/vp/ Makes a Game: Pokémon Sage

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>>22745452
QC Multimap Survey Madness (closes Feb. 5th, 11am EST):
https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/SurveyingHowToSurvey

Andante Bay, Dreamdery Ranch, & Route 10 Multimap Survey (closes Feb. 6th, 11:59pm EST, pending results of QC Multimap Survey Madness):
https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/WGK8GHZ

Gym TMs Batch 1 Name Survey (closes Feb 8th, 7pm CST):
https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/GymTMBatch1NameSubmissions

Scrapyard Multimap Round 4 (closes Feb. 10th, 11:59pm EST):
https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/Scrapyardmultimapround4

New Ability Pre-Changes Approval Survey (closes Feb. 12th, 3pm PST):
https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/MyCatsLikeCheetos

Demo Feedback Survey:
https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/F88BFDG

===========================================

New Ability Changes submission thread:
http://z13.invisionfree.com/Pokemon_Gen_VP/index.php?showtopic=510

Gym Leader names submissions thread (names for the !/? pair should be submitted in pairs):
http://z13.invisionfree.com/Pokemon_Gen_VP/index.php?showtopic=468

Gym TM submissions thread:
http://z13.invisionfree.com/Pokemon_Gen_VP/index.php?showtopic=383

Plot minor changes submission thread:
http://z13.invisionfree.com/Pokemon_Gen_VP/index.php?showtopic=493

Dialogue archive:
http://z13.invisionfree.com/Pokemon_Gen_VP/index.php?showtopic=169

Random ideas:
http://z13.invisionfree.com/Pokemon_Gen_VP/index.php?showtopic=419

Sidequest ideas:
http://z13.invisionfree.com/Pokemon_Gen_VP/index.php?showtopic=441

The Plot:
http://capx.wikia.com/wiki/The_Plot

Requested tiles (add to the list or try your hand at making some):
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1vkpQwh4vyKTJ5HjTfVBJPI1h0k3Kmq55JuGOs8qJeqk/edit

KEEP THIS UPDATED WITH ANY CHANGES!
http://capx.wikia.com/wiki/Demo_Changes

first for ban majora

>>22744528

Circle Burrowl, I checked and is wrong. Ill correct it later.

>>22739627
The problem with that isn't the animation, it's the BP. You're getting hit by a fucking asteroid, which in real life is instantly lethal to pretty much fucking everything.

>>22739686
>>22740137
Most people assume that when voting, your goal is to make a good game. That's because this is being made on 4chan, rather than tumblr or somewhere, and here the default paradigm is to focus on the quality of the product rather than the identity of the person who made it. If you personally would rather punish people you don't like by attempting to shut them out of the project, even to the extent of voting for designs you'd otherwise consider inferior and effectively sabotaging the game, it's your prerogative to hold that philosophy but you are a faggot who doesn't belong on 4chan or in this project.

>>22740169
It's our snorlax, so that's fine.

>>22740870
I really like that image of the sun.

Also for such a cool pokémon, Somberado needs a better sprite.

>>22741486
This is high in the not-Andes mountains. Other parts of the region are low down and not snowy.

>>22745675
>but majora is an exception

>>22740910
>>22740910
It's an improvement but the main problem is she's too rubia. Darken her skin and hair at least.

>>22741545
Galaxagos is better. I don't even see the difference for the next three, please specify it. Except the eyes on the lantern, those are worse now than before.
Burrowl is worse, both the pose, shich is shit, and the way the torso is laid out which is worse looking in general.
People have already said about machima.
Chayan is shit but he was before too, so whatever.
Gilla is vastly better in the old sprite, everything different in yours is worse. The old one is good and yours is shit.

>>22741811
>Not sure Chayan will ever not look like steaming dog shit.
Well not if it's made by someone who feels like that about it.

>>22745691
If you're a petty fuck, I guess. It's not like he'll leave just because his maps don't win. Most he'll do is stop making maps, which means we don't get his maps (that are not horrible) but we still get his shitposting and anti-fun (which is). Shutting out shit he makes because you don't like him is actively choosing the worst possible situation regarding Majora.

>>22741946
>>22742006
Everyone, please look at this retarded faggot and don't be like him.

>>22741987
The point of a sugi is to look pretty. That's why they're on the wiki. They are not official confirmed designs but they, like sprites, should resemble the official design in all important ways, so it's fine if people see them. The reason nothing is based off of them is because then we'd be playing a game of telephone and tiny error made in the sugi could easily proliferate and grow.

>>22742067
>I've been using the approved art
This guy is the one doing it right.

>>22742109
No, the sprite is wrong and should be changed to match the approved design. The sugi being the same is, as far as spriting is concerned, an irrelevant coincidence.

>>22742434
>basically Red but older and cooler, and with a story tie-in
I like it. But don't call him a prodigy.

>>22742541
Both A and B mean that your response should be to inquire for further details. "How so?" might be sufficient.

>>22743943
>>22743943
>good luck convincing anyone to vote for something that isn't a derivation of [a boring design]
Thanks but luck isn't necessary :^)

>>22744295
>>22744394
>Facade
>not Façade
Can we fix this?

>>22745717
>sugis are the official designs
This is not a false statement.

>>22745822
At least it should be. Just saw the context of the discussion, and obviously the original approved design is more important than the sugi.

Threadly reminder that we need a tiles survey, so we can vote the opaque water the skypelluminaty want to force in.

>>22745671
>>22745675
>>22745681
>>22745690
>>22745693
>>22745683
>>22745698
>>22745702
>>22745717
>>22745731
>>22745738
>>22745758
The fuck is wrong with you

>>22745822
Yes it is. The official design is the one that got voted in. A sugi is a specific style of deisign made for a particular purpose, based on the approved design - like a sprite, though the purpose is different.

>>22745897
Some people have jobs but still want to contribute to things. This isn't a chatroom, you know. Replying to things that happened more than a minute ago is normal.

>>22745901
Stream of conciousness replying to arguments from last thread isn't really contributing

>>22745904
Oh, you...

>>22745904
4chan confirmed for IRC. If it wasn't 3 minutes ago it's ancient history.

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Does this angle look better for Crawglock backsprite? Also, top or bottom one?

>>22745920
top is great

>>22745899
>based on the approved design
Thus, the sugis are oa depiction of the official design. And considering they aren't easy to make, provoke a lot of discussion (mostly praise) and are used for the main dex image, they should be able to be taken as the prime reference for designs. Which is fine if we qc the sugis well enough and update them according to minor changes.

I get your meaning though, and you're right that it can be problematic to rely too heavily on the sugi.

>>22745897
What was that for?

>>22745904
An argument is a disagreement in a proper detail of the project. Bringing up reasons for one side or another allows people to make decisions based on a greater body of information/logic. Therefore arguing is (at least as long as you're not a Majora-tier obstructive faggot about it) contributing, even if minorly so.

>>22745931
dunky is a bitter old chode sometimes. How dare you have opinions.

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>>22745931
>Thus, the sugis are a depiction of the official design
A depiction, yes. But they're not themselves the official design. And since any depiction, made by imperfect humans, but necessarily be imperfect, any sprite based off of a sugi is liable to inherit those imperfections. Sure, the difference should be trivial if everything is being done right, but it's minimized further by just using the actual design.

>>22745958
good image choice

>>22745675
Y-you actually think M-majora's map was better than mine ;_;

>>22745975
Honestly that's ancillary to the issue, which is more philosophical. I don't even know which map is Majora's this time, because it's utterly immaterial and therefore I don't care. In general, I find his maps kind of boring. But if someone is voting against Majora's map specifically because it's Majora, that implies he'd otherwise vote for it and therefore does think it's the best.

>>22745958
nigga, quit stealing my argument from last thread. treachery of images is my jam homes

>>22746002
What can I say, you were right.

>>22745958
>they're not themselves the official design
The point is that they should be. Especially at this stage. We should not have unofficial sugis anymore, especially not in the dex image.
Pretty sure that pipe looks like the pipe it was inspired by.

>>22746008
but you shouldn't be smoking out of an oil painting should you.

>>22746015
pokemon aren't real

>>22746008
What exactly would an official sugi entail? Do you want to replace every voted-in concept with a new image that happens to be a sugi? That would be a ton of surveying to no practical gain.

>>22746020
It's safer dealing with commodities.

>>22746022
No to meniton minor redsigns were closed long ago, so doing so would break our own rules, which in general should only be done for something that's a fairly big deal, and this isn't.

>>22746020
POST OF THE DAY

>>22746020
that feel when

>>22745920
Top is okay.

>an argumant that was finished has started up again
Dunky was right.

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OKAY CHANGING SUBJECT!

Does anyone not agree that blue snow is better than grey?

>>22746059
I agree that opaque water looks like shit

>>22746059
Make it a mix of both.
That shade of blue seems more unrealistic, but Pokemon is a game supposed to look colorful.

>>22746059
make it yellow

>>22746059
but yeah, blue snow all the way

>>22746059
is it compatible with transparent water

>>22746063
Must have sucked for you playing the official games.

>>22746095
*compared to transparent one
jeez

>>22746059
Yes, it's a definite improvement.

>>22746064
Grey isn't colorful either way, whether it's straight grey or a bluish grey.

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>>22746085
there is only one example of transparent water in the main series and it is unreachable.

>>22746022
>What exactly would an official sugi entail?
It's obvious. An official sugi is the sugi we vote on. And it's only a valid sugi if it's design-accurate. So there technically is no such thing as an unofficial sugi, at least not in the dex. If there is, they should be removed and our sugi artists pestered to get on the job.

All I'm saying is that it's legitimate to assume the sugi to be design-accurate and thus using it as basis for inspiration. It would naturally be more prudent to check the original approved design, though.

>>22746015
you shouldn't be smoking

badum tss

>>22746059
Blue is better. Not necessarily that blue. We'll see when the tiles are tweaked

>>22746059
yeah, blue snow is good. I've been meaning to do that for a while actually.
Did you also tint the cliffs? I don't really like that.

>>22746109
and it looks great, and we already have the tiles

>>22746114
I don't see why you laugh, if some new tiles don't feel like a straight up improvement, they will surveyed, stop shitposting.

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>>22746130
Legit question: Are you new?

>>22746143
No, are you?
Please explain what do you have against that without retorting to memes.

>>22746147
We don't survey tiles. You'd know this if you weren't new.

>>22746150
Can you read >>22746130 and explain why would this be unfair or bad or whatever you have against it?

>>22746150
we don't survey movesets either, and see Shell Smash, Extreme Speed and Mega Horn

>>22746150
There are obviously contestable issues. Water and grey cliffs spring to mind.

>>22746157
We don't survey tiles. You really are new.

>>22746164
those seem to be proof that we do survey movesets.

>>22746168
Some people prefer transparent water, some prefer opaque, what do you propose?

>>22746157
Don't bother trying to be reasonable, this places community just like the game is a massive pile of shit and its better for anyone to just leave while they can to avoid being autists.

>>22746172
That we do like the official games. Sounds reasonable to me.

>>22746168
>>22746150
Quality reasoning here, you may actually be on my side and just false flagging, who knows.

>>22746179
Not to me. It seems we disagree, I guess we'll have to survey it.

>>22746179
I disagree

What's so great about the transparent water anyway?

>>22746196
It looks great and comfy to me, and gives a shallow water feel ideal to our high altitude locations.

>>22746121
I did veeerrry slightly, whoever wants to edit the tileset can decide exactly how much everything is tinted.

I'll also point out that I made the little bits of grass poking out of the snow actually green, just adds a bit more colour.

>>22746206
I agree, both changes looks great, could you try it with transparent water to see how it would look like?

>>22746206
How sure are you that those were supposed to be grass?

>>22746202
>comfy
ugh I hate this word. Maybe it's just oversaturation from /v/ and people using it for literally everything.

>>22746121
>I don't really like that.
I do.

>>22746218
sorry

>>22746172
let mapchat decide. Seriously, whenever thread gives input to things regarding maps, the entire mapchat is filled with us mocking how dumb 90% of the feedback is. >make it bigger was a a meme for a while. If you're worried about illuminati shenanigans, guess what, you too can join the illuminati.

>>22746223
yeah, no

>>22746223
no

>>22746216
the only other thing I could even begin to think it could be would be the scratch marks of a big cat in the snow.

It's grass.

>>22746223
I don't want to join Skype, this is /vp/ makes a game.
Same could be said about statschat with movesets and plotchat with plot, but it doesn't happen.

After the last survey being posted without consulting anyone, and taking away the QC period, mapchat is not to be trusted.

>>22746244
>>22746223
Oh, and I forgot about the very last survey which is trying to force these tiles in a subtle way.

>/vp/ Makes a Game: Pokémon Sage
Is it still the same game from don't know how many years ago?

>>22746262
y

>>22746262
si

>>22746262
no its skype makes a game

>>22746272
Jesus, when are you going to finish it?

>>22746276
Jesus isn't on the team as far as I know, but he might contribute as anon.

>>22746276
Next Demo Soon™
We have all the bases done, but there's a lot more to do (maps, plot...) check the wikia if you want to see actual progress.

>>22746276
It'll be a while. Remember, unless horribly rushed, even with a full professional dev team, a game at average takes about 2 years to make. That's with skilled workers and a heirarchy that directs how everything goes so everyone works smoothly.

We're a bunch of assholes constantly at each other's throats. There's no real boss here and everything is volunteer. It's gonna take a long time.

>>22746282
>dia
>contributing

>>22746223
You saying that mapchat is making fun of anons trying to give feedback is the perfect way to back up the decision of handing full control to mapchat.

I have nothing against meritocracy per se, but we don't have to go full elitist here.

>>22746329
I've said it before and I say it again, we should have made Dunky a monarch

>>22746368
lel

>>22746059
>using the 3d sprites

>>22746375
What?

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>>22746375
>3d sprites

>>22746329
I don't know what he's talking about but only thing close to that is mapchat members showing disagreement with what others say, like anyone else would in thread or skype. And its not like mapchat is homogenous in its opinions either.

>>22746223
Can you join mapluminati without any mapping or sprite skills?

>>22746398
kek no

>>22746398
Majora was in there at one point

>>22746375
That's not even the pseudo-3D tiles. What are you smoking?

>>22746404
But I want to make fun of anons too.

>>22746420
happiest man on earth

>>22746394
They could state why the feedback of certain kinds isn't useful, addressing the anons that come up with it. Seems to me a lot more productive than mockery on Skype, as anon implied was the case.

And mapchat not being homogenous on its decision is simply more proof that their decisions aren't the "objectively best or most reasonable ones" as is sometimes used to justify the fact we don't survey certain things, but merely the decisions most people on mapchat happen to agree upon.

I restate that I have nothing against meritocracy, though. But there are a few contestable issues regarding tiles that would benefit from a more openly democratic approach. Shutting those issues down with no better reason than "we mapchat" which is then justified with "if you dont like it, join mapchat" is dubious at best.

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>>22746109
Here's another example of transparent water in the main games that is very reachable and that looks great.

>>22746420
Don't do this, damnit. At least you spoilered.

Never change, dunky.

>>22746434
>anything in sinnoh
>looking great

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>>22746420
Damn, Dunky lost weight.

>>22746434
Thing I have against transparent water, is that it is just blue rock tiles.

>>22746443
Well it's the art style that is the closest to the game we're making, so I don't think it's irrelevant at all.
Fact is, Game Freak has done transparent water before and there's no reason why we shouldn't when it looks better than opaque,

>>22746434
That looks really bad if you ask me.

>>22746432
>>22746394
I think the best way to handle it would be putting a set up to a confirmation survey on mapchat's proposal, with a separate question for each tile change.
This way we would avoid "not fitting with each other" tiles being voted in, and we would be able to change those which people think don't look good.

>>22746420
Please delete, I'm sure Dunky doesn't want his real name on here
And if you are Dunky then you aren't the sharpest tool

And speaking of tools, fuck you 4chan for showing me sushi and pizza at 8 in the morning

>>22746460
>there's no reason why we shouldn't when it looks better than opaque,
That's one hot opinion.

>>22746460
>it looks better than opaque,
it doesn't though.

>>22746472
I know, I'm sure you have one as well.

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>>22746443
If anything looked good in Sinnoh, it was probably the lakes.

>>22746420
Are you related to President Roosevelt in any way?

>>22746479
nothing in sinnoh looked good.

>>22746468
That was close.

>>22746434
very visually noisy

>>22746484
>>22746472
Anyway, thing is I remember that the first time I played the demo, the first thing that really wowed me was the water in the starting town. It looked great.
Now it just looks plain and boring in comparison imo.
I'm not suggesting we put transparent water everywhere, but just in specific locations where it's fitting, like in the starting town.
Besides, it's in the mountains, the water is supposed to be super pure and clear, and transparent water emphasizes that.

>>22746476
Yeah. Didn't state mine as if it was true though.

>>22746500
agreed, we have rock tiles if you want to rock riles.

>>22746508
An alternative could be just making the opaque water more cyan in the mountains.

>>22746508
Agree 100%, like in small lakes

>>22746468
>>22746490
We got archives though.

>>22746508
That's a sound compromise, but isn't there a problem with transparent tiles where they have to he very shallow?

>>22746434
You might notice that, even if your example image happens to have transparent water, it's a lot LESS transparent than the kinds of waters we've been using.

>>22746550
it's deeper

The main argument I've heard against transparent water is that it can't be animated in RPGMaker because it isn't an autotile.

Now I'm no expert in rpg maker, but couldn't this be circumvented by making an autotile that is just the shimmer/animation of the water (without the edges or the blue colour) and layering it up on top of the water?

>>22746556
it doesn't change transparency at any level