[Boards: 3 / a / aco / adv / an / asp / b / biz / c / cgl / ck / cm / co / d / diy / e / fa / fit / g / gd / gif / h / hc / his / hm / hr / i / ic / int / jp / k / lgbt / lit / m / mlp / mu / n / news / o / out / p / po / pol / qa / qst / r / r9k / s / s4s / sci / soc / sp / t / tg / toy / trash / trv / tv / u / v / vg / vip /vp / vr / w / wg / wsg / wsr / x / y ] [Search | Home]
4Archive logo
SOUL OF THE MIND, KEY TO LIFE'S ETHER...
If images are not shown try to refresh the page. If you like this website, please disable any AdBlock software!

You are currently reading a thread in /v/ - Video Games

Thread replies: 505
Thread images: 45
SOUL OF THE MIND, KEY TO LIFE'S ETHER...
>>
>>256038094
i want to stick muh dick in her
>>
>>256038094
SOUL OF THE LOST, WITHDRAWN FROM ITS VESSEL...
>>
>>256038094

This is just so much better than:

> lest
> lest
> lest
>>
>>256038094

This isnt because of the Vidya lines thread is it?

Also i just seen a great ass Dynamic Nexus theme for ps3.
Wonder why I never seen it before
>>
>>256038295
BEAR
SEEK
SEEK
LEST
>>
File: 11u83tg.jpg (89 KB, 900x922) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
11u83tg.jpg
89 KB, 900x922
Would you play a Garl Vinland focused game?

Still Souls
Just no custom character.

Id fight for the maiden
>>
File: 1390203537356.jpg (414 KB, 660x899) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
1390203537356.jpg
414 KB, 660x899
>>256038712

Of course.

> fighting demons in the swamp
> all for the maiden
> unrequited love, because she is too devoted to her cause
> lose mind and soul because of her

Fuck.
>>
File: 1400812226446.png (199 KB, 265x469) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
1400812226446.png
199 KB, 265x469
>>256038094
I was replaying demon souls yesterday. It's amazing how fucking good the atmosphere is.
>>
>>256038094

i think you mean

SOUL OF TEH MIND, KEY TO LAYFE'S ETHAH
>>
>>256040570
>there will never be a PC port of Demon's souls that does away with the hub world allowing for free roaming to all areas (along with newly added areas).

Also...how did they get Dark Souls II so wrong?

Instead of being oriented to player skill, it's just oriented to making you frustrated (with little to no real rewarding feeling).
>>
>>256038094
How big are chances that she will return in Bloodborne?
>>
File: 1383341485384.gif (907 KB, 150x113) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
1383341485384.gif
907 KB, 150x113
>>256038094
Maiden in Black is the only waifu choice i can respect.
>>
>>256042906
somewhere between zero and zero
>>
>>256041187
the world's are so jarringly different that, if it was a connected world i'd be jank as fuck

the hub world design is fine
>>
>>256041187
Please no. The Nexus was fantastic, frankly I really missed it in the Dark Souls games.
>>
>>256041187
The issue is they tried their own view of what "hard" really means and fell flat on their faces.
>>
>>256043135
Did you ever play Dark Souls?
It's the exact same shit, but it's so well connected that it works.
It would be difficult, but I could see it happening.
>>
File: TfwNoBlindGF.gif (2 MB, 343x224) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
TfwNoBlindGF.gif
2 MB, 343x224
>>256043092
>>
>>256041187

But they didn't get it wrong, you're just bad.
>>
>>256041187
They believed they could just reapply Soul staples and it would automatically make a good game.
The series has become a parody of itself at this point
>>
>>256043527
But it would make a good game. What makes DaSII bad in comparison are exactly the design choices that differ from the staples.
>>
Does bloodborne have armor or is it like demons souls where armor doesnt help for shit and it's basically just a cosmetic choice?

I dont want another havels or giantdad
>>
>>256038220
LET STRENGTH BE GRAND SO THAT THE WORLD MIGHT BE MENDED
>>
>>256038094
SOUL
KEY
>>
>>256043306
The archstones were really far apart though.
>>
>>256043306
i did play dark souls and all i really remember changing from area to area was the tone of colour in the sky, unless you went underground
>>
>>256043797
SO THE WORLD... MIGHT BE MENDED
>>
>>256038295
Not in your life even for a second.

Y'know why? I can tell the Herald to shut the fuck up by mashing past her dialogue.

The Maiden in Black never shuts the fuck up and won't ever stop chanting her faggot prayers.
>>
>>256044206
>wanting the Maiden to shut up

I could hear that sexy voice for all eternity.
>>
>>256038712
>An entire game set around traipsing through the Valley of Defilement and protecting Astraea from its residents and angry clerics sent to kill her alike, as your small party gets picked off along the way

Could be fun.
>>
Dark Souls is the worst Souls game
>>
>>256043863
So were the ending bonfires.
It would be a remake sort of.

I get the feeling that Dark Souls was what Demon's Souls would have been like if they had more time/money/whatever they had a lack of to use that hub world stuff.
>>
>>256044368
I don't care how sexy a voice is. When you're FORCED to listen to dialogue repeatedly, it's a bad thing.

Emerald Herald is better in every way

>Not ugly and weird looking
>Cutest accent
>Ginger Hair
>Pretty outfit
>Dialogue you can skip
>Changes her dialogue to reflect your game progress
>Actually does more than just sit in the Hub.

MiB a shit.
>>
File: 1406838066132.jpg (92 KB, 400x400) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
1406838066132.jpg
92 KB, 400x400
>>256043092
But there are so many lovely girls out there. Why only this one?
>>
File: 1384123642827.jpg (41 KB, 398x400) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
1384123642827.jpg
41 KB, 398x400
>>256038094
>Art thou done? May thine strength help the world be mended.

Maiden in Black is the one true Souls waifu
>>
What's this accent called again ?
>>
>>256044550
>Actually does more than just sit in the Hub.

Confimed for never getting the good ending.
>>
>>256044550
Herald is shit.
She is weird looking, her face looks fucking strange.
MiB has the wax over her eyes, but still looks cuter than that manjawed monster.
>>
>>256044837

I think she is Russian.
>>
>>256043797
>GRAND
you had one job
>>
>>256044837
Dickmancer.
>>
>>256044875
MiB never left the Nexus. EH showed up at several major plot points and elaborated on the plot.

>>256045015
>I've never seen a real woman
Okay then pal.
>>
>>256044550
No amount of attempts to aggressively state your terrible opinion will make the Maiden remotely look inferior in comparison to the Herald. You can't change the facts.
>>
>>256044438
Dark Souls was an incomplete game because it didn't get enough time/money/whatever. There's a reason the end-game segments are so much weaker than the rest of it.

The only difference between Dark Souls and Demon's Souls is that one has loading screens and teleporation, and the other has long corridors and elevators which serve to break the world up anyway, and which make way for loading screens and teleportation later on.
>>
>>256045141
Son, if you'd seen a woman before, you'd know there was something off about the Herald's facial proportions.
>>
MiB is purest waifu
>>
>>256044550
>Actually does more than just sit in the Hub.

What else is the MiB supposed to do exactly? I don't remember an actual time where she could show up realistically, also doesn't she like tend to the Nexus or something like that?
>>
File: moenna.jpg (698 KB, 2560x1440) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
moenna.jpg
698 KB, 2560x1440
> look at me i like pancakeface/dumb mute cunt/dumb ginger cunt
> no one like qt roenna
>>
File: Black maiden.gif (430 KB, 427x235) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
Black maiden.gif
430 KB, 427x235
Those fucking feet.
>>
>>256044720
Because she is elegantly lovable. Don't force itself. It would be only natural. On short terms, it's good taste.
>>
>>256045141
>MiB never left the Nexus

Below the Nexus isn't inside of the Nexus.

EH just sanics around and spouts plot at you.

MiB is integral to both endings and without her presence you couldn't complete the game.
>>
>>256045532
Don't get me wrong, I agree. I think she's really great, but she's not the only Good one out there.
>>
>>256044550
gr8 b8 m8
>>
>>256045395
>What else is the MiB supposed to do exactly?
She could have had more plot related dialogue to share. She could have appeared as a phantasm near the start or finish of each world, maybe just to spit out a blurb about the lore of the area.

>>256045635
MiB being a maguffin doesn't count for much.
>>
>>256045751
>MiB is useless
>No she isn't
>Okay then she's a maguffin

And the Emerald Herald is just a exposition spewer with no other worth, and her dialogue is shit and that's why you don't mind skipping it.
>>
>>256045751
What part of "cannot leave the Nexus" did you not understand?
She tells you all she has to about the plot. "Go kill Demons so we can put the Old One to sleep." That is the fucking plot of the game. Sorry that she doesn't give vague, meaningless exposition all the time like EH does.
>>
File: 1382768363576.jpg (43 KB, 361x313) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
1382768363576.jpg
43 KB, 361x313
>>256045751
>thinking over exposition makes a good or bad character

I don't like your opinion and i don't like you. In fact, i'm sure you're not over 22 and went to the movies watch Transformers 4.
>>
>>256046086
>And the Emerald Herald is just a exposition spewer with no other worth


>created by Aldia to permanently do away with the Undead Curse
>this backfires and he still adopts her even after his subscription to Bad Dragon
totally boring xD
>>
>>256046227
What part of "phantasm" doesn't make sense for you?

>She tells you all she has to about the plot.
Yeah like two sentences one time. It's shit and she's shit.
>>
>>256046402

Is there a difference between phantasm and ghost? If there isn't, why would you go with phantasm? Did a thesaurus fall on your head?
>>
>>256038094

TOUCH THE DEMON INSIDE ME

Y-you too
>>
>>256046545
>Is there a difference between phantasm and ghost?
Are you so stupid that you have to complain about me using big words? Kill yourself, you waste of skin.
>>
>>256046402
It's a game about killing demons. It's structured like a fucking medieval Megaman. MiB is your guide, and she tells you what she needs to tell you.
>she can't leave the Nexus, and tends to it
>she can level you up if you're interested
>she needs you to kill Demons so she can put the Old One to sleep
There, done. What the fuck else do you want her to say?
>>
>>256046828
>remove the shitty descriptions from the archstone menu
>give them to MiB as expository dialogue in each level

Suddenly she's more than some annoying cunt who won't stop repeating lines ad nauseam.
>>
>yfw Drangleic is beyond the broken archstone
Wasn't it called Land of the Giants or something like that?
Wouldn't it also explain why Garl Vinland got swole and arrived in the Crypt?
>>
>>256044550

This guy knows what's up.
>>
>>256046828
He said he wants her to give some lore on the areas, but that's stupid for two reasons because 1) the monumental already does that and 2) part of the appeal of the souls games has always been figuring that shit out on your own.

He's complaining about nothing.
>>
>>256047003
Please stop. Don't waste energy trying to link DeS with DaS in general.
>>
>>256047137
>the monumental already does that
No he doesn't.
>part of the appeal of the souls games has always been figuring that shit out on your own.
Except that this wasn't ever true of DeS because you're outright told what happened in each area.
>>
>>256046282
Yup. That's incredibly boring.

>Oh hey I'm going to just follow you around and spew uninspired story at you which you won't care about anyway
>btw I was created in a lab and my dad's a dragon

Wooooow
>>
>>256046989
>instead of letting players read about the world if they're interested, force them to mash through a bunch of dialogue if they aren't
>make MiB leave the Nexus (which she cannot do), or make the player wait for her to explain shit before they can leave
The reason people hate EH is because she never shuts the fuck up about shit that we don't care about. People love MiB because she's not a fucking burden.
>>
>>256046709

> admits he's pedantic
> call others stupid

OK.
>>
>>256047180
But FromSoft already did.
>>
>>256047240

Not the guy you're responding to, but if you weren't interested in the story, that's your own shortcoming.
>>
>>256047206

Yes, he does. Right when the game starts.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0sKHamDdl8
>>
>before Dark Souls Demons Souls discussion used to be friendly and okay
>after Dark Souls no new souls game could ever be considered good (DS2)
>after Dark Souls PC port the thought of a similar-but-different game is the point of shit-console/pc wars (Bloodborne)

Demons was such a great game, I sort of wish Dark Souls 1 never happened. Considering it's the worst of the three Souls games it'd probably have been better that way too.
>>
>>256047003
Drangleic wasn't the land of the giants, though, Drangleic was at war with the land of the giants.
>>
>>256047329
He's also in the Armored Core games
>>
>>256047206
He gives a short description of the history of each area. not really much in the way of exposition but still.

Right but I meant more in the way that you discover the history and beliefs of the people of each area and what specifically happened to them. Like the whole death cult from the shrine of storms.
>>
I fucking hate MiB's voice
Jesus Christ it sounds like a god damn spic with that ugly as fuck accent
The only good part of her is that animation in which she's sitting and moves her feet around, but the Herald does it better
>>
>>256047453

Just like the Moonlight.

Fucking B-Team rehashing their designs.
>>
>>256047259
>The reason people hate EH is because she never shuts the fuck up about shit that we don't care about.
Are you so dumb/slow you can't mash X/A fast enough that she doesn't get a word in edgewise?
>People love MiB because she's not a fucking burden.
she's a burden on my ears. I'll take 4 lines I can skip by mashing A over a retarded prayer chant I can't shutup without muting my headset/television

>>256047404
>video explaining what happened to the world at large is the same as a couple detailed sentences about each world.
Are you being stupid on purpose? You're allowed to disagree with me but don't flounder around like an idiot trying to win arguments with idiocy.
>>
>>256047329
It's a reference and hommage to DeS. That's as far as it goes. From does this all the time and many other series does it as well.
>>
>>256047440
>BEYOND the archstone
you know what I meant you dong
>>
>>256047393
I was interested in the story, anon, but it all amounted to nothing in the end. "This bitch is part Manus and wants power." Everything the Emerald Herald tells you is of no consequence whatsoever. They could have made her entirely silent and very little would have changed.
>>
>>256047393
Not that guy, but the fuck it is. Emerald Herald has nothing interesting to say, all she ever tells you is her own boring backstory, or vague bullshit that in the end is totally meaningless. The fucking talking cat should have followed you around instead, since she actually tells you relevant shit that you give a damn about.
>>
>>256045141
Herald didn't elaborate on shit. At some points she outright clammed up when you tried to ask her a basic question.
>>
>>256038094
Is that what she says? I never could make it out because it was in the menu without subtitles. I always heard "Soul of the mind, eats a slice pizza"
>>
>>256047791
pfffhaha
>>
>>256047416
Yeah, i still remember the good threads we had. As more people play them, we incorporated some retards on the fanbase and crows that just tries to stir shit up. We'll never have them again.
>>
>>256047889
Bloodborne threads might be alright, depending on how the game turns out.
>PS exclusive
>no shields
>brand new setting
So far, Bloodborne is looking like heaven.
>>
>>256047791

This is what she says:

Soul of the mind, key to life's ether
Soul of the lost, withdrawn from its vessel
Let's strength be granted so the world might be mended
So the world might be mended

Art thou done? May thine strength help the world be mended. This is seared in my brain. Umbasa.
>>
>>256047591
>The Emerald Herald is better because she actually follows you around and spews exposition
>Which I skip through anyway

This some retarded shit right here.
>>
>>256047591
No, you can't just mash before she talks. There's a delay after you hit the button, you have to always hear at least the first word, hence BEAAARUHH SEEK SEEK LEST
>>
>>256047591
Herald's lines can outright delay the menu prompt showing up. Even if you skip them, they'll still slow you down.

Also, the Maiden's chant is background noise while you level up. It doesn't block out or delay anything.
>>
>>256047692
>Over the hill and past the forest is the King's castle. Where a man peered straight into the essence of the soul. But what ever came of it…
Tells you where Castle Drangleic is aswell as a little bit about what Vendrick did over there
>Those who come to Drangleic seeking salvation soon lose hope, and turn Hollow.It happens to them all, sooner or later. That blue knight at the base of the tower… His spirit is already broken. Although he does offer sound advice. Perhaps he is a foreshadowing of your own future?
>That tiny thing inside the ruins…An ancient being that will mock your very existence. She imparts sound wisdom. Provided you find her on a good day…
Hints about local important NPCs
>Bearer of the curse.Long have I awaited one such as you, one who might shatter the shackles of fate. One who can set me free. Bearer of the curse, it was my own manifestation that led you here. The ancient dragon has watched over the world for aeons past. Take this. Do not resist. The dragon welcomes you.
Explains that it's her presence that's responsible for luring undead to Majula/Drangleic while simultaneously telling you no to fear the Ancient Dragon


or compare that to

>Brave soul, who fears not death. Prithee, lull the Old One back to its ancient slumber.
>This is the Nexus. It holds together the northern land of Boletaria. Thou can'st not exit the Nexus, but each of the five Archstones will connect thee to another node.
Basic game premise shit
>>
Favorite DeS boss(es) go
I'm partial to the Armored Spider, Old Monk, Flamelurker, and Astraea
>>
>>256048105
15 FPS heaven. And i'm really afraid it will turn out as a bland unimaginative middle ground between souls and dmc with worst parts from every series.
>>
>>256045425
Hnngg.
>>
>>256048250
>No, you can't just mash before she talks. There's a delay after you hit the button
No there isn't. At most I get B-Se-S-L

>>256048280
>Also, the Maiden's chant is background noise while you level up. It doesn't block out or delay anything.
It's 1000% more annoying than being asked to mash a 4 times.
>>
>>256048105
>SILKY SMOOTH 3FPS

Between the sour grapes, the now-larger 'fanbase' (for lack of a better term), and the trolls and shitposter the former two will inspire, Bloodborne threads will get worse before they get better.
>>
>>256048332
Armored Spider is one of the most fun spider bosses in any game series
>>
>>256048332

1) Tower Knight, because might body wasn't ready;
2) Old Hero, because he looked too cool;
3) The Adjudicator, because the song was really silly and appropriate.
>>
>>256041187

nah demons souls hub system fit the game better
>>
File: 1399932142082.jpg (25 KB, 263x237) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
1399932142082.jpg
25 KB, 263x237
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91dKH-7QkFs

why did you do it /v/?

;_;
>>
>>256048332
False King, hands down.
>>
>>256048332
Astraea, parrying and riposting Garl was so satisfying
>>
>>256048506
>Liking one of the worst fights in DeS more than most bosses in gaming at large
I wish you would choke to death on your own blood as it froths up from your stomach because of all the horrible noxious acid I wish I could pour in there.

>>256048332
>Tower Knight
>Flame Lurker
>Old Monk
>Old Hero
>Penetrator

Maiden and Armor spider were memorably BAD. I can't imagine why they get praise.
>>
Land of Giants DLC when?
>>
>>256048648
>Leave us, slayer of Demons.
This is a sanctuary for the lost and wretched.
There is nothing here for you to pillage or plunder.
Please, leave quietly.
And then Plague Babies
>>
File: 544553533.jpg (17 KB, 300x246) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
544553533.jpg
17 KB, 300x246
>>256038094

> yfw Land of the Giants Expansion Pack after all these years
>>
File: 465765421.jpg (43 KB, 1280x720) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
465765421.jpg
43 KB, 1280x720
YOU HAVE A HEART OF GOLD.
>>
>>256048767
>Armored Spider
>bad
What the fuck
>>
>>256048940
>It's as big as the entire original game

I want to believe
>>
>>256043756
I believe Bloodborne is confirmed for light armor only.
>>
>>256048648
Because she's deluded and turned evil. She's commanding the legions of people who live in the valley to kill people and feed her souls.
>>
>>256048994
Stockpile Thomas was my favorite bottomless box.
>>
Do people still play this joint? It was ded as fuck last time I checked about 2 weeks ago and playing alone is not fun anymore.
>>
>>256048994
DONT LET THEM TAKE IT FROM YOU
>>
>>256048320
We can see exactly where Castle Drangleic is once we enter Majula. Also, there's more than one forest and hill, so that's not actually very helpful. As for the Crestfallen Warrior dialogue, that's about the same as what the Firekeepers tell you about the travelers. She's also needlessly vague when describing Shalquoir, who by the way is everything the Herald should have been as far as dialogue goes.

As for the Dragon stuff, that comes at the very end of the game and is still needlessly overwritten. Her "manifestation" brought people to Drangleic? Also, how are you shattering the shackles of fate if you're to link the Fire? Her dialogue and agenda don't even match up there. While she tells you not to fear the Ancient Dragon, she certainly doesn't tell you why you're even seeing him, and she neglects to mention that while the dragon welcomes you, everything else most certainly does not.

The Herald's dialogue is very wordy, vague, and written to be needlessly mysterious about some very basic things. She says a lot but ultimately tells you nothing. In contrast, the Maiden in Black could be clear and mysterious at the same time.
>>
>>256049154

> playing Demon's Souls alone
> not fun

Tobias, come on.
>>
I like her laid back attitude. She seems like somebody you could sit back and drink vodka with, while the Emerald Herald sits to the side looking indignant and righteous.
>>
File: Maiden.jpg (41 KB, 624x624) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
Maiden.jpg
41 KB, 624x624
Y'all niggas need a bit of Maiden
>>
>>256049196
>>256049142
Oh man I loved this guy.
>>
>>256048436
How is it more annoying? It doesn't impede anything. You can even instantly cut the entire thing off by leaving the menu. Depending on your actions, it can be shorter than skipping through the Herald's dialogue.
>>
>>256049240
Playing alone is not fun after you've finished that game for like 50 times already.
>>
>>256048320
More dialogue is not better. Why can't people nowadays understand the concept of elegant design ? Maiden in Black told you what was necessary to move forward. Whatever little she told you was enough to make you keep going. Just because Herald talks almost in riddles about some lore that isn't even necessary to know doesn't mean she any more meaningful than the Maiden. It's just more brute exposition. Fuck man, no wonder movies and games have to shove text and objectives on our faces all the times, people go to far lengths to defend this shit.
>>
>>256048105
>Bloodborne threads might be alright
Not on NintendoGAF it won't, same thing happened to InFamous threads.
Sad thing is, I'm not even a Sonydrone, I like a little from all sides except Xbox at this point, but I'm not about to call all Xbox games shit just because they aren't on my choice of console.
>>
>>256049206
>so that's not actually very helpful
good thing I wasn't claiming it was.
>She's also needlessly vague when describing Shalquoir
There's nothing vague at all about it. She's the only female non human in the game who also sorta laughs at you.

> that comes at the very end of the game and is still needlessly overwritten.
It doesn't matter if this is your opinion. It exists and as a result serves to further justify her existence. Something MiB doesn't have.
>Her dialogue and agenda don't even match up there.
You being confused and or the story being vague isn't a contradiction you faggot.

>, she certainly doesn't tell you why you're even seeing him, and she neglects to mention that while the dragon welcomes you, everything else most certainly does not.
Again, you spew a mountain of autistic complaints that serve to prove nothing. Having a MiB/EH style character means you need to justify her as more than a statue at the hub world. DaS2 did this well. DeS didn't.

> In contrast, the Maiden in Black could be clear and mysterious at the same time.
No she couldn't. Get your biases in line faggot. There's nothing mysterious about tellin' you to get kill demons and lull the old one.
>>
>>256049154
I've been playing through and I've seen a few blue summoning signs. I also got invaded in Latria.
>>
Soo of da mind, key to wife's ether.
Soo of the wost withdwawn from its wessel
WET STWENGH BE GWANTED
So da world might be mended
So da world might be mended...
>>
>>256041187
Dark Souls 2 isn't bad it just suffers being a good game in a great series.
>>
>Sticky white stuff
>>
>>256049659

Was that your first playthrough? I would have lost my shit if I got invaded in Latria of all places during my first time.
>>
>>256049694
Be vewy vewy quiet
I'm hunting demons
>>256049784
>great series
>DeS is great yes
>DaS is a half finished mess
>DaS2 is good
Uh maybe GREAT series is overselling it
I mean there have only been two games before DaS2
>>
>>256049023
>walk down a boring hallway until you're too close to the spider to see anything
>mash attacks until stamina runs out
>guard a fire attack
>eat grass
>mash attacks until stamina runs out
>win

Armored Spider is INCREDIBLY shit.

Fucking DeSfags, can't even judge a bossfight somewhat objectively.


>>256049451
> You can even instantly cut the entire thing off by leaving the menu
So I should have to deliberate on my stat choices without looking at the menus just so I can avoid hearing her prayers for the 100 000 000th time?

>>256049451
>Depending on your actions, it can be shorter than skipping through the Herald's dialogue.
Not possible. I shut the Herald up in less than 1.5 seconds. Mashing buttons to skip her words is easy and doesn't force me to compromise.

>>256049567
>More dialogue is not better
sure
>Maiden in Black told you what was necessary to move forward. Whatever little she told you was enough to make you keep going
Exactly. She did almost Nothing of value while serving to make me frustrated and mad every time I had to hear her fucking chants again.
>. Just because Herald talks almost in riddles about some lore that isn't even necessary to know doesn't mean she any more meaningful than the Maiden
No, she's just better designed and implemented. She does more to justify herself.
>Lore/Plot
>Estus upgrades
>Leveling up
MiB only fits into one of those categories properly. She shares her lore role with the monumental.
>>
I REALIZE
>>
>>256049847
Nah, I was pretty upset with myself though, I got knocked off the edge of a walkway.
>>
File: yurt.jpg (23 KB, 300x412) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
yurt.jpg
23 KB, 300x412
Are you here to fight the Demons?
If so, then help me escape this place.
I am on your side. I have come to face the Demons.
>>
>>256050617
Yurt did nothing wrong
>>
>>256049603
Then why mention that dialogue? It doesn't really tell you anything then. As for Shalquoir, the Herald is extremely vague and dramatic about a dang cat that lives in a house 50 feet away. The point about the Herald's dialogue coming late is to emphasize that it takes forever before she finally tells you anything about herself, and even then it's structured oddly. Also, that line is indeed a contradiction. Linking the Fire is treated as an inevitable, fated option throughout the game, something that Vendrick and Aldia tried to avoid. The Herald speaks as if you'll break that cycle, but the ending reveals that she actually wants you to link the Fire, which just continues the shackled fate that the brothers sought to escape. As for justification in the game world, the Maiden in Black is the reason why slayers of demons can empower themselves with souls and is the key to sealing the Old One. The Herald exists in a series where Bonfires could level you up just fine before and she does nothing but try to point you somewhere, having no true relevance of her own. As for mystery, the Maiden's demonic nature and who she may have been in ancient times is left open to interpretation, as is her connection with the Old One, why she has the wax on her eyes, etc.
>>
>>256050617

I had that shit spoiled for me, for better or worse.

A friend straight up told me to kill him or he'll kill almost everybody in the Nexus and so I've played through the game half a dozen times and have always killed him.
>>
>>256050006
If DaS was, according to you, a "half finished" mess. Whatever actually was "finished" was more creative, deliberately designed and varied than the entirety of Dark Souls 2.
>>
>>256050828

Your friend is a true friend. That piece of shit has to go.
>>
>>256050954
That "piece of shit" is your friend. He fights on your side.
>>
>>256050709
>>256050828
why does he kill everyone?

I haven't played it since it came out, I vaguely remember some shit about Mephistopheles or something
>>
>There is a question I have long had in my mind
It is whether we are right to banish the Old One
>And I now have the answer, and it is a resounding no.
>Listen closely. The Old One must not be cut off from us.
If the candle maiden tries to entrap it, kill her.
>>
>>256050946
shup up moron

they shipped a game with 2 unfinished areas
>>
>>256051057
He's hired by Mephistopheles to kill anybody left who dabbles in the soul arts.
>>
>>256051037

> believing a murderer

Then you realize you became just like him... ;_;
>>
Should I feel bad if I cheesed almost every boss? Or should I feel proud that I beat the game in the most efficient method possible?
>>
>>256050023
If you already know what you want to level up, you can do so immediately and leave the screen whenever you want, instantly ending the entire chant. With the Herald you have to skip four lines no matter what, and said lines can cause a delay in the menu even appearing.
>>
>>256051140
And once again, I would rather play a great game with 2 unfinished areas than a "finished" game which is mediocre throughout and riddled with questionable design decisions.

We can go at this as long as you want.
>>
>>256051140
They shipped a game with two poorly designed areas. Dark Souls II shipped with a lot more than that.
>>
>>256050023
>More dialogue is not better
>sure

>She did almost Nothing of value while serving to make me frustrated and mad every time

>she's just better designed and implemented. She does more to justify herself.

You just have some terrible opinion. Really, there's nothing even to discuss anymore...you're simply someone who appreciate being over exposed with information. No matter what i say you'll never appreciate the Maiden because she's done inside a design you aren't fond for.
>>
>>256051248
Cheese all you want, nobody can tell you how to play. You're just not gonna get any better if you cheese is all.
>>
>>256050805
>Linking the Fire is treated as an inevitable
No it isn't
> The Herald speaks as if you'll break that cycle, but the ending reveals that she actually wants you to link the Fire, which just continues the shackled fate that the brothers sought to escape.
Because she's a failure and the only answer is to link the fire to keep it away from Nashandra and her sisters.
> the Maiden in Black is the reason why slayers of demons can empower themselves with souls and is the key to sealing the Old One.
You haven't made a point.

>a series where Bonfires could level you up just fine before
This complaint it retarded. It's like saying we don't need to level at bonfires because in the older games we didn't use archstones but an NPC to level up.

You're going on about ephemeral lore shit. Don't. You're stupid. It's way simpler than all this

>Emerald Heralds plays more important plot and game related roles
>Emerald Herald's dialogue acknowledges game progress
>Emerald Herald actually expands on lore and shows up to play that role
>Emerald Herald's most annoying aspects can be skipped and ignored in under 1 second
>Maiden in Black plays a minimal story and plot role
>Maiden in Black repeats dialogue endlessly to the point of irritation

>>256051349
>someone who appreciate being over exposed
It's got nothing to do with information and everything to do with not being EXTREMELY fucking annoying and having better justification for her existence from lore AND gameplay perspectives.
>>
>>256051248
Demon's Souls bosses are mostly pretty bad, so I wouldn't feel guilty about it.
>>
File: laughing priest.jpg (129 KB, 800x571) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
laughing priest.jpg
129 KB, 800x571
>Second chance
>Anti magic field
>stacking regen
>Tactical nuke

mfw god is on my side.
>>
>>256051248

I've only ever beaten Flamelurker by cheesing him. It's easy to get him stuck around the huge bones. He'll keep attempting to dash at you against the bones, being stuck in place, and you can hit him there until he dies. Occasionally you just have to be aware of his jump attack that makes a big explosion that can hit you through the bones.
>>
>>256051306
>, and said lines can cause a delay in the menu even appearing.
No they don't. that was release day console version.
>If you already know what you want to level up, you can do so immediately and leave the screen whenever you want
Nope. You can't know the exact cost of each level without her menu.
>>
>>256051474
Except that's wrong.
>>
>>256051349
I think the problem is either:
a) He's absolutely in love with The Herald and will not listen to reason
b) He hates the Maiden's voice/accent so much that he's willing to just project that hate onto every other part of her.

Either way, there's some serious psychological shit going on there. No sane man could think that Dragon fucker is better than the Maiden, let alone a good character.
>>
>>256050946
The first half of the game was amazing, I will admit
But the second half is so god awful that it ruins the game for me.
In both DeS and DaS2, there was no point where I said "This is awful, I don't want to play this anymore."
The state of Lost Izalith is the worst out of all of it, and is fucking unacceptable
"The birthplace of demons" is reduced to annoyingly bright bloom, dragon butts, timpani demons that look ridiculous rather then scary, and THOSE STUPID FUCKING STATUES WE'VE BEEN FIGHTING SINCE THE DEMON RUINS
WHERE'S THE CREATIVITY
And it's not just LI
It's ALL the lord soul areas
And it really doesn't matter that it was rushed, it doesn't excuse the fact that playing through them is an awful experience
All in all it ruined DaS for me.
>>
>>256051632
DeS bosses are all real easy, save for three of them which are just a little above average in difficulty. The draw to DeS' bosses is that they're all memorable.
>>
File: alpha as fuck.png (385 KB, 480x530) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
alpha as fuck.png
385 KB, 480x530
>>256051632
Except it's not.
>>
>>256051604
I usually dodge his first attack and run straight for the stairs. He always gets stuck on the fallen column.
>>
>>256051682
>trying to figure out my problem
Maiden in Black is one of the worst videogame NPCs ever. NPCs that spout unskippable dialogue on repeat are shit tier. Nope exceptions.

Emerald Herald takes the Maiden in Black concept and succeeds at implementing it where DeS failed.
>>
>>256051471
>>256050023
>>256049603
>>256048320
>>256044550

One mental-disease-ridden motherfucker. I just realized you spent a lot of effort trying to justify your hate for a character. Good job.
>>
>>256051471
>It's got nothing to do with information and everything to do with not being EXTREMELY fucking annoying and having better justification for her existence from lore AND gameplay perspectives.

Do you listen to yourself ?
For you the Maiden is annoying and doesn't have a good existence justification from lore and gameplay perspective. How am i suppose to argue with this ? It's just plain factually wrong. What the hell.

>>256051868
Yeah, it's definitely something psychological. I'm done with you.
>>
>>256051902
>how dare somebody hate on my precious demon waifu!!!!
MiB is shit. It's a fact, that Emerald Herald addressed all the biggest problems with MiB.
>>
>>256051703
Right, they're all memorable encounters with some unique mechanic or situation (for the most part). I don't think that the combat system of the Souls games is conducive to interesting boss fights based solely on combat. There's only so much you can do with it. That's why everybody complains about Dark Souls II's bosses, and even a lot of Dark Souls' bosses were pretty lackluster. Demon's Souls avoids this by having something other than just combat involved.

Look at Dark Souls II. Most people agree that the Chariot is one of the better bosses. Is it hard? No. But it's different and memorable.
>>
File: 1274585133881.jpg (12 KB, 308x352) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
1274585133881.jpg
12 KB, 308x352
>going down the stairs to fight Dragon God
>Get down to the bottom
>Dragon God lets out a high pitched screech that's loud as fuck
>mfw
It was obviously a glitch, but holy shit it scared the fuck out of me. I wish I had recorded it. It was like his basic roar, but amplified x2 and raised in pitch x4.
>>
>>256051687
>But the second half is so god awful that it ruins the game for me.
I have never understood this. Lost Izalith still had great atmosphere and wasn't remotely tedious to get through unless you're retarded. The rest of the areas were perfectly fine, with New Londo and Dukes being almost as good as any earlier part of the game.

See, the problem is:
FUCKING STATUES WE'VE BEEN FIGHTING SINCE THE DEMON RUINS
WHERE'S THE CREATIVITY
I felt this way through ALL of Dark Souls 2.

>All in all it ruined DaS for me.
And that is absolutely, incredibly bizarre coming from somebody that has implied that Dark Souls 2 is the better game and doesn't suffer from bigger problems.
>>
>People falling for the MiB vs Emerald Herald b8er
Guys, really?
>>
>>256051976
>it's not annoying to hear her autistic shitty little prayers on repeat a thousand times
>having only 3 or 4 major dialogue lines makes up for how her dialogue doesn't acknowledge game progress or how she ONLY sits around the nexus being boring
>>
>>256051703
All of Boletaria's bosses except Allant were shit. False Idol wasn't memorable and Old Monk is only remembered for the online gimmick. Honestly, the only memorable bosses were
>Allant
>Flamelurker
>Dragon God for being a puzzle
>Old Monk
>Maneaters
>Paladin guy and his lady
>>
File: 294416.jpg (182 KB, 800x915) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
294416.jpg
182 KB, 800x915
Demon's Souls thread
>>
>>256051976
>no refutation
Notice how when I disagree with you on something I'm able to prove why you're dumb with facts and logical supports? Why can't you do the same?

>>256052121
I'm not baiting anybody. I'm laying out cold hard facts for autistic losers who can't remove their nostalgia glasses for two seconds to see things clearly.
>>
>>256052121

Bro, bait is blitzkrieg: fast and furious. This dude is fighting a war of attrition - against, I don't know.
>>
>>256051976
Probably just fucking with us, nobody could have those specific gripes about MiB and still somehow think EH is a good character when she's even more of an annoying useless cunt that ultimately says and does absolutely nothing of relevance or value to the game or story at large.
>>
>>256052171
>Not Storm King
>Not Adjudicator
>Not Old Hero
>Not Old King Doran
>Not Tower Knight
>Not Penetrator
You're small time.
>>
>all of these DS1 PC fags shitting on the thread

can we just talk about demon's souls without you faggots shitposting over the game you don't have?
>>
>>256052093
>I felt this way through ALL of Dark Souls 2.
Because you're a jaded cunt with poor taste.
>>
>>256052171
>tower Knight
>not memorable
Are you fucking kidding me?
Also gameplay aside Astraea has the best atmosphere of any boss fight in the souls series.
>>
>>256052141
Nigger do you want her to speak more or not?
Make up your mind.

If you find her annoying then don't complain that she isn't explaining things to you constantly.
>>
>>256052402
We could, if people could learn to just ignore dissenting opinions or refute them without turning it into a shitfest.
>>
>>256052314
>MiB's biggest flaw is being an annoying bitch who never shuts up
>Emerald Herald can be told to shut up
It's that simple. Everything else is gravy, though it doesn't make that gravy any less valid to be secondary. Her plot roles and changing dialogue do a LOT to further solidify her as superior to MiB
>>
>>256052032
The best souls bosses are the ones that combine combat with some sort of unique mechanic or situation.

The problem with most Demon's Souls bosses is that too many of them were too "mechanic", or more accurately, gimmick focused. With the exception of Penetrator/Allant, and Astraea (merely because of the narrative implications), I wouldn't say any of the end-world bosses were actually that good. Atmospheric, yes, but mechanically really lame.

I'm not going to claim that Dark Souls didn't have its share of lemons though, and that DaS2 wasn't bad for just going down the pure combat route.
>>
>>256052093

My main gripe with Lost Izalith was the Chaos Eaters. They were so fucking disgusting to look at, goddamn. I honestly had no issue with the area. Blighttown was way worse for me.
>>
>>256052494
>can't into basic reading comprehension
No wonder the thread is all worked up and mad about my posts. You fucks can't even read simple english.
>>
File: 1401741450720.gif (796 KB, 320x286) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
1401741450720.gif
796 KB, 320x286
>>256052171
>All of Boletaria's bosses except Allant were shit

>Penetrator
>Tower knight
>shit
>>
>>256044550
>people actually believe this
like me
>>
>>256051471
Yes it is. Even the Ember you get mentions that the Flame being weak is a natural state that flares up at times, and there are "a new flame rises from the ashes" elements everywhere. Also, even if the Herald's a failure, isn't the point that she's looking for someone who won't fail? Hoping they link the Fire goes against her dialogue at the Dragon Aerie. Regarding the Maiden's Soul Arts, she is indeed crucial and important to the game; she's the reason the Monumental can even amass an army of demon slayers in the first place, she empowers people so they can stand a fighting chance (with the risk that they'll become power-hungry and turn into demons), and she has the most vital role of all, ultimately stopping the Old One and saving the world. The Herald does have more exposition, yes, but she needlessly complicates her explanations while ultimately saying nothing that's truly informative. She even clams up entirely in some places, effectively standing there doing nothing.

As for the Bonfire point, Dark Souls introduced the Bonfires, resting places and power wells that let you level up. Dark Souls 2 features the same Bonfires but removed the leveling option solely to give the Herald some justification. As such, her function isn't actually unique to the Dark Souls series, which led a lot of people to see her as a time-consuming inconvenience.

If you seriously find the Maiden's brief, easily skipped background chant extremely annoying compared to the Herald, then that's ultimately a subjective matter and it's doubtful this discussion will change that.
>>
>>256052408
Or maybe it's because Dark Souls II feels like shit to play due to its mechanical changes, has shit level design, and has a shit opening, doing nothing to improve going forward.
>>
>>256052320
>>256052446
>big guys who swings stuff
>memorable
You guys hated this when it was in DS2, you friggin hipsters
>>
Why the fuck are load times in Demon's Souls so fucking long? Shit.
>>
>>256052408
No, it's really not that, and that's a hypocritical claim to make after saying that you had to rage-quit in the middle of Dark Souls because it was apparently that bad. I've beaten all 3 games multiple times myself.

Dark Souls 2 suffers from poor design throughout almost the entire game. Holy shit, they even included fucking dragon butts in the DLC.
>>
>>256052794
Because
>PS3
>From Soft's first new gen game
>Bluray
If you have the digital version it's not as bad, but it's still long.
>>
>>256052783
Not a single one of them looks as good as the tower knight or has a theme that comes even close to his.
But I would've complained about DeS too if every boss was some unispired version of the tower knight.
>>
>>256051612
It's not nearly as bad anymore, but occasionally there can still be a brief delay. Also, for leveling up you really just need to pour souls into the thing you want until it locks you out. The whole process is extremely fast.
>>
>>256052783

Because it had already been done ad nauseam. You can't find fault in Demon's for that.

Also:

> that Tower Knight fight
> that music
> that ho-ho-ho
> that realization you would have to clear the whole fucking bridge again to have a shot at him

My body was - not - ready.
>>
>>256052271
What facts ? What logic ?
MiB have lore and gameplay reasons to be there. You hate her for being annoying but she has less dialogue. The little dialogue she has is background noise and don't interrupt gameplay. The only dumb here is yourself who thinks your grips are logical and factual when they're entirely the opposite of that. You're biased over Herald. Just go and be happy with it.
>>
>>256052897
Oh no, it's that guy who likes the Tower Knight theme again.

I agree that it was a cool fight though.
>>
I think that all of the Souls games are excellent in their own way. :)
>>
>>256053104
>Not liking HA HAHAHA HA
What's wrong with you?
>>
File: Don Manly Tears.jpg (22 KB, 381x427) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
Don Manly Tears.jpg
22 KB, 381x427
>>256048332
Penetrator has to be my favourite boss. By chance alone, he turned into such a rollercoaster for me.

>Hunting fat fuck
>Motherfucker trolls me through the entire level
>Defeat all the knights and shit, walk through the fog
>"Alright you little cunt, time to die."
>MASSIVE FUCKING SWORD THROUGH THE CHEST
>Get him down to half life before mis-timing a dodge and die
>Fight my way back to him, a fucking bird flies straight into my window with a loud thud; when I look back at the screen he's penetrated me
>Final attempt had the frustration get the better of me and I botched it again
>Say fuck it and do some exploring instead, eventually finding both Yuria and Biorr
>Go back to fighting the Penetrator
>"YO DEMON SLAYER, I GOT YOUR BACK SON"
>Stand unmoving and in shock for long enough for Biorr to take down half his life
>"AIN'T NO PUNK ASS DEMON GONNA FUCK WITH MY HOME"
>Sit back as Biorr solos the nigger and becomes my best friend

>NG+
>"Biorr's got this, I'ma chill."
>Biorr gets his ass raped, half his health is gone and the Penetrator isn't sweating
>"Shit, I've got to save him."
>Pen has Biorr stuck in a corner
>I charge in like a fucking retard swinging around the Dragon Bone Smasher
>It hits Biorr through the Penetrator, killing him
>I'm stunned and stare in horror at what I've just done, before Penetrator takes advantage and penetrates me further
>Eventually go back wearing Biorr's armour and wielding his weapons and murder the shit out of the faggot

I'm sorry, Biorr. I'm so sorry.
>>
>>256053104
>not liking it

What is wrong with you?
>>
>>256052695
>Even the Ember you get mentions that the Flame being weak is a natural state that flares up at times,
So?
> "a new flame rises from the ashes" elements everywhere
Yes because the game is about how the flame was lit a lot between DaS1 and DaS2. The cycel fo the chosen undead occurs lots. That's NOT the same as implying Fire Linking is inevitable.
> isn't the point that she's looking for someone who won't fail?
No. She's a failed experiment. She can't ask somebody to succeed at a role she was BORN to fulfill.

>she's the reason the Monumental can even amass an army of demon slayers in the first place, and she has the most vital role of all, ultimately stopping the Old One and saving the world
Too bad she never talks about this much and hardly even acknowledges game progress

>The Herald does have more exposition, yes, but she needlessly complicates her explanations while ultimately saying nothing that's truly informative. She even clams up entirely in some places, effectively standing there doing nothing.
Which is still FAR preferable to never doing anything at all.

>Dark Souls 2 features the same Bonfires but removed the leveling option solely to give the Herald some justification.
Actually the bonfire leveling option removal is part of a several elements of DeS they worked into DaS2. It serves the horizontal world design to force a hub

>>256052919
Without seeing the cost per level, you won't be able to balance your spending.
>>
>>256052271
Dude, the Emerald Herald is an awful character. I feel sorry for you believing that you're educating people when you're so deluded.

That retarded, riddling way of speaking is so unbecoming of a character like that, and an irishwoman.
>>
>>256053104

> that guy

What? That guy is nearly everyone now? Everyone but you, obviously.
>>
>>
>>256053243
>Which is still FAR preferable to never doing anything at all.
Not that anon but are you claiming the MIB did nothing?
did you even beat Demon's Souls?
>>
>>256038094
Holy shit OP. I just started playing Demon's Souls and unlocked her for the first time last night.

I told the baby mannequin thingy to fuck off and then it said i'd be trapped in nexus forever and laughed at me.

I'm a little late to the party.
>>
>>256053356
>Dewrito Pope will die in your lifetime
;_;
>>
Have any of you ever beaten the Tower Knight early in a new game without killing all of the archers first?
>>
>>256053191

10/10 story

Biorr > Tarkus thread derailed
>>
File: Necro_blunt_hit[1].jpg (376 KB, 1310x403) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
Necro_blunt_hit[1].jpg
376 KB, 1310x403
>>256049694
>>
>>256052871
I got the digital version during a flash sale on PSN. Still annoying as all hell.
>>
>>256053458
>Baby Mannequin thingy
That's the Monumental, you uncultured swine.
>>
I just can't understand how a guy who oversaw dark souls could also oversee a game as lifeless and boring as demons souls.
>>
>>256053089
> You hate her for being annoying but she has less dialogue.
Less dialogue, but dialogue which I have no choice but to listen to on repeat.
>The little dialogue she has is background noise and don't interrupt gameplay
It's much worse than background noise. It's a flaw that makes me dread even choosing to level up.

Meanwhile you guys think Emerald Herald is inferior despite the following differences/improvements she's got to bring to the table
>actually acknowledging your quest progress
>shutting the fuck up when asked
>does more than sit at the hub the whole game

>>256053260
She's not even human. Of course she's spouting riddles and shit.

>Dude, the Emerald Herald is an awful character.
I don't think she's great, she's just WAY better than that trainwreck from Demon's Souls
>>
>>256053458

> baby mannequin
> it's THE FUCKING MONUMENTAL

Holy shit.
>>
>>256053356
It took me a while but I got it and I giggled.

>>256053296
This is literally the first time I've been outnumbered in regards to my opinion on the Tower Knight theme. It's usually just one guy saying he likes it while everybody else laughs.

Then again, tonight has been a weird night, with entire threads made up of almost positive discussion about The Last of Us, and a guy in this thread actually waifufagging the Emerald Herald. Is it a full moon?
>>
>>256052093
>Great atmosphere
What atmosphere
There is barely any atmosphere, it's just a city in lava with demons inside it
Hardly the "birthplace of demons" we were promised
>New Londo
Okay I can't really complain about that
Was a little disappointing how short it was though
>Dukes
Starts out fine
Then as soon as you get out of the prison you realize that it's really tiny and then you get to the crystal caves, which is also a huge disappointment

As to your second point, the difference is while yes they reused enemies, they were actually enjoyable to fight in DaS2
The demon statues were just boring and were annoying to fight.
All they did was float around and breath fire.

>>256052826
I didn't rage quit, I beat the game. I'm just saying the game made me WANT to ragequit because it was so awful.
And the dragon butts in the DLC were hella better then the dragon butts from DaS
Mostly because they're easier to fight in the sense that you're not surrounded by annoying bloom and the screen shaking every time they moved
Also, they're far enough apart that you won't aggro them all at once, unlike A CERTAIN ENEMY IN DaS 1
>>
>>256053727
Just to restore your insanity I might love the Tower Knight theme but I decided to ignore the Emerald Herald fag.
That is just fucking ridiculous.
>>
>>256053727
I'm not waifufagging EH even for a second. The whole concept should have been cut and bonfires should have stayed the same.

But that doesn't stop the Herald from shitting all over the Maiden from a quality perspective.
>>
Hey guys, how about that DEMON'S SOULS HUH? GOOD GAME HUH?
>>
>>256053886
>But that doesn't stop the Herald from shitting all over the Maiden from a quality perspective
Not even close. Are you serious?
>>
>>256053657
Admittedly, the Maiden in Black's chant is a little annoying, but how you can think it's worse Bear Seek Lest Lest loading time pray animation is beyond me.
>>
>>256053976
It was a good game
Fluted armor a best
All other armors go home
>>
So why was the Thief class and armor more resistant to poison? I never understood that.
>>
>>256053994
I've repeated my argument a dozen times in the thread. EH>MiB.

What's hilarious is how pathetic the responses are. nobody is really trying to debate with me about facts.

The FACTS:
>MiB has very little dialogue and never acknowledges your current gamestate
>EH has lots of dialogue and changes her statements based on your game progress

>MiB doesn't do anything for almost the whole game except sit around the Nexus
>EH turns up at major plot progression moments and talks to you and expands on the story

>MiB chants an annoying as fuck prayer nonstop when you're trying to choose your stat investments
>EH says a few canned lines you can skip past VERY quickly when you want to interact with her

MiB is shit.
>>
File: toweroflatria1.jpg (214 KB, 775x349) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
toweroflatria1.jpg
214 KB, 775x349
>UGGGGGGRRRRRAHHHH
is this the blighttown of demons souls
>>
>>256052039
>kill Vanguard
>Go down to fight the Dragon God
>just punches me
y-you too
>>
>>256054434
That would be the Valley of Defilement.
>>
>>256054425
It's hilarious that you think those things make her better.
You're fucking deluded and you have terrible taste.
I'm genuinely happy you will never work on a video game.
>>
>>256054434
Nope
Fifth world is blighttown
>>
>>256053848
>There is barely any atmosphere, it's just a city in lava with demons inside it
You're basically just a huge pleb who can't appreciate Dravidian Architecture.

>Hardly the "birthplace of demons" we were promised
You're really just butthurt over some incredibly arbitrary thing. You're so buttblasted over Lost Izalith not being the Birthplace of Demon's that you dreamed of, that you're willing to project your disappointment onto almost the entire game, meanwhile ignoring the fact that DaS2 is an abject disappointment both in design and atmosphere from start to finish.
>>
>>256053706
It looked like bride of Chucky to me.
>>
File: 1397072858712.jpg (108 KB, 750x750) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
1397072858712.jpg
108 KB, 750x750
>>256054551
>zero refutation or reasoning
HAAH WAAW
>>
>>256054425
Those aren't arguments. You haven't said why any of those things are good.
>>
>>256054434
PLEASE HELP ME
>>
>>256054635
You look like the bride of Chucky.
>>
>>256054425

Understand this, since you're sooooo much better than everyone here.

Nobody wants to argue with you anymore because you are an idiot with awful taste and you're shitting up the thread.
>>
>>256054648
>Not HAAH WAAW WAAW WAAW, WAAW
You missed a golden opportunity there, boy-o.
>>
>>256054649
I shouldn't have to tell you why NPCs who acknowledge quest progress is good. I shouldn't have to explain why a major NPC playing a more involved role in the plot is good. I REALLY shouldn't have to explain why dialogue that plays on a loop is a bad thing.
>>
>>256054616
Dude, I agree with you that Dark Souls II is shit, but you're kidding yourself if you don't think that Lost Izalith is worse than most of the areas in it. Overall Dark Souls is much better, but you're just talking out of your ass here.
>>
>>256054702
HEY NIGGA CHECK THIS OUT THERE'S SOME OLD ONE SHIT GOAN ON UP IN HERE AND YOU GOTTA TAKE CARE OF IT SON WHAT YOU SAY ?

NO? WELL THEN FUCK YOU, YOU'RE FUCKED LIKE THAT CRAZY CHICK WITH NO EYES

dolls are fucking weird man. didn't the whole two rows of them just freak you out? I don't trust them.
>>
Why do Dark Souls babbys hate Demons Souls so much? Is it because there aren't bonfires to hold your hand? Or is it because they don't own a PS3 and are butthurt they never got to play it?
>>
>>256054648
I'm not him, but my personal refutation is that The Emerald Herald provides excessive exposition in a game which doesn't require it, and does so in meaningless, idiotic riddles which add almost nothing to the experience or to your understanding of the game. She's a far more pervasive and annoying presence than the Maiden in Black, whose only real fault is the fact that she repeats the same line too often, in the background.
>>
>>256054997
Not really since they were all dead but the Monumental. Just kind of sad, really.

That and it took me so fucking long to find them that I was just all "whatever, time to accept this shit."
>>
>>256050006
>>great series
>>DeS is great yes
>>DaS is a half finished, but still great
>>DaS2 is good

Yes there has only been two games before DaS2 and they were both amazing in their own way. DaS2 tried to mix the best aspects of both games and for the most part it did good job, but it still missed the mark in capturing the ethos of the Soul series.
>>
>>256055101
>is it because they don't own a PS3 and are butthurt they never got to play it?
pretty much this and most of them were in middle school when it came out
>>
>>256055101
Dark Souls has more of a focus on combat, and when they try to play Demon's Souls the same way it comes up short. Demon's Souls is more about progression through the level and exploration, the enemies only exist to serve that end.
>>
>>256055153
Does it really change the game if you don't accept the Monumental's offer? I figured I'd just do it later. The whole "only you must save the world thing" is kinda boring so I wanted to wait a little before pretending to buy into it again.

I like the game though.
>>
>>256055107
>She's a far more pervasive and annoying presence than the Maiden in Black
But half my point is that the Emerald Herald is something you can mitigate. You can choose to mash past all her dialogue. You can choose to never ever talk to her when she pops up at the Throne of Want and Dragon Aerie and Undead Crypt.

>meaningless, idiotic riddles which add almost nothing to the experience or to your understanding of the game
I'm going to offend you with this but I can't avoid it: You're pretty fucking stupid if you think her dialogue is meaningless or "riddles"
>>
>>256054902
>but you're kidding yourself if you don't think that Lost Izalith is worse than most of the areas in it
Uh, it is and I never said otherwise?
>>
>>256055375

If you don't accept the "mission," you won't be able to get the Friend's Ring, which helps you co-op. But that's it.
>>
>>256055362
fighting is exactly the same besides some slight changes between the three games

you mean PVP got more popular when Dark Souls was released
>>
>>256054648
>witty reaction face

>MiB has very little dialogue and never acknowledges your current gamestate
Quality of dialogue > Quantity of Dialogue
>EH has lots of dialogue and changes her statements based on your game progress
She repeats herself like crazy which is fine for her incantation but not for the rest. Also her incantation is frontloaded which is beyond retarded.
>MiB doesn't do anything for almost the whole game except sit around the Nexus
She fulfills a purpose. Again the amount of time a character gets in a story has nothing to do with quality.
>>EH turns up at major plot progression moments and talks to you and expands on the story
All her appearances we're jarring and didn't amount to anything in the end. Nothing she said was NEEDED.
>>MiB chants an annoying as fuck prayer nonstop when you're trying to choose your stat investments
It's an incantation
>>EH says a few canned lines you can skip past VERY quickly when you want to interact with her
I guess if you deactivate your subtitles it isn't annoying. I always manage to read them every time I mash through it. But it isn't too bad.
Also you're not really proving the character is well written by bringing up the ability to skip her dialogue as a good thing you idiot.
>>
>>256053243
"So?" That and several other things portray linking the Fire as the fated cycle that Vendrick and Aldia were precisely trying to avoid. The cycle that the Herald implies she wants broken at Dragon Aerie, only to turn around and want it to continue at the Throne of Want. Also, it doesn't matter if the Herald was born to break the cycle; she couldn't do it, mostly because she was a botched experiment. Her whole goal is to find someone who'll succeed where she failed. The Maiden in Black doesn't need to talk about the soul army and powers much when they're clear and established early on, and also pointed out by other characters. Also, the Herald really does do nothing at all. She just stands around saying a lot but conveying nothing. As for the Bonfires, the point is that the DaS series established that Bonfires level you up just fine. In DaS 2 that feature's locked out for no reason, forcing you to have to warp back to Majula every time you want to level up, even though DaS 2's multiple Bonfires are better suited for staying in one area as you traverse it.

Looking at the cost per level takes a second-long glance. Just load up on souls to go over that number then return and spend them in the stat you want.
>>
>>256055362
This is bullshit. Both Dark and Demon's souls have an equal focus on progression and exploration and both have a similar number of combat focused encounters.

The real black sheep here is Dynasty Souls 2.
>>
>>256054425
>>MiB chants an annoying as fuck prayer nonstop when you're trying to choose your stat investments
>trying
>trying
>this anon isn't able to choose his stats while hearing a prayer
>>
>>256055639
PvP is an element too, but Dark Souls plays differently enough to be jarring for people going to Demon's Souls. It's slower, weightier, and you have more attacks. Demon's Souls can feel limited and floaty by comparison. Dark Souls also has more enemy variety, and parrying is more useful too. The level design feels more like the enemies are spaced from one another, while in Demon's Souls they're placed in relation to the environment. That's not to say that one game doesn't have the elements that the other focuses on, but I definitely think that Demon's Souls is more about environment interaction, while Dark Souls is about enemy interaction.
>>
>>256055727
>Quality of dialogue > Quantity of Dialogue
So dialogue that directly acknowledges your ingame efforts and progress is of a low quality? My whole point is that the quality level goes up immensely when you start accounting for context sensitive lines.
>Also her incantation is frontloaded which is beyond retarded.
There's nothing wrong with it if I can mash past it without seeing or hearing it.
>All her appearances we're jarring
Nope
>Didn't amount to anything in the end.
Except for explaining what Vendrick and Aldia had attempted to do in order to answer the curse of the undead and shit.
>It's an incantation
Or a prayer chant. You can't know for sure, don't be a dumb cunt.
> I always manage to read them every time I mash through it
I literally don't believe you. I skip so fast she never even opens her mouth much less has time to activate subtitles
>you're not really proving the character is well written
Good thing that was never my goal and not a point I've tried to support.
>>
>>256055904
Yeah, Dark Souls II definitely seems to be moving in the Hack and Slash direction. Still, I think that going into Dark Souls the devs definitely wanted to focus on improving the combat and creating interesting situations with that more than anything. That's just the feeling I get when playing the game.
>>
>>256055465
>You're pretty fucking stupid if you think her dialogue is meaningless or "riddles"
Okay
>"This castle is isolated, but you must press on"
"T-thanks, can I have some more information please?"
>"...."
Unless I am as stupid as you say, at least half of what she has to say is as vague as this, or at the very least is nothing more than unnecessarily vague foreshadowing that can be interpreted in a million ways, but still doesn't actually add to the story in any way.
>>
>>256054616
>architecture
What the fuck does that have to do with anything
Were it Gothic architecture or Roman architecture I would still dislike the area for just being a city in lava with nothing interesting going for it
>You're really just butthurt over some incredibly arbitrary thing.
No, I'm "butthurt" because the area is absolute trash. Terrible enemies, awful bloom, wasted design, and the worst boss in the souls series. I'm also "butthurt" that the second half of the game is a gigantic disappointment compared to the first half.

But you know what, that's not the point of this thread
So how bout that Demon's Souls
>>
>tfw the first DeS thread in weeks is overrun by shitposters
;_;7 R.I.P. in pieces thread.
>>
>>256056292
Yeah, that's a fair assessment, especially in regards to the boss battles.
>>
>>256056464
>The ancient dragon is old but benevolent
>My name is Shannalotte and I'm a fialed half dragon experitment run by Aldia and Vendrick to cure the curse of the undead

I think she even expands on some other stuff too.
>>
>>256054865
The Monumental was the NPC who acknowledged your quest progress and got new dialogue, and the Nexus itself acknowledged the progress with the changing music. Also, the dialogue plays because it's the dang spell that lets you level up in the first place.
>>
>>256056619

ShitposteR. It's literally one guy who thinks he's contributing something while berating one character.

But don't mind him, how about them Maneaters, huh?
>>
>>256041187
Why would you want to get rid of the Nexus? I love the Nexus and the music.
>>
Anyone have the Maiden in Black version of that little dress-up dog/bean
>>
>>256056821
The Maneaters are the best boss in DeS accomplishment wise. Prove me wrong.
>>
>>256056230
>So dialogue that directly acknowledges your ingame efforts and progress is of a low quality?
Not necessarily no.
>My whole point is that the quality level goes up immensely when you start accounting for context sensitive lines.
That is equally wrong though.
>Nope
Yes. Take the one before the castle for example. Were did she come from? YOU just opened the Shrine of winter and moved past a bunch of enemies. Why was she suddenly there? The information she gave you was useless.
>Except for explaining what Vendrick and Aldia had attempted to do in order to answer the curse of the undead and shit.
Please expand on that I'm curious if there is something I don't know about them that would make me like the EH more.
>Or a prayer chant. You can't know for sure, don't be a dumb cunt.
My point was that it wasn't annoying because that is how incantations or prayers or Poems work. You're supposed to remember them.
>I literally don't believe you. I skip so fast she never even opens her mouth much less has time to activate subtitles
Just tried it out again just to see if they changed it and mashing as fast as I can I can still read the first half of every sentence.
>Good thing that was never my goal and not a point I've tried to support.
I'm not sure what you're trying to prove then. We're comparing two characters here right? So if one of them isn't well written that one is worse.
>>
>>256049571
/v/ needs more people like you
>>
>>256056523
>the second half of the game is a gigantic disappointment compared to the first half.
But overall the second half of the game is basically of the quality of Dark Souls 2.

What I'm trying to say is that you're insane, and you're basing almost your entire judgement of a game on one single area.

It's like you're so mad because your bowl of caviar had a spoonful taken out of it that you're going to claim that your complete Big Mac was better.
>>
>>256057037
I dunno. I felt much more accomplished having a manly duel with the false king, but I also ended up cheesing the maneaters using that brazier in the middle cause they kept raping my face.
>>
>>256055465
You can mitigate the Maiden in Black too. The difference is that the Herald's dialogue is an obstacle to what you want to do, whereas the Maiden's dialogue is present while you do what you came there for and entirely ends when you're finished. Only the Herald presents an obstacle.
>>
>>256057075
>Were did she come from?
this question is irrelevant.
>Why was she suddenly there?
She wanted to talk to me
> The information she gave you was useless.
So?
>Please expand on that I'm curious if there is something I don't know about them that would make me like the EH more.
They made her as some sort of an attempt at curing the curse. that's all we can know.
>My point was that it wasn't annoying because that is how incantations or prayers or Poems work.
I shouldn't be forced to remember it because I've been forced to hear it 100 times. I should be remembering it because it had lyrical value
>Just tried it out again just to see if they changed it and mashing as fast as I can I can still read the first half of every sentence.
Are you on PC?
>I'm not sure what you're trying to prove then.
That Emerald Herald is better than MiB in almost every respect.
>>
>>256057418
>jumpiing over a puddle of vomit is worse than being sprayed with it lightly.
>>
>>256057564
Didn't you complain about somebody responding with "no refutation or reasoning" a few posts pack and now you're doing the exact same?
>>
File: Land of Giants.jpg (346 KB, 1280x1024) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
Land of Giants.jpg
346 KB, 1280x1024
I fucking wished we got this in the game.

Also while I think EH is cuter than the Maiden, the Maiden is better overall because of her feet and accent.
>>
>>256057564

WE GET IT, you don't like her, please move on.
>>
>>256054425
>still trying to argue with people who decided that you're just a tasteless faggot
Your pockets clearly have infinite spaghetti.
>>
>>256057707
>>jumpiing over a puddle of vomit (Maiden) is better than being sprayed with it lightly (Herald)
Fixed that for you.
>>
>>256057707
It just sounds like you don't like the Maiden's voice or that incantation. If so, that's a totally subjective matter and doesn't warrant the long discussion you've been making.
>>
>>256057764
The demons from world 4 were so powerful, that they were destroying entire lands with nobody to stop them. If you were to be able to go to the land depicted in that concept art, you wouldn't stand a chance.

However, world 4 was in the works and you were supposed to be able to visit it as we all know. The finished models and textures make it seem like a snowy area, and some of the enemy models are straight out of DaS, with some one enemy looking almost identical to the man serpents from Sen's Fortress.
>>
>>256057707
I think this whole argument really boils down to whether you dislike mashing through dialogue more or having it play in the backgroud more.

Which is an immensely stupid argument to be having for everyone involved..
>>
>>256057764
>I fucking wished we got this in the game.

You're going to love this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ANGfZP3hcqU&feature=youtu.be&list=PLH-cMCF0_NrbhOUJ5y8dBG3Dopq1WSgnK
>>
>>256058221
I read an interview with Miyazaki way back in 2009 about how they were working on a library area. I guess the Duke's Archives was going to be made for DeS but they had no time.
>>
>>256058073

You are right, you're not waifufagging at all. This is some next-level shit. You will now be known, forever and ever, as Heraldchu.

Good job, Heraldchu, ChanChan has nothing on you.
>>
File: god fuck.jpg (741 KB, 1920x1080) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
god fuck.jpg
741 KB, 1920x1080
FUCKING SUMMON ME ALREADY
>>
File: 1401228503991.gif (3 MB, 250x250) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
1401228503991.gif
3 MB, 250x250
>>256043797

>GRAND
>>
>>256058382

OOOOOOOH, MY FUCKING DICK
>>
File: Thor is confused.jpg (33 KB, 630x354) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
Thor is confused.jpg
33 KB, 630x354
>>256057324
>the second half of the game is basically of the quality of Dark Souls 2
Are you being serious right now?
I
What
Do you HONESTLY think the entirety of DaS2 is the same level of quality as the awful second half of DaS1?
Sure it may not have been all as great as the first half, but to put it on the same level as the second half?
Nothing in DaS2 is anywhere NEAR as bad as the second half of DaS1
I see now
No point in arguing with you anymore, cause you clearly don't know what the fuck you're talking about

>>256058423
Maybe it was going to part of the tower of latria
Forbidden knowledge and all that crap
>>
>>256057564
Seeing how your main point is that the EH is better because you can ignore her why don't you expand that courtesy to us and use a trip so we can filter you?
>>
>>256058382
Some of those enemy designs were better than almost anything else in the series. It's so sad we never got to see that.
>>
>>256044550

When you access the MiB to level up and what not, you can still do what you need to do while she's talking. When Herald talks, you have to sit there as she goes over her repetitive bullshit every time before she lets you do anything.

Also >Liking ginger hair
>>
>>256058382

> that death animation

Why, From, why didn't you put that in the game?
>>
>>256044420
Try harder, faggot.
>>
>>256058382
Sweet crispy fuck...
>>
>>256056821
>do a mini challenge run of sorts for DeS
>basically, I have to play the worlds in a rigid order (-1 worlds in order, then -2, then -3 starting with 5-3, ending with 1-3 and moving on to 1-4) and am not allowed to go back to the Nexus until I kill the area boss
>get to 3-2 with only a longsword +4
>my lack of face when Maneaters
It's a really good boss, but Jesus Christ, cut me some slack.
>>
>>256044550
>Pops up and explains plot at you for no real reason.
Yea, it's not like souls games were known for their environmental story telling style.
>>
>>256058827
They kind of still did with the Old Hero's death animation.

The Land of the Giants was a victim of time constraints. Some assets were made, but the call was made early on. The enemies probably don't have all the attacks they were planned to get, and the attack speeds would have likely been altered for some of them. Also, just how giant they'd get would also be an issue. I mean, look at this picture. >>256057764
>>
I'm really disappointed Bloodborne didn't turn out to be Demon's Souls 2. I enjoyed it a lot more than I did DaS or DaS 2.
>>
>>256058204
I didn't mind the voice OR her incantation until it was ruined for me by playing ad nauseam.

>>256058323
In the end? Yes. But EH has advantages other than that. I'm amazed how much /v/ whines that other games feature NPCs who never acknowledge game progress but can just ignore it when it flies against their shitty nostalgia. Incantations and such totally aside, it's important to have a central NPC like the MiB or EH behave like she's paying attention to your quest. Emerald Herald accomplishes this by verbally acknowledging your progress and growth and then physically following you afterwards to continue to solidify the sense that she cares about and follows your efforts.

Emerald Herald is more alive and more part of the world itself. MiB just sits in the Nexus and spews canned dialogue on repeat until the end of the game.

>>256058797
>When you access the MiB to level up and what not, you can still do what you need to do while she's talking
Yes but is hearing her dialogue needlessly on repeat worth saving a quick moment of button mashing?

>not liking ginger hair
I guess it's too exotic for you?


>>256059112
Actually that's just DaS.

In DeS we've got
>Lengthy detailed cutscenes full of clear explanations
>Two NPCs in the first area who explain most of the rest of the plot
>a sentence per archtstone that elaborates directly on the local happenings
>>
>>256045751

Do you REALLY need plot thrown into your face like that? Part of the charm with DeS is that you had to actually study the items and the descriptions of areas at the archstones. I prefer to uncover the lore through these types of discoveries. I don't want to visit a Tourist Kiosk to have a tour guide explain shit to me.
>>
File: 1405005050205.jpg (168 KB, 665x724) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
1405005050205.jpg
168 KB, 665x724
>>256057764
>You will never fight in the Boletarian army against the Giants
>You will never be a knight of Lord Gwyn fighting against the Everlasting Dragons
>>
>>256059239
To be perfectly honest, I was kinda hoping it'd be it's own thing
Getting kinda sick of the Souls game
>>
>>256059376
I've already responded to this basic argument.

All you need to do is cut those little blurbs they have the warp menu about each archstone and give them to her as dialogue. They could even use it add exploration content or a small quest if they made finding her location in each level a little hard to reach via exploration or combat.
>>
>>256058641
>Do you HONESTLY think the entirety of DaS2 is the same level of quality as the awful second half of DaS1?
Yes, it really is. Duke's Archives, New Londo Ruins and maybe Tomb of the Giants are as good as anything in Dark Souls 2, which isn't hard. Lost Izalith brings it down a little I guess.

>No point in arguing with you anymore, cause you clearly don't know what the fuck you're talking about
What?
>Lack of enemy variety
>Lack of boss variety
>Most areas are just strings of linear corridors with the occasional open arena
>The difficulty/challenge is almost always administered by placing several "guys with weapons" in the same area, with almost no variation
>Little exploration
>Enemies are much less subject to the rules of not only the player, but reality (Scantily clad lion men with infinite poise and stamina, fuckhuge Woolly Mammoths in heavy armor can get stunlocked by a dagger etc. etc.)
>Much less loot hidden behind risk/reward scenarios
>Most secrets are behind invisible walls rather than concealed by actual level design
>Most bosses are just "armored guy with weapon"
The difference here is that I know what I'm talking about, and I recognize trash video game design when I see it.

Okay, to be fair, I recognize sub-Dark/Demon's Souls design when I see it.
>>
>>256059541
That is horrible and would've made her even worse than the fucking EH.
>>
>>256059375
The voice and chant getting annoying is still a subjective thing. It personally never annoyed me, and unless I was intentionally farming I didn't have to level up very often. You can advance several levels at a time too, so it's not like the process was tedious.
>>
>>256048436
>B-Se-S-L
Fuck off I can't even get that with fucking turbo on.
>>
>>256059482
It's thingken.
>>
>>256059673
It's exactly like all the other content they have cached away behind world tendency. It actually fits directly into the existing designs.
>>
No one will win this argument
>>
>>256058382
Can you imagine using the mod menu to replace all enemies with Giant Depraved Ones?
>>
File: godhelpus.gif (630 KB, 300x169) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
godhelpus.gif
630 KB, 300x169
>>256059968
>>
>>256059789
I'm sorry but to me that sounds horrible.
I'm glad the Maiden had a much smaller role. her suddenly talking about every area would be shit.
>>
>>256055904

No it's not. You just have no idea what you're talking about because you're a Dark Souls babby.
>>
>>256059525
>To be perfectly honest, I was kinda hoping it'd be it's own thing
But it's clearly just another souls game, even if it doesn't have souls in the title.
>>
>>256048940

I always fancied that the Giants in DS2 came from the DeS Land of Giants, but the archstone was crushed when they were slain.
>>
>>256059612
>Lack of enemy variety
Plagues all three games.
>Lack of boss variety
There's far more of them and they hardly ever get as blatantly bad as the worst offenders in other games
>Most areas are just strings of linear corridors with the occasional open arena
This is vast oversimplification and a sign that you're just looking to confirm your own biases.
>The difficulty/challenge is almost always administered by placing several "guys with weapons" in the same area, with almost no variation
The hardest parts of the previous games had been multi enemy moments too y'know.
>Little exploration
There's more content and more optional content than ever before. Factually wrong.
>Enemies are much less subject to the rules
Get gud you whiny little baby
>Much less loot hidden behind risk/reward scenarios
Outright wrong. The lockstone system is the definition of risk and reward and even without that there's lots of dangerous loot placements
>Most secrets are behind invisible walls rather than concealed by actual level design
I guess that's true
>Most bosses are just "armored guy with weapon"
and that's not actually a problem.

Typical antiDaS2fag
>>
>>256060283
>When they were slain
DOHOHOHOHO
>>
>>256059541

You responded to it by blatantly saying that you need plot to be made painfully obvious to you, instead of doing your own investigation.
>>
>>256059612
>Lack of boss variety
I ain't the guy you were arguing with but DaS2 objectively has more variety in bosses than DaS.
>>
>>256060437
> you need plot to be made painfully obvious to you
It would take MORE work to go find the Maiden and hear about the local lore than it does to just READ THE FUCKING WARP MENU.
>>
I came into this thread AN HOUR AND A HALF AGO, and you faggots are STILL falling for this shitter's b8.

What the hell happened /DeS/?
>>
>>256060281
I know that's why I said I was "hoping", not "I hope"
>>
>>256060667
I dunno, people like arguing over cute girls.
>>
>>256060667
Just because I don't agree with him or think he has terrible taste does not mean I have to tell myself he isn't serious.
This isn't a hugbox. I'm not on /v/ because I always want everyone to agree with me.
>>
>>256044206
But at least I don't have to wait through 5 minutes of dialogue and kneeling animation to level up.
>>
>>256060667

We're just happy to discuss anything DeS-related, really. ;_;
>>
>>256060587

>ignoring what I said about finding items that describe lore

Yeah, you keep cherry picking. Also, it doesn't take a whole lot of effort to find the EH either.
>>
>>256060763
>>256060815
But this is a DEMON'S SOULS thread, not a DARK SOULS 2 thread. If you want to yell at each other over trivial shit, then go to /DSG/ or one of the many DaS2 thread on /v/. DeS threads are rare enough as it is on /v/ already, and we don't need people wasting away the bump limit over this shit.
>>
>>256061042
A comparison between the emerald herald and the maiden in black belongs equally in either thread.
>>
>>256061117
It really doesn't, especially when it takes up dozens of posts with the exact same responses that eventually devolve into a DeS vs DaS vs DaS 2 shitfest.
>>
>>256060893
>less than 2 seconds of button mashing
>less than 2 seconds of a kneeling animation

I don't see that being as bad as forcing repeated dialogue you can't turn off. non optional repetitive dialogue is one of the biggest sins a game can commit

>>256060964
>ignoring what I said about finding items that describe lore
But what you said has nothing to do with this.
>Also, it doesn't take a whole lot of effort to find the EH either.
this also has nothing to do with the debate at hand.

you tried to hate on my idea about giving maiden region specific dialgue she gives you if you find her in each level by saying it would make the game spoodfeed me the lore. I'm sorry you got all confused and mixed up because you're too stupid. It really wasn't too complex of an idea.
>>
File: per.jpg (239 KB, 900x900) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
per.jpg
239 KB, 900x900
>>256048105
>No shields
I just want to viably duel wield shields, why is this to much to ask for.
>>
File: 1380822969143.jpg (88 KB, 500x276) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
1380822969143.jpg
88 KB, 500x276
>>256059375
>nobody has responded yet to the most thorough and well worded post yet
>the thread will continue to pretend like MiB is the best and that this poor guy is a baiting troll
>>
>>256060667
Sad as it is, this is the closest we can get to properly discussing EH's flaws too. DS2 threads can be shit at times.
>>
>>256061413
>viably
That's why you're never going to be happy.

DaS2 already gave you your shitty dual shields option.
>>
>>256059375
Demon's Souls did have a character who acknowledged your game progress: The Monumental, the Maiden's boss. He was quite clear too, and opened up a lot about the history of the world, the consequences of the Soul Arts, etc. Progress for the Herald was just a new direction to be pointed at followed by infinite ellipses.

Also, the Herald comes across as wasted potential, taking a lot of time to really say or do nothing for the plot in the end.
>>
>>256041187
You're a retard on both points
>>
>>256038094
I really hate having to come back every time I want to level.

The fact it was usually after a boss and there would be an stone thing helped but those loading times were shit.
>>
The other day I was at a hard techno party and I noticed a familiar vocal in one of the tracks, it was that maiden in black quote.
>>
>>256062297
>He was quite clear too, and opened up a lot about the history of the world, the consequences of the Soul Arts, etc
He wasn't directly acknowledging your progress though, THE GAME acknowledged your progress by unlocking more dialogue with him. Still it's a fair point to make.

I'd like to counter by pointing out how much of a chore it is to go talk to the monumental. It makes good sense from a game design standpoint to combine his role with that of the MiB.


>Progress for the Herald was just a new direction to be pointed at followed by infinite ellipses.
> the Herald comes across as wasted potential
Yes, but she's still a general step up from MiB. Can you imagine the potential of a Hub Waifu with the improvements of Emerald Herald but with a Solaire/Lucatiel style story you can get invested in or maybe even Kathe/Frampt levels of plot exposition?
>>
File: 1370115685257.png (209 KB, 510x1140) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
1370115685257.png
209 KB, 510x1140
>>256060317
>>The difficulty/challenge is almost always administered by placing several "guys with weapons" in the same area, with almost no variation
>The hardest parts of the previous games had been multi enemy moments too y'know.
I don't remember that in DeS, most of the hard things in DeS were quick fucks that hit for half your health and not being able to fucking roll..
>>
DeS is such a pain in the ass compared to DaS

Its great but fuck man. Carry weight, the nexus is too tall, some levels dont have a shortcut.

Its all good stuff in here but its a real challenge compared to the others. Good thing consumables make combat easy peasy.
>>
>>256062931
DeS had plenty of that, it was just easier to handle because the enemies had no shields. Dark Souls had it too, but again it was mostly with torch hollows who have no shields and no poise. It's only in Dark Souls II that they make it tedious as hell.
>>
>>256063078
The health system in DaS1 was fucking perfect. I still don't get why they went a step backwards again with DaS2.
>>
>>256061930
Fucking DeS gave me the option and two normal shields work better than that stupid fucking slaming shield set.
How the fuck is duel wielding crossbows more viable than shields.
>>
>>256062931
>Multiple Giant Depraved Ones more then once
>Plague Babies
>Swamp Jellyfish
>Hordes of knights just beyond the reach of dragon flames
>All those manta-rays shooting you throughout SoS
>All those rockworms in 2-2
>Necromancer Wraiths in SoS
>>
>>256063229
The thing is, it wasn't perfect. There were plenty of obvious improvements they could have made, but instead they took a step backward. I'll never understand how Dark Souls II ended up the way it did.
>>
>>256063229
No it was FAR too easy.

10 estus anytime you want was a joke. 15-20 was retarded and destroyed any difficulty the game might have had.

I'd prefer DaS2 without consumable healing. Finding your own estus in the world.
>>
>>256063379
Alright you are right I was exaggerating.
>but instead they took a step backward
That is basically what I meant.
>>
>>256063379
And they made good improvements

>Estus doesn't heal all at once
>Can't just kindle up to 20 at once
>Drink speed be influenced by stat investment
>Secondary healing choice to promote DeS-eque lack of major pressure when exploring as well as adding a moment of deliberation when you choose to eat a gem or drink some sunny D

Can't account for autists who complain all day but can't notice what's been done for the better though. You'll probably insist I've just proved WHY DaS2 is shit.
>>
>>256063078
>the nexus is too tall
Fuck you
>>
>>256063251
>Multiple Giant Depraved Ones more then once
Avoid Giant depraved ones like the plague, it only took me one mace to the face to work that out.
>Plague Babies
Ran past.
>Hordes of knights just beyond the reach of dragon flames
After seeing the dragon kill them (and me) I just lured them out and got the dragon to smoke them.
>All those manta-rays shooting you throughout SoS
Run forest.
>Necromancer Wraiths in SoS
Keep running forest

Honestly, if something kills me once the next thing I do is try to run past it and it normally works.
>>
>>256064126
Walking up there everytime I wanted to talk to an npc was rough man.

Rough
>>
>>256063723
>Drink speed be influenced by stat investment
That's fucking retarded

Lifegems are terrible though, and they invalidate your second point. Remember in Dark Souls when you got hit for less damage than an Estus healed, so you had to decide whether to be wasteful and use the Estus, or wait? That's an interesting decision that you don't have to make anymore. When you don't limit the available healing then the game loses something.

>promote DeS-eque lack of major pressure when exploring
The game isn't structured like DeS though. In Dark Souls and Dark Souls II you have bonfires, and you're given a limited amount of healing between them. Lifegems only interfere with that balance.

I'm not trying to pretend that Dark Souls II didn't make any improvements at all, but overall it's definitely a step backward.
>>
>>256064134
>run past everything
Thats not how people usually play games anon.
>>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4C_KHIpJ2A
>>
>>256064134
Regardless. I proved that all the games use multi enemy encounters as their hardest battles. DaS2 does it more because they seem to have had a small focus on tripping up DeS/DaS vets with shit like

>backstab proof tanky knights
>infinite poise enemies
>multiple enemy battles that're harder to defuse with luring
>>
>>256064216

You had a hard life.
>>
>>256064331
>>Drink speed be influenced by stat investment
>That's fucking retarded
I like it this way.

It lets sl1 faggots have a real challenge and adds more depth to leveling your character.
Then again I also like adp so my opinion is automatically shit.
>>
>>256058524
do you really believe people need help with that boss you slag?
>>
>>256064331
>That's fucking retarded
I suggest you play a different genre then.

>The game isn't structured like DeS though.
That's not the point and yes it is. the Nexus features a connection to several linear paths that end with a major boss. Majula does the same.

Having only 5 estus for all your exploration wasn't very fun at times. Not only did it limit how much they could use harmful falls in level design, but it forced needless backtracking and repeated killing of enemies. Lower Blighttown is a good example of why DaS2 could have benefited from Lifegems.
>>
>>256064537
>Then again I also like adp so my opinion is automatically shit.
Pretty much. Part of what made Demon's Souls and Dark Souls great were their consistency in things like that. Anyway, required stats don't add depth to leveling.
>>
>>256063723
>Drink speed be influenced by stat investment
How the fuck is that a good thing?
>Secondary healing choice to promote DeS-eque lack of major pressure when exploring as well as adding a moment of deliberation when you choose to eat a gem or drink some sunny D
And that made health not a consideration anymore in DaS2. In DaS1 I had to consider if I should use an estus now and go into a new area with full health or wait until I could use it to its full effect in case the next bonfire is too far ahead.
In DaS2 I just always popped a stone between fights because that was the best solution.
>>
>>256064537
>I also like adp so my opinion is automatically shit

I chuckled. Tying i-frames in dodges to stat levels was pretty stupid, in my opinion.
>>
>>256064716
It does to me.

If I feel like my character should be more agile I need to sacrifice potential damage or health.

Only needing to remove armor for a light roll takes no skill or decision making. You just take shit off until you can light roll. So much depth
>>
>>256064758
>How the fuck is that a good thing?
IT'S AN RPG WITH STAT BUILDING. THE MORE THINGS YOUR STATS INFLUENCE THE DEEPER AND BETTER THE SYSTEM IS.

>And that made health not a consideration
Just like in DeS.
> In DaS1 I had to consider if I should use an estus now and go into a new area with full health or wait until I could use it to its full effect in case the next bonfire is too far ahead.
And now every time you're hurt you have to consider if you want a faster stronger reusable but rarer healing choice or a slower riskier but faster and more costly heal over time.

Trade offs exist.
>>
>>256058382
Those are exactly the wolfbeast depicted in >>256057764

Amazing, never knew they did that.
>>
>>256064710
>That's not the point and yes it is.
That is my point, and no it isn't. Dark Souls II has bonfires, which removes the need for things like grass.

>Having only 5 estus for all your exploration wasn't very fun at times.
It is for me. If it's not for you then kindle the bonfire, they gave you an option for that reason.

>Not only did it limit how much they could use harmful falls in level design
This is a good thing. Dark Souls makes great use of verticality in places, but making you take a bunch of damage and then giving you lifegems to heal it wouldn't add anything at all to the game. In fact, it would only take away that tool since harmful falls become meaningless.

>but it forced needless backtracking and repeated killing of enemies
You mean it made you make tough decisions? Like whether or not to push forward in hopes of finding a bonfire, or turn back and spend your souls but lose progress? I love that.

>Lower Blighttown is a good example of why DaS2 could have benefited from Lifegems.
Not really. They space the islands so that you never need to get poisoned.

Lifegems completely invalidate the interesting resource management that the Estus system creates.
>>
>>256064927
Because you're a casual little turd who can't into basic features of RPGs
>>
>>256062826
It's not really a pain to go see the Monumental. Visits to the Nexus are kind of a break from the world as is.

I think the Herald was an attempt to expand upon the Maiden in Black, but I don't think it was successful. The main thing about the Herald that stood out to me was how she could say so much yet impart so little at the same time. Also, if she was raised by dragons on a mountain or in a lab somewhere, why is she so wordy and prone to riddle-speak? It's almost like she's putting on airs to seem more important than she actually is.
>>
>>256065075
>THE MORE THINGS YOUR STATS INFLUENCE THE DEEPER AND BETTER THE SYSTEM IS.
nononononono.
I hope you are exaggerating because fuck you if you actually believe an rpg with 500 different stats would be good.
>Just like in DeS.
Even worse actually. You know have healing items and the fucking estus and 4 ring slots.
>>256065075
>And now every time you're hurt you have to consider if you want a faster stronger reusable but rarer healing choice or a slower riskier but faster and more costly heal over time.
Did we play the same game? I never had to think about that at all. I always had several dozen lifegems at any point in the game. I never had to think about health at any point in the game.
>>
>>256064452
Which I personally find to be DaS2 biggest problem for me. I will never be challenged by a souls game again without it feeling cheap. I am too good and patient at the genre to fall into noob-traps, I don't sweat it when I get low HP, I don't bite off more than I can chew. So the only way for the game to challenge me is to throw 6 royal knights at me, or multi-bosses cause the camera doesn't support it.

Everything else is fine about DaS2 but jesus was that realization a shitty one.
>>
>>256065075
>THE MORE THINGS YOUR STATS INFLUENCE THE DEEPER AND BETTER THE SYSTEM IS.
That's completely fucking retarded though. Arbitrary stats don't make something 'deep', stats should have interesting and meaningful effects. Making the game feel like shit to play unless you put points into a stat is not 'deep'.

>>256064976
That is depth. You can wear armor and try to tank the game, or you can wear light armor and use your mobility to your advantage.
>>
>>256065075
>The flaw was in DeS, so it's justifiable here!

>You have to choose between waiting for 3 seconds or 6! That makes up for the fact that you you now never have to worry about your health.
>>
>>256065075
>Just like in DeS.
That was the point anon. DaS1 was an improvement while DaS2 was a step back again.
>>
>>256065675
You can do that in DaS2 as well.

Heavy armor will let you tank more damage but it limits the range of your roll. If you wear light armor you have more mobility and roll noticeably further.

The stat is how effective the roll is, not how mobile it is.
>>
>>256065332
>Dark Souls II has bonfires, which removes the need for things like grass.
No it doesn't. I explained this already

>It is for me.
Because you aren't being thorough or live in pretend land where you're not being damaged on your first time through a level.

> Dark Souls makes great use of verticality in places, but making you take a bunch of damage and then giving you lifegems to heal it wouldn't add anything at all to the game
Actually it does add plenty because falling is a common "Souls" platforming element. The more they can use it without worrying about depleting all your estus, the more complex and dangerous falling sequences they can demand of you.

> Like whether or not to push forward in hopes of finding a bonfire, or turn back and spend your souls but lose progress?
No that's not what I mean because I was never so bad at the game that I ran out of estus before reaching a bonfire. I'd either die early or arrive with 1-2 in reserve.

> They space the islands so that you never need to get poisoned.
That all depends on your inherent poison resist and willingness to sit around for 30 minutes to reduce the poison buildup. With Lifegems I wouldn't have to reset the level 2-3 times to explore it thoroughly and find all the items and enemies.

>Lifegems completely invalidate the interesting resource management that the Estus system creates.
And that's okay because they deepen your choices in combat and open up more options for level design.
>>
>>256065362

How is tying a basic game mechanic like evading (in this case, dodging) to a stat level good or "more hardcore" (since I'm a casual turd)? Your stats should affect things that are specific to the character, not basic gameplay.
>>
>>256047591
are you having a bad day, asshole?
>>
File: 1405529570527.jpg (51 KB, 712x1095) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
1405529570527.jpg
51 KB, 712x1095
>>256049694
AHHHHHHHH
>>
>>256066081
>sit around for 30 minutes to reduce the poison buildup

>this dunce didn't bring any moss
>>
>>256064452
But, you didn't prove it all you noted was a bunch of things you can easily avoid...
>>
I dont get it. Rolling is affected by armor and a stat now. Why is that worse?

It makes heavy armor viable and light armor just as good as the flippy ring once you level it.

Or you can ignore it and just get gud.

The choice to change the difficulty of the game is pretty good. Admit it
>>
>>256063379
And i'll never understand the legion of people who defend DaSII. DeS and DaS aren't even that old and das2 fans already talk like people who prefer those games are some kind of hipsters oldfags who can't appreciate progress. It's like some bizzare cult.
>>
File: 1307039340664.gif (513 KB, 240x180) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
1307039340664.gif
513 KB, 240x180
>>256065579
>the more things your stats influence, the better
>this means I think we need 500 individual stats

You're dumb.

>>256065675
>Making the game feel like shit to play unless you put points into a stat is not 'deep'.
No it's just how RPGs with character building work. Again, go fuck off and play Skyrim if you don't want stats to influence your abilities.

>>256065829
It's not inherently a flaw.
>that makes up for the fact that you you now never have to worry about your health.
It does because of all the tension it adds to COMBAT. If you choose to use a lifegem and still take damage before you've had your chance... you die.


>>256066121
I'm getting more and more mad the more I hear idiot teenagers saying this shit.

YOU BOUGHT AND PLAYED AN RPG. RPGS INFLUENCE YOUR PROFICIENCY IN VARIOUS TASKS WITH STAT SYSTEMS.

DAS2 DEEPENED THE STAT SYSTEMS AND ROLE PLAYING ELEMENTS WITH ADP AND THE VIG/VIT/END CHANGES

DEAL WITH IT.
>>
>>256065629
>6 royal knights at me
wut?

This NEVER happens. That is unless your a blind casual.
>>
>>256066397
sitting around waiting for buildup to reduce is just as bad as farming Darkroot for moss or farming bosses for souls to buy moss with.
>>
>>256066612
First playthrough of the game, didn't run by them and take the low route to the latter for the ruin sentinals. So yeah it happens numbnuts.
>>
>>256066612
He's probably talking about just before Velstadt but he must be retarded because those guys are easily pulled in groups of 1 or 2.
>>
>>256066565
>all the tension it adds to COMBAT
Which, if you actually think about your item usage for 3 seconds, will be zero, since you'll save all your estus for the fights and your lifegems for afterwards.
>>
>>256066689
You mean the bastille mob?

Holy fuck you really are a casual. You aggro the 2 groups separately. If you arent a huge retard anyways.

It helps to noting your surroundings.
>>
>>256066565
Adp is a shitty stat. Deal with that. It makes rolls inconsistent and that is never a good thing in an rpg.
>>the more things your stats influence, the better
>this means I think we need 500 individual stats
YES. The more, the better means exactly that. There is no upper limit and it would always improve.

Honestly you're even worse than that fucking Emerald Herald fag.
>>
Man, I had everything in this game. Then everything changed when the data loss attacked. At least I still have my 100% trophies. Still sad I have to start over from scratch if I want to play again.
>>
>>256066081
>No it doesn't. I explained this already
And you did a shitty and unconvincing job of it. It's go a vaguely similar general structure, but the individual levels are not structured similarly at all.

>Because you aren't being thorough or live in pretend land where you're not being damaged on your first time through a level.
I'm a completionist when it comes to these games, I've always made sure to pick up every item and explore everywhere. Having limited healing makes it a lot more interesting. If you disagree then you can kindle the bonfire, like I said.

>Actually it does add plenty because falling is a common "Souls" platforming element. The more they can use it without worrying about depleting all your estus, the more complex and dangerous falling sequences they can demand of you.
No, the more they use it without considering your healing, the more meaningless it becomes.

>No that's not what I mean because I was never so bad at the game that I ran out of estus before reaching a bonfire. I'd either die early or arrive with 1-2 in reserve.
Well then what kind of backtracking do you mean? Please, enlighten me.

>That all depends on your inherent poison resist and willingness to sit around for 30 minutes to reduce the poison buildup. With Lifegems I wouldn't have to reset the level 2-3 times to explore it thoroughly and find all the items and enemies.
It depends on how well you prepare. They give you poison resistant armor that pretty much takes care of it, as well as plenty of moss. Anyway, disliking Blighttown isn't a reason to add lifegems, there are much better solutions.

>And that's okay because they deepen your choices in combat and open up more options for level design.
Which is fucking bullshit. Adding a healing item doesn't deepen anything, it just makes things simpler. You don't have to worry about conserving things anymore, you can just pop lifegems all the time.
>>
>>256066664
>just as bad as farming
And yet you're supporting a system that encourages the farming of lifegems.
>>
>>256066868
You misunderstood him man.

He meant having the CURRENT stats affect your various action is better. NEVER mentioned added more stats bro.

Now resistance isnt a turd on your character
>>
>>256066873
>go offline
>use cheat engine to get your stuff back

problem solved
>>
>>256066565
>"A shitty stat is good because THAT'S HOW RPGS WORK, STUPID!"

Jesus Christ, you're an idiot. It's barely even an RPG anyway you fucking idiot.
>>
>>256066868

It's the same guy. Check his writing style.
>>
>>256067062
He didn't misunderstood shit. The other anon said the more stats you have the better. And that's a stupid statement to make. More is not always better. Elegance lies in making less feels like more.
>>
>>256066664
I don't think you played the game because you can get dozens of mosses in less than half an hour
>>
File: 1298076677801.png (579 KB, 4358x3996) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
1298076677801.png
579 KB, 4358x3996
>>256067268
Let me quote the earlier post
>IT'S AN RPG WITH STAT BUILDING. THE MORE THINGS YOUR STATS INFLUENCE THE DEEPER AND BETTER THE SYSTEM IS.

The more things your stats influence.
That is not even close to saying add more stats.

Its talking about making current stats more useful.

Stay classy /v/
>>
>>256067454
It's still a fucking retarded thing to say. It's the kind of arbitrary design philosophy that made Dark Soul II shit. There's no reason for it, it's just MORE! MORE IS BETTER!
>>
DaS > DaS2 > DeS
>>
This is bullshit. I came for MiB lewds, not watch a couple of autists argue over waifus.
>>
>>256067454
Alright. Again that it is wrong because the logical conclusion of that would be a single stat that influences everything.
The more, the better is still wrong.
It would create game in which everyone has the same build. Although I guess he likes that because he likes DaS2 which has that thanks to Soul Memory.
>>
>>256067628
No. It took current stats and character actions and tied them together in a new way that adds more depth to leveling and more risk to combat.

Thats kind of the entire thing souls is about. Obtuse leveling and dangerous combat.
>>
>>256067773
>Thats kind of the entire thing souls is about. Obtuse leveling and dangerous combat.

Holy shit. Fuck this shit. Fuck. Fuck you, man. Shit.
>>
>>256067454
I just expressed my self poorly. I'm just tired from that EH fag. The conclusion is the same though. Just because you have more things influencing your character through stats does not always means better. It's easy to say otherwise but if you stop 5 minutes and think, you'll see the stupidity in that statement. In fact, you just need to play DaSII.
>>
>>256066853
>e you'll save all your estus for the fights and your lifegems for afterwards.
Lifegems are a viable option during combat though. they allow you to walk while you break them and sometimes can be squeezed into opening that would have gotten an estus drinker killed.

>It makes rolls inconsistent
No it doesn't. you're just stupid and mad that you don't understand the underlying systems.

Slow characters don't need any agility and fast ones need to get around 90-100. That's all you need to know.

> that is never a good thing in an rpg.
Oh are you trying to be a big boy and hold the game to RPG standards now?

> The more, the better means exactly that.
No it doesn't. The more things my stats influence the better the game is means that having stats influence lots of things makes them good. That's one of the biggest strengths DaS has. the various stats have varied influences on many different things.
>>
>>256067738
Taking something to the extreme doesnt automatically mean your right.

Your way we would get a literal rehash of DaS1 since you dont want anything to change.

See how extremes dont work when your trying to paint someone else in a bad light? It just makes you looks like a frothing fanboy.
>>
>>256067026
I didn't farm anything. You can't REALLY farm in DaS2

I just bought them in stacks from Melentia.

>>256066881
>No, the more they use it without considering your healing, the more meaningless it becomes.
Are you retarded? It's a skill testing moment with a death penalty for failure. If you need to consider health you can't do that very often.
>Well then what kind of backtracking do you mean?
I mean in places like Lower Blighttown where I had to turn back and hit the bonfire merely because the poison buildup had depleted all my Estus.
>disliking Blighttown isn't a reason to add lifegems, there are much better solutions.
You're implying there's a problem to be fixed. There's not. Lifegems are just an expansion and addition just like all the changes to Estus
>. Adding a healing item doesn't deepen anything
Choices deepen things. Gems are consumed faster and don't force you to stand still. I've already explained how gems added a new layer of depth to the combat
>>
>>256068015
>Taking something to the extreme doesnt automatically mean your right.
Then "the more the better" is wrong.
>Your way we would get a literal rehash of DaS1 since you dont want anything to change.
No.
I loved DeS and loved DaS1 and they are different. DaS2 is the only one I didn't like as much.
>>
>>256067773
>depth
>risk

No my friend, all it does is making the gameplay inconsistent.
>>
>>256068052
And you can buy moss in stacks from that hag after Capra.

And I got 99 lifegems just by being summoned and helping people out.
>>
>>256052794
>he hasn't installed an SSD on his PS3 yet

it takes like 3 minutes, you don't even have to open it up
>>
>>256067926
I'm
>>256064537

We can keep argueing but I like adp.
It makes leveling take a little more thought, and makes combat more interesting and potentially challenging to me. To me.

Call it inconsistent but I fond it completely fine and completely consistent since its directly tied to a number.
>>
>that EH-fag
>that ADP-fag

Anyone still trying to claim summer isn't a thing?
>>
>>256068332
>Anyone still trying to claim summer isn't a thing?
Get the fuck out of here summerfag.
>>
>>256067773

> obtuse leveling
> i-it's a feature

This has got to be the stupidest post I've ever read about any of the Souls games.
>>
So when are we all going to admit healing is meaningless an ALL THREE games?

99 grass is bad
20 estus is bad
99 lifegems and 12 estus is bad no matter how slow they heal
>>
>>256068497
Did you ever play DeS?

It was obtuse as fuck for any newcomer, DaS was the least offensive in this way but still had shit like res and att. You HAVE to reference multiple menus until you learn their language.
>>
>>256068052
>Are you retarded? It's a skill testing moment with a death penalty for failure. If you need to consider health you can't do that very often.
Why on Earth would they do that often? That's an awful thing to keep coming across. It's much more interesting when you need to risk a jump for an item or a shortcut once in a while at the cost of health.

>I mean in places like Lower Blighttown where I had to turn back and hit the bonfire merely because the poison buildup had depleted all my Estus.
It seems like you just don't like Blighttown to me. Lifegems are not the solution to this.

>You're implying there's a problem to be fixed. There's not. Lifegems are just an expansion and addition just like all the changes to Estus
What? You're the one who said there was a problem, and that lifegems were a good solution. They're not, that's what I said. Yes, lifegems are an addition, a shitty one.

>Choices deepen things. Gems are consumed faster and don't force you to stand still. I've already explained how gems added a new layer of depth to the combat
Well you're wrong about it, arbitrary decisions that mean you don't have to make harder decisions or manage your resources carefully do not add depth.

You're really grasping at straws now, and you're not even addressing all of my points anymore.
>>
>>256068516
It was best in DaS1 because you really didn't have 20 Estus for most of the game. And not even 10 in the first run.
>>
File: 1291000027742.gif (950 KB, 476x319) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
1291000027742.gif
950 KB, 476x319
>>256068332
It's all me. I refuse to back down to idiots. If people are rude or spew dumb things at me without reasoning or factual support I enjoy making myself feel smart by tearing their opinions and arguments down

You're allowed whatever opinions you want, but I'm allowed to attack them if you post them. I've been doing so because I enjoy forcing people to confront their opinions and assumptions. Sometimes it gets through to people and I have somebody admit he's seeing things in a new way now.
>>
>>256068673
You had 20 estus before sens.

Most people just forget about that place before pressing into the actual game.
>>
>>256068674
I don't mean it as an insult but can you get a tripcode?
>>
>>256058423
The Painted World was also supposed to be in DeS at first, they said they pretty much copy/pasted it to DaS
>>
>>256068661
>Why on Earth would they do that often? That's an awful thing to keep coming across

To you maybe. DeS wasnt afraid to push your bitch ass off a ledge.
>>
>>256041187
>pc fags want to get rid of this nexus
doesn't surprise me one bit. If you got into souls because of the 360 or pc port of dark souls then you need to get the fuck away from this series.
>>
>>256068757
If you deliberately went all the way down to the TotG, and then climbed back up then you had that much before Sens, and you still had to kindle every bonfire. That's not something a first-time player is going to do. Dark Souls' system wasn't perfect, but it was the best of the three games.
>>
>>256059375
>Yes but is hearing her dialogue needlessly on repeat worth saving a quick moment of button mashing?

Oh god this so much. Id rather take half a second and press a button twice than having to hear the same dialog over and over again.
>>
>>256068865
>To you maybe. DeS wasnt afraid to push your bitch ass off a ledge.
Not that this actually addresses my point, but when did Demon's Souls do this?
>>
>>256068674
Just curious. What is your opinion on Other M, Metroid Prime and Skyward Sword?
>>
>>256068984
The catacombs was meant to be done before anor londo.

Theres a reason the fire smith is down there and pinwheel is insanely weak even solo at low level. The TotG was suppose to make you turn back. Pitch blackness after an easy boss is never a good sign.

Everyone waits until after but thats why its such a joke area
>>
>>256068646

Um, not really, at least if you're somewhat familiar with RPGs. It even had Luck, for crying out loud.
>>
>>256068661
>Why on Earth would they do that often? That's an awful thing to keep coming across.
why don't you ask Fromsoft? It's been a major theme in all three games.
>It seems like you just don't like Blighttown to me.
Nah it's cool, it just highlights the weakness of being limited to having only so many healing tools carried at once.
>You're the one who said there was a problem
I guess that was a poor word choice. It's a weakness but not a problem.
>manage your resources carefully
time is a very important resource during combat. gems and estus are defined by differences they have in speed when looked at during combat.

>>256068780
Nope. I'd rather you just behave better on 4chan. Maybe being afraid that the petty autistic NEET who enjoys to argue for the sake of arguing will cause you to consider posting with a higher level of thought and reasoning.
>>
>>256068325
It's alright. Just for the sake of explaining why i don't like it: dodging is a matter of pattern recognition and timing. When you put a stat related to i-frames you're essentially creating that inconsistency. So you'll need several characters with the same ADP to guarantee the dodging to be at some specific moment for each enemy.

That's terrible design to me. I understand why they put it, but the consequences are terrible.
>>
>>256068757
>You had 20 estus before sens.
If you bothered to take on pinwheel.

One of the biggest differences in DaS is that you couldn't passively get too much healing. I accidentally gathered up tons of grass in DeS and got 99 lifegems in DaSII before I even beat the Lost Sinner. In DaS, you had to kill a boss and constantly use humanity at every bonfire you came across.
>>
>tfw claws are only good in DaS2
>>
>>256069168
They way the stats were conveyed was obtuse and hidden behind weird symbols.

It took a while to learn those symbols. DaS made it pictures so casuals could level up.
>>
>>256069080
Blight towns style place and the shortcut to flamelurker are the obvious ones.
>>
>>256068674
Thank god it's just one idiot. At least the cancer is isolated.
>>
>>256069221
I'm not that guy or any other guy but can you actually explain WHY that's terrible design, or why different characters having different timing is bad? Would an agile character not be better at dodging than a tank? It makes perfect sense to me.
>>
>>256069163
That's nonsense, there's nothing to support that.

>>256069178
>why don't you ask Fromsoft? It's been a major theme in all three games.
Except it hasn't.

>Nah it's cool, it just highlights the weakness of being limited to having only so many healing tools carried at once.
Except you're talking about a mechanic that only exists in that one area. The solution to that isn't to add lifegems, which come with a bevy of problems themselves, it's to fix the damn mechanic. It's not really a problem anyway, as we've discussed.

>ime is a very important resource during combat. gems and estus are defined by differences they have in speed when looked at during combat.
You lose so much more than you gain though. There's no more resource or HP management.
>>
>>256069343
The manual that came with the game explained the symbols pretty well but the only thing I didn't understand right away was scaling
>>
>>256069343

Oooooh, the symbols. Yeah, that was obtuse.

What this guy is arguing is a different kind of obtuseness. It's the kind that changes several things surreptitiously, as in you actually have to count frames to realize you're dodging is now more effective. He thinks it's better and we should "deal with it." I don't think more is better. I also don't think that tying basic and general game mechanics to a stat level is a good idea.
>>
>>256069463
And you don't really take a lot of damage when doing those.
>>
>>256069221
>to me
Welp I guess were dont then.

To me it adds more depth because in order to become agile and a character based off dodging I HAVE to sacrifice potential damage or health.

Agile characters should be slightly weaker than heavy characters. It just makes sense.

Also ADP only changes how effective the roll is. How far you roll is still tied to armor weight.

So now I can be a tank and eventually have a good midroll if I level enough. OR I can be agile and get the flippy ring roll with light armor.
>>
>>256069706
>manual

Lucky you.
>>
>>256069178
>who enjoys to argue for the sake of arguing
You don't. Anyone who loves arguing is great at assuming the other point of view. You don't. You haven't moved a single inch argument wise on either argument. Arguing with you is as boring as arguing with a wall.
> will cause you to consider posting with a higher level of thought and reasoning.
You're not improving this thread.
Most sane people have already given up to argue with you because you are incapable of empathy.
>>
>>256069959
I bought it used too haha
>>
>>256069504
But i explained in my post. The timing to dodge is broke because of the relation to ADP. In DaS, doesn't matter if you're mage or tank, if you recognized the pattern and timed right, you would dodge. In DaS II, if you recognized and timed the attack, you would suffer if you didn't had the ADP stat at least equal to your last character. That's the issue it creates.
>>
>>256069327

Don't forget the vanquisher seal. stunlocking niggas all day.
>>
>>256070221
Yes, and that is a bad thing for creating diverse classes and characters. Like I said, a rogue and a tank should not be able to dodge the same way or with the same proficiency.
>>
>>256069504
Because the graphical input you get doesn't change. If your character model and the sword blade touch but you only get damaged once it is inconsistent.
>>
>>256069818
Its a direct stat right in the menu.
Agility literally tells you "boosts ease of evasion and other actions" if you look at it in the menu

Thats not sneaky at all. If anything it tell you more
>>
>>256070408
Then that's a problem with animation, not the ADP stat.
>>
>>256070527

But you don't by how much in terms of i-frames.
>>
>>256070348
And they can't in Dark Souls thanks to the different classes of rolling. This is a much more natural way of solving that problem, and it creates three distinct classes of roll instead of a vague scale.
>>
I don't understand how people have trouble with the ambushes in DaS2 as if DaS didn't have some that were worse (Large Divine Ember, Clams before Seath
>>
>>256070348
THEY DONT

ARMOR CHANGES HOW FAR YOU ROLL

>people really believe theres no difference in armor load
>>
>>256070654
And in DaS1 it told me nothing.

So I was trying to play the game with no armor thinking I'd be even more agile than with 29% load until the depths.
>>
>>256070652
But adp and animation frames are directly connected so it is a fault with both.
>>
>>256070348
That's the main question that i thing why me and you and all this debate goes around with. I consider dodging as a skillshot. DaS is a realtime action rpg on top of things. So transform what was a matter of skill from the player to some stat related issue. This is bad design to me. DeS and DaS managed to make the classes different from eachother without creating this problem.
>>
>>256069143
I've avoided Other M entirely based on critical reception. Metroid Prime is one of my favorite games of all time and Skyward Sword is almost unplayable because of how forced and annoying the motion controls are. Fuck flying, fuck stamina gauges and fucking aiming my sword.

>>256069602
>There aren't falling segments in Stonefang and Blighttown and Catacombs
unless you forgot? It's more common than moving platforms in Souls games.
>You lose so much more than you gain though.
Well, you're given less Estus for the earlier parts of the game so at that point you're REALLY worrying about managing your 2-4 sips. There's still management but with a more concrete sense of growth over time. Having one slowly expanding main pool of estus is FAR superior to kindling. Don't forget how DaS2 wants you to manage your equipment durability more than the other games do.

>>256070063
>Anyone who loves arguing is great at assuming the other point of view.
I can see the point of view of an idiot. That doesn't make it any less dumb.
>You're not improving this thread.
Ask me if I care
>>
>>256070767
I understand that. There's more to it than armor, ie ADP

>>256070913
If the animations accurately represented the i-frames it wouldn't be a problem. ADP at its core is fine, or at least it is in theory.

>>256070984
I can understand that. You could say Dark Souls 2 isn't a good enough RPG to justify changing it from a static roll to an ADP based roll and I'd have to agree
>>
>>256071236
>or at least it is in theory.
I will admit that.
but the end product in the game isn't.
Can we end on that?
>>
>>256071102
>There aren't falling segments in Stonefang and Blighttown and Catacombs
And they all work fine without lifegems.
>>
Okay.

Armor changes how far you roll. With heavy armor you will not make it out of range of large attacks. With light armor you will roll much farther and be able to avoid more attacks.

ADP only effects how much of the roll actually works. Without ADP you roll has a smaller success window. No ADP and heavy armor means you have the smallest amount of time to roll away and also not go far enough to avoid the entire attack. No ADP and light armor means you still have a small success window but because your roll is almost twice as far you actually have twice as much of a dodge window. You travel farther in less frames.

Adding ADP to the previous two situations does nothing but give the player a larger window of escape. A heavy roll is STILL a tiny roll with no distance so you are STILL in more danger trying to roll as opposed to rolling large distances in light armor.


Its okay though ADP a shit so why bother reading.
>>
>>256071442
Yes but I'm saying they were able to use them MORE in Dark Souls 2 because of lifegems and that's a good thing. they're tense and skillbased moments. even the best Souls players still fuck up a falling jump or die trying to get the dull ember.
>>
>>256071359
Yeah I can agree on that. I think it'd work better if ADP was affecting i-frames less, or not at all, and instead affected roll speed and length
>>
>>256071696
They don't do it more though. If anything they do it less. It's really just the well in Majula, where there's a bonfire at the top, halfway down, and at the bottom. You said the punishment for failure was death, so lifegems don't matter anyway.
>>
>>256044837
scottish
>>
>>256071987
>they don't do it more

>the Pit
>Various parts of the Gutter
>Brightstone Cove near all the white sorcerers and later with the Spiderweb room
>All over the fucking place in Shulva/Dragon Sanctum

> You said the punishment for failure was death
Yes that's right
>so lifegems don't matter anyway.
Are you 12? Is this the extent of your reasoning abilities? Lifegems matter because their inclusion allows the devs to send you off damaging falls much more often. When they can only count on you having 5 estus, they're not gonna send you off more than maybe 2 damaging falls in a row.
>>
>>256071987
There are two pits int the grave of saints.
The gutter also has a few drops for extra stuff.
The iron keep has some good drops.
Tseldora also has lots of vertical drops to items/shortcuts.

The FofG doesnt but the giant memories does.

I'd say its more than DaS but not much. DeS probably had the least.
>>
>>256047574
>Fucking B-Team rehashing their designs.

The Moonlight Sword was literally been around since the first King's Field game.
>>
>>256072421
I'm pretty sure that was a joke.
>>
>>256071987
>You said the punishment for failure was death, so lifegems don't matter anyway.
You realize what you just said?

Lifegems arent estus buddy, you dont magically get your used healing gems back for fucking up like estus.
>>
>>256072406
>>256072401
There's some scary dropping to be had in Dragon Aerie.

>dat Great Hero Soul on a lone pillar you have to drop from the zipline to reach
>>
>>256072401
>Are you 12? Is this the extent of your reasoning abilities? Lifegems matter because their inclusion allows the devs to send you off damaging falls much more often. When they can only count on you having 5 estus, they're not gonna send you off more than maybe 2 damaging falls in a row.
I meant that if you're going to do die if you miss a fall (like in Majula), then it doesn't matter how much healing you have. This whole thing is specious anyway, lifegems don't make these falls more interesting, and it's a ridiculous reason to include something like that.
>>
>>256072762
>I meant that if you're going to do die if you miss a fall (like in Majula), then it doesn't matter how much healing you have.
I know but I only mentioned dying because you tried to say falling wasn't skillfull or dangerous and it's both
>, lifegems don't make these falls more interesting
No, they just enable liberal usage of the concept of falling sequences.
>>
>>256045119
you, i like you
>>
>>256072925
But look at what they were able to do in the other games without lifegems. I really doubt that anybody felt limited when designing the levels in DeS and DaS.
>>