>>323687568 ps4/xbox had better marketing for the actual console even going as far as to advertise things which where still months off. also multiplats and people not understanding that its not a tablet addon for wii
>>323687568 No FIFA, I think they just got Netflix back as well. And they still make a game console with a controller different than their competitors, rather than making a glorified DVD player that can sometimes play the latest EA Sports games.
Basing the system around tablet shit and the worst marketing ever.
Motion controls made it appeal to casuals because HURR IM GETTING FIT WHILE I PLAY VIDEOGAMES THIS IS SOCIALLY ACCEPTABLE AND I SAW IT ON ELLEN. Making it a tablet in a market already hugely oversaturated in tablets, destroyed all that.
Also, nobody knows it is a new system. I work in childcare and parents will STILL be surprised when I tell them about the WiiU.
>>323687568 >What was the Wii U's downfall /v/? Being released by Nintendo. I'm not trying to say "Nintendo is doomed", but there were certainly no much faith in Nintendo home consoles since N64 times. And in Europe Nintendo consoles are a lot more rare. And the crowd, Nintendo created with Wii, switched to PS4, especially when Sony began to say "we're with gaymurs, we're for gaymurs". Saying about NX, I don't have any thoughts how they will think to get more people buy their new home console.
>>323687568 Using a PowerPC CPU when all the other major consoles finally moved on to x86.
Also the rise of mobile gaming on smartphones and tablets might of contributed to it. Instead of buying a $60 game very casual gamers can spend less then $5 for a mobile game that works on multiple devices.
1.- Not doing enough to differentiate from their previous console 2.- Tablet gimmick when actual iPads and Notes were booming 3.- zero 3rd party support secured 4.- Weaker hardware compared to their upcoming competitors 5.- Shit tier online system
>>323690507 Because buying a different console in the 90's and even the 6th gen,felt like buying a whole different gaming world. In short, i dont care if they are "budget pcs", i care about the video games, excluisve video games. The thing witht the xbone and ps4 is that they share 99% of their library with 1 or 2 mediocre exlusives now and then. The wii u doesn't even have what set nintendo appart, exclusives. Sure there is bayonetta, but everything else is just dumbed down and casualized Games that were once easy to learn but hard to master IP's. Fuck nintendo, because they fucked us in the ass. Tr4sh was the last straw, and i am happy to see them failing so badly.
>>323690837 >dumbed down and casualized Games You only see what you want to see. I'd bet a lot of money that Donkey Kong on Wii U or Kid Icarus on 3DS on the highest difficulty setting would make you eat crow, for example.
>>323687568 It's name. It tried to get the normie audience that originally bought the wii. Every normie I know has no idea what a wii U is and at best think it's just the same thing or an add on until I show them it's a completely different system
>>323687568 >the stupid name that leaves people unsure if it's an add-on or a new console >the terrible marketing that focuses entirely on the gamepad while actively hiding the console, further adding to the confusion >no amazing hardware to appeal to ignorant normies who love cg movie games >no competent third-party relations, making it so the masses won't even consider it a worthy investment >the gamepad is a convenient excuse for shitty third-parties not bringing games over to it >the gamepad brings an interesting concept to their game design, in asymmetrical multiplayer and so on, but hardly any of Nintendo's own games take advantage of it. >even with off-tv play and the gyro being extremely useful for some games, the gamepad had no need for a microphone and camera >the multitude of spinoffs instead of mainline games, when their core consumers are the only ones they can market to now >focusing on the desires of the japanese market when it's downright tiny compared to the american and european market and has in general lost its interest in home consoles.
>>323692494 >Alienating their previous audience with their novelty casual console
>there are still people who truly believe that Nintendo ever used to be the first choice for the "hardcore crowd"
You do realize that Nintendo has always been kid-friendly? Back in the day, the more mature audience used to play on home computers and Sega consoles. Later on, they moved over to the PSX and its successors.
Nintendo just needs to stray from the blue ocean strategy that made the Wii a success and actually advertise their shit. Mobile phones and tablets have eaten up all the casual market in the gaming industry, Nintendo isn't really gonna make money there unless they release things on mobile platforms. As for advertising, look at Splatoon, they advertised the shit out of it, and even my casual sister and her boyfriend remember that annoying commercial to this day. Nintendo proved they can sell a new product, they just don't care to invest in what they have, probably because NX is coming. I mean, XCX was a critical success, but I can remember seeing ONE commercial for it. I think Nintendo still makes high quality products, but they need to advertise their products everywhere else.
Treating the casual market like the hardcore market.
The vita is unpopular but a massive success because the types of people who play vita games are adults with disposable income. When they want a game, they simply buy it. Appealing to otaku is a good idea. They spend more and are more invested in their hobby.
The wiiu is unpopular but a massive failure because the types of people who play wiiu games are children with no disposable income. When they want a game, their parents have to buy it. Appealing to children is a good idea if you have the market cornered. Children spend less because adults regulate their spending, but there are many more children than otaku. Apple and samsung are particularly successful because of children and teens. Nintendo fails at reaching children because their systems only have nintendo games. The other games children want are on other platforms. The ps4 has become a family platform because the dad can play cod on the weekends and his son can play minecraft without needing multiple devices.
tl;dr know your fans. Nintendo couldn't properly identify its core fanbase if it wanted to.
>>323693146 You're probably a young fag but Sega actually had games with violent content and games that appealed to an older crowd (racing games etc.). Also, many Sega games were much more difficult than your average NIntendo game.
>>323693450 >Nintendo fails at reaching children because their systems only have nintendo games Because they're still deluded into thinking their the main place for young gamers to play. Everything is behind tablets and mobile and the consoles and games that they DO play are mature.
>>323693601 >Sega actually had games with violent content So did the SNES, let me guess you're gonna bring up the Mortal Kombat blood thing >and games that appealed to an older crowd So did the SNES. >Also, many Sega games were much more difficult than your average NIntendo game intothetrashitgoes.jpg
>>323687568 Naming it "Wii U" is a great start. The console didnt establish much difference from its older sibling the Wii. The tablet controller is to gimicky for a console and with an abysmal battery life to boot; the symmetry of the controller/tablet is wierd and takes getting used to. I couldnt play smash 4 efficiently. But it was fine for zelda and the like. Also having a lack of third party devs and games sunk the ship hardcore.
The reason why you faggots never understand that Nintendo never makes adult games is because their main focus for marketing is in JAPAN ONLY. They don't care about the neckbeards or Otaku fags in the westernations looking for that deep and edgy jrpg or shump. They want to pander towards Japanese kids who all live in the same neighborhood and don't engage in playing any Gaijin console like the XBOX or even the Playstation.
Why will the NX succeed based on interviews of what Nintendo now values?
>powerful (after criticism that Wii U didn't compete with competitors) >strong launch lineup (literally what siesta said they were pushing for before he passed; rest in peace) >bold marketing campaign (Iwata and new CEO Kimishima have both stated they are going to be aggressive with their intellectual property this time around)
These three are what leads to 3rd party support. We spreading know Squeenix is on board.
People obsess about the "gimmick" but it doesn't fucking matter, it's about the power, the launch lineup, and the marketing strategy. Everything else is secondary.
The only reason the SNES had those things was becasue of third party support. Sega had games like that from their first party studios. Currently, Nintendo has virtually zero support from third parties and can't offer much in that regard, can they now?
>>323693909 the funny thing is that it wasn't announced. They just mentioned it because they didn't want idiots thinking they were going mobile-only after their DeNA collab announcement.
Thing is, every company is already working on their next console, that's just how things work. Nintendo fucked up in giving it a name, which allowed people to talk about it, and everyone suddenly assumed that the NX was ready and about to be released.
The moral here is that you can't cater to idiot game journalists, but we're never learning that.
>>323687568 Giving third parties about a year to release games with almost no competition from Nintendo's games, and then third parties mostly releasing late ports at full price and wondering why their games aren't selling.
>>323687568 Most of all it was probably the shit hardware.
Like with the PS3 and the 360, the Xbone and the PS4 are close enough in specifications that most games aim for somewhere between the two and that somewhere is about twice what the Wii or now the Wii U can handle. This means if a game is getting ported to the Wii/Wii U the developers have to make a second game specifically for the Wii and it's low install base and even lower attach rate for third party games just makes it not worth the effort. People don't buy a Nintendo console to play the worst version of third party multiplats they buy it to play whatever exclusive games it offers that they can't get anywhere else.
Last generation the order for multiplats usually went PC > > > 360 > PS3 > > > Wii Sometimes the PS3 version would be better than the 360 version if the developer wanted to go through the hassle of optimizing for the peculiarities of the PS3's hardware but rarely if ever did anyone bother doing that when porting multiplats. PC is far enough ahead that when it gets a multiplat it was almost always the best version even when it was the laziest port possible, but being that far ahead also kept some developers from even bothering to port games so we ended up with some 'console exclusives' that would aim for only the PS3 & 360 kinda like how the Wii was too weak and they'd have to build a second game just for the Wii the PC was so strong they'd have to build a new game just for PC and most didn't want to bother.
This generation the order for multiplats is PC > > > PS4 > > Xbone > > > > Wii U The gap between the PS4 and the Xbone is about as wide as the gap between the average gaming PC and the PS4 at the moment so we've started seeing PC / PS4 multiplats that forego even making the Xbone version, often style themselves as 'PlayStation Exclusive * Also on PC' which leaves the Wii U so far between in hardware it's not even a consideration.
>>323694151 >>323695104 >moving the goalposts Nobody gives a fuck if they were first or third party, people who wanted Nintendo first party and "hardcore" 3rd party games went Nintendo, those who wanted SEGA went with SEGA. It's called "Nintendo hard" for a fucking reason. Metroid, Star Fox and F-Zero weren't exactly Kirby games if we're talking about difficulty, and Mario was generally harder than Sonic. The "lel Nintendo had no hardcore gamers" meme is demonstrably false.
>>323696180 Gamecube had competent hardware and it was equally shafted, it's far more about relations with third-parties than anything else. WiiU is certainly capable of running MGSV and possibly fallout 4 but those games just won't be seen on a Nintendo console
>>323687568 The 'gimmick' wasn't good enough to be honest. >Can't buy more of the pads >Not having games similar to FF:CC to make good use of the pads Honestly there just aren't any good games first party or otherwise tht make use of the pad, that said there is another VERY key reason it failed. Piracy.
You see, the Wii had many shovelware titles and etc but it still did good because it was hackable and people could sift through the shovelware something no one is going to do it at $20-60 a game but will gladly do for an easy download. I myself have both the Wii and Wii U, guess which one gets more use?
The DS and 3DS were similar, but the library was also lacking unfortunately this is part of the previous problem. A hackable system is great AT the time for system sales, but sucks for the third parties because so many people will pirate the games. DS->3DS Wii->Wii U PSP->Vita All follow this trend.
>>323690943 >The general public still thinks they haven't released a new console yet. >haven't released a new console yet. >yet. Ooh shit. This could actually work in their favor with the NX under one assumption. The assumption being that there is a market if retards out there still waiting for a new Nintendo system not realizing it's been out for 3 years now. Won't work that way though. Really feel it's suicide to release a new system mid generation. WiiU= Saturn NX = Dreamcast It'll be a solid system and a cult classic but ultimately fail and Nintendo will quit home console for either entirely handheld until that market is killed by the growing mobile phone market literally already happening or just third party which I don't see happening.
Nintendo needs to finally make the games that their fans asked for. The problem is that they keep trying to preserve their casual fans instead of realizing that casuals won't give them the sales they need.
>make a good, 3D pokemon game that is not the same as all its predecessors >make something with the boring ass franchises like donkey kong and pikimin, make it fun somehow >invest more in dank Japanese third party >get all the basic multiplats like COD and Battlefield
>>323696492 >Nobody gives a fuck if they were first or third party
Of course. They only care now about those kind of games missing on Nintendo's system. Teenagers and young adults want to play edgy and violent games. They are also the ones who like story-driven games but again Nintendo rarely provides games like that.
>>323697082 That would effect game sales, the main problem is the amount of games and their quality, and if you look at all 3 of those systems they all have the same problem. 3DS was focused on slightly more by Nintendo but that's first party they have a vested interest in staying and will.
Your 'tired of nintendo's gimmicks' bullshit is A)Wrong for the most part, there are many Wii games that excellently used the 'gimmick' and were extremely fun, it also had many games that didn't need it and were fun. You wouldn't find those decent games if you didn't pirate though. It also had a lot of actually good games mostly first party.
B)That doesn't explain at all the lack of launch titles, follow up titles within the first year (Where development would have already been going on a year-2 thus not have those numbers), it didn't have the proper backing from developers in the first place, and unfortunately it's price point despite being lower than the others wasn't enough to draw developers
>Being called the wiiu like everyone else said >The common player-base being casual as hell and sucking at video games that aren't catered to handholding them. >Appealing to more veteran and long-time video game enthusiasts and alienating everyone else. >Not having Major 3rd party releases that weren't helped out by nintendo. >Not having even a dvd player inside it.
That being said I love everything about the WiiU. It is for real veteran game players.
>>323697082 >>323697517 or publishers to believe that there would be one in every living room thus make a bunch of shovelware/'decent' games.
The fact that Nintendo has made it clear it doesn't care about things like sports games doesn't help their overall 'family console' reputation unfortunately because while it aims for kids it doesn't aim for the average american dad that wants to play sports games or some other casual shit like it with their favorite 'IRL characters'
Piracy is obviously not the ONLY reason that the Wii U is doing bad, there are many, but you also have to consider that just like there are multiple reasons the Wii U isn't doing hot, there are also many other systems not doing hot with very similar reasons that you can look at, and see how serious they are.
3DS sales went up quite a bit in december (Guess what, it became possible to downgrade in december and just got patched now), that's a large effect on sales. Wii U is getting a possible exploit leaked soon.
>>323696501 Their shafting again was a hardware issue since they opted to go for mini 1.5gb DVDs while the Xbox and the PS2 both had the 4.7gb discs meaning any multiplat had to cram itself into less than a quarter of the size. However, Gamecube if you remember was still in the running for multiplats even with this disadvantage and would often come out superior to the PS2 version, sure it was in last place but they still got games back then.
They made that mistake with the N64 too when they stuck with cartridges over moving to optical discs. Nintendo had this erroneous belief that shorter load times were more important than capacity which I think they finally learned around the Wii era but at the same time they made the assumption that skimping out on hardware was also acceptable probably lead by the fact the PS2 was the weakest console of it's time and sold fucking gangbusters. While it worked out for them with the Wii that bet didn't pay off with the Wii U.
If we don't look at the specific practical mistakes, I'd say that the root of all fuckery was that massive surge of overconfidence that Ninty got after the massive fluke of luck known as Wii. They thought that they had the situation under control and steady legs, while the situation was more akin to a guy winning lottery.
>>323687568 The name No marketing Barely any games No 3rd party support No system sellers at launch.
Basically Nintendo being clueless.
Had they given it a more sensible name, marketed is decently and most importantly, had a big system seller at release (think mainline Zelda or Mario, or even Metroid), it would have sold much, much better.
>>323697854 This is more of a theme with games overall to be honest, but yes 3D platformers tend to fall flat with difficulty, and the worst part is it's no that they can't do it, it's that some people struggle and never get the answer and 'win' therefore they tone it down or don't bother to add in more difficulty.
Games that are legitimately hard to beat and challenging are only played by the strict minority, and I don't mean artificial difficulty like DaS.
>>323698062 they could've used multiple disks, which many third-party games did. The real problem was that there was little userbase and that said userbase didn't invest in third-party games with the same interest they showed for first-party. They just didn't think the effort was worth it, where they had no trouble gimping RE4 to run on PS2, for example, because they knew it would bring sales.
>>323698142 Nintendo honestly doesn't know how to cope with positive responses. Remember when everyone loved the 3DS reveal, and they decided to price it at $250 because they assumed it meant everyone would buy one?
>>323698458 Not entirely no, Nintendo had been banging on the 'load times matter' drum for awhile even though most consumers already chose their competitor the playstation with it's 3 minute long load times 3:1 over their console they still thought having shorter load times would make their console more attractive to consumers.
Conversely Xbox did go with DVDs and it got them the #2 slot that generation even when they had a shitty lineup of games comparably. It was obviously the right move.
>>323696223 Unfortunately while I enjoyed the first NSMB their attempt at remaking levels, adding in 1-2 shitty new mechanics and rebranding it are really getting fucking old. I can't even bring myself to finish NSMB2 at this point.
>>323695361 Smash Mario Kart with more new characters (less DLC related just a larger roster of nintendo characters) A proper sequel to SM64, or something with a compltely new and fun mechanic/playstyle for Mario (Mario RPG proper sequel?), Waluigi game with his own unique style, Metroid that's actually serious, Zelda game that's actually serious (TP/SS sequel that actually looks good and is serious),
Really they just have a huge roster to fuck with and Smash showed that imagining that roster together in other genres is fucking great, they need to do more of that.
'Party'- Mario Party Fightan - Smash Sports - Mario X Racin - Mario Kart
Still can: Action/Adventure Platform RPG FPS Strategy Music HnS Beat 'em Up Metroidvania
>>323698721 Or what about Fire Emblem? >shit looks like the series is dying >let's just test ice with one more game >it actually sells >wow, now we can split the next game in three separately purchasable parts!
Just some of my nitpicks >No Metroid or F-Zero >Allowing Trash to be on the E-shop like "Bigley's Revenge" and all those Minecraft clones >Make a gamecube adapter, purely for Smash, and not update any games to be compatible with the gamecube adapter, and I guess Gamecube is hard to bring to VC? >Seems to be more focused on making or giving the 3DS, titles, rather than making things for the Wii U (Although, this isn't a bad thing for the 3DS market I guess?) >Not a proper 3D Mario title, akin to 64, Sunshine, Galaxy. Instead you get a better version of 3D Land.
Not only that, but I find a majority of the games lackluster.
>>323699060 to follow on this if Nintendo focused on making casual competitive versions of most of those genres that had a semicomplete cast, preferably even rotating certain people in different ones I think it would be great.
Yes a lot of those genres have specific games, Platformers (Mario, Luigi, Peach, DK, Kirby, etc), RPG (Mario&Luigi, Xeno, etc), FPS(Splatoon), but there is no overlap like Smash, which is fine but I think that SSE showed that this diverse roster in other game types is something people definitely want to see.
I would absolutely love to see a Beat 'em Up with Smash-like cast, or even just villains.
HnS is kind of already there in Zelda at least with a musou, but you can easily diversify the cast. They're avoiding it and I think it's to make their IP not get stale, but they've got a lot of sideline IP they can use, and more than enough to swap them out so that if the game is a hit they show up in the sequel.
Even better if the majority of the lineup aren't MCs
>>323699626 Oh and I forgot, I'd also love to see this for the semi-exclusive thirdparties and first parties that Sony has built up as well, I think honestly the casual competitive market will see a big rise in coming years.
Consider that most kids that loved Angry Bird (2009) at 10 years old are now 17. They've been spoiled in casual games if they are mostly phone babbies, games are very slowly becoming simpler year by year, competitive games are fun for most older people but might not be it for kids.
Having a casual competitive scene easily creates the type of atmosphere they want, something anyone can enjoy at what would be considered a decent level and still enjoy fighting against people awho are on the cusp of 'pro', yet there is still a high ceiling for.
>>323700814 Exactly like smash brothers, it's not quite a fighting game and is missing a lot of things that fighting scene dudes would consider very important to stay relevant as a fighter, but it still has a high enough cap to have it's own competitive scene.
As kids these days very much so enjoy watching more than they do playing but generally a healthy amount of playing at least, this allows them to watch, but also to just play on their own level.
Also these games are generally not as 'stressful' towards kids that play mainly casual non-VS games when just playing others online and such.
It would definitely take work, but I definitely think that Nintendo or Sony could do it, I honestly haven't paid enough attention to Xbox IPs so I have no idea what Microsoft is sitting on it that it could do anything with, but given their general audience I'm not sure competitive casual would work there, although I thought the same of Sony but that smash-clone got decent hype.
>>323699609 All throughout history the key to greatness has always been to never acknowledge your mistakes publicly but to respond quickly and correct them behind the scenes.
Maintaining prestige is something some people do better than others and that's usually what marks someone as great leader is this capacity to appear infallible. In reality as we know, no one is actually infallible, and the greats would consistently make mistake after mistake but ideally you learn from them and make them less often.
The delusion that you are infallible is of utmost importance especially to your supporters. You can never admit to being wrong because no one actually rewards humility, it's a sign of weakness and incompetence and no one likes seeing their side humbled. Yet you cannot continue making mistakes or stick to your mistakes after they've proved to be wrongheaded. This is as true in business has it was for kings.
Nintendo's leadership is good at the first part but terrible at the second and it's why the Wii U failed.
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