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>the free market is magic
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>the free market is magic
>>
>>256042756
Seriously? Four maps?
>>
>>256042756
Shut up anon. Nobody gives a fuck. Judgment was considered a shit game all around so your post is redundant garbage.
>>
>free market
Oh boy, why did you have to turn this into a /pol/ thread, you could have just made another modern gaming/Microsoft bashing thread
>>
>>256043121
>implying it doesn't apply to most other games released now too
>>
And now Cliff is making a Pay 2 Win shooter with Nexon.
So it just keeps getting better.
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>>256042756
A fairer comparison would be UT2k3. UT2k4 had a lot of reused content.

Still blows most releases out of the water though.
>>
Grafix are the problem
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>>256043198
>goal post moving.
You already fucked the thread, just make a new, less fucked up one.
>>
Wait, Gears of War judgement has seven multiplayer maps in total?
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>>256043491
How do we kill the grafix
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>>256043354
GoW4J has a lot of resused content too
>>
>>256043581

We restore the middle market. Right now every game is indie or AAA, but back on the PS2 there were hundreds of excellent games that only managed selling a couple hundred thousand copies and had shitty graphics but had unique gameplay to make up for it
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>>256043174
>microsoft bashing
you mean shitposting?
>>
>>256043703
This same problem happened and still happens in the film and music industry. The cost of making a product desired by the masses simply rises too hard and creativity suffers for it.

I have no idea how to fix it because the masses want "good graphics" which means 1080p or whatever and that simply costs a lot more than making games for old consoles.
>>
>>256043834
This.
Everyone's still upset they won e3
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>>256043703
some of those are still around
e.g. all those weeb shmups on 360
>>
>>256043689
>still goalpost moving.
>>
>>256043910

Not at all. Modern consoles, even last gen consoles could run games of PS2 graphical quality at 1080p60 with no problem.
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>>256042756
One is PC game and the other one is a console game.
>>
>>256042756
The best part was that people who bought UT2k3 could send their instruction booklet to Epic to receive a free UT2k4 copy.

How the might have fallen.
>>
>>256044138
enjoy your origin
>>
>>256042756
>magic
You're more of a faggot than elves if you believe in magic
>>
>>256043910
Tell that to all the PC gaming retards here.
>>
>>256043910
You're full os shit. Most of the game budgets goes towards marketing.
>>
>>256043703
You can't really do that.

By the nature of video games as a medium, more immersive games will requiere more money and more manpower to create.

That's simply the cost of advancement in the artform.
>>
>>256043910
>1080p
High resolution is one of the most trivial things to accomplish. You change a number in the source code and then downgrade graphics until the desired hardware can render the scenes with acceptable FPS.
>>
>not taking skyrocketing development costs into account

You canĀ“t just make a comparison like that
>>
>>256043703
but that's what the PC is for, S.T.A.L.K.E.R, Mount and Blade, Paradox, Wargame, even gamrs like KSP that are a higher production value than indie games but defiantly not AAA
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>>256044442
That's one of the stupider myths floating around 4chan.
>>
>>256044551
You can when it's been made publicly known that 90% of the budget goes to advertising
>>
>>256044564

And that's why right now the PC is looking much more promising than consoles.
This should also be the kind of area handhelds such as the 3DS are exploring, but they money's to be made in mobile.
Even 3DS+Contemporary PC doesn't come close to PS2 in its hayday.
>>
>People still think Capitalism isn't outdated or was ever optimal
>American Libertarians exist
>>
>>256044642
>Myth
HOW MUCH DO YOU THINK THIS SHIT COSTS?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJNOaPfw-q0
>>
>>256044564
They are niche games in specific genres, and not exactly on par with the cutting edge.

You are free to make inferior games, heck, they'll even get a fanbase, but it isn't taking us anywhere.
>>
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>>256044767
Because Communism was such a successful experiment right?
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>>256044767
>>
>>256044884
Hold the phone, any game that does not conform to AAA standards is automatically inferior as a game? Get the hell out of here, man.
>>
>>256044551
Development costs aren't increasing.
Given the wider variety of software, resources and intake of new programmers willing to work horrid hours for almost no pay, making a game has never been cheaper.
The real costs are from two things: unrealistic publisher expectations (it MUST be the CoD killer!) and increasing advertising costs to compete with an increasing amount of games.
>>
>>256044884
Please define cutting edge and why STALKER and Paradox are inferior.
>>
>>256044827
Pittens compared to programming the game, modelling the assets, animating them, and recording the voice tracks.

And that's not even going into iterating on game and level design. That's just what making cutting edge games costs.
>>
>>256044767
Not a libertarian or a conservative but do you have a better alternative?
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>>256044642
>stupid Myth

>Bioware/EA do this for TOR-Launch
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wjf_lWxqyI
>meanwhile, their bugtracker is breaking down because people keep posting bugs that have been in since Alpha
>TOR launches
>Bugs are still in
>>
>>256043491
No, retards buying crappy DLC and preordering shitty games are the problem. If people didn't buy their crap they wouldn't keep doing shit like this.
>>
>>256042756
A multiplayer arena game and a singleplayer game with multiplay tacked on. Let's just count the multiplayer maps. A very sound argument and I might add that comparing to irrelevant games is definitely a finite indicator of the free market.
>>
>>256045114
Look at the guru here who knows everything about the economics of video game development!
>>
they have to remove a lot of things to make way for the graphics
>>
>>256045201
>And that's not even going into iterating on game and level design
Considering those have been on decline in AAA games while the budgets keep inflating, something is not right here.
>>
>>256045201
Now you're just being delusional. That publicity stunt easily costed more than a month of the game budget.
>>
>>256044767
>American Supercapitalism is the only capitalism that exists.
>>
>>256045294
Got more Aisling?
>>
>>256042756
You're getting what you pay for. If you don't like what's included then don't pay for it.

Market's respond to customer demand. And people apparently are willing to pay more for fewer maps, online subscriptions, and higher retail.

Don't blame capitalism for selling you something you wanted. Blame yourself if you got a bad deal.
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>>256045517
>>
>>256045467
Good thing it took years to make Watch_DOGS then.

Gotta love how you are such an expert on game budgets, too.
>>
captalism is a failed system, it will never work as long as corperations exsist
>>
>>256045696
Where's your alternative buddy?
>>
Judgement killed Gears of War
>>
>>256045482
That's pretty much what capitalism is.
>>
>>256044642
Whatever that money sink is (marketing, celebrity voice actors, Hollywood accounting, incredible degree of inefficiency caused by quadrupling development team size to push the games out twice as fast or a combination of multiple factors), there's plenty of low-mid budget games with apparent production value equivalent or higher to that of the highest budget games, demonstrating that most of the AAA budgets indeed is fluff.
>>
>>256045527
>>256045778
>this one shill defending his masters
>>
>>256045687
>publicity stunt costs more than the salaries of all the people working in the game
>hurr good thing it took years
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>>256045823
>Oligarchy = a free Capitalist state
>>
>>256045778
i don't need an alternative, a failed system is a bad one and needs to go
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>>256045968

And how would it "go"?
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>>256045919
Okay Upton Sinclair, keep preaching the good word.
>>
>>256045968
What would you want to replace it with? If the answer is "nothing" then you've lost all credibility.
>>
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>>256045010
>Implying Capitalism and soviet-style Communism are the ONLY options
>>
>>256045968
And what do you do when it's gone, genius? Do you seriously think abolishing the system entirely magically solves the problem?
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>>256043919
>>256043834
>>
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>>256045010
>>256045228
>>256045482

I don't necessarily agree with the guy, but it's pretty funny the way people on /v/ yell about these companies and business practices, when so many people here are 17 year old right wingers.

There is no 'nice' company that doesn't care about profits and makes great games out of the goodness of their hearts.

You guys understand that when you attack a developer or publisher for being 'Jewish' you're basically just criticising Capitalism at this point right?
>>
>>256043093
Yea this. I call BS
>>
>>256046181
>>256045968
>Guys, guys, there are other options
>Proceed to list NONE
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>>256045962
That's the end-game of capitalism, yes.
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>>256046308
A man who is good enough to shed his blood for the country is good enough to be given a square deal afterwards.
>>
>>256045357
But it's true. If you honestly believe that gaming expenses cost more then you're an idiot.

It's not the job pool, the video game industry has become a hugely popular field and hundreds of thousands of kids are willing to enter it for dirt cheap pay and no hours. Given the availability of the internet, outsourcing jobs has never been easier either.

And there's now a large amount of both software and resources available to the company, so it's certainly not that

Distribution? Nah, it's never been easier to track consumer spending habits and you can easily judge how much of a shipment you'll need.
And digital distribution makes it even cheaper for the company.

So if it's not the jobs, or the code, or the distribution... What is it?
It's unrealistic publisher expectations, flooding money in hoping for dominance in that genre. And it's advertising costs, trying to fight against an ever growing amount of competition.
>>
>>256046308
I never complain about these companies being "Jewish"
If I don't like a company's practices I don't give them my money, simple enough.
>>
>>256045778
>>256045228
>>256045010
Although I actually support capitalism (not ultracapitalism), I must say that with the arrival of Internet, 3D-printers and other, easy to use means of production, Capitalism has a second shot.
Consider the following:
Capitalism was all about putting the means of production (back in the days, heavy machinery) and thereby the power of economy, into the hands of the workers, thereby liberating the workers from the power of the rich and powerful.
That didnt work, because then the tyrant got replaced by another tyrant. Also, the "means of production" is more than just machinery.
It's infrastructure, contacts, funding, ressources, etc.

But thanks to 3D-printing, Internet, crowdfunding, contact-sites, Free/open software crypto-currency printable circuits, drones and all these things, ALL the means of production can be in private hands. Hell, even 3D printers may soon be 3D-printed.

We're probably facing the most important paradigm shift in economy and production since the industrial revolution.
Marxism or Lenism Communism will most likely NOT be amongst the winners of this. If communism re-emerges, it will be a new kind of communism. Maybe Stallmanism.
>>
>>256046310
Well, TF2 had six maps at launch. I suppose four maps isn't really a stretch...
>>
>>256046565
>Capitalism was all about putting the means of production (back in the days, heavy machinery) and thereby the power of economy, into the hands of the workers

No it wasn't. That's communism.
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also funny because out of those 109 maps everyone only played about 4. Or remembers anyway.
Convoy was so fucking good
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>>256046621
>>256046565

Sorry, my brain is drunk.
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>>256042756
well, this got enough of a reaction from me that I might as well give you a 4/10, I mean... I'm responding and everything.

>unreal tournament maps can be made easily quickly and inexpensively, and is built on a reusable engine that just gets minor upgrades per version
>Gears of war was made from scratch 9 years later where graphics had advanced a bit, and graphics are a large money and time sink

in a sense, the death of videogaming was better graphics.
>>
>>256045357
le ironings
>>
>>256046565
Let me know when you can 3D print 100,000 ton cruise ship
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>>256046913
>graphics are a large money and time sink

Which explains why there are quite an ammount of Crysis mods and maps, right?

Although the map editor ran only on 64-bit, at the time not very common.
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>>256047107
http://www.theguardian.com/technology/video/2014/apr/29/3d-printer-builds-houses-china-video

Get ready.
>>
>>256046339
Regulated free market for starters (trying to make things work as if thoroughly unrealistic assumptions of free market theory, like perfectly rational consumers, were present). Free market with money worship/consumption culture replaced by one promoting responsible consumption and philanthropy would work too.
>>
>>256046913
>Built from scratch
Uses modded unreal 3 engine, retard
>>
>>256047682
>still using unreal 3 engine in 2014
>>
>>256046308
Most people here are 20-30 because once you visit and stay for about 1 hour you're here forever. I will be here, my daughter will be here, my wife is sleeping and she'll be on here later... The poor souls who never visited 4chan will forever not be jaded against fashion, vidya, fitness, cars, and everything else.
>>
>>256046913
>the death of videogaming was better graphics.
It was actually dev-tools not keeping up the pace, today single character models are typically more geometrically complex than entire levels in late 90's and early 2000's games but they're made using tools and convoluted processes that basically haven't changed short of becoming even more complex and user unfriendly in 10-15 years.

The new Unreal Editor is doing a lot to address this.
>>
>>256045327
>Gears of War
>singleplayer game
>>
>2004 game was great everyone brought it and everyone will remember it

>2013 game was shit everyone still brought it because they are idiots but it will never be remembered by anyone

Same as those big shitty songs like gangdam style or whatever the fuck it was called, sure it made a shit ton of money but 5 years from now nobody will know what you are on about, where as other songs that also made a lot of money that are fucking great will be remembered for centuries.
>>
>>256043246
A nexon pay to win shooter already exists though anon, combat arms
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>>256044185
except now the new UT is free for everyone (and not "free2play" apparently)
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>>256044719
>Even 3DS+Contemporary PC doesn't come close to PS2 in its hayday.
That's because the PS2's hayday was before EA and other big gaming companies decided to knock out the middle league players.
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>>256048904
It's open source-ish to boot (source is only available for those with UE4 Subscription, but it IS available).
>>
>>256044302
we literally have thousands of awesome games in the middle market, pc gamers don't buy AAA garbage anymore, fact is AAA only has graphics going for it.
>>
>>256045201
are you implying AAA games spend any money on design?? COD has literally been the same game with the most minor changes ever but the budget keeps going up
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>>256045201
mount and blade is at least twice as complicated as skyrim and it was made by 2 people
>>
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>>256042756
This piece of shit
>>
>>256046913
>the death of videogaming was better graphics

Greatest myth of our time. NO. Good looking games do no cost substantially more to make. They just don't. A lot of effort was actually wasted on compressing high poly models into lower poly models for old games. Try and make low poly stuff look good, it's fucking hard. With today's polycounts you can do just about anything, even spheres that look decent until you get very, very close. And all the shaders stuff really isn't that expensive to make, that's why modders bring it into tons of games in their free-time. What else is there to graphics that wasn't there back in the day? Nothing, graphics eating up budgets is a MYTH. A deception to distract from the real reasons for the budget explosion:

>Advertising

And to a lesser degree singleplayer of the COD 4 school of design where every corner you turn triggers a new script and there's always some NPC blabbing on and on and going through custom animations for the most banal events.

A better comparison for OP would have been Gears of War 1 vs. Judgment since both games have a genuine singleplayer campaign and are in many other ways also identical. On paper one would assume that Gears 1 cost a lot more to make because they had to iterate back and forth in the early days of Unreal Engine 3, UE3 was sort of built around Gears I would presume, and all the gameplay of Gears had to be invented whereas Judgment is just cut and paste with small changes here and there.

I recently played the first level of Gears 3 and that's already a mess of hand-holding scripted everything, Judgment probably puts even more effort into scripting. And it probably had a bigger advertising budget aswell, especially since it's a shitty game. The shittier a game the more advertising it needs.
>>
>>256042756
You forgot to mention that GoW was actually good, whereas most/all UT games are complete dog shit.
>>
>>256050120
Oh jesus fuck that game.

Drakk Homeworld was kinda neat though.
>>
>>256043174
>everything is /pol/ now!

you people make me sick.
>>
>>256044767
>people think our welfare state socialist society is free market capitalism
>>
>>256045201
http://frog-dog.com/articles/detail/how_much_should_companies_budget_for_marketing/

>10% to maintain what you have
>20-50% to gain market share

http://marketing.about.com/od/marketingmethods/qt/marketingbudget.htm
>My recommendations is that companies invest 20% of their resources into marketing.

>10-50%
>pittens

fuck off you unemployed neckbear.

Here's a really obvious real world example of how marketing works. Go into a grocery store. Buy abox of ceral. It's like, 5-6 dolllars right? Now go into the dollar store. Buy a box of the same ceral (generic brand), it's 1 dollar. Know why? Because dollar store companies spend almost 0 on marketing. Every cgi movie or tv commercial or magazine advertisement you see for a video game represents literally millions of dollars of budget.
>>
>>256046438
So true it is sad
>>
>>256045294
do people just stand around time square or something.
>>
>>256046438
>according to lolsocialists

protip socialists always lie.
>>
>>256051841
>implying companies don't lie literally 99% of the time
>>
>>256051426
>the amount of money i save not buying brand name shit

its glorious
you actually can save money by not eating shitty processed foods
source: i ran out of money and discovered how based celery, chicken, rice and lentils are
>>
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Microsoft is responsible for the industry going to shit
Tell me I'm wrong
>>
>>256042756
Left: low quality indie shit nobody cares about because its on PC
Right: actual quality game made by real devs made for a console lots of people actually play games on and pay for them
>>
>>256050495
>GoW 5 better than any UT game

Delusional nigga. Even if you just look at UT99, it's leagues better than any Gears game.

Shit, why am I replying to this bait?
>>
>>256042756
What you retards don't understand is graphics and advertisement are expensive. In fact most games have a higher advertisement budget then all the cost to make the game. You think those cool cgi trailers are free?
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>>256052550
Some off-brand products might even be better than the expensive alternatives (expensive brands are better on average but it's foolish not to give the alternatives a try in case they are one of those that are better in addition to being cheap). And some are completely identical (made by same manufacturer that sells them to different brands).
>>
>>256053564
>UT2k4 is low budget indie shit no one cares about because it's on PC

This post can't be real
>>
>>256054051
you think marketing makes a game good?
>>
>>256054113
>no counterargument
durr hurr mustard race
>>
>>256054250
Ok, I'll bite. How is UT2k4 "indie" in any sense of the word. We can start there.
>>
>>256046590
TF2 was also way cheaper and you could get it as part of a bundle with 4 other good games.
>>
>>256045805
gears of war was never good
>>
>>256055856
It seriously fucking wasn't. I was astounded at how mediocre it was.
>>
But this is the proof that the free market is good.

If everyone could make a game for any console, then big publishers would actually need to convince you to buy their shit.
>>
>>256042756
We don't talk about Judgement

It isn't a real Gears game
>>
UT2004 is a re-release of UT2003 and is a shameless cash grab
>>
>>256042756
A-at least UT4 will be good, r-right?
>>
>>256055856
>>256056169

Plebs detected

The Gears trilogy was amazing as far as console shooters go.
>>
>>256058838
>console shooters
>amazing
>>
>>256058838
>amazing
>console shooters
enjoying your shit sandwich
>>
>>256058838
Then that is very sad for console shooters now isn't it?
>>
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>>256045778

Season 1, episode 10 of Sliders.

No poor people, no inflation, no currency wars.
>>
>>256058923
>>256059116
Mustard race kiddies

Keep playing your ADHD Quakshit. Absolute trash.
>>
Gears of War 1,2,3 was amazing, It's a shame it's been scaled down so much. I've yet to play a better shooter on PC/PS3/360
>>
Why are you reposting reddit shit that can easily have valid reasons to defend the modern stuff, which is still shit anyway?
>>
>>256059170
>>256059116
>>256058923

Tell me how Gears is bad.
>>
>>256059186

Also no people with low IQs.

Granted, we may have to contend with a very spiritual population so they can come to terms with death.
>>
>>256058214
They could've used a bit more bloom there to get more of the call of duty audience
>>
>>256059371
It wasn't bad. It was mediocre. I didn't give a single shit about anything I was doing, nothing about it excited me, it was like playing COD.
>>
>>256046339
State-controlled Mercantile system where the economy is an autonomous arm of the state.

It worked for 1100 years in all of the Old World, Africa included (Kilwa, Mali, Kongo).

In fact, most of the people who wrote anti-state or economically libertarian literature did so thanks to the luxuries the mercantile system provided them.
>>
>>256059371

It's a cover shooter with a retarded art direction. It's nothing special because it does nothing special.
>>
>>256059931
The game mechanics are actually really deep. It's probably the shooter with the largest skill gap on consoles.

It's nothing like cod point and shoot duty
>>
>>256060215
>actually really deep
Bullshit. The only added depth I recall is the action reload, other than that it was mostly boring generic fps guns that work exactly as you would expect. Admittedly, I do like the action reload mechanic and I think it should be in more games, but that does not make it "really deep".
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>>256060007
>cover shooter

Is that a bad thing? It's the best cover shooter out there without a doubt. Most fluent movement easily.

>retarded art direction

How so?
>>
>>256060007
To be fair, it was one of (the?) first of our modern cover shooters.
>>
>>256060475
Confirmed for not getting into the game.

Mastering shotgun battles takes a lot of time. It's not just point and shoot.

Tell me you can so shit like this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tq4vCQWlnCk&list=UUbcnZlytdrASq_SzSd3bxuQ

Getting a hang of movement is really what separates the boys from the men.
>>
>>256058129
see >>256044185

>>256058214
At least they hardly acknowledge UT3 was even a thing. It's a start.
>>
>>256050195
Real artforms don't rely on challenge.
Not traditional art, not literature, not film.
SO instead of saying "without adversities (like a theme park" you could just as easily say without adversities (like all other forms of artistic expression)

Also avoids making players read for Elder scrolls and Mass Effect? Are you fucking kidding? Even without the codec or skyrims countless books, the amount of dialogue in those games far surpasses the games of yor. If you view the advent of voice acting as a bad thing then just fucking turn it off and read subtitles.

This graphic is pants on head foolishness bruv. Get your shit together.
>>
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>MFW I don't think vidya are dead

What's wrong with me /v/ why can't I stop enjoying games like the rest of you.

Why am I such a disgusting pleb fagg0t ;_;
>>
>>256060851
I'm not that guy, and I'm not trying to put down Gears, but...
1. None of that looks impressive to someone who doesn't know exactly what's going on anyways, so showing it to someone who isn't familiar with the game isn't gonna help.
2. The BR-tier rap song makes it seem like the game is only played by BRs. LOL AND THEN DOMINANT SPECIES COMES ON
3. How come nobody else is capable of hitting a single shot on this guy?
4. This game looks fun.
>>
>>256062131
>2. The BR-tier rap song makes it seem like the game is only played by BRs. LOL AND THEN DOMINANT SPECIES COMES ON

Yeah the song is very gay. Lots of mexicans and shit play Gears for some reason.

>3. How come nobody else is capable of hitting a single shot on this guy?

Basically his mastery of movement. He has wall bouncing and strafing down to a science. He's probably been playing since Gears 1 so he's had years of practice.
>>
>>256062731
>Lots of mexicans and shit play Gears for some reason.
Right, that's the impression I got, which is most definitely not a good one.
>wall bouncing
>action reloading
>strafing

I have no idea what those are, but this game seriously sounds like a ton of fun.
>>
>>256061821
Leave while you still can
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