half-demon and I am posting in this thread to say that their is no subjective positivity or negativity, and of one is decided negativity can never be eliminated.

Unless you take the shortcut and lobotomize yourself.
>>
What we need to do is basically create a "safe space" as big as a city. Then make it self sufficient and abundant with resources and positivity.

I always liked the idea of a massive skyscraper made out of recycled materials with solar, wind, and geothermal energy. A lot of open glass windows with light colored interiors with beautiful scenery on every floor.

There would be floors committed to classrooms and auditoriums for spiritual history and earth conservation and physical energy healing techniques.

Around the skyscraper would be a very fast public transportation network connecting people to various gardens and futuristic apartment complexes.

Everything in this city would be as self sufficient as possible, and there would eventually be dozens of these mega sanctuaries all over the country. My first location would be an inhospitable desert like in between california and arizona. It would send a message that we are not bound to certain areas and can now start spiritual and ecological healing of the world.

This was my powerball dream for the jackpot, but not a surprise how that turned out.
>>
It's a lot easier to try and add "good' than it is to remove "bad". The best course in my mind is to help people out in the hopes that they learn to help others as well.
>>
>>17319750
I'm not convinced that 'good' and 'bad' exist in nature. As others have said, they are human concepts to describe the parts of experience that we do and do not like. If murder/ killing is intrinsically 'bad' then surely every predatory creature on Earth is evil. How far do we take it, even herbivores destroy life to survive. There is a range of enjoyability of experiences, from total ecstasy to absolute horror. Whatever our experiences are we grade them by this scale, being relatively socially empathic creatures by our evolutionary nature, we extend this scale of 'goodness' to the experiences of others. This is problematic though as our experiences are not consistent across the population, so our scales are not synchronised. This means one mans joy can be another mans horror. Should we then aim to align our experiences, so that we may agree on what is good or bad? But surely that would hamper individuality. Does this matter?

Even if we were to align our experiences, good and bad would still exist, in our minds at least. If we were to remove the 'bad' components of experience, then surely what are currently 'good/ neutral' experiences become the new 'bad'. Surely then the answer lies in responsible exposure to 'bad' to keep your everyday experiences in perspective. Is this why people are into gore?
>>
>>17320630

It will take a lot more than wishful thinking to get there.
>>
>one animal on one planet in one solar system in one galaxy is a bit shit
>the universe needs healing
niet
>>
>>17320668
It would have to be an effort from many people, with clear rules on where any profit goes. Investors would have to become donators, to prevent any self interested people from poisoning the well.

But hey, this is just random thoughts going on in my head. I havent even put anything on paper yet.
>>
>>17320529
>step 3: ?

You kiss, and hold her tightly.
>>
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>>17320487
Different anon here. I'm interested in how you implement your pursuit in life. I believe the three things you mentioned are some of my most important values as well but it is clear we both see a different path. I do drugs, I am a pacifist in the sense of I am not aggressive.

I fight for truth by laying skepticism upon everything and leaving no argument inarguable (while still agreeing on the best possible answer with the information available). With that I have created as truthful a world view as possible and always seek to improve it.

I love every man, animal, plant, rock, and everything else in the universe. That includes myself, which I love being. Sometimes i get angry, depressed, or whatever, but that is all part of what I love. So is happiness. It's a sense of brotherhood with all things.

A fight for truth and a fight for love together is a fight for freedom to me. I love therefore am not aggressive, but I am free and will not be pushed around. The truth allows me to make proper decisions without breaking the principle of love or sacrificing my freedom.

So I think there is no good or evil. There is man, there are rocks, there is space. All are free. All are free to fight for freedom. All are free to take it away. I think being is healing enough for the universe.
>>
>>17320666
>murder isn't bad
>trying to cause dissonance
>enjoys horror
>references to gore
>666

NICE try stan
>>
>>17320630
Sounds like a dystopia. Not surprised you bought a powerball ticket.
>>
>>17320772
>>17320772
>>
>>17319750
>The main question I would like to ask you is how do we divert the "bad" away from active sentience - completely. And by completely, I mean no possible repercussions on humanity.
Genocide.

When you realize consciousness can terminate, you'll stop asking why.

Loneliness.
>>
>>17320780
I bought 50, actually.
>>
>>17320529
Underrated post

>>17320578
The point is to push it somewhere else where it won't affect anyone. But where... And how?

>>17320589
NASA... what the fug is this?

>>17320606
>ton of terms without clear definitions

There are dictionaries for that.

>>17320626
I'm post lobotomy, your argument is invalid.

>>17320630
Yes, we need a better means than the Powerball.

>>17320656
Severely underrated, how did this not get any response yet.

>>17320666
Okay Satan, I'll play... First of all lions don't know how to grow quinoa or buckwheat, and nothing besides meat will sustain them. This doesn't make them evil... And herbs aren't the same as flesh and blood, they do not experience pain like we do. And I'm sure those who enjoy murder would not enjoy being murdered. Individuality? You make me laugh... You mean to say we have individuality at this moment?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ftDjebw8aA

In our minds is the only place these evils should exist. We can draw our happiness from the past, and it's relativity to the present. "New bad" won't happen because there will always be old bad, of course.

>>17320741
>the well

>>17320758
lol

>>17320766
>Different anon

Stop lying, the person you described would say you're a different anon when really you're a same

>>17320803

Come here anon... I... *hugs*

>>17320780
>>17320858

Read an essay on the lottery today, shits evil.
>>
>>17319750
>away from active sentience
You mean to rip your own sentience away?
>>
>>17320780
It's only a dystopia if you can't leave, dear.

Wish I wasn't banned from Vegas.
>>
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>>17320927

No.
>>
>>17320933
Right, and I envision this with fast transportation to locations all over the country (and later world) through a railway. (That scifi shit that goes like 1000mph+)

The only restriction on residency would be who to let in, since resources would be limited due to the nature of a self contained city. People would be free to leave as they wished.
>>
>>17321006
>resources would be limited
Your transportation system sounds like a drag.
>>
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>>17319750
just a heads up from an arrogant anon
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>>17321154
That's not arrogance; it's realism.
>>
>>17321135
The worldwide transportation system would likely need to be powered separately from the city, and fed power at energy plant locations spaced evenly around the area. Im not sure how big the solar fields would need to be to power a super train or if its possible to give the train a "boost" at these plants so that it may get to the next station.

Im hardly a scientist or engineer (if you havent noticed) and Im really riding on tbe belief that we will find more and more efficient ways to create energy through solar.

A lot of the tech hasnt been invented yet sadly.
>>
>>17321190
>Im hardly a scientist or engineer
It shows.

"Just use more energy," is the philosophy of a decadent.
>>
>>17321202
Obviously "just" more energy wouldn't cut it. You'd need to find a way to reduce the amount of energy that the system would use, either through lighter materials or a newly invented system all together.

Again, i haven't put any of this on paper to think about details. I just know that a rail system would be neat.
>>
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>>17321154

Nah, this.
>>
>>17321269
Where can I get a hat like that?
>>
>>17321492

MS Paint :-)
>>
this is for OP

http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/matthew-kjv.html
>>
>>17320332
Human nature (biological drive for propagation, psychological drive for social acceptance) is not the last word on our purpose. That's up to the individual. When you are secure in your fulfilment of the above drives, you can more easily and purely pursue ambitions beynd those of simple animals.
>>
>>17321498
Where does she live?
>>
>>17321869
In every house that has Windows.
>>
>>17319897
This. Wolf killing a rabbit can be good or bad only if you side with one or the other, but otherwise it's just the way that life is.
>>
>>17319750
first off
>implying the universe needs healing
everything is as it is and as it is supposed to be.

>The main question I would like to ask you is how do we divert the "bad" away from active sentience - completely. And by completely, I mean no possible repercussions on humanity.
You can't
>I have been speculating on the principles behind converting negativity to neutrality with minimal to no effect on the positive, and obviously been having some trouble in making a practical conclusion
hate to break it to you, but there is no conclusion. Everything will remain in balance. Neutrality is the existence of that balance of positive and negative. Both will be equaled out on the large scale of things. You can't destroy or create either positive or negative, only convert, but even then, it will always convert back, and back again, like a pendulum.

Such arrogance of man, to think you can upset and warp the balance of nature just to cater to your hedonism. Life will always have a mix of good and bad, that's how it's always been, and that's how it will always be. It's best to just accept that fact and deal with it.
>>
>>17320358
what if WE are the dummy positive pole?
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>>17319750
pro tip.

the universe doesn't care.
>>
>>17320529
>step 1: ban food science. they are selling shit that makes people sick
[citation needed]. If you are referring to the whole "GMOs cause infertility" bullshit, you should know this comes from a guy who also claimed that gmos make hair grow on your tongue. Not to mention that we've been able to produce much more food than ever before much more efficiently than ever before thanks to "food science". Go choke on your tofu or something if you actually buy this crap.

>step 2: ban psychiatrists. they havent cured one person
Yes, let's ban the profession dedicated to the study of our brains, consciousness, and understanding how we work on a fundamental level. Let's disregard that many mental illnesses are all but impossible to "cure", but can be treated effectively. As someone who has an adoptive brother with schizophrenia, and has been living a fulfilling, successful life thanks to his psychiatrists treatment and finding a combination of medicines that make his symptoms non-existent while he's taking them, I say fuck you.

>step 3: ?
Step 3 is remove the helmet wearing, window licking retards from the gene pool. You should start with yourself, friend. google "exit bag" and use it.
>>
I keep having the same weird dream.

I am sitting in a kind of roman ampitheater with a crowd watching demons torture people

I go down and try to reason with them, convince them to see the error of their ways, explain the psychology behind what they are doing, some philosophy about the sanctity of life.

I argue as best I can, but they snap at me and mock me, they remind me of the bad things I have done and use that to eradicate the notion I am some hero standing up to them, they won't stop

I can try to stop them, but it requires that I put in a herculean effort and try to compete with them in terms of gaining power and strength, if I tried this I would barely be at a middling level compared to beasts like this

the few good people in the audience are just crying and shocked, there is no way I can team up with them

I sit back down and sink back into demoralization and confusion
>>
>>17322839
you might wanna actually research dickface.

> mercury known to cause mental illness since 500BC and they give it to 3.2billion. [dartmouth.edu tox history mercury]

> the founder of american psychiatry instutitute drove around and gave lobotomies to people (making them a retard) for 40 years with an ice pick for $25 before he was stopped, arguably they had mercury poisoning or a haunting. since then theyve tried shock convulsions, poison, tying people down 20 hours a day, drugging them and locking them away, and other bizarro sugeries. (Before that they tried hand crank drills to the skull to drain the blood away from the brain)
>>
>>17322995
google lobotomobile

also prove god isnt trying to kill everyone. smoke some pesticide cigarettes, drink some aspartame, live in a house with aspestos lining and painted with lead paint. oh and yes i did mean gmo fucking cereal and corn syrup and soda.
>>
>>17320772
If murder is intrinsically bad then god is more evil than anything else in existence. He murdered damn near the entire planet in the deluge myth. Not to mention a plethora of people after that.

So pick your poison.
>>
>>17321750
Its the last word on evolutionary purpose, applied to the species as a whole. The individual properties of the species is irrelevant.
>>
>>17322995
was actually already aware of that. My question is, so fucking what? nothing I said had anything to do with mercury, and why does a single quack mean an entire field of study should be abandoned? By that logic, let's ban ALL doctors since there have been a few that were serial killers or otherwise psychopathic, or because graves had to be robbed for people to learn about anatomy. Let's ban all scientists since a few of them invented the atomic bomb. Let's ban vaccines since some of them USED to use mercury.

You might wanna make some logical sense before spewing shit and cum out of your disgusting mouth, you backwards thinking faggot.
>>
>>17319750
Evil is entropy incarnated as an ideal.
>>
>>17320094
Learn to defend yourself
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>>17319750
>heal the universe
What, on God's green Earth, the flying fuck, does that have to do with the natural ability of a sentient being to experience negativity?
>>
>>17319750
>I'll try to get right to the point, it is widely accepted that there must be "good" and "bad," a neutrality that is existence

>grey jedi mindwank bullshit

It's not widely accepted. Stop getting your philosophy on morality and neutrality from Star Wars and Dungeons And Dragons.

The concept of balance when viewing morality has always been a really retarded idea that makes no actual sense. If you can explain to me the horrors that would happen if good was to become the greater force on this planet then you could change my mind.
>>
>>17322480
I-it's not like I TRY to talk in riddles or anything.
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