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Suicide: cowardice vs objective calculation
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You are currently reading a thread in /x/ - Paranormal

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Let's get this straight; only an imbecile would think that most suicides are born out of cowardice.
Either that or they just do it as a moral obligation and to disencourage.

If you have needs and striving for something and you objectively can't have it even tough you tried rigoriously, there really isn't a reason to live then isn't there?!
It would just be shameful and a waste of time to continue a life like that.

People shouldn't be sad about suicide, if they really wan't to pull it off and have reason to it then more power to tem! It should be a happy event for them filled with anticipation and redemption.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qef8daryXy8
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let's get this straight, you still haven't learned? great. see you next post.
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>>17170740
>redemption
>suicide

Pick one you babbling autist
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>>17170740

It's a complicated topic. Some warrior societies understand that death is inevitable and so it is best had through glory in combat if possible, or by performing a duty (like Seppuku), but suicide for most people is not that. Most people are not killing themself for a greater cause, this robs their death of any honor it might have had otherwise.

When Theodore Roosevelt's wife and mother died on the same fucking night he probably wanted to kill himself. Instead he wrote "the light has gone out from my life" and went west and started kicking ass and pushing animals around because he knew the pain of life could be escaped by just being a man, being the hardest most adventurous man you can. After doing that long enough he suddenly found his spirit had returned and went back east to become the President of U.S. But he could have just put a pistol in his mouth.

I don't agree with suicide but I believe even when things are at the lowest in your life you still have the potential to be something great and it's worth trying. If you have to escape yourself and remake yourself, do it. This is better than unmaking yourself.
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>>17170821
I like you. I'd buy you a beer.
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>>17170821
I was talking about well calculated suicide, not just a whim to numb a temporal pain.
I would even go as far as to argue that to kill a person out of mercy who is irredeemably sick whether mentally or physically would be the ethically right thing to do.
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>>17170833

That works. Nice masonic dubs.

>>17170842

Nihilism is easy. In that regard I understand it. But altruism is sacred. It's best to integrate both, the yin and yang into your philosophy. Have you ever known someone who killed themself? I have and I played and laughed with him as a child.
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>>17170842
Calculations done without numbers are subjective at best. The phrase 'well calculated' could mean anything depending on who was saying it.

Think less about people killing themselves and go try to do something you find some kind of meaning or joy in.
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>>17170740
I've been living with depression since I was a kid. I've always wanted to die, and that feeling increases the more I live in this lonely sludgepit of a city.
I haven't accomplished anything worthwhile in my lifetime, and I feel that the world is designed to keep me from succeeding at anything. While I know in my mind that there are people who would be very hurt if I decided to end my life, that's not how I feel because my illness drapes a veil over my heart. It's very hard for me to find joy in anything.
Sometimes I want my death to be quiet, and for no one to know about it. At other times, I want my death to be dramatic and highly publicized, a giant "fuck you" to the world. Either way, I want to die.
At the end of the day, I don't think I have the balls to kill myself, so I've taken up urban exploration in the hopes that I can see spoopy /x/ things and maybe die by accident from falling through a broken floor or something.
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>>17170842

For what reason would a person calculate suicide unless they were experiencing a desire to no longer live? That desire doesn't come from pain - it comes from a lack of joy, a lack of appreciation for the life they're living.

To argue that emotional pain is temporal but that somehow whatever you're talking about is not is rather unusual. We've all experienced nihilistic thoughts in our lives - the people who found them to be anything but temporal are people who were not able to find enough appreciation in their existence to crowd out the feelings of insignificance.

So in that sense it's just as temporal as anything else. Existence itself is temporal. Snuffing it out is entirely due to temporal discomfort and nothing else.
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>>17170740
i was with my friend when he killed himself by overdosing on heroin. he had a brain tumor doctors couldnt operate on without making him braindead. he was in a lot of pain.

made me promise i wouldnt call anyone for at least 2 hours so he couldnt be revived. he made a video explaining the situation so i wouldnt get in trouble. his mom thanked me for being there for him because she couldnt do that.

i completely understand why people do it.

teddy, i fucking love and miss you man.
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>>17170821
This is optimist babble, for one, there is no great forests and wild mountains to escape to nowadays, no game to eat or fish to catch.
And what little is left is either to far away(not to mention border restrictions) or there are laws that prevent you from doing what I said before.
Good luck remaking yourself working at Mcdonalds.
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>>17171286
Your not imagining it anon, the world really is about keeping you down.
I am into urban exploration too, want to share spooly stories?
Give me your mail or skype :3

>>17171338
You did good anon, most people deserve some one at their side in the end.
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>>17171422
This, unfortunately, is all too true, and part of the reason I want to die. The world just isn't what it once was. There is no peace and quiet, no privacy anymore. No more real freedom. The world is dead and gray.
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>>17171049
Its not very nihilistik if i think a man should know when he knows he lost the game.
I have a more epicurean sense of suicide.
Why should someone waste his time away with failure? If there is reincarnation, it would be a good move to end your failed life and start over right away.
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>>17171233
>>17171233
i guess you're right. phrased it wrong.
It's indeed very subjective and i can only imagine very rare instances where you would feel the game is really done for you.
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>>17171442
>The world is dead and gray
There is still purpose in trying to change the world into a better place. But if you're not able to, then suicide might still be an option.
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>>17171338
fuck man your a strong person. that just made me cry a bit.
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>>17170740

Obviously if you consider suicide an option it should not matter that it is considered so horrible by the human populace.

I agree, great men suicide all the time.

If you don't like Cobain, suicide or not, you can fuck right off!
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Depression is an illness, and those who die from it are no better or worse than those who die from any other.
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>>17173017

Kurt Cobain is terrible

>>17170740

Depression alone doesn't usually cause suicide. What usually causes suicide is depression alongside a lack of inherent meaning in life, aka being afflicted with a case of nihlism. Typically it is this sudden disillusionment in a state of depression that makes one kill themselves.

But that's thinking reasonably anon. in order to beat nihilism, you really have to go beyond thinking realistically and challenge the absurd head on. Recognize and accept that something is impossible but attempt to do it anyway. At this point suicide really becomes the boring answer. Go read some Camus or something nigga.
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>>17172532


>Its not very nihilistik if i think a man should know when he knows he lost the game.
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>>17170821
thanks, casually passing by and needed to hear this
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>>17170740
I don't believe that there is any objective purpose or obligation in life. Even if there was a god, his existence was probably just as accidental as we believe ours to be.

Everything in our lives we must decide for ourselves, we give ourselves purpose and meaning, no God or man should dictate our own lives nor should we dictate theirs, our existence is our own. We have no obligation to live just as we have no obligation to die, you can muffle it up with words and morals or try to manipulate those YOU love/hate into living/ending THEIR lives, but the truth is none of that matters. We should not let those words direct the course of our own lives, our own desires. If someone finds life to be suffering, someone who was thrust into this existence AGAINST THEIR WILL, then they have every right and power to leave if they want to, just as they have the right to live if they so choose. We can exist to help others, but nobody's existence should be to serve their whims entirely without their consent.

Personally I don't enjoy life, and one day hope to work up the courage to end it. There is nothing left for me here, and even if there was I cant be bothered to go chase it. Right now, and in every moment since my conception, I have not wanted to be here, and I think I have the freedom to die just as much as anyone else. I hope you all have a happy existence, but it's not wrong if you don't.
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>>17171441
Dunno if you're still around, but here's my email. Sorry for replying so late, I was getting home from work.
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>>17176786
fuck, I forgot we don't have an email option anymore.

[email protected]
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It goes against one's own humanity. You may as well shoot your neighbor, molest his child, and eat both of them. There are mechanisms in your brain which prevent suicide. It's difficult to do for a reason: you're not supposed to.
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>>17176796
Just like how it's difficult to go to the moon or build a house with electricity or create the fucking Internet, there is no supposed to. False equivalence doesn't make it wrong, humanity is an idea, not an objective measurement. There are mechanisms in your brain that prevent you from doing a ton of meaningless stuff too, doesn't mean it's automatically wrong or equivalent to devouring children. Plus we also have mechanism in our brain which actually encourage that sort of vile behaviour, such as rape or murder, it's our ability to think and act beyond the mechanisms that allowed us to even come up with this concept of civility.

Tl;Dr: everything you just said is retarded
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>>17176846
> There are mechanisms in your brain that prevent you from doing a ton of meaningless stuff too
None of your examples support this statement. Go take a nap, wake up to some coffee, and try again.
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Suicide is just natural selection in action.

The weak die and the strong survive.
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>>17176977
But that's wrong, there are tons of awful and weak people who live long lives through either sheer luck or money, and a ton of great people who decided this shit world isn't worth living in.

I don't think anyone on this site actually understands natural selection.
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Enlightenment
Is the death of the self and the world
In my opinion nobody should pursue enlighten unless he is ready to kill themselves
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>>17177672
You don't understand the world at all. You think it has existed less time than it has.
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>>17177709
You don't understand that post at all. You think you know what you're talking about but you don't.
The world isn't so black and white.
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>>17172636
Try and do it as an example.
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>>17170740
If suicide where painless you'll see a shit load of more people doing it.
We are just to scared of pain to kill ourself.
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>>17178039
>tfw have a huge fear of blood, gore and pain
>it's literally the only reason I haven't killed myself

I wish voluntary euthanasia was legal in my country, but of course they'd never allow themselves to lose a good moneyslave. That's the only real reason people stop you, not for your sake, but because you serve some kind of purpose to them, be it emotionally, physically or financially.

They even have the gall to act like bringing you into this world is a fucking gift, or you absolutely have to exist because life in all it's suffering is so precious. It's all meaningless trash, self righteous lies to make them feel better. The only reason anyone really "enjoys" life is because they lie to themselves about what it is, or follow the deluded indoctrination of others about why they should keep going.
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Hey now, don't kill yourself.

Who else would do all the shitty jobs I don't want to do? Who would I then exploit because they are to tired from all the hard work?

Even if you have a disease or similar that makes your life a living hell, and absolutely no one wants to help you but rather take advantage of your situation, you are still a coward for killing yourself. - Mr. Best.
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>>17170740

Needs and wants both change over time. Sometimes things you cant live without dont come. After time you might find life works out better that way
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whats the point? is it subjective? or is it objective,based on some all powerful god? who acts indifferent to the suffers of his creations? or is it so meaningful we will never know? personally I would rather suffer so others didnt. bringing joy to another even if they will not remember me is what gives me meaning.
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>>17178182
Just clog your exhaust pipe bro.
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What about succumbing to suicide as an alternative to a greater evil like hurting or killing others out of sadness or anger? If the darkness inside has grown so out of hand that you can no longer control it's influence over you, isn't it better to kill yourself before you become a monster?
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>>17170821
being an achiever is worthless anyway, we are all dust spots wasting time and waiting to die no matter what.
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>>17178182
>>17170740

It's funny. If someone wants to kill themselves, then they should really feel liberated. You have nothing; and that's an amazing thing. you have nothing holding you back. You're capable of anything, and yet you sit there and do nothing. Like, if you're gunna kill yourself you might as well start doing extreme sports or something and die in a fun way, and yet most people seem to want these small, painless deaths. Then there's the breed that say "I'm killing my self out of a noble cause!!1 Better kill myself than hurt others!!". 1. If you really cared about people you wouldn't be killing yourself in the first place. 2. Please, dedicate your life to becoming a super villain or something. That would be infinitely more entertaining than dying in your garage like some little piss ant.

small, painless suicide is the most narcissistic and boring thing a person can do. Like seriously nigga if you don't care whether you live or die go fight crime or dedicate yourself to martial arts or something.
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>>17181565
>hurr durr, why aren't suicidal people with obvious depression energetic and motivated?
Did it ever occur to you that not everyone wants to do that shit? I don't give a crap about making myself suffer any more by doing something I don't want to just because I've got "nothing to lose", I wanna die, not become a super villain or fill my empty life with meaningless distraction because society tells me that I should want to.
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>>17170740
Despair isn't any better than cowardice. Egotism is actually worse.

Any life can serve a function, even if it means unending abject shame. The key is transcending the self. The alternative is true failure.
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>>17181618

Literally angst at it's finest anon.
>I don't care about anything!

Then why are you sitting here arguing wit me fucknut? See, here's the thing anon, rather than even lashing out at society like a good little fuck up, you just want to lie down and do nothing. Your nihlism is not the final form of your belief anon. Refer to >>17174825.

>I want to die

see anon, you don't even know what you want. You don't want to die, you want to cease living. There is a difference here. Wanting to die would mean that you were excited to die, and would be "energetic and motivated" to do so, and you know what? Wanting to die is fine by me. But you don't even want that. Your entire existence is a non-answer to a question that you're simply to afraid to answer. When asked "what do you want" you answer "well; I don't want that" and stop there. You'll continue living anon. Not because society tells you to, but because giving an answer would wound your silly little ego.

but you know what? That's fine by me too. Your mediocrity is magnificent. I look forward to watching you rot away in the most mediocre way possible. A man who enjoys collecting stamps must be an incredibly interesting person for enjoying an activity so dull.
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>>17181681
>All these assumptions and projections
You clearly don't understand depression at all, so maybe drop the armchair psychology and stop pretending you know what everyone else thinks. I never said I don't care about anything, just that I don't want to do all the carefree active normie shit you listed.

I actively want to die, I want to stop existing or go to sleep, not only as a means of escaping this shitty life but to obtaining a better state of existence, null. I have been excited to die, went into fits where I've tried to kill myself eagerly anticipating what comes next, only to end up fucking it up, suffering a lot and ending up in hospital. I've went and had "help" from other twats like you who act like they know everything yet can't seem to comprehend what it's actually like with their narrow selfish materialistic perspectives.
You all seem to think that everyone has to somehow share or fit into your own subjective little perspective, you feign empathy and understanding when in truth you're always just project what you want to see in other people, things that are easier for you to comprehend than what they're actually thinking or feeling.

I know what I want, and I know what I can't have. It's just a matter of what things I want which are available to me. Even so, what I want becomes ever irrelevant, meaningless fluff muffling the best answer there is, not just freedom from this life but also the ultimate answer to all things.

>but you know what? That's fine by me too. Your mediocrity is magnificent. I look forward to watching you rot away in the most mediocre way possible. A man who enjoys collecting stamps must be an incredibly interesting person for enjoying an activity so dull.
And you have the gall to call me angsty. Not everything in existence is about what is interesting or enjoyable. Maybe try not limiting yourself to such things so you can find something more objective than temporary pleasure.
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>>17181766
>Making assumptions and projections while accusing someone of assuming and projecting

>Literally "You don't understand my pain"

>Hasty generalizations

Anon, I'm flattered, but this was never about me. As you and I have both stated, you do not want to die.

> I want to stop existing or go to sleep

there you go anon. You don't want to die at all, you want to stop existing or go to sleep. And as you speak, you only further my points. See, when a person who sees value in life is depressed, they assess the causes of this depression and seek its end. The real issue here is that you're depressed and see no value in life; otherwise you'd desire to continue living because you still find value in life. you are a Nihilist

>And you have the gall to call me angsty. Not everything in existence is about what is interesting or enjoyable. Maybe try not limiting yourself to such things so you can find something more objective than temporary pleasure.

Oh, please enlighten me. I'd genuinely love to hear a nihilist lecture me on higher meaning in life.

And for what it's worth Anon, You should give The Myth of Sisyphus a read. It's a book on this exact subject, you know.
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I want to kill myself for the sake of my wife. I have crohns disease and I'm and holding her back so much.

I'm not scared of the pain...I'm scared of Yahwehs judgement
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>>17183543
>I have crohns disease
Damn, that's some bad shit (no pun intended.) I once knew a really sweet girl who had this. Broke my fucking heart.
>I'm and holding her back so much
Don't talk that way about people who love you. She's the one who decides if you're holding her back, not you. Give yourself a break FFS.
>I'm scared of Yahwehs judgement
Relax. If he exists, and is worth a damn as your god, he'll forgive you. After all, he's the ultimate cause of your pain.
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