>Temple of Solomon the King:
Added Cialdini's "Influence" to ML.
We got banned from /his/.
Continuing the topic of hypnosis being occult or not; I posit that it's not, based on these:
Reading about the local adepts A' A' escapades makes the world of organized occult and esoterica so interesting and exciting. And here i am doing 20 minutes Isha Krya off YouTube and rereading RAW.
Should i just go and roll into the nearest Masonic lodge? Maybe the one thing i lack in this whole thing is a physical teacher's guidance.
I just feel i lack practical guidance. Reading books from the Mega is very exciting, and learned A LOT of really good things. Valuable things. Things that made me reevaluate my outlook on life and actually change myself a bit.
But as to the practical, progressing spiritual discipline, i'm at a loss as to where to actually start. So i've been thinking that i really need to seek out a guru or an organisation.
Don't have much to choose from: IKCSON, various new agey yoga classes filled with bluepillers, edgy variations of OTO and so on. But we do have a legit chartered Scottish Rite Lodge and one Memphis Rite Lodge.
The Memphis Rite people from i understand are more esoterically inclinded, but have no charters or any kind of legitimizing factor at all.
Why do you need an authority figure such as an organization or a guru to tell you what to do, what to believe, and what to think?
Like J.K said Truth is a pathless land, and you cannot approach it by any path whatsoever, by any religion, by any sect. ... The moment you follow someone you cease to follow Truth.
Okay. First things first, define for yourself the terms:
In terms of practice, what kind of advice do you actually want?
The more specific your question, the more specific your answer.
So as i saw you do osha kriya, so you prob listen to sadhguru sometimes. If you want to take a more spiritual/eastern route in this, or atleast just delve a bit deeper into it, research buddhist centers around you (tibetan buddhist) and go to meetings with teachers. They give teachings about tantra and eastern esotericism, its worth it.
Apart fromthat, my only advice os to stay away from iscon, they have little to do with actual hinduism and are just a mix of christianity and vaishnavism.
JK can suck a dick.
>Like J.K said Truth is a pathless land, and you cannot approach it by any path whatsoever, by any religion, by any sect.
>The moment you follow someone you cease to follow Truth.
You seem to forget that ones own path is still that: a path.
>what to do, what to believe, and what to think?
Jumping to conclusions, my friend. I know who i am. I just need some help with my excercises and the disciplinic aspect. Where to start, and how to progress.
I'm not looking for a power structure, i just need a direction to set me on the path more firmly.
>Truth is a pathless land, and you cannot approach it by any path whatsoever
I am also aware of Alan Watt's notion that practices are a way of putting it off before you get it. Well, let's then suppose that i want to put it off in a more orderly fashion.
I don't get what i'm supposed to do, with say, Kabbalah. Or Liber Null. Or Lama Yeshe's book on Tantra.
So i meditate and practice visualisation and thought control and the like. But where do i go from there?
At some point everything just dissolves into this whirl of pleasant things that ring true to my heart, but the only thing i can actually practice is meditation, because it says: do so and so. Or Carroll's trick with picking an ideology at a dice throw.
Maybe i'm just stupid or a natural order follower. with no initiative of his own. Now that would be a shame.
>>I don't get what i'm supposed to do, with say, Kabbalah. Or Liber Null. Or Lama Yeshe's book on Tantra.
What do you mean what you're supposed to do?
There's no "supposed".
Just do whatever you think is possible.
>So i meditate and practice visualisation and thought control and the like.
Of course, remember that it's an interaction between conscious and subconscious. Doing just one without the other is a complete waste of time.
>But where do i go from there?
Look into the google drive.
>At some point everything just dissolves into this whirl of pleasant things that ring true to my heart, but the only thing i can actually practice is meditation, because it says: do so and so.
Okay. Bring up focus. Turn it up a huge notch. Then relax your mind.
>Maybe i'm just stupid or a natural order follower. with no initiative of his own. Now that would be a shame.
It's only a shame if you resign yourself to that state. You can always do more.
>break up blockages in the soul
Nigga what. Two-three months at most.
Get your methods sorted, cause that shit's slow.
Plus, I'm certain that it doesn't work nearly as well as directly solving issues.
Franz Bardon, Initiation into Hermetics.
People here dislike it because it takes actual work, without bothering with all the superstitious cult doctrines they like to masturbate over.
I don't even dislike it, I'm just neutral on it, but that seems enough to be branded as a circlejerking superstitious cultist.
Also, no one in the history of these threads has ever explained how Bardon's system is more 'work' based than any of his many contemporaries who have equally robust systems.
Remember, kids, factionalism is for, well, kids.
>Plus, I'm certain that it doesn't work nearly as well as directly solving issues.
We're not even talking about the same thing.
My sacral and manipura chakras are blocked like fuck and I can't do anything about them.
ALL the exercises? Hypothetically, your will made manifest.
I've obviously never met anyone who has mastered the entire program. The first couple steps themselves can take years, depending on the individual.
>because it takes actual work
I can change a man's habits in half an hour.
I want to see someone do the same, using solely "magical" means.
Then MAYBE I'll be more open to the notions Bardon presents.
The chakras are a rather useless layer of abstraction in general; find the issue, solve it, and the chakras will naturally open.
I.e. you're not supposed to do therapy on chakras; they're there so you can access the resources you already have in a particular way.
>The first couple steps themselves can take years
That's why even considering doing Bardon is a waste of time.
Also I've been thinking, we could do a weekly show or something on blab.im or some other service. Getting guests and people to interact and share observations and experiences, perhaps a weekly lecture on a topic or another?
It seems like a very good way of doing the whole "teaching" thing online.
>The first couple steps themselves can take years, depending on the individual.
You shouldn't to do it step by step.
If you do every step roughly in order, not to mastery, but to competence, you can probably do IIH way sooner. This is why autists should stay away from the occult.
>That's why even considering doing Bardon is a waste of time.
>I ain't claiming magic is real beyond its anthropological context.
You clearly have zero magical ability, so your thoughts on the matter are worthless.
>You clearly have zero magical ability,
Defined how, exactly?
What I do fits very well with the anthropological context of the practices; almost perfectly, in fact.
>so your thoughts on the matter are worthless.
How so? Are you claiming magic IS real beyond it's anthropological scope?
If so, show me. I'll be more than glad to be proven wrong.
>find the issue, solve it, and the chakras will naturally open.
Not how it works, bud.
The blockages are there solely because Saturn is raping my Sun and Mars in my natal chart. This has nothing to do with any kind of new agey psychological model.
You can stop repeating "anthropological", and just say "belief" in its current context.
If you consider magic to merely be a belief, then you quite obviously have no magical abilities.
>Not how it works, bud.
Exactly how it works, friend.
>The blockages are there solely because Saturn is raping my Sun and Mars in my natal chart.
>implying your nativity has more agency in your life than you do
>implying your relationship to your nativity isn't the issue here
>This has nothing to do with any kind of new agey psychological model.
It seems you're as ignorant of how the mind-body complex works as you are knowledgeable about astrology.
I highly recommend you get your shit straight instead of excusing your weakness by some distant celestial bodies existing. Certainly, they might have some influence.
But also consider this: just as a radio tunes into certain signals, picks up interference, and whatnot, so it can process the signal that it receives into something useful. If you're not doing that, then all you get is static.
>You can stop repeating "anthropological", and just say "belief" in its current context.
Except I'm not talking about belief(s).
>If you consider magic to merely be a belief, then you quite obviously have no magical abilities.
Except I don't. How did you conclude that I do?
Magic has a exoteric social function, such as rites of passage, initiations, changes of social state, etc. etc., but it also has an esoteric function, which is self-exploration and growth.
It is a very old form of catalyzing change by symbol, as evidenced by its many forms and long history.
Those symbols are simply abstractions of real processes, and over time, they've grown to be considered supernatural. I find no use in the latter aspect, so I drop it. Because why stick with superstition when it only inhibits my ability to cause change in accord with volition?
That's only my personal perspective, and my bet is, MAYBE one person in this thread shares it. Beyond that, you'll be hard-pressed to find any Thelemite materialist enough to just let the notion of magic go entirely.
Ah, absolutely. But that's the case for every group that involves ranks or grades.
It's a sad, sad reality that people are more interested in particular small parts of the puzzle, rather than in the sum total of what's available to them.
You don't know what your talking about.
>your relationship to your nativity isn't the issue here
My only relationship to Saturn is that of a rape victim.
Saturn is spiritually raping my solar plexus. That is the issue. To remove the issue, I need to negate the energies of Saturn. Once this is done, I promise you my solar plexus will open.
>"Occult threads were a mistake." ~ Frater K.
>>magic is about personal growth and improvement
Things I Never Said: The Post.
>he doesn't like to get high
Thoth is a goddamned poser (literally) and nubti is too but he also doesn't know what he is talking about. The ancer of this thread is the namfags hogging attention and replies saying "I know." and they do not know and "I have heard' and they have not heard.
>I'll just complain real hard instead of trying to indicate where and how the tripniggers ITT are wrong, or which materials are better resources!
I'm more than happy to address your concerns and
support my points in the literature and research available.
The only way I can do that, however, is if you point out
what your concerns actually are.
>weed is for dumb niggers!
I don't think this is accurate, to be honest.
Weed does make you inefficient, far as my experience goes.
Caffeine, doesn't really affect performance as much, it simply removes the feeling of tiredness, which is basically useless in terms of productivity, however it's still better than negatively impacting it.
What I've found wonderful is tobacco (menthol snuff), which in fact I've found increases my productivity in a significant way, as it boosts my focus and allows for a degree of emotional relaxation while consciousness focuses.
>smoking American weed
>not smoking either pure charas or charas mixed with Datura.
>The cancer of this thread is the namfags hogging attention and replies saying "I know." and they do not know and "I have heard' and they have not heard.
>"That doesn't mean anything! Nothing at all."
I have yet to see anyone actually finish it.
When I see someone producing results or good material who went through his whole system (bear in mind IIH is just the first book), I'll be happy to recommend it.
Where step are you at in the book, as a matter of interest?
>Growth plates are still open
Well I want to keep memeing at people but in this case I'd say it's worth a shot, at least, maybe with a chem cocktail on the side and a wee bit of hypnotic induction.
Just off the top of my head I'd recommend going real heavy on mantra associated with the chakras tied to growth stimulating endocrine centers.
Finished revising the first bit of my notes but still staring at SA wondering how to make the synopsis. Good news is I finished the book proper last night and I think I've got a notion of where this is all going and how to braid Lover's Call back into the book.
>wee bit of hypnotic induction
That'd require the Sichort state, in order to actually achieve direct influence to the endocrine system, as well as stimulate metabolism in the right way.
Entirely possible though, provided your body is already predisposed for growth.
I'd also play around with regression and progression related to growing taller/ more muscular.
You'll find the relevant scripts in the >Therapy > Scripts > OMNI folder.
You want the ones for Esdaile and Sichort states.
So your process would be:
>Elman induction + deepener
>Establish subconscious agreement
>Give suggestions towards growth
In case you want to go all the way, you'll also want to go a regression to solve potential emotional blocks keeping the person from growing, and progression to build motivation towards the benefits.
>Finished revising the first bit of my notes but still staring at SA wondering how to make the synopsis. Good news is I finished the book proper last night and I think I've got a notion of where this is all going and how to braid Lover's Call back into the book.
Man, you're miles ahead of me, that's some serious work. I've been a lazy fuck the past few days, really need to get back into gear.
Incidentally, one of the groups has a few messages of support for the wiki. One of them reached out to me (someone who left a message last year about doing the book), asking what we thought of the Phoenix rites, must get back to her on it.
Where do you think the LC actually fits, incidentally? I presume it's a supplementary practice for IA or something?
Uh. That's a nasty one. But here's my thoughts on how this
You establish the flow state. Great.
Given that the flow state is characterized by the subconscious
generating the best solution, the ideal solution for anything
that you are doing (consciously or automatically), I would
consider enforcing conscious desires (i.e. sigils) as the worst
possible choice at the given time.
In essence, you are enforcing what's conscious (form) onto the
subconscious (function). This is the essence of old-school
hypnotism, in that it was considered to be about control.
In modern times, with our superior (and significantly more
appropriate) understanding, we know that it's so much better to
guide the subconscious into finding its own, perfect solutions;
a hypnotist has entirely no clue as to what solution will be
best; what remains then is, to get the subject to generate
their own solutions, dynamically, each time they encounter a
Now, there is *one* way in which I could see the two working
together nicely. That is, if you first create a regular sigil
representing a goal, with a full SMART + SWOT analysis, then
progress to the time when the goal is achieved completely, work
out your route to the goal step by step, from the future time
where it's achieved back to now, and THEN initiate the flow
state, and let it carry you there.
But at that point the sigil becomes nothing more than the
ingraining of the goal within the subconscious, which can be
done significantly faster and easier anyway.
Ok can you guys just explain to me the appeal of DBoE?
I just don't understand. What are the claimed benefits of sacrificing your blood to reptilians? Why would anyone use Chumbley's system over anyone else's?
>anon doesn't understand that if we give our blood and seed to the reptilian Nephilim NOW then when the great Harvest of Spleens and Tongues rolls around we'll be culled last
Print out a few fliers and post 'em around your nearest centers of like reading and commerce. Coffee shops are good provided they're non-chain and low on hipster shitheels.
Don't use any of the common acronyms or even much art, just advert for the first meeting of an esoteric discussion group and tell the people who show what you put in the thread: You're not looking for the OTO, you're looking for a small circle to actually practice with.
What they were doing here was "recruiting" (loudly, as in there wasn't any attempt to hide it) from the ghost-hunting group by inviting people to stay for an hour after meet-ups.
Shortcut to Knowledge and Conversation of the Holy Guardian Angel, allegedly, and is 7/10ths of why I'm giving they system a shot.
>You want to shift the locus of control away from yourself instead of direct action.
What you're saying doesn't make much sense. Where do you even see a "locus of control"? Also, how would it move away from "oneself", when the whole process is internal?
As for direct action, that's literally the last part of what I wrote.
Which tells me that you don't understand basic concepts.
That's literally the process I use with my business clients; solving issues in management, getting businesses moving when they stall, that kind of thing.
So... 20 minutes a day is "so much time"?
It's much better than scrolling through facebook when I'm bored.
Why is it you folks don't even have coherent critique? It's all just trashposting.
It also doesn't help that Chumbley seems to be taking what little of vague definitions into weird and just as poorly defined territory but I *think* I can get away with falling back to experience of Face or Alterity which gets pretty in depth philosophical treatment alongside various shades of samadhi.
What's the point of getting your PhD if it can't even prevent asthma death? What's the point of having friends of they won't even prevent asthma death?
What's the point of [anything] if it can't even prevent [something]?
I've had a pet theory for a while, hear me out.
It seems pretty non-controversial to say that Edward Kelly and John Dee, in their meditations and ceremonies, believed that they communicated with angels.
However, all the stuff that they did (said meditations and ceremonies), seems very similar to how people today create Tulpas. So what's to say that that's not actually what they did? What if they just made Tulpas that had the form of angels?
The Tarot is a higher level of abstraction than the HGA is, thus making its study in order to find the HGA's actual nature futile.
You mean self-induced DID. That is a possibility, however DID is, to be perfectly honest, not necessary in order to experience Otherness and forms from the subconscious.
Well, from my point of view, it is simply a (rather misguided, though still useful) abstraction of the role of the subconscious into a divine figure.
>abstraction of the role of the subconscious into a divine figure.
What's the point though? Why spend a year for DBoE or 18 months for Abramelin when you can go into a trance and interact with your subconscious directly within 30 minutes?
Iunno. Some people consider it more valuable, I guess. I
don't. Thus my constant pushing of hypnosis and hypnotherapy.
Btw, re: subconscious communication, it's actually much less
than 30 minutes. More like 30 seconds.
For whatever it's worth, the way I do self-hypnosis (when I
have a few minutes) is basically this:
>sit down, deep breath, close eyes on exhale
>focus on right arm
>starts repeating the words "relax" to it
>when it's completely relaxed, I try to move it
>if it's stuck in place, I know I'm in trance
>start giving suggestions to self and using ideomotor responses
Takes about a minute to get to catalepsy, then I establish
IMR's, and then suggestions for a minute or two.
Hope this helps.
>The Tarot is a higher level of abstraction than the HGA is, thus making its study in order to find the HGA's actual nature futile.
Who said anything about the HGA and the subconscious?
I guess I am fairly resilient to straight up verbal induction. Only one person really can get close. I can hit most of the states I need to be in within 3 to 5 mins, most days, 20-40 mins for other/deeper shit. Extending work out over rituals or even patterns or strings of rituals over time serves to establish an embodiment of performativity I need for things to stick. Bare contemplation isn't quite somatic enough for me.
>Who said anything about the HGA and the subconscious?
That'd be me, I think I mentioned it in the last thread.
>I guess I am fairly resilient to straight up verbal induction.
It's not really a question of resilience. It's more along the lines of whether you want to do it. If you do, and you're talking to yourself (literally), then it happens.
>Only one person really can get close.
I've trust issues too. Especially around my family. In the end, however, as long as your behaviors change in the way you want them to, it's all good.
>I can hit most of the states I need to be in within 3 to 5 mins, most days, 20-40 mins for other/deeper shit.
And how much do the changes you make in your emotional states, thinking patterns and behaviors stick in the way you do this?
>Extending work out over rituals or even patterns or strings of rituals over time serves to establish an embodiment of performativity I need for things to stick.
So basically you want repetition for things to stick. Doesn't seem optimal, tbqh senpai.
>Bare contemplation isn't quite somatic enough for me.
Have you looked at the way NLP uses kinesthetic elements in order to cause mental and behavioral change?
Well, the guy thought it was something like a personal angel who sorts out your problems. It's not. In fact, a glimpse of an Angel, and it wouldn't matter to you if you were to live one day or a decade.
>The Tarot is a higher level of abstraction than the HGA is, thus making its study in order to find the HGA's actual nature futile.
It's actually a good map that helps to make sense of the experience. For example, the Red Lion and White Eagle alone can make one understand both the Sun and the Moon, red and white, symbolism of Western Magick and Eastern Tantra and how it fits the Angel both on the level of experience and on the level of metaphor. Haven't you never pondered why The Tower lays across The Art? And how that can be applied to the Knowledge and Conversation?
>Well, from my point of view, it is simply a (rather misguided, though still useful) abstraction of the role of the subconscious into a divine figure.
Have you ever invoked your Guardian Angel?
I really only like Dennet when he's talking about notions of weak free will and neuroscience.
That'd be RHK.
Babalon/Nuit depending on function and perspective.
Levinas makes a really good case for the phenomenological state of communion with Other or Alterity at a face-to-face basis.
EFT is mostly placebo. I mean the whole mind-to-3d approach. Using your spatial memory and changing that.
Haven't. I'm mostly interested in hypnosis as it is. If you have a link, I can put it in the library.
>a glimpse of an Angel, and it wouldn't matter to you if you were to live one day or a decade.
Bullshit, brah. Bullshit.
>For example, the Red Lion and White Eagle alone can make one understand both the Sun and the Moon, red and white, symbolism of Western Magick and Eastern Tantra and how it fits the Angel both on the level of experience and on the level of metaphor.
No, they can't.
>Haven't you never pondered why The Tower lays across The Art? And how that can be applied to the Knowledge and Conversation?
I have. Didn't get anything from it, despite being reasonably strong with the Tarot. On the other hand, applying a solution based approach instead... works wonders.
>Have you ever invoked your Guardian Angel?
Yeah. Ended up dissociating and recognizing that it's simply a part of my subconscious (after a rather long while). Consciousness should be a tool in your toolbox, no more, no less.
I'd say LBRP would work but you don't wanna hear from me.
Do you want to talk about something or just piss and moan? You could give a stab at helping out this ray of sunshine: >>17183041
Define? As in modern grimoires? Haven't touched the shit. As in Ken Grant's material. A bit, but nothing to the extent of using them as like Lemegeton stand ins like Karlsson and other modern LHP groups advocate.
In the traditional Hebrew conception Klipot & Sitra Achra aren't even host of spirits, they imply destructive habituation which must be overcome.
Okay, listen very carefully.
It's a very very VERY old ritual.
Don't take it easy, it can destroy your life, this is no fucking joke.
I tell you people this, because i am tired, tired of you people messing up with this shit.
It's very hard, and complicated. I don't tell you exactly how it works, because it is really, really, dangerous.
Step 1. You have to draw the circle of the unmasked serpent, its
like the jewish star, únder it you have to draw the other symbol.
Step 2. You need old paper, or pergament, it has to be very old, it must have soaken alot of conflicts, and karma in it.
Step 3. You need candles of real Wax, not this parrafin bullshit from the supermarket.
You put them in the corners of the drawings. The work of the bees, need to melt, work of the creation of god. Bees are amongst the pures beings.
Step 4. This is were the real shit begins, you have to write what you want, and who you want to beg for this gift.
Step 5 put a dip of your blood on it and say the spell alot of times, till you feel really connected to the other world, like you were meditating or praying.
No, i wont tell you the spell.
Step 6. Wait. You get real fucked up dreams, were the demon, or satan appears to you, and tells you if he accepts the trade or not.
You will either have to promise him your soul, or you have to sacrafice another human being and drop the blood on the pergament.
After it is done, you need to put your autogram on the pergament, and burn it in the fire from one of the candles and rub the ashes on your forehead, and swollow a bit from it.
After that repeat the spell till you are in a trance condition.
After that, it's sealed, and there is no comeback.
It's true, but it's fucking dangerous, and you can end up in an asylum for retards.
It really messes with your head after you dropped your blood and say the spell.
Either you can withstand it, or you will go mad. You need to have a real strong soul.
Oh yes, so better, do you feel in control now? You feel like youve established yourself as a man now? Or will momma have to remind you about counting to ten and returning to the safe zone again?
I spit on your grandfathers carcass faggot
>do you feel in control now?
No. I feel in charge.
>You feel like youve established yourself as a man now?
Ye I'm a big guy.
>Or will momma have to remind you about counting to ten and returning to the safe zone again?
>I spit on your grandfathers carcass faggot
Shut it, hothead.
I'm starting to think most "occultists" can't be taken seriously
Closest way would be Sichort state.
If you really want something paranormal, I highly recommend the Keys of Solomon or Martinist approaches.
Clearly you don't know what that word means.
Correct. In fact, taking anything seriously is a grave offense.
>Clearly you don't know what that word means.
It means a thelemite.
It's like dubstep fans trying to claim they "don't listen to that WUBWUBWUB stuff, only good dubstep!"
It just makes you look even more retarded.
>"look at me I'm gargling gallons of semen!"
>"HAH I BET YOU DONT EVEN KNOW THE FIRST PERSON TO USE "FAG" IN REFERENCE TO HOMOSEXUALITY! "
Would you like to try again, theletubbie?
As an aid to a given work? I can understand how this might promote faster healing, but I'm talking about flesh that is gone and the wound completely scarred over.
>Keys of Solomon
I can't think of a goetic spirit whose domain is said to be healing of the flesh. Can you help me out?
I'm not sure how effective Christian mysticism would be for a non-Christian, but I thank you for the suggestions and welcome any others.
>but I'm talking about flesh that is gone and the wound completely scarred over.
Well, there's no scientific way of doing that... yet.
Think Greater Key, not Lesser. You want Angels.
You can also just let 'em shitpost and we can talk around them.
I need to ask here because most of you guys probably are more involved with the Teachings of some of the classic or less known Occultists.
Now, I hope my question is not Off Topic to this specific thread, if so please tell me.
It has come to my mind that something has entered the Reign of Man, something that is capable of Becoming and not just Being, something of sinister nature that could be transforming the species into something thats ''Not Man''.
In any of the Texts that you've read in the past, have you guys found any mentions to this?
It is unknown to me if this Being is making touch with the very fabric of the Human soul, as in something thats deeply ingrained within us or if its the nature of this Being whats corrupting the soul.
Hi /omg/, I've got a question.
I'm not working with any particular established system right now, but I've been trying to go through astral projection through two methods: rigorous meditation and working through dreams. My reason for working through dreams is that I have seen more than a few sources state that astral projection is possible (and, for some, easier) during the dream-state. The other night, I had some kind of entity visit me in a dream. It resembled a man, between 30 and 50, with short hair and striking eyes of no particular color. (There was color, but I can't place what it was on the color wheel.) He and I spoke for some time about the nature of otherworldly entities, but when I came to reject him due to discomfort, I found myself in an unrelated and ordinary dream wherein he/it did not make another appearance.
Have I lit some kind of beacon attracting nonhuman entities due to my attempts to project and my increased practice of general magick? If so, what is the proper form of action to take -- should I encourage these entities as part of my progress, or should I take steps to reject them, and if I should reject them, what is the best way to do so?
Ey guy´s, one of you could tell me what are these symbols, this video channel is very strange.
read a book. any book. one of the first things you should do is to create and cultivate a mental space to work from, one that you have control over what comes into it.
shitty meme is shity.
How about you do the work? Here is the main text
Do whatever ritual you want. Repeat whatever part you want. The main things needed are concentration and emotional intensity. All else is a formality. I actually did it first as a joke.
>Bullshit, brah. Bullshit.
Or maybe you're shit at occultism. Even absolutely normal people with no ties to the occult actually have flashes of the beauty and harmony and eternity of the word (Check Colin Wilson's Beyond the Occult, where he compiled similar experiences of his friends and world known writers). The fact that you can't get such experience, despite being in the occult, which actually trains one to achieve them, shows that either you're lying to everyone here or don't have the proper requirements to do it. (That is, you're undisciplined.)
>No, they can't.
Want to know a thing? I showed the Thoth Tarot to normie friends who didn't even know that such thing as Kabalah exist, and guess what? They started saying thing about the Trumps that only a hardcore occultist would know. And it's weird that for someone who reduces everything to the subconscious, you don't understand how it works through symbols.
> Yeah .Ended up dissociating and recognizing that it's simply a part of my subconscious (after a rather long while)
I doubt it. The first thing you notice, if you done the work, is that you're never one hundred percent sure if it's out there or not. Some experiences can be explained through on the subconscious; others not. I also don't think it's really something separate, but some experiences remain unexplained. And I never experienced any dissociation with the HGA. In fact, I've never felt so in touch with the world, and the HGA took all the disconnection from people away. Everyone else attested that I was sane and open and approachable.
You're either extremely bad at occultism, or bullshitting everyone here.
>using Samekh to conjure the HGA when 666 explicitly states that it's HIS ritual for HIS HGA and you'll need to devise your OWN ritual using the principles outlined in The Vision and Voice
>Not sure if it's there or not even though the chapter in MWT, more or less his final comment, posits that the thing is fucking objective, and that the idea of an imaginary HGA is different from a dream only in inessentials
Get off your high horse about doing the work via the main text, m8. I agree with your third sentence and after that it just sounds like feelpinion, which is all you, me, Z, or AC has.
>"The HGA is not Perfect Self" ~ t. Crowley
In the *past*? I don't see much comment on that before the 60's and Mike Aquino, really. There *may* be something worthwhile in Seth: God of Confusion.
None of us are talking about either of those things.
If you think hypnosis ain't real, well, you're wrong.
If you think magic ain't useful (even if it's just it's social and psychological functions), then you're wrong.
It's really simple.
Depends on what you mean, it could be anything.
>Have I lit some kind of beacon attracting nonhuman entities due to my attempts to project and my increased practice of general magick?
I would subscribe this more to the notion of "that's how the subconscious communicates now".
>The main things needed are concentration and
I.e. you're going into trance. Great. I see no use for it,
given that fact.
>Or maybe you're shit at occultism.
>Even absolutely normal people with no ties to the occult
>actually have flashes of the beauty and harmony and eternity of
>(Check Colin Wilson's Beyond the Occult, where he compiled
>similar experiences of his friends and world known writers).
That's easily justifiable using the way the human body and mind
are structured; no need to resort to woo explanations.
>The fact that you can't get such experience,
That's a huge claim. How do you conclude that I haven't had
such an experience?
>despite being in the occult, which actually trains one to
In a way which is explicitly contrary to achieving these
experiences, mind you.
>shows that either you're lying to everyone here or don't have
>the proper requirements to do it. (That is, you're
The things you write show that you're simply buying into the
superstitious side, without considering the way things work in
the real world.
>Want to know a thing? I showed the Thoth Tarot to normie
>friends who didn't even know that such thing as Kabalah exist,
>and guess what? They started saying thing about the Trumps that
>only a hardcore occultist would know.
That's entirely unrelated to the previous question re:
understanding the nature of the Angel via the Tarot. What you
say is definitely possible, however the structure and symbolism
of the Tarot aren't conducive to finding the nature of ones
Angel, or even describing what the Angel IS.
In short: you're not only confused, but in your confusion,
you're also creating strawmen.
>And it's weird that for someone who reduces everything to the
>subconscious, you don't understand how it works through
It's weird that for someone who claims to have studied the
occult, you don't understand what words mean.
>I doubt it. The first thing you notice, if you done the work,
>is that you're never one hundred percent sure if it's out there
Except when you test. And you should *always* be testing.
>Some experiences can be explained through on the subconscious;
>I also don't think it's really something separate, but some
>experiences remain unexplained.
>And I never experienced any dissociation with the HGA. In
>fact, I've never felt so in touch with the world, and the HGA
>took all the disconnection from people away. Everyone else
>attested that I was sane and open and approachable.
As I mentioned before, you don't understand what words mean.
Dissociation doesn't mean "disconnected from the world", but
only "distanced from a thing". In this case, in order to behold
the HGA, you have to dissociate from that part of you which IS
It's very fundamental to the whole experience, because the
dissociation allows it to manifest *despite* all your emotional
issues, internal conflicts, opinions, and so on and so on and
>You're either extremely bad at occultism, or bullshitting
I highly recommend you step it up, sempai. Read Roy Hunter's
Parts Therapy book. It's going to help your understanding
Does anybody have opinions regarding The Sitra Achra or even Ixaxaar publishings in general?
I've been trying to locate physical copies of several different out of print texts by Ixaxaar and it seems the only place to find them is on ebay being heavily scalped.
I may bump this a few times or even create a thread if no interest is generated.
Why? What do you WANT out of the material?
>Define? As in modern grimoires? Haven't touched the shit. As in Ken Grant's material. A bit, but nothing to the extent of using them as like Lemegeton stand ins like Karlsson and other modern LHP groups advocate.
>In the traditional Hebrew conception Klipot & Sitra Achra aren't even host of spirits, they imply destructive habituation which must be overcome.
Start here for a rather traditional Kabbalistic view of the klipot, it's derived from Hebrew contemplative alchemy:
And if you WERE going to treat the Shells and Tunnels of Set as if they were places with demons I'd recommend starting on Ken Grant's conceptions first, and probably even working the genii in liber 231 around Tifaret before even going into the averse paths.
I have a question, for those of you practised in these dealings of things..
So, a few years back I was heavily into this stuff, I brought in a few of the goetian dieties
[marchosias, azazel, king paimon] - the regulars i tried to work with
[asteroth] - i couldn't exactly connect with, if you want to call it that..
and for the most part, the questions i asked/what i asked for happened.. now i also made offerings and delivered them to get these.., but i have a small niggling feeling 'they' haven't 100% left...
so, how can i 'detect' who's here still and how do i get them to leave?
Greater Hexagram Ritual keyed to banishment. You should be more or less clean after that.
I dunno, I'd say to do LBRP a couple times and if you still feel paranoid use the big guns mentioned above.
To be honest, I don't know about anything of the occult. Everything I've read has been incredibly hard for me to understand.
I've read 40ish pages of the Sitra Achra and don't even know what's going on. I own the physical Liber ABA and cannot understand what's being talked about. Then I've read bits and pieces of various texts sprinkled throughout the internet and have a hard time following any of it.
Am I just fucking retarded or is there some core text everyone else has read that I haven't?
I wouldn't even say im paranoid about it, just time to time it'll pop into the front of my memory.. and i wonder if they've left... if they ever came is another question
thanks, what's your address so i can send you anthra---cookies* ?
>Use a dictionary.
A *good* dictionary.
You're fine, m8.
Lemegeton's very much so babby's first evokation. Easy to learn, hard to master, nets generally favorable results, will teach you how to do other stuff in subtle ways of you work at it enough.
Academically, I'm either done or might go back to college, no idea for what though.
>interests in occult
I desire knowledge.
I don't know what's going on around me, only what I and most others perceive of this world.
I'm interested in learning what others have managed to tap into.
I'd like to apply the knowledge I like to my life so I may gain wisdom and am more comfortable with what I have left of this life.
These symbols can be seen within St Bartholomew's Church on 52 an Park Ave NYC. Any idea what they mean? I've searched repeatedly but haven't found anything. Thanks.
Got your email, K, many thanks.
I like form these notes are taking, it'll be a great addition to the library once it's complete.
Weekend is going to be BUSY, I have to hunt around for a new ritual spot, and also collect (smaller) boughs for black moon. Don't have the advantage of my garden this time (where I knew where they all were), so should be tricky. Luckily, willows are always near water here, and yews are always in graveyards, so thats 2/10 anyway. Definitely replacing these next time I do it, there has to be something simpler.
There's a fucking LOT going on in HU....I don't want to cheap out by going for the simpler method, but we both know from Black Moon how much planning goes out the window on the day.
You could just take it outside for a glimmer of starlight then go back inside to complete the thing. It's what I plan on doing. I already gathered all my hand boughs and took them home after Black Sun, they're encircling my altar now.
I'm going to try to do all of HU. Even if you cheap out you still have to do the Forge, so at that point what's an extra hour of incantation?
First you could try:
>identifying the strain
>pitching them right the fuck in le traschan if they're less than F5 stable
>switching to rockwool or areoponics or anything but that potting soil that's been sitting in the shed for a year and a half
>actually using the needed nutrient plan, with a nicely weighted formula (I like the basics, Rockwool Formula A/B, super fuckin' easy to tweak)
>make sure you're ventilated correctly
>make sure your light cycles are adhered to, stop peeking, fgt
>etc etc etc
Other than that, rituals for Chesed, Netzach, Jupiter, Venus, and maybe Ieosod/Luna.
The thing is they have no real knowledge. Real knowledge doesnt come from books. Real knowledge is moksha, liberation.
They quote books and are human encyclopedia but they dont have the state of siva, they only read about things. No experience
It's probably a bit beyond your know-how at the moment but any ritual tied to Jupiter, Chesed, or maybe Netzach/Venus from Griffin's Ritual Magic Manual, or if you wanna go lightweight with it (which you asked in the first place), Greater Ritual of the Hexagrams with the invoking hexes for Jupiter.
>Real knowledge is moksha, liberation.
And that's precisely why you're such an idiot.
Knowledge is knowledge, moksha is moksha.
Get your shit straight.
If you want me to talk in empty, useless platitudes, I can. But the question is: how is that in any way useful to anyone?
(protip: it's not)
Hey, Maybe i'm just blind but. Would you mind helping to refer me torwards good PDFs for western and goteia occult(more goteia if possible?) I can't really find shit in the mega. I've been meditating for awhile but i've taken an interest in this kinda stuff. First time asking and checking shit out. Thanks.
Are there any esoteric sects of Buddhism?
Is there any ideology that incorporates Buddhism/Shinto into an esoteric dogma?
Yeah, Vajrayana, whole folder of it in the Eastern folder.
I dunno about full blown Shinto integrations. The Himalaya's is functionally where my knowledge takes a nosedive, though I'm p. proficient with Yi King.
Whaddya mean? Look up "Henson Lemegeton" and you tell me if the file's "legit".
If you're looking for trusted material I vet the stuff and there's a fuckton of academic material, but I've got trash in there too like Koetting because I'd rather you get it from here than paying hundreds for it from his fuckhole website.
>"Son, if you're going to smoke pot, do it with me."
>he doesnt know that the real knowledgenis no knowledge. That in enlightenmnet heres nothing to gain or loose
Kek. Tbh you do realize im kidding about all this and have just been shitposting the whole time?
You and thoth might be the only productive /x/phile trips out there
Black moon script basically done, just have to paste in the orations, a bit of cleaning up, and we're done. Might format it a bit as well.
Quite a different rite from Black Sun, interesting to see what Chumbley did with it. I'm beginning to wish I got a bigger vessel, this thing is going to be full as fuck by next November.
The boughs thing might work for the major rites, though I get the impression that the fire is a slightly bigger deal than we realise. Still, Black Moon provides a structure where nothing is burned, and the vessel with a candle stands in as the fiery column, so it's suited to indoor shit. I get the feeling I'll be doing that for HU.
Beginning to see a little why CS are reluctant to discuss it with outsiders- in the hands of the witchcraft crowd this thing would go to shit in a matter of months, with people changing whatever they wanted because of feelpinions. This is definitely one you can't fuck around with, at least for the first run-through.
That having been said, Chumbley is surprisingly encouraging about experimenting with Black Moon, he even suggests a sexual method at th end.
I wrote out my Black Moon materials some time back and did transcriptions for Pact of Blood & Starlight and each of the stars, then um, well here's what's in my working grimoire:
Notes on tools
Black Sun Structure
Image of draco with all the stars named with comments
Pact of Blood & Starlight
The 14 Transvocations
I slipped Black Moon stuff on the same page notes as Black Sun, so I didn't have to take up space with it.
I'm going to add a few pages for sigils and earth signs, actual practical stuff, but leave the big yearly rites out. I IMAGINE I'll have altered them substantially save the two required (Black Moon/Sun) to expand on the ecliptical/Behenian stars.
Oh wait, did you figure out what the missing 11 names were for the Hallowing? I kind of got sidetracked with that.
A working grimoire might actually be a solid idea, I might do one separate to the wiki.
I'm also in two minds about the wiki - it's almost guaranteed to piss CS off, which isn't great given that literally no one else has experience with this shit. I'll keep it up, but the last thing I want is for fluffy wiccans to get hold of it and think the DBoE is something they can just carve up and jam parts of it into their own rites. I dunno, I'll have a think about how I'll approach it.
A map of draco is also a good idea, might get on that. I'm doing to start trying to identify it in the night sky next time I'm back home, the sky is clearer there.
Incidentally, I like the way Chumbley did separate illustrations for each rite's circle, it's a nice touch. Too bad all the Helen Oliver art got removed before publication
>Oh wait, did you figure out what the missing 11 names were for the Hallowing? I kind of got sidetracked with that.
Yeah, in my notes and just read over the section again, it's the 140 star names, plus the two names listed for each point in the table, bringing it up to 160, then a single cry of Azhdeha at the end, it's sandwiched between the Pact of Blood & Starlight.
>you don't want your thing to be a magnet for the fluffbunnies
Hold on, someone's already kinda mangling the shit, I'll link it in my next post.
If you wanna email me about the trajectory of the wiki, I'd be more than willing to give more input.
>Hold on, someone's already kinda mangling the shit, I'll link it in my next post.
If it's one of the tumblr people I think I have an idea who it might be.
Cool, I'll pop you an email related to that now. Haven't gone through your notes in too much detail yet so I'll email you about that tomorrow probably, it's becoming a great body of work
>Patrick J. Larabee, published 2012 via Aeon Sophia Press...
>The book concludes with a series of invocations to sixteen faithful gods and goddesses that encircle the ‘I’ and this retinue is given as: Hekate, Qayin, Lucifer, Lilith, Samael, Rahab-Tiamat, Baphomet, Tubal Cain, Naamah, Mahazhael, Lilis, Janus, Ruha, Azazel, Lucifera, Asmodeus, all of them with deep and thick ties to witchblood proper.
IJS, it looks like Chumbley was WAY pickier about his construction of the Witch-parents than this guy.
About 99.9% of "Left Hand Path" material is occult fanfiction written to make you feel like you're touching something dark and forbidden that you own and read it. Especially that Sitra Achra book. A buddy bought it and its a heap of turds. When cornered on it most LHP people describe embodiment as the goal but you'll hear the same thing from GD folks or whatever. Which is the main "RHP" they often set themselves against.
Didn't work that guy too hard though, Lemegeton has more interesting entities. Better be with 72 of 'em.
No, sorta/not really if you're competent.
I've got a couple Solomonic books in the Grimoires folder, Henson's Lemegeton is the best.
Peterson's next best, in terms of pure preservation of material:
Crowley's Illustrated Goetia by LMD is, well, meh, but it's not trash, can get you started.
So piss and moan, huh?
This is not entirely the case. If you look at the ONA or TOB system, for example, it is a fairly straightforward path. In fact in speaking to an ONA member, he suggested that serious adherents not accumulate excessive manuscripts but instead apply one or two fanatically and to the hilt. The basis of this is not so much occult speculation, but rather, real practical acts conducted in the flesh.
None of that sets it apart other than the spooky aesthetic and flaky posturing to make yourself look like a comic book villain. Tell me then. What really sets the "left hand path" apart from the "right hand path".
Got any texts related to St. Muerte?
Nigger I've been saying for ages now that magic isn't real.
What the fuck do you want me to say?
It's a matter of perspective. Some people want that supernatural context, others don't.
I'm in the latter category. That, however, doesn't mean that I'll just up and generalize my opinions upon everybody, because everyone's entitled to do their own research and thinking, and come to some conclusions.
>most churches aren't hollowed
That's not the case here in Poland. But then we're Catholic-central.
Can I tripfag here?
Im newer to the occult in general but I plan on starting a religion at some point and I enjoy reading occult readings. I honestly just want a solid occult general and am willing to make it better by contributing. There's no place on the internet besides maybe fringe that is decent for occultic.
>I plan on starting a religion at some point
You're the cancer of the world.
>There's no place on the internet besides maybe fringe that is decent for occultic.
gb2 /fringe/ then.
It's a shitpile of cancer as well.
Disavowing the supernatural in one sentence then claiming divine providence in the next. I wut.
Still you were way into low magic before I left last time. phyc model suits you better.
Having spent more time than I would have liked with the clergy in the states, and in the pews at various cathedrals, their songs sound empty and their recitation just repetition. Even sometimes listening to audio from regardie and hall, they sometimes sound like they are trying to imitate the church instead of vibrating. It's a shame. And from what I hear from other friends over there, the church in poland sounds far more like a political body than a spiritual one.
can trip anywhere you want, just so long as you're willing to deal with the occasion legion fag.
>start a religion
you've either got to tell a real funny joke, be able to do a few miracles, or be really good at manipulating people if you want to do that. the occult really isn't needed for that type of thing.
>Disavowing the supernatural in one sentence then claiming
>divine providence in the next. I wut.
You do realize ground is made hollow by ritual and sacraments,
Those are widely practiced in Poland, especially by Catholics
and the Orthodox Church. A very important part of the
>Still you were way into low magic before I left last time.
>phyc model suits you better.
Yeah, I definitely feel better doing this than that. Mostly
because I know I can always rely on the things I read, since
it's actually researched and evidence-based, rather than
reliant on personal experience.
>Having spent more time than I would have liked with the clergy
>in the states, and in the pews at various cathedrals, their
>songs sound empty and their recitation just repetition.
Correct. Because they're not supposed to be vibrating. Have you
noticed how their voice just "gets into your head"? It's
supposed to; that's how they operate, and it's one of their
many conditioning tricks.
>Even sometimes listening to audio from regardie and hall, they
>sometimes sound like they are trying to imitate the church
>instead of vibrating. It's a shame.
Well, if it worked for them, it worked for them. Can't argue
with results, except when they're absent.
>And from what I hear from other friends over there, the church
>in poland sounds far more like a political body than a
Politics is the purpose of religion, and "spirit" is never
defined in coherent, human, terms. I.e. I don't think it's
anything more than a bullshit excuse for people to subscribe to
Just like Allah is an excuse for muslims to imitate Mohammad.
Was listening to a native american gentleman talk once, attempting to explain his upbringing to a bunch of white people. He explained that when he and his tribe spoke of the spirit of an animal, they weren't talking about some glowing ghost version of the animal running (that idea be very stupid). But that the spirit of an animal being all the things associated with that animal with a persons head. The bear for example being strong and fierce and having knowledge of herbs (bears do seem to have some knowledge of which roots to eat to self medicate). So when they refer to a shaman or man having the spirit of bear, they don't mean he's literally possessed by a ghost animal, but that he has the traits that they would associate with a bear.
Using this little allegory here. Lets say that the spirit of a person is all the things associated with that person, the cohesive and sometimes contradictory whole. Both the conscious and the subconscious and the physical; all the things they think of themselves, and all the things other perceive in them.
This definitions fits with the general usage of the word. Something can be said to be "in the spirit of things" if it is inline with the general perception and actions of something else. Much the same with the term "spiritual successor" with something being called the spiritual successor to something else if it functions in the same manner, and gives others the same impression as its predecessor.
Now to continue this line of thought. If we are going by the definition of spirit as both the internal and external whole of something, than a spiritual organization would be one that both sought to understand the spirit of something, and helped that something gain a better understanding of itself, of the spirit of itself. Or to be a truly spiritual institution (in this case institution would be the entire standing body of something, the people, the teachings and associated egregores ((egregore in this case being long rooted cultural meme)) would have to be about understanding and working with the spirit (total sum) of a person or group or nation, in a way that leads to greater understanding.
So any institution that demands strict adherence instead of flexible understanding, would not be considered spiritual.
Black and white is so bland. Understanding implies guidelines, it's how those guidelines are acted upon is the determining factor.
Confusion is the natural state of affairs. Embrace it.
Made a sigil for the first time. Plan on lighting it up tomorrow.
I was wondering if I could also make a few more sigils with different desires than this one and just burn them all in one sitting. Will that be okay or will that diminish the effect of the main one that I want to focus on most?
Also, should I keep a record of these sigils somewhere?
Yes, it's fine. Just make sure your trance is deep enough.
You can keep them, or you can stow them away. In a perfect scenario, you want to forget about them entirely in deep trance.
Another question is how to phrase the intent. Is it "I want ___" or "I will ___"?
If I made a sigil that says "I want to have a billion dollars" wouldn't that just result in me wanting a billion dollars forever rather than actually having a billion dollars?
Instead, it could be written as "I have a billion dollars". It sounds more affirmative of what the desired outcome is, right?
>Is it "I want ___" or "I will ___"?
None of those.
In a perfect world, you want something along these lines:
>On the day of XYZ, I am FGH, and I feel ABC.
>It sounds more affirmative of what the desired outcome is, right?
Also Liber Israfel.
Ritos y Mitos de la Muerta en México y Otras Culturas
As for your last question it tends to rest on conceptions of purity.
No idea, friend.
Yeah, I've posted a good deal on /fringe/. It's most ideologues and various white nationalists sperging out about Bardon, giantess fetishes, and "look how le chaotic my magick is".
I stopped in the other day and it did look a bit better though, when this thread finishes off I'll post the update compilation and the new alchemy folders here and there.
There's still a surplus of information in there. Let me preface myself a little bit.
Coming from an extremely logical background. Raised catholic. Found myself exploring psychedelics and eastern mysticism in my twenties. Have had several 'irrational experiences' which balance against the rational legal education I'm pursuing.
Recently found this topic interesting, particularly the idea of will influencing perceptions and the world around me.
Have also struggled with depression and a dark DMT journey in which I was shown my innermost self, and it was a dark shadowy abyss.
How's that for a more refined way to suggest a starting point?
...not a whole more info on what you actually want to learn.
As I say, pick something that looks interesting an explore it. If you want eastern mysticism, there's more than you can shake a stick at in there.
That. I get my numbers wrong.
>How's that for a more refined way to suggest a starting point?
Leave the MEGA, start with the Google Drive; there's an index file with some pointers on what's what.
First thing you want to read is either Elman's "hypnotherapy" or Parkhill's "Answer Cancer". Both explain the system very well. The latter is more modern in its approach.
That should sate your logical background rather well.
itt lost in the maze
ill skip this thread, just thought you should know,
>he doesn't know at least two tripfriends ITT make blood sacrifices to the reptilian Nephilim from Thuban
>it's a "the thread's almost dead and I'm hard pressed to care about my post quality" post.
>the opening notes of Fortunate Son starts wafting through the air.
Stop wishing you could sit down and shut and work and ACTUALLY sit down and shut up and work.
On a scale of Jared Fogel to Joe Fritzl?
About a J.D. Gunther.
So, starting with Enochian and got a few qs.
1) How careful do I have to be outside of what the books on the mega tell me.
2) Does the quality of worksmanship/material on my tools of practice (the watchtower tablets, the dagger, cup and wand/scrying mirror) impact the rituals in significant ways?
3) What other precautions and preparations can I take along with those described in the books?