When did Castlevania truly die, /vr/?
With the release of IGAvania on the PSX?
With the addition of moeshit in Rondo of Blood?
Or with the multi-whip bullshit in Super Castlevania IV?
>IGA (Koji Igarashi) is the man who made most of the decisions for Symphony of the Night.
Nope, sorry look at the people involved in SotN, ita's all old hands at the franchise. While Symphony is where IGA cut his teeth and first took an active hand in the franchise, crediting him for the game's triumphs is a miss-attribution akin to calling Final Fantasy XII an Akitoshi Kawazu game or assuming everything Nintendo publishes springs wholly-formed from the mind of Shigeru Miyamoto. Symphony was helmed and conceived by Toru Hagihara, who had been with the series for years. His was also the mind behind the original Dracula X.
The Belmont clan plays a secondary role, and Alucard can equip every weapon except a whip? No big deal; Alucard had already earned his cred with Dracula's Curse, accompanied by a dagger-tossing pirate and a mage whose stave was no match for her spells, and both Bloodlines and Dracula X had offered alternate characters with alternate weapons as well. The removal of a discrete level structure was hardly a radical change, either; Symphony simply expounds on the direction Dracula X was taking the series with its branching levels and hidden pathways. Besides, Castlevania had its roots in exploration. Not only was Simon's Quest a fully open quest through the Transylvanian countryside, the MSX version of the very first game was entirely built around searching through a series of non-linear stages in pursuit of the keys needed to advance.
>Symphony was helmed and conceived by Toru Hagihara, who had been with the series for years. His was also the mind behind the original Dracula X.
This is correct. People also should keep in mind that Symphony is, quite literally, Dracula X2.
It died with Lords of Shadows.
Anyone that says that it "died with Symphony of the night" or that believes that "symphony of the night was shit", is a contrarian hipster and nothing they say will convince me otherwise.
Symphony of the night may not have been a traditional Castlevania game, but judged on its own merits it's a great Metroid game with rpg elements. It seems like only now is it popular to hate on it and pretend that it ruined the entire series.
I remember back when it first came out, basically everyone I knew that was into Castlevania started referring to it is as one of the best games of all time and we all saw it as a fresh new take on a series of games that were starting to become stale.
Now of course, the new game hype eventually died down and everyone slowly started realizing that maybe it wasn't the best game of all time, let alone the best Castlevania game, but it was still a very good game on its own.
Now I do understand that some of the resentment towards sotn lies in the fact that after it released, traditional Castlevania games stopped happening, but I think you can really blame that on the times more than on Iga himself.
It's really no secret that as time went on, games started becoming easier and 2d platformers started becoming rarer and rarer. I just don't think there was a huge market for traditional Castlevania games in the 2000s anymore. I think that without Iga, Castlevania would have died way before Mercury Steam put the final nail in the coffin.
Anyway that's just my take on it, you may now start calling me a casual and accusing me of not playing a Castlevania game until sotn, even though Simon's Quest was my first Castlevania.
The MSX version was released after the original Akumajou Dracula on Famicom though, I wouldn't say Castlevania had its roots in exploration, and likely the reason they made the MSX game an exploration-based game is because the MSX couldn't do scrolling, so they had to focus on screen-to-screen gamplay instead of straighforward action.
I see what you mean though, SOTN wasn't the first game in the series to try something different, and Igarashi himself said his main inspiration for SOTN was Zelda and not Metroid (I don't know if I believe him, Simon's Quest has a lot in common with Zelda II AoL, but SOTN is definitely inspired by Metroid, whether IGA or the other staff that worked on it).
That said, it's true that Igarashi doesn't like precise platforming or challenging gameplay. After all, he was working on Tokimemo before joining the Castlevania team.
Rondo's moeshit didn't affect the gameplay in any way, and it's one of the best in the series.
SCV IV cazualitation is one of the reason CV became the way it is. People liked that and they made a more casual game that mostly missed the point of castlevania gameplay-wise: SOTN.
None of them are bad games, though I'd say SotN isn't anything special either. The bad ones will come later, like most of the GBA igavanias and all the ones that came after those
I don't hate SotN, I love the artwork and the OST, the controls and animations are really smooth too, but from a design perspective is really poor. Compared to something like Super Metroid it's just a bad attempt at intricated level design, and one of the most evident examples of quantity > quality.
Also the inverted Castle is laughable.
>Rondo's moeshit didn't affect the gameplay in any way
Well, being able to unlock Maria as soon as the 2nd level in the game and her having OP boomerang attacks and OP animal friends, as well as double jump and slide, basically changed the way CV is played as well. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Maria introduced double jump to CV, which was then implemented on SOTN.
The item crash mechanic, which not only kills all enemies on screen but also gives you invincibility frames, also could be considered "casualization".
Not to mention the levels are pretty short and easy, and most of the bosses are pushovers as well (compared to bosses from the NES games).
I love Rondo though, but I don't get why'd you say IV is a casualization and Rondo isn't. At least IV has a hard mode (2nd loop), sadly there's no such thing on Rondo.
I thought the term originally was only referring to the Castlevania games that copied Metroid? As in it's a Metroid Castlevania.
Am I wrong? Years ago I think that's the only way I ever saw the term used, but I might not be remembering correctly.
Lords of Shadows didn't kill anything, and I find it hilarious that people keep saying this. What, do you think the series was thriving with the DS games? Even with Igarashi the series was little more than a zombie.
I enjoy the GBA and DS games for what they are (Aria in particular is good), and I agree that Symphony of the Night didn't kill the series, but Lords of Shadow isn't to blame either. The Lords of Shadow games weren't the cause: they were merely another symptom.
Maria is just an extra optional character, I don't know why people complain about her. Sure, it'd be great if you could play her without breaking the game, but you can just ignore her.
I know, I know, and I actually love playing as Maria (although it does feel more rewarding playing as Richter, which I also like), but I mean, if we're going to go into the "casualization" criticism, then yeah, Maria is a very easy character to unlock at the beginning of the game, and even if it's optional, it means the developers intended to give Maria as an easy mode for people who were struggling with the normal controls.
And the level design is still pretty easy. IV has easier combat due to the multi-directional whip, but the platforming on IV is harder and more focused than on Rondo, I feel. Especially the later levels.
>good level design
It was just too gimmicky. Super relied too much on the new controls, like grapple and duckwalk, and not enough on perilous platforming.
Agree on IV's level design.
Yeah, the controls and new whip functionality make IV easier than III or the original, but the actual level design is frequently more demanding (and certainly more interesting) than most of Rondo.
Is everyone willing to ignore the 64 titles?
Those were the worst things to come of this whole series. Even the sixth and seventh generation ones were at least a little enjoyable in comparison.
Well, I may have let some of my bias creep in there. I really hated Lords of Shadow and I don't consider it a Castlevania game at all. I mean I remember reading somewhere that it wasn't even meant to be a Castlevania game originally.
Even when I treat it as its own thing, I just don't find anything to like about it (well ok, the artstyle was alright in a few places).
But yeah, you're right. The series was already on its way out by the time the ds games came out.
Because /v/ has never wanted to discuss anything, they just wanted to be /b/2.0(now with videogame emphasis). Notice all the shit threads that are just reposts of shit threads from /v/.
Of course, this is only tolerated since the mods/janitors rarely visit here.
Lets make these threads less shitty
lets start by posting
>favorite cv ost
>favorite cv art style
Also, we really need to make beginner's resources to introduce some newfriends to castlevania
I like how you establish yourself as a grumpy old faggot in your first post.
Those games were all great, if you couldn't enjoy them, then there's just something wrong with your brain.
Castlevania threads have perhaps the worst videogame discussion on all of 4chan because it all boils down to “MY TASTES < YOUR TASTES" with endless shitflinging that really has no reason to occurr.
It's like there's people who take it as a threat to their person that you don't have the same favorite game.
>"I thought SoTN was pretty alright, though it wasn't perfect-"
>"FUCKING IGABABBY, HOW CAN YOU LIKE THE GAME THAT RUINED THE SERIES AND RETROACTIVELY DAMAGED THE OLDER GAMES [insert assumptions about age and what CV's anon has played here, along with a hearty helping of absolutism and the insistence that CV3 was the absolute pinnacle of the franchise] HOW DARE YOU NOT HAVE MY CHILDHOOD"
Tossup betweeb Super Castlevania and Aria Of Sorrow
Super has great controls and music, but it falls a bit short because the enemies are often too easy (it's as if Belmont made the jump to 16bit but the enemies stayed in 8bit), also, it just doesn't look as good as X (though it did showcase a lot of impressive SNES trickery), Sorrow feels like a much more competent and focused Symphony. I like Symphony, but it's far from a perfect game.
>favorite cv ost
Chronicles has a bitchin' rendition of Simon's Theme, but overall I think Dracula X has a consistently great soundtrack (though I don't think it's a very fun game)
>favorite cv art style
Either Dracula X or Aria Of Sorrow
Super does have a great soundtrack, I really love the treasury one.
With the 3D games in my opinion. CV just never really worked in 3D. LoI and CoD were okay, but didn't feel like Castlevania to me.
Igavania also feels like a different series of games, but they both feel closer and better than the 3D ones. But then Simon's Quest is my favorite game in the series.
Then Lords of Shadow came along and took a huge dump on everything. Mirror of Fate isn't just the worst Castlevania by a landslide, it's one of the worst games ever made period.
Release order is always the way people should get into series.
>favorite cv ost
>favorite cv art style
SOTN (mostly because it also uses a lot of enemies from Rondo and IV, so it's like an all-stars game in terms of art style and designs)
>When did Castlevania truly die, /vr/?
People who whine about their favorite gaming franchises "dying" are usually self-entitled cunts. They always happen to be Castlevania and Mega Man fans for some reason.
Except his favorite game in the franchise was Castlevania 3 and his dream game was to remake it for modern systems but Konami wouldn't let him.
Yes, lets blame IGA for everything of course though.
Speaking of IGA, anyone remember an old interview he had with Mana from Malice Mizer/Moi dix Mois?
Pic related is from said interview, only resolution of the pic I could find now.
It was uploaded to the official harmony of dissonance website in Japan originally. They discussed the Castlevania series and Mana commented on how he got into it when he was younger.
It was also to promote a ringtone that Mana himself composed for Harmony of Dissonance, which people could download off tsutaya (a japanese rental site), the ringtone was called "La nuit blanche", and sadly I don't think we westerners will ever be able to listen to it unless some fan in Japan still has an old 2002 cell phone with the ringtone on it.
Would love to find that interview again, if I could find the old URL I could check on archive.org.
EDIT (not really, but 4chan has been down for an hour or so, so I had time to do some research).
I didn't find the old original URL, but I actually found a translation of the interview someone did in english! Here it is:
>implying metroidvanias killed classicvanias
>implying classicvanias weren't killed by no longer being a financially viable kind of game to make
>implying metroidvanias wasn't the only way a 2D sidescrolling castlevania could have ever continued past the demise of sidescrolling platforming action games
>implying classicvanias would have been made at all after 4th gen if metroidvanias never existed
I thought Curse of Darkness was pretty dope tbeeh senpaitachi, it had awesome music and was pretty much 3d SOTN but with an infinity dungeon and the ability to play as a few different blokes to appease every style
My favorite castlevania is circle of the moon. I played the NES games a handful of times at the time of their release and bought it off eBay for pennies to use on my new ds. Everything about it was top notch, soundtrack, graphics, controls, map layout, difficulty, love going back to it once every couple years.
Best soundtrack? Harmony of Dissonance by a landslide. I teach composition at a college and use it as a reference piece for my dissonance curriculum. It's a perfect example. Even the fucking game title has the word 'dissonance' in it. My students usually hate it at first but once we get rolling they start to understand why we use it.
Yeah! How dare people express opinions about others relating to retro video games. Speech should be censored if it doesn't appeal to your liking.
Pictures and statements like this live to show people's age and not understanding that cv4 was an early game that capitalised upon the fetuses of the snes (better looking sprites than the nes, mode 7 stuff) but chances are none of you was there so it's hard for you younger ones to understand that. I remember being blown away by it when I was young. Who cares if it was easier. It was fucking fun back then and still is now.
Yes, and people were impressed by DKC's CG graphics at the time. Doesn't change the fact that its level design is straightforward and unmemorable as fuck and its controls are very banal and generic.
Most people discussing castlevania aren't really fans, just internet tryhards trying to one up other nerds by saying that this or that popular game is shit just to piss off other people and show everyone else how different and special snowflake their taste is.
I remember that.
It IS sad that Castlevania never actually had some kind of Mana thing. Malice Mizer's last Album was pretty good for that heavy baroque gothic feel the series went to after SotN with Kojima's art and all that.
they even made their own Dracula movie. as a movie it was kind of average, but the designs and shit were kinda neat.
and the Johnathan Harker to go with that Dracula
>Malice Mizer's last Album was pretty good for that heavy baroque gothic feel the series went to after SotN with Kojima's art and all that.
Yeah, bara no seidou is one amazing piece of work.
Although their early works also remind me of Castlevania music, especially the Castlevania IV soundtrack which has that goth rock-ish feel to it
Reminds me of tracks like Forest of Monsters and Clockwork Mansion.
Also, I remember the Dracula movie from Malice Mizer. Bara no konrei, was it? I remember downloading that back in 2002 or so from WinMX, it took weeks to download. It's so corny and hilarious, Klaha's false horseback riding was the best, but yeah the aesthetics and music are actually pretty nice.
Also Mana as a demonic nun.
>Bara no konrei, was it?
the cheese was palpable. it was a weird mishmash of Dracula and Interview with the vampire, considering Kozi's role and interactions with Mana.
you can actually find the whole thing on youtube, with about the same quality as you wouldve gotten from downloading it.
>The album is 15 years old
>its been 14 years since Malice Mizer split
Jesus Christ where does the time go.
A. Metroidvania killed Classicvania
B. Anime has no place in a European-stylized franchise
C. You have bad taste if you prefer the RPG Castlevanias to the platformer Castlevanias
>A. Metroidvania killed Classicvania
Metroidvania was by far THE most popular style of Castlevania, no thanks to Konami having no idea how to make a proper 3D game
>B. Anime has no place in a European-stylized franchise
you are autistic. the series has been fairly "Anime" since day 1, see pic related. also, WOW A JAPANESE VIDEOGAME HAS ANIME STYLING WHAT A SHOCKER
>C. You have bad taste if you prefer the RPG Castlevanias to the platformer Castlevanias
WAAH STOP LIKING WHAT I DONT LIKE
>A. Metroidvania killed Classicvania
no, the failure to transition to 3D successfully is what doomed it, and relegated it to handhelds, after which small budgets and Konami's retardation killed it.
The transition to Metroid didn't help, though. We were going to get Castlevania V on 32X which could've got an enhanced port later to Saturn/PSone like 68K did but Iga killed it off and absorbed it into his shitty Alucard project. Obviously SotN's popularity is what compelled them to rehash the same game 6 times during which time we got NO CLASSIC-STYLE GAME EVEN ON HANDHELDS. Fuck Iga and fuck Konami. And when we finally DO get a Classicvania it's put on the fucking Wii which nobody except grandmas and kids used for their Wii Sports Resort instead of also putting it on Xbox Live, PSN and Steam where more people would actually care about the game.
Classicvania games wouldn't have done well anyway. They were seen as somewhat old-hat by the time of the PS1. I'm sure, assuming the games made alterations to make themselves more accessible to contemporary tastes, the Classicvanias could have continued to some extent. But it still probably wouldn't have been more than somewhat niche. Now there's some degree of demand for Classicvanias, I'm sure (though I don't know how well ReBirth did when it came out), but back then? Probably not.
I feel your pain--I love Classicvanias much, much more than Symphony of the Night and its progeny--but the only thing to blame for Classicvanias fading out is time.
What does "generic" even means?
IV has a great art direction, stop irrationally hating it just because it's popular/AVGN/Nintendo or whatever.
>IV has a great art direction, stop irrationally hating it just because it's popular/AVGN/Nintendo or whatever.
You mean just like your irrational hate for Rondo of Blood because it's "too anime"?
AVGN was one of the reasons possible, but you could also hate it because it's popular, or because it's on Nintendo.
And it's not me even being paranoid, I can search for archived CV threads were people here say "fuck off AVGN fanboy" when people say they like IV.
Again, please explain to me what does "generic" means to you, because I think IV has a legit good art direction, same as the other Castlevanias. Art direction and music were always the strongest points in CV games.
Sorry, I forgot to mention I wasn't the other guy, I also like Rondo and don't mind the anime characters.
>Art direction and music were always the strongest points in CV games
I disagree. They were always good, of course, but I think the core game design itself was always the strongest point of Classicvanias.
Well, I don't disagree there, I also think Classcvanias core design was actually the best, but then you have people who prefer the SOTN-type games, and other people who even complain about the design within the classicvanias. Only CV1 and 3 (and maybe X68K) get a free pass, every other Classicvania is subject to being criticized by tryhards ("multiwhip makes the game too easy in IV", "maria mode and item crash trivialize gameplay in Rondo", "autoscrolling stages and lance user sucks in bloodlines", etc).
I personally like them all, even Simon's Quest and Haunted Castle.
Lance user is actually pretty balanced in Bloodlines. He deals a lot less damage than John Morris can, while being better than John at jumping. The biggest problem with Bloodlines is it's too short, bosses and enemies are boring compared to Rondo's (IV had this problem as well, but there was no excuse since Bloodlines came years after both IV and RoB), stages have some shit design like autoscrolling tower of pisa or the mirror part in the last level, background visuals are a bit lazy and sometimes even ugly, and FM synth doesn't suit Castlevania type music very well imo. Sampled instruments and Redbook quality audio are much better. Also notice some input delay between landing after a jump and attacking which always felt a bit off. Didn't like how it kept Rondo's item crash ability either, and the blue orb item was op as fuck.
Don't mind me, just ending your no-damage Rondo runs.
Honestly it would have been interesting if they went the 3D action platforming route. A lot of games during that period were grappling with how a game controls in 3D space and how to deal with the camera. Castlevania 64 had its problems with its controls and especially its camera, but it was a good transition for the 2D games.
Classicvania's style works better when its only a few levels long with branching paths for replay value. Playing it for hours and hours on end gets tedious as hell.
>why'd it have to become fucking metroid of all things?
Because Symphony of the Night was way more successful than Castlevania Chronicles on the PS1 and nobody bought Adventure Rebirth on WiiWare.
The audience for that style of game simply isn't very big anymore.
because its the same telling of the original simon belmont slaying dracula story you fuckin retard. Like for fuck sakes even if the levels are all different its still telling the same story. A remake can also change the cannon, IV and 68k are remakes and you're fuckin retarded if you think otherwise.
>Fire Red and Leaf Green aren't remakes because MUH NEW CONTENT
thats you, you fucking retard. Go take your meds and get your mom to wheel you away from the computer.
>Metroidvania killed Classicvania
No it did not, Metroidvania arose because Classicvania stopped being marketable entirely.
The style of game that Classicvania was stopped happening in 5th gen.
There was no replacement, just adapting to a changing market.
There would never have been any more Classicvanias anyway if Metroidvanias didn't exist.
>You have bad taste if you prefer the RPG Castlevanias to the platformer Castlevanias
What if I like both for different reasons?
>With the release of IGAvania on the PSX?
Well the metroidvania games were really good and a much needed breath of fresh air for the series. It also didn't stop the release of classic style platforming CV games (Castlevania Rebirth on wiiware was just as good as bloodlines, rondo and IV).
>With the addition of moeshit in Rondo of Blood?
The moeshit from Rondo stayed in Rondo (in other games Maria and such were just unlockable easter eggs).
>Or with the multi-whip bullshit in Super Castlevania IV?
The multidirectional whip stayed in IV.
I think that what killed the series was the silly lord of shadows games. Konami started focusing on those games and abandoned the main series (metroidvania and classicvania) and when the LOS series inevitably flopped they just abandoned the franchise altogether.
Why are you so upset? What you're not understanding is that story counts for very little in the Classicvanias. This is why some people find calling IV and x68k "remakes" is, at the very least, misleading.
If you think what Fire Red does and what IV does are comparable you haven't played one of the two or either.
I lost interest when everything became a SotN clone. Granted, it could just as well be said that a lot of older Castlevania games are clones of CV1, but that's still my preferred format.
I did like the SotN's RPG mechanics, just not its bottleneck world design and the massive amount of backtracking that takes places there. I like large, open worlds with varied environments. You seldom see any type of wilderness in Castlevania titles anymore.
Simon's Quest is my favorite. The Chronicles version of CV1 is a close second. Didn't care for CV3 or Super CV. Bloodlines was okay, and Belmont's Revenge is definitely the strongest of the handheld titles. Still haven't played Rondo.
That was just a spinoff and actually not THAT bad.
I wish it was a traditional 2D fighting game similar to Guilty Gear though, that would have been better, but you can't be serious calling Judgement the moment CV died.
>nobody bought Adventure Rebirth on WiiWare
First of all. Wii exclusive. Second: It looked like a 16-bit game, and not exactly one of the best looking ones. That probably scared away most 'younger fans' and only appealed the retro nostalgic part of the fanbase. At some point it was also marketed as a remake of one of the game boy titles, that probably scared a lot of people too.
They already announced they will release a new album on '16
So, how would your ideal/perfect Castlevania game be?
Yu-ki is still around somehow, in 2012 he performed with both Mana and Kozi on a sort of Malice Mizer reunion at one of the dis inferno events, and I believe they did it again later, not sure.
Yu-ki now sells selfmade jewelry that he sells through Mana's midi:nette shop.
But yeah musically he seems to be retired for good sadly, I really like his one and only composed song in Malice Mizer, Syunikiss.
>So, how would your ideal/perfect Castlevania game be?
Dracula X tier graphics.
Dracula X tier music or Aria Of Sorrow Tier music.
Super Castlevania controls with sidescrolling and shit.
Harmony Of Dissonance style castle with two "sides", but also larger.
Also that'd be the endgame, you'd have to go through numerous areas and dungeons on a map, like Order Of Ecclesia
Number of towns where you can talk to people for info, resupply, save, and get the odd mini quest, a little like Simon's Quest
Some ability upgrades like double jumping along the way.
Castlevania 3 style party of three members, one Belmont, one mage, and then some third dude
Aria Of Sorrow tier spellcasting
Large variation of items and equipment, sort of like Symphony but less disjointed and less needlessly similar items, and less game breaking items (they're fun, but you'll have to unlock those in a challenge mode after beating the game)
Equiping items like in Symphony, head, neck, torso, weapon/whip head, boots, and then jewelry/misc slot
Throwable explosives as inventory items
Lots and LOTS of secrets like Circle Of The Moon
Typical Metroidvania levelling, -BUT-, strength and hitpoints only do so much, bosses will require you to learn their patterns and behavior, you couldn't necessarily default out a boss because you have bigger numbers, you cannot one-shot anything but a regular enemy or a mini boss, more strength can help you but it's not end-all be-all
A nice encyclopedia of monsters and items.
A score meter, not for any good reason, it just lists the score on the current level, resets when you leave but will keep your best in memory. I just like score meters, I miss that in modern games.
Because I'm entertained by dumb shit like that, a house/manor/property by one of the towns which you can improve and decorate, buying and finding furniture. It'd be more than just collecting sprites though, a lot of them could do things, not necessarily always great or useful things, but some would.
>A score meter, not for any good reason, it just lists the score on the current level, resets when you leave but will keep your best in memory. I just like score meters, I miss that in modern games.
I really miss that on modern games too.
They are amazing to make your own challenges like setting a time limit and see how much points you can get, or tryng to get certain score, or compete with a friend to see who makes the best score in that time limit.
A highscore table would be amazing too, especially if it saves scores online. You could try to get worldwide's best score.
wikipedia has little info on most of the members that aren't Gackt, though I know he wanted to return to music. but that was like, 04. in a conversation with Klaha. who himself went completely dark after his pop career didnt hit off.
IMO MDM was at its best when it was malice Mizer 2.0. Juka was a pretty good vocalist, and its clear Mana was channeling Klaha in him. Seth, imo, isnt as good. and MDM since the member shift has in general gone downhill in quality, which is partially mana's own fault since he micromanages every detail of his bands, and writes the music.
>So, how would your ideal/perfect Castlevania game be?
hard to say. though, IMO, I think for a 3D game, the LoS games do have some inspiration to offer. while LoS2 was largely shit, all the castle sections were really REALLY good, in tone, pace, story, all that. and as far as alucard goes, his DLC gameplay was really good too. Just needs some tweaking so when he uses different swords they aren't just different colored reskins with an elemental attribute.
and as far as LoS1 goes, it had pretty good atmosphere. scenes like this were great. and it had all the right areas (for a classicvania) too.
tldr, i think a good 3D game is overdue, with loS offering visual (at least) inspiration for a classicvania and LoS2's castle areas offering visual inspiration for a metroidvania. it just needs combat that is more platformy- less combat-hack-n-slash-y (the combat in both games is good, but IMO, the N64 games had the approach that made more sense- puzzle gameplay, involving platforming, and combat along the way)
forgot to mention the music- I liked the LoS series music, but the soundtrack needs to go back to location dependent. so youve got your catacombs theme, your besieged village theme, etc. atmospheric tracks like LoS is ok if done right. LoS had nice music but there was too little of it, which meant you heard The Waterfall during every climbing/platforming section, and the same 2-3 combat themes all throughout. if, say, Waterfall was SPECIFICALLY the theme of the clockwork tower, where it works well, (which was one of the best stages, IMO) or hell, the actual "waterfall of Agharta" in the name of the track, it would work better
You really don't like Metroid, that's some shit taste bro.
Also, how the hell do you know what it was gonna be? To my knowledge, no 32X was planned.
What was planned was an RPG one for the SNES, which was cancelled and it's assets recycled for SoTN.
So during the brief window that the (remarkably overpriced) 32X was relevant, any plans they had for a game on it would very likely have been RPG oriented.
Oh don't worry, there'll be plenty of pachinko machines.
In 2004 Yu-ki wrote the lyrics for Kozi's Memento single, which was pretty amazing, and was a song for Kami. But then he disappeared until that 2012 reunion.
And yeah, Klaha vanished after his 2005 (I think?) EP Setsubou. His solo career was pretty damn short and admittedly weird. I actually kind of liked his scape album, it's cheesy as hell and the production value is all over the place, but it had some interesting stuff going on. I also love his previous works with Pride of Mind, really great band.
As for Moi dix Mois, yeah I was really into them during the first 2 albums with Juka, it seemed like a continuation of Malice Mizer's later days with songs like Beast of Blood and Gensou Rakuen, although MM still had some diversity with softer songs like Garnet and Gardenia, as well as the Bara no seidou album being probably the better produced thing Mana ever did. MDM in comparision felt more indie, and Dix Infernal, a lot of the songs had the same kind of wall sound with too much stuff going on, a bit over produced IMO. Nocturnal Opera was more interesting, but still both albums were enjoyable to me at the time.
I actually like Seth/Seiji's prior bands to MDM, After Image, Amadeus and Brain Hacker, I was pretty excited when he joined MDM as I thought he was perfect for the kind of music Mana does, but indeed he feels a bit boring, all the passion of his operatic vocals in After Image and Amadeus just isn't there in MDM, it's weird, maybe he just grew older, or maybe I didn't pay too much attention to that era of MDM, around that time I kinda stopped following Mana that much, Beyond the Gate had some good stuff but it felt even weaker than the previous albums in terms of production, and Dixanadu bored me. In retrospect I actually liked Kozi's solo career better than MDM, and I feel Kozi was able to make more diverse and experimental music in 2 albums than Mana did in 4.
>You really don't like Metroid, that's some shit taste bro.
The one that's into casual first-party Nintendo games would have the shit taste, though.
Also, none of the Metroids are good. They reward exploration and grinding over true skill.
>that one guy who hates Nintendo with a passion
What's the matter? your parents couldn't afford more than one system when you were a kid?
How did it feel to have only half a childhood?
Most of the devs that went from Nintendo to PS were RPG devs. You claim to not like casual games so I assume you aren't interested on turn based JRPGs like Final Fantasy, right?
Nintendo 64 still got games like Goemon's Great Adventure and Sin and Punishment. You should like those if you like Castlevania and general Konami gameplay-focused, skill rewarding games.
talk for yourself nigga, don't include the rest of us in your own opinions and tastes.
I'd like to see you attempting a speedrun of SMB1, I bet you'd get a game over before world 3.
>N64 was only good if you liked kiddy collectathon platformers and Zelda.
Then what about Goemon's Great Adventure and Sin and Punishment?
GGA is one of the best Goemon games and has a lot of Castlevania vibes.
S&P is one of the best shooting games of 5th gen.
Oh, you're one of those guys.
What makes it so much better than the SNES entries?
Never came out globally, also exceptions don't make the rule etc.
>Oh, you're one of those guys.
Implying it isn't true. A majority of the N64 library wanted to cash in on Mario 64.
>What makes it so much better than the SNES entries?
You should play it, it's really good. For one, it's a lot more challenging than the SNES games, so it should be up your alley, assuming you actually enjoy hard games.
It also has a paranormal/spooky theme so it feels kinda castlevania-ish, albeit with the typical Goemon flair.
>Never came out globally
Same thing about most of the worthwhile fighters and shmups on Saturn. The PS1 ports shouldn't really count as they were always vastly inferior.
Importing games existed even back then, though.
PSX had a shit ton of exclusive fighters that came out in America. If you wanted the arcade experience go to an actual arcade however.
Anyway it's quite sad that your only excuse to praise the N64 is an overrated Treasure game that pales in comparison to Panzer Dragoon 2 and Omega Boost.
Nah I wouldn't really put up with PS1 ports. I owned a modchip Saturn back in the 90s so I could play the better ports on it. Later on I got the 4MB ram cart and the difference with arcade was very minimal.
>Anyway it's quite sad that your only excuse to praise the N64 is an overrated Treasure game that pales in comparison to Panzer Dragoon 2 and Omega Boost.
haha come on man, those games you mentioned are great (especially PDII) but S&P is amazing.
Sad to see you hate Nintendo with such a passion that it prevents you from enjoying good games, it probably bothers you that Nintendo published S&P.
And it's not an excuse, we're on a Castlevania thread so I mentioned games related to Konami.
Also S&P is not my only excuse, I strongly recommend GGA to you, but it seems you want to ignore it.
It was a port of a X68K game, and the rearranged version was casualized and gave Simon pink hair for whatever reason.
The original is a great game though.
Not sure why you're trying to shitpost by saying "keep crying nintenyearolds" as a /v/ teenager would say, though.
And? My point was that the rearranged version exclusive to PS1 isn't "hardcore" at all, but the original version that luckily is included on the disc is great.
And really, what exactly went through your mind when you made that post? capslock and all.
No one was talking about the games themselves since the beginning, you only realized this 160+ posts later?
Castlevania threads are shitposting central with lots of console war and false flagging, basically /v/.
>They reward exploration and grinding over true skill.
Exploration is bad? And grinding? There's no fucking grinding in Metroid, have you played any of them?
I would say there's some skill involved, yeah.
Oh, you're actually just 12 years old, you should go back to your daycare on >>>/v/
Sorry, sorry, I know this isn't retro but I have to get it off my chest right now. Order of Ecclesia is a disappointing mess. The only good thing about it is the return to a more gothic art style. Single lamest Dracula fight ever. Should have just replayed PoR.
That screenshot doesn't seem to establish anything, for what that's worth... I feel like I hate that stuff he mentions too, and I love Castlevania III. EXTREME precision is too much. Acrobatics like what people have to do in speedruns, where you only have 1/64 of a second to press a button or whatever AND you have to land on exactly the right pixel to make it possible, aren't much fun for me. But I don't think old Castlevanias required you to do that sort of thing.
Have YOU played any Metroids? Of course grinding for health is a thing in the games, that's why they give you a ton of energy tanks, and the first game starts you off with only 30hp so you have to go grind for health in that one.
If you stop to grind as soon as you get injured, instead of of pushing onwards and collecting health as you go, then maybe you're not any good at all at Metroid, hate the playa, don't hate the game. It's not the game's fault that you have to stop and twink because it gets too difficult to you.
Besides, there's plenty of places in the game which recharges your health for free.
Yeah, pretty much. I realise now playing it that the nes one was my first but I was to young to get past the merman dudes.
Is there any reason to be using the sword at all? The magic arrows do more damage at a safer distance
Magic arrows use MP, you don't have endless MP, once you've used your MP it regenerates slowly.
As you go through the game, you'll get more magic attacks (bullet souls), some better, some worse, some situational. Better bullet souls typically require more MP per use, thus can only be used so much before you have to wait for it to recharge or use an MP potion (but those aren't free).
Better weapons become available as you go through the game, and you'll be finding yourself having to balance the use of bullet souls and regular weapons, there are also different souls that are used for movement and for performing specific tasks, these also use MP.
If you prefer ranged combat, you can find a handgun later in the game (though it isn't very good, doing half of your base damage), and later a silver handgun (which actually gives you a proper damage bonus).
If you like to frequently use ranged attacks, you should try to get the Evil Butcher bullet soul (by killing Evil Butchers, naturally), it's cheap in MP use, can be used rapidly and has long reach.
My favorite bullet soul is the Lightning Doll, because it's powerful and there's never a time when it won't cook an enemy good or do a decent hit on a boss (though obviously all enemies have different resistances) that comes later in the game though.
There's also passive souls that will provide an effect or stat bonus by just having it equipped, without cost.
The game has various endings and there's lots to keep you busy, in my opinion it's one of the best Metroidvanias.
And holy fuck we just hit a deer with our car.
It never did. There were missteps here and there (any of the 3D entries), but the main line sidescrolling Castlevanias are still consistently good, unlike Sonic or Mario which can't seem to recapture what made their early scrollers good or Metroid which has just stopped producing any content.
speaking of Malice Mizer and Castlevania, I can't help but find a similitude between this part of Divided Bloodlines (the part starting at around 1:00)
and Malice Mizer's Apres Midi
Castlevania died with Lords of Shadows. Sure, it was the commercial success that Konami wanted (at least the first one, I don't know about the second one) but it was more like a God of War wanabee and less like a Castlevania.
After Lords of Shadows series, it ended up as a pachinko.
Yeah I was in the backseat typing, deer jumps out in front of car and impacts the grill with a BONK.
I think it snapped it's neck or something because it had fully bloodshot eyes, wasn't blinking, and was twitching for a while.
Car took only minor damage, the grill was plastic and shattered, one light cracked, but still worked, and I just noticed today that a tuft of fur fused itself onto the front of the hood. Insurance will probably cover it.
Anyway, the GBA titles are really the best of the Metroidvanias, I reccommend you check out each of them.
Aria has an unlockable bonus mode where you play as Belmont, if you want to Classicvania it up a little, and the other GBA titles both feature you as a whipper-cracker.
Aria is relatively generous with healing items, you can buy them and they aren't too expensive.
Harmony is more restrictive with them and money is more scarce, and merchants are a bit unusual, so you want to save them.
It alsi features an unlockable bonus mode to play as Simon Belmont from the original Castlevania, same graphics and behavior and all.
Moon is VERY stingy with healing items, and there is no merchants or any money, what you find is what you get, they drop rarely and most of them are rather low powered, you REALLY need to save them for when you need them the absolute most! It also has one of the hardest Draculas in the entire series, he hits hard, takes a lot of beatings, and his attacks are hard to dodge, be prepared.
Moon has multiple unlockable bonus modes, which changes the main character's "class", giving him a huge boost in one stat and it's growth, but penalties in others.
Like, the mage class gets lots of int and MP, as well as all magic cards, but you can't whip or take damage for shit.
Is true. Never noticed it before. Közi could have took inspiration (maybe unconciously) from Divided Bloodlines. Not castlevania related but I have noticed that ma chérie has a very heavy similitude to Umberto Tozzi's Gloria.
>ma chérie has a very heavy similitude to Umberto Tozzi's Gloria.
LOL, this is true, never noticed it before.
In fact, for a long time when I was listening to opposing bloodlines/divine bloodlines (whatever it's called) I was thinking it reminded me of a MM song, and I always though ma chérie, or maybe Gardenia, but it's definitely Apres Midi which also happens to be one of my favorite songs.
Speaking of IGAvania, I now want to play SOTN again after seeing a detailed review on it from an obscure YouTube channel I've gotten addicted to (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qx0HfXgTmgY). Is there any reason not to get the downloadable version on consoles? I feel like every time I download an old game on PSN, it runs like a shitty emulation.
The DS ones are by no means bad, Dawn Of Sorrow was an ok followup to Aria Of Sorrow.
The GBA ones are just kind of better in a lot of ways, but I think each portable Castlevania has something to offer on it's own (well, the later ones, I heard Adventures was supposed to be mega bland)
Dude, pretty much all the Metroidvanias ape Symphony to some degree, with Harmony being the most shameless in doing so.
Though I guess Ecclesia is much more varied in that, it actually didn't feel like it was trying to be Symphony.
I love Super Castlevania, it's one of my favorites, but you gotta shut your fucking mouth
>muh e-celeb boogeyman
Is not a legitimate argument and makes you come across as a worse simpleton than the people you're angry about.
It teleports you to the same room until you find another one.
what's funny about Egoraptor is that he actually thinks IV is a great Castlevania game, he just commented on how he thinks the whip makes the sub-weapons a bit useless but that's not saying much because he isn't really well-versed on SCV IV, he never finished it and on his grumps playthrough he gave up at Stage 8.
Yeah, obviously you rely a lot less on the sub-weapons, but I mean, if he actually used the sub-weapons more on his playthrough of it, he would have died a lot less. He actually sucked at the game, which surprised me a bit since he was able to finish Dracula X (SNES).
>He actually sucked at the game, which surprised me a bit since he was able to finish Dracula X (SNES).
How do you even do that? Super is easygoing and has fluid controls, X is much harsher and the controls are stiff and restrictive in comparison.
How do you suck at an easier game and be good at a harder one of the same series?
Super IV is a challenging game, something the Rondorks love to deny. The water level, the ballroom, treasure room, and clocktower stages are all much harder than most Castlevania games because they have really tricky platforming with lots of RNG.
I don't know, admittedly he sucked at Dracula X too, but maybe since it's a shorter game, he coult endure until the end. On IV he gave up at the cellar stage, he had to start over many times because of getting game overs. He struggled a lot with the floating eyes, precisely because he didn't use sub-weapons.
I agree, IV is not the most challenging game, but it puts up a decent challenge in the later levels.
Then again, I'm not able to tell which castlevania is easier or harder anymore because I've player through them all so many times. All I know is that I can go through Rondo barely losing any life, while on IV I struggle not to reach game over at the end, but I can still manage to.
>Super IV is a challenging game
Nominally, it has it's tricky parts, but really it doesn't run you even close to as hard as X or really any of the original CVs.
The treasury has real tricky and time limited platforming, but other than that and maybe Dracula, it's pretty chill.