I'm watching the final episode >Man, Len Kachinsky really reminds me of William H Macy in Fargo >Google his name to get a picture to accompany this comment when I make it on /tv/ >Oh, the internet already beat me to it
HE WAS SETUP MAN THE PO LEES IS CORRUPT AS FUCK HE 100% INNOCENT DIN DU NUFFIN HE WAS JUST A BABY WHEN HE BURNED THAT CAT ALIVE THEM PO LEES BE GETTIN IN HIS NEPHEWS MIND AND SHIT SWEAT EVIDENCE DONT MATTER EITHER :)
>>64669456 >he left her car on his property >he didn't crush the evidence of her car in his very own car crusher >ONLY his DNA on the key >specks of his blood in the car but no fingerprint on or inside the car >no blood in the bedroom
An anon in another thread said Mike Halbach admitted to deleting the voice mail messages in court. Is there any source to this? Literally the only thing that casts a doubt on Steven's innocence, to me, is the phone calls to Teresa and the deleted messages.
So yeah, the cops let him get arrested for the thing in 1985. That all stemmed from the confrontation with a cops wife.
But the cop wasn't involved in the case relating to the murder. Why would an entire police department have a grudge on Steven and set up this whole elaborate conspiracy over a confrontation with some guys wife? Makes no sense.
very stupid people always have terrible phone manners. Growing up, my dad would get calls from this retarded guy who did business with him. Someone would answer when he rang and he'd always just say "Who this" as if he had totally forgotten he was making a phone call.
>>64669890 >Why would an entire police department have a grudge on Steven
His resulting lawsuit got a whole bunch of important people deposed. People who had power forcibly taken away from them are not known for their rationality, especially when those people are police which is a notoriously masonic environment. They got exposed and didn't like it, so by besmirching Stephen and entire Avery family name it makes people less sympathetic to his false imprisonment and more willing to believe the sherrif's department really dindu nuffin
>>64669890 1) clearly officers Holbourn/Lenk hated Avery as evidenced by them doing nothing when in '95 Holbourn received a call from a different detective saying Allan admitted to crime Avery was in prison for 2) they and the department stood to lose a crazy amount of money as well ruined reputation as a result of the Avery civil suit (aka when they were deposed
3) they and everyone in the city hated that family
now one might not think this is enough to incentivize them to tamper with evidence but so much of the case was sketchy. If they were didn't have a grude against Avery why were they so hellbent on being involved in the investigation even though they WERE SPECIFICALLY TOLD TO STAY AWAY FROM IT
Add their inclination to be a part of the scene to the many questionable circumstantial pieces of evidence and things get murky
1) key randomly appears only after multiple searches and of course was found by Jim Lenk when their babysitter police officer wasn't paying attention
2) Jim Lenk never logged into the evidence scene and lied about what time he entered to make it appear as though he got their before the log started (even though the first time around he said he got there well after the log started)
3) needle in container of blood in Avery's file, which was originally sent in by Lenk himself
>>64670351 Because other than multiple heinous crimes involving one person they have nothing in common. The Jinx is almost entirely about Durst, Making a Murderer is about law enforcements, prosecution and defense attorneys as much as it is about Avery himself
>>64669337 Dude, you are a fucking retard. You're dumber than fucking Dassey is. Find one—just one—instance of Brendan offering anything of evidentiary value before being first told explicitly what to say.
>he cut her hair? >no brendan >he punched her? >brendan he shot her >oh >so you're saying yes >yeah
Or this gem, the so-called "omitted evidence":
>what did he do to the car brendan? >he put the gun inside it? >no brendan something with the hood >he opened it? >you're saying he opened it? >yeah
>>64670518 They barely touch upon that stuff relative to MaM. It's not like they go in depth documenting the states and defense attorneys arguments. The Jinx is 95% about Durst, his ex-wife and her family and Susan Berman. Very little coverage elsewhere.
More than half of MaM is about the actually court precedings
>>64670643 No one bothered to get him checked out. Sounds like their whole family is slow, it probably was no surprise to them when Brendan turned out to be more retarded than usual. Out of everyone I feel the worst for him because he had no chance from the start. Steven at least managed to have some wits about him. Brendan didn't even know what fucking inconsistant meant.
>>64670826 Because she just lot her son to lofe imprisonment thanks to absolute bullshit and she knew it. If people were surrounding me after that happened I'd probably do the same. It's not funny, it's grim as fuck watching a woman lash out knowing she has no power to do anything else.
>>64670826 >The press have every right to film anything they want Of course, but that doesn't mean that it's always appropriate. It might have been better to give her some distance considering what happened.
>>64669635 Because he's too stupid to think critically, much in the same way Dassey was unable to defend himself from manipulation. The family was prepped, like any other family, by prosecutors who assured them they had an air-tight case and any resistance from the defense was petty lawyer's prattle. When prosecutors have dubious circumstantial cases, they wage media war and enlist unwitting victims' families into the effort, so when you dispute the state's case, you're really just admitting:
>you don't care about teresa >you care more about a murderer >dey proved it >da show is bias
And so on. Kratz' manipulation of Mike Halbach was even more devious than Wiegert and Fassbender's of Dassey. He picked the youngest, most naive surviving member of Teresa's family to walk point into the media. He got a guy that would never, ever question what the state said about the death of his sister, and being her brother, the media and everyone else are forbidden from challenging him, because of his protected status as crime victim/survivor.
>>64670552 A variation of the Great Lakes Accent. You hear the spectrum of them in Wisconsin, Minnesota, Michigan, and the corresponding regions of Canada. It's the result of Scandinavian and German immigration into the region in the mid-1800s.
He also claimed that he participated in the murder in a phone call... That kid is legit retarded and just kept telling people what they told him to say so that he'd get out of trouble. He had zero concept of the consequences of what he was saying.
at this point i feel if steven did it, brendan was uninvolved mostly if not completely probably thought if they couldn't get brendan to be a part of the crime(therefore reinforcing steven's guilt) they could get that celeb boosting slam dunk
i'm mostly certain she was burned in the drums at the quarry with the remains they could gather moved to steven's pit and the timeline they pushed is likely off >>64672079 his few consistencies is the alibi that leaves him unable to be involved at the time they say she died if he's involved(and steven guilty whether or not he had his help), the timeline's wrong
He definitely came off as suspicious, but I feel like the filmmakers edited things on purpose to make it seem that way.
But in his first appearance, he's talking to reporters immediately after she disappeared, before there was any reason to believe she was murdered, and he was already talking very calmly about "grieving" and "moving on." Definitely odd
>>64672768 that kind of drama is better for the cameras he didn't love her and she suffered trying to force herself to care about him >i love my sisters I LOVE MY FAMILY he rode her ashes to what is essentially knighthood in wisconsin and out of fairness to them that's pretty much all of they give out on family perspective kratz(am much as he bitches now), len, the police, and even none of halbach's relations wanted anything to do with the documentary posting the camera hungry puppet of kratz was the only way they could provide a viewpoint on the halbach side at all
The ex boyfriends seemed so sketchy to me. Whether or not they killed her, it still remained pretty obvious that it was the first time they had been interviewed, indicating that the police targeted Steven Avery specifically and exclusively
Thinking Avery is innocent is my new favorite meme.
Muh cops killed her Muh ex looks suspicious Muh reasonable doubt Muh EDTA testing is bad because it went against us and if it would have gone the other way it would totally be a viable test Muh middle class cops are criminal mastermind
>>64674263 That already happened so it no longer works that way. But I'll but anyway.
Bullet that killed halbach ( proven) was fired from a gun that Avery had in his possession. Defense offered NO VERIFIABLE PROOF that anything else occurred. They just tried to tie a bunch of circumstantial stuff to it.
>Only Steven's DNA on Teresa's car key >No blood found in his house despite "killed" there >No blood found in the garage despite "killed" there >There was a hole in Steven Avery's blood tube which only have the police access to >No fingerprints in car, but there's his blood. If he wore handgloves, there would be no blood. >Had a car crusher, didn't use it >Cops lied multiple times in court and everything was disproved thanks to audio and video recordings
I mean it's so fucking retarded, how can the judge buy into this? You don't have to study law to know there's something wrong here
>>64674495 Police had 8 days access to his house. You don't think they can pick up a gun and fire a bullet? His entire garage was searched and about 927+ items were found and examined, and they find the bullet 4 months later?
Is it possible that Steve straight up killed her, and actually cleaned up really well? The cops being aware of this (booked appointment with Steven, Steven is last person to see her), however could not find enough evidence, plant enough evidence to ensure Steven is found guilty.
I think this is the most logical truth to this situation, considering how much of a mess the whole thing is. Steven actually did kill her and the cops planted a bunch of evidence to find "proof" of Steven's guilt. Other than that, I can't really think of any other way any of this would make sense.
Of course there is a possibility of a third party (ex boyfriend, brother, whatever, these possibilities were never considered by anybody) but there isn't enough to go with there.
Let's face it, these hicks are dumb. Dumb hick Steve Avery, fresh out of an 18 year sentence for a crime he didn't commit, having the pillars of society shake hands with him and apologising to him on behalf of the state. Now, to this dumb hick, he feels invincible, he knows the state has wronged him. Naturally, a dumb hick would figure this the perfect opportunity to sexually assault Teresa, because its unlikely that the cops would have the balls to convict him a second time.
Remember, this is a hick who a)burned a cat b)ran over and pointed a gun at his cousin because she was talking shit about him and c)wrote on his kids bday cards that he was gonna kill mummy when he got out
>>64674876 All of the things you mentioned is hard proof. Now show me hard proof of Avery having shot the bullet. And apparently it happened in the garage, why is there not the tiniest droplet of blood found anywhere? He also "shot" her 11 times, why did they only find 1 bullet?
>>64674932 >He did it. His own lawyer even let that slip in his closing argument.
What? Did he and his lawyers slip out he shot her?
How are the Averys so poor? They have like a thousand scrap cars in their yard. So many spare parts etc etc. I mean its not a goldmine but you could easily take apart those cars and sell the parts online or in person for like a minimum of 100 dollars a day
>>64675037 >They have like a thousand scrap cars in their yard. So many spare parts etc etc. That doesn't mean shit, scrap cars are usually rusted and have the same parts that you can get from a store in much better condition. Plus, most of the good stuff was probably taken out years ago already.
>>64674858 >Actually cleaned up well So he meticulously scrubbed pretty much all the blood and any other evidence, but completely forgot to do something about the car?
>Is it possible that Steve straight up killed her, and actually cleaned up really well? The cops being aware of this (booked appointment with Steven, Steven is last person to see her) The police saying they "know" Avery killed her because he had an appointment with her is pretty stupid.
>Of course there is a possibility of a third party (ex boyfriend, brother, whatever, these possibilities were never considered by anybody) but there isn't enough to go with there. In any sane justice system, it's not the job of the defense to offer an alternative theory.
>>64674510 Yeah those two lawyers really passionately gave a shit and you could see they knew the jig was up when Steven got sent to jail. I have no fucking idea how a jury could ever find Brendan guilty of anything except being legit retarded.
When will this meme die? There's so much evidence.
>The gun hanging above Avery's bed was the same gun that fired the bullet found in the garage with Teresa's blood on it >Steven Avery bought chains and ropes from a sex store the day before Teresa's disappearance, the same rope and chains Dassey described. His fiance was in prison so it probably wasn't for her >Avery DNA found under the hood of the RAV4, corroborating Dassey's testimony that him and Steven went to the RAV4 to remove the battery (The police didn't feed him this) >Teresa's belongings found in a burn barrel on Steven's property >Teresa's uneasiness with Steven Avery, reporting to her boss that she doesn't feel comfortable going to the Avery farm after Steven talked to her wearing nothing but a towel >Steven making multiple phone calls to Teresa after she left, including once from a *67 number
Source? Google it you fucking lazy asshole. This shit is all over the internet. Confirmed by Kratz, and nobody is debating any of it was presented at the trial.
>>64674142 >Muh EDTA testing is bad because it went against us and if it would have gone the other way it would totally be a viable test
You are both missinformed and retarded if you think the EDTA test developed by the FBI in a matter of weeks has any relevance on determining if there was EDTA in the blood or not. Please read something about how diagnostic tests work and the concepts of specificity and sensitivity before you attempt to comment on this case again
Also that SUV was called in days before Theresa was deared dead, days before the search party miraculously found it by, you guessed it, magicalOfficer Lenk who always convieniently can't remember what the fuck went down when questioned.
Dean Strang's line in ep. 8 about the lack of humility in the justice system (including police and judges) said it all, to me. It's fucking terrifying the power cops have and how their authority or integrity cannot be questioned.
American deference to anyone in uniform is sickening.
It's also sickening to think one cunt said that to question the integrity of the police, that they would "be at their own peril". This is a fucking threat.
Thanks to this documentary and new-found media attention (this time from a different perspective), Avery will probably get a new trial with a great defense lawyer doing it pro-bono for the publicity alone, and will probably walk free because everyone has now already decided Avery is in fact innocent.
>>64675281 Not that guy, but if you live in the South or the Boonies, you can't trust cops for shit because if there are no black or brown people in your area then they go after the poor, with extreme prejudice. They don't give a shit if you're innocent or not, if they can find an easy victim that will save them time from actually doing hard work then they will throw you under a bus without second thought.
>>64675468 I am from Wisconsin, not Manitowoc county, but I watched the whole thing. Kratz also said it recently. It was common knowledge during the trial to those in the area. Sorry but searching yields the same crap as what you said
>>64675313 >>The gun hanging above Avery's bed was the same gun that fired the bullet found in the garage with Teresa's blood on it The cops probably planted a lot of stuff -- it isn't crazy to think they might have fabricated this. >>Steven Avery bought chains and ropes from a sex store the day before Teresa's disappearance, the same rope and chains Dassey described. His fiance was in prison so it probably wasn't for her Source needed. Also -- where was the blood in the room? The police fed the stuff to Dassey about the ropes. >>Avery DNA found under the hood of the RAV4, corroborating Dassey's testimony that him and Steven went to the RAV4 to remove the battery (The police didn't feed him this) Source needed >>Teresa's belongings found in a burn barrel on Steven's property Could've been planted by the real murderer, who probably knew Avery >>Teresa's uneasiness with Steven Avery, reporting to her boss that she doesn't feel comfortable going to the Avery farm after Steven talked to her wearing nothing but a towel Wow, a tactless hick upset a woman because he's clueless? The guy has a low IQ and spent nearly two decades in prison. I'm sure he doesn't have the best people skills. Also, I've had people answer doors to me in their towels after showers. Hicks act like hicks. >>Steven making multiple phone calls to Teresa after she left, including once from a *67 number Why would he call someone he just killed?
>Steven Avery bought chains and ropes from a sex store the day before Teresa's disappearance, the same rope and chains Dassey described. His fiance was in prison so it probably wasn't for her Unless there is conclusive evidence that they were used on Halbach, that's evidence of jack shit.
>Avery DNA found under the hood of the RAV4, corroborating Dassey's testimony that him and Steven went to the RAV4 to remove the battery (The police didn't feed him this) Wasn't this DNA "found" long after the murder took place? That is, my understanding is that it was a few months before somebody decided to swab for DNA even though they knew that the battery was disconnected
>Teresa's belongings found in a burn barrel on Steven's property If you buy into the premise that Avery is being framed, dumping her phone into a barrel on his property wouldn't be that difficult.
>Teresa's uneasiness with Steven Avery, reporting to her boss that she doesn't feel comfortable going to the Avery farm after Steven talked to her wearing nothing but a towel >Steven making multiple phone calls to Teresa after she left, including once from a *67 number Being a creep doesn't make you a murderer
>>64675414 I live in the South and I feel you there. Most of those guys don't really care about the uniform and see it as just an easy way to make money. Every year in my county they do an internal bust to get the corruption out and it's just usually the ones that were too stupid to hide their criminal activity, the rest are smart enough to hide their tracks.
>>64675619 >cops are way more lenient in small cities
No they fucking ain't man, they're only lenient to those that give them hush money or a cut from illegal profits. Small town cops don't give a shit about the regular folks and will fuck them over so they have to waste money in court fees.
>>64675815 >Planted the car >Planted the bones >Planted Avery's DNA underneath the hood of the car and removed the battery, just so Dassey's testimony makes sense >Stole Avery's gun and used that to kill her >Removed the bullet from her skull and hid it in Avery's garage
>>64675313 >Steven making multiple phone calls to Teresa after she left, including once from a *67 number
It's funny how contrarianfags who have done no research on the matter always leave out the fact that he gave his sister's name in those calls and they were made for bussiness. If he was harassing her, why would he give the name of another Avery?
>>64675774 >the worst cunts I went to school with went on to be cops as they knew it was easy-street and they'd have power. That's mostly what you got here too. I know of several people I went to high school with that shouldn't be given a butter knife let along a badge and gun, knowing they'll just abuse it as soon as it was handed to them. The commissioners don't care, so long as they have bodies in uniforms and those that do try to become honest policeman, usually quit after a few years because they can't do anything or become just like the rest.
>>64675922 Don't you see, magic fairy dust. The cops planted everything. They left no evidence of planting, but they definitely did. Now I'm going to go in the corner and closer my ears as tight as possible so I don't have to hear your argument.
>>64675895 Some chucklefuck killed her on Avery's property knowing that Avery wasn't a model citizen and wasn't popular with the police, and would therefore be a good patsy. The cops assumed Avery did it and saw it as a godsend given the pending lawsuit. There wasn't enough evidence tying Avery to the crime, so the police planted/made up enough to convict him.
>>64675932 Your implying that they somehow either A. Fired the gun without the other officers raising any suspicion. B. Taken the gun, probably the most crucial evidence on the scene, to another location, shot the bullet, then planted it
You're going beyond reasonable doubt here.
>>64675921 I'm not being contrarian. I'm just not being a fucking sheep who obeys the clearly biased documentary that left a lot of this shit out. Do you have any source on this? Because I haven't read that anywhere.
>>64675959 >those that do try to become honest policeman, usually quit after a few years because they can't do anything or become just like the rest. Yep. It's the Serpico catch. Police chiefs could be more thorough in rooting out corruption, but they're probably dab-hands at it themselves, or don't want to rock the boat too much.
The sense of entitlement of cops is just staggering.
>>64675221 This was my biggest issue. The prosecuting DA had two different stories of what occurred for Steve and Brendan. They ignored the fact that Brendan's testimony stated that they slit her throat, implying blood would be absolutely everywhere and assuming that this killed her. Then in Steven's trial, they say that she was killed by a gunshot wound to the head in the garage. I mean, it's pretty obvious why they didn't use Brendan's admission in Steve's case, because none of his story matched with what the DA was trying to convince the jury of.
This is all ignoring the fact that not a single piece of evidence shows that any of this torture or mutilation ever occurred anywhere on the Avery property, bedroom, or garage.
Any fucking moron who doesn't believe that Avery at least deserves a new trial is literally a straight troll. The biggest evidence that was omitted from the doc that the drug addled sexual offender Ken Kratz could come up with is, "He was being creepy before she died."
>>64675961 >you clearly have no experience on the matter I live in a small town, and I've lived here my whole life. Just because you had a good time with police doesn't mean everyone else has. I've seen them fuck over friends for doing the same thing you did, yeah you got away with it, not everyone else does.
>>64675366 I always thought the reporter on the far left under good tier was sexy as hell. She had ungodly huge tits back then. Found her twitter today though and she's leveled out, fat, but still massive jugs.
>>64676248 i really don't believe you anyway. you probably hang out with a bunch of monkeys and are making shit up. let's also not forget that running red lights and speeding is actually against the law
>initially 7 jurors were NG for Avery Anyone see the today interview with new lawyers who said one juror flipped to guilty because he/she feared for his/her life? Wouldn't doubt it as a Wisconsinite. Those booney hicks stick together like noneother
>>64676495 >A bullet found in Avery's garage tested positive with Halbach's DNA and the bullet was linked back to the gun that Avery kept above his bed in his trailer. "Ballistics said the bullet found in the garage was fired by Avery's rifle," Kratz told People.
Are you literally retarded m8? or shall I say Mr. Kratz?
>>64675961 >a city cop will bust your ass for going two over Spoken like a true hick.
Hick cops sit on their obese asses all day looking for people to bust in order to get their quotas up. City cops are cunts, sure, but you're just bullshitting. Many hick cops' only job, day-in-day-out, for decades, is standing with a speed-gun.
>>64676400 >you probably hang out with a bunch of monkeys and are making shit up
Aww what's wrong kid, surprised there are people with a different opinion than you. Cops are fucking assholes that will screw a person over to meet a quota. I'll say again, just because you had a good time with police doesn't mean everyone else has. Going by this thread, many people know that most cops don't care all that much for justice and would throw the book at a person so they don't actually have to do hard work. Yeah, there are good cops out there, but they are becoming more difficult to find year after year.
>>64676166 you might as well have posted a buzzfeed article called "10 Things Making A Murderer Left Out About The Case. Number 3 Will Give You Chills" and it would be as believable. Post actual sources, faggot. I'm waiting.
>>64676681 Proof? The only way to "prove" that to you people would be to have a video of Avery holding the gun firing the trigger at Teresa Halbach's head. Even then I'm sure you guys would be skeptical.
The gun was hanging over his bed, and was always hanging over his bed. Someone would have to break into his house and steal the gun and use it to kill her.
>>64676670 It was found in the garage, with blood ON the bullet. It's likely that the bullet was removed from her and hidden in garage.
>You mean when the cops occupied his house for 8 straight days? To suggest this is to suggest that every single police officer involved in the investigation was in on the crime. Even the 95% of the cops that weren't involved with Avery at all, and the majority of the cops that weren't Manitowoc police.
It's not like you can just fire a high caliber bullet out of a rifle and no one around would here it. It's not like you can steal one of the most crucial pieces of evidence from a crime scene and no one would raise an eyebrow.
>>64676945 Probably not all of them, but I've seen a lot of corrupt shit m8. Shooting inside a water bottle could be used as a "silencer". I don't know if the cops were that smart but it's a possibility. I'm aware it makes sound but not enough to alarm everyone outside.
>>64677111 >If they took the rifle to outer space and fired it no one would hear it Shut up. You're still putting two police officers alone in a room with the most crucial evidence of the case. That's not done, and the defense never brought that up, at least not that I've seen.
>>64677151 What's your point? I don't care if they wanted to frame him, or even if they framed some evidence. Maybe a mistrial is warranted if you can prove that. All I know is it's nearly impossible to fake the bullet, and suggesting that they did makes you dumb. You just want to believe this fairy tale for some unknown reason. Maybe you want to fight the system man. I bet you believe the moon landing was faked too.
>>64677391 >Hey why does Lenk have that rifle in the other room with him? >I don't know. >Oh. >>At the trial when Lenk is being accused of framing him >>No one brings up the fact that Lenk was in the room with the rifle alone, the most crucial evidence >>The Lawyers don't even suggest this
>>64676909 Striation marks. It's not hard as long as the bullet isn't a complete mess. Then they just fire more bullets from the gun they suspect to be the weapon and see if the marks on those bullets match the bullet they have in evidence.
Is it just me or do the 3 separate burn sites not really fit with the prosecution narrative? How did they explain the bone fragments in the burn barrel and quarry if they posited that the main burn site was in the "bombfire" pit?
It seems to me that it would make most sense that someone brought the burn barrel to the quarry and burned the body there and then tried to dump it in the burn pit to suggest Avery did it.
>>64678026 It doesn't make sense for anybody to do it, regardless of intelligence. If you're trying to move something, the location where there's minute traces of what you're moving would logically be the location of which you're moving it from.
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