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What is the best combat system to ever come...
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What is the best combat system to ever come from a JRPG?
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>>322722743

Vagrant Story.
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Simple
>>
>People not saying Grandia
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>>322722997
But it's just an ATB system.
>>
>>322723208
The only right answer

Saying anything else and you're LITERALLY lying
>>
>>
>>322722743
Legend of Legaia or Valkyrie Profile
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>>322723879
Came to say Legend of Legaia.

Grandia's is good too. haven't played Vagrant Story so I can't comment on it.
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>>322723208
You mean Persona 1/2?
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Souls games / Bloodborne
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>>322723423
It's so goood. I know you're reading this.
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>>322725627
not an rpg
>>
This fucking game right here.


No need to swap characters in and out at inns. Fucking awesome combo system for physical and magic skills.

Only problem is it's just a bit too easy towards the end.
>>
>>322725720
incorrect
>>
>>322725773
Nope. I'm correct. They're not RPGs
>>
My vote goes to Valkyrie Profile.

Shit is nuts. My only complaint is that special skills quickly becomes an annoyance once you've seen the same mini-cutscenes several times, with no way to skip em'
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>>322725773


In the sense of a what is considered a general JRPG battle system. He's right.

Don't be contrarian.
>>
>>322723423
yes
>>
Battle Network.
>>
>>322725865
>he

Guess again.
>>
>>322722997
not even close
>>
>>322725837
The game's box says it's and RPG, every reputable website says it's an RPG. You're braindead, mate.

>>322725865
There is no such thing as a "general JRPG battle system."

Don't be stupid.
>>
>>322723879
>>322725861
>2 valkyrie profiles
my niggers
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still the best
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>>322725929

No one cares what's between your legs. But I guess the fact that you're being enough of a bitch to make it a point of discussion at all has revealed you.

>>322726034

Hahaha, stop it.
>>
>>322725723
This. Also Fluid as fuck.
>>
>>322726034
Having RPG elements is not being an RPG, you moron.
>>
Hey guys, Onimusha is my favorite JRPG.
>>
is anyone else's favorite jrpg sonic and knuckles?
>>
>>322726146
RPG elements don't make an RPG? Fascinating, kiddo.
>>
>>322722743
Overall, SRPG's. Honorable mention to Valkyria Chronicles for mixing SRPG with FPS in an honestly fun way.
>>
Dissidia is my JRPGOTYAY
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>>322726298
If you're agreeing with me then why the fuck did you bring up the Souls games? Are you mentally impaired?
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>>322726034
>general JRPG battle system

Probably referring to the old FF games, where it was menus upon menus to do anything.
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>RPG from Japan
>"I-IT ISN'T A JRPG! IT'S A WRPG!!!! BAWWWW!"
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>>322726418
Where did I agree with you, you illiterate human shit?
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>Action-adventure game from Japan
>People call it a jrpg
>>
>>322726146

An RPG is an RPG no matter where it's from. As
>>322726470
put it.
>>
>game is X genre
>people call it Y genere
>mfw when
>>
>>322726146
They are clearly Action RPG's, I don't know why this is hard to understand.
>>
>>322722743

What game is this? Looks cool.
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>>322726525
Action RPG, then.

Battle system is typical for an A-RPG, so it shouldn't have any reason for it to be in this thread.
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>>322726609
you have a sexy girl face when that happens? thats weird.
>>
>>322726506
The part where you asked for confirmation on RPG elements not making an RPG. You see, stats and levels is not what makes an RPG. Turn based combat is.
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>>322726054
Hear hear. I love everything about this battle system.

Valkyrie Profile is honorable mention.
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>>322726298
It sounds as if you are being sarcastic. If that is the case then you are being sarcastic for no reason. Tetris is not an RPG. If you add levels to Tetris, you've added an RPG element, but you still don't have an RPG.
>>
Button mashing!
Song synchronizing!
Block spamming!
>>
>>322726652
Radiant Historia, my friend.

Has a real neat battle system, but the game is one of the worse games I've seen to handle Time-Traveling, it makes no sense and bunch of plotholes appear because of the way they handled it.
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>>322723423
The series is dead and no other games use this battle system. What a shame
>>
>>322726617
It's not. But this thread is about JRPGS.

>>322726470
>>322726570
JRPG is a subgenre, not a nationality.
>>
>>322726525

>story is revealed by talking to NPCs, you level up by killing enemies, you customize your character by allocating stats and learning magic, wide variety of playstyles

>somehow, just because it's got non-turnbased combat, it's not an RPG

>>322726708

>Elder Scrolls isn't an RPG

Fuck off, dumbshit.
>>
>>322723423
this
>>
>>322726708
>if you ask why I'm a fucking retard, it means you're agreeing with me
Even more fascinating.

>Turn based combat is.
Well it seems Civilization IV is an RPG. The more you know.

Just fuck off, retard.
>>
>>322726708
>Turn based combat

I disagree with you. Also the guy you are replying too was being sarcastic, and while being hard to pick up since it's on text you you are very socially handicapped if you couldn't pick up on that.
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>>322726806

What in the fuck do you think the J in JRPG stands for, you fucking subhuman? Turnbased? Jobsystem? Don't try to talk about shit you don't know anything about.
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>>322726806

You're a nationality.
>>
SMT press turn system in general.
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Are the Arkham Batman games, RPGS?
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>>322726898
Yeah, cause you roleplay as Batman.
>>
Tales of Xillia 2
FF12/13
>>
>>322726806
How are the soul games not action rpgs? I would love to know.
>>
>>322726898

They're 3D Metroidvanias.
>>
>>322726886

Press-turn is too easily exploitable.
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>>322726764
don't make me kick your shin, bro.
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>>322726806
If "japanese" and "western" do not refer to a location, what do they represent?
>>
>>322726898
yes because you level up and rp as bats
>>
>>322726735
Yes, but if you add enough RPG elements people start seeing it as an RPG. You know, just like when you add enough humor to a movie and people start calling it a comedy. Notice how pretty much everyone except your dumb ass lists Dark Souls as an action RPG. Time to give yourself a reality check.
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>>322723423
Nothing beats this. Muh classic jrpgfags pls go
>>
>>322726881
It's called like that cause most of the games in that subgenre happen to be from Japan, but it has its own clear peculiarities and gameplay, so it's a genre, you dense motherfucker.
>>
>>322726898
Yeah, but it's a western RPG.

Don't let that anon in this thread know that, or else he'll throw a tantrum.
>>
>>322722743
>>
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I liked this one.
>>
>That one guy throwing a tantrum over JRPGs/WRPGs
>Everyone else replying to the retard seriously

STOP. Get back to the what the thread was about
>>
I really liked the combat system in Xenoblade.

But there again, I'm one of those subhumans that genuinely like hotbar-MMO combat, so shows what I know.

I never understood what was wrong with pressing a button to make your character carry out an attack. Why make it into this delicate dance over a long-ass combination? If I know what I want to do, why should a game burden me with getting it done?

To me, the challenge in a game is figuring out the best or correct way of doing something, not carrying it out according to the game's rules.

I really like puzzle games and grand strategies too.

[/blog]
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>>322722997
Yeah I really liked the combat in Chrono Trigger. It wasn't overly complicated, and it had a neat tech system.
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>>322727101

Yeah, there are a lot of similarities between the gameplay of the Tales series, Valkyrie Profile, Final Fantasy, Xenoblade, and Valkyria Chronicles. Oh wait, those games all play so differently they might as well all be different genres. Yet they're all JRPGs. Wonder why that is? Maybe it's because the only thing "JRPG" means is "it's an RPG from Japan." Jesus Christ, dude.
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Are you niglets arguing about rpg variants and not inviting me?
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Hey Tales of Games are not RPGs because they're not Turn-based!
amirite hmm
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I liked the simplicity of Skies of Arcadia's battle system.
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>>322727026
>when you add enough humor to a movie and people start calling it a comedy
That sounds like retards missing the point of the movie or insulting it. If you want a comedy, you make a comedy. A movie having some humor in it doesn't make it a comedy. This is not so hard to understand.
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>>322727413

>WRPG
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what part of "ROLE PLAYING GAME" you fucks dont understand?
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>>322722743
none of them
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>>322723208
>>322723298
The Trails series combat is like Grandia except better, especially Cold Steel.

So, no, Grandia by default is #2 at best.
>>
>>322727307
>I never understood what was wrong with pressing a button to make your character carry out an attack

I haven't played Xenoblade, but the reason I hate this in hotbar MMOs is just that the majority of attacks are so inconsequential, you end up having to press 30 buttons a minute just to carry out the same things that auto-attack would handle for you in an older MMO.
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I liked this one's a lot
>>
Holy shit this thread is cancerous. Is it really that much fun shitposting one of the few good threads to death?
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>>322727609
>good threads
This ain't one of them.
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>>322727564
Except that Grandia's combat system is a carbon copy of Persona.

The only difference is that Grandia uses that bar with the moving things and Persona is represented in turns
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>>322727609

You should've seen the old JRPG general on /vg/. So cancerous that nobody even bothers making threads anymore.
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>>322727609


Yeah it's bad.

I don't know why people have to go an ruin a thread dedicated to a specific aspect of a relatively well-defined genre by throwing in shit they know doesn't apply.

What's worse is the idiots who fall for it though. Why are people just aching to correct others?
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>>322727725
>Except that Grandia's combat system is a carbon copy of Persona.
I've never seen such a retarded post in all my life.
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>>322727387
The Tales of games are ARPGs, FF pre XII and VP are JRPGs, FF post XII and Xenoblade are MMOs, and Valkyria Chronicles is an SRPG.
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I love the combat system in Parasite Eve but it's too simplistic. Wish more games built on it, could be absolutely incredible.
>>
>>322727198
Isn't that just like Ogre Battle?
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>>322727750
Actually they were quite good but a few retards kept posting spoilers and eops started invading.
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>>322727609
I can't recall a single JRPG thread that was good.
JRPG fans are already divided enough, constantly spewing venom and vitriol at each other, then you have outsiders that want to shit on all of them.
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>>322727850
Like 3rd birthday?
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>>322727847
>XII
XI I meant, my bad.
>>
>>322727603

Oh, well Xenoblade isn't like that at all, and it's not what I like about hotbar-combat.

Skills should have a good chunk of cooldown between them and the player should never have to manage more than 5-9 at a time in combat.

What skills you chose to take with you in to combat and all the strategic work of learning what skills do what and in what situation is still on you though.

Xenoblade did that well. You picked your skills and went in, used them according to your plan, and if it worked, great, if it failed, back to the drawing board.

This is also the reason I like talent trees.
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>>322727901
>eops started invading
So it's always been cancer, nice to know.
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>>322727923
No.
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>>322727847
No, they're all JRPGs since they come from Nippon.

Yet they're also the RPG genres you mentiones (With the exception of FF pre XII and VP being turn based rpg's)

A game can have multiple tags, just because it's an Action RPG or some other one doesn't meant it can't be a JRPG
>>
>>322727463
That's the point, you pathetic moron. That's why no one calls Call of Duty MP or Devil May Cry an RPG but everyone who's not a subhuman piece of shit calls Dark Souls one. The Souls games have enough to be considered an RPG. Hence the RPG label on its box, on its official site, on wikipedia, on Steam, on IGN, Gamefaqs, Gamespot etc etc every fucking relevant site that deals with video games. You dumb fuck.
>>
>>322727857
Sorta. It still does it's own thing but for the most part it will remind you of Ogre Battle.
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>>322722997
Why are there bars under them? Is this the mobile port?
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>>322727914
But that's wrong. Granted I haven't been in JRPG threads for more than half a year but the ones I've been in were consistently good with people discussing their games just fine. They only become bad once the WRPG vs JRPG shitposters come in.
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>>322728017
They're all Japanese RPGs, sure but not all of them are JRPGs. I know this may be confusing to you, but JRPG is a kind of game. A genre.
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>>322728042
Sure, you can call it an ARPG if you want to.
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>>322728240
Elaborate.
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>>322727026
>if you add enough RPG elements people start seeing it as an RPG
It doesn't matter what you see it as. If its an RPG, RPG elements don't increase or decrease its status as an RPG. RPG is a broad category that includes MOST games made in this day and age. Even COD is an RPG. The person in the single player has a preexisting story meant to be carried out and experienced by you through gameplay. That is a role playing game.

>Notice how pretty much everyone except your dumb ass lists Dark Souls as an action RPG
It isn't THAT hard to notice that you replied to a different anon. Dark Souls may be an RPG but barely. I haven't personally played through it, but I've played through Bloodborne. In BB, you are given a defined role. Your character is your own creation, and lacks any real character development. The story was designed to be interpreted and created by the mind of the player. The game is void of a role, so how do you call it a role playing game? Is Dark Souls the same way, or is the lore a bit more definitive at least?

>everyone
Argumentum ad populum. The correct answer is not always the popular answer.
>>
>>322725720
no, the skill ceiling is high enough that you could have 1 in every stat and still wreck shit if you knew what you were doing. the statistic system is essentially meaningless anyways. we're talking about fashion souls here
>>
>>322728240
No, it's just you think seems to think that.
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>>322728496
Are you actually saying that D&D played with pre-made characters wouldn't be a roleplaying game?
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>>322728487
JRPG started as a term to name all the RPGs coming from Japan, but with time it became its own genre. The stats, the leveling, the fantasy settings with races and classes all come from basic RPG, but the emphasis on anime-like story telling, characters and aesthetic, as well as the turn based combat systems are what make JRPGs what they are. Japanese people can and do make other kinds of RPGs all the time, so they're not all JRPGs.
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>>322722743
A good mix of three styles.
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>>322727857
Kind of. It's shittier than Ogre Battle though. The only reason people still bring it up is because the game lets you go full edgelord.
>>
The one in FFX-2 is pretty damn great.

Shame it's in fucking FFX-2.
>>
>>322727282

This.

Mana Khemia's battle system is insane once you get the early game. You switch between characters and combo abilities back to back like a madman. It's so fucking good.
>>
Grandia 2 that is all.
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>>322728496
>you are given a defined role
>The game is void of a role
Hahahaha. You can't even make this shit up. And protip, you retard: the mechanics decide what is an RPG.

This is not argumentum ad populum, you fucking retard, since it's not only people calling it that but the industry's own press and accredited stores. Everyone, except dumb fucks like you. But you are seriously a cretin enough to think you alone get to define what a genre means, congratulations on being dumber than my dog.

>Even COD is an RPG
That's it. Just fucking end yourself.
>>
>>322722743
Undertale easily.
>>
>>322727461
God, no. Even with the awesome battle themes playing, SoA's battle was just so slow and boring.
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>>322725720

good job
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>>322728791
I assume pre-made means there is some sort of story behind the character already. As long as you are forced into using that story, then you have a role. For example, if you have to choose to go through the game as a dark elf, then you've been assigned a role. If dark elf is all you have to go on, then it is a pretty weak role, but a role none the less. Bloodborne doesn't have anything definitive like that, and I assume neither does DaS but I wouldn't know since I didn't play it.
>>
>>322728827
You only open more confusion, anime-like story telling, characters and aesthetic needs to be expanded upon then since there are many different styles of each of those among anime alone, furthermore are you sure its only for turn based? I see people call real-time combat RPGs from japan "JRPG" all the time
>>
>>322729529
Isn't the role of the hunter in Bloodborne to hunt beasts and get blood or some shit? I haven't played it, but I believe your character had a role. In Dark Souls it's very clear, you're the chosen undead who must ring the bells, get the lordvessel and then get the souls of some gods to get access to the first flame. You're told all of this directly by the NPCs.
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I genuinely consider games like Superstar Saga and Paper Mario to have some of the best RPG systems to date.

Also Battle Network.

What (J)RPG's need is something active, but also turn-based so that long animations have some skill attached to them.

Attach that to some strategic choices such as a plethora of classes that can be combined, and maybe Fire Emblem-style movement, and you could end up with a fantastic RPG.

Persona 4 did something well too by making encounters slightly more active through simply allowing you to press a button to rush an enemy down.
>>
>>322729127
>you are given a defined role
>The game is void of a role
You can't realize that the first one is a typo that was supposed to read "you are not given a defined role"? Are you attempting to insult your own intelligence?

>This is not argumentum ad populum
>since it's not only people calling it that but the industry's own press
Something is not an argument based on popular opinion because it happens to have a really popular opinion? What kind of logic is that?

I agree with you, and this sentence is totally not sarcastic because I used too much sarcasm thus negating its status as sarcastic.

>to think you alone get to define what a genre means
Right, I go by their original meaning. Not whatever random people think it should be in any given year.
>>
>>322729732
Anime changes all the time, and in fact it's another term that's confusing in itself, so I'm afraid there's not much I can expand upon there. In any case, it's a style of doing things that's hard to replicate, so if it looks animeish to you, it's a good starting point.

>I see people call real-time combat RPGs from japan "JRPG" all the time
As I said, it's genuinely confusing because of the J part, and even more if the game has an anime style going on too, but those should be called ARPGs, like the Tales of games, for example.
>>
>>322722743
ctb ffx is my personal favourite. unmatched ability to plan your moves in advance, although its one of the things that makes the game mostly very easy.
>>
>>322729860
>Isn't the role of the hunter in Bloodborne to hunt beasts and get blood or some shit?
Nope. Unless you feel like that is what you were meant to do. The game is only full of hints, and those hints have no actual meaning. From themselves actually mentioned that BB has no story because they preferred hearing the stories that the fans came up with.
>>
>>322726969
reading comprehension fucboi
>>
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Generally when I think of a JRPG I think of a few of the following things.

1. When battling enemies, a transition from town/overworld map to a map/area suited for battle. Maybe not a full screen-wipe, but definitely some sort of augmentation to surroundings that differentiates it from just walking around/exploring.

2. Transition from non-battle music to a battle theme.

3. Use/navigation of menus to select skills/actions.

4. A party of characters. Meaning more than 1. This is where the souls games fall short for me in terms of a JRPG (genre). They are more similar to the Baldur's Gate games on PS2 than JRPG's.

Anyway. That's my 2 cents.
>>
also battle network
>>
>>322725861
FINISHING STRIKE
FINAL BLAST
DREADED DRAGON
OUGI HYOSO HOJIN
NIBELUNG VALESTI
CELESTIAL STAR

I only recently caught up on it with the PSP port, so I didn't play it back when it came out. It would have easily been my favourite childhood game if I did.
>>
FFT

Legend of mana had many weapons and every weapon had it's own combos that you could learn.
It was nice but didn't the game was so easy that it didn't really matter.
Would be kind of cool to have game like Ys with weapons and combos from Legend of mana.
>>
>>322730191
>he really is fucking stupid enough to think you have no defined role in the souls games
>he thinks official accredited sources in any field count as "popular opinion"
>he thinks he alone defines genres

Hahahaha. You're amazing. It's like I'm having a conversation with a piece of shit that can type on keyboard. Your IQ is below room temperature.

You're like a fucking retard who goes to the zoo, points at the lion and says it's a bird. And then when you're shown that everyone else knows it's called a lion and even all the biologists and zoologists call it a lion, you go into your kneejerk WAAAH THAT'S WRONG ALL OF THEM ARE WRONG IT'S JUST ARGUMENTUM AD POPULUM I know it's really a bird I KNOW THE ORIGINAL MEANING!!!!!!

You're hilarious.
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Make your pick, anon:

Gigantic city that takes a good hour to truly explore / see everything / talk to everyone

vs

Nice small cities with every NPC having something important to say
>>
I think as far as traditional turn-based battle's concerned, Mana Khemia 2 perfected it.
>>
>Bravely Default
>Tales of Graces f and every fucker who complains about NO-AIR-COMBOS you have Xillia 2
>Shadow Hearts Covenant
>Star Ocean 3
>Final Fantasy 13: Lighting Returns
>Final Fantasy X-2
>Fate/Extra. I really liked it. Don't judge
>Kingdom Hearts 2 FM
there are many good systems. I can't pick just one.
>>
>>322730348
I was just messing around, frankly I disagree with you wholeheartedly

furthermore Tales games are RPGs with Real time combat. the genre of a game is supposed to give an idea of the type of game, its not any more action focused than any other RPG calling it an Action RPG makes no sense.

JRPG is a stupid term because it cannot be properly defined if you are going to say things like anime-like then say the criteria for anime like cant be defined because its always changing, do you not see how fucking stupid it is to use a term for something that has no criteria because its details always change?
>>
>>322727608
If it was more fleshed out, maybe. The maps didn't really provide enough light/shadow spots and you more or less fought the same battles over and over again.
I forgot the name of the MC but he was definitely the most fun character.
>>
>>322727608
Just started playing this last weekend. I would have agreed if the combat system stayed set with one party-level shit or at the least changed less gradually. It's trying to do too many things and not on combat alone. No wonder this game flopped. It lacks direction.
>>
>>322730623
You generally think wrong then. JRPG describes the country of origin of the game. Nothing more.

Is it a RPG by any definition? Is it from Japan? It's a JRPG. JRPG doesn't describe a certain mechanics. If you want to talk about mechanics then you say it's "turn based", "action based", "party based" or whatever the fuck would describe that particular game.
>>
>>322731347
Why are people incapable of understanding this?
>>
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Just one of the best battle systems ever coming through.
>>
>>322731347
RPG in general is screwed up. You can call pacman an RPG.
>>
>>322731347


Stop being contrarian. Most people talking about JRPG's in a JRPG thread know that the name refers to a general style of RPG's with certain characteristics (such as battle screen transitions/battle theme/parties of characters on a quest) that was became super prevalent around the SNES/PSX era- most of which happened to come from Japan.

The J doesn't imply that role playing games are all/always made in Japan or that they have to be, just that a very large percentage of popular games that defined the genre happened to come from Japan. I would call Undertale a JRPG even though it wasn't made in Japan. I would not call any souls game a JRPG because it doesn't have those characteristics. It's more like an action RPG or a dungeon crawler with RPG elements.


But blah blah blah you'll just ignore it all and go "HURR DURRRR IT'S THE COUNTRY OF ORIGIN THAT MATTERS" even when it clearly does not.
>>
>>322722743
Growlanser IV's battle system is really good
>>
>>322731542
Except its broken and Scouts can rush for quick victory
>>
>>322731747
What would you call games like Vagrant Story, then?
>>
>>322731007
>he really is fucking stupid enough to think you have no defined role in the souls games
Actually I specifically say Bloodborne. I don't have the experience with the Souls games necessary to make such a claim. How thick headed are you to not get that?

>he thinks official accredited sources in any field count as "popular opinion"
If the accredited sources share the same opinion as the masses, then yes they shared a popular opinion.

>he thinks he alone defines genres
Nope. Again, I am going by their original meaning, not one of my own creation.

>You're like a fucking retard who goes to the zoo, points at the lion and says it's a bird.
Actually, it is more like I'm the guy who calls a tomato a fruit even though the accredited people at the white house decided a pizza is a vegetable due to the tomatoes present in the sauce. Or the guy who calls a microwave an appliance even though the accredited people at the white house have decided a single IP address represents a person, and a microwave happens to have its own IP address. Or the guy who calls the world round even though the accredited people in Europe decided it is flat.

Accreditation does not make anything "correct". It just means that a person or group of people have acknowledged that you have studied a subject enough to satisfy that person or group.

BTW, who are these accredited people you speak of, and how did they go about gaining their "knowledge"?
>>
>>322731542
The battle system is great, agreed. Unfortunately there's a total lack of balance in the first game and the third game has shitty recycled maps with randomly generated enemies. So much wasted potential.
>>
>>322731845
I won't deny any imbalances, but the thought of such a combination of strategy and real-time, along with personalisation of units and some strategic choice is great.
>>
>>322730623
But there are JRPG's in which you can fly solo and the game won't force you to pick up party members.
>>
>>322731747
You people want to think the JRPG as a genre. And genre describes the mechanics of the game.

But JRPG doesn't. It has nothing to do with the mechanics of the game at this point. It's just another term to describe a game. You wouldn't call "anime artstyle" a genre either. JRPG is used in the same way. It describes the game but it DOESN'T describe the mechanics.
>>
>>322731902


I'd still call it a JRPG because you're still navigating menus to do attacks such as selecting individual bodyparts rather than just swinging with a lock on system.

If anything I'd call it a JRPG with platforming elements. Kind of the inverse of a souls game, which is an adventure/platforming game with RPG elements.
>>
>>322732285
What about Tales of games? No menus, no dedicated battle screen in the last game and in the next. It's still clearly a JRPG.
>>
>>322731747
Look up a list of Genres and Sub-Genres. JRPG will not be on there. Neither will WRPG. Because J and W stand for where the game came from. JRPG is not a genre. You don't see JRPG or WRPG listed on a game's box or wikipedia page. I don't understand what's so hard to understand about this.
>>
>>322732105


Because the J is an all encompassing term that is derived from a group of genre defining games that came out around the same period of time- most of which happened to be from Japan.

I agree maybe a different name should be chosen. But the J is just an easy umbrella term for most people. Much easier to say than STTBMNRPG (Screen Transition Turn-based Menu Navigation RPG). It's just a name that let your brain go into heuristic mode and go "ah, some of these properties".
>>
>>322732105
>And genre describes the mechanics of the game.

I'd like to extend this, Genre also is a tool we use as a means of convenience not exclusion, just because a game is an RPG doesn't mean it cant be an adventure game, the point of genres is to identify and categorize the focus of the game, calling Dark Souls an Action RPG makes sense because its half action game half RPG, Action RPG isn't a sub-genre of RPG that are action focused, a stacked adjective genre means multi or split focus.

So yes >>322731678, you can call Pacman an RPG because you technically play the role of pacman but because that is not the focus of the game it will never be categorized as such because its 1% RPG and 99% <non RPG genre>
>>
Protect yourself against autism. Be overly clear and say. "best battle system of turn based rpgs, especially those that came from japan. Things like the tale series count, but action oriented like zelda, alundra and dark souls don't. Mostly final fantasy inspired"
>>
To be honest? Dragon Quest, any of them, maybe VIII. Say what you want but going back to the series this week (starting with IV) felt so refreshing in it's simplicity. Attack, item, spells, etc.
>>
What's the name of that DS RPG where you use a book to hit things and absorb them into the book to use later?
>>
>>322732285
But that's the only element there, except for maybe the linear character progression but even that's very unusual. The overworld and battle areas are one and the same, there's no party, no battle themes, no lengthy intro towns or any kind of towns really. It's clearly considered a JRPG but it lacks all of the elements typically associated with JRPGs.
>>
>>322732693
Avalon Code
>>
>>322732693
Don't know the DS but there's a PS2 TRPG with similar mechanic, Eternal Poison.
>>
>>322731178
Holy shit, literally worst taste on this thread.
>>
>>322723208
>tried it
>couldn't get anywhere, the only place I could go was a cliff or something and I would run down and die or whatever
meh
>>
>>322732885
Yes. Thanks anon.
>>
>>322732378

https://youtu.be/QXQddERLV2A?t=14

Hm, notice I said there doesn't have to be a full screen wipe or anything like that, but there definitely is a transition as extra enemies pop out, your extra characters pop out from the main character, AND a battle theme initiates. So there's still a change.

So there is a distinct difference between battle/non-battle, a group of characters, and a transition in music. Still covers points 1, 2, and 4 in my post here: >>322730623


Notice I said there actually didn't need to be a full screen wipe to count. Chrono Trigger doesn't have a transition screen either but is still a JRPG by my definition based on how the game changes when a battle starts.
>>
>>322731936
>he hasn't even played the shit we've been discussing
>he is literally fucking retarded enough to think professionals in the field are popular opinion
>thinking arbitrary lawmaking that only applies to one country and contradicts every professional source is similar to this situation where literally everyone except your uneducated fucktard ass agrees on something

>I am going by their original meaning, not one of my own creation
However this part is interesting. Link me to this original meaning you go by, from a reputable source of course. This should be fun.
>>
>>322732491
>Because the J is an all encompassing term
Only you think like this. If I hear a term JRPG, I think of a RPG from Japan. After that I ask "What kind of JRPG? Turn based? Party based? Real time action? Dose it have simulation elements?", because JRPG doesn't describe the mechanics.

>>322732525
Yes. I think Dark Souls as Action RPG too but the term JRPG also describes is just as well.
>>
>>322732918
Let's see your taste then. I'm curious.
>>
>>322730901
>a rehash of FF 4HoL battle system
>that annoying "Bravely" and "Default" based combat

fuck no
>>
>>322723423
Probably my favorite battle system in all video games
>>
>>322732980
indeed JRPG does define Dark souls since its an RPG (even being halfbreed RPG) from Japan.
>>
Front Mission Series.

Too bad the series is DEAD.
>>
>>322732980


That's where we're different. If someone says "JRPG" I think "Oh like a breath of fire, suikoden, or a final fantasy". If someone means an RPG type different from that in my mind, I expect them to come out and say "Well my favorite strategy RPG is FFT as it is better blah and blah than Arc the Lad, a different strategy RPG".
>>
>>322726758
>Can block the, at the time, instakill move from a boss that you're supposed to lose to
Can't say I've seen that before, but fuck blocking some of the attacks.
The wizards in deathlandia with their screen shakers come to mind first.
>>
if srpg count FFT advance is probably my favorite system of all time. the judge cards were neat.

i don't like P3 because you can literally 100-0 someone if you get a crit/knockdown/weakness
>>
Turn based - Valkyrie Profile or Radiant Historia
Action - Souls or star ocean
ATB - FFX-2
Unique - Grandia
srpg - Tactics Ogre LUCT
>>
>>322733490
Watch out, according to this guy >>322733325 it's SRPG and not a JRPG :^)
>>
>>322733179


I guess it's just a nuance then from people who played more of them during the time they were more popular. You could go on any gamefaqs forum from ~1995-2005 and say JRPG and people knew you weren't talking about a disagaea or basically any game with the word "tactics" in the name. It was a distinction that arose from necessity and brevity that allowed people to generalize in their minds a difference in way battles/encounters played out.

It might be an artifact now but amongst people who played them at the time "JRPG" was not a confusing utterance. People knew what you meant.
>>
>>322728306
And you imply that an ARPG cannot be considered a JRPG
therein lies the problem
hurr durr Drakengard isn't a JRPG because it's not turn-based D:
>>
>>322733791
Considering the term JRPG wasn't coined until the mid 2000s and wasn't regularly used until the late 2000s by retards like yourself, you're pretty stupid.

JRPG is not a genre and has never been a genre because it describes exactly nothing about the gameplay contained within which is what determines a genre.
>>
http://strawpoll.me/6455476/r
So which is it?
>>
>>322733791
We are not confused about your definition, we just no longer use it since its deprecated, the definition of words can evolve and change over time, it just so happens that JRPG is basically deprecated because parity is no longer reached, because tomorrow or the next day when this argument spurs out again because someone doesn't think Dark Souls is a JRPG that guy will think Tales games are JRPGs. what i'm saying is people who use the term JRPG NOW use it for anything from "anime RPG" to "turn based RPG" the amount of splits or groups of people that have slightly differen't meanings for the word JRPG have made the term useless. The only thing that they all agree on about it is that the J stands for Japan.
>>
>Numbers go up
>It's an rpg
I want off this ride, it's somehow even worse than the roguelike/roguelite/rogue-roguelite-lite.
>>
>>322733078
Nah, whatever I post you'll say it's shit. Rest assured it's better than yours. :^)
>>
>>322734465
No no, you misunderstood me. If you know better than me, I would like to know them and try them out. Because, why not? I'm always looking for good games.
>>
Undertale isn't a WRPG because it isn't like the other WRPGs D:
IRPGs are Open world y'know, everyone thinks that when people say WRPGs so it must be true
>>
>>322731178
>Bravely Default
One of my biggest problems with BD was that too many of the passive abilities felt lackluster, so there felt like there was no interesting builds to do around them. I was hoping to get a FFT without the 3D battlefield which would have already been a downgrade.
>>
Oh, and best gameplay?
Pick any Dept. Heaven game and there you go.
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>>322722743
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>>322735869

>there will never be another Tales game with such a fluid, simple yet engaging battle system like Symphonia ever again

why BABA WHY?
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This one.
>>
>>322736676
Why are you playing PSP version?
>>
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>>322725723
Ironically, I like Suikoden 1 and 2's combat system for those exact same reasons. Except you obviously have to swap out characters because there's ~70 playable ones, but games alleviate that by giving you six combat slots. First two games had blazingly fast combat with no LOADINGU bullshit or anything.
>>
>>322727725
>Except that Grandia's combat system is a carbon copy of Persona.

You mean Lunar games, right? Which Grandia is a successor to.
>>
>>322728886
It's a damn shame Bahamut Lagoon never got officially translated. Such a great game that many players never got to experience because SNES fan translations are hardly mainstream.
>>
>>322735986
>fluid
>Symphonia
Nigga did we play the same game? The system was shit.
>>
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>>322722743
the active battle system like in lost odyssey and legend of dragoon

finding the rhythm for new attack combos is rewarding
>>
>>322736786
Why not? Loading times are the only thing wrong with the port and PPSSPP makes them nonexistent.
>>
>>322722848
No one acknowledges your post because only few people actually have played VS. But at least you and I know what's up.
>>
>>322723423

Came here to post this. Good job anon.
>>
>>322737068
I still can't believe you get cucked in that game.
>>
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Pokemon of course
>>
>>322738039
Is that a fucking dishwasher?
>>
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>>322738219
>has wheels and a handle
>dishwasher
>>
>>322738219
What sort of fucking dishwashers do you have in your country.
>>
>>322722743
Mario and Luigi: Superstar Saga
>>
>>322738417
They wash the lawn too
>>
>>322738417
Sorry I meant lawnwasher.
>>
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>>322738632
>>322738919
You sure you aren't thinking of Mexicans?
>>
>>322736979
goddammit now I feel like replaying lunar 2
>>
>>322722848
>>322737453
>Going into the menu every few seconds and minmaxing to fuck
>The best combat system.
Lots of people have played Vagrant Story, but didn't like going into menus constantly in combat.
>>
>>322741017
you're mistaking combat system for gear management, anon. and before you start with

>MUH RISK
game gives you curatives to handle it and expects you to use them. risk seem to be a common complaint from hoarders who don't actually use items in jrpgs.
>>
>>322722848
First time where you're expected to use something else than sword to be-all and end-all thing?
Though with enough preparation you can make it one.
>>
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Definitely wouldn't say it's #1, but I fucking love timed hits. Any other games that do this?
>>
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J
>>
U
>>
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S
>>
>>322742285
You can use any weapon you want if you are good enough at timing to chain combos without stopping.
>>
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T
>>
>>322735986

Of all the Tales games, Symphonia has probably one of the most rigid battle system.
It's just Abyss without the FOF Changes.
>>
Sengoku Rance or FF Ⅻ.

I'm serious
>>
>>322722743
literally just ordered this game new from amazon, just arrived; waiting for me at the post office

can't wait to play it again
>>
Mana Khemia
>>
>>322723423
why the fuck did starforce change the camera angle?

i don't even want to play starforce because of that.
>>
Tales of Eternia
>>
>>322742728
Paper Mario and Mario and Luigi series
>>
Could someone explain what specifically makes mana khemia's battle system good?
>>
Valkyrie profile 1 is best system for me.
>>
>>322743392
As fun as SR is, it's really luck based.
TURN 1 ASSASSINATE 2 YOUR UNIT IS FUCKING DEAD GG NO RE MOURNFUL BLUE DEFEAT MOONRUNES
>>
>>322746250
Not sure myself.
All I can remember is being able to stun opponents and the burst gauge which activates on the wrong time similar to limit breaks in FF9.
>>
>>322737068
To be honest an official release would have to change 50% of the dialog.
>>
>>322747050
why?
>>
Controversial opinion but I liked Chrono Cross' risk based combo system.
>>
>>322747391
Problematic content.
>>
>getting that S grade on a boss with your saved EX finisher

so good
>>
>>322747391
Porn mags, NTR, suicide as a means of at
>>
>>322747650
atonement*
>>
>>322747650
Not to mention drugs, and a gay wizard hitting on you.
>>
>>322736979
"You need a spanking!"

You know who my favorite character is
>>
>>322726758
>>322727282
>>322736676
These.
Gust games are so much fun.
>>
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>>322747650
fuck that
>>
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Nocturne
>>
>>322728087
Probably.
>>
>>322748097
It's a good game with amazing sprites though, and the guy that your childhood friend loves is actually a cool, likable dude
>>
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No mention of this game? Seriously? I would say the first one but Forced Evasion is seriously cheap bullshit in that game.
>>
>>322748442
What, is it translated?
>>
>>322748615
Only most of the menu items.
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