"It is a mistake to consider any belief more liberated than another. It is the possibility of change which is important. Every new form of liberation is destined to eventually become another form of enslavement for most of its adherents. There is no freedom from duality on this plane of existence, but one may at least aspire to choice of duality."
-Peter J. Carroll, Liber Null and Psychonaut
"Chaosophy" is a meta-belief that all beliefs are tools for power. "Nothing is true, everything is permited" means that all possible interpretations of reality(religions, magick systems,etc.) are valid and every way of manipulating reality works as long as you belive in it.
Chaos magick primary teachings are probably familiar to most magicians. The basics of practical works are
Warning: It's very easy to get crazy with this, so do yourself a favor and don't take it too seriously
You can ask me any questions on this thread. (I might take some time to answer)
FIVE MODELS OF MAGICK
A way to classify all types of magick and anything supernatural. But it's not always precise. Trying to create an explanation for an event based on each model is the best exercise to practice the chaos magick way of thinking.
>The Spirit Model
This model includes any magick that utilizes the concept of spirits or independent entities and interacts with them through various means and with individual purpose. It's used a lot. It includes gods and goddess as well as angels, demons, saints, ghosts and everything in between.
Can include: prayer, ritual, offerings, altars, mediumship, dream communications, dream magick, commanding and bartering relationships, etc.
The energy model takes the view that all things in existence are made up of energy, and that energy can be directed and utilized.
Can include: psionics, chakra work, kundalini, tai chi and other martial arts, reiki, auras, etc.
Focuses on the magick as happening in the mind sphere. This model is constantly growing as our understanding of the human brain does.
Can include: meditation, trance, hypnotism, neuro-linguistic programming, use of sigils, traditional ritual, study of consciousness, etc.
The information model starts with the premise that all things in existence are comprised of information. Even energy itself is coded to exist. The human is not simply a processor of information, but also an active nexus of convergence between programmed existence and conscious reality manipulation.
Can include: telepathy, remote viewing, cybernetic modeling, study of memetics, study of dynamic systems, sociology, anthropology, coding, marketing, virality, etc.
The Meta-Model of magick is where Chaos Magick fits nicely. It is the conscious application of any of the above models, and indeed, any established paradigm or system. Often utilizing a meta-model approach to ones own personal outlook and practice results in an idiosyncratic and eclectic belief structure peculiar to the individual. This differs from the traditional scope of eclectic magick as it allows not only synthesis between belief structures, but also a deeper, more personal internalization.
"The Pact is a vehicle for the persuit of the Great Work of magic and the pleaures and profits attendant upon this quest. The Pact also acts a psycho-historic force in the battle for the Aeon."(Peter Carrol)
Iluminate of Thanatheros (IOT) is an active international occult organization and magickal pact created by the authors of main Chaos Magick books.
I don't particularly recommend joining them. Why?
>On the first rank you are required to study the same short book(Liber MMM), experiment and make a detailed report absolutely every day for 6 months.
>Members have to offer themselves as a shield for magickal attacks against IOT, and provide energy for them. (Non-members can actually steal "the inexhaustible sources of Chaos or the field of power of the IOT").
>Their information is limited. Everything is archived, but they won't share, not even with their own members depending on their rank.
>Other stuff that would just make the thread unecessarily big.
There are good things about them i suppose. Their huge archive looks useful. imagine a gigantic magickal diary with varied experience from multiple highly trained individuals.
And their influence over the "battle for the Aeon" looks positive.
TOUGHFORMS AND SIGILS
Sigils are viewed in Chaos Magick as a way to make your desire go to the subconscious mind where it has the power to shape reality.
There are many method of creating a sigil. The point is that it should be very hard to discover the initial intent of the sigil. Consult existing sigil for reference.
Example method 1:
>Write what you want to happen starting with "My Will is to"
>Remove repeating letters
>Make all letters on the alphabetical order.
Example method 2:
>Draw what you want to happen, a symbolic simple representation of the desired event.
>Distort it to make unrecognizable.
>Add details to make it look more "magickal"
Toughtforms are present in many magical systems. The difference on Chaos is that you can use anything, even thoughforms that weren't ever created intentionally.
Want to run faster? Summon Sonic the Hedgehog. Want to train battle on the Astral Plane? Son Goku will help. Programing test? Spock's logic will do the trick.
Simplified thoughform creation guide:
-Decide shae, name, function and sigil for the thoughform
-Draw the sigil anywhere, or keep its image strong on your mind.
-Give it energy.(methods include blood, orgasm, willpower, etc.)
You might not see an obvious strong relation to chaos fast, but Principia Discordia is a great way to learn the chaotic way of thinking.
Especially the the part of metaphysics that the book recomends you skip. And the humor helps you on not taking chaos magick too seriously.
The Church of Subgenius also has similar content.
Probably the best books for a begginer to magick are chaos magick books. They already are on the Sticky downlod, if not they are easy to find.
I recommend them in the following order:
>Liber Null and the Psychonaut by Peter Carrol (It's full of pictures for the lazy reader)
>Liber Kaos by Peter Carrol (Extra new content)
Then only if you really want more…
>Condensed Chaos by Phil Hine
>Prime Chaos by Phil Hine.
tfw you see someone recommending the principia before illuminatus
You should always read in chronological order, no?
Does anybody have anything to to say on the subject?
>Peter Carrol is shit
Is that all you took from this?
Just as a heads up, for those interested, the Principia Discordia is online for free, and I personally believe that anyone, at any stage of life that at least includes functional literacy, can benefit from perusing it.
As it's only about 84 short pages in length, it's also an easy read, and rather like the Book of the Subgenius, there's no reason to read it in page order, cover to cover, the first time if you don't want to. In fact, I personally believe it's a great idea, if you can get a print copy or just print out the source from the website and make one, to just carry the PD around and, when the mood strikes, just flip it open to a random passage.
Everything has its place. If you were not born with gifts it means you are not meant to have them.
You have told yourselves this is not so. And so you dabble in things you shouldn't and give yourself over to Satan's spirit because you are seeking things that doesn't belong to you just as he seeks things that are not meant for him.
Its 0 hour and both sides are actively recruiting.
Now is not the time to be fucking with this shit.
>thinking masons deemed satanism was bad
Boy. The whole point of masonry is to reconsile Satan and god - nothing that Lucifer does could ever be completely satanic as his power comes from god.
For starters tho there is no such thing as "my" truth. There is "the" truth. By very definition if something isn't true it means it is false.
There is -the- truth, and then there are lies. No shades of gray.
The problem is that you are unable to comprehend -the- truth because it is on a scale you are not built to comprehend.
You wish to know the truth?
Individuality is a lie. Each human being is but a cell in the body of the species. Each cell has a different purpose, but they all function for the goal of maintaining the body.
Individuality causes these cells, or individuals, to be in places that they are not meant to be
What is it called when cells of one part of the body start showing in another part?
It is a disease sent by God to make us understand what is going on with us, it is why we have the troubles that we do.
I have much much more to share if you care to hear.
And this is why most of these books should've never found their way to the day light. I would have used other words though.
You could, I am sure of that. What I know though is that if you have found something in yourself you can not explain it to others. So if you have or do not have an answer to what troubles me is irrelevant as long as I don't get it myself.
Like Crowley hides his goods between the lines, the truth can not be written in clear words.
It is possible, however unlikely, that this may be a trick. It is up to each person to decide. However without any reasonable evidence to the contrary i must operate under the assumption that i am indeed God's son because to not do so would be in comtempt of legitimate revelations from God
If it is not so it will not be so. But if say...it just kind worked out that way and many prophecies of which it spoke were fulfilled 3 and 4 times over in different ways?
Would you believe it then?
So it is with cain and able as it is today, There are two groups of people.
God looks down on favor with the efforts of one group and not with favor at another.
For the purpose of making you understand -why- it is bad is because he has blinded you so you could see the stark contrast between yourselves and the almighty and how foolish and stupid you truly are
Without divine intervention humanity would kill itself off but for the sake of the few our species is being saved from itself.
Then fucking do it! I've never been afraid of being proven wrong or taking what's coming my way. And shut the fuck up about "opening your ears to listen", stupid little bitch nigger not knowing fuck about shit. Like seriously, what if you were genuinely talking to someone that knows more than you about occult/religion/whatever the fuck you think you're an expert on?
You're just a regular fuck like the rest of us. You're not special and deep down inside you know you're nothing but a retarded faggot on /x/, trying to get other retarded faggots like me to suck your "messiah" dick. On an image board of all places. Yeah, totally, you're a regular font of wisdom.
I startet my magic career with chaos magic, but honestly the results were.. Chaotic.
If I need work done on the material plane I now do my own hermetic-shamanic thing using both planetary forces and spirit allies, and it works like a charm. For spiritual matters I consult the angels using the techniques outlaid in Gateways through Stone and Circle, or just meditate while focusing on contacting the specific being.
No, prophecies are shit. Because then that would mean no free will and a set future path. Unless the path can be changed and the future altered. But then, what's the significance of prophesy then? It would become so mundane and of little importance, kinda like inferring how shit will go based off logic and reasoning. Everyone can "prophecy" if they try hard enough.
Tell me then, what am I other than the sum total of my experience? You seem to know, and I would sincerely like to. I know I've been effin and jeffin this whole time, so excuse the way I communicate please.
The time for prophecies is over. The time is now. I am here to educate you on why you fuck up.
Gods name is he that causes to become.
That means that whatever he wants to happen will just sort of work out that way
He is a being far beyond or means to comprehend and it has taken this long for it to finally sink in.
It comes down to the reality of the feelings of your own importance.
If you call yourself a dick, your probably a dick (thats ok we need dicks)
If you say you dont like someone because they think they are better than you. Guess what? It means they -are- better than you
You didn't need to put everyone through this shit to figure put "don't be an asshole to other people"
"Tell me then, what am I other than the sum total of my experience?"
You are the sum total of your past, current and future experience. From the beginning of time till the end of it. However, your meatsuit only remembers the present. Billions of years in the future you are calling back through time, shouting "wake up!" And your past selves are watching, eyes filled with pride at all you have already attained.
God is the direct source of the emotions such as love and inspiration itself and every single thing that is considered good.
A big problem is that while the purposes of God never change the means he uses in order to work them are endless and chooses the easiest way he possibly could to cure us
Science is a gift because it helps us better understand how he works
The very purpose of the internet is so i could reach everyone with my message.
According to your own laws i could declare myself the sole owner of science and the internet.
Do you not see how foolish it is to think like this?
But what has led you to take this information as truth?
Why do you feel like you can talk to me like you know me? What makes you so sure of your opinions of other people? Why the importance on "feelings"? What is a "feeling" to you? Regular emotions or a thought compounded with emotions? What or who is God to you? What is its nature and function? Why? Turtles all the way up and down? Why does your God function the way it does? What's the importance of it being the way it is, and not already perfect and done with? Why ANYTHING you've said? Why? What is your reasoning for not thinking that we are nothing but an evolved primate on a regular planet and after death our consciousness ceases like before conception/birth?
I just want to learn....
Holy shit, what a neat thought! Oh how I wish I could write something beautiful involving that. Something that would make Ray Bradbury proud. Something that would resonate with anyone that wanted to read it.
Is God the inspiration and sense of love a serial killer has towards his "craft"? What is good? I know the golden rule is a good way to teach people empathy, but what if a person has a warped sense of things? What is objectively good? What about that episode of rick and morty with the space fart? Was his idea of good really just that? Extinction of all life in the universe to protect the larger multiverse?
I get this a lot, and it's not entirely comfortable. My mom used to tell me to drink a glass of water and see what happens. She's weird as fuck. Maybe distract your mind with something or an activity. Or make yourself emote on purpose. I hope you have a good night c:
According to my own laws? What laws? What made you think that? The owner of the Internet? What the fuck are you talking about? Please, talk to me like the regular fucking human that you are. Stop with this rp bullshit, it's cringy to read and no one believes you. Just fucking TALK to us and maybe we'll have a pleasant discussion. I really wanna talk to you, you seem interesting as fuck. But it's really hard to understand, let alone swallow, anything you're trying to say. Your cryptic mystic rp theatre talk is stunted and fractured as shit, SO I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THE FUCK YOU'RE EVEN TRYING TO SAY.
Make your goddamn point.
But what has led you to take this information as truth?
I am using the scientific theory. I wss left with a very strong impression that i am the chosen and have a set of requirements i would expect to see given this is true. One of these theories is that no matter what people say, every last person will know i speak truth because they will be made to feel like it is truth to their very core. It will be undeniable to every last person on earth. Those that i say i am the antichrist are ones not acceptable to God because they can't handle the truth of what they are.
Why do you feel like you can talk to me like you know me?
I know God and God knows all people. Therefore i know everyone by proxy
Single questions at a time please. There is a lot of ground to cover
How do you know what that would feel like? Don't freak yourself out needlessly. Unless you're sick or hurting your body (dehydration). Drink that glass of water and calm down. I'm here if you are getting stressed out. C'mon anon :D let's talk about spoopy stuff. What was this thread about again? Yeah, let's talk about that c:
The very foundation in which you built your civilization was built in 400A.D.
At the time you could not own any land because the system was that only those that create can own a thing.
Because people did not create the earth but God did and it was on the false assumption that the pope was God's representative thst things such as land rights were born.
If this is true i say i am Gods representative and every square inch of this rock belongs to me and only me.
Infact not just the earth i lay claim to all of physical reality, every star, every planet, everything.
You see how foolish this is?
You know what I think? I think you're a regular person being frustrating either on purpose or accidently. I don't really care. But it kinda hurts me inside to think that you need or want people to feel that way about you (the whole feel it inside that you're the Messiah or whatever). It hurts me inside to think that you'll need to keep deluding yourself just to keep up your pretenses. It hurts me inside that you need this so badly, and literally no one will give it. God, why can't people just be healthily happy? What a stupid question I ask...
I do not want this. You use your standards to judge me but the basis you use for rendering such judgements is flawed.
I am doing what i am doing, not because i want to but because my God requires it of me.
I just want to play fallout 4
Where are your sources that at 400 a.d. only those that could create could own land? What are you trying to say? I'm so lost. My civilization? Who the fuck do you think you're talking to? I don't think god created the earth. I personally don't believe there is a god. I could be wrong. But with everything I learn and see for myself, it keeps me locked in agnostic atheism. But if I'm wrong, oh well I guess I'll learn in the end. Better to just be the best person you can be, for the benefit of yourself and others.
Belief in something does not make it so. There is only truth, all else is lies. Its as simple as that.
You do not realize the sheer gap that has been come to be between you and i. You live in a world built of lies and it always leads you to frustration and ultimately failure. My way is just and true and there is none of you who will come to be able to challenge it.
I am an arbitrator. I am here to inform you of what is and what isn't. It is not my responsibility to hash out the details it is your responsibility to search and see it is so.
No it isn't. It's not my responsibility to give thought to any crack pot bullshit. There's a wonderful video on YouTube by Terence Mckenna called 'Why Most People Are Idiots'. You are a terrible troll, or a sick idiot.
Not all ideas operate on equal footing.
Im throwing the very meaning of life before your feet and in your ignorance you have mistaken me for something I'm not.
Very soon all peoples eyes will be opened and every last person on this miserable rock will come to understand the truth of the matter and will feel great shame.
U mad brah? My stupidity causes me pain too, I wish I didn't grasp just how much I don't know about everything. I'm sure a lot of people would like to know everything, I'm sure it's not just me. Are you mad because you don't own fallout4 and robocraft? I can totally gift you a steam key dude, just ask c:
It is a fool's errand to try to convince someone out of something that they WANT to have faith in.
It's weird that after one conversation with me, you're sayin shit like "every last person on this miserable rock will learn and be ashamed".
Your behavior is so vivid and interesting to observe. I've enjoyed my conversation with you c:
Not meant to be there according to what? The bible? Lolololol ok, the world is also only 2-4000 years old.
>"What is it called when cells of one part of the body start showing in another part?"
It is not a disease... you sir are clearly uneducated. The body shares cells of the same type in many different places. The basis of all cells are stem cells.
Just stop. I believe your preacher has got a little bit too far into your mind. If you would take the time to read any of the material OP has posted, it describes people like you perfectly as transcendentalists, but you're the worst kind of one, one the subscribes to a secular god.
So many shills, shitposters, trolls and christfags in one fucking thread.
Ignorant plebs can't understand chaos magick.
Even most occultists need a system to work with.
We're living in a dark era.
I'm glad this thread is still up. Hail Eris.
All this thread says is to go find some psychology books, learn how to get under people's skin, hide behind proxy metaphors and find some way to really have fun with the whole process because this is life and death. It's in the name: chao-sophy, the study of being untraceable.
Do you agree with my assessment?
turns away from Abrahamic good spirits
to worship Abrahamic bad spirits instead
Your own words betray you. It is the way of things. All men are given certain positions by God but you do not like your positons so you make up lies to say it is not true but it is
You come to hate all who have been given greater possitions than yourself and have claimed the authority to rule the world with it but you are theives and take what does not belong to you.
God has tolerated this for a time but that time has passed. Let all nations open up their storehouses of secret and supressed information and let the world decide if they have done a good thing or a bad thing
>"It is a mistake to consider any belief more liberated than another. It is the possibility of change which is important."
That's stupid. If one day you tell someone you're a Wiccan, then the next day you say you're a Christian, then the next day you're a Hindu, pretty quickly people are going to stop taking anything you say seriously.
Being able to commit to an idea is part of what makes somebody an adult.
I've been in a lot of sissy hypno trance a few years now - and being in trance is crazily insane as everything your brain gets commanded to do becomes real as long as your imagination is focused and active.
I think this would have been a good subject for me, because things that don't make sense in reality to the masses seem normal to me.
I just hope the chaos gods are merciful when it comes to weak minded but ambitious brethren.
Where do I begin?
>Why would I tell anyone any of that?
I guess if you never leave your basement then it doesn't really matter.
If you actually interact with other humans daily, then yes, having consistent beliefs (and others who validate those beliefs) is pretty important.
I am occasionally possessed by an ancient indian shaman who complains a lot and makes me feel like crap about being white.
God i want to punch his fucking face in.
>hes just so sad...
Also I really want to be rich but i hate rich people and if i were rich i would hate myself but i hate being poor so i hate myself either way and i'd rather be rich.
I make carbon nanotubes in my butt.
The quickest way to dry up a womans cooch is to mention that you were raped as a child. After all, if you can't even protect yourself, how are you supposed to protect her child?
NEVERMIND THAT YOU WERE FUCKING FIVE
LETS PARTY AND FUCK AND DO DRUGS!!!
OH SHIT, WHAT DO YOU MEAN I HAVE A BABY? AND DRUG DEPENDANCY? AND ALIMONY?
WHAT DO YOU MEAN I HAVE TO GET A JOB? WHAT ARE ALL THESE THINGS? BILLS?
BUT I AM A GREAT AND POWERFUL SORCEROR!!! HEY, WHERE DID ALL MY FRIENDS GO?! WHY AM I SUCKING DICK FOR CRACK?!! OH WELL, BETTER BLOW MY BRAINS IN!!!
WHY AND THE FUCK SHOULD I HAVE TO "PAY" YOU TO FUCK ME IN THE ASS?! WHAT KIND OF COLD BLOODED PSYCHOPATHIC CUNT WOULD CHARGE YOU TO DO SOMETHING SHE WANTED TO DO ANYWAY?!
Take the green pill, /x/.
Embrace Islam, bow to Allah, and you will know wisdom and power that cannot be found in any spellbook.
I want you to "want" to do the dishes.
Why would I "want" to do the dishes?
(Because your too broke to hire a maid, you fucking trailor park white trash inbred redneck peice of garbage!_
I WANT YOU TO "WANT" ME TO TOUCH YOUR TITTES!!
WHY WOULD I "WANT" YOU TO TOUCH MY TITTIES?
(TO PROVE YOU ARE NOT A FRIGID CUNT!!)
You know, at least OUR evangelicals have the fucking decency to run telemarketing scams instead of selling smack to toddlers.
Oh, but ALLAH says its okay.
ALLAH says its a jihad, and you can do whatever you want during a jihad cause ALLAH said so
It's a fun read, thanks.
I don't really see the purpose of sigil stuff if it's a "use what works, discard what doesn't" system. As far as I can tell, sigils can only poorly provide a basic visual aid. Anything could do with the proper direction of intent. A bowl of water. Your eyelids. It seems a superfluous step that's overemphasized with a lot of people.
In Chaos magic you should completely embrace whatever belief system you are utilizing at that moment but there is no harm going back to your "true" beliefs once you're done with the exercise. An equally effective method is to create your own personal religion (that you could actually believe in) from the various theological parts you need to get the job done. A piece from here and a piece from there and voilà, working tools without going all coo coo magoo.
Take a look at all the delusional people on shows like American Idol. Many of them, despite being awful, thought themselves to be amazing. If the power of belief was real, they would all be superstars
Way to ruin the Occult and Discordianism with your new age hippy deviantart tumblr garbage.
Seriously these people are fucking idiots, they have no idea what they're talking about.
They bring shame to magick, shame to Discordianism.
I'm saying it because I'm one of those higher entities. The idea that chaos is uncontrollable by the spiritual world is a complete ignorance of the nature of the spirit world.
Chaos magic is a pretty good way to learn though. Just a friendly reminder of the current spiritual climate.
Maybe youre not doing it right. You have to be in the right mindset. Keep practicing.
No. I've just listened to some files and you just let the words fool your brain.
It's considered less of what you know and more of what you don't know.
You need to be relaxed, a radiant imagination that doesn't fade and a full concentration that's kept within the borders of your glow, you must not break them! You have to >understand< these words in order for them to work - how they make you feel and what their meaning is.
But while in trance, you keep it up by sending yourself waves of dense flows that conserve the state you are in. And when the time comes at the certain part of the chapter, you send even bigger waves for the next stage.
I gotta admit I did try to summon the ones from the other side whatever they look like, but the summoning did not occur because I failed to recognize them. I wanted them to arrive at a form they're comfortable in, not what I wanted them to look like. All I wanted is info about the other side and things unknown.
Anything else I considered just material garbage or human desires unworthy of their time
The reason magick works is because the world isn't 100% organized and deterministic
if it was, you'd know what was going to happen, and magick, being probability manipulation would be pointless
EA Koetting fans spotted, spelling magic with a K and everything ha ha. Have fun painting your face like the crow and masturbating to your my little pony tulpa.
Dear fuck I hope so. Some people still find old school discordianism edgy ("zomg I made fun of the pope in 2016! Take that, grandma!") which is pseudo rebellious autism made manifest. Though I would argue that the whole "make your own personal religion from the various theological parts you need to get the job done" is brilliant, I seriously doubt that 99.9999999% of discordians are smart enough to understand that was what Wilson was getting at. It's a great idea, presented in a funny manner (for the time) and was adopted by retards in all the wrong ways. There are way better ways to get to that conclusion than discordianism, it's an occult practice that is every bit outdated as thelema or masonry and ought to go.
I agree, the benefit of discordianism was welcomed when it was needed to cut through all the crap. I makes you start with something adogmatic. Dogmas are the source of most or every conflict in any occult community.
This is what the word chaos had to do with it. Every one creates it's own religion, consciously or not. Better be the pope of yours and be in charge of everything.
In light of OP's ridiculously derailed thread I have a question about chaos magic. In hermetics I produced a series of elementary entities that work together for a purpose. Can this be done with chaos magic?
It's meant to teach you to use belief as a tool not state some untouchable truism. The philosophy behind this (i.e. Discordianism) is that because you have no way of proving that what your senses (such as eyes, ear, touch etc.) are telling you or to a greater degree what public opinion (i.e. society/science/religion/history/news) tells you that they are all true to someone to a certain degree. Sure there is an absolute truth, but what difference does that make? To you, the brain, there is no difference between the two. Take for example conservatives or liberals. To them their knee jerk ideological meat headed conundrums are absolutely 100% real. The socialist left controls the media and they are trying to destroy america and it's morals/religion/family unit and take away your guns and Jesus so that the Freemasons can form a one world government under Satan. Or, the super rich and evil capitalists want to destroy democracy, any form of governmental oversight that can oppose them and turn you into their obedient slaves so that they may consolidate their power into a one world government under the control of the 1%. Now perhaps some of what these two ideologies preach as truth is actually true or maybe none of it is. It's irrelevant because to the brain perceiving them, there is no difference. Again, philosophical, not literal. It's meant to help you use BELIEF AS A TOOL rather than preach theology.
I can only speak from my own experience so I could be entirely wrong, so take it for what it's worth.
1: It's highly segregated. To pretend elsewise is intellectually dishonest. Yes, Prince hall, Eastern Star and Co-Freemasonry exist but they are blatantly separate but not equal, esoterically. And what happened in Georgia was shameful. No one should be black balled without consideration of their actual character.
2: Minutes. Jesus Christ, the minutes. Send a fucking email. And to a lesser extent, the budget. We have a treasurer for a reason. Why is this taking precedent over education?
3: It is a temple with no foundation, ironically. The biggest problem is that the core esoteric backbone (see what I did there?) was taught as an oral tradition for obvious reasons but the baby boomers were more interested in rubbing shoulders than western enlightenment and as such has been almost entirely forgotten. One can, once they understand what is missing, apply the lessons learned (and to be fair they really are beautifully crafted and have the most impressive safeguards against madness I've ever seen) but without the big K (or Q if that's your thing) it's entirely pointless. They regurgitate stories about the staircase but not how to get up it and even the most patient and passionate will quit in frustration. It's like a waiting room with no doctors on the other side of the door where patients are diagnosing each other out of desperation.
To be honest the millennials are trying their best to change these problems, they really are, and I applaud their uphill battle to save the craft. If they do succeed the big G will regain it's crown as the apex of western esotericism and even I myself will return, without hesitation. But even if these passionate people do rise to the position their grand lodges will (as we've seen time and time again) cock block them, because old people are old.
It's a goddamned tragedy and it breaks my heart. It was so fucking beautiful.
Well I triggered you to come out of the closet with my name. Sorry.
I have come to the same conclusions as you did, am much more knowledgeable than most of the others in the lodges I visit and they can't even see it. I won't rub it under their noses because there are some people willing to learn and those are the ones I concentrate on. I can learn from my scholars, too.
What irritates me most though is your last and most important point (4). I have seen it, they claim to want to find selmselves but in fact they are shaking hands for monetary reasons. They think they found out it was all about the money, try to latently convince you about that "fact". It pisses me off.
To be honest, I have witnessed some very occult and hard core stuff in this forum that I wouldn't even have had contact to in my every day routine. Some of you are more advanced in their character development than actual masons.
Sure, once you hit master you can rock the S.R. for more in depth lessons and again, it's beautifully crafted but without the big K it's useless.
Though to be fair I was northern jurisdiction and I've heard that it pales in comparison to its southern counterpart.
And yes at that point you can search for the good stuff elsewhere but I found that because of my location every lodge I visited for any length of time was more of the same.
I knew not to bother with the Shrine, Jesters etc. I've heard fantastic things about Memphis but there were none within a hundred miles of me so I can’t confirm.
All Masonry needs is a universal course that restores it to it’s intended purpose.
Traditional observance should be available in every lodge for those who seek the light, but instead these dickhead degree mongers push for blue lightning.
They pine for degrees like they were fucking merit badges and it sickens me.
Repeating lines doesn’t mean they understand them. They talk about the light but know it not.
Don't be sorry. Neither of us broke oaths and for all of 4chan's posturing the likelihood of anyone figuring out who we are is nil.
I would probably lose my standing in the Chaos community elsewise, sad as that is.
There are far too many fuckwits (hint hint Gordon from runesoup hint hint) of large stature parroting mindless conspiracy nonsense,
claiming to be free of Christian programing yet they participate in the divide and conquering of Babylon, attacking people
with almost identical spiritual paths to their own. Why the occult community keeps falling for this tactic, I'll never understand.
Being anonymous is why I love /x/ so much. Yeah, r/occult is "nicer" to me but I can't be myself as lovely a place as it is.
I'm not alone, I've bumped into some pretty big dogs here and it's easy to see why.
Of course you have to wade through a sea of shit (roleplayers and pseudo-atheist trolls) but there's no such thing as a free meal right?
What then is Discordianism? What is your definition and what does it mean to you. Genuinely curious jere.
Wouldn't it be easier for it to attack you if it has a "connection" with your body?
I'm not an expert barely a beginner, but that idea while cool sounds like it can fuck up royally.
>It's highly segregated
As if this were a bad thing.
If you are just creating them or are unfamiliar with them it would be wise to bind them to an object so that you can lock away and/or destroy the object if shit hits the fan. If for nothing more than psychological purposes. If however you've bonded with them and you are BFFs, fuck yes. That could make the bond between you even closer. It really does depend on the nature of your relationship. If you are actual friends (i.e. neither of you are commanding the other) go for it. If however you are in a "I scratch your back, you scratch mine" sort of deal, nope. Nope all the live long day. They'll likely just turn on you, understandably. No one wants to be someone's bitch.
I was under the impression you're not supposed to bond with a servitor.
Can you really make a human-like servitor? I assumed at that point it was more a tulpa than a servitor.
Chaos magick (and by extension all magick) can be summed up as 'belief = results', right?
If so, what's the point of any occult literature, shouldn't we rather be studying psychology to better understand how to manipulate our own minds instead?
DUUUH ! I tell this people all the times: ALCHEMY, CROWLEY... they all talk in metaphors and mean the influencing of the own mind. No magician would say "yes" now because you don't talk about it just like that but I do. The thing is most can not really understand and will keep casting "spells" in their rooms.
dude what the fuck I'm so confused. I tried to read about Discordianism and it's all jokes and mocking religion. Is that the entire thing, or is there something behind all the satire and jokes?
illuminatus trilogy, cosmic trigger, zen without zen masters, book of eris, black iron prison, principia discordia, in that order. Follow up with the "I in the triangle", some random crowley books, "a young woman's illustrated primer", and american gods, in any order you'd like.
The secret to it underneath all that funny business is that you create your own personal religion (hence the title of Pope) from whatever parts are necessary to get the work done and revise it as you go rather than doing a total paradigm shift from one established belief system to the next as “baseline” Chaotes do. No one's version of Eris will be the same because everyone's view of what "god" is differs. Moreover, unlike standard chaos magicians Discordians utilize the "Eight Circuits of Consciousness" which functions in the same manner that Kabbalah does for Thelma, Masonry and GD or the Chakras do for Buddhists and Hindus. Chaos magic by itself dead ends at some point unless you pick one of these three systems, which sadly most don't.
That could very well be. You hear that knocking? That's her. Let her in. See what happens.
I'd like to tell you my story in case anyone can give me some guidance or feedback.
When I was 16, (I'm 31 now) I started toying with what I thought as magic. I can't remember for shit how it all started, but I think it has something to do with reading the Dark Tower series and somehow believing parts of it just as some people believes in the bible (It's curious because you seem to use Dark Tower words too. Coincidence? All things must serve the beam, man!).
It's curious that many of that memories from that time are lost to me, but the first memories I have from it is that I assumed that inanimate objects had conscience of their own and one could talk with them mentally. I also kept some kind of idols at home, and moved them rituallisticaly every night. I kept a chicken leg on my backpack as a lucky charm, and things like that.
I also had lots of mystical "coincicences"; the kind of coincidences like always meeting the people I wanted at the street, knowing who was calling at the house phone before picking it (we didn't have screen phones back then!) or going to buy something, pick some money knowing that the thing is gonna cost just that and discovering that you we're right.
Soon I tried to impose my belief into reality (I must specify that I hadn't read nothing about magic and that I thought that I was the only man in this world doing this kind of things). One day, In which I had drank nothing but beer in the whole day, I decided to pick a french deck and try to separate it in two different piles without watching; and try to put all the 2s on one pile and the rest in other.
I succeeded (If i remember well i only managed to achieve three 2s, but that felt like a success)
Around that time, I also made snow once.
I was trying to meditate (I didn't know how it was done by then, I was just laying on my back listening to The Doors and trying to get illumination by all means without really knowing how it was done). Then i got a strange kind of feeling and thoight it could be it, and then my brother came in and distracted me. I got really angry because I didn't know if I could achieve this trance again; and I went into my room thinking that (literally, I remember this perfectly) I couldn't get in good mood even though a snow fell into town. This came to me because an episode of the Simpsons in which bart has to study but it's snowing outside and he must choose between keeping a promise to god or enjoy the snow. IDK; maybe there is any message there.
The thing is that in around an hour or so, it started snowing. I had never seen the snow, and it was the first snow in my town in decades (and it hasn't snowed ever since). My mother and brother were all trying to get me to the balcony to see the snow, but I was angered and refused (deep inside me I wasn't surprised at all, that I remember. I can not imagine that today, but I was a very strange kid then).
But this doesn't end there: when the snow stopped, we had lunch and while at it, I was rolling a 10 sided dice I kept. I didn't play rpgs by then, I just liked to have it. All the time, the dice was giving me the same results: 3, 5 and 9 in consecutive order. It was like a totem number or something for me at that time, I can't remember how I got it, I swear. I think I just liked them; and had even changed the hour on my alarm clock so it woke me up at 3:59 every morning to go to high school (real time: 7:00 or so)
Once I finished my meal, I went out to meet my friends on a vacant house one of them had. On the streets there was no trace of snow. Nor people. So I walked on a strange state of mind and I just thought about throwing the dice as far as I could ahead of me and watch the results it would give me. All along the way (three streets, three corner bends) I got 3, 5 and 9 consecutivelly. I have calculated the odds for this on this days. They're just astronomical and absurd, but it didn't seem to shock me more than a slight sense of ¿triumph?.
Once I got there, I didn't tell anything of this to my friends. I picked up a guitar and I was teaching the girl I liked at the moment a Metallica's song (nothing else matters) when it started snowing again. The girl and two more friends wanted to go out and play with the snow, and maybe because she was going, I acceeded to see the snow then.
It was a wonderful evening and in the end I made my first snowballs ever, we tried to make a (very filthy) snowman and had a stare up to the snowy black sky which I still remember as awesome.
With time, this powers ended up causing me an OCD behavior (I believed that I had to wash hands and make some other tedious rituals so everyone I know won't die for some reason), and It started to scare me seriously. With time, I started to reject all magical ideas and practices so they would lose their power, and it worked somehow (I see in your guide that I was right: I tried to pay them the less attention I could). I've only talked about this with few people, and almost always very drunk. I don't think that nobody has ever believed me but for my current girlfriend. I doubt of myself sometimes, but In those years, I promised myself to remember that It was real, no matter how strange seemed, It worked and I should never forget that.
IDK if it has something to do with it, but I still have impressive hallucinations when I'm about to sleep, incredibly detailed things and even sounds (mostly horrible, giant monsters when I go to bed angry or worried, but nice all the other times). I also have voices in my head that talk nonsense whenever I wake up after a drinking night. They never speak to me directly, but speak one to each other in meaningless dialogues and is very frightening and annoying. So much that I quitted drinking completelly about a year ago. When I was 23 I smoked an opiate medicine once that produced me a very similar effect.
Sorry for this wall of text, but I stumbled recently with bluefluke's >>17280587 and it has shaken a part of me that I wanted to obviate forever more, and I needed to get it off me, even tough, or maybe just because, you're all a bunch of strangers. Any opinions on this would be welcome. Though I have to admit that your work has stirred my curiosity, I don't feel like getting into chaos magic today; I feel like my sanity is too fragile today to attempt any of those things and I lack that force of will I had then.
If you are good enough you can make sigils happen without actually drawing or imagining the sigils. You just need good willpower. You can try to daydream a specific smaller event like someone saying a very specific phrase that he normally wouldn't use but that's also not too weird and then focus on this picture/video in your head. If you do it right you should go almost into a trance as if you were meditating.
I should probably add that it will not be 100% accurate. There might be another person saying that sentence or the person might say a slight alteration of such sentence. However the longer you practice, the more accurate it will get.
One of those huh? How boring. It's a puzzle, you know?
Just like any other mystery school, except it uses Memetic engineering based labyrinths rather than mathematical ones.
Just sitting there in plain sight for anyone smart enough to see 'em.
A Discordian who never moves past the Fnords is like a Mason who never gets past Metatron's cube.
They are so obsessed with the question that they forget there was an answer.
They forget the about the test, or even why they were taking it in the first place.
That or maybe I'm like, really, really high and shit.
Why the fuck are you listening to me?
I'm not your Mom.
That said, I would certainly consider myself an expert of this approach to changework, so if anyone has any questions, I'm up to answer.
Not meta enough.
>Peter Carrol is shit
Hine is pretty much top notch.
I would say this is very accurate.
You're being vague as fuck and pretty off-putting to someone who wants to figure out what this is all about.
Give me a concrete example of something that can be accomplished with this.
>given the experience
You, my friend, don't get chaos magick.
Neither of these is involved in chaos magick.
>your will to accomplish
You don't get chaos magick at all.
Aaaaaaand now you've claimed that you can't do any magic. Well done, chaos mage time traveling universe jumper.
That's because they're a cheap imitation of an actual magical entity.
>You mean social engineering.
If you knew what I meant, why did you bother to correct me?
Yes, I mean social engineering. But memes are the most efficient way to create social change. Low effort, low risk, high reward.
>Memes aren't mind control.
If that helps you sleep at night, okay.
>memes are the most efficient way to create social change
So that if you ended up saying this, I'd be in the perfect position to tell you the truth:
No, it fucking isn't. You're retarded if you think I change the world using memetics. No, holy fuck, no. You are in for a rude awakening when you finally trigger its memories.
23 out of 5 for entertaining me.
No, no, of course you're not. Clearly you're part of a brand-new movement called "chaosophy" that's altogether separate from the well-known polity that is Discordianism.
No one is a discordian, because it's a meaningless descriptor. Every classification a damnation.
Suppose this thread were to be looked at by our descendants like a Dead Sea Scroll in a thousand years' time. What do you think it's worth telling that generation about the life you've lived and the lessons you've learned from it?
And let there be light
> "Something which has never occurred since time immemorial; a young woman did not fart in her husband's lap"
anyway, enough shitposting for now. you guys need a library so newcomers can read one book and declare themselves most knowledgeable so the circle of chaos can continue.
Hey OP, I googled λάχανο and I got a lot of pic related, whats up with that?
It's a belief system created to be highly memetic with the goal to emancipate people from belief systems. In that way Discordians are are non-discordian. It's a bit akin to a strange loop. That's why Discordianism is a joke and Discordians its pointe.
FFS "memetic" has become the new useless buzz-word to mean anything you want and to be used in placed of other shitty buzzwords like "viral."
>Basically Satanism for beta males.
You Discordians are always quick to troll.
Stop believing in the energies of your body and start knowing!
Here is a short exercise:
This exercise works very well when you lie in your bed and the room is almost dark.
Close one eye and observe your arm. Start switching your eye and give the brain a chance to power up. You will start seeing fine silver lines on your arm. At first it will be a little difficult to recognise them, because those lines are new for you to see and maybe you are a little bit nervous at first. Try to have a curios and open mind. After you have recognized the fine silver lines you can start exploring them further and you will start to see fine silver flashes ascending from your arm. Don't forget to switch the eye again but stop switching when you don't feel comfortable anymore. With practice you will see the whole grid all over your body and you could see the colors of your bio electrical field, but remember your brain has to acclimate first, because it is not used to process those kind of informations. For the most part your mind is not accommodated to handle this unexpected informations.
And by they: allot of people can see the full aura in broad daylight. I have no use to extend this skill, but if you work with people, it can become quit handy. But be warned, with the mastering of this skill you will be able to see 'inside' the people around you and this could be very disturbing!
>Stop believing in the energies of your body and start knowing!
You realize that "knowledge" is a split between Belief and Truth, right?
It's true though. I have literally never met a female Discordian, and never met a Discordian who wasn't beta-male pussy repellant. It's like Satanism for nerds, or Wicca for virgins.
please, could any learned chaos guy answer me a question:
ACCORDING TO CHAOS MAGIC, are all gods and spirits in fact human unconscious creations (collective and individual)?
I mean, just like in the American Gods book
Simultaneously, yes and no. Chaotes often refer to a stratum of pan-reality concerned with unlimited potential and power. From this point of view, all gods do and don't exist. They are usable both as thoughtforms and as revealing particulars concentrated of omniversal forces.
I don't think highly of a human-centric perception of the omniversal. The pan-chaos goes beyond clay-born limitations, thus it is reasonable to assume that there are/were primal entities/energies which predate the matrices of causal forms. A human-centric model is fine and dandy if appealing to the more materially-inclined, but I am more fond of a model which supersedes the primacy of consciousness/unconsciousness assemblage points.