This is a bit of a rant.
Does anyone else just get tired of the hobby? On one end you got hipster collectors, dumb kids, and ecelebs while on the other you got the scalpers.
Video games have changed so much past 4th and 5thgen it’s crazy. I don’t hate change but when the change is shooters like CoD and Halo and all the other things wrong with the industry like DLC. It just makes me not want to be part of it.
The scalpers are what really gets me. No other hobby or industry is that bad. Both modern and old video games. For example, Bayonetta 2 is now going for $90+ new on ebay.
PC games don’t escape this either. I just bought the new Rainbow Six game and they want $20 something dollars for the 4k texture pack…. It’s just out of control. The online environment is so different now too. So many 3rd worlders from South America and Russia. It’s hard to get a good game these days.
Even /vr/ has changed unfortunately. Dank memes are the norm now.
Most people here will agree that the modern industry sucks, that's why we're on /vr/.
You can emulate if the cost of retro games is a problem. You have almost a lifetime worth of games that can be emulated for free and with good quality.
I just don't pay attention to the opinions of hipsters or kids I think sound dumb. I avoid the games I don't like as well and there are still plenty to play. Also I like DLC. It's almost never necessary, and those games are easily ignored. In some games like fighters, it's great to have the option to update rosters and re-balance characters if necessary. Even in the event that it's a character I don't want to buy, I like that it still gets added as an option for someone else to fight and another opponent for me.
>No other hobby or industry is that bad.
This part is just plain wrong. Most hobbies based around collecting are like this.
I feel you man. Look at retro collecting as a game for people with disposable income. These are the prices that people are willing to pay for these games, and if you think that's too expensive, well, that's life, can't always get everything you want.
Personally, the high prices make it more exciting for me. It wouldn't be very fun if I could just pick up a $5 bin with every game I wanted and then some. With the high prices, buying a rare retro game is more of a treat, it encourages me to shop around for the best prices and decide what I want to buy next, etc. And like I said, anyone who just wants to play the games and doesn't care about collecting can just emulate.
Your complaints about modern scalping with things like DLC are more valid. Just don't support companies with shoddy business practices and hopefully they'll go away eventually.
Fighting game characters are pretty much the worst example of paid DLC though. They strictly increase the cost of the game for people who want to start playing it competitively, since tournaments virtually always run the games with all updates and all (relevant) DLC.
If you're just talking about free balance patches, then sure, that's great.
High prices are one thing. I don't mind that. Scalping shit and the BiN artificial price is another thing.
If auctions actually had the prices these games for it'd be another thing.
You got near double the price for a brand new game. That's ridiculous.
>The scalpers are what really gets me. No other hobby or industry is that bad.
Try getting into collecting dollfies
dollfie scalping involves people sleeping the whole night on the street in order to get the first places when Volks holds an event at any convention or store, then they get pretty much all the limited edition ones (which are usually less than 100 or 50) and sell them at exorbitant prices at Yahoo auctions.
It's a lot less popular than Nintendo characters, but the dollfie scalpers are some dedicated motherfuckers. I'm sure other niche hobbies have it bad too.
>You can't play modern games as a whole without at least paying for DLC and an online paywall.
One of my most played games this gen, GTAV, has no paid DLC and isn't behind a paywall on PC.
I don't know what point you were trying to make, though, as that has nothing to do with anything I just said.
That was my point though. If you don't want to buy the character, you don't pay for the DLC but the game still gets patched with that character in it. You just don't have the option of playing as them, but you can still fight against them. So even if you don't spend a penny on DLC, you still get the benefit of it.
The other side of DLC is mostly either expansion packs or extra item stuff. Extra items is always very easily ignored. There are almost no games where it's important at all and none of those are good anyways. There is the whole aspect of "free to play" games, but that's not so much DLC as a different way of trying to sell.
The other side is expansion pack stuff, and again I love it. If it's a game I really like, I'm glad that expansions on them are a lot easier now. No more waiting for a full release again which inevitably gets the price jacked because it has to be physically distributed.
Red Dead Redemption's Undead Nightmare expansion is a perfect example of this done well. The game is full and excellent on it's own, but if you want to keep playing there's more available.
Also if you wait a bit, if the game was successful there will almost certainly be a special release with all the DLC for a lower price.
Theres ups and downs in any hobby OP.
I collect Comics, Games Workshop games and Vidya, the first two not as much as i used to, because GW is all about jewgold now and i don't have that much room for new comic books anymore.
The game industrie is changing, actually this is a pretty interesting time to be a video game enthusiast, but this changes is something you have to get used to if you are in the hobby for decades already.
Sure forced online, DLC and piracy protection is absolute cancer and the blockbuster industry turned everything into a rather unhealthy direction, but at the same time we get a lot of indie stuff and some of the blockbuster monies rubbed of onto more interesting titles.
Overall i'm fine with the situation, i just aquired a PS3 and am hyped about the new and shiny things i will play on it, also i'm in the process of building a survival horror collection, recently played Silent Hill on wii and silent Hill 2 on original XBox.
Another thing is mobile stuff, i love my 3DS and there are even some Android games that are fun on the Tablet.
And you link to the post where I show a game with extra content that gets added completely for free.
Also this makes me laugh every time. I'm one of the oldest people on this board. But keep throwing out that kid line, you gotta shoehorn condescension in anywhere you can!
You're asking me to list bad DLC and then are saying it's good while expecting me to take you seriously. Good one.
The examples are rampant. Every AAA games has DLC the first week or a patch.
You're the one who calls everyone you disagree with "kid" I'm just pointing out how idiotic it is. Actual age means little, maturity is what's important. Throwing condescending digs about how young the person you're replying to must be is pretty fucking immature. I don't know what age your driver's license says, but you're acting like a 12 year old.
>You're asking me to list bad DLC
I didn't ask you to make a list of anything.
We've reached the point where you have games like DOA5LR, where the actual game is free and you pay to unlock the story mode, arcade mode, and the other half of the roster, as well as an optional $400 worth of DLC alternate costumes (not even exaggerating about that figure).
Like I said earlier, "free to play" is a different model from DLC. While I'm sure if you wanted to, you could buy all $400 worth of DLC, ,but it's not necessary in any way.
I haven't paid attention to DOA because I don't care about it, but that model doesn't sound horrible if the price structure is right. I don't give a fuck about story modes in fighting games, or buying extra costumes. So if I could just pay for arcade mode and unlocking the other half of the roster, that would be good in my books.
I'm not even sure what point you're trying to make here. No one in this thread said all DLC is good.
I can't tell if you're shitposting or too dense to understand things beyond black and white.
>How am I suppose to argue if you say there is "no examples of DLC that's required or really necessary in any way"?
You can start by arguing against something that was actually said by the people in this thread.
I'd assume so. As I said if you're not a kid/teen anymore and still support DLC then wow. Makes me wonder what running a video games company is like when I can just charge season passes to people like you before the game is out.
>How am I suppose to argue if you say there is "no examples of DLC that's required or really necessary in any way"?
Not him, but can you mention any examples of DLC that are truly "necessary"?
You get put into the a different que if you don't have all the maps. Added that maps prior the 4th CoD had always been free.
They are a requirement if you want to play and have a chance of enjoying online.
>I'd assume so
That's why I made the comment about maturity. DLC didn't even exist when I was still a teenager, but you assume that purely because I don't hate it as much as you do, I must be some kid. However old you are, grow the fuck up.
That sounds the way some shooters worked back when I played then on PC. If you didn't have map packs, you got on servers without them. I guess if almost everyone bought the map pack and you were one of the few who didn't that would be a problem.
I only buy DLC for games I really like.
So that usually means I'm only buying it for FROM's games.
I did think the 20 dollar bloodborne DLC was over priced, but it was mostly good content.
>OP getting mad about scalpers and hipsters
Yeah scalpers suck, but it's not like you don't have opportunities to order the game when it's announced or released. Don't blame the Scalpers, blame Nintendo for not putting out enough copies of games like Bayonetta 2, and Pikmin 3 which is why you see them maintaining their value.
There are so many cheaper games for most systems that are actually enjoyable, but if it's on a Nintendo console and it's not some big name like Mega Man, Mario, Metroid, or whatever then people just don't even know it exists.
>OP calling others hipsters
>Only wants the hipster games
>You can emulate if the cost of retro games is a problem
Or you could buy cheap bootleg cartridges if you prefer to play on the actual system.
I seriously think that there is a number of /vr/ frequenters that are currently experiencing mid-life crisis. They are lashing out now that they realise the world is moving on and they're not on the bus. And by world, I'm talking about everything not just gaming.
>Unhappiness with life and lifestyle that previously made him or her happy.
>Boredom with people and things that may have previously been of interest.
These are the signs people.
OP: Go buy a sports car or something. Or just stick to discussing the games that you are interested in.
I'm only 23 and I already identify with a lot of the bitterness here.
That's why I'm making my own game. The imaginations of others don't satisfy me, so I need to rely on my own imagination.
No I am not some pleb at the mercy of other's inspirations and choices. If I want gaming to be more fun and more interesting I'll start romhacking or translating or I'll find something new to play or I'll make my own game. Games have enormous untapped potential as a medium and if I'm unsatisfied I can only place the burden upon myself to make something greater.
Good thing my hobby is playing games and not buying them, I'll get tired of this.
When bugs me most is the levels of autism in retro communities. I guess having someone to discuss a game with is half the fun, but then you have communities like /vr/ that just churn out general after general of autistic circlejerking. At that point, I don't even want to play those games anymore.
As for price-gougers, I just pirate the more expensive shit, assuming it's something I even want to play.
>Does anyone else just get tired of the hobby?
Me personally, I don't really regard retro gaming as a hobby, no more than I regard owning CDs or DVDs as a hobby. It's just more media for me to consume to stave off boredom.
I picked up on retro games because they're often littered throughout thrift stores in my area, and I tend to live a frugal lifestyle. I've played newer games on occasion, but I just don't feel like the hardware is worth investing in at retail value, especially when 3D games of past generations can be just as fun and immersive.
>Except Saturn... fucking Saturn.
What about the Saturn?
>Does anyone else just get tired of the hobby?
As far as aspects like collectors, scalpers and basically, people who give too much of a fuck...yes, I hate "the hobby", as far as those sorts of things are "the hobby".
>For example, Bayonetta 2 is now going for $90+ new on ebay.
Shop on pirat-ebay and not normal-ebay. Afterall, it's only filthy dumb collector scum who are part of "the hobby" that care about such purist ideals as owning the physical copy.
>Even /vr/ has changed unfortunately
all boards turn to shit eventually as they age. /vr/ isn't quite there yet, though.
You're just not a clever collector.
Do you know what's getting SERIOUSLY overlooked right now?
The Playstation 2.
I just bought a PS2 collection for under $100 including exclusives that you know are going to balloon in price when they're the same age as the PS1 like Freak Out, Whiplash, Breathe of Fire and Code Veronica.
It's too late to be collecting for 4th gen and 5th gen is getting pricey too - especially the Sega Saturn.
Prep your PS2 and Xbox collection. You can play the games with emulation and the titles are still cheap.
I bought the last copy of Champions of Norrath from a not so near Gamestop just to play, but it was just a bare disc so it was $5 CAD. Over the years I've rebuilt that sucker with a replacement PS2 DVD case, cover art, and manual book.
I go shopping for PS2 games occasionally and it makes me happy to see that same game stored in glass cases with a relatively demanding price tag. Makes me think I did a good job restoring my disc to a full package.
Back then it was second-rate platformers and shooters and fighting games, nowadays it's second-rate platformers and fps and fighting games. Mega Man and Street Fighter had Assassins Creed and CoD syndrome years before AC and CoD's creators even learned how to code. Even DLC had predecessors like the Satellaview service, even though it was more experimental and was barely used, and also it didn't impact actual gameplay. On the other side, games like Street Fighter would have only profited from a modern-styled DLC service instead of having 15 revisions of the same game.
In it's core though games have barely changed. Extreme prices were always the norm. Scalpers aren't a today's phenomenon. Catering to retards has always been a thing, as were retarded/third world communities. The main difference is that you yourself have gown up and no longer hold the same limited rose-tinted mindset you had back when you were a kid (or a tween).
tl;dr take your rant accompanied by an ""aesthetic""" anime pic back to tumblr where you might find more nostalgiaffgots to support your retarded worldview. Either that or enjoy retro games and modern games for what they are - games, and stop bitching.
It's really easy to spot the differences between someone that actually knows these games and has heart for it, and people that like youtube top 10 meme stuff. Emulation keeps the hobby cheap/free. Hackers and geeks find new information on ancient games. I think this hobby is far from dead/taken over by shitty people.
That's actually a good p-
>it's just another buttblasted collector
I mean, I also like my physical copies but I would just get my favorites or games I know I'd really like to play on the original hardware, which are always playtested on emulators. AND I must also feel really attached to them. Collecting for the sake of it is stupid.
Unless we're talking something legendary I don't see how you're going to spend that much. Just suck it up and get the stuff you need and flashcart/burn the rest.
I've noticed the same thing. It makes me feel bad for them, stuck with the bitterness that everything is getting worse and worse all the time. I want to shake them and say look around! It's actually pretty great! But some people just really want to wallow.
If they are, then that's great. Actually makes me happier. Because no, I'm not deep down unhappy at all. I think things are great and most things, gaming included gets better and better every year. It's it's all a lot of tongues in cheeks and trolling then awesome.
Modern game development is trash, yeah. Realize too that you have the luxury of choice; you can cherry pick the creme de la creme from all of gaming's history right from your computer (assuming it isn't a potato) in minutes. When you have 6 Mega Man titles, 9 Final Fantasy titles, and god knows what else in front of you, you're not likely to remember 80 dollar game carts, short ass controller cables, faulty game slots, corrupted memory cards, shitty licensed titles, or any of the other lame parts of /vr/. Maybe you've blown through those 6 Mega Mans and 9 Final Fantasys already though and you're feeling vexed because there's literally nothing else good to play? Channel your frustrations and make a good game yourself then. Be the change you want to see. That's what I'm doing anyway.
>Modern game development is trash
Not all of it though, some is legitimately great. Just the same as not all old development was great. There's always been a mix. And as always you can ignore what you think is trash and just go for the cream.
Yeah, you're right, I was just being instinctively pessimistic. I pick up the odd modern title now and then, mostly for Nintendo's systems. The adage is true though; they don't make 'em like they used to. Even Nintendo is stuck in a feedback loop of recycled concepts, so it would seem. I think the industry in general is hitting a sort of plateau where the manpower required to create the sort of gaming experience that normies expect from their systems is spiraling up and out of control as technology improves. These games get prettier but scope gets shaved off as more and more polish gets applied; more and more fresh ideas get ripped away through design-by-committee. It's a tricky balance and I think the industry is gonna have to readjust people's expectations soon. What's going on right now isn't really sustainable.
>I'm only 23 and I already identify with a lot of the bitterness here.
Because you're one of the sane ones who understands the arguments being made. It's not like scalpers will suddenly disappear and shitty games will stop being made if someone acknowledges a mid-life crisis and gets a porsche. Once upon a time retro collecting was very affordable, but even that market has become saturated and competitive. I'm just glad I completed mine before the prices went astronomical.
The thing is, people always expect the lastest technology, even if it's flawed. They don't want robust packages full of polish in both technical and design.
And then when games that are truly polished may just not cater to your tastes. I couldn't bring myself to enjoy Uncharted, for example, even if I consider the games to be decent, I find a lot of flaws in them that I personally couldn't pass as good, but some other people might care less about controls and design and more about graphics and story/characters, and that's not objectively bad.
On the other hand I loved the fuck out of Bayonetta, might as well be one of the best games I have ever played, me being mainly into 8-bit and 16-bit systems the most. And I loved both the game design and also the story and characters, that combination is also important, but I don't think I would have cared enough if I didn't enjoy the core game, story and characters are a nice plus, but even still some people might not enjoy the whole japanese-y weirdness and typical Platinum over the top presentation, people have different tastes and that's it. Luckily that taste can change and evolve, too.
I still love pretty much every game I liked back when I was younger, but now I can also appreciate modern games like Bayonetta, and I also start liking older games that I didn't liked or cared as a kid, like many RPGs/SPRGs.
I just indeed became a lot more picky over the years.
Splatoon is pretty innovative and very well made. In general I completely disagree with you though. Although there's a lot I don't personally like, I think game design has been getting better and better in many ways. There's a ton of variety and creativity these days, new genres are even appearing more and more quickly.
Also these days it's possible for virtually anyone who's interested enough to make the game they want. Sure there are massive companies designing by committee, but there are also small developers trying weird and new things.
And you might say "but most of that is shovelware trash!" and you'd be right. But as with the heaps of shovelware trash we got dumped on us in Atari days, it ultimately doesn't matter. All that matters is the great stuff that rises to the top.
>There's a ton of variety and creativity these days
>new genres are even appearing more and more quickly
Are we living on the same planet? It's nothing but FPS, MOBA, sports, faux-retro and open-world walking simulators which are just a boring variant of FPS and might as well be 3D tech demos from 1996. Game design has become more stale than it has ever been since the crash. It doesn't help that EA/Activision bought everything out in the west and the Japanese market is dying.
>Are we living on the same planet?
Apparently not, because I see far FAR more variety than that. Also you just mentioned MOBAs which is one of the new genres I was mentioning.
I think there's always been at least 90% crap with a bit of cream on top. But these days I think the cream is excellent.
This desu senpai... I'm worried that Sega Saturn and PS1 collections won't exist for much longer.
You can stave off disc rot byntreating them well and keeping them in the cases, but I don't know what the upper limit is.
>Also you just mentioned MOBAs
Calling it a new genre is a bit of a stretch, it's basically taking the gameplay established in a few levels of a much better RTS (WC3) and turning it into a cancerous e-sport.
Just like to point out this isn't actually true, since DOA5LR costs money. It just has a free version if you want to skip the story mode and just get the characters you want. You can still get the game itself with everything in it and a good amount of free outfits.
That's how new genres come about in most cases. What I don't get is why people like you hate those games so venomously. I only played a tiny bit of them, and it wasn't something that interested me a ton but clearly a lot of people love them.
What's bad about that? It's just more people enjoying games. That's a good thing in my books, I don't give a fuck that it's not a game I'm interested in. They probably wouldn't enjoy playing Roguelikes all day, but for me that's perfect.
That's why I think games these days are so great. Practically whatever floats your boat and cranks your nipples gaming wise, somewhere out there it's probably being done.
Yep, agreed. What's the point in having games like Witcher 3 and Fallout 4 look as pretty as they do if they're not even fun to play?
I hope we see a fracturing in the industry where a minority of games continue to push hardware to new levels of photorealism while the majority of games aim for 6th gen production values. I hope we see a resurgence of unique art styles, like in Wind Waker and Jet Set Radio. I hope 2D gaming continues to grow. I wish that those could become mainstream expectations. The future may look grim, but all hope is not lost.
>but clearly a lot of people love them.
Clearly alot of people are still buying mediocre games which is keeping the whole shitshow going. Younger generations have nothing to compare it to unless they come on 4chan and learn about games with really good gameplay from oldfags. They wouldn't learn anything if 4chan was just another IGN/neogaf where everything is 10/10 and everything is awesome don't ask questions.
I find Witcher 3 incredibly fun though. I had a fantastic time with all of them so far. It's a massive open world RPG with fun combat and interesting quests and characters all over the place.
I do agree with you on the aesthetics thing, and very strongly on games like WW and JSR. As well as I hope 2D continues to grow, but I think it's making a come back with many of the smaller developers.
The trouble with aesthetics now is that everything is HD and making beautiful art is quite hard. So many fall into the trap of trying to make something look "retro" because they think simpler graphics will be easier to pull off. But simple graphics if anything are actually harder to make look good. So many games, even some good ones still look like shit. That's always been the case though.
>Clearly alot of people are still buying mediocre games which is keeping the whole shitshow going.
But my point is that if these people are enjoying these games, to the degree they are then they can't really be that bad of games. If they were, the gameplay wouldn't hold up enough that people would be playing them competitively.
You are calling it a mediocre shit show simply because you don't like them and it's not the kind of game you want to play. I've been playing video games practically since they existed, in early arcades and the 2600. I think game design has gotten steadily better over the years and there is just as solid gameplay in a lot of modern games as there is in older ones.
>people are enjoying these games, to the degree they are then they can't really be that bad of games.
That bad of games? They're mediocre games. Many times kids play them, then forget about them thinking that that's what video games are. A disposable shit medium that you aren't supposed to really get into, like modern Hollywood. MOBAs are popular for a simple reason: they're easy to get into and everyone is playing them. It's a viral effect which does NOT equal quality, just popularity. Compare it to the complexity of a classic RTS and you'll see it's braindead. If you're going to push garbage then this isn't the site to do it on.
>Can you explain to me how the console defining games have gotten better?
I look at the CoD games the same way I see the MOBAs. They're not for me, but they're clearly for someone who is enjoying them and that's good enough for me. I tried several of the Ass Creeds and hated every one, but I know many people like them.
However what happens is that even though the super popular games don't generally appeal to me, they still bring enough gamers in general that other devs make games for the system. I hardly played any of the yearly top 10 360 games, but every years I had plenty of stuff I liked that kept me busy. If that was being supported by a huge player base of kids playing CoD, that's fine by me.
Games are meant to be entertainment. If the people playing them are having fun, that's all that really matters to me. Comparing MOBAs and traditional RTS isn't really a great comparison. They're different genres and the team vs team aspect is a huge thing. It's like saying fighters are more boring that beat em ups because you're only fighting one enemy, not dozens. But it's obviously a terrible comparison.
If the whole MOBA genre dissolves within the next year then the players will I'm sure move on to some other kind of game. That's what I do when I've exhausted the entertainment in a given one.
>Many times kids play them
Bingo. A lot of 20+ gamers forget about this.
I was at my young cousin's house the other day, watching him and his friend play Battlefront 3, and they were having an absolute blast with it. It doesn't matter that EA released half a game so they could scalp people on DLC. It doesn't matter that the first two Battlefronts were better games with more content. The kids got to run around as Luke Skywalker and kill people with a lightsaber, and that was cool as shit to them.
Modern AAA games are targeted at children, much like the biggest releases in generations past were targeted at children. Once you understand this, the state of gaming makes perfect sense.
>If the people playing them are having fun, that's all that really matters to me
and to people who actually care about the medium, there's something far more important and that's quality.
>in b4 but that's subjective!
No it isn't. Either way the market agrees with you though, so shit will only get worse, without a "critical mass of shit" redline that the Atari ran into. Now there are safety valves and no escape from the pressure cooker.
In my opinion, yes. The purpose of a game is a piece of interactive entertainment for someone to enjoy. If people are enjoying them, then they're fulfilling their purpose. What different people find fun varies of course, so games vary as well. Not everyone likes the same things, that would be super boring.
I see no pressure cooker. The game industry was imploding by the end of the Atari days, now it's thriving. And there are still many excellent games coming out. I'm an extremely picky gamer. I dislike at least 95% of everything that gets made, both modern and reto eras alike.
Despite that, these days I always have more great games on my plate I want to play through than time to devote to them all.
I'm saying that kids are enjoying the games that are designed for them. I don't care that it wasn't designed for me because I don't play those games, I play other games.
But like I say here >>2897085 I'm super duper picky about games so I've been used to digging through stuff I didn't like all my life. Try being a teen in the 80's who finds platformers like Mario boring. CoD's popularity is nothing to me these days. I'm too busy playing games.
>And there are still many excellent games coming out.
No, there aren't.
>I see no pressure cooker.
Because you think things are going well. The safety valves are working as intended. Poison, but just with enough sugar to convince people it's good enough for consumption. That sort of banal mediocrity can only end when there's a perception shift among the audience, but whether that will happen this time is another question. They've certainly got you fooled.
>No, there aren't.
We'll just have to disagree on this then. I know how picky I am and I'm inundated with far more great games than I have time for.
If me being "fooled" is having a ton of games I find extremely enjoyable and like playing then I suppose I'm okay being fooled. I also think calling Monster Hunter mediocre is a little hilarious.
that's what happens when the entire scale shifts downward. What were formerly dizzying heights become meh, what was formerly meh becomes DLC-ridden clunky garbage and what was formerly garbage becomes kickstarter with a legion of fans who bought into it defending it to the death.
>DLC-ridden clunky garbage
Monster Hunter only has a little DLC, all of which is free extra quests and missions. How is that bad?
Again, coming from a 40 something extremely picky life long gamer, I think Monster Hunter is one of the best game series of all time and 4 is the best it's ever been.
You're free to disagree, but at this point I think you're pretty much just a bitter crank who's decided to hate everything no matter what. Either way, I feel kind of bad for you. But ultimately that's your problem, you can be sour and upset all you want. I'm very very happy with gaming these days and always looking forward to what's next.
All I'll say is that whichever genre/franchise you choose, the best games have already been made for it. For some genres that doesn't mean much because even their best is crap, but I'll leave the rest up to your imagination and google skills.
You're truly hilarious. I've also been deep into fighters since before they were even really a genre. Fighting games are in an amazing resurgence now with some of the ones now the best ever made.
Roguelikes are another of my lifelong favorites and similarly experiencing a real golden age right now.
We could get into a big fight about either of these, but I will never ever agree that they're getting worse and I can tell from your attitude that you will just dig your heels in and pout so I won't even bother. Instead, have a nice day being mad about the world. I have games to have fun with.
Did you even play Mortal Kombat back in the day? Come on man, we all had fun with it, but it was never a well made series. 9 and X are the only actual good ones they've made. The reality is that outside of KoF and Street Fighter, most retro fighters were pretty bad.
King of Fighters has turned to crap, and that's sad but there are still many excellent series out there. SFIV really is the best, even though I still have a preference for III.
Injustice actually is almost perfect for my fighting tastes. It's not the most popular, but is extremely solid and fun and even not being super popular is still doing quite well player base wise.
I actually think DLC fits really well with fighting games. It comes in two parts, extra characters and extra costumes. I see little point in extra costumes, but if other people want to buy them then I'm fine with that.
As for extra characters, it's great though because the games can have their rosters updated even after it's out instead of waiting for a new game or semi-release the way Capcom did with it's fighters so much.
Instead you just buy the base game. Then when they add more characters you can decide if you want to get them or now. Often now you can even pick to specifically get just one character if you wanted one, but just one.
Then the best part is that even if you didn't buy the new DLC, your game still gets updated so you get the benefit of playing against other people using the new characters even though you didn't decide to buy them.
Ultimately though that stuff is all on the side. What matters is how the base game is designed, and Netherealms really came a long, long way with MK9. Even sticking with the block button, it was a real surprise how good that game is.
Or they could be like the originals and just have you unlock the roster without the fighters being behind a paywall.
DLC is trash. There's no excuse for it. If you like being blind to shit and just throwing money at it because why the fuck not. Go ahead.
You're missing the point. Look at it like Street Fighter 2 and SF2 Turbo, the Alpha series and SF III, Second Impact and Third Strike.
When SF 2 came out, was it incomplete because it didn't have Cammy or DeeJay in it? Of course not. They hadn't been developed yet.
Was Street Fighter 3 incomplete because there was no Chun Li? Actually some people would say yes. But the point is, gamers only choice was to wait for Capcom to release another whole version of the game that they would try to sell you for as much as possible.
But with DLC it's not like that any more. The game gets released and the company continues working because they're a game developer and that's what they do. But now when they make new characters they can release them directly to you, instead of forcing you to buy the whole game over again. So even if you do want the full update, it's far cheaper than it would have been in the days when new boxed copy of the game was the only option.
But that's not even the best part! If you bought vanilla Street Fighter 3 and then your friend got Third Strike, you wouldn't be able to play against each other anymore because you're on different versions of the game.
But now that DLC is a thing, you can stick with the original version of the game and your friend can get the DLC pack if he wants. You can still play vs each other even though your versions are different, and he can even use the new characters he just got even though you didn't buy the DLC.
I think it's a far better system for updating fighters than we had previously. DLC can be shitty and bad, but it doesn't have to be and it most certainly isn't always.
>But now when they make new characters they can release them directly to you, instead of forcing you to buy the whole game over again. So even if you do want the full update, it's far cheaper than it would have been in the days when new boxed copy of the game was the only option.
No, now they purposefully remove some complete characters so they can sell them later as DLC. Or, they release an unplayably buggy beta version, so the game can be out by the xmas buying spree and make more money - they can just patch the game bugs out in the upcoming half year, with some of the missing parts of the game released as DLC.
Then they release the entire game again for full price will all included DLC, with a "Super" prefix or "GOTY Edition" suffix.
SFV is going to allow you to buy characters with currency earned either through gameplay or through real life money.
DLC is good when it's used as an update or expansion pack, shame most devs treat it for jew purposes though.
Many fighters still get released with good sized rosters. But even then, I think the ability to add more characters easily and cheaply via DLC is far, far better than waiting for full boxed expansions the way Street Fighter did for years.
>No, now they purposefully remove some complete characters so they can sell them later as DLC.
That's a pure guess. When my current favorite, Injustice came out, it had a roster of 24 fighters which is pretty robust for a first release. Then there were eventually 6 more characters made available. Perhaps some of them had started development before the game was out, but not all because Netherealms had the community vote on who else we wanted in the game.
Either way though, the important point is that there was no way they would have released the game originally with the 30 character roster. 24 is already a lot for a new fighter, making and testing that many characters would have been financially unsound.
In the old days we would have had one release and then if successful and the company kept making characters there would have eventually been an Injustice: Second Impact or whatever. It would have to be a boxed copy and priced accordingly.
Now, that's all changed. The characters get released when they're done and you can choose to buy them if you want, or ignore them if you don't. Or if you just want Lobo, just buy Lobo. It's your choice. Either way you have the benefit of more characters to play against.
>they release an unplayably buggy beta version
Releasing buggy versions because they can be patched is never good, but also that's been happening on PC since the 90's.
Also with fighters, patching is very important because even though play testers work very hard there's always a lot that gets worked out when tens of thousands of people are playing. Now they can be continually tweaked until perfect. For someone into the player vs player competitive aspect of them, that's a great thing in my eyes.
Messed up my numbers, had to edit and repost. This is what I'm talking about.
That's what you were doing back in ye olde days anyway. Today you pay something like 20 bucks to turn your copy of Super Street Fighter IV into Ultra Street Fighter V. Back then you paid 80 bucks to replace your previous copy of Street Fighter II Turbo into Super Street Fighter II.
The industry is fucked and ruined a lot of genres, but fighting games not only survived unscathed, they flourished.
DLC aside, is SF IV the best in the series? Will V be the best in the series? That's one of the more stable genres (like sports) so it's not hard to point out that they're surviving. FPS is continuing to be FPS just fine too, it's hard to fuck up the formula though they've managed to with several games while those that are "competent enough" are heralded as hot shit.
Yea I love this "the good old days of fighting games"
Can you imagine the bitching that you'd hear about if this board was around in the early 90s
>Mortal Kombat 1992
>Mortal Kombat 2 1993, WHAT THE FUCK BRO I JUST BOUGHT THIS GAME FUCKING CROOKS
>Street Fighter 2 1992
>Street Fighter 2 Turbo 1993
WHERE IS STREET FIGHTER 3, WHAT THE FUCK MAN
It was actually more expensive back then all things considered. I thought you had to be 18 to post here.
Did you even read my post? 24 fighters is a good number for a new game. If it never got another character added it would have been a great game with a good roster already.
Nothing was split up, new characters were developed after the fact. Exactly the same as Capcom has been doing for years. We just didn't have to wait for a full re-release of the game.
>DLC aside, is SF IV the best in the series?
I personally prefer III because I like the parry system in it, but overall IV is probably better. I can't say anything for V now as I haven't played it, but Capcom hasn't completely dropped the ball on a 2D SF yet.
You must have not been alive if you think people were overjoyed about a $60 game coming out in 1992 money every year except this time with the bosses as playable characters (and it's faster)
Each version for SNES added 4 characters
Each time for $60 in early 1990s money
You're either underage or an old man syndrome guy with low T who is cranky now but not remembering reality
You are nitpicking like no tomorrow.
SF5 had a fucking season BEFORE THE GAME EVEN CAME OUT. You paid for fighters in an unfinished game before the damn thing was out.
Do I even need to list Mortal Kombat X's bullshit?
Tekken 7 announced DLC at launch
These games aren't using DLC as a way to expand the game. They're using DLC to make money from ignorant players like you that think they're expanding the game. This "expansion" of the game was planed before the thing even came out and they'' even charge you along with the price of the game at release for it.
And you will go as far as to defend this shit?
>I personally prefer III
So do most people, or even II. So it all comes back to the fact that the industry in general is stagnating at best, in decline at worst.
We've reached a technological plateau which would suggest that companies would be competing to make games of better quality within existing frameworks, but they're content not to and consumers are content as well because they have little to compare it to until they eventually wander onto /v/ or /vr/ and emulate/collect to see what they're missing.
Well considering I gave you solid examples of it being done well and you just ignore them I'm not too inclined to continue genuinely trying to discuss this with you.
Even though Capcom's model for V isn't great, I still like it better than the full releases they had been doing.
I have no issue with DLC being announced at launch. I assume that especially with fighters, the game is going to keep getting worked on. Them telling me there will be more characters down the line if I want them is just them saying officially something I knew already.
And still my point stands that you don't have to buy any of the updates if you don't want them. You don't have to buy DLC characters to fight against them.
If you want to be super angry about DLC, then go ahead. But as a long time fan of fighters, I really like what it's done for the genre. And I think these games in general are better now than ever before.
So we'll just have to agree to disagree. I'll play some fighters and have fun and you can stay pissed off and angry.
I don't have any friends (save for one who I see maybe once or twice a year) who are as into gaming as I am. This is actually my first time on this board looking for a CRT thread or just about to make one.
Video games as a hobby in this era is now akin to Movies as a hobby, there are so many games, so many types of games, and so many different types of people who play those games. You've got the pussy slaying chav's who get the new CoD, Battlefield, and Halo each year and who even dip into the TES, Fallout, and character action games like God of War and Darksiders every now and then. Then you have your average 6-13 year old playing Minecraft, iPhone games, shitty licensed movie games, latest CoD, and handhelds like the DS.
Scalpers attach themselves to absolutely everything, and the larger that thing grows the more scalpers appear. Video games are officially a bigger money maker than movies nowadays, and retro gaming is more popular then it has ever been.
I'm a /vr/ novice, I play a random selection of all types of games and I'm just now wanting to start going backwards, re-buying OG xbox, gamecube, etc, until I get to the SNES, and to play these games in their intended format I want a nice HD CRT tv (HD for newer consoles and laptop)
Are you mad it's not on physical media at some point? They come out in greatest hits way cheap less than a year later now, these games are cheaper than ever, you're bitching about not being in a time that never existed
If you're complaining about the DLC being lost to time because no physical release then I 100% agree with you
>So do most people, or even II.
Actually if you go to fighting communities, IV is the most popular followed by 2. A lot of people don't like the parry system. IV is the technically better game though.
And no there isn't a decline. But we've been over this, you will never agree and I don't really care if you do anyways. I am loving the fuck out of one of my lifelong favorite genres which is in an wonderful resurgence.
>IV is the most popular
It's also the latest game so that makes sense. The fact that II/III are consistently held to be the pinnacle though, even after newer games have come out, tells you something about their gameplay. Like I said it doesn't matter if you're "loving the fuck" out of something, (lots of consumers are plunking down money for new systems that have libraries of maybe 2-3 exclusive games), it doesn't change the fact that devs just aren't pumping out what they used to in general, and kickstarter didn't fill the gap.
I don't think IV being the current most popular SF game really says much. Fighting game communities typically dump the previous entry in a series as soon as a new one comes out, regardless of the perceived difference in quality. I think the biggest exception is SSB Melee, which is so far above its sequels that it remains the most popular Smash game.
See, you're doing it wrong, OP.
Firstly, don't play anything after sixth gen. That's the jumping-off gen for online-capability and all sorts of other unbelievable faggotry. Secondly, your attachment is to the hobby, not its people. Don't get too attached to anyone or any place (like /vr/ or whatnot), and completely ignore e-celebs. They're all irrelevant to the hobby. Your worlds lie in cartridges, optical discs, and game cards. Go fucking explore them! Thirdly, emulate where possible. This doesn't mean the second some poorly coded piece of shit comes down the pike you get rid of your corresponding console- it means for shit with 100% accurate emulators (emus so accurate you can target them and have your software work on the actual console as well, BTW) like BSNES or Gambatte, don't bother dropping obscene cash for what you can already get 100% free! It helps mitigate the scalpers quite a bit.
Fourthly...You will never encounter a girl like the one in your OP. Never. Not in a fucking thousand years. Don't waste your time searching, it could better be spent doing more retro shenanigans.
That's nice. I think people who throw the word cancer around because they're upset that not everyone agrees with them have the maturity of spoiled children.
It's not because it's the newest game though. That's why many SF fans prefer II over III. The hardcore SF players think the parry system in III ultimately just fucks up the footsies and though it can lead to a few amazing moments like the Daigo/Wong Chun Li parry, is overall not a great system.
SF IV is mechanics wise a lot more similar to II and traditionalists like it a lot more than III. Also IV has the biggest roster and a bunch of the III characters suck.
Personally I was always much more of a KoF (and other SNK fighter) fan, and I still like SF III a little better than IV mostly because of aesthetics.
>That's nice. I think people who throw the word cancer around because they're upset that not everyone agrees with them have the maturity of spoiled children.
Not as a buzzword. Your kind are a kind of cancer on this industry that supports horrible practices. You basically enable the kind of shit the industry does currently.
Ya you're not making the stuff but the stuff is only around because people like you buy it.
>Your kind are a kind of cancer on this industry that supports horrible practices.
That's nice. Like I said, I've been gaming my whole life since the 2600 days and I think things are better now than ever. Fighters especially.
Call me cancer all you like, it doesn't bother me one bit. At the end of the day, you're the one who's upset and I'm the one with so many great games I want to play that I barely know what to start next.
I'm sure many will, but IV will still have it's fan. Heck Injustice wasn't anywhere near as popular as SFIV but even with MKX out all this time, there are enough players that I still find good matches online easily.
>Call me cancer all you like, it doesn't bother me one bit. At the end of the day, you're the one who's upset and I'm the one with so many great games I want to play that I barely know what to start next.
You got a better term? Cancer seems to fit for me.
I never buy new games at release and I don't even put my new consoles online so you can call me cancer all you want if it makes you feel better, I'm not enabling anything, just saying you're looking at the past with rose colored glasses and are a humongous baby
lol use whatever term you want, I could care less. In my head I'm calling you angry baby man. :)
Don't buy new games, or buy them used
The last time I bought modern games it was for the Gamestop $2.50 sale. I don't support any of the modern gaming industries practices and I hope they collapse but I also don't whine about the "good old days" that never existed because I'm older than 14 and was actually alive when these consoles came out
I don't buy fucking DLC period, you can hate it all you want, I'm indifferent to most of it, I think morons who pay $100 for preordered map packs for COD3 are idiots and the industry will crash but who cares, it's a retro board
You're acting like things used to be good, they weren't
Or you could try "don't buy it if you don't want it." Most DLC isn't necessary in any way at all. There are really only a handful of games where any DLC was integral (mass effect) and those were all shit anyways. For the most part you can completely ignore it ever existed.
This is like complaining that someone asked "would you like fries with that?"
I explained many times in this thread examples of it being used well. And yes I'm using reaction faces for you. Is that "triggering" you kiddo?
I didn't call you a kid for not buying it. I pointed out repeatedly how most of it can be completely ignored and especially in fighters that DLC works very well because you can not spend a penny on extra characters but still get the opponents you face updated without having to buy a new copy of the game like you did in previous generations.
Of course all of that went completely over your head because all you care about is that you hate the existence of DLC and despise anyone who doesn't share your anger. Sucks to be you. :)
Which is why I think you're such an idiot. This system is way better in every way than what Capcom used to do.
Also if it's keeping people like you out of modern gaming I think that's another nice added bonus.
It's because you no longer have to wait for Capcom to release a Second Impact or Third Strike style, full retail boxed release when the next version is ready. Even if you want the full update, it's not as expensive as the full game re-releases were and you can often buy the characters piece meal if you want. Cherry picking which, if any you want to buy for yourself.
And also, unlike in the old days even if you don't buy the new version of the game, yours will still get updated with the new characters. So you can play against other people using them even if you don't want them.
I think that's a far better system. Someone who doesn't care about extra characters never has to bother with them, someone who wants all the characters can get them cheaper than was possible in the past. And both people can always play against each other.
Waiting for the ultimate or goty edition is basically like waiting till Third Strike comes out to play at all.
I'm sure you're not. Doesn't make me care about any of you people any more. If DLC keeps you or anyone else from playing games I think it's more funny than anything else.
>It's because you no longer have to wait for Capcom to release a Second Impact or Third Strike style, full retail
But that's exactly what an ultimate edition is. If you want to upgrade to IV AND get all the DLC content for the price it should've initially been at, you need to wait until they feel they've milked the DLC dry and release the ultimate version. SFII hyper came out because people began hacking the game to make it faster and Capcom was pushed into releasing an official version. SSFII Turbo was a new game that ran on newer hardware compared to SSFII. You can't compare that to DLC that may or may not be a result of "extended development" ie. releasing a game before it is complete, charging for the "extra" content, then re-releasing it once it is. The only thing that has changed for the better is the fact that they can give you free balance updates, not DLC.
I am making a big case to support it. But part of the support for it is pointing out how easy and non-impactful it is to ignore if you don't want it.
That's why I've been talking about fighters so much. Even if you don't spend a penny on DLC for new characters you still get your game updated with them so you can fight against them. Before DLC came along that never happened. If Third Strike came out and you still wanted to keep playing SF III, you really didn't have a choice but to trade up. Now if you don't care about any of the new characters you can just keep playing.
>But that's exactly what an ultimate edition is.
Which is why I said that in the last line of my post.
I see the ultimate version as the equivalent of a Third Strike is to vanilla or Second Impact. You no longer have to buy the whole game again.
I disagree with the notion that because they have plans on adding more characters that the original game is incomplete. I didn't think Street Fighter III was incomplete when it was released. I think it was a full fighter, then Capcom kept working on it. That's how they've been developing their fighters for years.
Anyways, I'm done work so it's time to stop 4channing for the day. I personally think the way fighters do DLC these days is fantastic and a much better way of updating than we had in the past. If you disagree, that's okay. But I'm still happy with the state of things.
DLC isn't always great, but it sometimes can be and when it's not it's easy to ignore. Later, friends!
>You no longer have to buy the whole game again.
Sure, but that's because of technology. They can patch it as much as they like, whereas on older media you were stuck with the initial product. We get patches for free now instead of having to buy it all over again, imagine if they charged for patches. Would you still defend it because it was cheaper than what they previously did?
>Spatoon is innovative
How? Because of the cover mechanics?
>Well supported too.
In Japan. Literally nowhere else. It's not like it's caused some sort of Wii U resurgence. Sure, it bodes well for a future franchise, maybe. But it's not well-recognized by young people (again, except in Japan) and it is selling decently because it is the "it" game on a console with 9mil units.
If you didn't have the map the server was running in a PC FPS game, you just downloaded it from the server.
"Map Packs" are console cancer that has spread to PCs, so now developers don't bother releasing modding tools for people to make their own maps like they used to and instead charge $15-$20 for a pack with 3-4 maps.
>Sure, but that's because of technology.
>whereas on older media you were stuck with the initial product.
Yeah, the technology of implementing downloadable content to a game after it's been released. That's what makes it so good. Buy one version of the game and update and add content if you want or don't if you don't.
Only thing I hate is putting down the money for the console + everdrive, but i can't complain. I get the whole library for 1/100th the cost.
Just get modded consoles and flashcarts. It's fun and you get access to games you couldn't.
>tfw pseudo saturn works with all games a mod chip does.
Now adays it's easier than you think.
Is the flashcart faithful to the games 100%? I mean I would assume it is but some people say it isn't but I've never been provided with examples. I just want to know for sure before I put down the money.
I don't care what anyone says N64/Saturn emulation on PC has never been 100% on any game I've played.
The question of whether I would pay for patches? Of course not. Just the way I don't pay for or buy games with DLC that doesn't interest me. It's not that I think all DLC is wonderful, it's that I think it can be used well and when it is I'm very happy to see it. When it's not I'm very happy to ignore it.
That's just games for you and an effect of living in the internet age. I can't go update and play Tribes anymore without patching it myself first either. It doesn't mean I want to go back to before the internet existed.
Yes it's the exact same thing as owning the original cartridge, it loads the rom into the flash memory making the cartridge the original game cartridge until you switch games. There's no difference other than access to the whole library on one device. Also n64 everdrive has 100% compatibility, pseudo Saturn hasn't not worked with a game I've thrown at it, including PDS and PDZ which people say don't work, but they do.
I've been deeply into video games for twenty years and none of what you mentioned has anything to do with my life except the part about /vr/ sucking, which is obviously easily solved: Just spend less time on /vr/.
What? Where? If you see them while shopping somewhere and they bother you, quit shopping there and buy online like a sensible person, or download ROMs. If you see them online, quit reading those crappy forums or whatever.
Same as above. Also if you see/hear them in games, play better games, or turn off the chat feature, or some such.
I don't even know who or what you're talking about. Stop doing whatever you're doing that brings you in contact with scalpers.
>shooters like CoD and Halo
Play games you like then. There are loads of game genres and styles now. Dark Souls is fantastic. Try Awesomenauts, it's a MOBA so it's as modern as things get, but it's also 2D and colorful and playful and pretty much the opposite of CoD. Try Dominions IV, that's a new game and it looks like it came out for a 486, but it's deeper than almost anything. Try the critically acclaimed indie games; some just catch on because they're excitingly "artsy" but some are genuine gems. Play old ROMs. The options are endless. Being tired of Halo isn't being tired of video games. If you think it is then you're not just trying.
If it's good buy it, and if it's not don't. If you hate being given the option then play games that don't have it (indie games usually, "retro" ROMs, etc.), or wait a long time for prices to go down and then buy the whole game plus all DLCs (where applicable) in one cheap bundle.
>Bayonetta 2 is now going for $90+ new on ebay
Why do you even know this? How is your backlog so small that you can even keep up with what Bayonetta 2 is doing? Get a bigger backlog. It shouldn't be difficult if you like games, because there are a million of them.
> Like I have no TG16 stuff and I'm not raping my wallet for it.
Why does your wallet mind when you download emulators and ROMs? If the problem is just that the "hobby" you're referring to is collecting rather than actually playing games, then get a better hobby. I suggest gaming. It's fun!
Did buying physical objects used to be fun for you? What was wrong with you at that time? You should be glad to have become at least partly cured of the problem, with help from "hipsters" and "scalpers" and whatnot. SPENDING MONEY SHOULD NOT BE FUN ENOUGH THAT YOU WANT TO MAKE A HOBBY OUT OF IT. Finish fixing your brain so that you believe this (because it's true), and then either get into what video games are actually for, or try something different, like swing dancing or mountain biking or Dungeons & Dragons.
I'm just tired of gaming in itself. After nearly 20 years of it being a primary hobby I'm ready for anything else. Hell, the only systems I haven't sold are my various Gameboys, N64, and Wii U. I would like to pick up a few more N64 titles before they get more expensive but that's about it. These days I'd rather spend my time and money on fitness, hiking/backpacking, learning about cars, etc.
I think I'll aways be something of a "gamer", and there may be the one AAA someday that gets me excited again, but for now I'm content with playing Mario Kart 8 a couple times a week online and emulating the occasional niche title that gets mentioned here.
While it might still be somewhat expensive, you could always narrow your collection down to a system or two. 4th gen was the bulk of my childhood so SNES and Genesis are all I really collect for. The vast majority of the games I have for the N64 and onward are just the ones I got new at the time and didn't end up selling.
You guys are still in here? How does this thread still exist?